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Pastors: Stop Doing 80% of What You’re Doing!
Episode 41031st October 2022 • Everyday Disciple Podcast • Caesar Kalinowski
00:00:00 00:32:55

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If you’re a pastor, a lot of the things you're spending time on each week may not be producing as much fruit as you think. But all of us get caught on a hamster wheel of things we’ve added to our list of responsibilities, or someone else has, that over time become a huge waste of our energy and resources. This week on the Everyday Disciple Podcast, we talk about why most leaders should STOP doing 80% of what they're currently doing. You are facing what may be the biggest opportunity you'll ever have to reset your schedule as things get restarted. In This Episode You’ll Learn:
  • Why the future of your church depends on you doing less.
  • How your physical time and capacity may not be as drained as your emotional capacity.
  • How to assess your true values and what gets you up in the morning (and why).
  • Practical ways to know what you should be putting on your "stop doing list".
Get started here… From this episode: "We all have only so much physical time and capacity, but we also have a limited supply of emotional capacity to spend each day and week. If you’re maxed out on both time and emotional energy, you will hate your life, have very little to give your family, and will hide and/or die under a pile of exhaustion and never have time for making disciples in community in your everyday life."  
Each week the Big 3 will give you immediate action steps to get you started.
Download today’s BIG 3 right now. Read and think over them again later. You might even want to share them with others…

Thanks for Listening!

Thanks so much for joining us again this week. Have some feedback you’d like to share? Join us on Facebook and take part in the discussion! If you enjoyed this episode, please share it using the social media buttons you see at the top of this page or right below. Also, please subscribe and leave an honest review for The Everyday Disciple Podcast on Apple Podcasts or wherever you listen. Ratings and reviews are extremely helpful and greatly appreciated! They do matter in the rankings of the show, and we read each and every one of them. Links and Resources Mentioned in This Episode: Free Download of the Big 3 For Episode #410 Get the Everyday Disciple Workshop here. Coaching with Caesar and Tina in discipleship and missional living.   Join us on Facebook

Transcripts

Caesar:

Chances are that a lot of what you really don't enjoy doing are not producing that much fruit or accomplishing the mission of making disciples anyway.

Caesar:

But all of us get caught on a hamster wheel of things that we've added to our list of responsibilities or someone else has that over time is a huge waste of our energy and resources.

Caesar:

Remember, we all have only so much physical time and capacity, but we also have a limited supply of emotional capacity to spend each day and week.

Caesar:

And if you're maxed out on both time and emotional energy, you'll hate your life.

Caesar:

You'll have very little to give your family, and you'll hide and or die under a pile of exhaustion, and you'll never have time for making disciples and community in your own everyday life.

Heath:

Welcome to the Everyday Disciple Podcast, where you'll learn how to live with greater intentionality and an integrated faith that naturally fits into every area of life.

Heath:

In other words, discipleship as a lifestyle.

Heath:

This is the stuff your parents, pastors, and.

Heath:

Professors probably forgot to tell you.

Heath:

And now here's your host.

Heath:

Caesar.

Heath:

Kalinowski.

Caesar:

Hey, my brother Heath.

Caesar:

How are you running today?

Caesar:

Running cool.

Caesar:

Running hot.

Caesar:

Running.

Caesar:

I'm running.

Heath:

Okay.

Heath:

, Caesar: how are you?

Heath:

You seem, you seem to be a little worked up over your day gig.

Heath:

Just slightly.

Heath:

Yeah.

Heath:

Not like, you know, anybody in particular, but

Heath:

just little.

Heath:

It's the grind of, of going.

Heath:

I wish they would listen to some of us that are boots on the ground.

Heath:

Yeah.

Heath:

You know, the day to day.

Heath:

Yeah.

Caesar:

People have something to say cuz I understand just to point out you're not working at the, at the church gig anymore, so, But that still exists everywhere.

Caesar:

Right?

Caesar:

It can, Yeah.

Caesar:

Here's another thing I have to ask you.

Caesar:

How's your computer been running?

Caesar:

Cuz I know you had some.

Caesar:

Problems and challenges with this thing.

Caesar:

Like it doesn't like wanna run unleaded anymore, you're having to put like special fuel in it or something.

Caesar:

Well it's funny How old

Heath:

is that?

Heath:

? Yeah.

Heath:

This computer's what, six years old?

Heath:

I was just thinking about that.

Heath:

All of our gear has our microphones,

Caesar:

our Oh yeah.

Caesar:

We cobbled together whatever we had running to make it work.

Caesar:

Yeah, yeah.

Caesar:

And still right.

Heath:

So it's funny cuz we're actually, you know, my power supply.

Heath:

We're in between episodes.

Heath:

I have to like plug it in and juice up a couple minutes before we go again.

Heath:

Otherwise, the battery's just, I mean, I can watch it just tick down from on . Yeah.

Heath:

Right.

Heath:

Yeah.

Caesar:

But I've never been a pc.

Caesar:

Yeah.

Caesar:

I mean, well I was years ago.

Caesar:

Okay.

Caesar:

Um, and then I had a buddy, uh, of mine who was so Mac like evangelist guy.

Caesar:

Yeah.

Caesar:

You know, um, when I was working at the big church and he finally said, Listen, just try a Mac.

Caesar:

You're never ever gonna regret it.

Caesar:

And so I, you know, I don't know.

Caesar:

We're gonna go there and we're gonna get into this big debate and listeners are gonna be all over us.

Caesar:

And then it's Mac or PC pc tell macro pc, then it's gonna be like boxers or briefs and big fist cuffs.

Caesar:

, maybe.

Caesar:

But maybe there's someone out there that wants to help Heath get a new computer.

Caesar:

If you're out there, that'd be nice.

Caesar:

It's gotta be a max, so don't offer to give him your used, you know, uh, compact 2 86 or whatever.

Caesar:

But pick up an old Dell at a garage

Heath:

sale.

Heath:

He's running.

Caesar:

Yeah.

Caesar:

He's high octane to keep the show.

Caesar:

But seriously, if there's anybody out there that wants to help Heath, you know, and maybe we can put you on a show or put you on his podcast or something.

Caesar:

That

Heath:

fun, wouldn't it?

Heath:

Oh, I was, I was, I will say I was a PC guy.

Heath:

When I got in the music business, everyone said, Hey, you have to have Mac's, cuz that's kind of how we roll, which makes sense for production, that sort of stuff.

Heath:

Yeah.

Heath:

This would be really hard to do these shows on a pc.

Heath:

It would be, the job I'm at now gave, issued me a pc and the first few months it's like my grandma learning.

Heath:

Like I'm, I'm a 35 year old dude trying to figure out how to type and I look like a 94 year old woman trying to figure out where the keys are at.

Heath:

Why do I have to use F Keys?

Heath:

, Caesar: Every time I do, I I go, F you cap

Heath:

the caps.

Heath:

F Oh no.

Heath:

Well tell us in the Facebook group if you're a Mac or PC person, let's, let's cause some unnecessary fighting.

Heath:

Hey,

Caesar:

the group has gotten large.

Caesar:

Yeah, it's amazing.

Caesar:

Thousands of people now.

Caesar:

So please jump in the water's fine.

Caesar:

Tell us if you're a Mac PC box or brief.

Caesar:

Either way, you know, keep you, I

Heath:

will say the way that you do get blocked, cuz I've had to block a couple people recently, we haven't even talked about this, is people that are posting promotional videos of themselves.

Heath:

On the Facebook group.

Caesar:

Yeah.

Caesar:

That's not what it's for.

Caesar:

No family.

Caesar:

We're not gonna make you more famous.

Caesar:

Yes.

Caesar:

People trying to put their livestream up.

Caesar:

That's not what it's for.

Caesar:

Yeah.

Caesar:

We're not doing this.

Caesar:

No.

Caesar:

I mean, good, God bless you.

Caesar:

But no, this is to have discussions around discipleship and, and the topics for that week primarily so that it's not like back 800 episodes, but, and then people are helping each other a lot.

Caesar:

Like, Hey, I'm trying to find that one episode about this or that.

Caesar:

How do I find this?

Caesar:

And someone else will search it up and go, I think it's this one.

Caesar:

You know?

Caesar:

Yeah.

Caesar:

So good on you.

Caesar:

And if you're a

Heath:

PC person, we've got a whole community of people that are experts in walking you from unbelief to belief into the Macintosh land.

Caesar:

Exactly.

Caesar:

All right.

Caesar:

Now, today, this ancient, I don't know, distorted model of the pastor, ceo, Jack of all trades, has to do everything.

Caesar:

And then if as we grow, he gets lots and lots of assistance, that's always gonna kill people.

Caesar:

Yeah.

Caesar:

And I, I don't know of any businesses that are run that way where, you know, the person who's the CEO has to be good at everything.

Caesar:

Sure.

Caesar:

You know?

Caesar:

Yep.

Caesar:

You know, Anyway, so I hope not, man.

Caesar:

I don't wanna kill anybody.

Caesar:

And that's kinda what I wanna talk to about today.

Caesar:

Uh, address today is, is I, I think that, that going forward, and this is this, I would've had the same, In fact, I've been, I've been kinda scratching my head around this topic mm-hmm.

Caesar:

way before there was ever anything called Covid 19 that we were aware of.

Caesar:

Sure.

Caesar:

Is that I think.

Caesar:

A lot of pastors, a lot of leaders, so it doesn't even have to be paid staff or anything, but just people leading in, in churches and in community groups and all, they probably could stop doing 80% of what they are currently doing.

Caesar:

Yep.

Caesar:

And, and they'd be healthier for it, and they'd be able to focus on that 20% that's actually producing fruit.

Caesar:

That's kind of where I wanna go today.

Caesar:

I.

Caesar:

Yeah,

Heath:

man, it makes sense.

Heath:

And I, you know, as you, even as you're talking, I'm just sort of wondering like, do you think that this is kind of the reality that we've been given and pastors are gonna have to deal with it as we wait for everything to pass?

Heath:

Or do you still think, like, as we've been saying here on the show for weeks, that this is actually a really amazing opportunity to make some core fundamental changes that are actually gonna propel the church on mission going.

Caesar:

Man.

Caesar:

I hope so, brother.

Caesar:

I really do think so though.

Caesar:

Okay.

Caesar:

I really do think God has given us a huge reset button of sorts.

Caesar:

Hmm.

Caesar:

Not everybody's gonna push the reset.

Caesar:

Sure.

Caesar:

You know, it's just like, you know, how long you been fighting that, you know, Tina's computer lately?

Caesar:

It's just like every time she hits a key, she waits for the cursor to react.

Caesar:

I'm like, What's going on?

Caesar:

Like, honey reboot.

Caesar:

You know, it's, I have, it's just, you know, so, but I, I don't, I think God's actually given us a reset.

Caesar:

And if we'll embrace it, the future of the church and our one true mission of discipleship will grow to include more of the priesthood of saints.

Caesar:

Okay.

Caesar:

More people exercising their gifts and serving others than ever before.

Caesar:

And I think pastors and elders and all church leaders can shift more of their time to equipping the saints for acts of service.

Caesar:

Mm-hmm.

Caesar:

, go look an Ephesians for, uh, and discipleship in all of life.

Caesar:

And see us accomplishing what Jesus commanded and promised us, which is maturity in unity as believers and more and more people being set free from performance based religion.

Caesar:

Yep.

Caesar:

And starting to truly walk in freedom with Jesus in all of life.

Caesar:

I think if we'll embrace this and shed certain things going forward.

Caesar:

Yeah.

Caesar:

This is what a what a s what a cool time.

Caesar:

So,

Heath:

How would you say like how does a pastor or other church leaders begin to reframe their roles and how they spend their really stretched thin time so that we can actually see the things that you described happening more and more?

Heath:

Because I've got some pastor friends who now I know are up against a crunch cuz they go, It's time for us to innovate.

Heath:

But now they have to give a, to either board or elders that.

Heath:

Strategically think like that.

Heath:

Yeah.

Heath:

And so they're kind of caught in this weird world.

Heath:

How do we serve

Caesar:

pastors in this time?

Caesar:

Yeah.

Caesar:

Well, again, I kind of tipped my hand a second ago there, but I think most pastors need to stop doing about 80% of what they have been traditionally doing throughout the week.

Caesar:

Yeah, traditionally.

Caesar:

Okay.

Caesar:

Some of the new rhythms are kind of cool.

Caesar:

And I think they kind of broadened out the week of like, Hey, we're a family all week.

Caesar:

Right?

Caesar:

Sure.

Caesar:

So I'm not, I'm not suggesting all that stuff needs to be killed or done away with, but, And the church elders are gonna need to back them up on this and step up to the plate themselves in order for this to happen.

Caesar:

Yep.

Caesar:

Okay.

Caesar:

So please think of this as family, not as like, well, you know, we hired you to do everything we could dream up, you know, it's your job.

Caesar:

And then well, you've got a part-time assistant for chronic, you know, like elders step up and be an elder.

Caesar:

Like lead, be the big brothers and sisters of this community.

Caesar:

Right?

Caesar:

Um, and here's what I'd say to pastors.

Caesar:

Start by assessing your personal.

Caesar:

I mean, this is, Let me back up a second.

Caesar:

Okay.

Caesar:

This is how I think you can get to like that, getting rid of a lot of stuff.

Caesar:

Okay.

Caesar:

Start by assessing your personal and your church's core values and why you exist as As a body.

Caesar:

Okay.

Caesar:

Do you exist to create loads of programming that's primarily consumed one day a week?

Caesar:

Is that your calling?

Caesar:

Hmm.

Caesar:

Okay.

Caesar:

Understanding what drives you like really gets you up in the morning.

Caesar:

Yes.

Caesar:

Will make it easier to stop doing things that are not really in line with your goals, your gifting, your church's values, your personal values.

Caesar:

Yeah.

Caesar:

Then start cutting out activities and tasks that don't support those.

Caesar:

Okay.

Caesar:

Look at what feels like drudgery to you every week and either cut that out or hand that to someone else in your church or staff that loves that stuff.

Caesar:

Sure.

Caesar:

Okay.

Caesar:

Chances are that a lot of what you really don't enjoy doing are not producing that much fruit or accomplishing the mission of making disciples anyway.

Caesar:

Hmm.

Caesar:

Right.

Caesar:

Yeah.

Caesar:

But all of us get caught sort of on a hamster wheel of things that we keep adding to our list of responsibilities or someone else has, and then over time it's just a huge waste of our energy in

Heath:

resources.

Heath:

Yeah.

Heath:

You know, even as you're saying that, I'm thinking of situations when I was in the institutional church working, um, it's kinda like a budget, a family budget too.

Heath:

You go, Hey, times.

Heath:

We've went from 5,000 to $3,000 a month, Some things are gonna have to get cut.

Heath:

What do they look like?

Heath:

How can we get creative in this?

Heath:

What do we really value?

Heath:

What's critical?

Heath:

Yeah.

Heath:

So this is actually a really good time for the, for the.

Heath:

The church, you know, your own individual church to go, Is it necessary that we have ministry here seven nights a week?

Heath:

Are there any that we can outsource to different locations and make that the new rhythm?

Heath:

And or could

Caesar:

there be new home versions of these things decentralized because now more people are engaged anyway.

Caesar:

And you know, things like Awana this year, are you doing Awana?

Caesar:

Like, Oh, we gotta get all back together and it's all gotta be in the parking lot, you know, in the church campus.

Caesar:

Why not do distributed Awana's, you know?

Caesar:

Well, and that's what, Or, or.

Caesar:

Vbs, you know?

Caesar:

Sure.

Caesar:

Like, why not distribute VBS and let's, let's have 'em all over the neighborhoods.

Caesar:

What an impact.

Caesar:

Right.

Caesar:

Well, well there's a hundred of those kind of things, so we don't have to just, you know, we don't have to get back to all that stuff.

Caesar:

And that's the sad

Heath:

thing for me is watching these pastors that are just chomping at the bit to get back to what was rather than going, Yeah,

Caesar:

man, we keep talking about this.

Caesar:

Yeah.

Caesar:

Our third or hundredth episode about,

Heath:

I guess we must really believe in it, huh?

Heath:

Yeah.

Heath:

And I've, I've even heard too about this 80 20.

Heath:

Yeah, I think that's what it's called.

Heath:

That says, uh, you know, the premise of it is that 20% of our work actually produces 80% of the results.

Heath:

Something like that.

Heath:

Yeah.

Caesar:

The 80 20 rules, also known as the Pareto principle.

Caesar:

Okay.

Caesar:

And, um, that, that's attributed to this Italian economist, I don't even know if I can pronounce his name right.

Caesar:

It's like Vireo.

Caesar:

Pareto.

Caesar:

Okay.

Caesar:

Pinocchio's father.

Caesar:

Yeah.

Caesar:

Something like that.

Caesar:

And it holds that the, um, 80% of results in any organization come from 20% of the effort.

Caesar:

Hmm.

Caesar:

And this has been studied like every way.

Caesar:

Yeah.

Caesar:

You know, it really, and it's, there's kind of a, there's a real reality to this.

Caesar:

Sure.

Caesar:

And that means you're probably spending 80% of your time actually not accomplishing much of what's truly important or moving the needle, you know, based on the mission, the goal.

Caesar:

Yep.

Caesar:

Making disciples.

Caesar:

And we've also seen the 80 20 rules show up in most churches this way, where 20% of people do 80% of the work.

Caesar:

Yep.

Caesar:

Right.

Caesar:

Is that true everywhere you've ever been?

Heath:

Yeah.

Heath:

Yeah.

Heath:

I've even heard 20% of the people do 80% of the giving.

Heath:

I mean, it's,

Caesar:

No, it's that.

Caesar:

No, it is that or, and that's like nine and people say, No, it's the 90 10 here.

Caesar:

Right.

Caesar:

. And a big part of that 20% of the church doing everything is the pastor and often his wife and his family.

Caesar:

Yeah.

Caesar:

You know, one time, um, Tina and I, we did a flow chart of responsibilities for a church plant that Tina and I were a part of.

Caesar:

And we were, we were getting ready to move and they said, Well, let's, let's get clear on all the things that you guys were kind of leading in and involved in.

Caesar:

Sure.

Caesar:

Kind of keeping, you know, your finger on.

Caesar:

And we were like in 17 key function slots on this.

Caesar:

Way too many.

Caesar:

Right?

Caesar:

We wonder why people are burning out, like, Oh yeah, yeah.

Caesar:

And so not, and I wasn't senior pastor or anything.

Caesar:

Sure.

Caesar:

This is just, you know, concerned, uh, family member.

Caesar:

Right.

Caesar:

So, not only does 80% of what is getting done not accomplish much, but the stuff that is important is getting done primarily by a small percentage of people in your church.

Caesar:

Hmm.

Caesar:

So let's, let's start to change.

Caesar:

Yeah.

Caesar:

Okay.

Caesar:

Please.

Caesar:

So use this idea, sort of this 80 20 thing, this Pero principle to refocus your schedule.

Caesar:

Yeah.

Caesar:

And I, I, I wanna just start creating a stop doing list.

Caesar:

Hmm.

Caesar:

Okay.

Caesar:

Things that you're gonna stop doing.

Caesar:

Yeah.

Caesar:

And, and, and you create that list from the 80% area.

Caesar:

Of things right, that aren't really accomplishing the mission.

Caesar:

Sure.

Caesar:

And, and start concentrating on the things that are bringing real results and bringing you joy.

Caesar:

And you're seeing multiplication, like there's a disproportionate amount of joy and momentum from this 20% of stuff.

Caesar:

This 80%, it's like expected, we gotta do it.

Caesar:

So from that 80% chunk, start creating your stop doing.

Caesar:

Hmm.

Caesar:

And let's start to grow the 20% of our church or community members that, that are already doing effective work.

Caesar:

Yeah.

Caesar:

Let's really start to give them our best time and effort to equip them and more and more saints for service.

Caesar:

Yeah.

Caesar:

And equipping.

Caesar:

Okay.

Heath:

You know, I don't, I don't want to break script too much here, but one thing that I think too is really important is just an honest assessment of what that looks like.

Heath:

Because there's some people, when you're in the rhythm of week in, week out, doing, doing, doing, you, you tend to not be fair with what is actually happening.

Heath:

And so there, I know there's all kinds of, even apps on your phone where you can log.

Heath:

You're weak and go, Oh, yeah.

Heath:

Oh man.

Heath:

I really spent way more time on this than

Caesar:

I thought.

Caesar:

Yeah, it's a good, within coaching and even leading church staffs.

Caesar:

Yeah.

Caesar:

I've had, I've done this many times throughout the years and, and no one likes doing it, but I go, Listen, I want you to log from the time you wake up to the time you go to sleep every 15 minutes, what you, what you got done.

Caesar:

Yeah.

Caesar:

You don't have to stop every, It's shocking.

Caesar:

You don't have to stop every 15 minutes, but like, if you were working on X, Y, or Z for like 45 minutes at the end of that, go, All right.

Caesar:

45 minutes this.

Caesar:

Yep.

Caesar:

And I've never seen.

Caesar:

Be much better than 80 20.

Caesar:

Like where it's like people come with their head hanging, like, I'm like, What's up?

Caesar:

And they're like, uh, just two weeks of doing that thing.

Caesar:

I hated it.

Caesar:

I'm like, What did you hate about it?

Caesar:

I know it's kind of a pain, you know?

Caesar:

Yeah.

Caesar:

But it's very revealing.

Caesar:

They're like, Exactly.

Caesar:

Yeah.

Caesar:

They're like, You know what?

Caesar:

I'm so embarrassed by how little actually, like the stuff, the right stuff I spend my time.

Caesar:

Wow.

Caesar:

Am I distracted on a million other things or stuff that I think people expect and Sure.

Caesar:

I'm putting a lot of extra time in and Yeah.

Caesar:

Or whatever pet project or it's, but it's not even moving.

Caesar:

Right.

Caesar:

Well, I'm doing that even

Heath:

at work right now where I'm going, like I got 12 hours of standing weekly meetings before I even get to start my work week and

Caesar:

80 20 buddy.

Caesar:

80 20 principal, take this home with you.

Caesar:

All right.

Caesar:

Here's another thing.

Caesar:

Okay.

Caesar:

Resist energy drains.

Caesar:

Like as you're, as things are starting back up and you're trying to, you know, look at like, Oh my gosh, I can't do everything we used to do and everything we still have to do and all this.

Caesar:

Sure.

Caesar:

You only have so much energy and if your primary motivation for doing a lot of what you're doing is like obligation.

Caesar:

Yep.

Caesar:

Or guilt.

Caesar:

Or just cuz that's what we've always done or whatever.

Caesar:

That's not a wise use of your time.

Caesar:

Like Steward better than that.

Caesar:

Right.

Caesar:

You know?

Caesar:

Yeah.

Caesar:

Man up, woman up, whatever, you know?

Caesar:

Mm-hmm.

Caesar:

, pull up.

Caesar:

Right?

Caesar:

Pull up those big pants, you know, and who wants a pastor anyway, that's just doing their job merely out of obligation or guilt.

Caesar:

Yeah.

Caesar:

No way.

Caesar:

All right.

Caesar:

So know the people in your life and know the activities in your daily, weekly life that bring you energy.

Caesar:

Hmm.

Caesar:

And then prioritize those activities.

Caesar:

That's good.

Caesar:

Chances are those people and activities are square in the middle of that super productive 20% anyway.

Caesar:

Sure.

Caesar:

So you're not, you're not like, Oh, I'm forsaking all this stuff.

Caesar:

No, you're not.

Caesar:

You're focusing on the parts that are actually, you know, accomplishing the mission.

Caesar:

You're giving your time to those people who are probably getting most of that done anyway.

Caesar:

Yeah.

Caesar:

And you're looking for ways to start to equip more and more people to take.

Caesar:

Off of your plate so you can focus more and more on equipping and the 20%.

Caesar:

Right?

Caesar:

Yeah.

Caesar:

Does that make sense?

Caesar:

And remember, we only have so much physical time and capacity in life, but we also have a limited supply of emotional capacity to spend each day and week.

Caesar:

Hmm.

Caesar:

Emotional capacity.

Caesar:

So people look at their calendar and go like, Man, I'm really busy, or, I wasn't that busy this week, but man, am I fried?

Caesar:

It's like, you know why?

Caesar:

Cuz it was high emotional level stuff.

Caesar:

Yeah.

Caesar:

And when you're doing a lot of stuff you don't feel good at, or it's not in your sweet spot or it's not really in your values, That is, is eating up your emotional capacity.

Caesar:

Yep.

Caesar:

Regardless of what the calendar looks like.

Caesar:

So if you're maxed out on both time and emotional energy, you'll hate your life.

Caesar:

Yeah, you'll have very little to give your own family and probably your church, and you'll hide and or die under a pile of exhaustion.

Caesar:

Yeah.

Caesar:

And you'll never have time for making disciples in community in your own everyday life.

Caesar:

You'll just be like, I'm just too busy and I'm exhausted.

Caesar:

You know?

Caesar:

And, And you will be.

Caesar:

Yeah.

Caesar:

But you don't have to be okay.

Caesar:

You don't have to be, you know, this

Heath:

might get a little bit of flack too, but one thing I've found to be just kind of a practical tip, um, You know, it's like runners who just keep running and running and running, and eventually they wear out.

Heath:

For me, I've got an app, like a mindfulness app that twice a day just pings me to sit down for five minutes, close my eyes, listen to a little meditation thing, and I'm amazed how taking five minutes and slamming on the breaks and sitting there.

Heath:

Oh yeah.

Heath:

I mean, I, the

Heath:

next,

Caesar:

I did 10 minutes, three hours.

Caesar:

I just go, I did 10 minutes right before you got here today to record the podcast cuz I'd just been running today.

Caesar:

Yeah.

Caesar:

And I was like, I don't wanna bring that sense of like scatteredness and like, ugh, freaking out to, to this.

Caesar:

Which we love doing.

Caesar:

Yeah.

Caesar:

This is, this in my life is the 20% for sure.

Caesar:

It's moving the needle.

Caesar:

And so Yeah.

Caesar:

I totally agree with that.

Caesar:

I agree with you.

Heath:

So I'm sure pastors.

Heath:

Even church leadership are kind of listening to this, maybe a little anxious, and I'm kind of curious, , like how can leaders start to engage their roles and how they actually spend their time without everyone just getting freaked out or without them worried about being fired by the elder board?

Caesar:

Stuff like that.

Caesar:

Yeah.

Caesar:

Well, my guess is that that.

Caesar:

Pro for a lot of people, especially if you're pastor listening to this and you're leading, um, probably between 69% of your church's time and budget is spent in some way, um, around Sunday mornings.

Caesar:

And now maybe you'd say, Well, you know, Sunday's been closed, but now it's triple that to put it all online.

Caesar:

Well now it's coming back.

Caesar:

So now you're gonna have triple times triple right and that right.

Caesar:

But you're having so little time.

Caesar:

To release new Missional leaders, new Disciple makers.

Caesar:

Right, Sure.

Caesar:

To really equip people in their gospel fluency.

Caesar:

And, and that has to be addressed.

Caesar:

Yeah.

Caesar:

Cause there's always gonna be the next thing.

Caesar:

See, that's the, that's the thing about this whole beautiful opportunity that God's given us for like a reset, is that there's always gonna be something we can hide behind and, and all that.

Caesar:

And, and I always wanna be clear, I'm not suggesting that you change everything overnight.

Caesar:

Okay.

Caesar:

Okay.

Caesar:

I, you know, and I've talked to my buddy Mike Breen about this, and he's written on this, you know, there.

Caesar:

There's, there's always gonna be stuff that needs to be changed.

Caesar:

And, and his suggestion is you go after evolution rather than revolution.

Caesar:

He says, he says Revolutions are bloody and expensive, and usually ending everyone on both sides ends up dead . Wow.

Caesar:

That's true.

Caesar:

Right?

Caesar:

So you want evolution.

Caesar:

So I'm not suggesting you go and you go like, Listen, I was listening to the, you know, Caesar Heath, and I'm gonna stop doing 80% of stuff tomorrow,

Caesar:

What?

Caesar:

What we're trying to say is, you probably can get to this and you'll be so much more effective and have joy, right?

Caesar:

Sure.

Caesar:

So what do you do?

Caesar:

And so here again, this is some of Mike's language.

Caesar:

You know, imagine your church is a cart.

Caesar:

and a horse . Okay.

Caesar:

There are things in your church that are higher maintenance and they require a lot of organization, a lot of your time and attention, and that's fine, up to a point.

Caesar:

But the horse, the thing that pulls the court, the cart, that's, that's you and your best leaders.

Caesar:

Hmm.

Caesar:

Okay.

Caesar:

The people who are leading communities on mission actually really making disciples.

Caesar:

You know, they're the ones who are gonna lead the church into the future.

Caesar:

Really.

Caesar:

Sure.

Caesar:

The Missional frontier, if you will.

Caesar:

and they're gonna take the cart along with them.

Caesar:

Okay?

Caesar:

But the problem comes when we have carts that are just too heavy and too ornate, and elaborate and fancy, and lights and sound and action, and they're too inflexible and they are high maintenance.

Caesar:

Right.

Caesar:

Sure.

Caesar:

We wanna be a lot light, more lightweight than that.

Caesar:

Okay.

Caesar:

So if that's your situation, here's what I think you need to do.

Caesar:

You need to feed the horse . Okay?

Caesar:

Right.

Caesar:

And slowly make the cart more lightweight.

Caesar:

Hmm.

Caesar:

Okay.

Caesar:

Yeah.

Caesar:

That's what you have.

Caesar:

Start taking stuff out of the cart.

Caesar:

Like, Hey, you know, we're getting back to doing Sundays and Sundays used to include this, this, this, this, this, all that, and we spent all week getting ready for it.

Caesar:

Why don't we take some of that stuff off?

Caesar:

Like, like why could you not come back and say, you know, instead of having like the crazy light show and this and that and all the sound and the 18 piece band and special mu, why can't we say, you know what, scale it.

Caesar:

Scale that back a little bit.

Caesar:

Yeah.

Caesar:

We're gonna have like an acoustic, someone on a piano, maybe a couple of vocalists.

Caesar:

Yeah.

Caesar:

We're gonna be sitting down like the lights just come on.

Caesar:

That's where they're at.

Caesar:

We don't need 18 people.

Caesar:

Yeah.

Caesar:

You know, not cuz we're looking to fire people, but like we want them out actually doing the 20% stuff that moves and I wanna give them that focus.

Caesar:

Yeah.

Caesar:

So now think about your production meetings and how much they just changed throughout the week.

Caesar:

Yeah.

Caesar:

And what you could start to focus on.

Caesar:

Absolutely.

Caesar:

Here's another example.

Caesar:

If someone who teaches or preaches regularly, you're spending, I don't know, some people spend like 30 hours a week on their message.

Caesar:

Well discipline yourself to start to do it in 20.

Caesar:

Hmm.

Caesar:

I remember when I got to a point where I said I'm not gonna spend more than 10 hours a week on a message

Caesar:

yeah.

Caesar:

Really.

Caesar:

10 hours.

Caesar:

Guess what?

Caesar:

It's, it's, there's another principle here that says that something like the amount of time allotted will always rise to meet the need or vice versa or something like that.

Caesar:

Huh?

Caesar:

And so what I found is when I had 10 hours to prep a message, you better get it done in that 10 hours, , they were, they were just as good.

Caesar:

In fact, they were more concise.

Caesar:

They didn't tend to run on.

Caesar:

I usually had one big idea or two that were being totally developed versus I had to read every.

Caesar:

Commentary, everything.

Caesar:

Yeah, all of it.

Caesar:

It was all these disjointed things and it was proof texting all over the wall and it was crazy.

Caesar:

Right.

Caesar:

Hmm.

Caesar:

What?

Caesar:

You know what if we took that prep time and we took all that creative meeting time and it was all cut back by like just say 25% to get started.

Caesar:

Yeah.

Caesar:

Right?

Caesar:

Yeah.

Caesar:

And what if all the money usually allotted for Sunday mornings was cut back by a certain percentage and reallocated to equipping saints getting coached, right.

Caesar:

Developing communities that actually multiply, make disciples growing in gospel fluency.

Caesar:

That's how we're gonna make disciples and win the day, not getting back to everything else times a hundred plus all the new digital rhythms, right?

Caesar:

Yeah.

Caesar:

And.

Caesar:

I, I just say you gotta start taking stuff out of the cart.

Caesar:

Hmm.

Caesar:

What are those things you can, you know, get out of the cart?

Caesar:

Yeah.

Caesar:

Okay.

Caesar:

Now one of the things that I've learned over time is, um, you don't wanna just kill off things.

Caesar:

What you wanna do is you want to sort of defund them with your attention.

Caesar:

I think Mike calls it studied neglect . Okay.

Caesar:

You know, I like that idea.

Caesar:

Yeah.

Caesar:

Right.

Caesar:

So some leaders out there more prone to revolution.

Caesar:

And instead of being patient with the process, they take a sledgehammer to the cart rather than a scalpel.

Caesar:

Sure.

Caesar:

Right.

Caesar:

And when you do that, when you start killing off stuff, like, we're getting back together, but we've just killed everything and events and all these stuff, different stuff.

Caesar:

Um, and you do it all in one felt swoop, people will feel it and they'll freak out.

Caesar:

And maybe they don't even really know that it's not benefiting them or whatever, but they just feel like they lost something.

Caesar:

Right.

Caesar:

Yeah.

Caesar:

And so it's, it's a, it's a pretty easy thing rather than killing.

Caesar:

Stop resourcing it with your attention.

Caesar:

Hmm.

Caesar:

That's why he calls it practice neglect.

Caesar:

I call it just defunded.

Caesar:

Yeah.

Caesar:

You're not, I'm not giving it my time.

Caesar:

We're not equipping to that anymore.

Caesar:

Um, you know what, We're not paying staff to have 15 or 20 hours of production time for Sunday.

Caesar:

Mm-hmm.

Caesar:

, you can prep that up.

Caesar:

It's the same 30, 40 songs that we've done for the last 10 years.

Caesar:

Yep.

Caesar:

You can prep that thing up in a, in two or three hours.

Caesar:

Easy go.

Caesar:

If you don't know your.

Caesar:

By now.

Caesar:

Yeah.

Caesar:

And you got music stands in front of you, which has always been my pet peeve.

Caesar:

I hate it.

Caesar:

Yeah.

Caesar:

I never saw that at a concert in my life.

Caesar:

But you know, like we're just gonna start limiting some of these things.

Caesar:

Yeah.

Caesar:

And you know what?

Caesar:

In the body we're gonna ask them to be cool with it.

Caesar:

Yeah.

Caesar:

Hey.

Caesar:

Cuz if they are like, I'm not coming here because, you know, if there's not three electric guitars and two keyboards and all those bad, where's my choir?

Caesar:

You know, it's, Listen, you can let em go.

Caesar:

That's okay.

Caesar:

So let it go.

Caesar:

Don't remember, not evolution.

Caesar:

Or not Revolution?

Caesar:

Evolution.

Caesar:

Evolution.

Caesar:

Start by finding some of these things or suggesting a certain percentage be taken out of the cart.

Caesar:

And then, but don't just, don't.

Caesar:

Just take stuff out of the cart so you can add more of the wrong stuff in.

Caesar:

Go back to that 80 20 principle.

Caesar:

Look for the things that are making disciples, developing leaders.

Caesar:

Yeah.

Caesar:

Stuff like that.

Caesar:

That's gonna be key.

Caesar:

You have a, like I said, you have a, you have a very finite amount of time and energy and emotional capacity and all that, and attention, right?

Caesar:

Sure.

Caesar:

So whatever you're starting that you know from anytime you add stuff, something has to come out or you're doing worse at all of it.

Caesar:

Okay?

Caesar:

Exactly.

Caesar:

Now, please don't miss this too.

Caesar:

Okay?

Caesar:

Sorry, I'm running out a little bit here.

Caesar:

Please don't miss.

Caesar:

Um, we have to have, to have to start equipping more of our people for mission and Disciple making.

Caesar:

Hmm.

Caesar:

And, and see now is the perfect time to do everything we're suggesting here because we have a very real and plausible.

Caesar:

Quote unquote excuse.

Caesar:

Sure.

Caesar:

Right.

Caesar:

That our folks and our elders will understand, like we're coming out of a, something that's happened globally that's never before happened in the way that it's happened.

Caesar:

Yeah, exactly.

Caesar:

Before, so, well, there's been pandemics, not when we had sound systems and lighting and electricity and all that.

Caesar:

You know what I mean?

Caesar:

And all that, and Skype and Zoom and all this, right?

Caesar:

Mm-hmm.

Caesar:

, everything has and is changing, and there's no way that the pastor, preacher, ceo, Jack of all trades model of pastoring and leading different areas of ministry or children's mis river will suffice as we go forward.

Caesar:

Hmm.

Caesar:

And people all understand that.

Caesar:

Yeah, they do.

Caesar:

So it's like, you know, in sales and in marketing, you know, why, why do the sales all happen like a Memorial Day sale or like a 4th of July sale?

Caesar:

Like, oh, you know what, that's what I always think about as a new TV on the 4th of July.

Caesar:

They're just looking for a plausible reason.

Caesar:

To do something, make it change, spend some money, whatever.

Caesar:

Yeah.

Caesar:

Your body, your church, your people, and hopefully your elders as well, they'll all understand.

Caesar:

It's all different.

Caesar:

It's all changed.

Caesar:

It was crazy before and we weren't all that stoked.

Caesar:

Yeah, exactly.

Caesar:

About where, you know, how many disciples we were making and how that was going.

Caesar:

And now we're gonna try to do it all virtually and come back, but now we, instead of doing one or two services, we have to do four because we can only have this many people and all that.

Caesar:

Okay?

Caesar:

Create your stop doing list.

Caesar:

Okay?

Caesar:

Check it against your core values.

Caesar:

Hand off things to others that are important but don't.

Caesar:

Here, here's another thing.

Caesar:

Don't call it delegating.

Caesar:

And really what you're doing is abdicating.

Caesar:

Oh, that's good.

Caesar:

Yeah.

Caesar:

Okay.

Caesar:

Right.

Caesar:

A lot of people say, Well, I'm gonna start delegating a lot more.

Caesar:

And you hand it off and they crash.

Caesar:

Sure.

Caesar:

And they burn or they feel neglected or forced.

Caesar:

No.

Caesar:

Equip them.

Caesar:

Yep.

Caesar:

Equip them.

Caesar:

Check in with them.

Caesar:

How's it going?

Caesar:

How about you watch me do it this week?

Caesar:

Then I'll.

Caesar:

Help you, then you'll help me.

Caesar:

Then I'll watch you, Then I'll give you a little feedback.

Caesar:

Then you're on your own.

Caesar:

Come to me if you need help.

Caesar:

Take things out of your cart, defund, or exercise that practice neglect, right?

Caesar:

Then train and equip folks to take on things from that 20% part of the list that are really working and important, right?

Caesar:

And are producing disciples.

Caesar:

And you know what?

Caesar:

Don't be afraid of letting your people sort of fail forward or like I like to say, suck forward.

Caesar:

Yep.

Caesar:

and create new ways and experiences of, of, for doing things.

Caesar:

And here's what, here's what your posture needs to be as a leader to be able to do this, is you're gonna exercise low control over your people.

Caesar:

Mm-hmm.

Caesar:

, but high accountability.

Caesar:

Yeah.

Caesar:

You know what I mean?

Caesar:

Yeah, absolutely.

Caesar:

Low control.

Caesar:

So, listen, I don't have to micromanage all that cuz now I'm just busier.

Caesar:

Yep.

Caesar:

I'm, I'm, I'm letting go.

Caesar:

I'm not abdicating cuz I'm, I'm equipping, I'm delegating, I'm letting people, I'm having low control, but high accountability that they're actually getting it done.

Caesar:

Yeah.

Caesar:

That if I ask 'em to get back to me with any questions they did.

Caesar:

Although that's, that's accountability.

Caesar:

That's what adults do.

Caesar:

That's what family healthy family does too.

Caesar:

And you know what people are probably wondering right now, so you.

Caesar:

How do I know who to hand what to Sure.

Caesar:

Right.

Caesar:

And if you're a smaller community, you're like, Ah, there's nobody to give anything to.

Caesar:

It's like, Ooh, you know, who will take up these new leadership roles?

Caesar:

Sure.

Caesar:

That's what we're gonna talk about next week on the podcast.

Caesar:

Okay.

Caesar:

Can't go.

Caesar:

I'm already starting to preach now.

Caesar:

Right.

Caesar:

So, but yeah.

Caesar:

We'll tell you how to find the right people to do what with, but.

Caesar:

. Anyway.

Caesar:

There you go.

Caesar:

I'm gonna stop there before I get back on my preaching.

Caesar:

Soapbox,

Caesar:

. Heath: Yeah.

Caesar:

You know, I'm thinking too, that this really does show whether or not your church actually functions as a family or a business in the way the responses to this.

Caesar:

Yep.

Caesar:

If it's a, you're failing, there's a 90 day plan to get you to speed, or you're, you're fired, you're done.

Caesar:

Like, I mean, you're like, we're a business.

Caesar:

If there's grace, we're falling forward, we're learning, we're serving one another.

Caesar:

You're a family.

Caesar:

And so this, I think this is really where you can separate the, the sheet from the goats and go, we're a family, or we're, or we're a business and what are we, And this

Caesar:

isn't just about pragmatism.

Caesar:

Yeah.

Caesar:

So like, we can get more done.

Caesar:

No, it's, it's about are we doing the right thing?

Caesar:

Yep.

Caesar:

And taking 80% off while we've got this opportunity so we can give full attention to the 20% of the people and the things that are actually making a huge difference and, and making disciples and building the kingdom and seeing people come to faith in all that.

Caesar:

Because, let's be honest, so much of what we do doesn't Absolutely.

Caesar:

But we just keep doing it week after year, after, you know, we do millennials, so

Heath:

I'm working with a church right now who, I mean, they just spent millions and millions and millions on a new building because the pastor says that this is the way that you keep people coming.

Heath:

This is the way you attract people to Jesus by the lighting show on the L led D walls and,

Caesar:

Okay.

Heath:

All right.

Heath:

Keep it up, man.

Heath:

Okay.

Heath:

Right.

Heath:

Let's get to the big three.

Heath:

All right?

Heath:

Because as always, we wanna leave people with big three takeaways from today's topic.

Heath:

So if nothing else, things that you do not wanna.

Caesar:

And by the way, you can always get a printable PDF of each week's big three as a free download by going to everyday Disciple dot com slash big three.

Caesar:

Okay, so here's the big three for this week.

Caesar:

It's too easy to slide into more and more responsibilities and busyness thinking that we're being productive when we're actually not.

Caesar:

See productivity is not about packing as much as humanly possible into your day and your schedule.

Caesar:

Don't forget to look at your personal and family responsibilities in time as well.

Caesar:

Hmm.

Caesar:

Okay.

Caesar:

You are one person with one calendar and your capacity both in time and emotional capacity.

Caesar:

It's not limitless.

Caesar:

Yeah.

Caesar:

All

Heath:

right.

Heath:

You're right.

Heath:

You don't let the, don't let the church kill your family and everything else because you're working so hard to keep that thing fed.

Caesar:

You're like, Well, I'm busy.

Caesar:

Yeah.

Caesar:

So it must be, it must be good.

Caesar:

It must be productive.

Caesar:

Nope.

Caesar:

Okay.

Caesar:

Second.

Caesar:

Um, you have nothing to prove to others or earn from God by how you spend your time.

Caesar:

Hmm.

Caesar:

Okay.

Caesar:

Like I just let that soak in.

Caesar:

You have nothing to prove to others.

Caesar:

Or earn from God, who's the only one whose approval you need.

Caesar:

Yeah.

Caesar:

And you have it by how you spend your time.

Caesar:

You are deeply and completely loved right now because you're God's child.

Caesar:

That's good.

Caesar:

Okay.

Caesar:

Your loving father does not want you fried and freaked out and frazzled all the time.

Caesar:

Okay.

Caesar:

Ask the Holy Spirit to show you regardless of traditions and past expectations of others, what you should best be spending your time on for maximum kingdom fruitfulness and joy in your life.

Caesar:

Yeah.

Caesar:

Trust God with the results.

Caesar:

The pressure's off.

Caesar:

Okay.

Caesar:

And amen.

Caesar:

All right.

Caesar:

Okay.

Caesar:

Look at your current responsibilities and create a stop doing list based on your core values and the 80 20 rule of effectiveness that we talked about.

Caesar:

Okay?

Caesar:

Okay.

Caesar:

Like, stop, do that.

Caesar:

Like take out paper this week.

Caesar:

Sit down, do an 80 20 list.

Caesar:

You'll be shocked.

Caesar:

Okay?

Caesar:

Um, if you're real bold, do that whole time thing where every 15 minutes you log what you've been doing throughout a whole day for two weeks.

Caesar:

Okay?

Caesar:

That'll prove what we're saying is probably true.

Caesar:

Okay?

Caesar:

Assess how much of your time and efforts being applied to the one true mission of the church.

Caesar:

Which is making disciples of Jesus who make more disciples.

Caesar:

Yeah.

Caesar:

That's stark alone.

Caesar:

Yeah.

Caesar:

Do a lot more of that stuff.

Caesar:

Okay.

Caesar:

And start removing other things from your cart right away.

Caesar:

Your time is best spent equipping the saints for acts of service, not doing everything for your people and keeping them babies for years and years and years.

Caesar:

Okay.

Caesar:

There's your big three.

Caesar:

Isn't this freeing?

Caesar:

And again, before we scoot outta here today, I wanna invite you to get immediate access to the Everyday Disciple workshop.

Caesar:

We've trained thousands of people in this powerful framework of discipleship when we were doing our everyday Disciple challenges, and we always had people asking us how they could get and keep this training in all the videos.

Caesar:

Well, now you can just go over to everyday Disciple dot com slash workshop to get this simple and reproducible discipleship framework.

Caesar:

That really works for busy people.

Caesar:

That's everyday Disciple dot com slash workshop.

Caesar:

I hope you'll grab that, get that downloaded, start watching that, start sharing that with others, cuz now you'll have all of it.

Caesar:

All right, I gotta go for now.

Caesar:

I hope you'll join us next week.

Caesar:

I'll keep diving into discipleship and mission and hopefully help pave the way for this to be a whole lot easier and more natural in your everyday life.

Caesar:

I'll talk to you soon.

Heath:

Thanks for joining us today.

Heath:

For more information on this show and to get loads of free discipleship resources, visit everyday Disciple dot com and remember, you really can live with the spiritual freedom and relational peace that Jesus promised every day.

Pastors:

Stop Doing 80% of What You’re Doing!