Higher Powered Personal Eschatology Jessica Morris part 1

Join Pastor Bob Thibodeau as he welcomes Jessica Morris, a remarkable author and spiritual director, to discuss her transformative journey and her book, "Higher Power: One Woman's Journey of Personal Eschatology." Jessica shares her powerful narrative of overcoming addiction and trauma, illustrating how her faith led her to healing and purpose. Central to the conversation is the concept of personal eschatology, which redefines spiritual transformation by emphasizing the significance of individual experiences with God. As Jessica recounts her moments of desperation and divine intervention, listeners are invited to reflect on their own journeys and potential for change. This insightful discussion not only offers hope but also encourages a deeper connection with faith and recovery.

Takeaways:

• Jessica Morris's journey from addiction to recovery illustrates the transformative power of faith and personal introspection.
• The concept of personal eschatology invites individuals to rethink their spiritual transformations, focusing on current experiences rather than distant future events.
• Pastor Bob's story parallels Jessica's, highlighting the common struggle of overcoming personal demons and finding redemption.
• Jessica emphasizes the importance of recognizing pivotal moments in life that redirect one's path towards healing and purpose.
• The dialogue around addiction recovery in this episode sheds light on the necessity of community and support in the healing process.
• Both guests share that a close relationship with God is essential for maintaining sobriety and transforming one's life.

CONTACT INFORMATION: 

Email:  jessica_l_morris@comcast.net

Website:  https://jessicalmorris.com

Book: Higher Powered: One Woman's Journey of Personal Eschatology – on Amazon

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Welcome to the Kingdom Crossroads Podcast with Pastor Bob Thibodeau.

Pastor Bob conducts personal interviews with Christian influencers from around the globe, helping Christian authors, recording artists, CEOs, entrepreneurs, non profit leaders, and yes, pastors and ministry leaders to get the word out about what they are doing to impact the world with the gospel.

Our podcast has been rated in the top 1/2% of all podcasts in the world by ListenNotes.com so you know your message will be heard.

Now here is your host with today's interview, Pastor Bob Thibodeau.

Hello everyone everywhere.

Pastor Bob Thibodeau here.

Welcome to the Kingdom Crossroads podcast.

Today we're so blessed that you're joining us.

What if the end of your world as you know it, isn't something to fear, but actually a doorway of sorts to a truly transformative, deeply personal journey with God?

What would that be like?

How would that make you feel?

Would you be willing to risk it all if you believe this is how you were being led to serve God?

Well, that's the type of transformational questions our guest had to answer.

And I believe that her quest in answering these types of questions will help you to grow as well.

Amen.

Today I'm honored to welcome Jessica Morris, a remarkable author and spiritual director, to discuss her book Higher One Woman's Journey of Personal Eschatology.

Jessica's story is one of profound transformation, to say the least, from battling addiction and trauma to finding healing and purpose through her faith.

In her book Higher Power, she explores the concept of what she termed personal eschatology, weaving her journey with powerful biblical narratives to help explain this for us.

Join us now as we dive into her inspiring experiences, her unique perspective on faith and recovery, and the life changing message she hopes to share.

With that being said, help me welcome to the program Jessica Morris.

Jessica, thank you for taking the time to come on the program and share with our audience.

I do appreciate it so much.

Well, thank you, Pastor.

What a wonderful, wonderful intro that you just summed it up.

Great stuff.

Well, the first question I always start with is this.

Other than that brief information I just shared, can you tell us in your own words, who is Jessica Morris?

Sure, yes.

I think most importantly for the audience to know is that I did grow up in a.

I was a preacher's kid and so my dad was a United Methodist minister and I'm the youngest of four children that he and my mom had.

And I was a.

I was told early on in my life that I was a mistake in that family.

And so that was my original thought of father daughter relationship and because he was the one who told me that.

And so he was also a minister.

And that made me have a very weird idea of what God was.

Interestingly enough though.

And I think, you know, part of it due to my mother's faith in Jesus, part of it due to the Sunday school teachers that I had, because of course, you know, I was in Sunday school every week.

You know, when your dad's the minister, you're at the church pretty much all the time growing up.

And I really fell in love with Jesus very young.

And part of that had to do with the fact that in a really weird way, I looked at him as being the abused son, you know, in a very odd way that, you know, God did this to him.

You know, it wasn't that Jesus offered himself, you know, it was that God sent him here to be punished by the world.

And.

But while that sounds perverse, it always kept me connected to, to, to God.

You know, even though I didn't make that connection all the time, I never ever became atheistic or even agnostic.

Like I knew there was, I always knew there was a God.

Even when I left the church, when I went to college, I pretty much, you know, turned my face from the church and said, organized religion is stupid.

I'm out of here.

Um, you know, look who God puts in charge.

And, you know, I would point to my dad.

And so, so that was, you know, and everything that I was angry at my father for growing up, I became in my own addiction, you know, and denial is a very powerful, powerful tool that the devil uses.

And you know, for a long time I, I just said, well, I'm just having fun.

My dad was a jerk.

I'm having fun.

You know, like, I would always do that sort.

But, you know, you can only do that for so long.

And when God continued to poke at me and poke at me and poke at me, it, it really came to a place of desperation when I was 29 years old where I, I just, it was either and, and I had attempted, not attempt.

I had had suicide thoughts, suicidal thoughts for probably about 10 years.

It started sometime when I was in high school.

I remember being in the bathroom in my, where we lived when I was in high school the first time I really thought about it.

And at that point, you know, I had a, I had a plan.

And then I thought of my big sister, my older sister who practically raised me.

And I thought, you know, if I do this, she's.

This is going to kill her.

Now, of course, that's really egotistic at the time, but my ego saved me at that point.

And then it was the last time I remember thinking of.

It was about a year before I got into recovery.

I had adopted a cat.

And it really was just me and her.

And I was serious.

The pills were ready.

Everything.

I was ready to go.

And she pretty much pranced her little furry butt into the room.

And I know that animals don't talk to people, but she basically said to me, who do you think you are?

You know, I need you.

And I had enough.

And I remember my sister once telling me that she thinks that cat changed me.

And she's right, because I did.

I.

Look, I never again thought about it.

Never again thought about it.

That last year, though, before I get into recovery, was the.

Probably the most desperate of my life because I knew I was stuck here now, you know, like, there was no out for me.

And thankfully, I had a counselor who pointed me towards recovery.

She.

She said, you have a lot of work to do on yourself, but until you get this addiction stuff under control, nothing's going to take because it's always going to be in the way.

And she was absolutely right.

And so recovery brought me to where I could go to seminary.

And, I mean, gosh, there's just so much I could say about that.

But we'll talk about it, I'm sure.

Oh, yeah.

As you're going through this, you know, it.

So many similarities between my story.

You know, I was brought up in church.

My grandmother was a church secretary, so we were there all the time as well.

My grandfather was a deacon and all that, and we were in the Lutheran church.

So we were there, you know, Sundays, Wednesday, Sunday night, you know, all the.

All the time.

And, you know, then, you know, my dad was an alcoholic, so, you know, I was brought up in that, and he'd been.

My mother died when I was 18 months old giving birth to my brother, who died 28 days later.

And, you know, so I was basically raised by my grandparents.

My dad was in and out of prison, you know, married four times and all that stuff.

And.

And I swore, you know, growing up that I was never going to drink.

I was only going to be married one time, and that's it, you know, and, you know, all this stuff.

And, you know, being in the military, started doing what military people do.

And, you know, we.

My wife and I got in a big argument one night and ended up.

The neighbors had called mps and all this stuff.

And.

And so I was arrested and put down in the slammer to my unit could come pick me up.

And when they close that door, I'm like drunk.

And I was an alcoholic.

I mean by that time, drunk and alcoholic, I'm on the verge of a divorce.

And because he was in prison all his life, I was like, I'm never going to go to jail, I'm not going to drink, never get divorced, I'll never go to jail.

Here I am in jail, on the verge of a divorce, drunk, alcoholic.

I said the three things I said I'd never do.

Here they are.

And that was a wake up call.

Well, we've been married.

We just celebrated our 47th wedding anniversary and it's been.

And that's a story, all of us out because God delivered me from it.

And I didn't know what had happened.

I went six months and didn't even realize I had never had a drink.

Wow.

But you know, all these things, you know, as I was going through your story, I was like, wow, yeah, I'm checking the boxes.

Yeah, yeah.

Now the suicide, I mean, I was there as well, you know, and when, matter of fact, the night I got born again was, I was going to commit suicide and direct intervention by God, a literal intervention by God stopped it.

And but you know, so it was just so amazing, your story.

And that's what I think was really drawn me into this.

Now let's go back to the beginning for a minute.

In your journey from battling addictions to becoming an author and a spiritual director, what pivotal moment led you to pursue, of all things, a study of theology, especially in the spiritual direction?

Yeah.

Oh boy.

Well, God actually.

God has a sense of humor.

Yes, it certainly, absolutely does.

It actually started there were two moments, one where I ran away and one where I turned back.

And the one where I ran away, I speak about in the book as ground zero, which is, you know, I was outside of a party, it was after college and I won't get into all the details, but I had a moment where I was yelling at God.

I, I was looking up at the sky and yelling at God.

I was all by myself and telling him what for and how stupid he was and you know, when is it my turn, all that kind of stuff.

Very self pitying victimhood.

You and Jesus came to me and I know with every ounce of my being that he was there to my left.

I was, you know, looking forward, you know, looking up at the sky.

And I knew I could feel him on my left.

To this day, I still have a Very warm feeling on my left side when I talk about this.

And I knew if I turned to my left, he would be there.

And it scared me to death.

And I ran back into the party.

Like, I turned from him.

The party was off to my right, and I ran back into the party.

That was about six years before I found recovery.

And those six years are what I would reference as my personal living hell, my personal weeping and gnashing of teeth because I had turned my back from his coming to me.

He came to me that night, which, when I was in seminary, I recognized was his second coming to me.

And that was the personal eschatology, where he said, I'm right here.

I'm.

You know, let's do this.

You know, it's time for you to let go of yourself, because yourself is not working.

And I didn't.

I.

I wasn't ready, let's say, or my disease wasn't ready.

Whichever it is, it doesn't matter.

I ran back into the party.

I spent a lot of time regretting that.

Like, I wish that I had turned and looked to him, because then I would have seen him, and I maybe could have hugged him, you know?

But I don't regret it anymore because I.

I really believe that those years needed to happen, and I needed to move to a new place from where I was living then to meet the counselor that I met after my first year of recovery, someone sent to an addictions counselor who never once said what his religion was.

He.

Because I don't.

In recovery, you don't really speak of outside issues so much as, like, you say, higher power in God, but that's pretty much where it ends.

Like, people don't say, I'm Jewish, I'm Christian, I'm this or that.

It's just.

We all have a higher power, and it's not us.

It's very clear.

Yeah.

You know, and so this counselor that I had was very much like that.

But he truly was Jesus in shoes.

In shoes and clothes.

I mean, he.

He very much knew how to connect with pretty much anyone in front of him, no matter where they were.

It was.

It was amazing to see him work with people.

He was calm and peaceful, and I needed to meet him in order to get rid of that childhood junk.

He was the one who helped me to.

To be able to really release that pain and to.

To release all of those diseased messages in my head that I had, that I either had created on my own or received from my dad, you know, and so he really encouraged me to follow My writing, you know, we did a lot of journal writing in my work with him, and he.

He encouraged that.

And there was a friend in recovery, an older man, real crotchety older guy, who I told that after a meeting one time, I was very proud of myself.

I told him I was writing a book about a serial killer.

I'm going to become a famous writer one day.

I'm going to have a bestseller.

I'm writing a book about a serial killer.

And he.

He was a war veteran.

He had a hat.

He wor the time, Korean, Vietnam War.

He was really a rough tumble kind of guy.

Had been in prison, you know, ministered to people in prison about the program, all that kind of stuff.

And he looked at me and his gravelly voice, he's like, what the f are you doing writing about a serial killer?

And I just looked at him like, how?

So offended.

How could he have said this to me?

And I said, well, I want to.

I want to make money off my writing.

And he goes, you need to write about something, you know, stop writing.

What do you know about being a serial killer?

And he told me to start writing about recovery.

And I did.

And I wrote.

And that's the year I went to seminary.

That's the year I decided I need to do this.

And I really.

I shouldn't say I decided because there were several years before that where God was pulling me towards it.

And I kept going, no, no, no.

My husband probably won't be happy with spending that money.

No, Like, I always had an excuse.

And then finally, I didn't hear it in my ear, but it came through me where God said, go to Moravian right now.

And the next day I called, and within two days, I was involved.

Wow.

Amen.

I mean, it just.

It had to happen.

You coined the term personal eschatology, as we led to in the introduction.

Can you elaborate on that term and how it redefines traditional views of spiritual transformation?

Oh, sure, sure.

Eschatology, for anyone who doesn't know, is the study of the end times.

So in.

In theological circles, there are different types of it.

Realized eschatology is.

It's happening now.

You know, the.

The Gospel of John is very much where people send you when you want to look at realized eschatology.

Because Jesus keeps saying, the time is now.

You know, it's happening right now.

You know, then there's apocalyptic eschatology, which is a revelation, sort of a future thing.

The book of Revelation is where you would go to look for that.

There's other places in the Bible where it talks, and there are lots of different ideas about those things.

Both of those.

Those two that I talk about in the book that I researched are for everyone.

Like, it's a sort of it's happening now for everyone or it's going to happen in the future for everyone.

The end of the way things are now is going to be, and then the new life, the peace is going to come, right?

And it's a promise, it's a revelation, it's a prophecy.

Some might say what happened to me was when I was learning these things in my Intro to New Testament class, I had this memory of Jesus coming to me that day or that night outside the party.

And I real.

I thought to myself, you know, all we talk about in this class is how Jesus spoke to people metaphorically, how he used story and.

And symbol to get his message across, and how a lot of people kind of didn't get it.

You know, they talk about how some people got it.

Even the disciples sometimes would come to him after a teaching and go, what were you talking about?

No idea what you were saying there.

And so people didn't often get it.

And it took a while.

And I thought, what if he actually meant it was going to be the end of my life as I knew it when he returned?

And I started to think about all the people that I've met in recovery and that I've heard tell their stories of transformation and how the person they were when they were living in their addiction is maybe still in there somewhere.

And if they pick up that drink or they pick up the cookie or they go gambling again, whatever it happens to be, that person will rear their ugly head again, right?

But that person, pretty much today in sobriety is gone.

It is a completely different way of looking at life, of living life, of receiving life.

And for me, I realized the Jessica who showed up at her first meeting of Recovery is not the Jessica of today.

In fact, the counselor who sent me to Recovery very soon after I got into recovery moved out of the area.

And I never really got to tell her, you know, how good things were going until I went to my first open house at the seminary.

And there she was here she had done a full circle, and she was a.

She was now in charge of the spiritual formation program at the seminary.

And I walked.

She had no idea who I was.

She couldn't put it.

I didn't remember because.

Well, she remembered once I told her, but she didn't see it in me because I was completely different.

I was changed.

Amen.

The life I knew was gone.

And the life I was living was one of peace.

Like, to have peace in my.

My addictions are food and alcohol, my main addictions.

And to have.

To have peace in my heart and to not think about food 24 7, because that.

That's my first memory of life.

Like my first memory of childhood is stealing food out of my family's cabinets.

And to not be thinking about food 24 7, that's a miracle.

That's is a complete alteration of my brain.

And that's not anything I did that.

I mean, I might have sh.

Like you said, I showed up and I did the work, but God's the one who changed my brain and changed my heart.

And I.

Anybody who doesn't believe, I say, look, I can't explain it to you, but I can tell you what I was like.

And people who knew me then can come up to you and say, yeah, there's a God.

Because this right here did not happen because she did it.

So that's.

That's the personal end of it.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Amen.

You know, when.

When I stopped drinking, I didn't know I'd stopped drinking.

And, you know, I mean, I was.

I could.

I could drink just about anybody under the table back then.

Yeah.

And one night I'll never forget, it was that week between Thanksgiving and the 1st of December.

Right.

Right.

In that area.

My wife and I.

Well, it was.

And we were out and not out, but we were out of alcohol.

Put it like that.

Oh, my wife and I were just sitting there watching the television.

I said, I feel like getting a drink.

I'm gonna go down to the liquor store, get a bottle and come back.

She's okay.

I got down there and now I've been born again already.

I was born again.

1992.

Right.

I was there.

I know what happened.

And.

Okay.

And so I went down to the liquor store and I'm looking at.

I don't know, it's not the.

Really in here.

Looking good.

So I got a little pint bottle of Jim Beam.

Now, I could do that by myself in about two drinks, two glasses.

And so I went back home, mixed up a drink, took about drink two or three sips.

I said, I'm just going to go to bed.

And went to bed.

Didn't think about it anymore.

May of the following year, we had a leak under the sink.

My wife said, there's a leak under here.

You know, everything's wet.

All right, so I'm pulling everything out so I can tighten up the loose fitting.

And there's that half full bottle of whiskey.

And I said, I have had a drink in six months.

I didn't even know I quit.

And then that bottle started talking.

I said, oh, right down the drain it went.

Never, you know, never had another one supernaturally delivered from an alcohol addiction and didn't even know it for six months.

Isn't that amazing?

Oh, but fast Forward to about 30 years later.

Our family went out to dinner at one of these steakhouses and stuff.

And there's no tables for us, so all the girls wanted.

We're in a little area they call the Avenue.

A lot like an old fashioned street.

You know, all the stores are on the street, not in the mall type thing.

Yeah.

And so they're gonna go just window shopping because they said it'd be about half hour before a table will be ready.

My son in law and I went up to the bar because there's no seats to sit in.

And I ordered a Coke.

You know, he, he ordered a drink, but I ordered a Coke and I had my arm up on the bar, a glass in my hand.

The atmosphere, the sound, the smells.

And that spirit came back and I was like, oh no.

I told myself, I gotta go outside.

I, I just gotta, I, I can't, I can't be in here because I just can't do it.

You know, that's the only time in all those years, the only time that spirit came back to try and make his way back and it didn't work.

I mean, I identified that thing right off the bat and said, no, I, I do not be, need to be in this environment.

And that's so.

Yeah.

And so I could relate to everything you're saying, you know, because it's, I mean, I'm getting goosebumps right now just thinking about how Jesus supernaturally delivered me from this stuff.

And.

Well, in such a gift that you.

I'm sorry, but that's such a.

I have to just point out what a gift that is for you that you were able to recognize that in the moment.

Oh yeah.

You know, because.

And, and I think I would attribute it to probably your daily walk with Jesus, you know that.

Absolutely.

That every day that's where you start and that's where you stay, you know, because when we're closest to him is when he's.

When it's easiest for him to protect us, you know, it's when we're far away that, you know, it's hard for us to hear the messages, you know, or when we've got something in between us.

And so when you were describing that, I was like my spiritual director hat came on, and I was like, whoa.

Like, this is.

Jesus is coming in here and just, like, putting a bubble around you, you know, because that old stuff does seem extremely inviting sometimes.

Oh, you know, like I said, I mean, I was in the environment.

I mean, I was reliving, you know, like.

Yeah, this.

Oh.

I mean, I was like, you know, I felt like, you know, Elijah, you know, when.

When he went, after he told Ahab, you know, it's not gonna rain till I say so.

Right.

Yeah.

And then, you know, God didn't pat him on the back, you know, say, good job, Elijah.

Kick back.

No, he said, run.

Yeah.

And that's what I felt in that moment.

I was like, no, Nope, nope.

I gotta get out of here.

Yeah.

And you followed.

What a wonderful thing.

You followed that intuition.

Hey, folks, we're out of time for this portion of this great interview with Jessica Morris.

I urge you, drop down into the show notes.

Click the links right there.

Order her book higher.

One Woman's Journey of Personal Eschatology.

I mean this.

Just consider how your own personal journey, like Jessica described, could lead to a personal awakening and a renewed sense of purpose in your life or your ministry, your career, and how impactful that would be on your family.

Amen.

Be sure to come back in the very next episode and join us for the conclusion of this interview with Jessica Morris.

Till then, this passes by, reminding you to be blessed in all that you do.

Thank you for listening to today's episode of the Kingdom Crossroads podcast.

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