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401 – Influencer Marketing – Word of Mouth at Scale with Yash Chavan
Episode 40117th December 2022 • Gift Biz Unwrapped • Sue Monhait
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I'm sure you've seen an influencer on Instagram, TikTok or YouTube share a product, and then their fans all rush out and buy it. Imagine how that would feel if it were YOUR product being shared! That's what today's episode is all about - how you can multiply the power of word of mouth by working with an established influencer.  Yash is the founder of SARAL - a tool for eCommerce brands that makes finding, managing, and monetizing influencers simple. He's an engineer by training, but a marketer at heart. After working various sales jobs, Yash started a marketing agency where he scaled with many brands and software companies to over $1M in annual revenue. Over the last couple of years, Yash has been focused on the world of influencer-driven marketing and has worked with over 5000 influencers. He created and perfected a 6-step-system that any brand can apply to start and scale a successful influencer program.

Word Of Mouth At Scale With Influencer Marketing

In this episode, you'll learn ...
  • What Influencer Marketing is all about
  • How this type of marketing is different from other marketing techniques
  • Finding the right influencers to work with for your business
  • How many influencers should you partner with?
  • A simple 6 step process to get started
  • Plus lots more ideas to start scaling word of mouth through influencer marketing

Tune in now to hear all the tips & tricks and start scaling your word of mouth through influencer marketing!

Resources Mentioned

Yash's Contact Links

WebsiteInstagram | LinkedIn

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Transcripts

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You're listening to Gift Biz Unwrapped guest episode number 401 Where

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instead of one customer talking to five of her friends,

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it's one influential customer talking to 50,000

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of her fans.

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Attention Gifters,

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bakers, crafters and makers pursuing your dream can be fun.

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Whether you have an established business or looking to start one

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now you are in the right place.

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This is Gift Biz Unwrapped,

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helping you turn your skill into a flourishing business.

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Join us for an episode packed full of invaluable guidance,

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resources and the support you need to grow your gift biz.

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Here is your host Gift Biz Gal Sue Moon Height.

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Hi there,

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It's Sue and I am so happy to have you joining

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me here today.

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I know you're in the hectic holiday season,

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so it makes it extra special that you're tuning in.

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It's this time of year I know you count on for

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a huge bump in business and along with that comes high

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activity and all routine flies out the window as you rush

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to get everything done.

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I bet right now you're thinking I'm gonna remind you to

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take care of yourself by eating right and getting enough sleep.

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That indeed is true.

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But what I also want to do is reference you back

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to a podcast episode I did a while ago.

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It's number 137 titled Five Steps to Merry and Bright Holiday

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Sales. Now,

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while this title sounds all light and festive,

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it's actually a very important show here.

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I share with you how to keep the momentum of your

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holiday sales extended into the new year.

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And the reason I want you to listen to this show

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now is I explain how to enhance your holiday season all

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around year over year.

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So write this episode number down and fit it into your

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podcast listening plan number 137.

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It's a shorter show and you can knock it out at

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double speed if you like.

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The important thing is you capture the information while you can,

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which is right in this holiday season.

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You'll understand what I mean when you listen to the show.

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I've actually got a lot of goodness coming your way because

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besides that show,

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in this episode we're discussing influencer marketing.

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This could be a new sales approach to dive into next

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year. The exciting thing about this strategy is that influencers are

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becoming more and more attracted to smaller brands.

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They're discovering that people with smaller audiences are more connected to

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their followers and in turn are more trustworthy as products are

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introduced and referred to them.

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This works in reverse two.

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I've seen the tide changing in this direction over the past

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year and now's a great time to get an update on

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how it all works.

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Today we're gonna be talking with Yas.

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Chauvin Yas is the founder of cll,

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a tool for e-commerce brands that makes finding,

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managing and monetizing influencers simple.

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He's an engineer by training but a marketer at heart.

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After working various sales jobs,

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Yas started a marketing agency where he scaled many brands and

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software companies to over a million dollars in annual revenue.

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Over the last couple of years,

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Yasha has been focused on the world of influencer driven marketing

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and has worked with over 5,000

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influencers. He's created and perfected his own six step system that

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any brand can apply to start and scale a successful influencer

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program. Yosh,

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welcome to the Gift Biz Unwrapped podcast.

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Thanks you.

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Thanks for having me on.

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And that was a lovely intro.

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Let's do it.

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Good, I'm glad we started it off right.

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Yeah. One of the things I like to do first with

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each guest that comes on the show is have you describe

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yourself in more of a personal way.

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Okay. And that's through a motivational candle.

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So if you were to describe for us what a candle

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would look like that really would speak to you Yosh,

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what color would it be and like what kind of a

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saying or feeling or quote would be on your very special

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candle? I think my candle would be a nice bright orange

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saffron color,

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like a very,

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like the color of the sun when it's rising it's probably

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gonna be that color and I think they're like too many

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quotes that I live by.

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I'm picking one,

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but I think if I had to do one on the

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candle it would be boring work leads to extraordinary outcomes.

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I think a lot of growth is just doing the same

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thing over and over again.

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Another non-res background on me,

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I train mma,

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especially in sports like jujitsu or even in like martial arts

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in general.

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It's a lot about doing the same thing again and again,

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like practicing the same kick again and again and again until

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you get it right and it gets boring after the point,

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but then that's where the progress comes.

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So I think it applies straight into business as well.

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Like not everything's gonna be exciting.

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So you have to get used to the boredom of doing

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the same thing over and over and over and over again

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until you see the end result.

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Right. Cause a lot of the graph is like slow growth

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until it finally hits.

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But most people just give up here cause it's too boring.

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Right. So that'll be my quote.

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Yeah, that makes me think differently.

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And we haven't ever talked about it with the word boring

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before but I think some people just get frustrated because they

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try something,

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it doesn't work,

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it doesn't work,

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it doesn't work.

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Or they don't start at all because they don't know what

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they're doing so they're afraid they're not gonna do it.

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Right. But to your point about it being boring and just

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rehearse and do it over and over again and practice until

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it becomes second nature and you perfect it,

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that's when you see the results.

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Exactly. Yep.

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I think it's both quality and quantity,

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right? A lot of people focus on like doing their best

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work, but then yes,

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you have to do your best work but you also have

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to do it so many times that everyone else who's doing

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their best work is like out to work by you and

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that's how you win.

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Right. Yeah.

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I think I'm gonna take this just a little bit of

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another extension for everyone who's listening who's a maker and hiring

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somebody in to help make their product,

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it will take them a little bit of time to get

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to the point near where your skill level is of being

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a creator,

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right? They have to have the creative skill but you have

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to give them some time to perfect it.

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Just like Yasha saying some repetition.

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If they don't do it right the very first time,

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don't be frustrated and think they're not the one who can

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help you.

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You need to give them a little time in to get

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there. Just came to mind.

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So I had to add that in.

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So let's take it back a little bit in time.

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I'm interested,

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I know you started your own marketing agency,

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but how did influencer marketing get on your radar?

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Okay, so this is a very interesting story.

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So I started the marketing agency,

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nothing new,

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just a few of us,

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like four or five people working with brands,

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working with SaaS companies.

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It was what's called a full funnel marketing agency.

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So we did everything from acquisition to onboarding to retention to

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revenue, like we used to do like touch all parts of

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the funnel.

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We weren't just like doing Facebook ads or doing email marketing.

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We were like pretty much like all over the place.

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We just worked with a few brands and we helped scale

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them. Were they all retail or product based brands or services

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also or product?

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No services.

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Product only.

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All product.

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Yeah. Yeah.

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Perfect. Okay.

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Not retail though.

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Mostly like e-commerce,

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like online stuff.

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Yeah. Okay.

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But still product.

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Product, yes.

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Got it.

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So we worked with them and then if you were in

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e-commerce back in like pre covid like 20 19,

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20 20,

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early 2020,

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a lot of the growth top of funnel like user acquisition

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was through Facebook ads.

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So they were just pouring money on Facebook and Facebook used

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to perform well this was slightly plateauing but then it wasn't

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bad. And then what happened was Apple launched this brand new

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thing called iOS 14.5

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and they,

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with that they launched a new privacy update which caused all

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Facebook ads to,

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and this was the time around when Mark Zuckerberg was in

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the news.

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A lot of like people from Google were in the news

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for like this privacy thing.

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So Apple took it seriously and then they just stopped.

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If you recall,

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a couple of years ago and even now your iPhone started

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asking you ask app not to track.

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Right? Right.

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So that was the software update and that basically crashed all

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of Facebook ads cuz Facebook couldn't track people anymore.

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They couldn't tell you that.

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Oh like Sue was interested in product,

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product-based businesses.

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Yas is interested in martial arts.

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They lost all that data tracking.

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Yeah. And as someone who was part of that scene doing

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Facebook ads,

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and I know that some of you listening also are familiar

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with this,

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but what used to be so great about Facebook ads is

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that, and you can tell me how much I know Yosh

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after I spent all this money on Facebook ads.

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Okay. But before that crash,

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once you had a system and an ad that worked,

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you knew your return.

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So even if you put more dollars to it,

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you knew and were very confident of the return that you

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would get.

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So it was a very stable,

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solid, well performing platform.

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Forget organic right now we're not talking that we're talking about

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with ads.

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And so a lot of us who,

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especially on e-commerce,

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a lot of us relied heavily on that to attract in

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new business because it was very predictable and then all of

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a sudden the door slam shut and it wasn't predictable anymore

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at all.

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Exactly. To be fair,

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they gave us what,

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three months warning?

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Maybe six.

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Yep. Maybe.

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Yeah. I did it that I remember the blue warning popping

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up and saying hey you need to fix your conversion events

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to something else or something like that.

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But then we were seeing the downfall of ads and this

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was already in the back of my mind like hey we

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need to like pivot otherwise like this is just not sustainable.

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And then the iOS update hit the nail in the head

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and we were like,

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okay, I have two options now.

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Right? Either all my clients would fire me cuz there's like

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no, no customers that they're getting Facebook or I could do

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something to get them customers.

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Right? So obviously I chose the latter and then that's how

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we discovered influencer marketing and there were like a couple of

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options we were considering,

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right? So content marketing is a good one but again,

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SEO and content,

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that stuff takes at least 12 months to really start performing.

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So like that's like too long of a timeframe.

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We need something relatively more quicker,

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right? Because Facebook ads is quick,

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right? You could just turn on an ad and two hours

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later you have a sales coming in,

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right? That's not possible with seo.

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So I think influencer marketing was sort of in the middle

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where it takes a couple weeks but then you see the

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sales come in and it's more long term as well as

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compared to Facebook.

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So we were like okay let's do influencer marketing and that's

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how I just kind of just stumbled across it thanks to

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Apple and Facebook and then yeah,

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that's how we got into it.

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We were really successful at it.

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We've scaled like programs from zero to 300 500 creators sometimes.

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And then yeah,

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we've worked with thousands,

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I've lost count.

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Like the 5,000

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number I gave you was just like,

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yeah it's probably 5,000

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now cause we've scaled so many influencer programs but yeah,

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thousands of creators have been reached out to negotiated with.

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So yeah,

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that's my influence of marketing story.

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Wow, okay.

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So this is new learning for me because I also talk

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a lot about content marketing and I think it's a good

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strategy but you're right,

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it's long-term.

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Kind of like how we also talk now about being on

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Pinterest. Pinterest isn't so much a social media platform now it's

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more kind of like YouTube,

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like a long-term.

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You put it up there and it's gonna work for you

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for a long time,

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but it's gonna take time to start seeing results.

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And you're saying influencer marketing sits between what social ads used

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to look like and then what content is Exactly.

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Yes, that's what what I'm saying.

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Yeah, because social ads was immediate,

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it's, it's like a tap,

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right? You turn it on,

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there were sales versus something like content marketing is like digging

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a well like over time slowly you find some,

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you find some,

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you know it's dry soil and you keep digging,

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you find some,

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you know mud,

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then you keep digging maybe some water and you keep digging

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then it's like a well right?

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It takes time But then it keeps flowing.

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Exactly. With Facebook ads when you stop it's over.

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Yeah, that app is done right.

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So I think influencers fit right in the middle where it's

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not as quick as turning on a tap build also does

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not take six months to really start giving some reasonable resorts.

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So when you decided that you were gonna target in and

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really get to know and understand influencer marketing,

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how did you do that?

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How did you educate yourself to get to where you are

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as an expert now?

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For sure.

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So I think I've spent for influencer marketing maybe over like

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almost close to like depending on what you consider influencer marketing,

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I'm close like spending like 10 K on coaching,

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on courses,

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on books.

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But I must say I did not start with any of

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this. I think a lot of people tend to like,

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cuz influencer marketing is like a weird space where it's like

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just not obvious what to do.

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Like how do we reach out?

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What influencer do I,

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how much do I pay them?

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Right? So what do I say in my email?

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How do I dm,

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right? It's just so many questions.

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I think people,

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it's natural to just want to seek out some sort of

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a structure with books and courses.

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But what I did was like,

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I'm a pretty scrappy like marketer so I just like,

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I was like okay,

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we need influencers.

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The best way to find influencers is on Instagram.

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So we just searched some Instagram influencers,

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sent them dm,

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sent them emails and then it started working and then I

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got the ball rolling first and then I invested in all

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this like courses,

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books and stuff like that and educated myself over the course

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of like years.

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And it also comes through doing right.

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The more influencers you talk to,

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the more negotiations that you do,

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the more campaigns that you run.

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It's like all of that is just learning over time.

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Right? Okay.

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So I love that because it's a combination of gathering the

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knowledge from people who have already been there who are sharing

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and then also doing your own experiments and testing and feed

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in to figure out exactly how it will work best for

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you. Exactly.

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So you're not just taking something and replicating what other people

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had. You did a combination.

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And I think that's a wonderful way to approach anything new

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that we're doing.

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And let's face it,

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influencer marketing is still also very new.

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And I think,

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and let's correct a misconception right off the bat here and

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you've already been stating it.

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I think a lot of us who are less tapped into

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this think that an influencer has to come to us.

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Okay, where what you are saying is the program is be

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proactive, decide you're gonna have an influencer marketing program and reach

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out to them.

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Yes. Right?

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Yep. Before we get into everything influencer marketing,

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let's make sure everybody who's listening understands exactly what we're we're

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talking about.

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So I'm thinking like a definition here would be good so

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that we all know we're starting from the same place.

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Sure. I think at the most fundamental level it's just think

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of it as,

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except regardless of influencers and social media and all of that,

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I think it's just word of mouth at scale.

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I think everyone knows what word of mouth is.

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It's when your customers shout out or talk about your brand

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to other people who also might become customers,

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right? So influencer marketing is just a form of word of

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mouth where instead of one customer talking to five of her

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friends, it's one influential customer talking to 50,000

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of her fans,

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right? So it's like it's a different form of word of

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mouth where it's at scale where one person has a huge

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reach of people specific to your target market when they're talking

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about you.

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So if I were to put a definition to it,

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I would just say it's like it's word of mouth at

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scale. Okay.

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I love that.

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And I think that's gonna be the title of this episode.

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Thank you.

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Perfect. We got it.

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Cause it really does,

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it describes it all and it's very clear to understand for

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sure. Okay,

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so you were gonna go on and talk a little bit

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more about how it all developed and you know all that.

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Yep. Outbound.

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So basically I think that's true most of even in e-commerce

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what I've seen is that people come from the affiliate kind

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of side of thinking where they think the affiliate has to

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apply to your affiliate program,

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then you approve them and then they promote you.

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That's possible.

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And we've seen that happen for a lot of brands that

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we've scaled.

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That comes with recognition,

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right? When you are an early stage brand,

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not a lot of people know about you.

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You have to reach out to these people,

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you have to find the right people,

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you have to reach out to them with the right message

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and the right offer for them.

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Like what's in it for them,

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right? Obviously for you as a brand,

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like there's lots of promotion,

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there's lots of reach,

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but what's in it for them,

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right? So you have to reach out to them with the

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right offer and then based on your experiments doing these outreach

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messages, maybe you send like 50 messages saying hey we'll do

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a percentage commission.

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Then you send 50 messages doing like hey we'll pay you

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a flat fee upfront.

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Maybe you send another 50 messages saying hey we'll do a

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combination of a fee plus some commissions.

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Then you learn from this and then eventually you build like

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a core offer for influencers which they can then apply to.

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But then when you are starting out,

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at least like to get your first 50 influencers to promote

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you, we've seen that outbound usually is just the best strategy.

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You're in control,

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right? Because you can onboard as many ways you want,

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reach out to as many as you want,

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you can take it slow if you want,

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take it faster if you want.

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Versus with inbound you'll just have an application pays there.

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But then what?

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Like don't have control over it.

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You don't have control over how many people apply.

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I love what you're saying Yash because you're saying yeah,

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get your first 50.

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And I think a lot of people are here like,

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dang I'd be happy if I got my first five.

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You know,

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you're thinking bigger and because you've seen that happen.

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So I love that.

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You know,

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I feel like I'm seeing a lot of focus now on

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micro influencers that we as smaller businesses,

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you know not the big brand names that are on the

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top of everyone's mind that are the smaller brands are becoming

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more popular with influencers these days.

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Yep. Is that right?

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You're saying I see you nodding your head.

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Yep. No one else can see it but you're nodding your

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head yes.

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So is that true and why do you think it is?

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That is very true and I think there's also another faction

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of influencers called nano influencers,

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which is even smaller than micro,

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right? And I think for us right now for our clients

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we are seeing that mostly like nano is the way to

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go. Especially if you're like a early stage brand.

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And I'll tell you the reason for that.

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Most, like you said Sue,

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most bigger brands are after the bigger influencers.

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Cause it's like if they are,

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let's say they're Nike,

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right? Nike wants to work with LeBron James,

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right? It looks like the biggest of the biggest,

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right? The influencer,

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the biggest,

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the brand is the biggest,

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right? And as you keep going like lower and lower in

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terms of scale,

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they wanna work with like influencers at a similar level as

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them. So as an early stage brand,

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you are a startup,

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right? You're a new brand so you wanna work with a

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startup creator,

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right? On the other hand as well,

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if you are a startup and you reach out to like

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someone with like 200,000

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followers, they're likely not gonna reciprocate.

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But if you reach out to someone with 5,000

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followers, they're very likely to reciprocate.

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So it's just that kind of like what's the stage that

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you are at and who's gonna reciprocate to you?

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And then yeah,

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most brands that we are seeing right now are having massive

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success with nano influencers and let's define that,

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right? So it's different where you read it,

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but usually anywhere between 3000 followers,

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25,000 followers is what's like a nano influencer.

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Okay? Then anywhere between 25 to a hundred K is micro,

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it's what we consider micro.

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So yeah.

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Alright. If I'm a jewelry maker,

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what type of influencers would I be trying to reach out

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to? Because I'm making the product and selling the product to

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my community.

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Yep. So give us just an idea so we understand the

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opportunities as you continue talking later.

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For sure.

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So if you're a jewelry maker,

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there are two concepts here,

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right? So let's say,

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I'll tell you my process of working with the brand.

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So let's say if a jewelry brand comes and they wanna

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work with us,

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we tell them the way we find influencers is,

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is two things.

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One is like who is your core influencer and who's your

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tangential influencer?

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And I can explain these concepts.

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So core influencer is someone who's posting about jewelry,

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who's posting about accessories,

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maybe like something that is just directly related to your brand.

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So like you know,

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jewelry, accessories,

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hearings, luxury jewelry,

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something like that,

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right? Or like whatever your,

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let's say you are into imitation jewelry.

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So someone who's posting about imitation jewelry is your core target,

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right? And then there's something called tangential,

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which is mostly like,

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so your core is usually like 20% of who your influencers

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are and then most of it it is tangential.

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So someone who's into jewelry is also likely maybe into beauty,

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right? Who's also likely into skincare,

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let's say luxury skincare,

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right? And who's also into like makeup,

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something like that,

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right? So it's like similar to like people who are into

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jewelry are also into X,

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Y, and Z.

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And these are like your tangential hashtags or your tangential groups

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of influencers.

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It's like the same audience but not directly selling the same

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thing. But their interests would probably be similar.

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Exactly. So your goal should be to not find influencers but

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to find sources of influence.

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So these are two different things.

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Sometimes someone's an influencer but they have very little influence on

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anybody, right?

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Versus maybe someone's not that big of an influencer,

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maybe they just have like 5,000

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followers. All 5,000

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of those people are like whatever this person says I'm gonna

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buy, I'm gonna try it out,

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I'm gonna do it in my life.

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So that person's a source of influence and that is the

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person that you wanna find.

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Well And that's also why I think the nano and micro

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are becoming more popular because you can have someone who has

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200,000 followers but such a small percentage of even that large

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number really care cuz there's just the community is so big,

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but when you have smaller communities they tend to be more

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focused and in depth and loyal.

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Exactly. Yeah.

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I think it's just natural loft numbers,

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right? The larger you go,

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the broader your appeal is.

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The smaller you are,

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the more focused you can be.

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You could also actually see it in like maybe pop culture

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or television stuff.

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So like when someone's like,

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let's say they're like a sports person and they're like a

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sports influencer,

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right? They just talk about sports.

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Let's say that sports person has like a hundred thousand followers,

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right? But let's assume they also now they go go get

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into like let's say their state politics or something.

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Right now they just can't talk about just sports,

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right? Because their audience has changed.

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It's like 10 times larger,

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a hundred times larger now,

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right? So you have to like go broader even as like

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from an influencers perspective,

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right? If they wanna go bigger,

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they wanna speak about more things in a to a broader

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audience and water down their core message.

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So especially as an early bank to see the most results,

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you wanna work with like the smaller creator with a very

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simple defined core message and like work with like more of

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those people than chasing that one superstar that you think would

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be like the golden unlock for your business.

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Because a lot of times everyone's chasing them and you're really

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not gonna get that presence or that the bang for your

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buck if you will.

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Even if they agree to do it.

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The smaller brands are much better,

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the smaller influencers.

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Yes, exactly.

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And the bigger influencers also gonna charge you a lot more

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upfront cash as opposed to the small influencer.

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Usually like small influencers also agree on like a commission basis,

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like a revshare or a affiliate model.

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And that's the best,

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especially if you're like a small business owner,

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you don't have external funding,

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you're just kind of like doing this on the side or

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have your savings that are into it.

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You don't wanna like risk paying someone 500 bucks and hoping

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that it drives at least 500 worth in sales,

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right? You would rather do an affiliate model and smaller creators

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are the ones that are most open to them.

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Well so tell me cuz now I'm getting myself a little

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bit confused here because a lot of the time from the

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handmade product or any type of a physical product,

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what we do is you reach out to someone and you

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send them your product to try,

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right? Yeah.

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And then the idea is then that they're going to try

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it and promote it to their community.

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Yep. And so who's paying who at that point you are

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sending a product.

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Yes. But where's the commissions or the flat fee coming from?

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Yeah, so usually like sometimes you can,

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if it's a really perfect fit,

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like if you are like into imitation jewelry and the influencer

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is all about imitation jewelry and your product is really great,

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like different from the market,

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they might just post for product only.

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But very rarely have we seen that work.

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What works usually in our case is that if you send

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them free product,

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yes and you give them a certain affiliate commission for themselves

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and if you give them a discount for their audience,

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so you're incentivizing all three sides here,

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right? Okay.

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You're sending free product which is basically rigging the game in

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your favor.

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They don't have to buy from you,

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you're just sending them it for free,

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sending it to them for free,

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right? You're giving them a reason to post so that they

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can earn a certain percentage in commissions so they have a

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reason to post.

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Now even if they post and nobody buys,

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then the whole thing is pointless,

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right? So you have to give the audience a reason to

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buy and that's where the discount for the audience comes in

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where you give them like a 10% off if you buy

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using my coupon code or something like that.

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So yeah.

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Okay. Well and honestly you know I feel like I would

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want to send them my product cuz I want them to

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take pictures having my product with them cuz that's credibility,

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right? Yeah.

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So we just got a new puppy,

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okay? And our puppy has its own Instagram,

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it's biscotti tales if you wanna check it out.

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Biscotti like the Cracker Tales,

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T A I L S.

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Okay. I'm not doing any influencer marketing yet,

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but I am getting approached by people,

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dog bandanas,

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dog bones,

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like all of that.

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And so us talking comes it a great time for me.

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Now obviously we just got him,

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I think he has 50 followers,

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maybe most of them family,

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you know,

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whatever. Maybe more if you guys are listening follow biscotti tales.

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But I'm having smaller handmade businesses reach out to me with

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dog related products saying Hey are you interested in promoting our

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brand? We'll send you free product or we're gonna give you

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this discount.

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That kind of a thing.

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They might not be doing exactly it,

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right? I don't know.

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Yep. But is this the kind of interaction you're looking at?

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Yes, this is exactly right.

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So I mean there are different flavors to it.

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I we mostly prefer to incentivize all three sides so everyone

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comes out on top.

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But some people like depending on your budget,

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on your constraints and what you wanna do and the type

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of campaign you're running,

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you might do a what's called a barter collab where you

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give them a 50 product and they post about you.

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There's no commission,

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there's no discount,

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none of that.

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That's a barter collab.

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What we do is also called ambassador CoLab where you kinda

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make them like a brand ambassador,

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which is the best for long-term cuz you can do barter

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once, right?

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But you can't take,

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it's like that doesn't work,

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nobody's just gonna keep posting what you for free,

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right? So you have to give them some skin in the

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game. Someone's been asking me about that too.

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I didn't know what that was yet.

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I haven't had the time to look into all of it

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yet. They're all communicating with me through dms.

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So I've got 'em all saved.

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I know I need to go back and look at them.

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And for me,

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even though it's biscotti talking cuz that's how I've made the

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account go,

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okay I need to know that I like the product before

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I'm going to recommend it,

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right? Because if I don't And if the Scotty likes the

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product, Right?

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Well he loves all his scarfs so far,

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but you're exactly right cuz I don't wanna be like oh

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you know she does all of this and half the stuff

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we never even see them using.

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Not that You're exactly right as a brand,

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you wanna work with creators like Sue who are selective about

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whom they promote.

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There's a lot of creators you would find online and I'm

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sure you've probably seen some of them who just promote every

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single brand that approaches them,

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right? Cause they pay some money that just loses authenticity over

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time. You are not credible.

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Cause on one day you're promoting like a,

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let's say a vegan health food startup on another day you're

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promoting a leather jacket.

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Like it doesn't make sense,

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right? It's not congruent.

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Good point.

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Yeah. So as a brand you wanna look for influencers who

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are congruent with their message.

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It's fine if they promote like a,

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let's say a vegan jacket and a vegans like a health

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supplement, something like that.

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Because as long as it's aligned on so it's like not

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incongruent, it's not like hypocritical a bit.

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And you wanna work for those kinds of creators and like

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Sue was mentioning,

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you wanna work with creators who will only promote something if

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they like it.

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Cause that's where true advocacy comes.

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Like if they actually love your brand,

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then like the affiliate commission and all of that is just

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like a icing on the cake anyway.

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Wanna promote you cuz you are so awesome,

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right? So find that TRIBE of people who would promote you

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organically and then I incentivize them to promote.

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It's kind of like if I were to give a similar

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analogy maybe for the business owners,

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cuz we also spoke about hiring right at the beginning.

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You don't wanna hire someone who would only work at your

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company for the money,

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right? You wanna hire someone who would anyway work at like

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they're any way a great fit.

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And then obviously like you gotta pay them,

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right? That's like,

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that's fine,

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right? Yeah.

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But you don't wanna work with someone who's just doing it

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because you pay them more or just doing it cuz they

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desperately need the money cause they're just not gonna perform well

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over time.

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Especially you wanna work with team members who are like motivated

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by your brand,

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who have full buy-in,

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who live the brand's ethos and then you obviously like pay

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them, you work with them,

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you treat them as family,

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all of that same for influencers.

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You wanna work with influencers who would anyway potentially become customers

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of your brand.

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They anyway love your product and then you are obviously giving

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them affiliate commissions so that you know they're incentivized to Boche.

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So that's like an analogy.

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Yeah. Got it.

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That's a good point.

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Yeah. One more thing but I wanna get into your six

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step process a little bit.

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But it brings up another question.

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As a small business,

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let's stick with jewelry cuz that's where we started.

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We'll stay with that theme here.

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Is there a certain number of influencers you should have?

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Because at some point it just,

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it gets to be they're not doing anything but promoting anybody

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So in terms of number of influencers,

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what we've seen work is that,

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like you said,

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like a lot of brands would be happy to have five

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and I'm talking about 50.

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Usually a lot of brands just think small with the number

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of, and they think that having like five,

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10, like a dozen people promoting them is going to result

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in sales and replace like Facebook ads for them.

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But that pretty much never happens unless you somehow convince like

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five super famous people to push about you on commission only.

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That's not gonna happen.

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You need a decent volume of creators.

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And what,

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by that I mean at least like 30 to 50 influencers

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promoting you on a consistent basis on your program.

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What Does consistent mean?

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Weekly, monthly Actually depends on the product,

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right? So what's the use case of the product?

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Let's say like a skincare product.

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Let's say a sunscreen,

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which you would use every day when you go out,

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right? Then maybe that's a weekly cadence where they pushed about

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it once a week.

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So people are reminded if it's like something like let's say,

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say a hiking product,

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which you'd actually use once a week every weekend when you're

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out on a hike,

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then it's better to promote it monthly,

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right? Cause that's like kind of naturally,

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it'd be weird if someone's posting about like this hiking stick

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every single day,

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right? It's like does like no one's going hiking every day.

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So it's like based on the product.

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But usually by consistent what we mean is one influencer should

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post about your twice or twice in a month depending on

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the product.

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Okay? So you would have,

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let's make a magic number be 30.

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Okay, so you would have 30 different outside influencers promoting and

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talking and bringing attention to your brand to their audience.

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Which then the goal obviously is for sales to come into

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you. You get to collect the email and then you,

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you know,

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hopefully you have an email marketing program,

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then you're able to communicate with them moving forward,

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Correct? That's the ideal,

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Correct? Yes.

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And then you can build on it of course accordingly.

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Yeah. Based on how it works,

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you can,

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I've seen brands sustain it at like 50 and like honestly

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if you're,

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let's say you're doing good on Facebook,

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you're doing good on TikTok and like your content's starting to

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work, having a community of 30 to 50 ambassadors is like

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probably one of the best things that you can do for

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your brand.

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Cause it also helps you get creatives for your Facebook ads.

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You can reuse their reviews on say Instagram,

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TikTok or whatever on your landing pages.

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So instead of like text reviews,

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imagine adding like videos of people talking about their brand on

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your product page.

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That's like insane,

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right? You can reuse it.

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It has organic content on your social.

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So it's like it's touching so many,

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you can reuse it in your email flows even like,

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hey noticed you left this product in the cart.

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Here's what Sue,

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who's like a jewelry enthusiast says about this product,

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right? It's like,

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it's just so organic and natural.

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It's like having a friend recommend a product to you,

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right? So you can reuse it in so many ways.

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It's just very powerful to have like these 30 to 50

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people who are posting about You.

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Yeah and especially if you are an e-commerce brand only.

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So you're not going out to shows,

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you're not in wholesale in your local areas and you're just

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selling online.

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I know this is a big sticking point for a lot

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of people here is I've got my website up or I

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have a shop on Etsy and it's not moving any product

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or it feels like such a fight and such a struggle.

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Yeah, this could be your solution and for those folks,

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you know 30 to 50 on a continual basis and maybe

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if you're doing a combination because you do go out to

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shows, maybe you start with five or 10 and add to

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it as you can.

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You do apply this on top of your specific situation too.

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Of course.

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And Josh,

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there's churn also to your influencers,

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right? Yes.

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Some will come in and some will come out,

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right? Yes,

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that's correct.

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That's a great point.

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So churn is definitely a problem.

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We call it attrition factor.

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Okay. Where a certain percentage of,

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but like churn is a good way to also put it

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is that some percentage of them would just post once and

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then never post again or post twice and then then never

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post again.

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So you have to factor that in by having your outbound

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engine running Constantly.

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Yeah, it's like,

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it's just the same as customer acquisition,

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right? Let's say you acquire a hundred customers,

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not all of them are gonna keep buying from you month

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on month and now you can dress right?

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The marketing keeps running.

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So if even if customers drop off,

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new customers come in and you grow and you make up

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for the churn,

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right? So it's the same with influencers.

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You have to have the outbound engine running every week and

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keeping on acquiring new influencers.

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But obviously like you can go a little bit more aggressive

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in the start and reach out to hundreds of people.

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But once you have a critical mass of like 30 to

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50, you can then reach out to maybe like 25 to

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50 people every week and onboard a couple every week and

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then keep the engines running.

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So Yeah,

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once you've got things rolling and then you have a system

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down, then it just becomes procedural and routine.

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Exactly. You're right.

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Yep. All right.

Speaker:

So I'm dying to know more about your six step process.

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Okay. Where do we get to start?

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I wanna know everything,

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but you tell us what you can,

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Okay, yeah,

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I'll go through all of the six steps,

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wonderful and summary and if you want me to dive into

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detail in any one of them,

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just let me know and we can dive in.

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Okay. What's the purpose behind the process?

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I was just about to start with that.

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Yay. Go for it.

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I can create it retroactively.

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I did not like start off with this or like anything.

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It just comes from experience of what I've seen over and

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over again with influencer programs and how they grow is like

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there's always like these six common steps that brands can take.

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Like I said in the beginning when you asked me about

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what did you do to educate yourself,

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right? This is like one of the shortcuts that I've seen

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that brands can just follow this six step system pretty much

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blindly at face value and they don't have to do like

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anything else that I did.

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Cuz all of this is like a synthesis of all of

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my knowledge to give you the first track to growing an

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influencer program.

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So that's where it came from,

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that's the purpose of it.

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And now we'll dive in.

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So step one is prospecting is finding the influencers.

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Step one is not strategy,

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step one is not taking courses.

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Step one is go out,

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log into Instagram and search for influencers who are posting content

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about your brand.

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So that may be if you're a jewelry store for example,

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right? You can go search for hashtag jewelry on Instagram,

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right? And then find influencers who are already creating content around

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that. And then that leads us to step two,

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which is outreach.

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Like reach out to them.

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I'm thinking if I do hashtag jewelry,

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I'm gonna find a ton of jewelry makers.

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Yes. I'm also going to find,

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I don't know what to call them,

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but kind of like roundup accounts,

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reach out to us if you want to be shown on

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our account.

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And some of them are paid,

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some of them aren't.

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Are those the people we're looking for?

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No. Again,

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so jewelry is a very,

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I agree with you,

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it's a very broad kinda hashtag to use.

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I am actually looking at Instagram right now.

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So you would would use something like hashtag jewelry addict.

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So a jewelry addict is going to be someone who's not

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necessarily like a jeweler or like another brand.

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It's going to be someone who's,

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oh, I'm a jewelry addict,

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right? Something.

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Or like hashtag jewelry shopping maybe.

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So something like that.

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Or what about,

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I don't know what the hashtag would be,

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but someone who shows you how to wear jewelry,

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how to accessorize maybe.

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Yep, exactly.

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Like the fashion flare.

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Yeah, exactly.

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Yeah. So you wanna find people who are posting about jewelry,

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not like other brands,

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not like Roundup accounts and all of like we've worked with

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roundup accounts,

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they don't really work that well.

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Okay, so not the roundups,

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okay, Not the roundups,

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not the other brands.

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Obviously you wanna find people who are organically and even under

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the hashtag jewelry,

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I'm seeing some posts like there are like posts of people

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who are doing,

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cause on Instagram especially,

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you see like top posts and recent posts,

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right? Split into two.

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Most of the top posts are gonna be like big brand

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accounts, but the recent posts are gonna be like people who

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are posting about hashtag jewelry,

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right? And then eventually you'll find more hashtags as you keep

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doing this research like jewelry of today,

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jewelry addict,

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like I just found this like in two minutes on Instagram,

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if you do this for like 30 minutes every day,

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you'll find more and more hashtags around hashtag jewelry love I'm

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seeing on Instagram right now,

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right? So yeah,

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So and then write down the hashtags.

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So you have a good pool to search through and then

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you go into those hashtags and then you find the specific

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accounts that could be approachable for influencing,

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Correct? Yes.

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Okay. That's all number one.

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Prospecting Number one is done.

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Got it.

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So now let's say you have a list of like 50

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to 7,500

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accounts ideally who are posting about your niche,

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right? That's your,

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again, so core and tangential we are on the core right

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now, right?

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So you'd find a list of your core people who are

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posting about you.

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Now step two is outreach.

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So reach out to them with something that is very focused

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on giving,

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not focused on taking,

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not focused on making a deal with them,

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not focused on paying them for a post focused on simply

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opening up a conversation and seeing where it goes.

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So the email or the DM should be something dms would

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work well for people who are smaller,

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like less than five,

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less than 10,000

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followers, emails work better for anyone who's above 10 K,

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15 K followers.

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So that's like quick tip there on dms versus emails.

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What the DM or the email should say is pretty similar.

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You say something like,

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Hey I saw your content.

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Don't start with,

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hey I'm the founder at jewelry brand one 20 three.com,

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we make the amazing guests jewelry in the whole of America.

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None of that,

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right? Even if you do,

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Even if you do,

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yeah, especially if you do,

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right? So if you do that,

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you risk talking about yourself,

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right? With your dms and your emails.

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You gotta answer two questions,

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what's in it for me and why you,

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right? So you start off by answering why,

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like why are you choosing them,

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right? So like hey found your content about let's say like

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imitation jewelry on Instagram and really loved and give like a

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personal compliment,

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right? Really loved something that they did in their content or

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like their dog or something that's specific to them so they

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know that it's coming for them.

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It's not like some general mass outreach that you're sending out.

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So once you do that,

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then in the next paragraph or the next line you write

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something like we have this brand,

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our philosophies align.

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Something like that.

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Like where I think your content is really aligned with what

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we are trying to do with our ambassador program.

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Would you be open to chatting?

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So don't end with something like,

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hey can we work together or are you taking collabs from

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brands or what's your poor post fee?

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Just say,

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are you open to collaborating?

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Would this be worth considering?

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Right? So you're simply opening up a conver and they can

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say no like and that's fine,

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but you wanna open up a conversation with them as opposed

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to just asking them to post about you.

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So that was step two,

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which is outreach right?

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Now moving on to step three,

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which is your creator offer,

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right? This is the stuff that I spoke of when we

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were talking about like the discount code and the affiliate and

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all of that.

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So what is your creator offer,

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right? So creator offer,

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according to me consists of three things.

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It'll consist of what you're giving the creator in kind like

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in like actual physical product or something like that.

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It'll consist of the commission that you give them for every

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sale or like a flat fee or whatever you are paying

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them, whatever the like the money transaction is.

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That is number two.

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And then number three is the discount that you have for

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their audience.

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You combine these three things and you have something known as

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your creator offer.

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Okay? So basically it should say something like we are gonna

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offer you x product,

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offer you X amount in commissions and give your audience a

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y percent in discount if they order using your discount code,

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right? So that's like your creator offer in one line.

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Once you have that,

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that is step number three and that will be your basis

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for your conversation with creators.

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So like when you outreach,

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obviously they're gonna reply to you saying Hey let's do this,

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let's do that.

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Here are some ideas,

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whatever you can send them your offer saying cause then they

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reply with a yes.

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Then they say yes I am open to collaborating.

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Then it's your job to send them your offer like hey

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this is what I'm offering,

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right? I'll give you this product this much in commissions and

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this much in discount for your order.

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So it's very clear for the creator as well and they

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can quickly read one sentence and make a decision as opposed

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to sending PDFs or contracts or doing like complex negotiations.

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You have it clear in your mind that hey this is

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our offer and we are gonna only focus on working with

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creators who say yes to this offer.

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Right? And then do that.

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So that was step three.

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It's like creating your offer and pitching it to creators.

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Step number four seems kind of like obvious or like it's

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a given but a lot of brands ignore it.

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Step number four is shipping.

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So the way you ship product,

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it's an indicator of how likely they are to post about

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you. So if you send your product in like a cardboard

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box, they're not gonna be like super,

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it is just another package that they get,

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right? You should like gift,

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wrap it,

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add a personal note to it,

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add extra goodies to it and make it as overwhelmingly positive

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as possible.

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Cause like it said,

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right, the unboxing is the only touchpoint with a 100% open

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rate. Like your email campaigns have a certain percent open rate,

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your ads have a certain percent click through rate,

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but everybody opens their packages,

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right? Especially if it's something that they've ordered or something that

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they've, you know,

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received from a brand.

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You are so right and we already know that it's a

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gift coming to you so obviously you're gonna open it.

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Exactly. Yeah.

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So it's like your best chance to impress them with like

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everything that you have,

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send them free goodies,

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send them swag.

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And it doesn't have to be like if you're like a

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small brand,

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you probably don't have like t-shirts or mugs with your brand

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name on it.

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That's fine.

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Send them a personal note.

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Anyone can take five minutes to write a pers 10 personal

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notes. If you're reaching out to 10 influencers right hand write

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it or like you could technically print it and then just

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add like some personal element like sign it or something like

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that and send it to influencers so that they should feel

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different. They should feel special cause they are right,

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they're gonna promote your brand.

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Oh so this packaging should be up leveled from even the

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packaging that you send out the regular product to your customer.

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It's like the influencer shipping program,

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Correct? Yes,

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that's exactly right.

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Okay. Can I just make a comment?

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Don't put in any sprinkly sparkly things that are gonna come

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out and make a mess of desks.

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Yeah, thank you please.

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Because it's gonna have the op,

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it might look pretty but it's gonna have the opposite impact.

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I've had that happen to me several times and it's like

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oh I'm so mad.

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Ah, it's the pain talking.

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Yeah. Yeah.

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So that was step number four,

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which is shipping and overwhelming them with how good your shipping

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experience is.

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Step number five is more logistics.

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So now you've shipped,

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now you've done everything you can to make sure that they

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post, you've had reached out to the right people.

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You, first of all,

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you've found the right people,

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you've reached out to them in the correct way,

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right? You have sent them the right offer that's appealing to

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them. They've said yes,

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you've shipped them a product.

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Not only have you shipped it,

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you've done your best to really like impress them with the

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experience. Now it's up to them,

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you've given them so much,

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most likely they're gonna post about you.

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Now what happens after the post is actually you're tracking the

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sales that come in.

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So step number five is tracking the sales.

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And usually this is done through some kind of a failure

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link or some a discount code.

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We mostly prefer discount codes when starting out cause you don't

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have to pay for additional software for the affiliate links.

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So yeah,

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just track like every week have like a discount code tracking

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session, have like 30 minutes every Friday.

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How do we know that they've posted?

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Do you ask them to tell you their posting schedule or

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how does that work?

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Multiple things.

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So usually you would also follow them on social media,

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especially if you're starting out and you'll just know when they

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post. And most influencers when they post,

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they will like send you the link saying Hey,

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I've posted about you.

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It's mostly like manual,

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like back and forth in terms of you just following them

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and you just notice a post already.

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Or they usually just send it to you over email saying

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Hey this is the link I forested,

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let me know.

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Stuff like that.

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So that's how,

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that's how we try.

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And my guess is you don't ask them or require them

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to do that cuz then you're giving them more work.

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Like if they're doing the work by posting.

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So let it be on your end.

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You already know who has agreed and who you've sent out

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things to.

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So as we start,

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it'll be 5,

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10, 30 people accounts that you're tracking,

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right? Exactly.

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Yeah. Okay.

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All right.

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And like once you scale to like hundreds of influencers,

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it's, it's like impossible to keep track of it manually.

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And in that case there's like social listening tools that you

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can use to make sure that,

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you know,

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when they mention your brand,

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you track it automatically.

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That's like a don't worry about it right now.

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Right? Yeah.

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So yeah cuz a lot of people tend to like look

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at software,

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look at this and that and tracking links and how do

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I do all this?

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And then they just never take action.

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You're right,

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exactly. You know US yash,

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you know us well.

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So yeah,

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these were the first five steps and it's a six step

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system. If you do the first five steps correctly,

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you already have a very good influencer program,

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like steps number six.

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But to go from good to great,

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you need step number six.

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And step number six is not tactical,

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it's more philosophical.

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It's to build relationships with these people.

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So posting about your brand once is fine,

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twice is fine.

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But then if you don't have a relationship with them,

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they're like,

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it's not gonna be long term.

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Right? So then your acquisition engine has to keep running like

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at, at like a heavy volume every week.

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And after a point you'll reach a point where there's like

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no more influencers in you.

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Cause there's only so many people pushing about mutation jewelry,

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right? And you'll reach a limit and then nobody's that you've

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reached out to everyone that there was to be reached out

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to, right?

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So you gotta build relationships with the people who are posting

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about you,

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keep them engaged at them in a WhatsApp group,

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slack group,

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something like that.

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And basically keep sending them free products.

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Do different kinds of things with them.

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So like it doesn't always have to be a product-based collaboration.

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It could be a live session,

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it could be them taking over your social media for a

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day, right?

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Could be like inviting them over to your factory or over

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to your kitchen and you know,

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making a product with them,

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showing them behind the scenes,

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something like that.

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Treat these people as you would treat your friends and basically

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like just make friends with them is the point,

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right? Because if you do that then and it goes beyond

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money, then it goes beyond like the brand.

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It becomes you and the creator,

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right? As the founder of the brand.

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It's your job to be having to be maintaining these relationships

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and you have to be intentional about this cuz it's easy

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to just lose track.

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So keep track of these things and make sure that you

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are, you know,

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engaging with them.

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Make sure that they know like some secret insider information about

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upcoming products behind the scenes of the,

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the brand,

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stuff like that.

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And you will see like these,

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I have this saying like maybe this could be on my

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influencer marketing candle.

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Like relationships,

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compound transactions don't.

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So if you do transactions,

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that's fine.

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It's like,

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yeah, okay.

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Commerce, right?

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Relationships will grow over time.

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Absolutely. Yeah.

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Okay. And I'm also thinking just as an extension of that

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is tag them on your email list and you can send

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specific emails just to top influencers.

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Exactly. It can be a combination of one-on-one communication and then

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very targeted groups of people communication too.

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But I love that full circle.

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And of course I have two things to say.

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One's a question.

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Okay. Do you ever fire influencers who've agreed to work with

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you and aren't performing?

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Like do you ever decide yourself to trim down the list

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cuz nothing's happening and here you have this discount code out

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there and maybe they're only buying product for themself at a

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discount and never posting.

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Well it could happen,

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right? It could happen,

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It's possible.

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But if you select the right kind of people in step

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one, we've very rarely seen that happen actually.

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Cuz our step one is very robust.

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We only find like the best kind of creators.

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So it's hard to go wrong with those kinds of,

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but yes,

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to answer your question,

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we have bulged programs before with like no,

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it also kind of once you're at scale,

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right? These things come in when you are at like a

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hundred, 200 influencers,

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when you're at like 30 or 50,

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most people are gonna post about you.

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Once you reach a certain scale you will have like some

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dead weight,

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right? And then we make sure that we don't like fire

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them in like the traditional sense of it being like a

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negative connotation to fire,

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right? We can just tell them that hey,

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we have a very robust like follow up process.

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Like if someone's just not posting,

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if we don't see their code in like the weeklys for

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like a month,

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we just reach out to them saying,

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Hey, you've not posted about us.

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What's going on?

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Maybe like they're just busy,

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something's happened,

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right? It's fine.

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Like they can not post for two months.

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That's completely okay.

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But just check in with them,

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ask them what's up if they're just not interested or if

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they say I'm not interested anymore,

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or if they just don't reply to you for two,

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three months in that case,

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just send them what I call like a breakup email saying

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Hey really sorry we have to do this,

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but we're focused on keeping our ambassador community niche and only

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for active people.

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So I'm gonna deactivate your coupon code right now,

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but if at all you're ever interested in working with us

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again, please reach out and I'm happy to enable it again.

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Right. Yeah,

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there's something very amicable and things on good terms with people.

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Yeah. Putting your account on pause,

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reach out when you are ready to go again or something

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like that.

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Exactly. Something like that.

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Okay. The other thought I had when you were saying,

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you know like in terms of deepening relationships,

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having people come to your kitchen and see how,

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you know those delicious cookies you make are made,

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things like that.

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Yep. Influencers could also be people in your local market.

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So if you are a local bakery,

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send the mayor could be an influencer.

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Exactly. Yeah.

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Or someone who is a teacher at a park district of

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your kids' classes.

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Yep. Could be an influencer because their online community,

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I'll say,

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yep. Are people part of the neighborhood community,

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the physical community and they are also potential customers of yours.

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Yep. So that would fall into the transgen,

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right? How do you say that word?

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Tangential Tenile.

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I can't say it,

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but that would fall in that category of prospecting,

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right? Cause it's not a direct map,

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but for local businesses.

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Huge opportunity,

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Huge op.

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Totally. Like I went on another podcast and the host asked

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me like how does this work for local,

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like if a local shop wandered like a cafe wanted to

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do it right?

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I was like,

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okay. So you will always find someone in a certain niche

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in your local area,

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in your city,

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let's say,

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right? Maybe not in your neighborhood,

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but for sure in your city,

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right? Let's say it's a cafe in New York.

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Just take that example.

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So there's a lot of people posting about hashtag cafe culture,

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New York hashtag Coffee nyc,

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something like that,

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right? So reach out to them,

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say, Hey,

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we'll give you like free coffee,

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come over with your friends or have host a meetup with

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your fans and then hey,

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we don't just organically promote us.

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And then promotion is just a consequence of them being there.

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So like working with local creators is definitely,

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it's not something that I have ever done directly cuz we

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mostly work with like national level e-commerce brands.

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But that's something that totally,

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I don't see a reason why it won't work for a,

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maybe on the smaller scheme,

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maybe you won't have like 15 influencers.

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Maybe you just have 10 or local in your city who

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regularly promote you and then Yeah,

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that's totally like an avenue.

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Well And it can be a combination.

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Exactly. Yeah.

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Maybe you have two or three local and the rest are

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all e-commerce.

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But I just don't wanna discount that cuz I think those

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could be really valuable and powerful connections for you too.

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Yep, yep.

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Totally. Okay,

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so well now I think we should probably wind down here.

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I could think and dream up a million other questions,

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but I won't.

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I'm gonna let you have part of your day for yourself.

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Yeah. But tell us more about what C offers if people

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are looking to dive deeper,

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do more with you.

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Yeah, share with us a little bit about that.

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Sure. So basically C is a platform for branch to come

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on board and run and create an influencer campaign in 30

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minutes. So Sarah,

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by the way,

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in Sanskrit means simple and easy,

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right? So because in like we discussed,

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it's so complex that you don't know where to start,

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what to do,

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blah, blah,

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blah. We make it super simple for you.

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You can come on our platform,

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it's a free trial,

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you don't have to put your card in.

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Find influencers.

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All of the six steps can be done inside of C.

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Find influencers,

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reach out to them,

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negotiate with them,

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send them your offer,

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ship your products through C,

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track performance inside of cll and obviously maintain all of your

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relationships inside of C.

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So all of it is like simplified for you in like

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one app,

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so you don't have to use like 10 different things.

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It's a very structured,

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kinda it's,

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it's more of an assistant than it.

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It's like an app.

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So it keeps you all organized.

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Exactly. So if you're new to it,

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especially, you should consider using to manage your program.

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But even if you don't,

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we have a very good resource called the academy on our

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website. I guess you will leave the link in the show

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notes, but definitely check that out.

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If like new to influencer marketing,

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you just wanna like check out like what are the different

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ways that I can do this?

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How do I reach out?

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If you have all these questions,

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we have all of them answered on our academies.

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It's the best resource on the planet to learn influencer marketing

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for free On the planet.

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Planet. Yes.

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Wonderful. Totally go there.

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Yeah. Even if you don't start a free trial,

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I think that's like a very good resource to just learn

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from and do some influencer stuff for your brand.

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So Yeah.

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Perfect. Well you are definitely up-leveling the whole world of influencer

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marketing, giving people an entrance way to come in.

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You've tested the systems,

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you have a very understandable six-step process that honestly,

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I mean a couple of these steps I would've never thought

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of. So thank gosh for you that you're here and you

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know that you can share that with us.

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This has been tremendous,

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Josh, thank you so much for coming on and sharing all

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of your wisdom and experience with us.

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Thank you for having me,

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Sue. And we,

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I'd love to turn it another time,

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maybe in a year.

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There you go.

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It's a date.

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Here we go.

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Are you as excited as I am about the potential for

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you with influencer marketing?

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It's a different way to leverage social media.

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That makes a lot of sense.

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Hopefully you've written down ASHA's six steps and are ready to

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dive into the first one.

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Prospecting, it actually sounds like a lot of fun if you're

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enjoying the podcast and would like to show support.

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A rating and review is always fabulous because it helps get

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the show seen by more makers.

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It's a great way to pay it forward.

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And there's another way where you can get something tangible in

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return for your support too.

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Visit my merch shop for a wide variety of inspirational items

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like mugs,

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journals, water bottles,

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and more featuring logos,

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images, and quotes to inspire you throughout your day.

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Makes a great gift too.

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And we've just added some new products for the season to

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the shop.

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Turn turnaround is quick and the quality is top notch.

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Nothing but the best for you.

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Take a look at all the options@giftbizunwrapped.com

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slash shop.

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All proceeds from these purchases helps go to offset the cost

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of producing the show.

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And now be safe and well and I'll see you again

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next time on the Gift Biz Unwrapped podcast.

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I wanna make sure you're familiar with my free Facebook group

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called Gift Biz Breeze.

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It's a place where we all gather and are a community

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to support each other.

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I got a really fun post in there that's my favorite

Speaker:

of the week,

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I have to say,

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where I invite all of you to share what you're doing

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to show pictures of your product,

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to show what you're working on for the week,

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to get reaction from other people.

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And just for fun,

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because we all get to see the wonderful products that everybody

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in the community is making.

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My favorite post every single week.

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Without doubt.

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Wait, what?

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Aren't you part of the group already?

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If not,

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make sure to jump over to Facebook and search for the

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group Gift Biz breeze.

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Don't delay.