In the world of site design, there’s a lot of “complexity equals quality” thinking. Companies get all tied up in jazzy elements, ultra-long menus, and fancy industry jargon. Unfortunately, that approach misses the mark for most users. In this quick-hit talk with Quinn Zeda, CEO of Conversion Crimes, we discuss why keeping your site easy enough for a child (or a drunk person) to use is the real marker of quality, where companies tend to fall short on testing, who is typically responsible for website flow fails (spoiler alert: everyone), and why being too quick to push a site can be so problematic.
Hey, Quinn, excited to have you back. Today we're talking a lot more again about how to convert more quality leads, you know, for the traffic on your website and to get more granular, we're really looking to understand, how to avoid
losing a user with the wrong flow of information now. Cause you're, the queen of UX and CRO, and the CEO of conversion crimes. So let's, let's hear about it from you cause you do tons of these types of testing. So what are the main things you're seen as, as, either know, not done well or just really poorly done, to really help a user understand the information so that they can get to where they need to be effortless.[:
So the most important thing should be at max volume. So it's the biggest, the boldest, the most attention grabbing thing. And then what's like the next piece of information they need to use. Well, maybe that's like a little bit smaller. We're going to turn down the volume a bit, so they're go. Kind of go 1, 2, 3, and then, um, the other part of that is kind of the flow.
Are they getting, the information that they need in the order that they need it? And one example was that was we bran, um, On a e-commerce site. And we're asking you to like check out before you be like put in the checkout information. So it was like the button to check out was on the top left and then the information to,
you know, make your selections or whatever was in the bottom. Right. But it really should be like, the button should have gone underneath. So you fill in the information and then the buttons there that's the flow versus they're filling out the information here. And then they've got to go all the way to the left side, which is not really the normal place to put a checkout button.
So, this is like one of the biggest things that we kind of see , on sites.[: [:
So we just like do it and we execute and we get it out there and we're trying things. But once you kind of get stuff out there, you want to make it better. So it's about like finding out how people are using the information. Are they able to find the things that they want to find in the flow that they want to find it?
So it's just like, you know, sometimes you just execute and push stuff out and you don't really put a lot of thought into it, or maybe you just don't have that kind of knowledge. Like not everyone is great at user experience or design and they can't like see these things. So maybe they're just oblivious.
So, Yeah, we do. It's just a pretty common thing.[:
Um, but that's not the fault of the business owner because they only hire, they only have. You know enough, they can only hire one or two people and then they have to, so eventually, you know, you have to outsource it or you find software or it's the owner doing it. And sometimes we see that the owners are trying to be marketers, because they're so close to their brand and you're like, you gotta let it go a little bit.
And you kind of trust people to like touch your site and you also see people. who was like, it was their cousin who did the site and they don't want to say anything.[:
Why, why is the checkout button in the top left corner? Like that makes no sense, you know? And when you can see people like confused with it, then you'd be like, oh, okay, well, it made sense to me, but nobody else is understanding that. So[:
I'm like, don't touch it. I know exactly where things are, even though it's messy.[: [:
Right. We're normally that kind of stuff is right.[:
Tell me what this is or find this for me. What do you feel like, you know, that idea of like, just keeping it simple by giving it to like a kid or someone just completely like, has no ties to your business? Like, what are your thoughts about.[:
Maybe it's still out there. It's like the user is drunk or something, and this guy would like literally drink beer and then do like disability tests on the site. And he's like, your site should be so easy to use that a drunk person can figure it out. And it's great because you're like what the thing is, like you want the experience to be frictionless and intuitive, you know, that's one of the reasons Steve jobs apple did so well, because it's like, you don't have to read a manual to understand how to use an iPad.
Like a five-year-old kid can pick that up and intuitively. Like know kind of what they're doing or when they're playing games or what have you. And that's what you want your website to be. You want people to intuitively know where to go, to find information and for that information to be in that spot.
So to kind of like really understand that. Yeah. Yeah, watching people use it for the first time, because it's like, we kind of talked about like, you know, where everything is on your website, you know where to look things, you can do things quickly, but you don't know what it looks like to someone that's viewing it for the first time.
And can they find that information? Are they going through the right flow or are they getting what they need at the right time? Um, so yeah.[:
I need some more pictures. I need to have some more validation, but then like, that's it, that's the end of the road. It's like buy now or book now. And I'm like, no, I need more information you guys. So I think having these feedback loops, you know, through user testing, like what you guys do, or just even talk to them.
All the folks. Um, I think it's so important because you want to make sure you meet the clients where they're at. Right. And everyone has different needs. Some people need more information, so he weighed less. And one really good tip I got from, from a mentor is you want to provide three forms of ways for people to consume written verbal and audio, because that's why you see videos on websites.
That's why you see graphics, right? Cause they explain complex things in a graphical or animation or written, cause some people just prefer to read it and they don't want to click the link. So I think sometimes people assume like I had a video there. Why didn't they understand it? Well, did you transcribe what that video said?
And like explain what the summarize that video or so I think having a mix of information, so you kind of meet people how they want to consume content will help create better coverage.
And then be like, oh, this is the information I really care about. And then they're going to read those like two paragraphs or whatever, if that makes sense. You know? So there's like the headlines, they can skim those. And they're like, oh, I want to know like where the vent is. If they're like whatever sustainable practices or whatever questions they have about it.
Then they can kind of skim find, oh, here's our lake sustainability, whatever. Then they can like read about it. Um, and find that information pretty easy.
Cause you know, some sites have a lot of content from others. Tech standpoint versus, and some people just aren't photography heavy.[:
People can skim it, they can kind of find what they need. But as far as like doing like video versus heavy content and, stuff like that. It really depends on the audience. Like if you have a photographer audience then probably want a lot of beautiful photos. So like big taxed and like things like this, where if you have a more like technical audience than they want to get into, like those nitty gritty details and the content.
Right. And so I would just say that that depends.[:
That if someone's still doesn't hasn't done any testing. Now what's the quickest, easiest way for them to kind of look at their site today and just make some aha moment changes.[:
Does it have to be like, uh, like something, you know, just grab someone from the code office. I mean, I guess we're not in offices now, but somebody like you grabbed your kid, right? It's like, how would you do this? Watch how they navigate it. What can they figure out? Even that can give you the information that you need.[: