Shownotes
- Challenges and opportunities of into tennis during teenage years
- Shaping of personal training approaches from his own experience with famous mentors
- Involvement and survival in the management and business side of club tennis
- Transitional experience: from country club to private club
- Image Enhancement
- Instruction
- Maintenance and
- Customer Service
Transcripts
(upbeat music)
Speaker:Welcome to the Atlanta Tennis Podcast.
Speaker:Every episode is titled,
Speaker:It Starts with Tennis and Goes From There.
Speaker:We talk with coaches, club managers,
Speaker:industry business professionals,
Speaker:technology experts, and anyone else we find interesting.
Speaker:We wanna have a conversation as long as it starts with tennis.
Speaker:(upbeat music)
Speaker:Hey, hey, this is Shaun with the Atlanta Tennis Podcast,
Speaker:powered by GoTennis.
Speaker:Check out our calendar of Metro Atlanta Tennis events
Speaker:at LetsGoTennis.com
Speaker:and be sure to register for the GoTennis Fall Festival
Speaker:coming up on November 9th at James Creek Tennis Center.
Speaker:It's gonna be awesome.
Speaker:And now let's get into our recent conversation
Speaker:with Jeff Chandley.
Speaker:Jeff has been the director of Tennis at Atlanta Athletic Club
Speaker:for the past 16 years and plans to retire at the end of 2024.
Speaker:Many consider this position
Speaker:as one of the most highly sought after jobs in Metro Atlanta.
Speaker:And this conversation covers Jeff's background
Speaker:as a tennis director,
Speaker:how he landed at Atlanta Athletic Club
Speaker:and what he believes has been the key to his success.
Speaker:Have a listen and let us know what you think.
Speaker:(upbeat music)
Speaker:Who is Jeff Chandley and why do we care?
Speaker:Yeah, well, I don't know if you really care,
Speaker:but yeah, I'm the director of Tennis here
Speaker:at the historic Atlanta Athletic Club.
Speaker:I've been here 16 years.
Speaker:I've been the director of Tennis the whole time
Speaker:and for three years was the director of athletics.
Speaker:It's also before that I was at the landings club
Speaker:in Savannah, Georgia for 10 years,
Speaker:director of tennis and athletic director also
Speaker:and then saw a grass country club before that for eight years
Speaker:and became the director of tennis
Speaker:and the director of athletics there.
Speaker:And it really kind of just started my career
Speaker:in Nashville after college.
Speaker:I was a football player through high school,
Speaker:had football scholarships,
Speaker:but it had been injured quite a bit.
Speaker:And my junior year of high school,
Speaker:I decided I was gonna take up tennis
Speaker:and I fell in love with it and in high school
Speaker:and played my senior year for our freshman football coach,
Speaker:tennis coach and had to have somebody pay for my college.
Speaker:So I talked my way onto a junior college team
Speaker:and ended up playing on two national ranked teams
Speaker:and then was blessed enough to get the Nashville Tennessee
Speaker:where I played for Trebekah Nazarene College
Speaker:at the NAI School there in Nashville.
Speaker:And started my career shortly after I graduated from Trebekah.
Speaker:I was really blessed to be able to get under the teaching arm
Speaker:of Peter Van Lingen and probably not known here in Atlanta,
Speaker:but Peter was an incredible player from South Africa
Speaker:was Davis Cup player for South Africa,
Speaker:had wins over Ash and Stan Smith.
Speaker:And I spent five years with him teaching
Speaker:and the guy was so far ahead of the game.
Speaker:I mean, guys are teaching modern tennis now.
Speaker:Peter was teaching that and I was learning from him
Speaker:on the teaching side for five years
Speaker:and he was so far ahead of everybody
Speaker:that he was teaching the modern tennis back 44 years ago.
Speaker:So it was very impressive to be under him.
Speaker:Peter wanted nothing to do with the business side of tennis.
Speaker:He didn't wanna run events, he just wanted to teach.
Speaker:So I was, when I finally started answering the questions
Speaker:or in the clinics before he did,
Speaker:I knew it was time for me to maybe start looking around
Speaker:and I had pretty much paid my dues.
Speaker:Lucky enough, I had built a reputation enough in Nashville
Speaker:that I got hired over at Maryland Farms
Speaker:by a new director that came in.
Speaker:It's a great club.
Speaker:It was eight indoor courts, 16 outdoor courts
Speaker:was an athletic facility, didn't have a golf course.
Speaker:And that director left shortly after I got hired,
Speaker:I didn't push him out, but anyway,
Speaker:and I talked to the GM and the owner at that time
Speaker:and said, "Give me a chance to be the director of tennis there."
Speaker:And they pulled the strings and let me do it.
Speaker:And was my first real director's job
Speaker:in finding out about what the business side of tennis was.
Speaker:I remembered my first day that being the director,
Speaker:went straight to the accounting department,
Speaker:set on the guy Sofa and just said,
Speaker:"Tell me anything about accounting for a country club."
Speaker:'Cause it's so much different
Speaker:than what I try to do with my checkbook.
Speaker:So I was able to stay there for five years,
Speaker:got the Virginia Slims of Nashville there,
Speaker:which was a $150,000 event.
Speaker:Worked with Steve Duffel, who's big in the Southern tennis
Speaker:USDA Southern.
Speaker:He was the owner of the tournament,
Speaker:but just gave me a lot of opportunities
Speaker:to meet a lot of players on the tour
Speaker:and really kind of learn about the tournament side.
Speaker:And then from there, went on to Sawgrass Country Club,
Speaker:where again, I learned what it was like
Speaker:to be in a private country club, tennis committees
Speaker:and committees and the hierarchy of what golf means
Speaker:to a private country club.
Speaker:So I was able to kind of cut my teeth on that.
Speaker:But that's, you know, married to beautiful wives
Speaker:that understands the hours that I got to put in,
Speaker:to, you know, I got three great kids.
Speaker:Two out of college, one that's finished in college right now
Speaker:at this advanced old age of mine.
Speaker:And just blessed to have been in this profession for
Speaker:the 44 years.
Speaker:Both the PTR and USPTA member, and now a PPR,
Speaker:Certified Pickleball Pro, which is a trend.
Speaker:And now my new title here is Director of Racket Sports
Speaker:and not Director of Tennis anymore.
Speaker:So the world is changing for us in tennis a lot.
Speaker:But that's kind of who and what I am or Dintry.
Speaker:- I love it.
Speaker:It's the beginning to end.
Speaker:So can you give me the quick version
Speaker:when you went and played in college,
Speaker:you played not far from where I played.
Speaker:I played at Lipscomb in Nashville.
Speaker:- Oh, yeah.
Speaker:- I was nearby.
Speaker:So you've mentioned it.
Speaker:- Oh, yeah.
Speaker:- Clubs and I still have a few friends that are my age
Speaker:that are in those clubs still teaching in the Nashville area.
Speaker:- Okay.
Speaker:- I think of that.
Speaker:And I left college and I know Bobby did too
Speaker:with tennis teaching not on the radar.
Speaker:It was not for us.
Speaker:That was not the plan.
Speaker:And I think a lot of guys do that.
Speaker:We kind of somehow fall into teaching tennis.
Speaker:And I don't know that other professions feel that way.
Speaker:And maybe more people do it than I think.
Speaker:You graduate with your law degree, go be a lawyer.
Speaker:But maybe most people graduate with their useless
Speaker:philosophy degree like I did and kind of have no idea
Speaker:where to go with their life.
Speaker:And maybe that's what you get when you get a philosophy.
Speaker:- I was there with you.
Speaker:Let me tell you.
Speaker:(laughing)
Speaker:- Okay.
Speaker:- Okay, so I had a so-called business degree.
Speaker:(laughing)
Speaker:- Yeah, I'm a minor in communication.
Speaker:So where is that gonna get me?
Speaker:Well, if you're from Nashville,
Speaker:you may have heard of Nashville or Village.
Speaker:And it was a, and I was working behind the pro show.
Speaker:I was working at Redcap, which was packing boxes
Speaker:at night and then working during school
Speaker:and then working at Nashville Village
Speaker:with Peter van Wingen.
Speaker:And he came to me one day and he goes,
Speaker:hey, do you wanna learn this business?
Speaker:Now I'm just behind the desk, pro shop guy
Speaker:making court reservations.
Speaker:And you know, again, didn't know what I was gonna do.
Speaker:And I said, sure.
Speaker:And he goes, I'm moving to Westside Athletic Club
Speaker:over near Bell Meade.
Speaker:And so I said, okay, you know, let's go.
Speaker:And really what I found out is my father
Speaker:was in the building business
Speaker:and he was building a house with his farmer
Speaker:that he realized that I had some experience in building.
Speaker:So it was kind of, I would teach a little bit
Speaker:then go over to his house and build on his house
Speaker:and then come back and teach.
Speaker:But he was the one that really just said,
Speaker:there were a couple of people in my life
Speaker:that have been instrumental in me getting into the business.
Speaker:When I fell in love with tennis in high school,
Speaker:a guy named Don Cully, who is a member
Speaker:of our little Mars Town Country Club in East Tennessee.
Speaker:And he goes, you seem to really like tennis.
Speaker:And I had no money.
Speaker:And he said, I'm gonna let you use one of my cars
Speaker:and I'll pay, you go find the best pro in Knoxville
Speaker:and I'll pay for your lesson a week.
Speaker:And so, I took up on that.
Speaker:So that was very instrumental in the...
Speaker:- Wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait.
Speaker:A guy gave you a car and paid for your tennis.
Speaker:- Just to use, just to use the car.
Speaker:He didn't give me the car.
Speaker:(laughing)
Speaker:Yeah, now, he...
Speaker:- Who does that have to Jeff?
Speaker:- Oh, yeah, I'm telling you.
Speaker:It's just Don Cully, I'll never forget that gentleman.
Speaker:- Yeah, and I never took any of his nice cars.
Speaker:He had a pickup truck.
Speaker:And I always took the pickup truck.
Speaker:And he had some really nice cars,
Speaker:but I always just took the pickup truck.
Speaker:And I found Tommy Mosier over in Knoxville.
Speaker:And I don't know if that name rings about with any of y'all.
Speaker:He was a legend in Knoxville at the Knoxville Racket Club.
Speaker:But I remember then, nothing against Tommy.
Speaker:He's passed away now, but I can remember, here I was this kid
Speaker:that didn't know how to dress in a private country club,
Speaker:tennis facility, and the whole time that he was supposedly
Speaker:teaching me, he was looking around the court
Speaker:and watching what was going on on all the other courts.
Speaker:And I'll never forget that and swore that if I ever got,
Speaker:well, later on in life when I was teaching,
Speaker:I was never gonna be that pro,
Speaker:because it was, even though I was paying him.
Speaker:So that lasted two whole lessons with Tommy before I realized that.
Speaker:And then of course, Alan Smith,
Speaker:who was the athletic director and tennis director there
Speaker:at the Treveck and Nazarene College.
Speaker:Again, Saul is playing in a regional junior college
Speaker:and wanted to know if I wanted to come to Treveck.
Speaker:And so, so I got Don Kelly, I got Alan Smith and Peter Van
Speaker:playing in that were instrumental in me getting into the business.
Speaker:That was longer than what you wanted to hear, but that was his.
Speaker:- No, but that's, I think that's a great thing,
Speaker:because people need to hear that, especially that young coaches,
Speaker:Bobby and I talked with the ideas we've talked to,
Speaker:Kappa Stanny, we've talked to guys at the different colleges
Speaker:where I first met Scott Hutchinson and he said,
Speaker:I graduated with a tennis coaching degree.
Speaker:I'm like, that's not a thing.
Speaker:What are you talking about?
Speaker:- Yeah.
Speaker:- But it is.
Speaker:And those are the kids, when Scott was, you know,
Speaker:same age as you, junior and high school was like,
Speaker:I think I can do this, that sounds like fun.
Speaker:He had that path and that was, you know,
Speaker:I had to somehow get sucked in or whatever it was
Speaker:that happened to me.
Speaker:- Sure.
Speaker:- And, but to hear that and to take some of these,
Speaker:maybe young players that don't realize,
Speaker:doesn't mean you have to be Jeff Chandley.
Speaker:I'm talking to you, young players, right?
Speaker:You don't have to end up at the best country club
Speaker:in the world, but you can make a decent living.
Speaker:You can figure out all these things.
Speaker:You can join the business side if you want to.
Speaker:We talk to all kinds of people that are ancillary to tennis,
Speaker:not necessarily teach in tennis all day.
Speaker:And then you got others, we got a partner in art
Speaker:and it would go tennis, Rob Carver.
Speaker:That guy is on court when he's awake
Speaker:and it's just what he loves to do and that's great.
Speaker:But there are different ways to do it.
Speaker:And I appreciate that story.
Speaker:So you're at Atlanta Athletic Club
Speaker:and my whole career, I confuse Atlanta's
Speaker:Atlanta club with Atlanta Country Club.
Speaker:Now Bobby, Atlanta Country Club is 10.
Speaker:- It's 10, that's where 10 is 10.
Speaker:- Yeah, Atlanta Club is Jeff.
Speaker:Now you're in John's Creek, right Jeff?
Speaker:- Correct, correct.
Speaker:In John's Creek.
Speaker:- Give us the quick, how cool Atlanta Athletic Club is.
Speaker:- Wow, well, again,
Speaker:- This is a quick version.
Speaker:- Yeah, there is, well, it's a lot of history.
Speaker:1898 that it was started downtown as an Athletic Club.
Speaker:It actually started with tennis first
Speaker:and baseball and basketball at the Athletic, no golf.
Speaker:So we always brag that tennis was a part
Speaker:of the Atlanta Athletic Club before golf.
Speaker:But then again, you have the history of Bobby Jones,
Speaker:you have the history of John Heisman
Speaker:as one of our athletic directors.
Speaker:In fact, his contract, $50, I think it's $50 a month.
Speaker:Was his contract with the Atlanta Athletic Club
Speaker:to be the athletic director here at the club.
Speaker:So there's a rich history of this club
Speaker:and from not just the PGA side or the USGA side
Speaker:but also from the, we had the, before I got here,
Speaker:the AT&T challenge that was a huge event
Speaker:which I'm still so sad that I never came to
Speaker:when I was in Nashville or whatever
Speaker:and missed out to finally be here at this club.
Speaker:But it is, and I'm not saying this
Speaker:because I'm a member or part of the senior leadership team
Speaker:here at the club, but this membership is incredible
Speaker:and has been so supportive of what we're trying to do here
Speaker:as a team from my staff.
Speaker:And they're seeing the fruits of that
Speaker:and the fun that we have in the culture,
Speaker:really the culture in the sense of community
Speaker:that we build here at the Tennessee.
Speaker:It's a really, really a cool place
Speaker:but you can take all the history and which is awesome
Speaker:and which is just glad that I'm a part of that.
Speaker:But the culture that we've built from a Tennessee here
Speaker:in that sense of community
Speaker:when people walk in the doors of really, really cool thing.
Speaker:It's fun to come in to work every day.
Speaker:I don't ever drive it.
Speaker:It's not like some clubs I've been there.
Speaker:Yeah. Oh yeah.
Speaker:Oh yeah.
Speaker:I think we all have at some point thinking,
Speaker:I don't know if I want to be here anymore.
Speaker:I'm not excited to come to work.
Speaker:Oh yeah.
Speaker:Oh yeah.
Speaker:I mean, it's what, got on Mike Leach told me
Speaker:when he came down and took over the Pontabedra Club down there
Speaker:and he goes, it is a J.O.B. Not F.U.N.
Speaker:But this has been fun.
Speaker:This has been fun and I've always looked at it that way.
Speaker:I don't think I've ever dreaded it,
Speaker:but walking in the door.
Speaker:But a lot of it has to do with the team
Speaker:that I get to work with and that we've put together
Speaker:and they're drive and they're their dedication
Speaker:to what we've got planned
Speaker:and what we're trying to do here in that whole sense of community.
Speaker:So.
Speaker:Yeah.
Speaker:And Bobby, I can see you just being patient.
Speaker:[LAUGHTER]
Speaker:You use it all my life.
Speaker:You know, you use it in my words.
Speaker:You know, culture.
Speaker:You know how I feel about this.
Speaker:That's our job.
Speaker:You got to build the culture.
Speaker:And as we talked, I don't think we were on yet.
Speaker:We were talking where we were getting our technical difficulties
Speaker:worked out.
Speaker:Sometimes it takes a little bit to massage,
Speaker:to get the right staff, to get the right group,
Speaker:to get the culture moving in the direction.
Speaker:I took over a club similar to what you're saying.
Speaker:Went in to work with a friend and two weeks later,
Speaker:the friend was gone.
Speaker:First people associate that you put the knife marks in his back
Speaker:and I was like, no, I was coming here to work with him.
Speaker:And no, but it was a different culture.
Speaker:And a lot of things were going on beside behind the scenes.
Speaker:I had no idea.
Speaker:And it took a while.
Speaker:It really took a while.
Speaker:And I'm thankful for the people that gave us the opportunity
Speaker:to go through because all the people
Speaker:who made a quicker decision.
Speaker:Now we're 10 years into it.
Speaker:And everybody's like, wow, glad we stuck in our 11 years
Speaker:into it, glad we stuck it out.
Speaker:Yeah.
Speaker:I still have one of the emails from early on
Speaker:as a reminder that not everybody was a fan.
Speaker:So yeah, that's tough.
Speaker:Yeah.
Speaker:And it's interesting.
Speaker:This later part of my career and you send your hand pros off
Speaker:to be, we talked about Andrew Manelli or Mike Robertson
Speaker:or Jeff Hedges, these guys that have gone on to be directors.
Speaker:And it's always interesting when they call me after the first 6, 8, 9 months.
Speaker:And they go, I don't think I can do this.
Speaker:And I'm like, once it becomes your culture, once it becomes,
Speaker:Mike Robertson talked to me about this a little while ago at TPC Sugar Love.
Speaker:And I said, once it becomes your program and all, you'll see how it--
Speaker:you just got to be patient.
Speaker:You'll see how it all works out.
Speaker:And all those guys have been successful because they stuck it out.
Speaker:But I can tell some horror stories about the first couple of years
Speaker:of being at each club.
Speaker:And again, the politics that goes along with it
Speaker:and what people try to do to move you out.
Speaker:But if you believe in what you're trying to do
Speaker:and you've seen success in the past, then
Speaker:you know what it takes to get a program or what a successful or a healthy program looks like.
Speaker:Then you can kind of map it out and just stick to your guns and your A. OK.
Speaker:Well, it's interesting. You bring up-- because historically, as you said,
Speaker:the Atlanta Athletic Club has always hired outside people from out of state.
Speaker:And the initial reaction within the state is, oh, well, they don't understand
Speaker:out there.
Speaker:But listening to you, it is a great idea not to know either.
Speaker:Because basically, I feel-- and as we talked about the years that up,
Speaker:I guess I've been doing this at that level for about 25 years now--
Speaker:you go in with your-- it was always about building culture.
Speaker:But our job is change.
Speaker:We are about a lot of managing people.
Speaker:There's so much tennis in Atlanta between out the USDA, T2.
Speaker:The need for us to do events is minimalized.
Speaker:But that doesn't change the other side of it.
Speaker:So it's really a different skill set that is required.
Speaker:And I think that leads to a lot of-- there's
Speaker:a big differences we see in all business between the sales leader and the sales manager.
Speaker:There's a head pro and the director.
Speaker:And I think a lot of unfortunate, a lot of the hiring people don't see that distinction.
Speaker:And it's a different hat.
Speaker:It's definitely a different hat.
Speaker:And again, I don't think I said this.
Speaker:I can't remember if I said it or not.
Speaker:I didn't start playing tennis like a lot of these guys did when they were four, five,
Speaker:and six years old.
Speaker:I picked it up when I was the summer after my junior year of high school.
Speaker:And so my playing skills are not up to speed with a lot of the players that have been playing
Speaker:all their life and played tournaments.
Speaker:And even though I played tournaments and ended up playing college.
Speaker:So I really focused on the business side.
Speaker:And then of course under Peter Van Lingen teaching side.
Speaker:Because you've got three pillars.
Speaker:You've got your business.
Speaker:You've got your teaching.
Speaker:And then you have your playing skill.
Speaker:And so I've always been able to focus on the business and the teaching side.
Speaker:And I think those are my two strongest points.
Speaker:But I, and again, I've been through three general managers at Sawgrass, three general managers
Speaker:at the Landings Club, three general managers here at the AAC.
Speaker:And I've seen the directors of those clubs.
Speaker:They always hire the opposite of what they just had.
Speaker:It's all, it's a fact of life.
Speaker:I mean, it's just the opposite of what they had.
Speaker:Chances are when I finally retire, they may bring in a player.
Speaker:I know they did that at the Landings.
Speaker:They brought in, you know, immediately brought in a NCAA champ.
Speaker:Didn't last but a year.
Speaker:You know, then they brought in another NCAA champ that lasted a year.
Speaker:And they went through and they ended up with a great guy down there that is more in line
Speaker:with the business side, the teaching side and all of that after 10 years.
Speaker:But I've seen it happen in every department.
Speaker:They hire the opposite of what they just had.
Speaker:And it's all left and all.
Speaker:We've all thought it.
Speaker:Yep, white, yeah.
Speaker:Same thing.
Speaker:If the restaurant was down, the next general manager was going to be a restaurant background.
Speaker:There was no question.
Speaker:Oh, yeah.
Speaker:And every chef that comes in is even though you spend a million dollars on changing out the
Speaker:kitchen a year earlier, and the chef comes in and it's like, what we all think we're going
Speaker:to have them.
Speaker:You know, it's, it's, this isn't going to work.
Speaker:So yeah, we're all experts until we're not experts.
Speaker:But I've just seen that happen so many times.
Speaker:So, so Jeff, the young, if you're going to talk to that younger self of yours, to be
Speaker:able to say, okay, well, you're going to be the guy now bringing in the younger coaches.
Speaker:And you're going to want to hire that culture.
Speaker:If you're going to be able to talk to me as a young coach or talk to the coaches out there,
Speaker:to be able to say, okay, this is what you want to be.
Speaker:This is, this is how you want to groom yourself, how you want to be ready for a position like
Speaker:this.
Speaker:You'll say, I want to, I'd love to work at a country club.
Speaker:And what does that actually look like?
Speaker:Because just coming off the tour is, in my opinion, not even a third of what gets you a job to
Speaker:be honest.
Speaker:Because that's not the same thing.
Speaker:Yes, it's one of the three.
Speaker:But I think it's the least of that is how good are you at playing tennis.
Speaker:And directors seem to know that, but not all the head pros seem to know that.
Speaker:Because a lot of the head pros seem to be former players.
Speaker:But to look at those main points and saying, are you interested in learning the business
Speaker:even if you don't already?
Speaker:Is there that path?
Speaker:One of the things I appreciate about the Wilson to the eels of the world.
Speaker:And you mentioned TBC Sugarloaf with, with Robo, sorry, I don't even know his real name,
Speaker:my grab.
Speaker:My grab.
Speaker:Yeah.
Speaker:Um, I'm kidding.
Speaker:He's on one of our tennis teams and we, we played.
Speaker:Oh, okay.
Speaker:Yeah.
Speaker:We're going to be calling Robo.
Speaker:Okay.
Speaker:But he's, he's a guy that's, that's going to get it.
Speaker:And he's going to bring in the right people.
Speaker:And he's going to be successful because he figures that out.
Speaker:But I think back to the Wilson's eels and the Darryl Lewis's that helped me evolve while
Speaker:I was there.
Speaker:I think the guys that don't work in the clubs, they really don't get that same feature because
Speaker:they don't have that mentor, the director helping the head bro and the head bro helping
Speaker:everybody else.
Speaker:I assume that's part of your culture.
Speaker:Oh, yeah.
Speaker:Oh, yeah.
Speaker:I mean, it's, we keep him involved.
Speaker:I want.
Speaker:I'll teach you everything I know as long as you want to know it.
Speaker:You know, and that's the key is you have to, I will lay it out for you.
Speaker:I can, you know, drag the horse to the pond, but you're going to have to be the one to
Speaker:drink.
Speaker:And so there's, there's a huge opportunity here at the club or any of these clubs that,
Speaker:if you want it, I can help you get to it and, and, and show you how to get there.
Speaker:But, you know, I share everything.
Speaker:Our, our financials on a monthly basis.
Speaker:We go through those types of things we talk about in our weekly staff meetings from not just
Speaker:the tennis teaching side or the, or the league side, but what's the business side looking
Speaker:like.
Speaker:I offer them every, every pro to send them to a court seminar, play court seminar, you
Speaker:know, to go out and, and learn about from the ground up how, how a play court is made
Speaker:and why it's, why it's groomed the way it's groomed and all of those.
Speaker:And some of the things you need to know, you know, researching hard courts, go out and watch
Speaker:them resurface the hard courts.
Speaker:You just have to experience these things.
Speaker:But the key is, is if you want it under my two lead, if you wanted, I'll be glad to spend
Speaker:as much time as I possibly can with you to show you how it's going to take to get you
Speaker:to the next level.
Speaker:Or I will introduce you to somebody.
Speaker:Again, we talk about Mark McMahon and his certified racket.
Speaker:What is it?
Speaker:Certified racket.
Speaker:Executive certification.
Speaker:Yes.
Speaker:And, and Carmen's gone through it.
Speaker:My associate director and I have Lance, my pro over men's tennis going through it right
Speaker:now.
Speaker:Great program.
Speaker:I mean, I've been able to, to see Carmen develop quite a bit from what she's learned from
Speaker:that.
Speaker:But that's, that's a $3,000 investment into one of my.
Speaker:It's not cheap, but it's not overly expensive.
Speaker:It's reasonable.
Speaker:No, but it's what I've seen is the criteria and the curriculum better.
Speaker:The curriculum is really solid and Mark and I taught.
Speaker:But I think, you know, I wish I, I had to learn that on my own.
Speaker:But I think that's a good tool and an opportunity for a young pro.
Speaker:If somebody will invest the money into it or they should invest it themselves, that they're
Speaker:really serious about getting into this profession at this kind of level.
Speaker:That's a good test of money.
Speaker:We'll have to put the link in the show notes or something to make sure Mark knows that
Speaker:you're seeing good things about that because that's always good.
Speaker:Well, I've been very impressed with what he's, what he's done with that through Carmen and
Speaker:Lance has just started his series with that group this past month.
Speaker:So we'll be following him through it.
Speaker:But I love to see a pro, young pro that maybe didn't know how to teach like I did and, you
Speaker:know, when I first started to go, okay, just sit on the side of the court and watch all
Speaker:five of the pros teach to learn to get a feel for it.
Speaker:But it just takes the pro wanting it and doing things that necessarily he may not be getting
Speaker:paid for, but to get the experience.
Speaker:And that's paying your dues a little bit.
Speaker:And that kind of speaks to Bobby.
Speaker:I see that I see the smirk.
Speaker:But that's not a common, I don't even want to say it's a feeling, but it's not a common thing.
Speaker:You talked about experience.
Speaker:And we all say, I've got 10 years of experience.
Speaker:I should be ready for a thing.
Speaker:But somebody said to me the other day, they said, right, but what experiences have you had?
Speaker:You've got experience.
Speaker:Did you just teach a bunch of lessons over 10 years?
Speaker:Because that means you're really good at that.
Speaker:Can you give me some experiences?
Speaker:What have you experienced to make you feel like you're ready to be able to do a thing?
Speaker:Because getting a director's job is no small tax.
Speaker:That's maybe not now.
Speaker:No, not now.
Speaker:Maybe you kind of head pro your way into it.
Speaker:But as we all know in Atlanta, that doesn't happen very often because we like to bring in
Speaker:outside talent.
Speaker:Well, you got to stay relative outside these gates.
Speaker:I mean, you know, one of the, one of the, again, hate to use the word four pillars, but
Speaker:one of them is image enhancement.
Speaker:And how do you enhance the program?
Speaker:But then also you need to enhance your image outside of these gates of the Atlanta Athletic
Speaker:Club.
Speaker:Be known through the GPTA, be, you know, show up at the seminars.
Speaker:We host the USPTA winner workshop.
Speaker:Great.
Speaker:You know, it's a great up one.
Speaker:I don't have to send my pros to travel.
Speaker:But two, it's held right here, you know, on our facility.
Speaker:And we have the opportunity to learn and, and then to move on, you know, on a national level,
Speaker:getting involved, volunteer with the USPTA or PTR.
Speaker:And, you know, just kind of rock and roll, but that's, that's important about getting your
Speaker:name and your brand out.
Speaker:I think that was a, that was a thing that held me back.
Speaker:And unfortunately, Bobby and I weren't talking much at the time.
Speaker:We had met, but I didn't have, I didn't have him as the mentor that, that I kind of view
Speaker:him a little bit now in a way is for him to look at me and say, Sean, you, you need to be doing
Speaker:these extra things.
Speaker:And I, and I say, whether it's paying your dues or just doing your due diligence, some
Speaker:of those extra things that nobody wants to do anymore.
Speaker:We all say, well, I just got to get home and walk the dog or we have different priorities
Speaker:to be able to say, Sean, you needed to be GPTA.
Speaker:It's not that expensive.
Speaker:But if you're not part of a club, some of those expenses are on you and you start doing
Speaker:the math on, well, I got to feed my family or am I going to go to, am I going to
Speaker:take a week off in late September and go to Florida for the, the world conference, whatever
Speaker:it is?
Speaker:Like most people can't do that.
Speaker:Now, that's the, the thing, I mean, we want to start understanding Alta, why are you doing
Speaker:a tennis teaching convention in late September in the South?
Speaker:That just most of us can't go.
Speaker:So understand those things makes a big difference.
Speaker:Obviously, I think, but to be able to understand those things younger, and if we talk to that younger
Speaker:coach and say, yeah, they're going to be a late night or two.
Speaker:We're going to be on, on a GPTA call as of recording, you know, tonight we're going to be late.
Speaker:Now, a lot of people drive at home and a lot of people, I'll be putting my son to bed while
Speaker:on the call and just trying to get the work life balance, but also really realizing you
Speaker:need those extra things.
Speaker:None of us are getting paid for that.
Speaker:No.
Speaker:I mean, we don't want to talk to each other and learn from each other if we really do want
Speaker:that next thing in our career.
Speaker:Well, and that's, yeah, it's so true because therefore while, I mean, we pay, I'm blessed again
Speaker:to be at the Atlanta Athletic Club and we pay the dues for our staff and I would pay
Speaker:the $75 for the GPTA and then nobody would go.
Speaker:So then it was, okay, you're going to pay.
Speaker:And then if you hit these hurdles throughout the year, then I'll reimburse you for the $75.
Speaker:And just said, you know, I'm tired of just you having GPTA on your name tag and you're not
Speaker:doing anything with it and I'm paying $75.
Speaker:So, so we kind of reverse that and just said, hey, you have to write an article, you have
Speaker:to do this, this and this and then I will reimburse you.
Speaker:But the whole work life balance right now is just an animal because it's, I hate that
Speaker:phrase because it's not anything I knew.
Speaker:It's not anything I knew growing up and luckily, again, luckily I have a wife that understands
Speaker:that this is not a Monday through Friday, nine to five job.
Speaker:My kids, even though I was very involved with the kids at school because I could take off
Speaker:in the middle of the day and go take them lunch or volunteer.
Speaker:But there's a lot of this, give me 40 hours a week, which is unheard of.
Speaker:To give me 40 hours a week and sometimes we struggle getting 40 hours a week in and I'm
Speaker:paying salaries and less in commission.
Speaker:It's frustrating.
Speaker:It's, that's the toughest part of this job right now is getting people to work, you know,
Speaker:without if they want to raise, go teach one more lesson a week.
Speaker:That's the best way to get a raise.
Speaker:That's better than the 3% I could give you on your, you know, stipend.
Speaker:But go get another lesson and there's the best raise you can possibly get compared to
Speaker:what I could give you for free.
Speaker:So yeah, it's, that's, it's, if you want to get the hair on the back of my neck up, start
Speaker:talking to me about work like balance.
Speaker:All right.
Speaker:We're, we're, we're balancing.
Speaker:We'll create a lot of people and we'll figure out who wants to get a raise.
Speaker:It's not going to change.
Speaker:I mean, it's the culture right now.
Speaker:We need to be able to, we need to be able to deal with it.
Speaker:Luke Jensen told us at one point he's like, these 20 somethings in their phone.
Speaker:He's like, you can't fight it.
Speaker:You're just, you're going against the tide here.
Speaker:So you just got to work with, just move the needle, just figure out.
Speaker:And maybe that's what I mean by we can't get together and fix it because it's not a problem
Speaker:to be fixed.
Speaker:It's a lifestyle and a scenario that we just need to understand and to be able to manage.
Speaker:It's longer just the baby boomer understanding the millennial that that seems easy now in
Speaker:retrospect.
Speaker:Mm-hmm.
Speaker:My wife is in that, she has an advertising agency that she listened to and I, I wish I could
Speaker:quote her that she was at a seminar and they brought in a professor that specialized
Speaker:in how to deal with the different the Gen Zs, the all the baby boomers and how you're going
Speaker:to have to communicate through it.
Speaker:It was incredible.
Speaker:And again, I wish I had said on this and I actually tried to get the club to pay for this
Speaker:professor to come in because it's, it's a lot of what we're dealing with.
Speaker:How do I talk to a baby boomer or a Gen Z or, you know, so it's, it's a new culture.
Speaker:It's going to be a struggle.
Speaker:Yeah.
Speaker:And from struggles to successes, if I were to say, hey Jeff, what's, what are some of your
Speaker:successes in the way of how you do what you do and say, hey, here's, here's a bit of a,
Speaker:a key.
Speaker:Here's how you talk about culture and Bobby's all in with that, whether it's playing music
Speaker:or making sure that your coaches go to the GPTA meetings or the team, the team building,
Speaker:whatever you do, you've got to do the following exercises.
Speaker:I don't care.
Speaker:Whatever, whatever you do seems to be working.
Speaker:So I know you may, you may not have on the wall.
Speaker:Here are three keys to success, but could you, could you share a little bit of why you think
Speaker:things work so well there?
Speaker:Well, I do have four keys to success.
Speaker:And I've already mentioned one of them and that's image enhancement.
Speaker:You know, we'll, we'll specialize in our instruction.
Speaker:We focus on our maintenance and we focus on our customer service.
Speaker:Those are the, those are the four, four things that we pretty much lean on and lean into on
Speaker:a daily basis.
Speaker:And if we can keep those things in check, so you've got your image enhancement, of course,
Speaker:so we already talked about that instruction.
Speaker:We want to be the best instructors and, and a wide, you know, I specialize in a certain
Speaker:group.
Speaker:Armored specializes in a second group, certain group.
Speaker:Wendy is, is great with beginners, kids and, and beginner women, you know, Enoch is, is
Speaker:funny and great players.
Speaker:So all the good players want to hit with Enoch.
Speaker:So we, we try to make sure what we hire is to plug into the different facets of our membership,
Speaker:you know, what they're going to need.
Speaker:And, and so that's the instructional part.
Speaker:The maintenance part is key.
Speaker:You know, a club and people that pay $120,000 just to walk in the door here and, you know,
Speaker:a couple thousand dollars a month, expect this place to look and feel like $120,000 initiation
Speaker:fee club.
Speaker:So we, we're very mindful of what the facility should look like.
Speaker:I started at the landings club, a standards and audits program.
Speaker:And it, we, we set standards for each tennis court and what a tennis, hard court supposed
Speaker:to look like, everything from the top of the net all the way to the, the wind screens to
Speaker:the surface, the net post the entrance, all of those things, play court, indoor court.
Speaker:And then my tennis committee goes out every quarter and I have an audit sheet.
Speaker:It's a pass or fail.
Speaker:And so the tennis committee goes out and audits, audits each court.
Speaker:So I'll give a member two courts to take some all of 30 minutes or four courts, just depends
Speaker:on the, we call them audit parties because I always have beer and wine and some cheese there
Speaker:for them to get them there.
Speaker:Yeah.
Speaker:Yeah, exactly.
Speaker:And so that's, that's a day, you know, and then the staff will do the same thing on the
Speaker:off months to go out and audit set a courts.
Speaker:So the maintenance side and then putting together a life cycle plan for everything that,
Speaker:you have on your, that you're in charge of when I first got here, I took pictures of everything.
Speaker:And so I run through those pictures every year to make sure that I've taken care of the
Speaker:issues, but a life cycle plan is, is an important part of keeping a facility up and going.
Speaker:So that's the maintenance side.
Speaker:And then the customer service side, again, becomes that, you know, we're the bartenders
Speaker:of the world over here at the tennis department.
Speaker:So we know so much about this membership and we want to make sure that, that when they
Speaker:walk in the door or they're greeted, they're taking care of one of the things I always stress
Speaker:with my staff is you just don't know what they're walking through that day.
Speaker:You know, it could be an issue, you know, just something in their life that may not.
Speaker:So let's make sure when they leave or they have a good time or that we're sympathetic to,
Speaker:if they're a little disgruntled that day.
Speaker:And, you know, it can, it can trap you, but you got to, you know, just step back and go,
Speaker:what are they walking through that day and just, you know, just kind of protect them.
Speaker:And that's part of the customer service.
Speaker:I mean, it's again, hiring the right person that has that mentality.
Speaker:You can train them to do anything.
Speaker:But if they have a customer service mentality, then you're golden.
Speaker:They're worth every dollar and then some.
Speaker:So, and I'm lucky that, you know, I, my pro shop supervisors, that type of person and,
Speaker:and we'll take on in the job.
Speaker:I'm feeling that's not luck.
Speaker:Well, yeah, you're involved in that hiring.
Speaker:Yeah, I mean, well, but, you know, again, sometimes you, you know, well, no, I'm going to say it
Speaker:was luck because she came from the locker room.
Speaker:Well, ladies locker room and wanted it again, culture is everything.
Speaker:I don't care how many employees of the club want to come over here and work at tennis, just
Speaker:because of our culture, but she's been, she's been a diamond.
Speaker:So, just proud of her and what she's taken on.
Speaker:And any responsibility of the club just took over the pro shop.
Speaker:I owned the pro shop before and I leased it out to Yerser.
Speaker:And the club is, you know, the world is turning.
Speaker:You remember when the pros and the golf pros owned the shop, well, the club took over the
Speaker:golf shop after our past director of 25 years left.
Speaker:And so now the club owns that and they wanted to do it at the tennis shop.
Speaker:So it took about a year and a half.
Speaker:And I was, I knew that it would be good for the membership.
Speaker:So, so she's taken on a lot of that responsibility and it's been, it's been great.
Speaker:Nice.
Speaker:Those transitions sometimes take a while, but they're important.
Speaker:So Bobby, I know you've got probably seven or eight questions.
Speaker:If you got one or two, you want to pick your favorites.
Speaker:And then I'll hit them with King of tennis and we'll, uh,
Speaker:I think you brought it up just real quick.
Speaker:I don't think anything is by coincidence.
Speaker:I think, you know, part of it is a lot of it.
Speaker:Most of it is the culture that is created.
Speaker:One thing that, and it's again, we always go into it.
Speaker:What's the next discussion?
Speaker:And it's the future of tennis and where is tennis lacking is, you know, the new guys coming
Speaker:in.
Speaker:I love to talk to Jeff Moore about and I share a similar background that tennis wasn't
Speaker:my number once for it.
Speaker:And I think that really attributes to the fact why 58 years old, I still love hitting them
Speaker:off.
Speaker:I did play as long, you know, so it wasn't the pressure of the life.
Speaker:So I still enjoy it.
Speaker:And I think that brings a different look to the other guys, the guys that get hired right
Speaker:off of the tour or high level clubs, players might not be soon, don't have the customer service
Speaker:because, hey, you got to be selfish to be successful.
Speaker:So now you're taking somebody who is inherently selfish and saying, no, no, you have to be responsive
Speaker:to somebody else's needs.
Speaker:That's tough.
Speaker:That takes time if you feel the person has got the ability.
Speaker:And in today's mentality, today's world, that's not the way they're trained.
Speaker:You know, they're doing you the next thing.
Speaker:And that's my only, you know, what I would want to talk to Mark about because I went to
Speaker:grad school, I remember, you know, we're getting out of, well, we should be getting a job
Speaker:that's, you know, there's much money for our degree.
Speaker:I'm like, well, if they're not offering that and you want the job, you have to decide whether
Speaker:or not you want that job or not because economies, the simple business, economies of scale.
Speaker:Yes, we have an advanced sports marketing master's degree, but anybody wants that job.
Speaker:So somebody's going to say yes to it and go bust their butt and work their way up when
Speaker:you're going to sit there and say, well, I was worth more.
Speaker:So it's tough.
Speaker:And then the other thing that made me laugh is, and this is the saddest point.
Speaker:I think this is a simple matter is that we, and again, I think we were talking about
Speaker:before we actually started to roll the old school Atlanta.
Speaker:If you want to be a director was go see Cindy Jones and you know, we brought up Matt Grayson,
Speaker:we brought up Wilson, Tineo and the tree that came up.
Speaker:Everybody went, if you were going to stay in the profession and you didn't get lucky like
Speaker:me, you had a different mentor who had just, you know, right time, right place, right?
Speaker:I got to be a rising star and didn't abuse it.
Speaker:You guys, you know, that those, that doesn't exist anymore.
Speaker:You know, it's not you want to go see Matt or you want to go, your Cindy was the place to
Speaker:go.
Speaker:And at, you know, at that time Cindy, you know, you could go to TPC, you could go to Country
Speaker:Club of Roswell, you could pick the job.
Speaker:No, that was Cindy.
Speaker:That was Cindy.
Speaker:That was Cindy.
Speaker:And we don't have that anymore.
Speaker:And that's what scares about the kids because they come out and I got this degree.
Speaker:I'm ready.
Speaker:Still not ready.
Speaker:You love more than you did before.
Speaker:But still not there's still and there's another pillar that's got to come into play.
Speaker:So you're going to have to go work on that pillar.
Speaker:Yes, you're further along.
Speaker:You're more horrible than you were, but don't think you have any of the answers.
Speaker:This is still number one.
Speaker:I tell people, you want to do a good tennis instructor show up five minutes early.
Speaker:You'll be great.
Speaker:You want to be a better show up 10 minutes early.
Speaker:Set up.
Speaker:Have everything waiting for the people.
Speaker:They'll be amazed because you don't understand what they're coming out of most of the time.
Speaker:Wasn't that guy?
Speaker:So if you can be just a little bit better and the simple things, you're in a great starting
Speaker:place.
Speaker:So now in commend to the job, you have been a pleasure.
Speaker:I could see.
Speaker:I mean, not what I expected at all.
Speaker:I got into, you know, but we've been around each other in different places.
Speaker:But man, really great to talk to you.
Speaker:I get it.
Speaker:Thank you.
Speaker:And continued success out there.
Speaker:I miss.
Speaker:I wish you were there when I said we talked about I was out there for a little bit with the
Speaker:old senior tour.
Speaker:And I had to put up with a predecessor who had pretty much checked out.
Speaker:And it was always fun.
Speaker:They were to play Streeted as stupendously and, you know, unbelievable.
Speaker:And walking around the history.
Speaker:I think we had a, you know, the PGA championship was there one year, which made getting there
Speaker:to paint.
Speaker:But oh boy, great time.
Speaker:So.
Speaker:Yeah.
Speaker:Yeah.
Speaker:I was really, really.
Speaker:I've been a part of a lot of great tennis tournament, but to be able to be a part of the
Speaker:PGA in 11 2011.
Speaker:It was quite a show.
Speaker:Yeah.
Speaker:So this has been good for me.
Speaker:Yeah.
Speaker:Thank you for the opportunity.
Speaker:No worries.
Speaker:Thank you.
Speaker:We appreciate it.
Speaker:Keep up the good work.
Speaker:And Sean, I'm sure.
Speaker:Maybe maybe is a strange thing to say.
Speaker:Maybe Jeff is the new Cindy.
Speaker:There you go.
Speaker:Well, my fear is, I agree with that, but I think Jesse for not going to stay.
Speaker:That's true.
Speaker:I think they're going to get his door.
Speaker:Yeah, that's the hard part about it.
Speaker:Metro Atlanta.
Speaker:There aren't too many of those jobs.
Speaker:Right.
Speaker:Now, you know, the, the job and they're going, you know, they're going even, they're taking
Speaker:away more than they're giving.
Speaker:I mean, you know, there were, there were more clubs when I started.
Speaker:I could count probably five.
Speaker:And we mentioned three.
Speaker:I think we mentioned three of the five right off the bat, you know, or four in TPC.
Speaker:And I would even say TPC probably isn't at the level of the other three.
Speaker:But it's, you know, it's, yeah, the guy, it's more HOA driven in.
Speaker:It's, you know, it's sad to say eventually you get what you're paying for.
Speaker:You know, if you're, you're looking to take a little shortcut, save a little money, I
Speaker:get it.
Speaker:Well, that's going to affect your culture.
Speaker:That's all.
Speaker:Well, and I always tell these young pros part of my success.
Speaker:And again, it's that I've been able to move towns.
Speaker:Yeah.
Speaker:Now, if I was, if I was a young pro and thinking that I'm going to move up the chain in Atlanta,
Speaker:that's going to be a tough one.
Speaker:But if I'm able to broaden my, my thought process of I would go here for a head pro job or a
Speaker:director's job in whatever town and start, you know, cutting my teeth there, then go do
Speaker:it.
Speaker:But if you have that ability to do, go do it because my success again has been every jump.
Speaker:It's been a much better job.
Speaker:But if I had tried to stay in the town, you know, all the, in Jacksonville and Ponta Vigia,
Speaker:all the pros came out of Flagler University or college.
Speaker:And I was the first one that came from out of town.
Speaker:And then Mike Leach came in from here and took over Ponta Vigia Club.
Speaker:And then I was like, if you were sitting around waiting for those jobs in the town, that's
Speaker:a long haul.
Speaker:But if you can tell yourself, this is the career and it's great to go to new towns and, you
Speaker:know, experience the culture and all.
Speaker:But it was really, really good for my career to be able to change, to change jobs in different
Speaker:towns.
Speaker:And I don't like that.
Speaker:I forgive the religious reference, but we're in Georgia. I can get away with it.
Speaker:There's no profits in the homeland.
Speaker:It has resonated with me often because sometimes I go in and I see, and I, somebody who knew me
Speaker:when I was a 25 year old idiot in the industry and making a name for myself, maybe not in the
Speaker:best way.
Speaker:If I had said, hey, you know what, maybe I had pro job in Nashville where I don't have that
Speaker:history.
Speaker:I don't know if somebody realizing that I was young and they just look at the body of work
Speaker:and needs to make that move and maybe just realize that if you come back in a few years and
Speaker:say, oh, maybe he went out and matured a little bit and came back.
Speaker:Bobby and I have stuck with Atlanta.
Speaker:So we've got history and everybody knows it.
Speaker:And that's part of the part of the deal that we navigate while we're here.
Speaker:You were smart enough to be able to leave and end up where you needed to be next.
Speaker:I think that's the thing to be able to do.
Speaker:Yeah.
Speaker:And you got to, if you're married and have kids, you got to have a spouse that'll go, let's
Speaker:go.
Speaker:You know, again, I mean, it's, if they're, you know, my wife, again, her advertising agency,
Speaker:none of her clients are in Atlanta.
Speaker:Well, they are now, but, but at that time, so she could, everything was virtual because
Speaker:she would travel a little bit.
Speaker:So she's the thank God.
Speaker:She just go, hey, let's go.
Speaker:It's better for you.
Speaker:Yeah, having the family that understands the helps there.
Speaker:So I want to, I want to jump into our last question, Jeff.
Speaker:Again, I, we appreciate the time with it's always fun.
Speaker:We always learn something.
Speaker:I think Bobby and I are in one of the best positions that you can be in Atlanta because we get
Speaker:to talk to anybody and everybody and we learn so much and we've learned so much over the
Speaker:last few years.
Speaker:But one of my favorite ways to learn is asking the, what we call the King of Tennis
Speaker:questions.
Speaker:Thank you, Jeff, for you working of tennis, whether it's the whole world or just Atlanta
Speaker:or just your club at any level, professional, social, whatever level of tennis.
Speaker:Is there anything you would do or chain without getting in too much trouble is I would, I
Speaker:would revamp the USDA from a national.
Speaker:Okay, trouble here.
Speaker:And again, it's where I am in my career right now and it's, I'm not expecting to get any
Speaker:awards or any paths on the back.
Speaker:But I, I think that it's time that, that the USDA has always fallen behind and not been
Speaker:the leader that it should be.
Speaker:And you know, this whole cluster that we had with the USPTA and PTR certification and,
Speaker:and what it was meant to be should have happened 30, 40 years ago, like the other federation's
Speaker:had.
Speaker:And when we see the drop off and American tennis players on the tour or just playing and,
Speaker:and there's a reason for that and, and I think the USDA dropped them all on that.
Speaker:You know, and, and again, you go.
Speaker:And I have not been down to the national campus, but it seems like most of the coaches down
Speaker:there are foreign coaches, not American coaches that are bringing up our kids, which is fine.
Speaker:Don't get me wrong.
Speaker:I think some of the best pros coming in for teaching pros are the foreign because they know how
Speaker:to work and they're willing to work.
Speaker:But I think we've, we've really need to, if I could, I, and I don't have the answer how
Speaker:I would revamp it.
Speaker:I just know the frustration.
Speaker:I was going to push because if you're king, you have to know how to do it too.
Speaker:I can't just say do it.
Speaker:So if you don't have the answer now, what I will do is I'm going to call you next week.
Speaker:I can't.
Speaker:I'll put more in the answer.
Speaker:I'll put more of the answer in.
Speaker:I, the first thing I would do would be the grass-rich program.
Speaker:I would spend a lot of time on, you know, we, we, I try to teach my pros all the time.
Speaker:It's a pyramid.
Speaker:I want a thousand red ball kids.
Speaker:And I'll take 500 orange ball and 300 green ball.
Speaker:And then I'll deal with the others.
Speaker:That's a pyramid that we need to have.
Speaker:If we don't have the feeder group.
Speaker:You know, if we, if we just focus on the top level kids and that's what was happening here
Speaker:at the club when I took over, all the effort was was on five or six kids.
Speaker:Where the rest of them were, you know, not getting the, they were the five or six really
Speaker:good players.
Speaker:And the rest of the kids were not getting the attention they should have and we lost,
Speaker:you know, the program was really small.
Speaker:But the, the USDA from, we have to start fresh.
Speaker:We have to start with the beginners, both adults and the, and the juniors and
Speaker:build the program up that way.
Speaker:Our biggest program has been tennis 101 here.
Speaker:And it's, you know, we've introduced probably, I don't have the number off the top, probably
Speaker:350 brand new tennis players to the game.
Speaker:And we're keeping them about 70% retention.
Speaker:And so we're getting in them involved.
Speaker:As soon as they get through 101, they go into 201, then they get into, you know, C8.
Speaker:And so I had one team that went from 101 to state championship in USDA 2.5.
Speaker:So it's a cool little thing.
Speaker:But again, off of, off of what we've done here, I would, I would spend a lot of time on
Speaker:the beginners and introducing people to the game.
Speaker:Pickleball is, I just spend a boatload of money on eight football courts.
Speaker:A boatload, we converted our stadium court to eight pickleball courts.
Speaker:It reminds me of tennis 40 years ago when it didn't matter who you played with.
Speaker:It was a little more social in the levels to, you know, easy to get into the game.
Speaker:That's why we got to, that's how we have to make tennis for these beginners.
Speaker:Yeah, that's a great point of view.
Speaker:And I think you're speaking Bobby's language there too.
Speaker:But Jeff, I appreciate it.
Speaker:Like I said, I'm calling.
Speaker:How are you going to do your King of tennis?
Speaker:But I think that's okay.
Speaker:You're here, mid, maybe that is the revamp.
Speaker:And maybe that's just just a fine.
Speaker:I'm going to stick with that.
Speaker:Yeah, it's marketing 101.
Speaker:The more people you have at the bottom, the more you'll have up on top, right?
Speaker:Exactly.
Speaker:It's always a hard part of backdoor.
Speaker:But it also, it speaks to your four pillars though.
Speaker:Because as you said earlier, you have somebody who likes to wear it.
Speaker:I think this is the big problem with, you know, when you bring in the superstar player,
Speaker:they don't want to coach the beginner.
Speaker:So, and do in the really, like you said, the leaders should decide, do we really need a
Speaker:pro to teach a beginner?
Speaker:We need somebody to get them excited about the game to take, to see where their next step
Speaker:is.
Speaker:Like, we try to do with our junior program.
Speaker:Sean runs our 12 and under.
Speaker:And I want them to see what's next, next to them and what comes after that.
Speaker:So you see where you want to get in, you decide where you want to go.
Speaker:And either I think through lack of resources, unfortunately, or bad judgment by the leadership,
Speaker:you know, that doesn't necessarily translate.
Speaker:And it's tough.
Speaker:It's tough.
Speaker:It's not an easy thing to do.
Speaker:But thankfully, if somebody in a position like yourself who can do it and as doing it
Speaker:is going to benefit the game.
Speaker:So in the long run, we're going to be okay.
Speaker:Well, there you have it.
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Speaker:And with that, we're out.
Speaker:See you next time.
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