Javier Espinoza moved to San Antonio in 2007 and quickly established himself as one of the best trial lawyers in the city. In addition to that, he has taken up the admirable role of giving a voice to many of our city's forgotten workers. He joins us to discuss his passion and his plan to start a program to mentor youth that need advice and mentorship to better their lives.

Transcript: [music]

Justin Hill: Hello and bienvenidos, San Antonio. Welcome to the Alamo Hour, discussing the people, places, and passion that make our city. My name is Justin Hill, a local attorney, a proud San Antonion, and keeper of chickens and bees. On the Alamo Hour, you'll get to hear from the people that make San Antonio great and unique and the best-kept secret in Texas. We're glad that you're here.

All right. Welcome to this episode of The Alamo Hour. Today's guest is Javier Espinoza. Javier is a trial lawyer. He's an advocate for workers. He's a singer. I've seen him do a backflip, I think, or a front flip, I can't remember, maybe a handspring. Was it a herky? It was one of those things.

Javier Espinoza: Backflip.

[laughter]

Justin: Javier has handled all types of cases all over the state of Texas, but he's really settled into a focus on workers rights, not only in the courtroom, but he's an advocate for workers outside of the courtroom as well. He's handled some really high-profile cases here. If you Google him, you'll see that there's been a bunch of stuff that's going on in the last year or so that we're going to talk about involving him advocating for the rights of workers, not just laborers, but also people that work in government. Javier, thank you for being here.

Javier: Thank you for having me.

Justin: Yes. We did a small, little episode for my law firm earlier, so we're ready. We're warmed up. I'm going to start with some color commentary, a Top 10 list I do with other people.

Javier: We're good. How are you doing, Justin?

Justin: I'm doing great. Other than you just told me I look old before we started. What are you going to do? I need to drink more water, I think.

Javier: You look refined.

[laughter]

Justin: Yes. Is that because there's a distiller on next, I look fermented? All right. Top 10 list with Javier Espinoza. Javier, when and why did you move to San Antonio, Texas?

Javier: We moved to San Antonio, Texas in July 2007. I had been practicing in El Paso for five years prior to that. The main, main reason is because my wife wanted to go to law school and that's the deal we had made was I went to law school then she went to law school. When I moved to El Paso with the family, there was no law school in El Paso, so we had to pick a landing place. There was few options and San Antonio was definitely at the top of my list because I knew the next move was probably going to be permanent.

Justin: It wasn't where you went to law school which is in a terrible town. I'm not saying terrible law school but Lubbock is- it's not much punkin'. I was out there recently. We're all doing our part right now. Eat local, help local, support local. Are you doing any restaurants? Are you doing take out from or trying to help out or just any of that you've generally realized, "Oh, I'm frequenting this one a lot"?

Javier: We've actually been cooking at home a lot. Well, I say we, and my wife would kill me if she heard me say we. She has been cooking a lot at the house, and [crosstalk]-

Justin: You've been eating.

Javier: - cooking. Yes. I've been eating a lot. It's been tough on me.

Justin: We did Soluna to-go last night. I know that's one of her favorite restaurants.

Javier: Oh my God. We've done that. We did actually Fruteria where we did the to-go Pepino margaritas. Oh my God, that's delicious.

Justin: I've seen you there. I've seen you there having those and you've never invited me to have one with you. It's such a strange thing.

Javier: I will, but have you ever had them?

Justin: Of course, I have.

[laughter]

Justin: Of course. One of my favorite-

Javier: That is my favorite drink anywhere in the world. It's that the Pepino margaritas from Fruteria.

Justin: I've got a good story. I'll tell you afterwards about those margaritas. One funny story about the Fruteria is one of our good friends who is a lawyer in town. Her and I were going to meet and talk about some cases. She helps me on some car wreck stuff from time-to-time. I said, "Let's meet at Fruteria for lunch." She said, "Okay." She shows up, and she's frazzled, and she's sweating, and she's real stressed out.

I was like, "What is wrong?" She said, "Well, you told me to meet you at Fruteria. I Googled it and there's like 60 Fruterias in San Antonio." Then she said she found one that was close to the office then went to each of their websites, if they had websites, and found one with a menu, instead of just calling me and asking me. I thought that was pretty funny. Okay. Hidden gems in San Antonio. Anything that you really find particularly intriguing or nice in our city that you share with people that isn't the normal tourist trap?

Javier: I like Costa Pacifica a lot. That's a pretty cool restaurant. A lot of mixed Mexican style seafood.

Justin: Is it up Blanco?

Javier: It's on 1604 and by Blanco. 1604 between Stone Oak and Blanco. It's pretty good. Then on Thursday nights and Friday nights, they have live music so you sit on the patio and have a margarita, have seafood, and listen to music.

Justin: Have you ever sang?

Javier: Not there. [laughs]

Justin: Okay. Well, another time. Since you're a lawyer, I asked Mikal Watts recently, who's the best lawyer you ever saw in trial?

Javier: I ever saw in trial--

Justin: What made him good?

Javier: My old partner and mentor, Sam Legate. I tried a few cases with him. Sam has a way of connecting with juries where he doesn't shout, he doesn't get angry, he just talks to them. He would stand up there, and he would talk to them. I just really, really, really loved his style in that sense. Actually, somebody I've seen in action, Sam Legate from El Paso.

Justin: There's something to be said with just being the reasonable one.

Javier: Yes.

Justin: Yes. People forget that and think that what we do is-- I always liked Matlock. I thought Matlock had a very good affect.

Javier: Well, he's very observant, and he's very introspective. He actually taught me a lot in the sense that he says, "Don't look at the way you're looking at things. Look at the way that you believe the jury would be looking at things. Don't look at the way that an attorney living in your house looks at things. Look at the way that if your jury's a mechanic that has to go work 60, 70 hours in a garage, in the heat, whatever, think about the way they would look at this case and how do you connect to that."

Justin: That's hard to do.

Javier: It is but he was very, very good at that. That was very impressive.

Justin: There's a lawyer I like to listen to and here he says, "On my tough cases, I just have to think why am I right and why are they wrong?" He says he spends a ton of time trying to figure out that question because that's what a jury is going to try to figure out. Why are they right or why are they wrong? Part of your background is when you were in college, you worked at a rental car counter is my understanding. I know some of the things that I have done with rental cars, and they've probably been very tame. What are some of the craziest things you've seen people do to rental cars?

Javier: Well, instead of what they do to or in rental cars, let me tell you a tip on how to get a better rental car.

Justin: Okay. All right.

Javier: What I do, having been in the industry, is I always book an economy car or a compact car because that's the cheapest one. What I do is I get up to the counter and you befriend the person there. "How are you doing with things?" Or whatever. "Hey, buddy, you got a full size for another five bucks." With the way we worked is you would get a commission based on any upsells.

If you came to my counter and you were booked on a economy for 22 bucks, and I could put you into a full size for 30 bucks a day. I'm making you spend $8 more per day. If I can sell you the insurance, I get a commission off that. If I can sell you the gas, "Just bring it back empty. We'll fill it for you." All of that goes into the commission for the salesman if they're on a commission-based system which most of them are. They would rather have the extra upsell of five bucks a day than nothing. They would rather have anything you can throw at them.

Justin: Do they have free rein on what to do with the cars in the lot?

Javier: Most of them do.

Justin: Okay. All right.

Javier: That's why a lot of times, I go up and they say, "You're reserving that compact. Would like something bigger?" I'd say, "Well, do you have anything available?" They say, "What do you have in the compact?" A lot of times they don't because they've sold out all the cheapest vehicles first. "No, I'm good with what I've got." They've got to give you the free upgrade anyway. You end up in a full size for a compact price because they sold out all the compacts. We used to do that all the time.

Justin: I like how much detailed instruction we just got on how to upgrade our rental car. Hey, you said you want to make sure people leave with a useful piece of information. That's one.

Javier: Yes, for sure.

Justin: How many are you going to get? Three today?

Javier: At least three morsels of golden nuggets.

Justin: Okay. All right. That's definitely one because I'm going to use that. If you were not a lawyer, what would you be doing?

Javier: I'd be an architect probably.

Justin: Okay. All right. You have a real artistic brain.

Javier: I started as an art major, on art scholarship when I first went to community college. I thought I was going to be an artist. I've got a love of music. My brothers and I all play guitar, instruments, and stuff. We sing. We're not any good, but we do it. Well, some of my brothers are very good. I'm not very good, but we do it.

Justin: How many brothers do you have?

Javier: I have three brothers. I have an older brother and two younger brothers. All of us are musicians. When we get together, I've got a whole music room with my bass and drums and guitar. Well, not drums but a percussion.

Justin: A drum machine?

Javier: Well, it's a percussion system. You know what a cajón is? No?

[laughter]

Javier: The look in your eyes is funny.

Justin: It's a family-friendly affair here.

Javier: A cajón is just a box that you sit on and you tap it and you've got the bass and the little-- It's used a lot in Latin music. I've got that, the cajón, and I've got the little congas. I've got the bass, the guitar, everything. We think we're a band. My goal in life, from a musical aspect, is to be the guy with the band at Coasta Pacifica [laughs] when you go on Thursday then you listen.

Justin: I rarely go up that far to eat, but if you're going to be playing a cajón, I'm going to go.

Javier: Well, that's my goal as far as my music aspirations.

Justin: Well, you have a hat people can put money in?

Javier: Maybe. Depends how good we are.

Justin: All right. This is a perfect segue. Who would you compare your singing voice to?

Javier: God bless. I don't know that I can find somebody bad enough.

[laughter]

Justin: I only say this because we had a short discussion a couple weeks ago about microphones and you said, "No, I want it to record music," and so I thought, "Okay."

Javier: With computers nowadays, there's a little thing called Auto-Tune.

Justin: Yes, apparently, Post Malone is really into that.

Javier: Yes. If I sing horribly, the computer can make me sound great, but if you hear me in my living room, then I'm not going to sound very good unless we've been drinking.

Justin: In my car, I sound fantastic when the music is really loud, no one can hear me.

Javier: I find it the more I drink, the better I sound.

Justin: Yes, I think that is true. As an aside, did you watch Post Malone's Nirvana concert?

Javier: No, I did not.

Justin: He was fantastic.

Javier: Oh, yes?

Justin: Are you a Nirvana fan?

Javier: I am a Nirvana fan. I know who Post Malone is, but I'm not a huge Post Malone fan.

Justin: Yes, I'm not a Post Malone fan at all. I know who he is just because he's got a bunch of popular songs. It's fantastic. He clearly is a humongous Nirvana fan, and he tries to do justice to Nirvana's albums, and it really is good. He raised $6 million, $10 million for COVID relief or something. It was super successful. The Blink-182 drummer was the drummer on it and they played it in Zoom. It's worth the hour.

Javier: I got to go check it out.

Justin: Yes, it's worth the time.

Javier: It's probably not the type of music I normally listen to, but I got to go check it out.

Justin: I even saw some judges posting on Houston, Harris County judges posting on Facebook about how much they liked it.

Javier: Oh, wow.

Justin: Yes. What do you think the biggest challenge facing our city is?

Javier: Getting out of this, reopening the economy safely.

Justin: Outside of our current shutdown predicament.

Javier: What is our biggest? I think the digital gap which has been really, really highlighted by this COVID deal.

Justin: Exacerbated.

Javier: I'll tell you, we live on the northeast side. When my kids in second grade were turning in their homework through Google Docs, through PowerPoint presentations, how can somebody way in the south or somebody in a low-income side of town that doesn't have internet at home, doesn't have a laptop, how can they compete?

When they get through high school and they just have a really minimal understanding of the digital world, I think that is going to be the biggest game changer from a education standpoint. It's not really just going to be education, it's going to be, "Do you know digital?" Think about this. We're doing a podcast. We're just talking about your digital thing here. If you don't have a minimal understanding of the digital world, how can you even do this podcast? That's what I think the biggest challenge is in our city.

Justin: San Antonio has got the strange element of you've got the rural Southeast East Side rural, and then you've got low socio-economic that covers a large swath of the city other than maybe the pizza slice going straight north of downtown. You've got digital divide from access to internet, digital divide from access to equipment, you've got this strange thing.

Javier: I think if there's anything that we could do to make a difference, it would be to give free internet to everybody, at least, a certain amount.

Justin: Yes, and devices.

Javier: Yes.

Justin: Check out devices. Our law firms help and work with the GED program here right now. They are providing laptops to take home because they can't come into the classes. They're doing Zoom classes. They have access to refurbished laptops for 150 bucks. It's not a hurdle that makes it insurmountable for schools or non-profits to provide. It's just got to be a focus.

Javier: Yes, for sure.

Justin: Do you do any fiesta stuff, and if so, what is your favorite?

Javier: We really only do the King William Fair.

Justin: Okay. King William's winning this one by 50%.

Javier: Oh, yes? Well, I think because it's family-friendly, and probably the majority of the guests you've had have families. I'll share. When we first got here in 2007, I heard a lot about Oyster Bake. I took my, at the time I guess, she would have been seven- seven, nine, and ten-year-old to Oyster Bake thinking, "Oh, I've heard a lot about it," so we go. My wife's at St. Mary's Law School, so maybe we'll see her study there for her finals. It got crazy real quick. Like, "This is not a place for a seven, nine, and a ten-year-old." We left real quick, and that's probably wise. Ever since then, it's like, "What's family-friendly?" King William Fair has been pretty family-friendly.

Justin: Early.

Javier: Yes. We go eleven o'clock.

Justin: The Pooch Parade is family-friendly. It's people dress their dogs up in costumes and walk down the street.

Javier: Well, I'd be afraid my family would dress me up in that.

Justin: Some of the owners also dress up. Also the Arts Fair is a fantastic family-friendly. I think it's my favorite, the Arts Fair.

Javier: The Arts Fair?

Justin: Yes.

Javier: I haven't been to that one.

Justin: It's the first weekend. It's early in the day, so everybody's still excited. People aren't hung over yet. It's just a neat event. There's a big kids area where kids can go do art all day.

Javier: Well, and I'll share it with you. I have a lot of people that call me in and ask me about San Antonio. I regularly remind people. Understand, be patient with me, I've only been here 12 years. People think I've been here all my life and I...