Shownotes
Business Building Insights
- Whatever is on your plate, you can handle it and move forward.
- Do market research to see if people can relate to your products.
- Learn from feedback and apply that to your business and product. It’s the way to “wow and dazzle” your customers.
- Once you see the demand, fill in the needs that are the most pressing.
- Reach your prospective clients at the point where they are most interested in finding a solution to their needs.
- Share why your products are special and unique to your customers.
- Establish strong rapport with partners (purveyors) and work with them collaboratively to find solutions.
- To retain clients, there should be active communication. Follow up with them on their orders and share content with them through newsletters.
Resources Mentioned
Hubspot – Generate leads, close deals and simplify your inbound marketing and sales process Shopify – Website platform for your business Google Alerts – Monitor the web for various topics and mentions Quickbooks – Simple accounting softwareContact Links
Website Facebook Instagram Twitter LinkedInGift Biz Resources
Join our FREE Gift Biz Breeze Facebook Community
If you found value in this podcast, make sure to subscribe and leave a review in Apple Podcasts or Google Podcasts. That helps us spread the word to more makers just like you.
Thanks! Sue
Transcripts
Gift biz unwrapped episode 234 We tell the story of impact
Speaker:behind our products and purveyors so that it truly becomes a
Speaker:gifting experience.
Speaker:Attention gifters,
Speaker:bakers, crafters and makers pursuing your dream can be fun.
Speaker:Whether you have an established business or looking to start one
Speaker:now you are in the right place.
Speaker:This is gift to biz unwrapped,
Speaker:helping you turn your skill into a flourishing business.
Speaker:Join us for an episode packed full of invaluable guidance,
Speaker:resources and the support you need to grow your gift biz.
Speaker:Here is your host gift biz gal,
Speaker:Sue moon Heights.
Speaker:Hi there Sue,
Speaker:and as always,
Speaker:I'm honored that you've elected to spend some time with me
Speaker:today. If you can even believe it.
Speaker:We're entering into the fourth quarter of the year.
Speaker:How can this be?
Speaker:I mean,
Speaker:wasn't it July 4th just like a second ago.
Speaker:Timing in the gifting industry always seems so off,
Speaker:doesn't it?
Speaker:Back in July we were planning for the holidays and now
Speaker:it's already action time.
Speaker:Executing on the plans created just a few short months ago.
Speaker:Time management with all of this is key and towards that
Speaker:end I have a question for you.
Speaker:How did your day go yesterday?
Speaker:Maybe a crazy question.
Speaker:I know and yes,
Speaker:you heard me right?
Speaker:If you were to rate yesterday,
Speaker:how much did you get done?
Speaker:How far did you advance toward your goal or maybe in
Speaker:your mind you're saying what goal?
Speaker:Many of you have told me you aren't sure whether what
Speaker:you're doing is the right thing for your business.
Speaker:You're confused that you may be focusing on the wrong things
Speaker:and wasting time and money and you compare yourself to others
Speaker:and feel like you're just not keeping up.
Speaker:Sound familiar?
Speaker:Maybe you find that you're busy all day long,
Speaker:but when you finish up,
Speaker:you haven't accomplished much of anything at all.
Speaker:I've been there too until I started working with what I
Speaker:now call the power of purpose.
Speaker:I made a free video for you that explains how to
Speaker:boost your productivity and get results using the power of your
Speaker:purpose. Isn't it time to make all the effort that you
Speaker:put into your business and your life do for you?
Speaker:What you've intended.
Speaker:Now, full disclosure,
Speaker:this video does lead into showing you my brand new inspired
Speaker:daily planner,
Speaker:but listen,
Speaker:you don't need the inspired planner to get all the advantages
Speaker:out of the power of purpose that I show you in
Speaker:this video.
Speaker:So if you're interested in discovering a new way to work
Speaker:through your days,
Speaker:so your time is intentional and your results are real,
Speaker:I encourage you to over and watch this video and you
Speaker:can find it it gift biz unwrapped.com
Speaker:forward slash planner that's gift biz on wrapped.com
Speaker:forward slash planner to tell you I'm excited to have you
Speaker:hear from our guests today is an understatement.
Speaker:There is so much gold in this episode.
Speaker:I almost don't even know where to begin.
Speaker:Somewhere around the 10 minute Mark,
Speaker:you'll hear a stellar demonstration of how to describe a business.
Speaker:It's rich in visualization,
Speaker:in purpose,
Speaker:but simple in its explanation.
Speaker:This is typical with our guest.
Speaker:Throughout the show,
Speaker:you'll get a clear sense of her level of professionalism and
Speaker:style that represents her brand perfectly.
Speaker:She's also a relatively new business owner,
Speaker:only three years in,
Speaker:but she's made huge strides and doesn't hesitate to share what
Speaker:she knows and what she's still testing.
Speaker:Besides our value pack conversation,
Speaker:what I love about our talk is the words she uses
Speaker:as she describes her business.
Speaker:You're going to hear things like purposeful purveyors and a suite
Speaker:of custom curated gifts.
Speaker:These phrases bring personality and flavor to a business and I'm
Speaker:quite sure they're used throughout her Workday with employees and customers
Speaker:alike, so enough of the mystery.
Speaker:Let's get to our guest reveal Today.
Speaker:It is my pleasure to introduce you to Liat child of
Speaker:packed with purpose.
Speaker:Packed with purpose is a specialty gifting company with a social
Speaker:mission. They curate high quality business and personal gifts that create
Speaker:an impact by sourcing products from purpose driven organizations.
Speaker:The result is a unique gift experience that leaves a lasting
Speaker:impression. Yeah,
Speaker:I was inspired to start packed with purpose after serving in
Speaker:the peace Corps in years in social impact consulting,
Speaker:advising C suite executives on how to best invest their corporate
Speaker:social responsibility and marketing dollars.
Speaker:She observed that these companies were spending billions of dollars on
Speaker:client prospect and employee gifts that were often unremarkable and sometimes
Speaker:just wasteful.
Speaker:Deciding there needed to be a better way to integrate business
Speaker:strategy and social purpose into gifting.
Speaker:Liat founded packed with purpose in 2016 Liat welcome to the
Speaker:gift biz on repped podcast.
Speaker:Thanks so much for having me through.
Speaker:I'm delighted to be here.
Speaker:I am thrilled you're here too and we've talked about this
Speaker:for a little while and we finally gotten it together,
Speaker:so that's awesome.
Speaker:I start off each show by having you describe yourself in
Speaker:a little bit of a different way and that is through
Speaker:a motivational candle.
Speaker:We have all creatives listening here and this is a fun
Speaker:way to see a little bit of a different side of
Speaker:you. So if you were to share with us what you're
Speaker:all about through a motivational candle,
Speaker:what color would it be and what would be the quote
Speaker:on your candle?
Speaker:I love this question,
Speaker:Sue, and my motivational candle would be turquoise because I love
Speaker:that color.
Speaker:I gravitate to it because it's soothing and powerful and inspiring.
Speaker:And the quote would say,
Speaker:you've got this,
Speaker:and I'd include that quote because no matter who you are,
Speaker:what day it is,
Speaker:you might have some hesitations.
Speaker:You might have some apprehension to do something.
Speaker:And I think that that would be a short reminder that
Speaker:really no matter what it is on your plate,
Speaker:you can handle it and you can move forward.
Speaker:I love it.
Speaker:I think so often we're our own worst enemies we think,
Speaker:think, think and then we put up all these obstacles where
Speaker:if we just would use what you're saying,
Speaker:you've got this,
Speaker:we really have everything we need inside of us to accomplish
Speaker:a lot of what our goal is.
Speaker:I couldn't agree more.
Speaker:Yeah. So take us back to when you were just in
Speaker:the concept mode of packed with purpose and maybe even before
Speaker:that, maybe in serving in peace Corps years,
Speaker:but how did the progression go to get to where you
Speaker:are today?
Speaker:Sure. So I started having the idea of packed with purpose
Speaker:in 2016 and my professional journey was really a dance between
Speaker:the area of marketing and social impact.
Speaker:So a few points along that stop.
Speaker:I was a peace Corps volunteer in Paraguayan where I really
Speaker:helped to build economic stability for my community.
Speaker:But then I also worked at a digital agency in marketing
Speaker:strategy consulting and in social impact consulting.
Speaker:So I really sort of flip flop between using my skills
Speaker:to do good and using my knowledge and bring to help
Speaker:businesses through marketing.
Speaker:So in 2016 I was consulting and advising to chief sustainability
Speaker:officers and their teams and marketing teams on how they should
Speaker:invest their citizenship or corporate social responsibility dollars to positively impact
Speaker:the business,
Speaker:but then also to positively impact society.
Speaker:And it was a cold day in Chicago in December,
Speaker:our office was littered with typical holiday gifts,
Speaker:so your Wicker basket of fruit or your box of cookies.
Speaker:And it just dawned on me that companies were spending really
Speaker:millions and billions of dollars on doing good and the best
Speaker:corporate gift that was available to us was more of the
Speaker:same. And it became clear that there was a real opportunity
Speaker:to provide a gift that also created an impact.
Speaker:And so that was where the first ideation of packed with
Speaker:purpose was born.
Speaker:So a question for you as I'm listening to your story,
Speaker:what was the reasoning for some of the gifting that they
Speaker:were doing?
Speaker:You talk about that it was clients,
Speaker:prospect and employee gifts.
Speaker:What were some of the purposes and the reason behind gifting?
Speaker:So the initial scenario,
Speaker:what the gifting need was,
Speaker:was centered around holiday gifts.
Speaker:So as you know,
Speaker:the fourth quarter holiday season is really where producers of products
Speaker:and gifts and the manufacturers of those items are really at
Speaker:an all time high in terms of the number of gifts
Speaker:that individuals and companies are sending out.
Speaker:So the real need that I noticed was around sending client
Speaker:gifts when a company was a B2B provider of a particular
Speaker:service. And thanking your client for working with you for that
Speaker:year. Really with the desire to say,
Speaker:I hope we get to work again next year and I
Speaker:hope we continue our operating agreement.
Speaker:Got it.
Speaker:Let's start talking about the evolution actually of packed with purpose.
Speaker:What were the first things after you identified this,
Speaker:what were the first steps that you took to establish packed
Speaker:with purpose?
Speaker:Yeah, so I'll give you a better sense of the progression
Speaker:from the initial idea to actually having a full blown prototype
Speaker:or concept.
Speaker:So it really all began where in my previous role I
Speaker:was exposed to various social enterprises or purpose driven organizations.
Speaker:And there was one product that was made by opportunity youth
Speaker:in Detroit.
Speaker:They made a delicious granola bite and it was part of
Speaker:a job training in 21st century skills building program for youth
Speaker:in the inner city of Detroit.
Speaker:And I just thought,
Speaker:well, what if I could bundle together a number of products
Speaker:like this one and tell the story of impact behind were
Speaker:no law or chocolate or coffee or a notebook,
Speaker:whatever it might be.
Speaker:Couldn't that be a great alternative to the ubiquitous payors or
Speaker:popcorn that is traditionally sent?
Speaker:So I started sharing this idea with some friends and some
Speaker:colleagues and I said,
Speaker:you know,
Speaker:what do you think about this?
Speaker:And the initial thought was,
Speaker:Oh yeah,
Speaker:and you're right,
Speaker:this doesn't exist.
Speaker:This could be great.
Speaker:So what I ended up doing was I took an alternative
Speaker:to the goody bag concept and it was my daughter's first
Speaker:birthday. I put together my first low fidelity prototype of a
Speaker:pack with purpose gift.
Speaker:I crowdsourced a logo,
Speaker:I found some packaging products online and I sourced products from
Speaker:the social enterprises that I was familiar with.
Speaker:And what I did was at the end of my daughter's
Speaker:birthday party,
Speaker:I had many friends that were there who could have been
Speaker:decision makers for their companies holiday or client gifts.
Speaker:And I gave them a gift box at the end of
Speaker:the party and I said,
Speaker:I'm going to follow up for a 10 minute call.
Speaker:I'd love to get your feedback and your thoughts on this.
Speaker:So that was really how I went from that first step
Speaker:of ideation to putting something together to start to get feedback
Speaker:and see if this idea actually had legs.
Speaker:Was this a goody box really for the parents of the
Speaker:children? Correct,
Speaker:exactly. Did the girls get their own goody box things or
Speaker:their own goodie bag?
Speaker:No, it was for her first year birthday.
Speaker:So at one years old,
Speaker:I feel like those kids don't even know what's going on.
Speaker:It's really a party for the parents and their friends,
Speaker:So, right.
Speaker:Well that was really smart because you're getting initial validation of
Speaker:the concept then.
Speaker:That's right.
Speaker:And I use that to get some feedback and that's what
Speaker:really enabled me to move forward with our real first prototype,
Speaker:which I launched as part of a Indiegogo crowdsourcing campaign.
Speaker:So that was the first way that I was able to
Speaker:get a product out to the marketplace.
Speaker:Obviously going beyond any friends or family that I knew and
Speaker:putting something in front of individuals that might be interested in
Speaker:the concept of packed with purpose.
Speaker:Were any of those initial mothers buying into the program and
Speaker:then purchasing it from the Indiegogo campaign.
Speaker:So from the feedback that I got from friends and family,
Speaker:I actually did have one individual who continued to buy packed
Speaker:with purpose gifts once we actually launched into what I call
Speaker:a real company.
Speaker:But then from the Indiegogo campaign,
Speaker:we did have several customers that they bought one gauged or
Speaker:they bought a handful of gifts and a few of those
Speaker:have actually continued to be supporters and customers of packed with
Speaker:purpose moving forward.
Speaker:Love the fact that you did the initial market research and
Speaker:you kind of did it in a couple of levels.
Speaker:So gift biz listeners,
Speaker:this is a good concept,
Speaker:particularly if you're not sure about your product yet.
Speaker:So you heard what Liat would say in his in terms
Speaker:of talking with some family,
Speaker:then actually introducing it to people in a more formal way.
Speaker:I'm still on this initial market research.
Speaker:And then we're going to get to the Indiegogo again to
Speaker:Liat. But were there any surprises from some of the parents
Speaker:about the packaging?
Speaker:Did you see some good feedback in terms of how to
Speaker:progress forward?
Speaker:Yeah, you know,
Speaker:I got great feedback in terms of what I'd call like
Speaker:use case scenarios.
Speaker:So part of what I wanted to know was does the
Speaker:product delight you,
Speaker:provide me some thoughts on the packaging and the design.
Speaker:But then I also wanted to get a better understanding of
Speaker:how would you actually use these gifts.
Speaker:So there was someone that said,
Speaker:Oh I would love to use this as teacher gifts.
Speaker:And in fact we now have a line of teacher gifts
Speaker:available online.
Speaker:And one of the initial customers has continued to be a
Speaker:consistent customer over the nearly three years of our existence.
Speaker:So that's one good piece of feedback.
Speaker:And then the other was folks who are really interested in
Speaker:better understanding the impact behind the products.
Speaker:And so what started with a simple postcard that had one
Speaker:line on the various products has now evolved into a really
Speaker:beautiful eye-catching booklet that showcases the impact of our purveyors.
Speaker:So sometimes you get feedback and it's almost like a bullet
Speaker:point and it's up to you to really tease out the
Speaker:learnings and apply that to your business and make sure that
Speaker:you're putting all of that feedback in the best light so
Speaker:that you can really delight your customers.
Speaker:Love it.
Speaker:So the booklet really sets you apart then.
Speaker:Correct. From anyone else who's doing box programs or something,
Speaker:this where there is some gift back because you're adding in
Speaker:the whole story.
Speaker:So do you have different booklets then for different boxes?
Speaker:That's a great question.
Speaker:So when we first launched,
Speaker:we had different cards for different boxes,
Speaker:but with our growth and with sending thousands of gifts out
Speaker:each year,
Speaker:that became operationally in sustainable.
Speaker:So what we have now is a comprehensive booklet that showcases
Speaker:most of our purveyors and it's got really beautiful photography and
Speaker:it's got a short quote about that organization's impact and that
Speaker:can provide each and every one of our gift recipients with
Speaker:the general theme for how all of our products and all
Speaker:of our purveyors do good without having to worry about the
Speaker:operational complexities of multiple inserts across dozens of different gift configurations.
Speaker:Right. And then it also gives you the flexibility if you
Speaker:want to bring product in and out of different boxes.
Speaker:Let's say something happens with one of your sources and they're
Speaker:no longer available or for short term aren't available.
Speaker:It seems like a much better solution.
Speaker:Absolutely. I think I'm recognizing right now,
Speaker:Lee, you and I have known each other for a while.
Speaker:We never really discussed exactly what the product is.
Speaker:We just started in with it.
Speaker:Do you want to share with everybody that's a box and
Speaker:it would be great.
Speaker:I know there you're right,
Speaker:But this is what happens when you know someone and you
Speaker:assume that all of that is common knowledge,
Speaker:Right? Yes.
Speaker:In terms of background,
Speaker:so packed with purpose is a business and personal gifting company
Speaker:where all of the products in our gift boxes do good.
Speaker:And as I mentioned,
Speaker:we tell the story of impact behind our products and purveyors
Speaker:so that it truly becomes a gifting experience.
Speaker:And we primarily focus on business gifting needs.
Speaker:So companies that are sending gifts to their clients perhaps to
Speaker:employees as an onboarding gift or a first year anniversary,
Speaker:thank you gift as well as to prospects.
Speaker:So companies that are looking to engage with prospects to educate
Speaker:them about their products or services.
Speaker:And then of course we also have gifts for personal needs,
Speaker:whether it's someone that wants to send a gift to their
Speaker:friends or family or even let's say a new baby gift
Speaker:for your colleague.
Speaker:And the array of products that we have in the array
Speaker:of gift collections is really fast.
Speaker:So we've got a host of typical holiday shareables where it
Speaker:might be an alternative to a gift basket that has fruit
Speaker:or has cookies or other edibles.
Speaker:But then we also have other gifts that might pair a
Speaker:tumbler and a branded notebook with a brownie that companies use
Speaker:as an awning gift or as a conference gift.
Speaker:So there's really a wide assortment of products in our gifts
Speaker:and generally we like to say we're helping both businesses and
Speaker:individuals send gifts,
Speaker:whether it's a typical corporate gift or it's an appreciation or
Speaker:thank you gift.
Speaker:Perfect. That was good just to ground everybody in terms what
Speaker:we're talking about.
Speaker:And of course give business owners,
Speaker:you can go right online and you can see exactly what
Speaker:we're talking about,
Speaker:how beautiful these boxes are,
Speaker:the contents that they have,
Speaker:et cetera,
Speaker:et cetera.
Speaker:And all of those links are in our show notes page.
Speaker:So we have talked up to this point,
Speaker:the evolution of the product creation.
Speaker:Let's mimic that with the evolution of business growth.
Speaker:In terms of the backend,
Speaker:things like you started by yourself.
Speaker:How did that growth happen for you?
Speaker:Yeah, so I think like many businesses,
Speaker:once you see that there is demand,
Speaker:you start to fill the need that's most pressing.
Speaker:So for me,
Speaker:one of those roles was an operations role and the other
Speaker:was a sales role.
Speaker:So there's a lot of complexity to,
Speaker:on the one hand it's simple.
Speaker:We're a gifting company.
Speaker:On the other hand,
Speaker:any one of your listeners that has a gifting company knows
Speaker:there's so many complexities from the products that go into the
Speaker:gift, making sure you've got inventory available,
Speaker:making sure personalized messages are accurate and as you grow,
Speaker:and the volume of what we're sending out increases,
Speaker:particularly in the fourth quarter,
Speaker:one of my first hires was having someone that could support
Speaker:the operations.
Speaker:So really initially it was operational support and then sales because
Speaker:as we had new companies that were interested in our gifts
Speaker:or individuals that were purchasing gifts online,
Speaker:we needed to continue to get the word out so that
Speaker:additional companies that might be interested in packed with purpose knew
Speaker:that we existed and we could educate them and help them
Speaker:order, you know,
Speaker:in an easy manner.
Speaker:How did you,
Speaker:or maybe you didn't have this issue,
Speaker:but I know a lot of our listeners do.
Speaker:How did you get over that initial,
Speaker:I'm going to do this all myself versus I'm going to
Speaker:bring in help?
Speaker:Well, when you start a business,
Speaker:when you're seven months pregnant with twins,
Speaker:I think it's a good reality check to realize that you
Speaker:can't do it all yourself.
Speaker:Having said that,
Speaker:of course there were times where I could have or should
Speaker:have hired someone even earlier,
Speaker:but we're all human and some of us decide to take
Speaker:that leap sooner rather than later.
Speaker:You were kind of forced into it,
Speaker:it sounds like.
Speaker:Correct. I was forced into finding services companies,
Speaker:people that could support the business and our growth because right
Speaker:out of the gate I knew I wasn't going to be
Speaker:able to package and ship several hundred or a few thousand
Speaker:gifts in that first year because I had twins in the
Speaker:NICU. So I already looked for someone to support the operations
Speaker:and a fulfillment center.
Speaker:And so that was a natural parlay to say,
Speaker:well, how do I find additional people that can support our
Speaker:sales growth and help customers know about who we are and
Speaker:help them in their ordering process?
Speaker:And at what point along the way then in this evolution
Speaker:where you,
Speaker:so were you past the Indiegogo?
Speaker:Oh yes.
Speaker:In the Indiegogo phase,
Speaker:I had a individual that was supporting me on the operations
Speaker:and because I,
Speaker:as I just mentioned,
Speaker:I started the business when I was pregnant with twins.
Speaker:I actually took about a six month break before I launched
Speaker:our online store.
Speaker:And so I was able to,
Speaker:let's say confine the level of complexity and I fulfilled all
Speaker:of our orders through the Indiegogo campaign.
Speaker:I was able to then focus on building our online website
Speaker:and then once that was in a good place and I
Speaker:had six month old twins,
Speaker:I was able to say,
Speaker:okay, let's actually open up the online store.
Speaker:A few months later I started hiring for sales positions and
Speaker:that's how we started to grow.
Speaker:Got it.
Speaker:I love that you bring this up because I think some
Speaker:people think that you go from not having a business to
Speaker:then having everything all at once and there's two things that
Speaker:you said here that I think are important because you were
Speaker:building your family and you were pregnant and all of that.
Speaker:You took it in stages too.
Speaker:First you did Indy Gogo product validation,
Speaker:two steps,
Speaker:product validation.
Speaker:Then you built your website and then it went full force,
Speaker:right? That's right.
Speaker:So it's not from zero to a hundred right away.
Speaker:You can go in stages and attack actually better to do
Speaker:it that way.
Speaker:The other thing I like about what you're saying is you
Speaker:integrated it into what was going on in your life at
Speaker:the moment.
Speaker:So I think so many people will start something and then
Speaker:maybe they have a crisis.
Speaker:They are a sick child or a sick parent or something.
Speaker:When we own our own businesses,
Speaker:we can put on the brakes a little bit.
Speaker:Still be productive,
Speaker:right? I mean to your point layout,
Speaker:you are building your websites,
Speaker:you are still progressing,
Speaker:but you can ebb and flow the business as you need
Speaker:to to fit within your whole life because your business is
Speaker:not your whole life.
Speaker:That's right.
Speaker:So now you have operations,
Speaker:you have sales.
Speaker:Let's talk a little bit more about sales because I know
Speaker:this is a challenge for a lot of people.
Speaker:How do you go and attract new customers and get new
Speaker:sales? So we do that through a number of different ways.
Speaker:I, I have a few individuals that really focus on outbound
Speaker:sales efforts.
Speaker:So they're prospecting and they're creating a list of companies or
Speaker:individuals that they think would be interested in corporate gifts and
Speaker:would be really excited about using a gifting company that embedded
Speaker:social good or purpose into their gifts.
Speaker:So that's one of the ways through outbound sales efforts.
Speaker:Another is through advertising and we focused a lot of our
Speaker:efforts on pay-per-click.
Speaker:So Google ad words we've got,
Speaker:whether it's executive assistants or marketing managers or let's call it
Speaker:regional sales directors,
Speaker:they might be at work and they're typing a client gifts
Speaker:or year-end holiday client gifts.
Speaker:And that's a way for us to reach our prospective clients
Speaker:at the point where they're actually really interested in finding a
Speaker:solution to their gifting needs.
Speaker:So I'd say those are two different avenues that we've focused
Speaker:on. Are you doing any Facebook advertising?
Speaker:We are doing some Facebook advertising and we have seen some
Speaker:initial traction,
Speaker:not as much as Google ad words.
Speaker:And I think part of that is for Facebook ads.
Speaker:Oftentimes people are on that.
Speaker:Is it outlet?
Speaker:So you're looking at that on a personal level and a
Speaker:social engagement tool.
Speaker:But it's not necessarily where the marketing manager who's tasked with
Speaker:finding gifts for their 300 VIP clients is looking to get
Speaker:additional information.
Speaker:Couldn't agree with you more and I think that just the
Speaker:whole popularity of social media,
Speaker:we forget some of the more traditional ways of approaching the
Speaker:market, which is Google ads.
Speaker:I've heard more and more people saying exactly what you are
Speaker:in terms of Google ads,
Speaker:so something to think about in terms of Google ad words,
Speaker:but also SEO because people can find you organically.
Speaker:Also. Are you guys doing any YouTube videos or blog articles
Speaker:or anything like that connected with your site?
Speaker:Great question.
Speaker:So we're not doing any YouTube videos.
Speaker:We are starting to create our own content in terms of
Speaker:posting organic content across different social media channels.
Speaker:So for us that is primarily Facebook,
Speaker:Instagram and LinkedIn because we are focused on that business professional
Speaker:and then creating blog content so that if folks are looking
Speaker:for gifts,
Speaker:let's say employee gifts or international women's day or client gifts
Speaker:throughout the year,
Speaker:they can find us based on content that we're producing.
Speaker:Okay. So all this sounds great.
Speaker:You clearly have positioned yourself well at the top of the
Speaker:organization. You have a lot of departments now that are helping
Speaker:you with all different types of things,
Speaker:which is why you sound so calm,
Speaker:Leah. Well,
Speaker:that's a facade too because so many people are Trying to
Speaker:do everything.
Speaker:And just in listening to how you've progressed in just three
Speaker:short years,
Speaker:I think a lot of it is because you've put yourself
Speaker:at the top,
Speaker:you've recognized the different avenues that the business needs to take.
Speaker:You're the one directing the ship,
Speaker:but you've brought in people who know what they're doing at
Speaker:each of those junctures.
Speaker:So you've kept yourself at a level where you can strategically
Speaker:direct the business and other people who are outbound sales experts,
Speaker:ops, et cetera,
Speaker:can work under you.
Speaker:And I think that's how you've grown also to the level
Speaker:that you have.
Speaker:But share with us.
Speaker:So it all sounds great,
Speaker:right? There has to be a story or two,
Speaker:but I'm only going to ask you for one where things
Speaker:weren't working so well.
Speaker:Can you bring us to that point?
Speaker:Absolutely. We're going to hear about one of
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Speaker:So I'll take us back to the very first days.
Speaker:So when we were fulfilling all of the orders related to
Speaker:our Indiegogo campaign,
Speaker:we just about a thousand gifts that had to be sent
Speaker:out in a week's period.
Speaker:And one of our purveyors sent us a product that was
Speaker:damaged. And basically we had a very tight timeline where we
Speaker:had to scramble to contact our purveyor,
Speaker:alert them to the issue,
Speaker:have them send us replacement immediately.
Speaker:Our fulfillment team was then put on hold so that they
Speaker:could accept the new product.
Speaker:And all of this was happening while I had really newborn
Speaker:twins. They were just about 10 days old.
Speaker:I was in the NICU every single day.
Speaker:So that is a backdrop made for a pretty stressful situation.
Speaker:But I think that keeping my calm and working together with
Speaker:my fulfillment team and with our purveyor to find the best
Speaker:solution that was as quick as possible so we could deliver
Speaker:on our promise in a timely manner to all of our
Speaker:Indiegogo backers was critical.
Speaker:Are there any tips or any suggestions that you have for
Speaker:someone who might be in a situation like that?
Speaker:I'm not sure what that would be,
Speaker:but I'm thinking relationships with vendors,
Speaker:you know,
Speaker:I'm not sure.
Speaker:What would you say?
Speaker:Absolutely. So I think,
Speaker:well one thing I would say is we affectionately call our
Speaker:product suppliers purposeful purveyors,
Speaker:and part of that is obviously the connotation of how they're
Speaker:doing good,
Speaker:but enough.
Speaker:Another part of it is that I don't view them as
Speaker:a vendor.
Speaker:They're really our partner in enabling us to create amazing gifts
Speaker:that wow our centers and ultimately gift recipients.
Speaker:And so part of that is establishing really strong rapport with
Speaker:them so we could immediately alert them to the issue and
Speaker:work with them collaboratively to find the best solution so that
Speaker:we didn't falter on sending all of these gifts.
Speaker:In a timely manner.
Speaker:And the other thing I would say is working with your
Speaker:counterparts and your internal team.
Speaker:For us it was my colleague who was supporting the operations
Speaker:and our fulfillment center that was working with us to get
Speaker:the situation resolved.
Speaker:So lots of people have good ideas and when you find
Speaker:yourself in a sticky situation,
Speaker:working with others and being creative with them will likely get
Speaker:you to a solid solution despite the odds.
Speaker:Perfect. But in the end it always comes down to relationships,
Speaker:doesn't it?
Speaker:How you treat people and the relationships that you have.
Speaker:Absolutely. So I know also that PR just traditional PR has
Speaker:played a role.
Speaker:Can you talk a little bit about that?
Speaker:Yeah, so I think I've learned a lot about what works
Speaker:in the realm of PR.
Speaker:And at the same time we've really just started to explore
Speaker:how PR can support our business.
Speaker:So a few words of console based on our experiences,
Speaker:it's really important to know what kind of PR is going
Speaker:to be most effective and important for you as a business
Speaker:based on your clients and the decision makers that you want
Speaker:to focus on.
Speaker:So in the early days I had a number of placements
Speaker:on TV shows and while that was flattering,
Speaker:a 6:00 AM segment on the weekend or a 11:00 AM
Speaker:segment on Wednesday isn't necessarily focused on the marketing director or
Speaker:the client service director that we wanted to court and to
Speaker:share the story of packed with purpose with.
Speaker:So we've moved away from a focus on TV and times
Speaker:that were not a fit for us to having placements in
Speaker:business related publications and publications that are focused on industries where
Speaker:we found we've had a lot of traction.
Speaker:So we've learned a lot in terms of how PR can
Speaker:help us.
Speaker:And I think with the tools of technology,
Speaker:we've also been able to see a clear ROI on which
Speaker:publications in placement are actually driving traffic and of that traffic,
Speaker:what is converted to an order.
Speaker:So that's been instrumental and hopefully all of your listeners are
Speaker:using CRM systems and solutions that can sort of demystify how
Speaker:your marketing dollars are having an ROI on your business.
Speaker:So important.
Speaker:I was talking just this morning now,
Speaker:one of my course calls about how it's not just overall
Speaker:sales, it's you've got to dig down into the data and
Speaker:see what's actually bringing that sale in.
Speaker:Absolutely. But how are you doing that for,
Speaker:let's say you've got TV placements,
Speaker:multiple ads,
Speaker:how are you able to track back where that's coming from?
Speaker:Yeah, so for the TV placements we were not able to
Speaker:have a direct track and that's where we also realized that
Speaker:audience wasn't who we were trying to reach.
Speaker:But for the write ups in let's say a business week,
Speaker:daily or in Forbes or in another publication,
Speaker:we're able to see which of those individuals comes to our
Speaker:website when they sign up to fill out a form.
Speaker:And so it might be filling out a form to sign
Speaker:up for our corporate newsletter.
Speaker:It might be getting more information on a custom curated gift.
Speaker:So if anyone finds us through one of those sources and
Speaker:complete any kind of form or sign up on our website,
Speaker:that's how we can track who is coming to us,
Speaker:let's say from a paid ad through Google versus coming to
Speaker:us through a PR placement And so on those forms,
Speaker:do you have tracking codes?
Speaker:We use,
Speaker:HubSpot is our CRM and that's able to pull the original
Speaker:source code.
Speaker:So for all of our contacts in our CRM,
Speaker:we're able to see if this was someone that is part
Speaker:of our database because one of our sales individuals has reached
Speaker:out to them.
Speaker:Was it through a networking event?
Speaker:Is it through a Facebook or Google ads or did they
Speaker:come through us through a referral code such as an article
Speaker:that we were placed in through PR.
Speaker:Perfect. I want to underline based on all that you just
Speaker:said right now to everyone who's listening,
Speaker:you heard how she started with what's the purpose and what's
Speaker:the intent of the PR.
Speaker:It's great to get local placement in newspapers.
Speaker:Certainly it's a credibility play.
Speaker:If you get in one of the big journals or on
Speaker:TV and I think there's a place for that,
Speaker:but then on top of that,
Speaker:is it really driving results?
Speaker:You can do a little bit for credibility,
Speaker:but then is it driving the results and you want to
Speaker:think about that beforehand versus after.
Speaker:I know a lot of you are also thinking about going
Speaker:into corporate placement.
Speaker:Either you want to sell your product wholesale or you want
Speaker:to do direct business to business through big corporations,
Speaker:big businesses.
Speaker:If you're in gifting and you really should think of what
Speaker:platforms that you're on,
Speaker:LinkedIn is starting to play a big role.
Speaker:That social media platform is transitioning from just being job creators
Speaker:and linking people in to being much more of a place
Speaker:where people are selling and buying.
Speaker:The whole thing is changing.
Speaker:Are you seeing that as well yet?
Speaker:We are in,
Speaker:actually we use LinkedIn right now as a prospecting tool,
Speaker:but we're actively evaluating whether we want to start pushing advertisements
Speaker:on LinkedIn because we have a really good sense of the
Speaker:job titles of the individuals that are actively looking for client
Speaker:gifts or employee gifts or prospecting gifts.
Speaker:And it's a great opportunity for us to get in front
Speaker:of them and hopefully help them find a great gifting solution
Speaker:that they might not have been aware of.
Speaker:Right. And I think your point also about Facebook,
Speaker:what's the intent when people are on Facebook,
Speaker:it's probably more personal and the decision makers who would be
Speaker:making a choice for your gifts probably aren't on Facebook when
Speaker:they're looking at that decision.
Speaker:That's not their mindset.
Speaker:But definitely they would be with LinkedIn.
Speaker:Absolutely. And the other thing I would say is we are
Speaker:still very much in the experimentation stage.
Speaker:So while we have a good sense of what the ROI
Speaker:is on our Google ads and perhaps that Facebook doesn't have
Speaker:as much result for us,
Speaker:there's still so many different tactics that we have yet to
Speaker:explore and to test out.
Speaker:And that's one of the exciting things related to starting a
Speaker:business and it's one of the challenging things that no one
Speaker:really has.
Speaker:The final answer.
Speaker:You will only have a sense of what works if you
Speaker:try it out.
Speaker:Absolutely. And things keep changing,
Speaker:especially where social media is involved.
Speaker:So what was working even a year ago is different now.
Speaker:I don't think that ever goes away,
Speaker:unfortunately. Absolutely.
Speaker:Okay. Let's switch a little bit over to customer retention.
Speaker:How are you working with your current customers to ensure repeat
Speaker:purchases? Yeah,
Speaker:that's a great question.
Speaker:So I would break this down into active communication.
Speaker:So after a customer sends a gift,
Speaker:having one of our sales individuals follow up to understand how
Speaker:has that gift received,
Speaker:or oftentimes,
Speaker:how was that batch of gifts received?
Speaker:They have any feedback periodically,
Speaker:staying in touch with them,
Speaker:sharing content with them through our newsletters,
Speaker:that is inspiring and educational.
Speaker:So introducing them to a suite of gifts and various purveyors
Speaker:and how our gifts create an impact so they can continue
Speaker:to be wowed and dazzled by what we do.
Speaker:And then also something that we're going to be doing in
Speaker:the next month is sending out new samples to some of
Speaker:our top customers so that they can be exposed to new
Speaker:products and purveyors.
Speaker:And that's a way for us to also jumpstart the conversation
Speaker:on their holiday gift orders.
Speaker:I love the idea of sending out samples because oftentimes the
Speaker:people who are purchasing never get to experience our gifts,
Speaker:especially if you're in a consumable business.
Speaker:Absolutely. So that's brilliant.
Speaker:Love that.
Speaker:You talk about your newsletters,
Speaker:inspiring and educational.
Speaker:I would imagine you have a ton of content because you
Speaker:can talk about any one of your purposeful partners.
Speaker:Is that what you call them?
Speaker:Purposeful purveyors.
Speaker:Purposeful purveyors,
Speaker:yeah. So they all have stories and photos and all of
Speaker:that. So is that what you're using in your newsletters?
Speaker:It is.
Speaker:Our content really varies from,
Speaker:and I should caveat this by saying we are just now
Speaker:starting to jumpstart all of our marketing efforts.
Speaker:So we've been sitting on a treasure trove of content,
Speaker:whether it's photos or quotes or stories about individuals from our
Speaker:purposeful purveyors or about how different companies or organizations at a
Speaker:whole are creating an impact.
Speaker:And then there's a host of other information around applying engagement
Speaker:and how has sending the right gifts or the wrong gifts
Speaker:can increase your connection to individuals and strengthen relationships.
Speaker:Not to mention a whole nother set of content related to
Speaker:the increase of embedding purpose and social good into companies and
Speaker:how that has been a differentiator for companies to attract talent,
Speaker:to keep talent,
Speaker:to enhance their client relationships and really differentiate themselves.
Speaker:So in a nutshell,
Speaker:there is tons of content for us to use.
Speaker:And as the CEO,
Speaker:I'm thrilled that we are now actively starting to use that
Speaker:to share why we think our gifts are really special and
Speaker:unique for our customers.
Speaker:Love it.
Speaker:So you have peaked my curiosity.
Speaker:So I have to ask you this question.
Speaker:What do you mean by good gifts and bad gifts?
Speaker:Yeah. So I think part of this is subjective,
Speaker:but I just read a fascinating article that said,
Speaker:sending your client branded sweater or a branded mug is not
Speaker:a good gift.
Speaker:It's a branded Monica.
Speaker:And I think part of what makes a great gift is
Speaker:thinking about what your recipient would enjoy receiving and also making
Speaker:that gift more personal.
Speaker:And sometimes adding that personal element is in the gift card.
Speaker:Sometimes it might be the content of the gifts.
Speaker:And so for many of our customers,
Speaker:specifically our corporate clients,
Speaker:they are looking at our gifts as an opportunity for them
Speaker:to showcase how they are taking active steps to be a
Speaker:better corporate citizen and how they're using their procurement dollars to
Speaker:create an impact.
Speaker:So for example,
Speaker:we had a wonderful financial services company that sent large gift
Speaker:boxes to all of their offices nationally and internationally so that
Speaker:they could celebrate international women's day.
Speaker:And the message was focused on how various products in our
Speaker:gift boxes,
Speaker:we're empowering women and providing them with job training and workforce
Speaker:development. So that was a really wonderful gift because it underscored
Speaker:the message that they wanted to share.
Speaker:It was as personal as it could be while also sending
Speaker:out dozens of gifts and it was a way for that
Speaker:company to share a message that was important to all of
Speaker:their employees.
Speaker:Listening to you talk,
Speaker:I wouldn't even say that you're just a specialty gifting company.
Speaker:I would say that you are a marketing specialist cause you're
Speaker:using your gifts and then you're offering your clients marketing advice
Speaker:of how they can heighten the perception of their business for
Speaker:their customers as well.
Speaker:I agree with you.
Speaker:I think that's an astute observation That is brilliant and it
Speaker:just gives me shivers over here.
Speaker:I think.
Speaker:I mean it's so interesting to listen to you because you're
Speaker:so early on still in the business,
Speaker:but to hear how much you have advanced is pretty incredible,
Speaker:I have to say.
Speaker:Have you gotten recognition along the way for the growth that
Speaker:you've had so far?
Speaker:We have gotten recognition,
Speaker:right? Sometimes it's a small Pat on the back that feels
Speaker:really good and other times it's a lift to the business
Speaker:that is remarkable in terms of sales.
Speaker:But I would say two points that were nice recognition along
Speaker:the way about,
Speaker:I'm going to say maybe a year ago,
Speaker:it might've been two now the years sort of flow together,
Speaker:but between a year or two ago.
Speaker:Then mayor Rahm Emanuel gifted a packed with purpose gift on
Speaker:TV, on air in windy city live.
Speaker:So that was great recognition and obviously a great way for
Speaker:people to learn about our product.
Speaker:So that's one instance and then we were recently one of
Speaker:three finalists in inc magazine and the ups stores small business
Speaker:competition. So there were over 2,500
Speaker:applicants and we were one of the three finalists that made
Speaker:it to a competition.
Speaker:That was just last week in New York.
Speaker:We actually got second place.
Speaker:We were thrilled with the results and it's a great way
Speaker:for us to get recognition from the business community and a
Speaker:resource and to resources really that are focused on helping small
Speaker:and medium businesses grow.
Speaker:Congratulations. While you know that I placed that question cause I
Speaker:knew that second one when I didn't know the results.
Speaker:So congratulations.
Speaker:That's awesome.
Speaker:Thank so much.
Speaker:A ton of visibility for you all told for sure.
Speaker:Absolutely exciting to see where that's going to go.
Speaker:Yeah. So getting back a little bit to some tactical things
Speaker:before we get done here.
Speaker:You've mentioned HubSpot is one of the tools that you use
Speaker:to keep track of customers tracking all of that.
Speaker:Are there one or two other tools that you find you
Speaker:just need to have and what you rely for your business
Speaker:the most?
Speaker:Well I'd say HubSpot is definitely an anchor beyond HubSpot.
Speaker:Shopify is what fuels our eCommerce website.
Speaker:Google alerts is actually a great way to stay up to
Speaker:date on news and terms that are important.
Speaker:So it might be corporate gifts,
Speaker:it might be social responsibility or social good.
Speaker:But that's a great way for us to be up to
Speaker:date on what the general community and business community is talking
Speaker:about related to our business.
Speaker:And another one,
Speaker:which is just a hard rule for finances for us as
Speaker:QuickBooks, which is what we use for all of our corporate
Speaker:payments and processing.
Speaker:Perfect. And I'm going to link to some of these sources.
Speaker:Give biz listeners also over in the show notes.
Speaker:Let's just jump back to Google alerts for one second.
Speaker:So you're talking about being an educational tool for you in
Speaker:terms of the conversations taking place online.
Speaker:Do you also ever use it to respond,
Speaker:you know,
Speaker:if something comes up or comment on someone else's blog so
Speaker:you can get attention out there for your business as well?
Speaker:We have not used it for that,
Speaker:but I love that as an idea.
Speaker:So I've made a note of that.
Speaker:We've used it really as we have an alert for our
Speaker:company name because believe it or not,
Speaker:there were instances in the early days and even now where
Speaker:we might be mentioned in a Roundup of top gifts or
Speaker:prospect gifts or personal gifts you didn't know about.
Speaker:And we would be mentioned in articles.
Speaker:And this was a great way for us to know because
Speaker:sometimes those journalists don't even have the ability or the time
Speaker:to follow up with you and let you know that you've
Speaker:been featured.
Speaker:So that's something that we use and really it's a way
Speaker:for us to stay up to date on content and then
Speaker:in turn use that content or articles or if it's a
Speaker:new study that was just released talking about the importance of
Speaker:social purpose and building progressive companies that are going to last
Speaker:for the next decade.
Speaker:That's a great way for us to stay up to date
Speaker:on those articles and use them in our content marketing.
Speaker:I was imagining just that it's great inspiration for your newsletters
Speaker:too. Exactly.
Speaker:Not to copy and paste what they've said,
Speaker:but just that's a topic that is interesting.
Speaker:I could,
Speaker:we could expand on it or however it would work within
Speaker:your newsletters.
Speaker:Yep. So what's coming up next,
Speaker:Leah? What's the future look like?
Speaker:So the immediate future,
Speaker:although we're in August,
Speaker:we are actively focused on holiday gifts.
Speaker:So I can't tell you the number of emails and calls
Speaker:that either I've received or my colleagues have received where the
Speaker:opening line is,
Speaker:believe it or not,
Speaker:but we're already thinking about holiday gifts,
Speaker:so although it's hot outside and almost 90 degrees,
Speaker:we're really thinking about the holiday season and that's what's on
Speaker:our plate for the near term and for the longer term.
Speaker:For me,
Speaker:it's really building the business,
Speaker:making sure that it is growing sustainably and that it's stable
Speaker:for each year.
Speaker:The influx of additional orders,
Speaker:additional clients,
Speaker:new purveyors,
Speaker:new gift box configuration,
Speaker:so there's a lot to it to maintain our growth and
Speaker:also to make sure that we never falter on a hundred
Speaker:percent customer excellence.
Speaker:That's beautiful.
Speaker:What would be your advice to someone who's just starting out
Speaker:and is a little bit hesitant?
Speaker:Might be a little bit overwhelmed with our conversation because let's
Speaker:face it,
Speaker:you've gone far fast.
Speaker:What would you say to someone who's kind of thinking about
Speaker:they've got a handmade business,
Speaker:they're just starting to think,
Speaker:but they just haven't pulled the trigger yet.
Speaker:Just haven't crossed the line.
Speaker:What would you say to them?
Speaker:So I would say just start sharing your idea.
Speaker:If you keep it to yourself,
Speaker:you're never going to know if it has his legs.
Speaker:You're never going to be able to hear someone's advice on
Speaker:how to make it a reality quickly or in an inexpensive
Speaker:manner or in a way that you could actually achieve.
Speaker:So share your ideas,
Speaker:share them wide with multiple people.
Speaker:The worst thing that happens if someone tells you it's a
Speaker:horrible idea,
Speaker:the best thing that happens is someone enables you to make
Speaker:that idea reality faster.
Speaker:And there's nothing more gratifying than that.
Speaker:Okay. So I know my listeners,
Speaker:and I have to ask this question,
Speaker:this is from all of them,
Speaker:but what if someone steals my idea?
Speaker:You know,
Speaker:I've heard lots of people being worried about that,
Speaker:and it might depend on your industry,
Speaker:but to hear an idea and then to actually put that
Speaker:into reality,
Speaker:even if someone thinks your idea is wonderful,
Speaker:there is so much that has to happen in order for
Speaker:that to take place.
Speaker:So unless you feel like you've got an easily replicable idea
Speaker:or product and you're talking to someone that's got the wherewithal
Speaker:to put that in place,
Speaker:I would say you're probably safe sharing it and really the
Speaker:most important thing is making sure you're sharing this with people
Speaker:that can give you good feedback and that you don't believe
Speaker:are prone to take your idea and run with it.
Speaker:I would say two to three years after initially having the
Speaker:idea of packed with purpose,
Speaker:there is so much that goes into building this business and
Speaker:taking that initial idea and making it a successful reality.
Speaker:So you might be concerned about someone stealing your idea,
Speaker:but there's so much that has to happen in order to
Speaker:actually do that,
Speaker:that you're probably better off getting some good feedback from people
Speaker:whose opinions you trust as opposed to keeping an idea to
Speaker:yourself and never bringing it to life.
Speaker:I agree with you there wholeheartedly.
Speaker:And I would also say no one,
Speaker:like if you look at packed with purpose and you shared
Speaker:the idea and someone decided,
Speaker:Oh this is a good idea,
Speaker:I'm going to try it myself.
Speaker:No one is going to be able to put together what
Speaker:you've put together Llyod it's just not going to happen.
Speaker:I mean they might have something that started off as something
Speaker:similar, but it's not going to be what you have here.
Speaker:Correct. And I think that's part of every founder has a
Speaker:vision for what they want for their company and no one
Speaker:can truly replicate it even if you share some of the
Speaker:bones of what that idea entails.
Speaker:Absolutely. All right,
Speaker:so our listeners I'm sure are very curious.
Speaker:Want to know more?
Speaker:Where would you send them online to learn more about packed
Speaker:with purpose?
Speaker:Well, they should go to our website,
Speaker:www.packedwithpurpose.gifts. You can see all of our pre curated gift collections
Speaker:and you can also contact us if you're interested in any
Speaker:corporate orders or custom orders.
Speaker:Wonderful. Leon,
Speaker:this has been so much fun.
Speaker:I am so impressed with what you've built.
Speaker:I love the fact that it has obviously the intent and
Speaker:the purpose and the overlay of the social mission,
Speaker:but what you've done with this business overall is really truly
Speaker:impressive. Thank you so much for coming on the show and
Speaker:sharing it with us.
Speaker:Thank you so much for having me Sue.
Speaker:So much direction and advice in this show.
Speaker:Leah used the adjectives wowed and dazzled at one point and
Speaker:I'm thinking that's how you're feeling right now.
Speaker:You might even want to bookmark this one for future reference,
Speaker:so on deck for next week is an interesting twist to
Speaker:the typical show.
Speaker:You may recognize this trend within the handmade industry,
Speaker:but it's still in its infancy,
Speaker:meaning there's a lot of opportunity out there for you if
Speaker:you're interested.
Speaker:We'll go into the details next week of course,
Speaker:and I look forward to us being together again.
Speaker:Then bye for now.
Speaker:After you listen to the show,
Speaker:if you like what you're hearing,
Speaker:make sure to jump over and subscribe to the show on
Speaker:Apple podcasts.
Speaker:That way,
Speaker:you'll automatically get the newest episodes when they go live,
Speaker:and thank you to those of you who have already left
Speaker:a rating and review.
Speaker:By subscribing,
Speaker:rating, and reviewing,
Speaker:you help to increase the visibility of gift biz on wrapped.
Speaker:It's a great way to pay it forward to help others
