63. How School Counselors Can Nurture Resilience with John Burnett

Episode 63 • 5th June 2024 • Counselor Chat Podcast • Carol Miller, School Counselor

dive in. I am so excited. The: 2024

John: Awesome. Hi, Carol. It's really nice to be able to speak with you and the other listeners. So my name is John Burnett. This is my 13th year in education. I started off teaching middle school Spanish. Really, really enjoyed it. But I didn't go to school for education. So I kind of got thrown into the world of education. And it's kind of funny how it happened. I was working as a bank teller and I was looking at a newspaper and that probably dates me and tells how old I am, but I was looking at a newspaper ad and they needed a spanish teacher at the local school. And so I went in thinking I was going to have this elaborate interview, and the principal was like, okay, so this is your room. This is when you start. And I'm like, wait a minute, what about the interview process? He's like, no, we need you immediately. You qualify. You start next week. And so when I walked into the building and I got my first set of students, I was really excited. I had all these activities planned and I was like, we're going to do so much fun stuff. And I never forget this one girl at the end of class. She's like, when are we going to do the fun stuff? But it was funny because it helped me reflect on my classroom management and my lesson planning on all those things. And I was in the classroom realizing that I was doing a lot of counseling already anyways with students who were having friendship concerns, problems at home. And so I was like, well, I might as well go to school and get my school counseling certification because I'm doing all the work already as it is. So fast forward. I started as a middle school, Spanish, a middle school counselor. Then I worked in elementary school, realized that I wanted to be a principal at some point. So I was an assistant principal. Quickly realized that that was not a fit for me, and I went back to my love as a middle school counselor, and that's where I am now.

Carol: Awesome. Awesome. And I, you might know this already, but I have a special love for middle school. I mean, I did that for a really long time. I have been a counselor a little bit longer, maybe a lot longer than then. You have kind of have done all the levels, but those middles, man, they definitely, they pull at your heartstrings.

John: They do. And people, you have to have a special love for middle school and you have to be a very special educator to work with that group. They are amazing ever changing. I have 6th grade this year and we loop with our kids, so I'll have them again in 7th grade next year. And I'm really excited to see what changes they're going to go through because we all know that they have that influx in 7th grade. And is that change?

Carol: Yeah, there is. When I was in middle school, our building was a five through eight building and it was just me. I was like the only counselor there. So I really got to see them go from these like, little peanuts when they walked in the building, you know, because they're still little when in fifth grade and then like these huge towering things to 8th and everything in between. And I always like to say that the middle school is stinky years and because, you know, it kind of is, but, man, they're just the amount of growth that they do and their personalities that develop, it's just pretty amazing. It is.

John: And I'm at a very diverse school, so a lot of my students come from many different countries, so over 40. And I absolutely love it because it has so many different perspectives. You get different cultures, you learn about so many different other students and their backgrounds, and it's just an amazing opportunity to be a counselor and work with all those diverse student populations.

Carol: Yeah, my. I'm in an inner city as well, but my school really, although it's a city school, it's not really very diverse. It's funny because a lot of the other districts around us, they are. We just don't. I mean, we're diverse, but not as diverse as some other districts that I've been in. But each school is different. And I guess that's what makes it kind of. Kind of unique.

John: Yeah. I mean, every day is something different. Working as a middle school counselor, any counselor at any grade level, but especially middle school, you literally never know what you're going to get when you walk in the door.

Carol: Right, exactly. So. Well, for our listeners, I just want to fill them in a little bit here. So John is one of our presenters at our summer counselor conference. And so I thought it would be really cool to have John on today to give us a little glimpse at kind of what he's going to be sharing in his session. And just so you know, too, like, John has presented, like, a lot of places. Like, he's a pretty big name. So we're really lucky to have John. Our little summer counselor conference, although I don't know if it's that little anymore. I mean, we get several thousand participants.

John: Some great people here. Like, when I saw the lineup, I was like, yes, I am so excited to be working with this group of talented educators again.

Carol: Yeah, the goal is to have, like, almost a Minneasca that's affordable for everyone to be able to go to. So.

John: And I love that because that's a great way to market it because I see so many people in my Facebook groups who are really wanting to go to Asuka, and if you've never been, it's really expensive.

Carol: It is. It is. And I have been to many Asuka conferences, and I've always had to. My district has never been able to afford to pay me to go or pay for me to go. So I've always had to, like, reach into my own pocket and pay for that. So I truly get the expense that it is and how much prep work it can be to, like, save up that money and skimp on other things around for, you know, a whole year. But, you know, PD is so important to me. I just think it's something that makes us better counselors. So I want. I want to be able to share that, that passion with everybody.

John: And it's great because a lot of counselors don't get a chance to get meaningful pd that is specifically for counselors, you know, in service when you go back to school. All those meetings are for teachers, and very, very few things are designed for us, for our development.

Carol: Exactly. So enough about, like, why they should go, because I think everyone should go, but let's just dive right in. Tell us a little bit, like, what your session's about. Give us a little.

John: Carrie. Awesome. So my session is titled nurturing resilience strategies for supporting middle school mental health. And so with that, I wanted to go, like, a bunch of different routes. So what I see as a middle school counselor, especially after Covid coming back and getting adjusted, our students are really struggling. So they are struggling with anxiety, depression, self harm, just a social anxiety. There's so many different things that they're fighting and dealing with. And we as counselors, it has made our jobs that much more interesting, I will say. But it really has been to where we're having to be very creative with interventions, with events, programs, school counseling lessons, small groups, like, all of those things. And so in this session, I really wanted to touch on a couple of different key points so that participants can get some ideas on how they can support the students and their families at their school. So one of the things I wanted to jump in on and talk about in the beginning is talking about trauma in general and how it affects our students. So our kids, they come to school and they're not blank slates. They have so many different things that they're dealing with. And we as counselors, as educators, we have to find ways to meet their needs and make sure that they have a meaningful experience at school. And so I talk about some of the things that they go through at home, some of the things, even that they deal with at school when it comes to bullying and different things that they experience. So trauma is a huge part of learning how to be an effective educator and counselor. And so I talk a lot about that, and then I give warning signs of what to look out for when students are struggling, when they have, like, mental health concerns. And then I, like, dive into, like, how to prepare a trauma sensitive school. So all these things. And after all that, the information, as far as the research and the thing, the knowledge, then I talk about, like, how to support students as far as individual counseling sessions, small groups, whole classroom counseling lessons, effective events and programs that counselors can put on at their school. So I'm really excited to talk about some of the things that I've done over the course of my career and help other counselors prepare some things and just talk about things that you can do, like, very easily, very low prep, very low money, like, financially, just things that you can do on your campus to support everyone.

Carol: Oh, that's awesome. I really. I can't wait to listen to it. So. It is. And, you know, I do get to listen to all of them before they actually go live. So I really. I'm looking forward to this. I can't wait.

John: I've already done the presentation. I just have to record it, so. And I'm actually finishing up a little bit of the slides because I love the color scheme this year. It's actually gonna see. I'm wearing the shirt right now.

Carol: Yeah, yeah, yeah. So I'm like, I think it's really important that, you know, we're talking about kind of, like, resiliency and. And, you know, so the theme for the conference is reclaiming our joy, because I think that's. And your session is just perfect, right? Because our kids, they do have all this trauma. They. We want to teach them resilience. I know part of me, when I'm working with kids, it's like, Covid was so long ago. Let's get over it already. But you can't. Right. It's just not something you can just get over, because it has really impacted them, I think, the kids, more than it has for us as adults. I think for us as adults, we've really had to pivot a lot in terms of how we deliver our lessons and how we provide activities that are going to be meaningful for them, because the way that they learn now is just so different than it was, you know, just a few years ago. But our kids are still playing catch up from that whole year that they really didn't have school.

John: And even socially. One interesting story that just happened a couple weeks ago is I had a student come to my office and he's in 6th grade, and he had his first heartbreak. And so he was really upset about this girl breaking up with him. And so I spent over an hour, like, just consoling him and going over different things with him and helping him, like role playing, like how to, like, deal with things like this and how to bounce back from it. And so, like, you were saying that these things, you know, most people would be like, well, just get over it. It's important to our kids in that moment because it's a big part of their life. Like, school is, of course, a part of it, but socialization is huge for them. Those relationships that they have with each other, the friendships, those are very, very real moments in their life, and we have to acknowledge those things and help support them and help them through them.

Carol: Exactly. Exactly. If you were to share some advice for, like, a brand new counselor, what would you, what would you tell them? Word advice.

John: There's a lot of things, but I would summarize it and say that in this role, it's a beautiful role and you really can make it whatever you want it to be as long as you have creativity and support from your admin team. And so one thing that I would say, especially to new counselors, come in with an open mind, specifically knowing that you're going to make mistakes. It's okay to ask questions, do what you can do, and stop looking at all these social media accounts and everyone else and comparing yourself to them and where they are. You may be looking at someone's year ten or year 15 and comparing it to your year one or your year two, and it's not on the same level. You can always get ideas from other people. But again, I just don't encourage people to compare themselves. It's always a good idea to look at someone and say, I want to try something similar to that, and then pick maybe two things that you want to focus on that year and then start small and then build from there.

Carol: Yeah, exactly. And to just, like, add on to that, not only is it that we might be in different places, like the people that you see online and things like that, that they might have more experience, but it's also their highlight reel. Right. Who's posting the worst job they did on something or a project that flopped and failed. Right. They're posting their highlight reel. So you have to take that into consideration, too.

John: No, I agree with that, and sometimes people don't even post the mistakes or things that they, the lessons that they learn, they'll post, like, the great things, but they won't post, like, when they made a poor choice or, you know, did something that they shouldn't have done, you know, not on purpose, of course, but the lessons that you learn from it.

Carol: Exactly. Exactly. So, you know, you don't know what they're doing or how many times they tried a lesson that just flopped. You know, I have lots of years of experience, and there are times that I've gone in to do a lesson and I'm like, ooh, that did not go very well. Like, I have to totally revamp that. And that's just what you do. As I think a good counselor. You're right. You kind of self evaluate and you say, what do I do? What do I need to do to do a better job the next time I do it?

John: Especially if you're working with back to back classes and you're teaching the same lesson, you're like, okay, so the first class is kind of your guinea pig. This one, if this one doesn't go well, then you figure out what you can revamp or adjust for the second class.

Carol: Yep. And there have also been times for me I've said, oh, I'm cutting that off completely. Let me grab a book.

John: Because you never know what you're going to get as far as student responses, as far as how they're going to receive the lesson. So it really is, you can prepare and over prepare, but sometimes you can't prepare for what's going to happen in the classroom.

Carol: Exactly. So I know this has nothing to do with your topic or anything, but it's just totally spur the moment here. But do you have a favorite lesson?

John: I have a favorite lesson. There's so many. Let me think what goes. Well, I'll talk about one of my favorite small groups that I did for students. So I submitted. This was towards the end of the year when testing was done, and we just had a lot of free time to just kind of do some fun things. And so I had a couple of surveys that I sent out and asking students, like, what forums would you like to participate in? Or many small groups. And one of them was that they wanted to learn more about social media and entrepreneurship and, like, how to start their own YouTube channel or TikTok or Instagram and how to build it. And I said, you know, this is actually really good because this is something that I have experience in. And I taught them not only just how to, like, record videos. But we talked about marketing, we talked about advertising, we talked about your social, your brand, like, how to be responsible, how to upload content in a consistent basis. We talked about determination, like, all those things that people don't see when it comes to, like, creating content or making digital products or all those things that people will look at and say, oh, Carol has an amazing product. Like, I love your calendars, which I do have your calendar, by the way, and a lot of different things. One of my favorite things from you that you've created is those mindfulness posters. Like, I love those. And, but, but people will look at those and think, well, that's just something great, but you also have to advertise it. You can't just put it out there and expect people to buy it. So I talked to that, about that in my small group, and our kids really, really enjoyed it, so much so that the next day they came to me and said, hey, is this social media candle? Is this a good topic? I was like, yeah. And so they were asking my advice and feedback.

Carol: You know, we're doing career lessons with actually our 6th graders right now. And, you know, of course they either want to be, like, professional athletes or a youtuber or a gamer, you know, so we have been talking all about pretty much the same thing. Like, you can't just say, hey, I'm going to throw this video up on YouTube and expect that people are going to automatically find it and watch it. And then you're going to have all this bucks rolling in from, you know, your sponsors and things. But it takes time to build an audience. And how do you go about doing that? And maybe there are some things that you need to learn still, because I have a couple kids, they're like, I don't have to do any training for this. I know exactly what to do. And so then, of course, I've been, like, pulling up some career terminology or career out there that are very similar but have a totally different title. And this is funny because this happened, like, just two days ago. So this one little pumpkin is working with me because. And she was just sitting at my table in my office because she had missed the class. So in New York, like, these career plans are required for all of our kids from k through 12th grade. So this is part of her career plan. And so she has to get caught up. And she's, she's all been out of shape because I'm making her do, like, a career cluster inventory and she does not want to do. I know what I'm going to do, I'm going to be this youtuber, she's telling me. And so I, like, I pull up some other career, and I'm like, okay, we're gonna skip this part. We're just gonna go to look up careers in the career cluster. I pull up one and she reads the description. She's like, they stole that. I'm like, what do you mean they stole that? She's like, that is a youtuber. They stole that. And she was 100% convinced that that job and the description of that job was stolen. I was, I couldn't stop laughing. I was like, okay, sweetheart, that's funny. It is what it is. I think this career title has been around a lot longer, but, you know, we'll just let it go.

John: And I love working with them when they're like that, when they're so convinced of things like that. Like, I've had a lot of them come in and say the same things, like, I want to be a streamer or I want to be a youtuber. And I always encouraged him. I said, okay, well, that's great. Now let's talk about what is your topic going to be, and let's narrow down your focus and so that you are prepared when you talk about that. And then we talk about the realistic side of it. Of course, like we were talking earlier, you can't just post things just to post them. You actually have to have, like, a plan. You have to, like, outline everything and be prepared.

Carol: Right, exactly. So, and I have a couple kiddos that one kid wanted to have a Amazon store because I guess he saw some stuff pop up online and things. He's like, I'm just going to run an Amazon store. I'm going to buy a bunch of stuff and I'm going to sell it on Amazon. And it's funny because I have a 19 year old that's in college right now, and he actually has an Amazon store. And he's always going to, like, BJ's and different places and buying all this, like, stuff. And so it's not uncommon for this, my kiddo to come home with like 500 bottles of, like, soap that he bought at like some discount place and then is going to resell it on Amazon. But, you know, it's still. So I'm like, trying to share, like, my kids experience of selling on Amazon. I'm like, but it's fine. But he still has to know something about how to keep an inventory and how to track his experience expenses and how he has to report it to the government for taxes and the kids like, wow, that sounds like I like business. I'm like, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding. I think we have a winner. So. But it's funny.

o was, which was in, I think,: 2022

Carol: That is cool. That is really cool. And, yeah, I. I tried making, like, one or two YouTube videos and I had to give it up because I was like, oh, my gosh, this is like taking forever and work. It's a lot of work. And mine was, like, super simple. I mean, it was, don't look on YouTube because it's pretty ugly now, you.

John: Know I'm going to look now, right?

Carol: Yeah. But it may or may not be under my real name, so. But, no, it was not. It was not good. And, yeah, so it does. It takes a lot of work, but I guess that leads us back to school counseling, because school counseling is really a lot of work. It takes a lot of dedication. It takes, I think, a passion for it, and you know, there's no magic number for how many hours you're going to put in or have to put in or. But it's all about just getting it.

John: Done, I guess, and then just over the years, finding what works, what doesn't work. You have to really be able to adapt in this field because there are some people who have been doing this career for a very, very long time, and what may have worked many years ago may not work now, especially with the way that our students learn. You really have to find different ways to connect with them and engage them and hook them into your lessons. So that's one thing that even I have learned and I've, like, perfected over the course of, like, teaching my classroom counseling lessons, I incorporate so many things that they're interested in. So I, like, talk about music. I'll put little gifs in there or memes or different things that just really appeal to them because I want them to be invested in it. And one thing about me is I'm a creative person anyway, so I love colors and different, vibrant things to catch their attention, and. And it's just, you have to do all those things in order to get their attention. You can't just put up a PowerPoint and have, like, 20 billion words on there. Read from it. Our kids don't learn like that.

Carol: Yeah, I. I use a lot of PowerPoints. I 100% admit that I do. But I am really, I'm animated. Like, when I go in, it's like a performance. But I kind of think that our kids are so used to all, you know, things in their face all the time with movements and action and, like, you almost have to be. You have to bring the energy, because I think the energy that you want to receive from the kids is kind of the energy you have to bring to them.

John: I agree. And don't get me wrong, PowerPoints are great. I mean, like, the ones where, like, they're just like the white screen and black words and there's no pictures and things like that. Like, you have some really great resources, like your growth mindset one. I really love using that one. So you give yourself some credit. You make some really good stuff.

Carol: Mine are kind of like. They're on steroids. My PowerPoints are on steroids.

John: Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Carol: So, yeah. But I have used plenty that, you know, and even when I first started, when I was, you know, I'm thinking about some of the PowerPoints that I did when I was, you know, a middle school counselor, and I'm like, oh, my gosh my kids would not relate to that now. And they're ugly. They're just like a lot of text, and, yeah, they have to be. You have to have something.

John: You have to have something in order to keep their attention and get them focused and. And invest it. One thing, a big thing, is, like, getting them invested in the learning and making them take ownership of their own learning. So I can come in all day long and tell them about a topic that I think is important, but if they're not invested in that part of it and they don't want to learn more about what I'm presenting, then I need to reflect and do something different. As an educator, as a counselor.

Carol: Yeah, because if. Yeah, 100%. Because if they don't want to hear it, that's it. It's. It's over. You've lost them.

John: And it could be a topic that they like, but if it's not presented the right way or it just may not go over well with them. So it's just a lot of trial and error. And so I just tell counselors all the time that no matter how long you've been doing this, it's always a good idea to go to conferences, read articles, read books, and just get some fresh ideas.

Carol: Exactly. You know what? We should do a conference together.

John: Like, I'm a little too.

Carol: We should. We should. This is. Could be for Asuka for next year. How to make.

John: They are. They have proposals today.

Carol: Yeah, I know. It's open now. How to rock your classroom lessons. I don't know.

John: We don't have to talk about that.

Carol: All right. Sorry, people. But, you know, we got important business here.

John: They don't want to hear this, though. Trust me, they're going to want to hear this.

Carol: So this is funny. Now I'm like, completely like, boy, when I think about conferences, I get all excited.

John: Me too. Because I love presenting, and I love, like, just the energy of that. Did you transfer within the, like, the audience and hearing their. And seeing their faces and seeing that light bulb that goes off? But I always tell people when I go to a conference and when I present, I'm like, I'm going to throw a lot of things at you. Pick two to three things and things that you can manage and do those. Don't try to do everything all at once, because you're going to leave this conference and you'll be overwhelmed with all the ideas that you have. But I would say pick two to three things that you know you'll be able to do. Like put a star beside those things and really focus on those and then, like, build it from there.

Carol: Yeah. You know, and if nothing else, even if you are at the conference and you're taking it all in and when it's all said and done, you're like, oh, I forget everything. We have notes. It's no big deal. You could always go back to them, but just keep that excitement in you. If nothing else, think about that excitement that you had, that energy that you were feeling, and let that carry you, because that energy, that's. That's what keeps you going, you know, on your roughest days, on the days that you're like, I don't know if I'm going to make it through, you know, or, boy, I have 20 more years in this profession. I don't know if I'm going to make it 20 more days, let alone 20 years. You know, you got to have that energy to just say, oh, no, this is temporary. This pain you have is temporary. You're going to get through. It's going to be fine and go from there.

John: And every day is a brand new day. I always tell people when you go home, that day is over and done. You reflect on it. If something didn't go well, then you start over the next day. And I was listening to one of your podcasts earlier, and I was. One thing that you said that really stood out is that there are times when you can have a checklist of things to do and you can knock off one or two, and that's a successful day. Even if you didn't get everything done. Hey, if you did something.

Carol: Yeah. Because there's always. There's always one thing. Although I don't know about today. We had a day today. I don't know if I got anything done. Well, nothing on my to do list. I got a lot done. I just didn't get anything on my to do list done today. But, you know, it is what it is.

John: This tomorrow. Even that.

Carol: Yeah.

John: Even if you don't get anything done, I bet you've made a difference in somebody's life. Even if you just smiled at them and your presence was enough. So that's what I always tell people, too.

Carol: Yep. That's all. That's all that matters. So I walked into a classroom today and they were like, misses, Miller's here. And that was it. That's my job was done. I didn't have to do anything because I was like, they're excited I'm here. Okay. Life is good.

John: Yeah, there's. So today was a couple different things. I was doing summer school. Of course, this is one of the things where it's, like, not the best part of your job when you have to call a student in and tell them they have to go to summer school. But I tried to balance it with other things, and so I asked the teachers to send me some positive office referrals of some students who didn't get recognized in our award ceremony last week. And I was like, I've got a lot of snacks to give out and some praise, so send them to my office. And this one little boy, for, like, the last, like, three or four weeks, every time I see him, mister Burnett, you owe me an ice cream. Just randomly, I'm like, I don't have. I always tell him I don't have cash. I don't carry cash with me. So when we're in the lunchroom every day, he asked me, and I'm like, maybe one day I'll get you some ice cream if I remember some cash. And today I remembered that I had an ice cream sandwich in our freezer, and I was like, I called into my office, and his little face just lit up because you remember.

Carol: That's awesome. That is awesome. Yeah. It's those little things that really can make a huge, huge difference.

John: Yeah.

Carol: So. Oh, all right. So before you go, because I want to be respectful of your time, and I know it's Lee, but let me see, what weird question can I ask you today? Would you rather be a hamburger or a hot dog?

John: And why I would rather be a turkey burger.

Carol: Oh, okay.

John: And the why I don't eat beef. So that's why I said turkey burger. But I chose burgers because they're more versatile. You have so many different options. You have, to me, you have more toppings that you can put on there when you think about, like, caramelized onions. Well, now I'm talking about what I like. Avocado, swiss cheese, all those different things. And of course, you can put a lot of toppings on hot dogs, too. But I just feel like with hamburgers, they're so much more versatile.

Carol: Okay, how about chips with dip or salsa and tortillas?

John: I use salsa with tortillas more because I love mexican food, so I'm gonna go with salsa and tortillas.

Carol: All right. All right. And one last one at the boy. I have to think of something good. Want to try to get off the food track here for a second?

John: I know, because I'm hungry.

Carol: Would you rather take a cruise around the world, or would you rather take a train ride and hit all the US states.

John: I love a good cruise. I cruise twice a year, literally. I go once in the summer and once during Christmas break because I love having somebody wait on me hand and foot. I don't have to clean my room, they can make up the bed and do all those things. And I can go just roll out of bed, get dressed and go see all the entertainment and eat like until I just can't eat anymore. And so I would definitely say a cruise.

Carol: Awesome. Awesome. Well, that was cool. I just thought it'd be fun.

John: So, yeah, I love it. I play would you rather with my kids all the time. Like there's some YouTube ones that you can put on and, you know, where they're aligned with some exercises and so it's a movement break, but it's also fun too. So I love. Would you rather.

Carol: Oh, I love it. I love it. Awesome. All right. Is there anything else that you might want to share with any of our listeners?

John: There's a lot of things. I always have to summarize what I want to say, but I love doing this. For those of you who are thinking about leaving education, this might have been a really hard year, but I would encourage you to find some bright spots. Think about some students, some families or even staff that you've made a positive impact on, or just being around, just checking on them and saying hello, good morning, things like that. And if you're struggling, there are many, many resources you can reach out to. Feel free to look up my YouTube channel, counseling with Mister B. I share videos weekly about different things that we can do that you can easily implement on your campus as far as like small groups, individual counseling sessions, whole wide events for your school. Just different things. But you got this. We need more counselors. So counselor educators around the world, please continue to send candidates our way because we need people.

Carol: Yeah, we totally need people. And I'm glad that you are here in the profession promoting the great work of school counseling and just sharing your, your words of wisdom with everyone. I really appreciate that. Thank you.

John: I appreciate it.

Carol: And people, once again, you know, if you really want to hear a good session, you have to come to our conference because John has you covered, especially if you're in middle school. But I really think that you could probably use this for any single grade level that you're with because you.

John: Really.

Carol: Good stuff. It's good stuff. So with that, I will also, for our listeners, I'm going to put John's info in the show notes. And so if you want to connect you want to check them out, you can. All right. Thanks for listening, people. Until next week. Bye for now. Thanks for listening to today's episode of Counselor chat. All of the links I talked about can be found in the show notes and@counselingessentials.org podcast. Be sure to hit, follow or subscribe on your favorite podcast player. And if you would be so kind to leave a review, I'd really appreciate it. Want to connect? Send me a DM on Facebook or Instagram at counseling essentials until next time. Can't wait till we chat. Bye for now.

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