Shownotes
Transcripts
What is happening, everybody? I'm Larry Roberts.
Sara Lohse [:And I'm Sara Lohse. And this is Branded. Your comprehensive guide for creative branding .
Larry Roberts [:On this anniversary ish, kinda, maybe sort of not really ish. We thought it'd be kind of cool to take a look back at the last year that we've spent creating this podcast.
Sara Lohse [:Podcast we originally launched last June. I think it was like the 13th. So we're a little bit late. I think this is gonna come out on July 2. So we're like two weeks late. But better late than never, man.
Larry Roberts [:In some instances, two weeks late is pretty scary, but in this instance, it's not that big a deal. So everything's fine. Oh, man. But yeah, it's been fun. Not just, it's been fun in looking back at our episodes. And it's kind of funny because this is going to be, I'm doing another podcast tonight, and it's also going to be a retrospective. Not a branded, but of another series that's out there. And it's kind of funny to sit and think that I'm doing two retrospectives in one day.
Larry Roberts [:But I was looking back at some of the episodes that we recorded over the last year and two weeks. And, man, we have covered a ton of stuff.
Sara Lohse [:Yeah, we've talked about so much. It's. We're actually kind of been hitting that, like, what can we possibly talk about next kind of wall? But we still find things, which is good. And I like being able to, as we go, we kind of started broad and now we're able to really dive deeper into specific topics. So, like, getting more specific as we go has been a lot of fun.
Larry Roberts [:Yeah, I mean, I personally didn't even remember that we had covered so much variety and diversity in the topics. I mean, we've covered everything from this one. Got me taxes as an entrepreneur.
Sara Lohse [:Shout out to PT.
Larry Roberts [:Heck, yeah, man. For sure, PT is the man. I was talking about him this morning, as a matter of fact. Needed connecting with someone that I met. But everything from taxes to basic entrepreneurship to finding your voice, to finding your audience, and I mean, so much in between and such a wide variety, although limited. And I think we're going to be moving more into this realm. But we've had some really amazing guests, too.
Sara Lohse [:Yeah, I was just thinking about that before because, I mean, we want to look back at previous episodes and what we've done over the last year. And the first thing that I thought of was the first time we brought a guest on the show. It was, I want to say Danielle Lewis was our first guest. She talked about. She was the. She was a designer, and she talked about brand design elements, and I don't think it made the show. I think we took it out, but when we opened the show, we had no idea what we were doing because we hadn't interviewed someone together. So it was just like, what's happening, everybody? I'm Leah Roberts.
Sara Lohse [:And I'm Sara Lohse. And this is Brand. And then we kind of just stopped because we just like that.
Larry Roberts [:As a matter of fact.
Sara Lohse [:Yes. We're like, which of us is supposed to introduce her? Like, what are we supposed to say? We had no idea. Thankfully, she's a friend of mine, and she. She laughed at it, and we didn't look like complete, just novices in front of, like, people who all. Who are better than us.
Larry Roberts [:Well, I think that's. I think that's a great point because, you know, we're both experienced podcasters in our own right, but we teamed up to do this podcast, and we haven't done. At the time, we hadn't done much speaking together or consulting together, or we hadn't done a lot of anything together.
Sara Lohse [:Yeah. This was our first, like, project together.
Larry Roberts [:Yeah. Yeah.
Sara Lohse [:Huh. And it's actually funny because I had done podcasting before, but I had been on the production side, or I had been on the guest side, but this is actually the first time I've ever been the interviewer.
Larry Roberts [:Yeah. And that. That's a totally different spin, you know? And I think a lot of people miss that. They miss that. Just that fact that it's so different being the interviewer as compared to being the storyteller. You know what I mean? Being the guest on a podcast. Totally different approach than being the one that's leading the dance.
Sara Lohse [:Yeah, it was. I mean, clearly it took, like, some getting used to, because the first time, we just didn't say words. Just, is it my turn or your turn? Who's supposed to talk?
Larry Roberts [:But we still run into that today. I mean, because it's so funny, because, you know, I try to make sure that I don't dominate a conversation, which I tend to do inadvertently every time I have a conversation. So I'll pause and I'll kind of peek at you on the monitor. I'll be like, it's for you, girl. Here's a softball. And sometimes you'll hit, you know, you'll hit a home run. You'll just. But other times, you look at me like, I don't want to talk right now.
Larry Roberts [:And I'm like, oh, okay, I got that. And all of this is happening within milliseconds, you know what I mean?
Sara Lohse [:Yeah. No, I feel like sometimes, though, you almost do that too much, and then I feel like I'm talking too much.
Larry Roberts [:Well, it. Prime example, yesterday we had a client call, right? And this was a young lady that I met last weekend at an event where I was speaking, and she bought our podcast launch workbook. And you being a co author, I wanted you to meet with her as well and get to know her because she bought one of our products. And, I mean, that's just, you know, it'd be kind of cool. And yesterday, you did most of the talking on that call because I was sitting here going, okay, I wanted her to be involved. I want to include her. I don't want to talk over. I don't want to dominate the conversation.
Larry Roberts [:So I just sat there and you ran with most everything, and it's.
Sara Lohse [:That's not true. I feel like you would answer it, and then I would answer it after.
Larry Roberts [:Maybe that's more it. I'll say that. I'll say it from this perspective, then. I am paranoid that I do that. How's that? Is that fair?
Sara Lohse [:Yeah, no, I feel. Yeah, in that case, it's like we both kind of answered, but we have different answers.
Larry Roberts [:Yeah.
Sara Lohse [:So it's like, I would let you answer, but then I would answer it again.
Larry Roberts [:And again. You know, it's funny, when we. When we meet people and we tell them about the show, that's one of the key points that I reinforce with potential new listeners is you get me, the middle aged white dude, and you get you the very young and vivacious and engaged youth on the opposite end.
Sara Lohse [:I am the youth.
Larry Roberts [:Yeah, you're the youth gone wild. So it's amazing. You've gone mild, but it's interesting to have that perspective, and it's fun to see that actually come out in the podcast episodes themselves.
Sara Lohse [:Yeah. I think my. Some of my favorite moments have been the ones where we don't agree on things.
Larry Roberts [:Well, yeah, because we tread lightly there.
Sara Lohse [:But no, like, things that are, like, relevant. I mean, we don't. We don't talk about the things we don't agree with. Non branding related, but even the things like branding related that we don't agree with. I remember the one time I left you completely speechless.
Larry Roberts [:Uh oh.
Sara Lohse [:That was. That is a highlight for me because it's not easy to do.
Larry Roberts [:No, it's not. And help me remember, because obviously I blocked those out because those are bad memories for me.
Sara Lohse [:So it was, we were talking about the different elements of a brand, and I was talking about brand experience. So what do people experience when they interact with your brand? And I said that this is something that's not fully in your control. And you disagreed because of there was some book by a Navy Seal or something.
Larry Roberts [:Extreme ownership by Jeff.
Sara Lohse [:Yes. So you always are in control of your brand. You never let it out of your sight, basically. And that's not possible when it comes to personal branding, because your brand can be places that you're not. So the example that I gave was if you're driving, like, down the road and you get rear ended by a U Haul truck, you're gonna have kind of a negative feeling towards U Haul. But U Haul wasn't even involved. The person driving does not work for U Haul. They just borrowed the truck.
Sara Lohse [:They just paid to use it. But still, if you have to move, you need to rent a truck. You're probably gonna go to, like, Penske instead of u Haul, because the last time you saw a U Haul, it was driving into your cardinal.
Larry Roberts [:Well, and the one thing that's going to happen there, too, is if you end up suing someone, you're going to end up suing U Haul as well. You know, not just the driver, but there's going to be some. Some legal repercussions for U Haul because you can bet they're going to hire investigator.
Sara Lohse [:They're going to look over that paperwork.
Larry Roberts [:It's. Yeah, it's in there. So you can bet, though, and you made a very, very valid point, you know, and the flip side of that is, is that I still believe that you're fully responsible for your brand. You're fully responsible for your brand messaging. Now, what people do with that messaging, sure, that's out of your control, and you don't have control of some of the context that your brand appears in. But, I mean, I have to own this red hat all the time, you know, and there's some negative connotations that go with red hats. For some odd reason, I can't figure it out. But, I mean, again, imagine even this past weekend, someone, when I was at that writer's symposium, helping people write their book, one of the ladies, I was going down to the elevator, and she rode the elevator.
Larry Roberts [:Me. She goes, so is the red hat an homage to the big red hat? And I was like, what? She's like, yeah, you're a manga. I was like, no, I'm not. It has nothing to do with politics. It has nothing to do with anything.
Sara Lohse [:But that's Alex.
Larry Roberts [:It's funny you said Alex. He literally just texted me. But, but, but, yeah, there's. There's still context and contextual applications of your brand that you can't control, but your messaging and your ideation of your brand and your brand values and your core values and the way that you conduct yourself and your business and how you reflect that in your brand that is within your control.
Sara Lohse [:So, yes, it's the experience piece that isn't. Because you can't. You can't control how people experience your brand.
Larry Roberts [:Exactly.
Sara Lohse [:Even if you're acting the way that you, like, want people to see you as they might still just. You're not their cup of tea.
Larry Roberts [:Yeah, yeah.
Sara Lohse [:And they might have a negative experience just with you being yourself. And that happens with me a lot. I'm sure I am an acquired taste.
Larry Roberts [:It definitely happens with me a lot. I can promise you that.
Sara Lohse [:But what for you is like, the most memorable part?
Larry Roberts [:Probably one of my favorite episodes is when we did the, what was it? Brands against humanity. I think the episode, yeah, it goes back a ways. But we talked about a couple of our favorite brands. Yours was cards against humanity. Mine is still Lego. You know, I love, I love, I love, I love legos. Yeah, well, you know, it is what it is. So there's no, there's no shame in my Lego game, baby, I'll tell you that right now.
Larry Roberts [:So. But I thought that was a really, really fun episode because we took some existing brands that are out there and help people understand, at least from our perspective, what we took from those brands. And it's super interesting to see that different individuals can, and this goes kind of go back to what we were just saying just a second ago, different individuals will read brands differently.
Sara Lohse [:Yeah, that one was interesting because I always talk, like, with my brand, I want everything to be very positive and kind and good and everything. And then the brand that I chose is one of my favorites is cars against humanity, which seems like it just doesn't fit. But you have to actually look on the surface it doesn't. But behind the scenes it really does, because they do follow the same types of values and everything that they do, they're doing for good. They just do it in a way that they know their audience and they give their audience what they want so that they can then take the proceeds and do good with it. I love that brand. I stand by it.
Larry Roberts [:Well, Doug, on it. I stand by legos, too.
Sara Lohse [:I said what I said, and a year later, you just spent your whole weekend building legos?
Larry Roberts [:Yeah, I mean, I did. I said last weekend, I went, it was weekend before last that I did that writer symposium, but this past weekend, I literally spent all weekend building my latest Batman Lego set. And since we've done that interview, or not that interview, since we recorded that episode, Legos evolved a little bit, you know, even in just the last year. And I. It's interesting to see the evolution of their brand. Traditionally, you look at Lego and it's very colorful and it's very playful and it's very child oriented. But a study was released recently where it shows that middle aged adults are the largest toy buyers. Whether they're buying them for themselves or they're buying them for their children, they're their key market.
Sara Lohse [:And I feel like we should have known that because kids can't buy things.
Larry Roberts [:But they still market kids. But traditionally, toys are marketed to kids. So kids wear out the parents, so the parents buy the toy. But now it's gotten to where you got a lot of adults that buy a lot of toys and they're not for the kids.
Sara Lohse [:So Lego different kind of toy?
Larry Roberts [:No, that's definitely not a. Not that kind of toy. Sarah probably don't want to use a Lego one, but. But they actually have a slogan now. Adults welcome.
Sara Lohse [:Oh, that's cute.
Larry Roberts [:And they change their packaging for the more advanced kits. If you look at the high Lego count kits that are like 2000 pieces and above, most of that packaging is done in a very sophisticated manner. They're black boxes with more of an embossed type backdrop in place that really highlights the theme of the packaging. If you look at anything that, again, 2000 character are not character, character. I'm launching a podcast, 2000 pieces or above. It's packaged in a way that's more appealing to adults. It's not very colorful. It shows the product itself and shows some of the cool features of the products themselves.
Larry Roberts [:But everything else is black and almost elegant to a degree.
Sara Lohse [:Well, they've actually. Now they're coming out with Lego flowers and home decorous.
Larry Roberts [:Yep, yep. 100%. I mean, if you look at that, the Titanic, there is the, you can actually buy a Lego kit of the Titanic. And it's one of the largest kits that's out there. It's like 7000 plus pieces.
Sara Lohse [:Is it pre or post crash?
Larry Roberts [:It's before the crash, but it's also designed in a way that you can break it in the middle. I'm not kidding. It's also designed so that connects together so you can actually kind of put it in a sunken position if you wanted to. That's the way they've built it. That way. Uh, but you look at that and it's. It's done as part of. It's in their art section.
Larry Roberts [:If you go to the Lego website, there is an art section. And these types of pieces are under their art section. And they've got paintings, they've got Rembrandts, they've got everything that you can imagine as a Lego for an adult type set. So it's interesting to see how the evolution their brand has taken place over the last year or so as well.
Sara Lohse [:And they still haven't sponsored us.
Larry Roberts [:Nope. Nope. Still, I wish they would because these freaking kits are a little pricey. Yeah.
Sara Lohse [:Dibs on the Harry Potter ones, guys. Send them over.
Larry Roberts [:There are some really cool Harry Potter ones. The Harry Potter ones are some bigger ones. Yeah, those are some good sets.
Sara Lohse [:I would not have the attention span.
Larry Roberts [:Oh, man. It takes me time to. Interesting. And one thing I have to say, too, and we're getting way off this.
Sara Lohse [:Turned into the Lego episode.
Larry Roberts [:But this, this one kit that I just did was. It's new for 2024. It's a Batmande Gotham city from the Batman animated series. And it was over 4000 pieces. 4210, I think, is the total count. And it's the first Lego kit that I bought that has a high Lego count, that it wasn't missing a piece. All my other kits that I've put together have all missed at least one piece. And you have to go to the website now.
Larry Roberts [:You get the piece for free. You get a replacement piece and they ship it to you. But it usually takes seven to ten days for it to get here. So if you're in the middle of your build and you're missing that one little. That one little plate that's got three little dots on it, that's all you need to put this in. You're stranded. And that kind of breaks your momentum a little bit.
Sara Lohse [:See, the last time I emailed a company because I was missing pieces to something, they're like, are you sure? It's like, of course I'm sure. And then I look again and no, I was not missing pieces. So now I'll just like, never, like, never ask for pieces of anything. I'm like, I'm just going to assume I lost them. This is my fault. I'm so sorry. I'm just going to. I'll duct tape it.
Sara Lohse [:It's fine.
Larry Roberts [:Well, it's so bad that I assumed because I was putting it together and I was about halfway through and I was looking for a piece. I couldn't find it. I don't see it anywhere. And I looked and I looked and I went piece by piece by piece by piece. Could not find this one little piece. And I went to the website, I ordered the replacement piece because I just figured this is the one piece that's missing. And after I was on with customer service and I got the piece ordered and I went back into my other desk and I looked down and right there, sitting there, right, just, just talking to me, going, hey look, I'm right here, buddy. Haha.
Larry Roberts [:So yeah, it was, it was something. But anyways, I just love, I love Lego. I love what they do. I love the, just the, you know, I said something the other day, I said it's mindless fun and it's really not mindless fun, it's, it's really creative fun because you have to follow instructions. If you're building something right, you're following an instruction book and looking for specific pieces and putting it together in a specific way. And if you don't follow the instructions, you find out you have to disassemble it, re put it back together. And I'm going off on a crazy tangent here.
Sara Lohse [:This episode is brought to you by.
Larry Roberts [:L E G O Lego.
Sara Lohse [:We should really reach out to them.
Larry Roberts [:Yeah, it would be fun. I mean, I think our branding fits some of their marketing as well.
Sara Lohse [:It's colorful, it's not sophisticated. So we'd have to be their children sets. But it's fine.
Larry Roberts [:We can brush it up. And that's interesting that we talk about that because we look at the branded branding and then we look at my branding. And again, we've talked about this before on some of the other episodes where I tend to kind of want to take my branding to a little more sophisticated level. You know, I want to have that refinement in place. And we've even labeled it as a corporate look. And then we come over here and branded as very pastel and very bubbly and very pink and very everything that.
Sara Lohse [:Is like retro ish.
Larry Roberts [:Kind of retro ish. Yeah. And it's fun. I love it. I love, you know, if you look at the chat bubbles, you can see they're colored in. It looks like they're covered in with markers and you can see little marker streaks there. And I mean, it's just, it's a really, really cool brand, but it's typically the direct opposite of what I do for red hat media branding, so.
Sara Lohse [:Okay, well, we've been doing this for a year and you've been dealing with my branding choices for a year. Is there anything that you would change?
Larry Roberts [:Well, no, of course not. I wouldn't change a thing. I love everything about not a. No, I wouldn't know.
Sara Lohse [:Correct answer.
Larry Roberts [:Nope, nope, not changing. I think it's amazing. I think we need more chat bubbles.
Sara Lohse [:And maybe some different, brighter pink.
Larry Roberts [:Yeah, some brighter pink, some different shades of pinkenhouse pink. Yeah, I think that'd be amazing. And actually, though, no, I honestly I wouldn't, because it is. It is the brand that it is and it's the brand that works for us. And so, no, I wouldn't change anything. I really do love the branding. People that see it love the branding so it resonates with our particular audience. So it works for what it is.
Larry Roberts [:Now, what if for some reason we went our separate ways? And would I with me? Not at all. No, no, not at all. But, yeah, there's just no chance that I would use something like this myself. Right. I mean, it's just, it's just not a Larry vibe. So it's kind of interesting to be a part of something that is so polar opposite of anything that I would do with my own branding.
Sara Lohse [:I don't feel that way. This is very me. I wonder why. Who designed it? Oh, this is a mystery.
Larry Roberts [:It's strange.
Sara Lohse [:It's interesting too, though. Like looking back over the past year, I feel like our branding for the, for branded has been pretty steady. But in the meantime, our branding for our personal companies have, like, things have changed a lot.
Larry Roberts [:Oh, yeah.
Sara Lohse [:Like on the other side, like, it's hard. You don't really see it here because we have stayed. I think we changed our tagline from building brands through podcasts to building brands that stick. But other than that, everything has kind of stayed the same. But my entire company has changed directions. Yours has changed a lot. Like leaning more heavily into AI. Mine has leaned more heavily into like, stories and thought leadership coaching than more full service marketing.
Larry Roberts [:Yes. Yeah.
Sara Lohse [:Even though I still have some full service clients, but it's more so on the story part and. But here everything, it just stays the same.
Larry Roberts [:Yeah. And I don't know, I won't say it's by design. I think it just works. I think we found broke.
Sara Lohse [:Don't fix it.
Larry Roberts [:Yeah, exactly. And it definitely works for us. But it's also interesting because our companies, you know, when we met, there was a lot of overlap there and a lot of the overlap we absorbed into branded and we, you know, with podcasts and podcast monetization and podcast audits and everything we offer from a podcast perspective was absorbed by branded. And then we have our own individual offerings that we present as well. Again, like you said, a lot of AI on my side, a lot of storytelling and coaching on your side. And those don't necessarily fit under the branded umbrella. You know, branded. If you look at branded, you don't go, well, that looks like an AI brand.
Larry Roberts [:You know what I mean?
Sara Lohse [:No, yeah, it definitely does not. And if you look at yours, it does not look like storytelling.
Larry Roberts [:No, no, it looks. I don't know what it looks like, but it. It looks like techy. It looks very techy.
Sara Lohse [:Yeah, definitely like high class tech.
Larry Roberts [:High class tech. I like that. That's kind of cool.
Sara Lohse [:Yeah.
Larry Roberts [:I had somebody look at my website this morning and he goes, dude, yeah, your website looks, I mean, it's as good as any other website out there. And I'm like, that sounds like a backhanded compliment of some sort.
Sara Lohse [:It's like, you look great for your age.
Larry Roberts [:Yeah. Then he proceeded to tell me all the things I needed to fix, and I was like, oh, okay. I can kind of see it. So, no, he made some really valid points. So it was. It was good having that conversation. But anyway, you know, it's been amazing over the last year, growing together in branded with branded and growing together with our audience and delivering, hopefully value with each and every episode. And I don't know about you, Sarah, but I'm looking forward to another year doing the same thing.
Sara Lohse [:No, I'm good.
Larry Roberts [:Cool. All right, well, we appreciate you guys listening up to this point. Be sure to check out our back catalog because there is no future catalog, so nothing in the pipeline.
Sara Lohse [:It's been fun, but, you know, everything has to. All good things must come to an end. Just kidding. No, I'm stuck. You're stuck with me. And, you know, it is okay outside of legos.
Larry Roberts [:Yeah.
Sara Lohse [:What is something else that you've learned about branding? Because, I mean, I learned through our conversations and through researching our topics and everything. So what is, like, the biggest thing that you learned that is not Lego related?
Larry Roberts [:Yeah, that's not Lego related is the brand values. You know, having a brand is great. Having services and products are great. But how are you delivering the message of the value that your brand provides and the value of the goods and services that you provide? Too many times we get caught up in the prettiness of the brand and the tagline of the brand and all this stuff, but we don't convey the message of what the value is. If a customer engages with us, if a client engages with us. So what is the value proposition there and the value in the brand? That's the biggest lesson that I've learned.
Sara Lohse [:That's interesting. And brand in that kind of context. It can almost mean two things, too, though, because you're talking about, first you said brand values, and, like, brand values are the values, like the ideals that your brand upholds and like, how you will conduct yourself, how you conduct business, and then there's the value that your brand provides.
Larry Roberts [:Yeah, yeah, I was going option b there because, yeah, you know, I don't get caught up in the values. Just do whatever it takes to make some money. You know, whatever it is, man.
Sara Lohse [:I'll check. Scratch the same.
Larry Roberts [:It's all green, baby. It's all green. So. No, I'm kidding, but no, I was definitely leaning more towards the value. That's awesome.
Sara Lohse [:Yeah. And those are both things that we've talked about. I have learned way more about AI that I would have liked to.
Larry Roberts [:You and me both, sister.
Sara Lohse [:I have done, like, I've almost done talks on AI. I had someone, oh, God, it was an awful, awful event, but it was just like a networking event that was just God awful. But the guy, I said that my business partner does a lot in the AI space and is a thought leader in AI. So then he kept kicking me under the table, saying, like, talk about AI. Bring up AI. Like a, no, b, your event, you do it. So eventually I'm just like, he just bring it up. So I brought it up and he's like, okay, cool, so what about it? And then just put me on the spot and I had to talk about AI, and I'm pretty sure at that point I sound like an idiot.
Sara Lohse [:This was a while ago, and you've talked more about it since, so I've learned some stuff, but, like, I now could actually speak almost intelligently.
Larry Roberts [:Yeah.
Sara Lohse [:Or artificially intelligently about AI, because I'm really, I don't know it. I'm just kind of just repeating things. I hear you say I'm like a parrot.
Larry Roberts [:Yeah.
Sara Lohse [:But I. I think I definitely have learned more about it than I thought I would.
Larry Roberts [:Yeah, it's, it's good. It's good. At least you got some value out of this time together.
Sara Lohse [:I mean, had to get something.
Larry Roberts [:Yeah, 100%. So, man, and on that note, I. I mean, hopefully everybody that's listening got value out of, out of the episodes that we've, we've given you. So far. I mean, we're up to, I don't know. What's the episode number? 54, 55, 50 something. 50 something episodes back there. And if you go back, there is a ton of amazing content, a lot of great guests, a lot of great insight.
Larry Roberts [:Go back, check it out, man. And hopefully you found some value in this episode as we took that walk down memory Lane and enjoyed the time together.
Sara Lohse [:Memory Lane is paved with legos.
Larry Roberts [:Wow. That's a rough walk.
Sara Lohse [:Follow the Lego brick road.
Larry Roberts [:All right. With that, do us a favor. Subscribe to the show so we can bring you these very insightful and fun episodes each and every week. And with that, I'm Larry Roberts, and I'm sorry, Lindsay.
Sara Lohse [:We'll talk to you next week.
