Most people think building a personal brand is about being everywhere—but the real power comes from being consistent in one place.

I had the chance to be interviewed by Charley Mann on his podcast They Don’t Teach This in Law School, and we went deep into building a personal brand that drives real business. We talked about my story and how I went from working in top marketing roles at Coca-Cola, McDonald’s Restaurants and Sprint to launching Ten Golden Rules, and why niching down into law firm marketing helped us triple our revenue. I shared simple ways attorneys can build visibility by just answering one question a week—and how to turn that into blogs, video, SEO, and social media without burning out. If you're trying to stand out as a lawyer or grow your firm, this one is packed with practical strategies you can use today.

Key Topics

03:52 – The one thing they don’t teach in law school: how to build a personal brand.

04:28 – My journey from Coca-Cola to launching Ten Golden Rules.

05:42 – Why niching down into law firm marketing tripled my business.

06:38 – How I balance my personal brand with my company brand.

08:45 – The easiest way lawyers can start building a brand: answer common client questions.

09:48 – The exact content strategy I use for law firms (video > YouTube > blog > social).

10:43 – Why sharing the spotlight with others helps build your brand faster.

11:56 – How consistent content made me visible across the legal industry.

13:16 – My 5-year overnight success strategy—webinar every month, podcast every week.

15:07 – How to turn a client email into content for every platform.

15:53 – My “easy button” content system: one video a week, then delegate.

17:52 – What I learned about branding from Coca-Cola.

19:23 – How John Morgan’s national brand proves recognition drives results.

20:07 – Four key elements I focus on for consistent branding.

21:48 – Why done is better than perfect when it comes to brand messaging.

22:53 – The 80/20 rule that helped me choose my niche and scale faster.

24:05 – How picking a niche made things easier for me and my team.

25:46 – Why Google now rewards hyper-focused websites—and what I did to adapt.

28:15 – The three signs (I call them "God winks") that told me to niche down.

Resources Mentioned

Books:

• Outlive by Peter Attia – https://a.co/d/0a3r544
• The Nvidia Way: Jensen Huang and the Making of a Tech Giant  – https://a.co/d/gW3709w 
• They Don’t Teach This In Law School by Charley Mann - https://a.co/d/4QMGrJO
• 
  

Technology/Software:

• YouTube (for SEO and video marketing) – https://youtube.com
• ChatGPT (for repurposing content) – https://openai.com/chatgpt
• Upwork – https://www.upwork.com
• Fiverr – https://www.fiverr.com
• 
  

Podcasts:

• All-In Podcast – https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/all-in-with-chamath-jason-sacks-friedberg/id1502871393 
• They Don’t Teach This in Law School - https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/they-dont-teach-this-in-law-school/id1640557971 

About our Guest Host:

Charley Mann has worked with law firm owners to grow their lives and practices for 15+ years. He has spoken and appeared on numerous stages and shows run by organizations including Profit With Law, Ten Golden Rules, The Law Firm Blueprint, Great Legal Marketing, Foster Consulting, 7-Figure Attorney Summit, Influential Entrepreneurs, and dozens more.

Today, he is the founder of Law Firm Alchemy, a coaching organization for law firm owners and co-founder of Red Kraken Creative, an email newsletter agency for law firms.

https://www.lawfirmalchemy.com/ 

About Jay Berkowitz:

Jay Berkowitz is a best-selling author and popular keynote speaker. Mr. Berkowitz managed marketing departments at: Coca-Cola, Sprint and McDonald's Restaurants, and he is the Founder and CEO of Ten Golden Rules,  a digital marketing agency specialized in working with attorneys.

Mr. Berkowitz is the author of Advanced Internet Marketing for Law Firms, The Ten Golden Rules of Online Marketing and 10 Free Internet Marketing Strategies that went to #1 on Amazon.  He is the host of the Ten Golden Rules of Internet Marketing Webinar and Podcast. He has been profiled by the Wall Street Journal, The Business Journals and FOX Business TV.

Mr. Berkowitz was selected for membership as a TITAN for Elite Digital Marketing Agencies, he is the recipient of a SOFIE Award for Most Effective use of Emerging Media, and a Special BERNAY’s Award.

Connect with Ten Golden Rules

Subscribe to Ten Golden Rules on YouTube

Check out our webinars on TenGoldenRules.com

Connect with Ten Golden Rules on LinkedIn

Follow Ten Golden Rules on Facebook

Connect with Jay Berkowitz on LinkedIn

Thanks for listening!

Thanks so much for listening to our podcast! If you enjoyed this episode and think that others could benefit from listening, please share it using the social media buttons on this page.

Do you have some feedback or questions about this episode? Leave a comment in the section below!

Subscribe to the podcast

If you would like to get automatic updates of new podcast episodes, you can subscribe to the podcast on Apple Podcasts or Stitcher. You can also subscribe in your favorite podcast app.

Leave us an Apple Podcast review

Ratings and reviews from our listeners are extremely valuable to us and greatly appreciated. They help our podcast rank higher on Apple Podcasts, which exposes our show to more awesome listeners like you. If you have a minute, please leave an honest review on Apple Podcasts. 

You can always find a great twin turn. You know

what a twin turn is? Right?

I don't. I have never heard that before.

A twitter intern. Oh, you hire an intern who can

post on Twitter for you. It's an old industry term, but

seriously, you can always find someone great who's a journalism

student who's looking to build their portfolio, or find someone

an Upwork or Fiverr who's really great at social media, and they

know all the formats and the sizes and how to write the tags

and everything and all you have to do the simplest like I call

it the easy button, all you have to do for your personal brand is

create one piece of content a week. And like I said, it's

easy. Just answer a question, and you can shoot a quick video

on your iPhone. You can write a quick blog post, if you're more

comfortable doing that, and then every week, you just send it to

your twin turn and that personal post it on your blog. Post it on

LinkedIn for you. Post in my case, like I said, every

webinars, we make five, we pull the five best clips from the

webinar. The full webinar goes on our YouTube channel, which we

now have over a million views. The congrats. That's awesome.

Thank you. Thank you. But again, five years of every month,

that's right, every month, a webinar, every week, a podcast

and and then, fortunately, people watch it, and the

algorithm took over, but you just produce that one piece of

content. You know, when you're just starting out, produce that

one piece of content every week, off to the intern, and then he

or she slices or dices it and puts it in all the other places.

And within six months, I promise you, you'll be everyone will be

saying, Oh, I see your stuff all the time, and that's because

they follow you on LinkedIn, or they follow you on Facebook, or

you can email out your blog and put it on your blog, on your

website, super simple, and even if you're a personal brand, back

to that attorney who works at men, man and man. You can do the

same thing, just answer a question one once a month on

your LinkedIn, and then drop it on your Facebook and your

Twitter, and link back to your LinkedIn, and you'll see mom to

present, and it'll help a lot with generating some revenue,

which everybody needs to do.

Well, good morning, good afternoon, good evening,

whatever time you're listening to this podcast or watching us

on YouTube, thank you for joining us on The 10 Golden

Rules Internet Marketing for Law Firms podcast. We've got a

little different episode today. Normally it's me doing the

interviewing. Today, I'm getting interviewed by one of the

smartest guys in the biz, Charley Mann. If you're not

familiar with Charley, he's amazing. His firm is called law

firm alchemy, and he's he was one of the most beloved

presenters at our event, 10 golden rules live. And you'll

get to meet me and get to meet Charley on the upcoming episode.

So if you like it, click Subscribe, click like, give us a

five star rating and enjoy. Here's me being interviewed by

Charley Mann.

Hello and welcome back to another episode of they

don't teach us in law school. I'm your host, Charley man of

law firm, Alchemy and red cracking creative. And my guest

today is part of, apparently, an ongoing series of I swear I had

them on the show before, but I definitely didn't. I'm really

excited to talk with him. He has been putting on a fantastic

event the past couple of years through his digital marketing

company, 10 golden rules. He's worked with several of my

clients. I have people who I've worked with who have been able

to have him do LSA management, website, work, etc, a really

impressive individual who has been making a lot of waves in

the legal marketing community writ large over the last several

years. Jay Berkowitz, great to have you on the show. Thanks

for having me, Charley. I'm happy to be here

and happy I got off that I thought I was on the show list.

I You know what? At some point I'll need an

official diagnosis for whatever memory lapse This is. But I'm

grateful to have you here. So Jay, you have the question,

what's the one thing they don't teach you in law school?

The one thing they don't teach you in law

school is how to build your personal brand, okay? And that

starts at an individual level, and it goes right up to the firm

size,

okay? So let's dig into that personal brand. When

you use that phrase, I think different people have different

ideas of what it is, so when you use it, what does that look

like?

Well, I think the first place you start is

figuring out who you are and what differentiates you. And I

went through an exercise myself. I'd been had these great jobs. I

worked for McDonald's and Coca Cola. And I was@a.com called E

diets, and we got that company to $60 million in revenue. But I

was hitting this marketing glass ceiling, I called it, where

financial guy or the sales guy was always getting the COO job,

or the right hand to the COO to the CEOs. And I went through

this exercise where I had to figure out my personal brand,

and the first time I saw someone mention that term was at a

presentation. He said, You know, think of yourself like you're

the brand manager. And I had been a brand manager Coca Cola.

I'd been worked on brands on the ad agency side, and what have

you done to update your resume? What's the new. Two shiny

cleaning crystals that you've added to your own personal

selling suite. And so I went through that exercise, and I

said I was unique because I was a marketer and I understood

digital marketing. I was strategic and understood digital

and then I came up with my brand, which is the 10 golden

rules, and wrote a book and a presentation and spoke once, and

then all the rest is history. And my company was formed 23

years ago. So first things first is figure out, you know who you

are, what differentiates you, and there's riches in the

niches. And like for our company, when we decided we do

internet marketing for law firms six years ago, and only law

firms because we'd worked with law firms for many, many years,

but that's we've kind of tripled our business since we got very

focused. So I think, as an individual, figure out who you

are, and as a company, figure out who you are, and get that

brand message honed in. And then the second step is just

delivering that consistently across all your different media.

So for you, when you went through that discovery

of personal brand, you mentioned, yes, you're a digital

marketer. Were there other aspects of like, personality,

hobbies, etc, that were also used in it?

For me, like the personality and hobbies is, to

me, is more like the flavor

Gotcha. But I think that helps define it, that

idea of like, difference between personal brand and the flavor of

it.

Yeah, and again, I struggle a little bit, and a

lot of people do between, where do you when you put yourself out

there? Can you put yourself out there as Jay Berkowitz or as 10

golden rules? Or both you and I are in maybe the enviable

position that we can pretty conveniently do both, although

you just added a second brand in your introduction and

congratulations, I've seen the marketing for the second brand,

but the convenient thing for me for the last 23 years is Jay

Berkowitz and 10 golden rules have been pretty much

synonymous. Yeah, if you're an attorney at a larger firm, you

want to carve out that personal brand identity. You want to

build your network, and all the things we can talk about, but

it's a little less clear, but I think you want to, I still think

you want to do both, like if you're Jay Berkowitz at man and

man and man law firm, you still you want to build your personal

brand as a excellent litigator at man and man and man law firm.

And then if you move you've built your personal brand,

you've built your network. You people are aware you're creating

some content on LinkedIn or or all your social media, video,

etc, but you want to start building your personal brand,

maybe even more so if you're at a firm, because most attorneys

have to bring in revenue and Oh, good, by the way, one thing I

learned when I started my business, you gotta learn how to

sell.

Turns out, yeah, in developing that personal

brand, you mentioned the intertwining between personal

brand and kind of the company brand, I think for a lot of law

firms, there's an eagerness to develop some of the personal

brand, even for the law firm owner, but the company doesn't

always necessarily follow in the adoption of that type of brand.

Do you see that reflected as well?

Yeah. I mean, sometimes it's a struggle the

bigger the firm, and certainly when you get into the financial

space, like those guys can't do anything without getting

approvals. But obviously, if we're at a big firm,

everything's going to have to be approved. But I think you can

start with the most simple guidance, which I give everyone

on either small startup, like your new startup, or an

individual at a big firm who's trying to carve out their

personal brand. And one of the simplest things I say to

everybody is just answer questions. And you can simply do

that by answering questions on video is great. Just a blog post

or even just a LinkedIn post is fantastic. But if in the most

simple format, you answered a question that you get asked all

the time, every week, once a week nice long LinkedIn post

about a question that you get asked all the time, or Yeah,

something changes in the tax code or the regional Personal

Injury laws, and answer that question. And that's a great

place to start, and that's actually the foundation for what

we do for law firms at 10 golden rules, is we ask the attorneys

to answer questions they get asked all the time on video, and

then we put that video on YouTube, search engine, optimize

it, add it to the website as a blog post. Write a blog post

about the video with the question and answer, because

then it's great for SEO, because people are asking that question

of Google or chat, GPT or whatever, and you're now up

search engine, optimizing it with YouTube and with a website,

and then we also use that same content on all the social media.

So like when you were on my podcast and I interviewed you or

my webinar, and Charley's been on both, we took the content, we

cut little SN. It's out one or two minute segments where you

said something particularly brilliant, which you often do,

and then those all went on our company LinkedIn, and my

personal LinkedIn, yeah. And so I'm doing that very, very

consistently, putting out great content. And LinkedIn first

LinkedIn. So we start with YouTube, the podcast and the

webinars are optimized on YouTube. They go on our blog, so

they're on our website for SEO purposes. Then they go in

LinkedIn, Twitter, Instagram, the whole Facebook, the whole

social suite. And it's relatively simple, right? You

and I just have to create the content. And then we call it

cascading. Someone on our team can do that, and we don't need

to spend the time doing that

actually brings up something really interesting Jay

that I hadn't thought of before now, but it relates to the

personal brand discussion, which is within the idea of a personal

brand, like you have your podcast, you have your webinar,

you do a great job of inviting people into your spaces, which

in turn means that You're making room for a lot of other personal

brands in that space. I think there are some people who maybe

jealously guard the space. How do you make that integration

between what you're doing for your personal brand while also

making space for others?

I'm not sure if I understand the question, but I

will give you one little interesting snippet. I bet if

you Google Charley Mann lawyer marketing, or even just Charley

Mann, our podcast and our webinar does phenomenally well

on SEO, so we're definitely building everybody else's

personal brands. But are you talking about the balance

between, like, how much is about me on my podcast and how much is

about you the guest? Well, no, I

think that you were onto something there with

the idea that, okay, so someone searches for Charley, and they

see a 10 Golden Rules video, and part of the larger company brand

is you invite a lot of people in, and now Jay has associations

with a lot of people, and it's good for What you kind of teased

earlier, the idea of building out a network that becomes an

extension of your brand overall.

Yeah, as a matter of fact, I just did the search

because I had to and your website and your LinkedIn, and

then the third thing that came up was three videos, and our

video was number one, so I ranked number three for your

name, are you and I together? One of the things about creating

content and answering questions and doing it on a consistent

basis is that it's incredibly powerful as it accumulates over

time. Yeah, and a lot of people say, What's the secret to

getting a lot of leads and getting a lot of inbound? And I

say, well, the secret is my five year overnight success story.

What does that look like?

What I've done is I've done a webinar every month,

a podcast every week, since we picked the legal niche. So 10

golden rules only does Internet Marketing for law firms. We've

been doing a webinar every month, SEO for lawyers, pay per

click for lawyers, Charley shared his incredible six figure

playbook. And so every month, we get one of the smartest people

that I come across in my networking or at conferences. I

literally went up to Charley after he presented it Great

Legal Marketing, and asked if he'd come on the webinar, on the

podcast I remember, so I curate really fantastic content and put

it out very consistently on a calendar, and then added the

other layers over the years that we talked about, which is taking

the snippets and putting it in social media and doing reels and

Instagram format and the different YouTube clips and

things like that. And you can see, I don't do that stuff

because I can't even explain exactly what it is

that's really good teams for that's why you hire

good vendors.

It's incredibly powerful, because people now are

saying they they see me all the time. I'm so blessed now that I

go to a conference, like I was at a big legal conference couple

weeks ago, and everyone's like, Oh yeah, I've seen your stuff,

or they come up. Oh Jay, I listen to your podcast. I watch

your webinars, and we get phone calls where people are like, Oh,

I listened to every podcast you did this year. I watched your

webinar the six parts of Google two times through, and I know

you're the right agency for us. So that's a blessing that came

from five years of overnight success. Yeah,

that's not an easy habit to keep. I mean, those two

habits really side by side. That's not easy to do. There's a

lot of people who get to the, I don't know, second year, if

they're lucky of that, and say, Ah, you know what? I'm going to

go ahead and I'm just going to go ahead and hang that up. What

kept you going.

I think we just started getting some initial

success and and by the way, I always like to share this with

people. You don't have to do a webinar, you don't have to do a

podcast. You could do what I said. You could just write a

LinkedIn article once, yeah, once, even once a month, but

hopefully once a week. Answer, just answer a question. And by

the way, nine times out of 10 you answered that question in a

long email to a client. Anyways, that's right. Copy and paste it,

throw it in chat GPT and and tell chat GPT to change the

scenario from personal injury lawyer to a bankruptcy lawyer,

and put it out as a blog post or a LinkedIn article. And then you

can always find a great twin turn. You know what a twin turn

is? Right? I don't remember Twitter intern. Oh, you hire an

intern who can post on Twitter for you. It's an old industry

term, but seriously, you can always find someone great who's

a journalism student who's looking to build their

portfolio, or find someone on Upwork or Fiverr who's really

great at social media, and they know all the formats and the

sizes and how to write the tags and everything and all you have

to do the simplest like I call it the easy button, all you have

to do for your personal brand is create one piece of content a

week. And like I said, it's easy. Just answer a question,

and you can shoot a quick video on your iPhone. You can write a

quick blog post, if you're more comfortable doing that, and then

every week, you just send it to your twin turn, and that person

will post it on your blog. Post it on LinkedIn for you. Post in

my case, like I said, every webinars, we make five, we pull

the five best clips from the webinar. The full webinar goes

on our YouTube channel, which we now have over a million views.

The congrats. That's awesome. Thank you. Thank you. But again,

five years of every month, that's right, every month, a

webinar, every week, a podcast, and then, fortunately, people

watch it, and the algorithm took over. But you just produce that

one piece of content. You know, when you're just starting out,

produce that one piece of content every week, off to the

intern, and then he or she slices or dices it and puts it

in all the other places. And within six months, I promise

you, you'll be everyone will be saying, Oh, I see your stuff all

the time, and that's because they follow you on LinkedIn, or

they follow you on Facebook, or you can email out your blog and

put it on your blog, on your website, super simple, and even

if you're a personal brand, back to that attorney who works at

men, man and man. You can do the same thing, just answer a

question one once a month on your LinkedIn, and then drop it

on your Facebook and your Twitter, and link back to your

LinkedIn, and you'll see omnipresent and it'll help a lot

with generating some revenue, which everybody needs to do.

That's right, yeah, you mentioned earlier, one

of the things that your personal brand stood out is you were this

major brand manager, but you also had some of these digital

marketing, more direct attribution skills as well. I'd

love to learn a little bit more about what you took from, say,

working at Coca Cola and bringing it and merging it with

some of this more direct marketing that you do.

Well, I think I'd like to talk about brand and the

importance of brand today, particularly for law firms. And

the funny part about working at Coca Cola is it was over 100

years. Now it's probably over 125 years, right? That it's been

marketed. And every time, I always wanted to come up with

new ideas. And I'd say, Oh, this is a great idea. Like I had this

idea we should do a points program where every coke you get

points, and they showed me a folder this thick, but if you're

listening to the audio, about a foot wide, and they've done all

the studies, and they'd analyze, and they said, Oh, this won't

work. And that summer, Pepsi came out with a points program,

and they crushed it because it was really popular. But it's

like, you try and come up with a new idea for 125 year old brand

that's marketed and done everything. The brand lessons

that I like to tell about marketing really starts with

something. I was doing some research for several clients and

looking at a screenshot. And we mostly work with personal injury

lawyers. So I'd search Personal Injury Lawyer, Philadelphia.

Personal Injury Lawyer, I'm down here just in Boca Raton, so it's

South Florida. Personal Injury Lawyer. And what was coming up

in every single market was like, my client, Scott, Lisa, came up

solo attorney, personal injury guy, and he was number two on

the local service ads, and John Morgan was number one. And I

searched another one of my clients in Philadelphia, he was

number one, John Morgan was number two, and another client

in California, he was number one, and John Morgan was number

two. So I said to myself, why is it that John Morgan is coming up

all across the country, because you can't just buy your way

there in the local service, right? If you bid too much, it

turns the algorithm off. As I looked into it, a big part of

the algorithm is click through rate. And if people see John

Morgan's face, and he runs $400 million worth of media, which he

does, you're going to recognize him and more likely click on

John Morgan than my solo attorney down here in South

Florida. So that brought me to this point about brand Okay, the

man man and man law firm can't compete with John Morgan, and

nobody else can in terms of budget or. Or breadth of

marketing, but what you can do is get your message figured out

and get consistency in how you deliver your brand message. So

we're actually working on our brand message yet again at 10

golden rules. We're working on our trade show booth, our one

pager. We're going to revamp our website, but part of that is

also the brand colors and the consistency. And so everywhere

you appear as a company or as an individual, you're going to be

super consistent. So you've got your logo figured out, your

slogan figured out, and then your image, your main imagery

and colors and your key message, your headline and your image,

those are like the four key communications of what your

brand message is. So figure out if you're the guys who fight the

insurance company, or you're the gal who's in the community and

gives back to the community, or if you're the ones who are the

best in court, you'll fight in court, and pick that message

that resonates with your personal brand and with

everybody in the company, and then deliver that super

consistently across all the different media, all your social

media, even on your signature line on your email.

Nice. And when a lot of times I see law firm

owners thinking about some of this brand and alignment on all

of it, some of them are still maybe earlier in the process of

figuring out who they are, right to gain that consistency. Are

there any things that you've seen or that you've experienced

that help find those moments of clarity in brand development?

Well, I think one thing that helps is just pick

one and go with it and know you can change it.

That's fair. It's

like we always say, Done is better than

perfect. And MVP minimum viable product and startups, right? Get

That's right. It out the bloody door. Don't overthink it. Just

sit down, have a brainstorming. If you can, I can refer some

branding consultants if you want. We're working with a great

one right now named Rose Moran, and she's working on our stuff

and working with a couple clients, and you probably met

her at our conference at tgr live. She's amazing, and so

it'll help you figure out a message, and just don't get too

hung up that it's perfect, or that you might move into some

other practice areas down the road. The biggest hiccup, I

would say, for some firms, is a lot of times I joked about man,

man and man, like, if you started a business with your dad

and your brother, dad might be like mass torts, and you like

personal injury, and your brother likes criminal that's

the only part that's a teeny bit tricky. But then, you know, then

you got to figure out, okay, who are you? You're the man family

that cares or something, and then you can take that brand to

market. And down the road, if Dad retires, and your brother

figures out there's more money in pi, and you guys go straight

in pi, then you can evolve your message,

right? There is definitely that, that fear of

commitment, and then I think it sometimes causes a lot of brands

to be too neutral overall, playing it a little bit too

soft. How do you help? Or how would you encourage law firms to

find that edge in their brand that maybe is missing?

Well, the first thing is, really do it? Because

there's riches in the niches, and I've seen it over and over,

and my personal story once we decided to go all in with

lawyers, and we're about triple in revenue, and it's been great

for our firm. And it also it made my life easier, and it made

my staff's life easier, because now I know if I want to get

booked to speak, I want to speak at Great Legal Marketing I want

to speak at pilma. I was there a couple weeks ago the personal

injury lawyers mastermind. I want to have my own event called

tgr live growth strategies for law firms. Right? We're very

honed in on what we do, and I know what I do, so there's no

discrepancy. And it makes it easier for my staff, because 80

or 90% of our business is Personal Injury digital

marketing, right? And they're getting really, really good at

it, because now that's all we've done for six years, is getting

them lawyers listed on SEO, figuring out LSA for personal

injury, figuring out Google Maps for personal injury lawyers. So

it makes their job easier, because I used to bring in all

kinds of deals. Hey, we're gonna this. We got this great client,

this beautiful island in the Bahamas, and you could swim with

dolphins in their natural habitat. And the next day, it

was like a real estate deal, and we're selling land, and you

know, it's uncharted land on the back of an island, on the back

of a mountain in North Carolina. It was a personal injury law

firm, and the next day, it was like an accounting firm. I was

able to pivot because I had a lot of marketing background, but

when you're five years into your career, it's a lot easier if

you're focused on one thing. You get darn good at it and you do

it all day. So I would encourage folks to pick a niche, and then

how do you do it? What's the magic like? Start with the 8020

rule, and every business has one 80% of your revenue comes from.

20% of your practice areas, and pick the one that you know was

really moving the needle, and commit to it right? Say that

this is what we do. And it could say, oh, we also do this, but

picking a niche and then making it easier for yourself and your

team, I promise you'll be a win

a lot of times. So interested in relating this back

to your business. I see some firms when they're looking at,

oh, I'm going to niche down. Hey, I have three different

practice areas, let's be honest. Like one of these is pretty much

dead already. The other one, I really don't get that excited

about, but, and this is where it comes in, they go, but I really

want to make I'm scared of losing the revenue from that

space. I'm scared of putting all my eggs into one basket. You've

gone through this experience. What was that like for your

company? What wisdom did you take

from it? So I was very scared, because it was

like, niching down from 200 Si, si codes to one, yeah. And then

people say, which area of which practice area do you do? And I'm

like, wait a minute, I went from 200 to one and we're still going

to help people other than personal injury, but we're

really pretty concentric around personal injury, yeah. But what

I would say for people is, not only is it make your life

easier, not only is it make your customer's life easier, like

people arrive at a website, they're going to decide within

three seconds if they're at the place they're looking for,

right? And so you only have, like I said, your logo, your

slogan, your image and your headline. They're going to make

a decision with two or three seconds. So you can't

communicate too many things, and you can't communicate nothing.

Everybody knows how to hit the back button. They'll go back on

the Google search and look for the firm they're looking for.

That's right. The second part of that, I would say is really,

really important, is Google is now saying you can't be too many

things. You've got to figure out who you are. And the broadest

example is one of our clients had all this stuff, like

flowering trees in Virginia and blogs about things to do with

your kids in the summer in Virginia, because they're a

personal injury law firm in Virginia, but you know, their

previous ad agency, digital agency, thought they could have

blogs about Virginia, and then they'd rank for but then Google

made a big algorithm change about five years ago and said

you've got to be very specific. So the more specific you are on

your website, in your marketing, it's going to help your

consumers, and it's going to help Google, and it's going to

help you be found. So that's yet another reason to pick your

niche and focus on it. Now you can also have under practice

areas. You can have the your brother's practice area in

criminal law, and he can write his articles on his LinkedIn

about how he got someone out of jail the firm as a whole, if

it's the 8020 rule, and 80% of your revenues coming from

personal injury. You gotta hone in on it,

yeah, taking that leap of faith, it's interesting,

because there's so many stories like yours out there, of people

niching down and it turning out in their favor. It's really

interesting. Even with all of these like business success

stories, I know that you play in masterminds like you yourself,

seek out business growth education. We can hear all of

these lessons, and somehow we still need to find ways to make

the mistakes for ourselves a little bit, right? Funny

enough, the mastermind was the third of what

I called my god wink, and I got three messages. So the first one

was I met this guy, and he had an agency, and it was about

three times the size of my agency, and I'd never heard of

him, and I'd done all this speaking and writing and books

and publishing, and he said, Oh, we only work with franchises. I

said, How can you only work with one niche? Like I have a hard

enough time building my business targeting all the niches, that's

great. We got really good at franchises, and we got hooked up

with orange theory. And then we got about 60 orange theories as

clients, and corporate made us one of their official vendors.

We've just been growing like crazy. And I said, Okay,

interesting. And then I met these guys who had the most

successful software startup in South Florida, and it's, I think

it's still, our record software sale. They sold their company

for three, $60 million dollars called E builder, and they only

did construction software in one niche, in hospitality. The two

brothers were arguing like about niching down, and when they did,

they said, it's so much easier because there's only 300 big

firms all around the world who needed our software. And once we

became the best and we owned the three trade shows a year, and

our sales people knew who they needed to call on. Like our life

got so much better, and we 10x our business. And then the final

one was showing up at my mastermind, which is called

seven figure agency. And there was, at that time, maybe about

only about 50 or 60 members who were building seven figure

agencies. And there was all these guys who only did roofing

and only did garage door repair and only did lawyers and

accountants and stuff like that. Then the all these firms were

hitting seven figures, which is a million dollars in recurring

revenue. So no, no projects, is how they define it in the seven

figure. Interesting. And so I said, okay, and I looked up. I

said, Okay, God, I. Get it three messages. It took me three

pounded over the head, and then we decided to go specialize with

lawyers. But very quickly we went all in. We had to redo our

website, and so we had to say 10 golden rules Internet Marketing

for law firms. And it's the best thing we've done

that's fantastic. Well, congratulations on all of

it. If people are interested in learning more about what you all

do and connecting with you. What's the best place to send

them?

Best place is 10 Golden rules.com or 10 golden

rules, or Jay Berkowitz on all the social media. And definitely

check out our YouTube channel, Charley's on there, and some

really amazing webinars. We've done webinars on EOS for law

firms and YouTube. We've got some great content on creating

YouTubes and building we've got personal brand stuff and rain

making. So highly recommend the YouTube channel as well. That's

fantastic. All right, Jay, one last little

question for you. It's a three parter. What are you reading,

watching and listening to these days?

I'm reading the NVIDIA way and outlive I'm going

back and forth. So great story on Jensen Wang, 100 billion

dollar the chip, massive chip manufacturer. It's fascinating

how they saw their way to build that business. Yeah, and outlive

is a great book about wellness and longevity, both recommended

to me, actually, by two different attorneys. Thank you

guys, reading, watching, mostly watching YouTube these days. As

a matter of fact, my last presentation, I talked about the

three hottest trends for legal growth strategies and marketing.

And the first one was AI, of course, the second one was

branding, and the third one was YouTube, because, I think, and I

checked the numbers, I mean, YouTube's absolutely on fire.

And basically what YouTube did is they tick tock themselves. So

you used to see YouTubes of people that you followed, but

then they started showing you YouTubes of things that you

would be interested in. So I see all kinds of stuff about legal,

all kinds of stuff. About marketing, but running your

business, and the Winnipeg Jets are hockey all I'm all about. So

reading, watching, it's the third one. Listening, listening,

yep, yes. Podcasts. Love Charlie's. Podcast, four or five

internet marketing podcast, love the all in podcast. Those guys

just keep nailing it. If you haven't seen that one at Jason

Calacanis, who ironically was on the 10 golden rules of internet

marketing podcast before he had a podcast, podcast in the world,

Jason was doing a startup, a search startup, when we

interviewed him, many years ago, and that podcast is amazing.

They just had Sundar Pichai, hope I got his name right, the

CEO of Google, talking about Google's AI product and how

they're going to monetize it. And by the way, they're going to

have to monetize it because it's really expensive to run AI and

chat GPT is going to have ads coming soon, I promise you,

because it's billions of dollars, trillions of dollars.

Matter of fact, I learned on that podcast, we're gonna have

to double the energy output, double the energy output in the

United States to accommodate AI. Since we can imagine that task,

like all the energy that we produce in the United States,

we're gonna have to double it to meet the demands of AI holy,

that's gonna be really expensive, and you're gonna see

ads and you've got GPT soon. There's like,

no kidding. Well, Jay, I appreciate your time

wisdom and insights here. As always, it's good to talk to

you, my friend. Awesome. Thanks. This was lots of fun, and we'll

see you all in the next episode of they don't teach us in law

school.