On this installment of RRH, we’ve got the co-founder and CEO of Leon Bryan Smith. Together we dig into the impact of managing human beings and measuring burnout.
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What's up human.
Amy:Welcome to the revenue real hotline.
Amy:I'm Amy UFF check more importantly.
Amy:I'm excited.
Amy:You decided to join us today.
Amy:I know you've got a ton of options and I appreciate you.
Amy:This is a show about all the hard and uncomfortable conversations
Amy:that arise while generating revenue and how to think, or rethink what
Amy:you're doing, why you're doing it.
Amy:And then of course, how to execute differently.
Amy:And like I said, I'm happy you decided to come along for the.
Amy:Don't forget to follow the show wherever you listen.
Amy:So you can be notified each time a new episode drops and do me a favor friend.
Amy:Don't tell anybody about the show.
Amy:Let's keep it our little secret.
Amy:I'm Amy UFF check.
Amy:This is the revenue real hotline.
Amy:Enjoy
Amy:Brian Smith.
Amy:Welcome to the revenue real hotline
Bryan:friend.
Bryan:What's up Amy?
Bryan:How are.
Bryan:Ah,
Amy:I am pretty fantastic.
Amy:We got a light breeze coming from the east, so the air is
Amy:cool here on the Jersey shore.
Amy:And I can hear the, the waves and the birds.
Amy:And so I got no complaints, but unlike your day, you just, you did
Amy:doctor's office for a new baby, right?
Bryan:Yeah.
Bryan:Three month checkups.
Bryan:It's a little three month old.
Bryan:Right.
Bryan:So it's just like, you know, it's like, it's at this point right now where you're
Bryan:at the doctors pretty much every, I think.
Bryan:At this point for other shots or checkups or whatnot.
Bryan:Right.
Bryan:But yeah, he's all good.
Bryan:So no complaints there, you're an
Amy:old pro it may have been a couple of years, Brian, but it's like riding a bike.
Amy:So I'm told
Bryan:it's like, we, it's not at all, like riding a bike.
Bryan:Like I completely forgot.
Bryan:I, so for the listeners, I have a, I have a 13 year old, a 10
Bryan:year old and a three month old.
Bryan:Um, this shit is not like grinding.
Bryan:Right.
Bryan:I completely forgot how to do all of.
Bryan:And you like, I totally forgot.
Bryan:Like, and also I'm older now.
Bryan:Yeah.
Bryan:So I'm like, sleeping is more important.
Bryan:Now my wife is breastfeeding, so it's, I sort of, I'm lucky
Bryan:that way, but God, I'm tired.
Bryan:I'm really tired.
Bryan:Oh man.
Amy:Well, thoughts and prayers, Brian, thoughts and prayers.
Amy:I like and prayer.
Amy:So, so why, why don't we, why don't you tell our listeners a little
Amy:bit about who you are and what you do every day and then we'll dive
Bryan:right in.
Bryan:Sure.
Bryan:Um, Brian Smith.
Bryan:So I'm one of the co-founders at Leon.
Bryan:We are a sales focused mental health platform.
Bryan:Um, and yeah, my, my background is, uh, I, I grew up in the world of sports science.
Bryan:So I, uh, worked for USA track and field and IX, which is a football club, B
Bryan:Holland, Philadelphia Eagles, um, bunch of different organizations, essentially
Bryan:just doing really cool stuff with data.
Bryan:To sort of predict performance or predict injuries with, uh, professional athletes.
Bryan:And somehow I ended up in the world of tech sort of doing it's something.
Bryan:I was sellers I'm that did the exact thing for sales teams.
Bryan:It's still pretty cool.
Bryan:I still get to work with, with high performers.
Bryan:So I like
Amy:that.
Amy:That's awesome.
Amy:That's those are my favorite people to work with as well.
Amy:All right, Brian, I.
Amy:I gotta say, I mean, we have to start with this.
Amy:You just made the decision to, um, make Leon a platform that currently has over.
Amy:I think it was 240 sales teams and 2.4 million data points about burnout.
Amy:Right.
Amy:And specifically with the goal to prevent burnout, right.
Amy:Predictive, um, at the manager level.
Amy:But I love the phrase catch burnout before the fire, as someone that went through the
Amy:fire and came out on the other side, like I'm speaking from experience listeners,
Amy:you don't wanna go through the fire.
Amy:This is something you wanna get in front of.
Amy:But anyway, Brian, I, you gotta, you gotta tell me how you came to
Amy:this decision that you're going to, you know, give the platform away
Amy:for free shift business models.
Amy:You'd put a ranger post out about how, you know, you cared more about your
Amy:sellers than, than the, like the VCs and they may fire you for it, which listeners
Amy:that'll be linked in the show notes too.
Amy:But Brian, tell us, tell, tell us about.
Bryan:Yeah.
Bryan:So it's important to understand what Leon does, right.
Bryan:And what we do is we collect data points from a bunch of different sort of things.
Bryan:If it's surveys and sort of like diagnostic surveys and Salesforce
Bryan:integrations and whatnot.
Bryan:And then we take that data and then we help frontline managers
Bryan:understand the teams that are at risk of burning out the teams that
Bryan:are at risk of mental health issues.
Bryan:The teams that you know, are not very aligned to the organization
Bryan:or the team or whatever, have.
Bryan:But on the opposite end of that, we actually tell them how to
Bryan:challenge or push your teams harder.
Bryan:Right?
Bryan:We take data in that.
Bryan:We tell frontline managers, this is what you can do and can't do.
Bryan:And here are some recommendations and services and some consultants
Bryan:that you can engage in to be able to better support your team.
Bryan:Now, why we, how we did that for free.
Bryan:In the world of tech it's, the sales manager is like sort of this
Bryan:like really interesting thing.
Bryan:Right.
Bryan:And the re, and the reason I say that is unlike every other manager in the
Bryan:world, sales teams managed by Salesforce.
Bryan:That's what they do, right?
Bryan:It's a dashboard.
Bryan:It's like, are you hitting your goals or you, are you not?
Bryan:And that's how AEs who get promoted or SDRs who get promoted.
Bryan:That's the path they usually take.
Bryan:Right.
Bryan:And that's what they learn from.
Bryan:But what they don't learn is how to manage human beings.
Bryan:How to manage sort of like the intricacies of understanding stress and understanding
Bryan:recovery and understanding mental health.
Bryan:And you probably agree to this, Amy is that that's probably 90% of
Bryan:what we do as sales leaders, right?
Bryan:It's driving performance by better coaching up our people.
Bryan:and quite honestly, to me, it just felt like Leon's too valuable to
Bryan:protect in protecting people to not give it to free for people.
Bryan:If that makes sense.
Bryan:Um, I didn't want a barrier of money to be the restriction that, you know, prevents
Bryan:people from getting burned out or prevents people from quitting art, prevents
Bryan:people from, you know, getting promoted.
Bryan:Does that make sense?
Bryan:It
Amy:does actually, it does very much so.
Amy:And what's most impressive about the pivot as someone that's, you know, a friend and
Amy:a cheerleader and an advocate and just super excited about the whole thing is is
Amy:you, a lot of people get stuck in their.
Amy:Way of thinking their train of thought, right?
Amy:It it's in the same way that people, their experiences with these, these
Amy:sales bosses, as you say, like sometimes the most the thing that's
Amy:kind of pulling against you, the hardest is your own experience, right.
Amy:Where you've had success in the past.
Amy:And it's it almost.
Amy:It closes the mind around other paths to success, right?
Amy:Or the changing nature of pretty much all things, or just at least, especially
Amy:since COVID what you exhibited to me is the opposite of that because you
Amy:not only saw the value of, of the good that you can do right now in the present
Amy:moment, but you also found an adjacent path to deliver value for the company.
Amy:right.
Amy:Mm-hmm as well as, you know, ran the calculation around the
Amy:gathering more data faster, which is an important step, especially if
Amy:we're gonna plan the game of right.
Amy:How sales is currently managed right now.
Amy:And it's through dashboards and aggressive use of dashboards.
Amy:And.
Amy:A lack of an understanding about where true performance comes from.
Amy:But Brian, it's interesting though, because while you were speaking,
Amy:it made, I had a thought, right?
Amy:I think that even when you do kind of push through as a, as an, I see
Amy:as an individual contributor, right.
Amy:And you get to a certain point.
Amy:I don't know, like most of my friends that are my age or other advocates on
Amy:the mental health front, like we learned the hard way, I guess you could say.
Amy:And that generally, I don't know if it's like a mid 30 thing or
Amy:just like, I, I don't know, but it's just a trend I'm noticing.
Amy:And so I guess what I'm trying to say is that I don't know of many human
Amy:beings that are this evolved on the understanding and communicating around
Amy:the internal struggle that it is.
Amy:Operate as a salesperson without having gone through the learning curve of getting
Amy:their, their own head game in order.
Amy:Yeah.
Bryan:You know, what's, uh, it's funny.
Bryan:I was just talking to my, my co-founder about this.
Bryan:People now mean employees now are demonstrably more productive than they've
Bryan:ever been throughout history, right?
Bryan:Like you take, you know, going to work in the nineties, hiring a sales rep in
Bryan:the nineties versus hiring a sales rep.
Bryan:Now they're infinitely more productive.
Bryan:Right.
Bryan:But with that productivity does come up sort of a level of protection,
Bryan:but also a level of demand that those sales reps or that employees can now
Bryan:demand that sort of take account to.
Bryan:Right.
Bryan:So when we talk about mental health and we talk about all of these things,
Bryan:I almost look to medicine, right?
Bryan:Like medicine has used this concept of evidence-based practice to dictate a
Bryan:lot of the decisions that we make on a daily basis within a hospital system.
Bryan:Right.
Bryan:The idea is that we wanna make sure we use evidence to be about
Bryan:in data to support its decisions that we make within our people.
Bryan:And that's why we decided to make it free, right.
Bryan:Is because we wanna understand what does your Salesforce instances look
Bryan:like when we're seeing on our system, that a team is starting to burn out.
Bryan:How do opportunities drop?
Bryan:How does call volume decrease or increase?
Bryan:What happens when you have a bad manager and what happens to
Bryan:sort of sales rep performance?
Bryan:Like we can say this generally, like, oh, most likely they'll sell less or
Bryan:they'll turn over whenever have you, but we haven't been able to quantify that.
Bryan:All right.
Bryan:I wanna be able to say let's take data in and I wanna be
Bryan:able to serve let's predict.
Bryan:When burnout's gonna happen using Salesforce and surveys and whatever else.
Bryan:So we can mitigate those costs before performance drops by 20%, you
Bryan:burn out your entire team and you lose your job as the sales manager,
Bryan:that's what I wanna be able to do.
Bryan:And that's why we're giving away for free.
Bryan:Cuz we're moving to that point where we can start using that
Bryan:data to make real recommendations.
Bryan:On like how to better manage your
Amy:team.
Amy:Brian, I sold data, right?
Amy:Embroiders wore data.
Amy:This was my fucking house.
Amy:And one of the things, one of the soapbox that I would climb up
Amy:on is that there's a tremendous amount of data around us right now.
Amy:And.
Amy:One of the first things.
Amy:If you want to plan a game of using evidence based data to make smart
Amy:decisions, smart business decisions as an organization, let's start by figuring out
Amy:how to use the data we've got right now.
Amy:And I'm thinking about the I, what is it?
Amy:The Google project oxygen study that I believe was done first, it's
Amy:been done more than once now, but it was the first time was 2000 and.
Amy:And they came up with a pretty exquisite framework using evidence based data
Amy:across Google, which at that point was moderately large to identify
Amy:the eight characteristics that went into exceptional results, right.
Amy:The performance that the team was having.
Amy:And then they went back and expanded on it and I.
Amy:This is all like pretty known information it's out there.
Amy:We live in the information agent.
Amy:So to this idea of solving for the root cause why do you think that our landscape.
Amy:Has not used or incorporated the data that is, has been out there
Amy:just to use that one example for 12
Bryan:years.
Bryan:Yeah.
Bryan:I mean, uh, to your point with Google, right?
Bryan:I mean, so when, when Google puts out a report like that, what they're
Bryan:trying to establish is best practices.
Bryan:Right.
Bryan:Which, which makes sense.
Bryan:Right.
Bryan:But that's also Google.
Bryan:All right.
Bryan:That's also a very specific type of person that's being hired at Google
Bryan:and a pedigree of managers, a pedigree of culture and all those other things
Bryan:that are sort of influencing that.
Bryan:Right.
Bryan:Mm-hmm so what we're trying to
Amy:understand is also known as a control group, listener this, and he set me up
Amy:here and I'm like, where's going, Brian,
Bryan:please.
Bryan:There's a gentleman by the name of Dave Snowden who talks.
Bryan:Is that in the world of complexity.
Bryan:All right.
Bryan:Which is managing people.
Bryan:There is no such thing as best practice.
Bryan:There's only emergent practice.
Bryan:All right.
Bryan:And what you have to be able to do is run safe to fail experiments,
Bryan:to wait for signals, to emerge, to understand what works for your team.
Bryan:You can run safe to fail experiments in Google and have a good understanding or a
Bryan:good control, uh, to what's gonna happen.
Bryan:But it doesn't mean that your sales team in Kentucky, right.
Bryan:That is selling, you know, a widget is going to be able to, you're gonna be
Bryan:able to implement Google's best practices than it's gonna work for your team.
Bryan:So what we would rather do is we give you a signal.
Bryan:We give you recommendations.
Bryan:We have you run the recommendation, we collect the data to understand
Bryan:the impact of that recommendation.
Bryan:And then we tell you if it works for you or not.
Bryan:Does that make sense?
Bryan:Of course it
Amy:does.
Amy:Okay.
Amy:So I wanna bring this more to the practical that was well said and, and
Amy:point conceited and made to you, sir.
Amy:Okay.
Amy:When you were talking about mental health and burnout is so subjective, right?
Amy:It means wellness means different things to different people, right?
Amy:And, and how to go about getting there is also very individual.
Amy:And this is why the, the coaching skills, um, at the manager level are
Amy:massive wellness, intelligence index.
Amy:I love that frame.
Amy:I think what I wanna talk about is how we organize and structure a
Amy:period of performance for sales teams.
Amy:And I loved this three week on and then recovery week, um, because
Amy:one, I had never heard it before.
Amy:And two, I was just having conversation last night with a
Amy:new manager, a new sales manager.
Amy:She's a friend of mine and the new directive came down
Amy:and it's like the same.
Amy:It's like do more.
Amy:Zero extra inputs go and do more like that in turn turns or feels like at
Amy:the rep level, just do twice as more.
Amy:What you've done is not good enough, like all those things.
Amy:And I don't know.
Amy:Let's talk more about how, what is organizing and structuring the team.
Amy:Performance periods look like to
Bryan:you.
Bryan:So, um, so to your point about, uh, wellness being subjective, right?
Bryan:Our level of resiliency is dictated by so many different things, right.
Bryan:And how resilient a team is to a point of things that you can't even control.
Bryan:I, for example, Epigenetics, like there's an interesting study done,
Bryan:um, with Holocaust survivors, right?
Bryan:So they took Holocaust survivors.
Bryan:And what they did is they measure hormonal stress responses to
Bryan:other great grandchildren.
Bryan:And what they found is that their great grandchildren lacked certain
Bryan:ability to adapt, to stress due to epigenetic factors from their great
Bryan:grandparents who were so stressed out and the Holocaust that it impacted
Bryan:generations of families down the line.
Bryan:So that made that subset of population less resilient.
Bryan:And I bring that up because when we're talking about.
Bryan:Stress and performance, whatnot.
Bryan:It's all subjective.
Bryan:So it can be
Amy:subjective around the time of day.
Amy:Like exactly Dan Pink's, um, scientific benefits of perfect
Amy:timing talks about what is it?
Amy:Chronobiology blue.
Amy:My mind started with a case study or a story about, I figured it's the
Amy:Lucita and how the captain made his.
Amy:Stupid decision at like three o'clock right.
Amy:When that dip comes in, I CA I tell stories all the time about how I, when
Amy:I've taken the Myers Briggs test, I, I actually straddle between introverted and
Amy:extroverted and realizing that something so fundamental, like how I physically
Amy:char recharge, excuse me, changed.
Amy:There is so much subjectivity.
Amy:There is.
Amy:So it's internal factors.
Amy:It's external factors.
Amy:It's the time of day.
Amy:It's our genetics, what our, our grandparents experience.
Amy:And yet everyone's still looking for a, I don't know, a magic
Amy:wand or some kind of, yeah.
Amy:You know, here, let me read somebody else's routine.
Amy:Let me.
Amy:Implement this turnkey thing, but still that said, we do need to
Amy:design sales floors with a high degree of predictability and control.
Amy:But tell me more about, so what
Bryan:I was getting at is with that understanding is.
Bryan:High performance isn't necessarily like tape a phone to your hand, like old
Bryan:school sort of like boiler room, right.
Bryan:And like bang out 25 red bulls all, although that can be part
Bryan:of, sort of the creating a high performance environment, right.
Bryan:At least within a certain subset of population.
Bryan:But when we develop these sort of three weeks on one week off model, the idea
Bryan:is, is that we're turning up sort of a stress response during that three weeks.
Bryan:Right.
Bryan:Right.
Bryan:So we're increasing goals.
Bryan:Maybe you're having a little bit harder conversations.
Bryan:Maybe that's when you're using that radical candor sort of concept where
Bryan:like, everything is just a little bit more poignant and targeted on performance.
Bryan:Right.
Bryan:So we do that for maybe three weeks.
Bryan:Maybe we sort of step up the sort of volume.
Bryan:So like week one, it's uh, like I talked about this in the podcast
Bryan:with Brian ancestor tother, you wanna almost run like an MVP.
Bryan:With sales professionals.
Bryan:We're so fucking busy, right?
Bryan:We have from LinkedIn to like whatever, writing blogs, whatever it
Bryan:is, like there's a million different things we're doing with that week.
Bryan:One, let's make that an MVP week.
Bryan:Let's get rid of all the unnecessary stuff that you don't need to be
Bryan:doing from a sales standpoint.
Bryan:Just focus on the task at hand, right?
Bryan:Align on goals, align on calls, align on whatever it is, right.
Bryan:Align, align on sort of performance.
Bryan:And then you slowly sort of ramp that up over, over a period of time, right
Bryan:over week one week two in week three.
Bryan:But while you're doing that as a manager, you're.
Bryan:Implementing sort of like micro strategies or micro, whatever to sort
Bryan:of help your team recover a little bit.
Bryan:Maybe that's when you turn on head space for that week, maybe that's when you do
Bryan:that team building event, maybe that's when you realign on personal goals.
Bryan:Right?
Bryan:So you're increasing ramp of performance while you're
Bryan:supporting them during that time.
Bryan:All right.
Bryan:And once you hit that three week ramp, that's when you drop down and you
Bryan:recover and that's when you recover.
Bryan:But to your point, it follows this sort of super compensation
Bryan:cycle, which is you're sort of maintaining a level of homeostasis.
Bryan:You increase stress, increase, stress, increase stress, right back off, or
Bryan:recover a little bit, allow your body to sort of super compensate and get back to
Bryan:that sort of new level of homeostasis.
Bryan:And now performance improves.
Bryan:When you take a focused approach, what happens is it's cyclical, right?
Bryan:It's stress recover, increased performance, stress, recover, increased
Bryan:performance, or increased resilience or whatever it is too often in sales, we
Bryan:go baseline, say you onboard as an SDR and you just go, go, go, go, go, go.
Bryan:And you're trying to get promoted.
Bryan:So you don't take a vacation and you're trying to get promoted.
Bryan:So you don't talk to your manager about taking time off and you.
Bryan:Go.
Bryan:All right.
Bryan:But as managers, we can build this stuff in.
Bryan:It's just understanding sort of the signals and the data that you have
Bryan:to figure out if like, all right, this team is struggling right now.
Bryan:Let me just run some micro strategies or micro interactions,
Bryan:or just like me talk to them about their personal love being goals.
Bryan:Right.
Bryan:That down regulates that stress response.
Bryan:So then it gives you more of an opportunity or bandwidth to stretch
Bryan:that performance out a little bit more.
Bryan:Does that make sense?
Bryan:Of course it does.
Amy:I loved your hand.
Amy:Gestures, listeners missed out, like you missed out.
Amy:It was, there were some serious graphs and bar lines and like, um, standard
Amy:deviation of pretty sure calculated.
Amy:Yeah.
Amy:Shouldn't have pretty sure it's calculated.
Amy:Yeah.
Amy:All of we are sitting here, so just so you know, like don't take
Amy:off Brian without a calculator.
Amy:Consider yourself worth.
Amy:Okay, Brian, that was awesome.
Amy:I.
Amy:Love it.
Amy:And I love this idea very much about like three, even three weeks
Amy:on three weeks or a week of rest, like the first week of the month and
Amy:introducing new stretching exercises.
Amy:But I stand by what, what I said.
Amy:I think that all managers should.
Amy:Be working with a cognitive behavioral therapist or frankly, I
Amy:feel like the organization should have one staff, um, like billions
Amy:on, on Showtime, like in 10 years.
Amy:Yeah.
Amy:I think, I think that's where it's gonna be.
Amy:Like, it just, it seems silly.
Amy:Like how hard do you think bill Belichick had to be convinced to get a sports?
Amy:I put colleges hired for like the, well,
Bryan:what's crazy about it though.
Bryan:Educate this approach in the beginning, you're increasing the overall
Bryan:capacity of performance in the long.
Bryan:Yeah.
Bryan:Cause
Amy:your muscles, even, even, even if it's just one cycle,
Amy:like every time your muscles come back and grow together strong.
Amy:Um, they are just that.
Bryan:Yeah.
Bryan:Right.
Bryan:It's called the establishment of a functional system.
Bryan:Like your body is creating systems.
Bryan:Alright.
Bryan:And I mean, body as like holistically mind, you know, whatever else
Bryan:is creating systems to learn how to adapt to that new stressor.
Bryan:So now for the first like six weeks, you did three weeks on when we call
Bryan:for whatever strategy you're using.
Bryan:Right.
Bryan:But after six weeks, Now you can maybe stretch it out to four weeks
Bryan:on one week off five weeks on one week off, six weeks on one week off.
Bryan:So you're developing a more resilient workforce if you're using strategy to
Bryan:be able to do it, versus how we do it now, versus just like hit your goals
Bryan:or get on a pit plan and die, you know?
Amy:Yeah.
Amy:Um, yeah, one of the most interesting things that I've
Amy:read recently on this topic.
Amy:I think it was looking at Navy seals and there were two control or two groups, and
Amy:it was like, which one performed better.
Amy:Right.
Amy:And they ended up identifying the way these, um, two groups assessed a problem
Amy:and went after solving it group a comes up with the whole plan, thinks it
Amy:through blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, and then executes.
Amy:But far more prepared group B take on a task rest.
Amy:Take on a task and rest task rest.
Amy:And I, I mean, I feel like it's kind of obvious here, but given the context
Amy:of the conversation, but care to take a guess, which group performed
Amy:way better than the other one.
Amy:I would say
Bryan:that the, the rest one, the task
Amy:and the rest.
Amy:Right.
Amy:And it struck me because I'm a planner.
Amy:I can see a project like in, you know, year, a month or months down the road.
Amy:And I like to have it all planned out now don't get me wrong.
Amy:I was raised by a sales VP.
Amy:We were asked every night at dinner.
Amy:Like how many, how many times did you feel butterflies in your stomach today?
Amy:Or tell me a story of when, so we were raised to seek out the discomfort, which
Amy:I think is a key part of wellness, but that said, I'm still a planner and I read
Amy:this and it was just like, oh my gosh.
Amy:And so I started making this change.
Amy:right.
Amy:And not only did it allow me to be more intentional with going to
Amy:take a walk in between a task or maybe not feel so overwhelmed at the
Amy:start of the day with all the stuff that I'm gonna try to do, you know?
Amy:And it just, it it's been awesome.
Amy:But on that, I'll give you, I'll give you a final
Bryan:word and then, then we'll.
Bryan:Yeah.
Bryan:I mean, uh, well that, that, I think that same thing applies to leader.
Bryan:Right.
Bryan:Is that it's not just task specific.
Bryan:It's also how you're managing people.
Bryan:Cuz I think as sales leaders, we get too caught up and like we said before
Bryan:about managing the dashboard that you never just pause and reflect and be like,
Bryan:how can I support my people right now?
Bryan:Right?
Bryan:Like what is something I can do to downregulate stress for them a
Bryan:little bit, have them realign on the mission hand and then push forward.
Bryan:Wow.
Bryan:So great point.
Bryan:Awesome.
Amy:That wraps another installment of the revenue real hotline.
Amy:I'd like to thank my guest for being so damn real and for sharing their insights
Amy:and for, of course, being so much fun.
Amy:And I'd like to thank you, two listeners.
Amy:It means the world.
Amy:And I appreciate you.
Amy:If you have any thoughts or comments or experiences, you feel inclined to share
Amy:head straight over to revenue, rail.com.
Amy:There's a new join.
Amy:The conversation feature on the right side of the page.
Amy:I am old damn ears.
Amy:Final thought.
Amy:We are introducing a coaching aspect to the show.
Amy:So anyone who's brave enough to dig into an account strategy
Amy:or outbound strategy session.
Amy:That's where we kick things.
Amy:Please do follow the show wherever you listen to your podcasts.
Amy:So you'll always have the latest episode downloaded.
Amy:If you want to contact me, I'm at Amy at revenue, rail.com.
Amy:If you wanna follow me on social Twitter is Amy underscore Raub check.
Amy:And LinkedIn is linkedin.com/amy UFF.
Amy:Check.
Amy:This episode was produced by the fabulous Neen Feedler rock, man.
Amy:And I appreciate you too friend.
Amy:And of course, whatever you do, don't tell anybody about the show.
Amy:Let's keep it our little secret.
Amy:Until next time, all I'm Amy hub check.
Amy:This is the revenue real hotline, happy selling.