If you've ever felt like something is off in your marriage but couldn't put words to it — this episode is for you.

Hasani and Danielle sit down to answer four of the most raw, vulnerable questions they've received from real couples navigating infidelity, pornography, and the painful road back to each other.

In this episode:

"My wife says she told me everything, but I still feel there's more. Is this intuition or trauma?"

"We separated after his affair, but we're still sleeping together. Is this helping us reconnect or making things worse?"

"I cheated years ago, we worked through it — but she brings it up in every argument. Did she ever really forgive me?"

"My husband says porn isn't cheating because there's no real person involved. Am I being too sensitive?"

What you'll learn:

Why full disclosure almost never happens without a guided process — and what trickle truth is doing to your healing. Why sleeping together during an unstructured separation is a fast track to divorce, not reconnection. What it really means when the affair keeps coming up in arguments years later. Why pornography is a betrayal even without physical contact, how it rewires your husband's desire, and why you will never be able to compete with it no matter what you do in the bedroom. Why the betrayed spouse almost always feels like they're doing all the work — and what the unfaithful partner actually needs to own.

This episode is for you if: You're recovering from infidelity. You're questioning whether you've been told the full truth. You're separated but still connected and don't know what that means. You've tried to move forward but keep getting pulled back. You're quietly wondering if your marriage can actually be saved.

Ready to stop navigating this alone? Book a Private Marriage Consultation with Hasani and Danielle at couplesacademy.org

Marriage Intervention is the podcast for couples who are done with surface-level advice and ready to do the real work. New episodes every week.

Subscribe wherever you listen — Apple Podcasts, Spotify, YouTube Music.

Keywords: infidelity recovery, betrayal trauma, pornography addiction in marriage, trickle truth, separation after affair, rebuilding trust, forgiveness in marriage, intimacy after betrayal, marriage restoration, emotional healing, porn is cheating, marriage intervention podcast, couples counseling, Hasani and Danielle

"I'm Not Attracted To My Wife Anymore." Porn Did That. | Marriage Intervention| 005 - YouTube

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p2yd9MuUCsA

Transcript:

(00:24) I don't sound like that. I don't look like that. I don't move like that. So that now when you see your spouse that doesn't do anything for you. It's like a peanut butter and jelly to a smash burger. You know what I mean? Men struggle to be turned on because they have created this appetite for the pornography and it's a quick fix.

(00:59) The wrong counseling doesn't work. >> The right counseling works. >> Hey, we're Hassani and Danielle and you're watching Marriage Intervention, where we answer all of your questions concerning infidelity. Han, we have a lot of questions that came in for today's show and I want to start with the first one and it says, "My wife says she told me everything, but I still feel that there's more. I can't prove it.

(01:54) But I think the deeper question is the idea that your spouse told you everything. And I would argue to say in most cases based upon the work that we've done that typically is not the case until you actually go through a process where someone's facilitating those conversations. And here's why. Typically, uh, when the affair comes out, there's a lot of questions, a thousand1 questions.

(02:39) We talked about this for years and it's almost like a faucet that drips and trickles water drop by drop by drop. And people do that when it comes to truly uncovering all things concerning the betrayal because they don't want to hurt their spouse or they fear the consequences of of what may happen if the truth comes out.

(03:29) time, right? What's actually happening on the exterior and then what's happening on the inside. And so often times what's happening on the inside is the emotional side. That's the trauma. That's those experiences that you're feeling. Those are the triggers that will result from other past experiences. But then there's the actual physical things that's happening.

(04:12) And there may be some reasons why she might be doing it. to your point, if she has not gone through an actual full disclosure process where she has been led by a a um counselor through answering questions and exposing the truth. >> Most of the time, she's going to answer questions and at the same time be trying to operate with some type of damage control.

(04:48) You want full disclosure because if you don't have full disclosure, that's when jump scares happen later, right? You never got the full truth and then something trickles out later and you were blown away and blindsided by it because you thought you had already resolved this. You didn't know that it happened in June. You thought it was in September.

(05:29) I mean, the fact of the matter is, Danielle, communication is probably the most important skill that you have to have when there's been a betrayal because by default, whether the unfaithful partner is conscious of it or not, they're engaged in deception. We we think that if I'm not, I didn't lie. I didn't tell you a lie.

(06:06) Sometimes there's an omission of truth. Sometimes you're given a false impression. Sometimes you're omitting information. Like there's all different forms of deception that a person is willfully consciously engaged in or unconsciously doing, but it it ultimately results in more confusion. The liar doesn't know what they're going to get.

(06:50) He's questioning that. Is that true? What we know is that if you haven't gone through a full disclosure process, odds are you do not have the full truth because at the end of the day, the person wants to preserve the relationship, the marriage, all the things, your heart, your mind. They don't know what's safe to say, what's not safe to say.

(07:27) Either I'm lying to myself about something, lying to you about something, keeping a secret from the spouse. So that's a lie. So there's deception all throughout it. And so in an affair, if you're keeping it up, you have to keep lying and covering bases and, you know, doing all types of deception or avoid >> completely avoiding.

(07:57) And guess what? I'm protecting you, right? Often times, they think that they're protecting the betrayed spouse by hiding information when you're really just continuously hurting them. And when the truth comes out, it's even more devastating because they thought that they had the full truth and then found out that actually D-Day was today.

(08:35) They're lying about the dynamics in the relationship. They're lying about things in general. So now because I don't feel safe with you, because I don't feel like I can tell you the truth when it comes to basic things like, "Wait a minute, you were supposed to be home at 6:30. Where were you?" Oh, I just, you know, I had I what had happened was I went to the store.

(09:20) >> Yeah. So the answer to the question is it's it's intuition and drama. It's both and actually get into some good counseling so that you can work through both. >> Absolutely. All right. Here's the next question. Um we separated after his affair, but we're still sleeping together.

(09:54) So, they're still legally married. >> So, that So, they're legally married, but they're separated. So, the more questions than answers right now because I'm thinking, okay, what happened in the marriage? Why that made them separate? Like, why did they separate, right? So there was obviously Okay. So it was his affair that caused them to separate.

(10:31) You're still giving your body to them. And that can feel like an internal betrayal, right? Because you don't have this person's total heart, mind, soul, body. You It's obvious that you're sharing it with this person. There's no fidelity there. So, it's a continuous trauma. >> Let's just say they're separated because of an affair.

(11:19) trained in helping you, a counselor who's trained to help you to be separated but actually work towards repairing the marriage is guiding you through a process of reconciliation. Right? So if they were under that kind of toutelage, it would be beneficial that they were actually taking those steps to re-engage and connect sexually and emotionally and all the other things.

(11:59) This can be highly destructive to the relationship and yes it could make it worse. >> That that's true because sex you got to understand there is a release of chemicals. There are a release of hormones and it could make you feel as if everything is okay because you have the bonding connection. You have the in love feeling that comes from that experience.

(12:39) And I need to be able to look at things and process things uh from a healthy perspective, not just an emotional perspective. And I think having the right guidance and the right steps can actually help. I mean, we've talked about this all the time. this sex fast that's appropriate for some couples so that they can build real intimacy, not sex, intimacy, emotional, intellectual and spiritual intimacy and form a bond and connection and then introduce sex.

(13:35) because you're in that situation again reach out connect um this is what we do we often times recommend controlled separations when it's appropriate for a couple when this is what they need in order for them to take a break, right? To get the counseling and the support that they need to learn how to come back together as one.

(14:09) >> So, now you feel betrayed, right? So, another affair has occurred because we're legally married, but under two different rules, but we didn't have any clear expectations. And I thought we were good to do whatever we wanted to do, but that wasn't your expectation. And now more betrayal happens cuz there's a lack of clarity.

(14:44) Like, you know, people are doing kind of finding clues and googling things to do. Oh, I've heard of this controlled separation. Let's do that. And sometimes it's necessary to separate, but you can't do it on your own without any guidelines, without somebody structuring how to come back together >> and facilitating what your journey looks like as you go through your journey.

(15:23) So, couple things we got to talk about. Number one, working through it. What does that really look like? Because many people do take a DIY approach >> and they figure, you know what? if we get a book, if we go to a class. I mean, to be quite honest, when we were in uh not a good space, the last thing I wanted to do is go to a counselor.

(16:03) I I need to submit to someone else's wisdom and authority. Likewise, with counseling, you cannot do it on your own effectively. And those who have tried, because we've had people who literally have gone away for the weekend, rented a cabin, and read the book, and attempted to do the work, and they were doing the right things in the wrong order, not getting the right results. Yeah.

(16:45) >> And I like the fact that they okay, they work through it. So, couples do this all the time. We started out by working through it, right? Remember the cassette tapes? You were playing it. You can start out that way. I mean, it's excellent to start out that way because that shows intention, but you can't just leave it that way because there's so many areas of recovery that will be just left undelt with, right? So, you know, when when you start talking about every argument, she brings things up.

(17:37) We go on psychology.com and we pick someone that looks like us that we like what they talking about and we just choose them because it says counselor or because it says PhD or whatever, right? And then you get into the counseling and you're no better off than you were before. So, it's important to to start someplace.

(18:15) So that again, we don't want to sound like a broken record, but like really it's important for you to find the right counseling. The right support is when you'll get the results. I hear people say all the time, I I'm not interested in counseling. Counseling doesn't work. >> The wrong counseling doesn't work. >> The right counseling works.

(18:53) This is what we will call the sufferer marital pattern that it seems like no matter what the issue is. It could be I was 5 minutes late for dinner or it could anything. I I I dropped something on the floor. The affair keeps coming up, right? And so it's just like it's a mystery why this couple's still together. It's a mystery why they can't overcome any issue and they're honestly always in like internal conflict.

(19:41) Yeah, probably forgiveness hasn't been truly actualized. And there's a role that both of you have to play in that forgiveness process. So, if if that's you, if you're struggling with this, you need to you need to get some help. So, the next question is a call-in question. So, let's listen to what she has to say. Let me ask a question.

(20:22) You know, I I'm my question is what is the work that she's doing, right? Because I hear this often. Um I'm doing all the work and um it sounds like, you know, she's gone back to routine. She's maybe I mean, I can only speculate what all the work means, right? She's going back to the routine.

(21:07) And we see this happen a lot, right? Like when the partner who has been betrayed has been forgiven or at least there's an attempt at forgiveness, they're likeoo, you know, I'm I'm in the clear. I'm off the hook. They go back to living life wonderfully, eating meals, the appetite is back, drinking and marrying and everything else.

(21:54) What are you doing? Right? And so I think that that's a huge issue and and and getting into the weeds of it would be helpful because you could um kind of help this man like figure out, okay, how can you show up a little bit more in this marriage like real talk? I mean, when it comes to marriage, husbands and wives, wives do a lot of work to support the husband in general.

(22:34) And you know, we take care of the children, we take care of the home, and obviously we work and we do a lot of things, right? And all of those things come naturally and with joy until there's a betrayal. When the betrayal takes place, every single solitary issue, flaw, idiosyncrasy, and problem with you is magnified a thousand times.

(23:17) And I think that might be what she's struggling with. And um you know, this man needs to to to know that that she's actually bitter. It sounds like she's living in resentment. And that only gets worse. Resentment literally transmutates into bitterness. And bitterness is a stronghold that has to be uprooted and takes a lot longer than if it were handled in the beginning.

(23:58) They've gone to seminars. They've asked Chat GPT all the questions. That's what they mean by doing all the work. They're trying to learn and understand what it is that they're going through. >> And typically, the unfaithful partner doesn't want to deal with it at all. They just want to move forward.

(24:34) you would need counseling cuz you're the one that's hurting. But the fact of the matter is if the unfaithful partner cheated, there was probably some hurt, pain, and brokenness in that person that led them to do what they did in the first place. And if they're not willing to acknowledge their own internal brokenness, then why would they get help for something they don't need help for? And so, I think there needs to be a level of awareness of what's going on inside of the heart and the mind of the unfaithful partner that caused it to

(25:27) So it does require work. And unfortunately, this is very common. We hear this all the time. And I think that there needs to be a reckoning in this relationship in terms of if we're going to move forward, this is what it's going to look like. This is what it has to look like because I can I can't continue to remain in this relationship the way things are.

(26:05) He wants the marriage and the mistress because maybe from the marriage, he gets stability, he gets family, he gets order and structure, but from the mistress, that's where he gets emotional connection and fun and sexual fulfillment. And so, you know, I'm I'm I'm attached to my spouse, but I'm attracted to my mistress. And now I can have both realities in my own space.

(26:50) >> Powerful answer. Let's talk about this last question here. I think this is a great way to wrap up this episode. Um, because this is something that's talked about quite often and comes before us a lot. The question is, "My husband says porn isn't cheating because there's no real person involved." >> But it feels like a betrayal to me.

(27:36) It is a violation to the relationship because I am fixing fixating my eyes on an alternative other. And what happens is forget physical sex. If I'm locked in to pornography, first of all, let's talk about how damaging it is to a marriage. I can have anything I want with porn. If I want light, if I want dark, if I want tall, if I want short, if I want Latina, if I want Asian, if I want African, if I want Caucasian, I can have it all.

(28:40) So it changes my desire. It changes my my my my temptations. It changes my appetite for sex. And so now, because of what I did, it creates insecurity in you because guess what? Now, if we do come together, you're covered. >> It's a blow to your emotions and your self-esteem and your body image because wow, she has big breast, you have small.

(29:26) I think one of the most destructive things and it's it's a blessing that we've not had this personally in our own marriage, but we deal with so many couples that struggle with this very thing, right? And it is so invalidating to the spouse. Now, there's way more men that are struggling with pornography than you have women that are struggling with pornography and watching it.

(30:10) Right? >> Same thing on the other side for men and women, right? And so you're you're so invalidated by it. But I think the worst thing and I don't know what chemically happens and maybe you can speak to this what happens in the brain >> but often times men struggle to be turned on by their spouses now right because they have created this appetite for the pornography and it's a quick fix right like everything is hot right then and there and they don't have to wait for it right it's instantaneous gratification and satisfaction of

(31:03) It's got it going on. And so this is what people are dealing with. And they're it's it's almost like they're they're caught up in their own trap, right? because they're so blame like I need you to dress like this. I need you to be more like this. I need you to try these physical acts. And I have counseledled many women who have tried their hardest to keep up to keep up with the pornography fantasies that their husband brings to the bedroom to no avail.

(32:00) I can watch a bunch of videos. I don't know these people. But then it's just like I want a little bit more because what happens is dopamine. And you said what happens in the brain? It's dopamine hits, right? It's a reward system. I I'm rewarded. But at some point, what is now new becomes normal, and I need something a little bit more.

(32:37) Like, there's technology where I can have a phone and lips attached to the phone. I'm kissing the lips and you have a phone with lips attached. And now we can kiss each other virtually through these devices. And those are the type of things that are being experienced virtually with strangers or with quote unquote pornography arena type experiences.

(33:19) It's just physical friction and there's no intimacy. >> And maybe that's what he's looking for really because that's all he's ever seen, right? And so I mean speaking on the other side of it like you know it's very painful and uncomfortable for a woman to operate in reality what they're seeing in the pornography.

(33:56) And and honestly, you're just becoming more and more distant because he's not satisfied because you're really never going to be able to satisfy that insatiable desire. He's going to finish with you and go right back to the porn because porn is an addiction, right? So it's like you're trying to accommodate, but the accommodating is only it's it's only making the situation worse.

(34:29) It's normal, you know, etc., etc., and they have no idea that they're stepping into a trap with a door that only opens on one side. >> That's a fact. And and just if we can be honest sexually, it has been said, studies have been done that the more porn you watch, it could potentially make you a lousy lover because you're modeling what's seen in the video.

(35:20) And it's very selfish, not selfless. >> It is. And it shuts her down. It shuts her down. So now you see her as the problem, right? Because she tried to keep up with it. She couldn't keep up with it. It didn't serve or solve the problem, right? So she shuts down completely. And now now you have an excuse, right? Because you won't give it to me. That's why I go to porn.

(35:59) Right. That's what you see. somebody who's got a bottle in their hand and they they're just all inebriated. That's what you think of when you think of an addiction. So, I you know, I'm discreet. I I I watch porn, but how many hours are you watching it? What is it distracting you from? What is it is it keeping you from? How much money are you spending to to support this quote unquote habit? And an addiction really is a uncontrolled habit.

(36:45) If you have more questions, tune in to the next episode of Marriage Intervention.