Are you in control of your systems, or are your systems controlling you?
In this episode of "The Business You Really Want," hosts Gwen Bortner and Tonya Kubo invite you into the world of systems and how the behaviors within your business shape the results you see. Whether you're running a solo operation or managing a growing team, understanding and optimizing your systems can lead to more efficiency, less stress, and greater success.
Here’s what you can expect in this episode:
Key Takeaways:
Ready to optimize your business systems? Try this:
If you enjoyed this episode, please subscribe and leave a review!
Also, be sure to check out Episode 8, where we explore solving the right problems in the right order.
EPISODE 7 GWEN: Why waste time
documenting something that
2
:we're going to revise, improve?
3
:Remove, delete, you know,
whatever, whatever it is.
4
:And so documentation of systems is useful
once you know you really have a useful,
5
:effective, proper, um, whatever term you
want to put around it, system in place.
6
:But people assume that by documenting
it, they now have a system.
7
:Nope, they had a system long
before they put any word to paper.
8
:EPISODE 7 TONYA: Are you feeling
overwhelmed, stuck, or uncertain about
9
:how to grow your business without
sacrificing what really matters most?
10
:Welcome to The Business You Really
Want, the show for women ready to build
11
:a sustainable, fully aligned business.
12
:Aligned with what, you ask?
13
:You.
14
:Your values.
15
:Your life.
16
:Seriously.
17
:It is possible.
18
:I'm Tonya Kubo, and along with
business advisor extraordinaire Gwynn
19
:Bortner, we're here to show you how.
20
:Do you have systems in your business
or do your systems have you?
21
:If you're me, it's more
the latter than the former.
22
:Gwen is the queen of systems, by the
way, just in case you didn't know that.
23
:Uh, so in this episode, I think
it's really important to talk about
24
:identifying and optimizing the
behaviors that shape your business.
25
:I'm Tanya Kubo.
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:Uh, I am here with
27
:operations expert extraordinaire.
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:I love this as, as the lead host
here, I get to say all sorts of
29
:ridiculous things about Gwen and she
can't stop me cause we're recording.
30
:As we are here,
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:Gwen, at the end of our
introductory gears series, right?
32
:Which we're exploring the five key
operational functions that make
33
:up the engine of any business.
34
:We have come to the last and
most certainly not least.
35
:We have talked about goals.
36
:We've talked about effectiveness,
we've talked about accounting, last
37
:episode we talked about resources,
and today we're talking about what
38
:I believe is the most misunderstood
business function, which is systems.
39
:Now Gwen, you don't know this, but several
weeks back, You gave me a definition of
40
:systems that absolutely blew my mind.
41
:So much so, I scrawled, MUST
BLOG THIS, in my notebook.
42
:Okay?
43
:This is how you know I
mean business, right?
44
:It's like, scrawled, that's several
pages back, cause that was weeks ago.
45
:It blew my mind because I am one
of those people who has spent years
46
:saying, I gotta work on my systems.
47
:I need better systems.
48
:I don't have any systems.
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:I hired people.
50
:The people told me I didn't have systems
too, so it's not like I was the only
51
:person who thought this, but when you
said systems are actually behaviors, I
52
:went, Oh, now that you mentioned it, maybe
I do have systems and I don't like them
53
:because I don't like the behaviors I have.
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:So start us off there.
55
:Explain to me how I have systems
if I don't know that they're there.
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:EPISODE 7 GWEN: Everybody
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:has systems.
58
:There, there is, there is nothing
that happens without a system.
59
:Now, you may not have consistent systems.
60
:You may not have documented systems.
61
:You may not have systems that are
producing the results that you want.
62
:Those are very, very
different kinds of things.
63
:But systems are happening all the time,
everywhere, around everything, all.
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:So, when someone says I don't have
any systems, that is not true.
65
:They have systems.
66
:They may not have documented systems, they
may not be consistent systems, they may
67
:not be the systems that they want, because
a system is just a way you do something.
68
:It is a behavior.
69
:The way you answer the phone, or
don't answer the phone, is a system.
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:like, you know, your
personal thing, you know.
71
:By the way, this can be used for
phone calls for those who don't know.
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:Um.
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:EPISODE 7 TONYA: Not by me, Gwen.
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:Not by me.
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:EPISODE 7 GWEN: know, on very
rare occasions, only under duress.
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:EPISODE 7 TONYA: I will slack you
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:and
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:you will call me
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:EPISODE 7 GWEN: system, right?
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:All of that's a system, it's a behavior.
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:EPISODE 7 TONYA: So if systems
are behaviors then, and I don't
82
:think I have systems because
I don't know their behaviors.
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:Let me see how much more circular
logic I can throw into this.
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:How do I know my behaviors?
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:How do I figure that out?
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:EPISODE 7 GWEN: So, that is an observation
activity, and this is why most people
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:don't think they have systems, is
it's really hard to observe ourselves.
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:EPISODE 7 TONYA: Okay.
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:Mm
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:EPISODE 7 GWEN: I use the phrase,
uh, you know, you can't read the
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:label from the inside of the jar.
92
:That's kind of what the situation is.
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:It's hard to observe yourself.
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:If you're doing it with some level of
consciousness, you actually can to say,
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:so what do I do when, you know, I'm going
to keep picking like on the phone, right?
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:The phone rings.
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:What do you do?
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:There is a system that we all have.
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:We don't, it's so automatic.
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:We don't even think about it as a system,
but I know when the phone rings, the
101
:first thing I do and look as I see, is
it a number that my phone recognizes?
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:Yay, caller ID.
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:Gosh, you know, we're old enough
to have not had caller ID.
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:EPISODE 7 TONYA: I know!
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:Remember when the phone
rang and it was a mystery?
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:EPISODE 7 GWEN: it was a mystery.
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:It was a total mystery.
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:So the first thing I looked is,
is it anybody I know, right?
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:That's part of my
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:EPISODE 7 TONYA: Mm
111
:hmm.
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:EPISODE 7 GWEN: if it's someone I know,
then I evaluate, um, can I answer it now?
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:Or should I answer it now based
on anything else that's going on?
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:Like if you and I are recording
like right now and the phone rang,
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:um, I'd be upset that I haven't
turned it silent, which I haven't.
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:Um,
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:but I would look and see is, is it
one of only a person or two that
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:I might answer the phone because
it's actually potentially urgent
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:right now, I'm not expecting
anybody to have any urgent issues.
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:So I wouldn't
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:EPISODE 7 TONYA: Mm hmm.
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:EPISODE 7 GWEN: in Necall.
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:That's part of my system right now.
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:Now, if it was, we weren't recording,
maybe you and I were just chatting,
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:um, depending on who it was, I
would say, Hey, this is so and so.
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:Let me, let me find out
if this is important.
127
:Um, other people would be
like, yeah, no, they can wait.
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:And I would send them
off to voicemail, right?
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:But I, if it was a number I
didn't recognize, I'd immediately
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:send it off to voicemail.
131
:All of that's a system.
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:Now, most people don't think about
it that consciously that they're
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:just doing those things, right?
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:This is just, but that's why
it's also a behavior, right?
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:That's your behavior of
how you answer the phone.
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:But that.
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:Behavior is in fact the system.
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:EPISODE 7 TONYA: Okay.
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:So, I know I can find out my
behaviors by observing them.
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:We tend to be terrible at that,
so I can probably do, like,
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:a task study or a time study.
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:EPISODE 7 GWEN: Yeah, and part of
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:EPISODE 7 TONYA: to do it
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:EPISODE 7 GWEN: part of it's being
aware, like, I hadn't prepped that whole
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:conversation that we just had, um, but
because I'm good at observing, I was able
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:to say, oh yeah, so what would happen?
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:Well, if the phone rang right
now, there, here are the first
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:two questions my mind would do.
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:And, and if you start paying
attention, you can say, oh yeah, I
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:know that if a number that doesn't
recognize come up, I always put,
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:you know, send it to voicemail.
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:I know, you know, you, you can start
paying attention to your own things and
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:saying, Oh yeah, what am I doing here?
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:Why am I doing that?
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:And that's really the question.
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:Like, Why am I making this choice?
157
:Why am I making this decision?
158
:Um, what, what is the trigger for
the decision or why am I doing it?
159
:Right?
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:I'm not going to answer the phone.
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:The phone doesn't ring.
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:That's the first thing.
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:It
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:EPISODE 7 TONYA: That's a good point.
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:Okay, so the phone ringing is the trigger.
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:EPISODE 7 GWEN: Yeah.
167
:EPISODE 7 TONYA: So then, how do I know,
so okay, so I've observed my behaviors.
168
:How do I know when it's
time to document them?
169
:Because one thing that you and me have
talked about a lot of times is, a lot
170
:of times people think system equals
SOP, or Standard Operating Procedure,
171
:when in reality, The SOP is just
cementing or standardizing the behaviors
172
:that we've been doing all along.
173
:EPISODE 7 GWEN: So,
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:so often when people First talk to
me about potentially working with me.
175
:One of the first things they say is, Oh,
so you're going to document my systems?
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:And the first thing is, I'm not
going to do anything like that
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:because that's not part of what I do.
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:EPISODE 7 TONYA: This ain't that.
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:EPISODE 7 GWEN: not that.
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:And I'm not going to encourage
you to do have anyone else do that
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:either, which always shocks people.
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:What do you mean?
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:Well, because we don't know that those are
the most effective systems that you have.
184
:Why waste time documenting something
that we're going to revise, improve?
185
:Remove, delete, you know,
whatever, whatever it is.
186
:And so documentation of systems is useful
once you know you really have a useful,
187
:effective, proper, um, whatever term you
want to put around it, system in place.
188
:But people assume that by documenting
it, they now have a system.
189
:Nope, they had a system long
before they put any word to paper.
190
:But if we're going to put word to
paper or computer, um, then let's
191
:make sure we're actually documenting
what we want to continue to do for at
192
:least some extended period of time.
193
:It may not be forever.
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:You know, that's also part of it is
these things will change over time.
195
:Um, but let's make sure we're
documenting what we actually want to do.
196
:Not necessarily what we're doing.
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:EPISODE 7 TONYA: Got it.
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:Okay.
199
:So we want to make sure that whatever
we do document is productive.
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:in some way.
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:It's the best way we know how to do
the thing in this given period of
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:EPISODE 7 GWEN: Yep.
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:No,
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:EPISODE 7 TONYA: document a system?
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:Um, you know, I'm a big fan
of a Google Doc, but I know
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:some people like spreadsheets.
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:Other people like task management systems.
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:EPISODE 7 GWEN: No, there are
multiple right answers to this.
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:And within any organization, there's
also multiple right answers to this.
210
:Um, back to getting consistent about how
you're answering that question really
211
:becomes important.
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:the important piece of
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:EPISODE 7 TONYA: Mm hmm.
214
:EPISODE 7 GWEN: Um, and so one of
my things is the fewer places that
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:you have to change something when
something changes, the better.
216
:So I'm not a fan of having, um, you
know, a whole set of like a project
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:plan or a whole set of tasks in a,
you know, a system like, you know,
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:ClickUp or Asana or, you know, any,
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:EPISODE 7 TONYA: Mm hmm.
220
:EPISODE 7 GWEN: and then also duplicating
that in some sort of spreadsheet
221
:or Google doc or any other place.
222
:Because now you have
to change it two places
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:EPISODE 7 TONYA: Right,
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:EPISODE 7 GWEN: when something changes.
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:Right.
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:So you can say the project plan for,
you know, this launch can be found
227
:here in Asana and have it link.
228
:And so then, but you know that the tasks
themselves are listed out in Asana, and
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:that's the only place that you change it.
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:So that when someone says, yeah,
where do I find the project
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:plan for this particular launch?
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:If they go to the Google
Docs, like, oh, go here.
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:Oh, here it is.
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:And we assume that that is
the most current version.
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:And if anything needs to be changed,
it's often changed on the fly
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:as they're, as people are doing.
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:It's like, oh yeah, we're not
using that software anymore.
238
:We need to use this other software or,
you know, whatever the case may be.
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:EPISODE 7 TONYA: right.
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:Okay,
241
:so, so we've established that systems
are really consistent behaviors, um,
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:that you document, but documentation
alone does not equal a system.
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:I love that you just pointed
out that, you know, systems are
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:not special software, right?
245
:There's no right or wrong way.
246
:It can, a system can be as easy as a
handwritten checklist, it sounds like,
247
:can be as complex as some kind
of interactive checklist system
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:that you have with really pricey
software that I've not heard of.
249
:I'm sure if somebody listening
or watching knows of this pricey
250
:software, they'll tell us about them.
251
:That's the one thing I love about
having conversations like this in
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:public view is that people can tell us
the things that we haven't thought of.
253
:You've also talked about the importance of
recognizing your behavior patterns, right?
254
:What, what it is you do, you know,
are you the person who's always
255
:going to ignore the phone call that
comes from an unrecognized number?
256
:Or are you the person who picks up every
phone call just because that's your
257
:habit of picking up every phone call?
258
:So I'm wondering about
the unconscious behaviors.
259
:What are the, about the behaviors
that we have that we don't know we
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:have, that could be either driving
our success or maybe sabotaging it?
261
:What do you have to say about those?
262
:Mm hmm.
263
:EPISODE 7 GWEN: So this is
264
:the place where having someone
work with you outside is really,
265
:you know, that's an outside
observer, really can be beneficial.
266
:Um, you know, you and I have had this
conversation, I can't even guess how
267
:many dozens if not hundreds of times
by now, where you will say something
268
:and I will say, well, what do you mean?
269
:Because For me, it's so natural, it's so
subconscious, it's so automatic, I don't
270
:understand that it's unusual or that
there's a particular nuance to it that
271
:is different than what most everybody
else in the world sees or hears or does.
272
:Um, and so having someone who's able
to actually look outside and say, all
273
:right, do you recognize that you do this?
274
:And for you to be able to
say, well, no, why would I?
275
:I mean, of course I do that.
276
:Right.
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:And because in our mind, that's the thing.
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:It's like, well, of course I do that.
279
:Why, how would you not do that?
280
:And,
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:EPISODE 7 TONYA: How
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:would you not?
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:EPISODE 7 GWEN: how would you not?
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:I, I know there's several
times I've said that to you.
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:What do you mean?
286
:How would you not?
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:And you're like, oh no, no, no
one, no one else does it that way.
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:And I'm
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:EPISODE 7 TONYA: Nobody
else would do that.
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:EPISODE 7 GWEN: It seems like craziness.
291
:And I am a really good observer
of systems and behaviors.
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:And I can't see it about myself either.
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:Sometimes you have to have someone else
watching to see what that thing is, to
294
:see what that little magic potion, what
that little phrasing, whatever, you know,
295
:there can be all sorts of little things
that really do make a big difference.
296
:Um, and you just can't see it for
yourself because it's, it's just so
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:natural that it's unidentifiable.
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:EPISODE 7 TONYA: Yes.
299
:And you know what, this reminds me
of a conversation we had recently,
300
:uh, might've been last week.
301
:Might've been yesterday.
302
:Time is a, is a fuzzy
thing for me sometimes.
303
:Um, so you were talking to somebody
about, like, there was, you were talking
304
:to a, a business owner and there was a
challenge, um, with, with a staff member
305
:and what it came, you had pointed out
to the business owner, you said, well.
306
:Um, you know, your, your staff member
can't get started on the project because
307
:you haven't given them enough information.
308
:And the business owner
was like, yeah, I have.
309
:I told them this and this.
310
:And you're like, yeah, yeah,
but that's not enough for them.
311
:And you'd said something, which was, I
bet you haven't given them that piece
312
:of information because you want the
freedom to change your mind later.
313
:And they went, yeah.
314
:And you actually, I mean, you
tie it all to Myers Briggs.
315
:But, you know, as I was watching
that interchange, I was going, Oh,
316
:so this is an example of how the
business owner, because their desire
317
:to keep things fluid so that they can
change their mind, they can kind of,
318
:you know, bob and weave as needed,
319
:EPISODE 7 GWEN: And it's been
320
:good for them.
321
:That's been part of their success,
322
:EPISODE 7 TONYA: right.
323
:That's part of the success.
324
:But as they are developing team
members into higher level positions,
325
:it's actually working against them
because These individuals can't
326
:perform at the level that the business
owner expects because they don't
327
:have the information that they need.
328
:Um, so that's the most concrete example I
can think of of how this whole unconscious
329
:behavior sort of sabotages success.
330
:Can you think of others or do you
want to maybe expand upon that one?
331
:Mm
332
:EPISODE 7 GWEN: Well, let's uh,
that's a great example and so
333
:let's just expand upon, upon it.
334
:Um, when, when we hold all of the
cards, when we are the solopreneur,
335
:truly the solopreneur, um, you know,
we get to do everything our way.
336
:Absolutely 100 percent everything our way.
337
:Um, but If the fact that I'm left
handed means that you now have to do
338
:everything left handed, that could
become a real problem because now
339
:I can only hire left handed people.
340
:So where are the things that we
actually can do some give on, right?
341
:Where, where is there space
for, for some give in there?
342
:And, Entrepreneurs, particularly
solopreneurs as they start,
343
:really like the flexibility.
344
:That's a lot.
345
:I mean, often you say, why did
you start your own business?
346
:Well, I wanted flexibility.
347
:You know, that
348
:EPISODE 7 TONYA: Freedom
349
:and flexibility,
350
:EPISODE 7 GWEN: and flexibility.
351
:Oh my
352
:EPISODE 7 TONYA: Freedom and flexibility.
353
:EPISODE 7 GWEN: Um, but the problem
is too much freedom and flexibility
354
:for anyone, including the owner,
means other people can't start
355
:making decisions for themselves.
356
:Because there's no way to predict
what owner answer would be,
357
:EPISODE 7 TONYA: Mm.
358
:EPISODE 7 GWEN: right?
359
:Now, if we start standardizing,
often the owner creative is
360
:like, that means I can't change.
361
:Well, no, you always can change,
but you can't change without
362
:dealing with the consequences.
363
:Now, here's the reality that most
people don't understand, is They're
364
:dealing with those consequences,
whether they know they are or not.
365
:Every time that they're making that
change, that shift, whatever, where
366
:before some, they were doing it, they
didn't realize all the consequences
367
:that they were causing, because they
were just causing them to themselves.
368
:And so it was just a thing
and that's the way it went.
369
:And this is the way I work.
370
:And, you know, you can justify,
you know, pretty much anything if
371
:you want, if you try hard enough.
372
:But now that there's other
people in the equation.
373
:That same cost is now showing
up in a different way.
374
:And so there's this reflection of what's
happening with this system, right?
375
:And so that flexibility is probably
still important, but the question
376
:is, how important is the thing that
we're trying to remain flexible on?
377
:Um, do you really not know?
378
:Do you really need time to process?
379
:Or are you just wanting.
380
:Another two weeks to be absolutely
sure that the answer that you thought
381
:of four weeks ago is still the
answer that you have, um, which I
382
:see that a lot with entrepreneurs.
383
:And, and so systems start putting these
pieces in place and you start finding
384
:where am I gumming up the works with
me wanting to have all the flexibility.
385
:Because we often think that
all of this intuition is what's
386
:actually driving, um, our, our
processes, our systems, our success.
387
:Um, usually it's not.
388
:There's usually a little bit at
the beginning and a little bit at
389
:the end, but most of the middle
is actually fairly consistent.
390
:And the more consistent it is, you
actually end up with better results.
391
:But everyone thinks they need all sorts
of flexibility in all of these spaces.
392
:And, and it's, it's not actually helpful.
393
:Because it's allowing you to use up
way too many cycles trying to process a
394
:decision that really you already made.
395
:EPISODE 7 TONYA: Okay.
396
:So,
397
:uh, that actually leads
into my next question.
398
:Uh, sounds
399
:like you kind of
400
:EPISODE 7 GWEN: when I do that.
401
:EPISODE 7 TONYA: I like
it when you do that, too.
402
:That makes my life a lot easier.
403
:Less setup on the question, right?
404
:Um, which is, you know,
405
:how do you create intentional systems
that support your goals and values?
406
:And it sounds like what you
just said is you figure out
407
:how much you can standardize.
408
:and still feel the freedom that's
so important to you, so that you're
409
:leaving the flexibility for the
things that truly need to be flexible.
410
:Do you have an example
411
:of that, like something concrete?
412
:EPISODE 7 GWEN: Yeah, so I'll, I'll,
I'll use, Us and the way that we work.
413
:So
414
:EPISODE 7 TONYA: I like the yes example
because I have some inside knowledge.
415
:EPISODE 7 GWEN: couple of things
that are really important to
416
:us is context matters, which
417
:means we do not have a predefined process
that we're going to take you through
418
:step by step by step by step by step,
419
:because your outcome and, and, you
know, the next client's outcome, even
420
:if you have very similar businesses,
may be very, very different.
421
:And there's all sorts of
pieces that play into that.
422
:But that doesn't mean we
don't have any systems
423
:EPISODE 7 TONYA: Mm
424
:EPISODE 7 GWEN: around that.
425
:Okay.
426
:Um, we have some places that we start
very consistently because we know that
427
:we need to get this set of questions.
428
:EPISODE 7 TONYA: hmm.
429
:EPISODE 7 GWEN: that we have an onboarding
process that we want you to go through
430
:because we've seen over time it works.
431
:And so instead of being flexible
about all of those things, we're not.
432
:There are some places where,
you know, we do this, we do
433
:this, we do this, we do this.
434
:We have some areas that we are
very, very consistent about.
435
:But there are other areas
that we are very open about.
436
:When we first start working together,
we have three different programs, and
437
:depending on which one, you're going
to fall into one of those programs.
438
:And I'm really not very flexible
for the first three to six months.
439
:After you've worked with us for a
while, this is the place where, you
440
:know, the choices become possible,
because I now know enough about you
441
:and your business to know, is this
choice a reasonable choice or not?
442
:But I don't let you have too much
flexibility because then you're
443
:not going to make a decision.
444
:You're not going to know what to do.
445
:You're not going to have,
have direction, right?
446
:So we will make adjustments as time
goes, as time goes forward, but we don't
447
:just let all options available Right out
of the, right out of the chute, right?
448
:Um, so there is some flexibility in there,
but there's also some systems in there.
449
:We're going to do this thing
for a certain period of time.
450
:EPISODE 7 TONYA: Got it.
451
:So that, that is really this, the
structure that goes in there is that we
452
:know that there is this thing that we
will do for a significant period of time.
453
:And then at the end of that time, then we
go to the next thing, then the next thing,
454
:and that in and of itself is the system.
455
:And there are systems within
that larger system, right?
456
:And I think that's also where
we get tripped up, is sometimes
457
:we don't realize that there's
three file folders in place here.
458
:We want to look at it all
as one big parent folder.
459
:And that's not, uh, oftentimes
that's just not how it works.
460
:EPISODE 7 GWEN: it, it,
461
:it's not.
462
:And, uh, you know, for instance,
we have onboarding processes and
463
:there's part of our onboarding
process everybody goes through.
464
:EPISODE 7 TONYA: Mm hmm.
465
:EPISODE 7 GWEN: But part of our
onboarding process, only certain clients
466
:that have, have purchased certain
packages and certain, um, you know,
467
:consulting advisory services go through.
468
:Um, so
469
:the system is sort of the same, but
there's a point where this one diverges
470
:and goes this way, but this, you know, but
you're still doing this one too, right?
471
:So we all start here and then, and
then some people are still doing this
472
:and doing this and others are just
doing this and that's okay, right?
473
:Um, But instead of asking, you
know, what do you want to do here?
474
:Do you want to do this?
475
:Do you want it?
476
:No, no, no, no.
477
:We're, you know, and that allows
my folks to then also be able
478
:to know what they have to do.
479
:I can't even remember the last time I
had to deal with any onboarding issue.
480
:EPISODE 7 TONYA: right.
481
:EPISODE 7 GWEN: Because we're
doing it in a consistent way.
482
:EPISODE 7 TONYA: Mm hmm.
483
:And what
484
:we have seen, just as an aside, is that
as we have gotten consistent with how
485
:we onboard individuals, it also has
streamlined the process of where people
486
:are as they start working with us, right?
487
:Everybody has a better experience because
we have standardized the onboarding.
488
:So, okay, so sort of to sum up here,
when we're talking about systems,
489
:we're really talking about harnessing
the power of consistent behavior
490
:because everybody has a system.
491
:You have systems even when you
don't think you do because systems
492
:really are consistent behaviors.
493
:And so you have helped us to
appreciate, well really it's been
494
:a mutual conversation I would say,
of how you identify your behaviors
495
:and it's really paying attention
to what you're doing day to day.
496
:Asking yourself a question.
497
:Why did I do that?
498
:What led me to do it now versus later?
499
:Um,
500
:as it is
501
:EPISODE 7 GWEN: doing it?
502
:Should I not be doing it?
503
:Yeah, it's, it's
504
:EPISODE 7 TONYA: Am I the
best person to be doing this?
505
:I think that was something you
506
:said
507
:EPISODE 7 GWEN: it?
508
:That's a great question to be asking.
509
:EPISODE 7 TONYA: Right?
510
:And then when you're clear that the things
that you're doing actually are the right
511
:things in the right order to get yourself
to the goals that you have set, then you
512
:come in and you start writing them down.
513
:Because that, those are the things
you want to make sure you, you
514
:check every box each and every time.
515
:And as far as the best way to document
them, that's really between you and
516
:your own brain and how it's wired.
517
:If you're a pen and paper person, yay you.
518
:Checklist person, yay you.
519
:Project management system, yay you.
520
:You know, for your purposes, Gwen,
I don't think I've ever heard you
521
:tell somebody, you know, to the
granular level of Notion versus
522
:Trello versus Asana versus whatever.
523
:It's like, you do you.
524
:Am I right?
525
:Am I talking to the school here?
526
:Okay.
527
:And then
528
:EPISODE 7 GWEN: And, and
529
:that's a really important piece
because often people think the
530
:tool will create the system.
531
:EPISODE 7 TONYA: yes,
I cannot tell you how
532
:often, how often people have said
like, Oh, if you would just use
533
:Notion, you wouldn't have that problem.
534
:No, cause I'm still me.
535
:This is a me problem.
536
:It's been a me problem since I could walk.
537
:It will continue to be a me problem and
they will never invent a tool that will
538
:outsmart me because I, I am committed
to certain aspects of how I do things.
539
:So yes, so it's not Notion,
it's not ClickUp, it's not
540
:whatever, it's just how I operate.
541
:EPISODE 7 GWEN: Yes.
542
:EPISODE 7 TONYA: And, you know, one
of the things that you pointed out
543
:is We have to identify and understand
our behavior patterns because we need
544
:to be really aware of the things we
don't realize we're doing that are
545
:secretly sabotaging our success.
546
:And you know, you pointed out it's
that flexibility, that hunger for
547
:flexibility and freedom oftentimes can
be our worst enemy when it comes to
548
:growing our business because that's
what gets in the way of us being
549
:willing to commit to a written list
of this is how we do things here.
550
:Have I left anything out?
551
:EPISODE 7 GWEN: the, yeah.
552
:And the real key about that is when you
are no longer using your brain power to
553
:be making what I'm going to call everyday
decisions, now they may not be every
554
:day, but they're, recurring decisions.
555
:You're actually freeing up your
brain power and that choice
556
:possibility for really doing the
creative work of the business.
557
:You can't explain it until
someone has experienced it.
558
:When all of a sudden they're like, I
have so much more time to think about
559
:this, or I came up with this great idea
that I would have never Yes, that's
560
:right, because you were spending way
too much time trying to figure out A
561
:or B, A or B, A or B, A or B, when you
know it's A 95 percent of the time,
562
:and when it's B, it's okay if it's A.
563
:So just, just standardize on A.
564
:A's gonna be fine.
565
:Yeah.
566
:EPISODE 7 TONYA: Yeah.
567
:Okay.
568
:So, um, now, you know, I want to
turn this over to our listeners.
569
:Like, I am curious, am I the
only person who this perspective
570
:on systems, like, am I the only
person whose mind's blown by this?
571
:Because honestly, I've never
heard it discussed this way.
572
:And so I'm glad that we were able to
have the conversation in public view.
573
:Uh, and I'm curious if you're listening,
like, what unconscious behaviors Do you
574
:now recognize are affecting your business?
575
:And I want you to let me know.
576
:So email me at tonya, T O N
Y A at everydayeffectiveness.
577
:com to tell me your story and help
inform future episodes of the show.
578
:Because that's really, I think
what makes this conversation about
579
:the business you really want so
powerful is the ability to have those
580
:real time relevant conversations.
581
:So until next time, we will see you soon.