Shownotes
- Consistency in Social Media and Content Creation: We both admit that maintaining consistent social media activity is exceptionally challenging. Despite knowing the right strategies, allocating time and resources remains a massive obstacle. Consistency is key, whether it’s posting regularly on social media or recording podcast episodes in advance.
- The Importance of Using a CRM: Sara shares her aversion to using Customer Relationship Management (CRM) systems in the past and the consequences of this resistance. The lesson? Tools like CRMs are indispensable for tracking client interactions and marketing efforts effectively.
- Managing Overcommitment: It's easy to fall into the trap of saying 'yes' to every opportunity, but overcommitting can lead to burnout and neglected responsibilities. Larry shares how they’ve both been guilty of biting off more than they can chew, resulting in missed deadlines and rushed work.
- Tracking the ROI of Marketing Efforts: Sara discusses the importance of tracking the return on investment (ROI) for various marketing and branding efforts. Without proper tracking, it’s impossible to discern what’s working and what’s not, leading to wasted resources and missed opportunities.
- Promoting Guest Appearances: Both Larry and Sara acknowledge their failure to properly promote their guest appearances on other podcasts. This not only lets down the hosts who featured them but also misses out on leveraging these opportunities to enhance their own brand visibility.
Transcripts
What is happening, everybody? I'm Larry Roberts.
Sara Lohse [:And I'm Sara Lohse. And this is branded, your comprehensive guide to creative branding.
Larry Roberts [:And on this, what could turn out to be a very embarrassing episode of the podcast, we're going to talk about some of the most common mistakes that we make, and actually mistakes that Sara and I continue to make when it comes to building our personal brand. So hopefully you'll understand you're not the only one that's out there that is making a mistake or dropping the ball from time to time. It happens to us all.
Sara Lohse [:It's funny because we often say, like, we are do as we say, not as we do, people, because when you look at some of the things like our clients are doing, they're killing it and they learn it from us, but we're just not doing it for ourselves. And I don't. It's getting to the point where I'm just like, I need accountability. So let's make an episode where we just tell the world how much we suck.
Larry Roberts [:Yeah, I'm not a big fan of that, but. But I'm here for it. So, you know, it's funny too. And I hate when we say that because it just feels like such a cop out, you know? Yeah, do as we say, not as we do. Man, that is the worst. You know, especially coming from me because I. I've always said, you know, you got to lead by example. I.
Larry Roberts [:I don't respect anybody that tells me to do something and then I don't, you know, do the. Or they don't do the same thing they're telling me to do or they wouldn't be willing to do what they're telling me to do. So leading by example has always been something that's super, super critical until you own a business and then you realize.
Sara Lohse [:Yeah, yeah, I think for me, the biggest one is social media.
Larry Roberts [:Well, I think the biggest one for a lot of people is social media.
Sara Lohse [:It's.
Larry Roberts [:It's just so tough to stay on top of it. And they go, oh, well, just create a content calendar. You know, do this, do that, make all this stuff in batch, bruh.
Sara Lohse [:It's just we've done all the things.
Larry Roberts [:You still have to do all the work. It doesn't seem like. Does it streamline it? Yes. Does it make it so you don't have to do it every day? Sure. But guess what? You still gotta do it. And allocating that time and those resources, that's where the challenge comes into play.
Sara Lohse [:Yeah. For me, I've noticed that it's if I'm working on something for a client, even if it's the same thing I'm supposed to be doing for myself, I know that I'm getting paid to do it when I do. No one's paying me to do my own social media.
Larry Roberts [:Well, you know, I. I'll contest that.
Sara Lohse [:Because I know what you're gonna say.
Larry Roberts [:Yeah, of course you do. Of course you do. So. But I think other people have to hear it, too, is that you are getting paid. You're not getting paid directly. There's no hourly rate or a salary that's necessarily attached to it, but you're getting paid on. Here's our favorite roi, that return on impact. Sara.
Sara Lohse [:I know, I know, but it's. It is hard. And it's hard. Like things that you just. You do it and then they're done. Like, that's easy. But this is something where you have to just read, just keep doing it. And we've sat down together.
Sara Lohse [:We'll make the content calendar and we'll talk about. This is all the stuff we're going to do. And then the content calendar just keeps changing months. Anyone else?
Larry Roberts [:Well, at the same time, our business has grown so much that we really had to start implementing some processes and some procedures and some workflows, and that's a great thing. However, at the same time, you go in, you set up all these wonderful workflows, and now you got to manage them, too. So now you got to manage the workflows on top of doing the work that you needed to do, that the workflows are going to help you get done. It's just stacks and stacks and stacks and stacks. And even yesterday, yesterday I was a little frustrated. Yesterday I was a little frustrated with it all, and it kind of came to the surface. But to my own defense, too, I just got back from a very long trip and it was very tired, and I'm making excuses. There are no excuses for it.
Larry Roberts [:You still got to do the work.
Sara Lohse [:Yeah, I think one of the things that I don't do, which I'm. Which we're working on, but, like, I never had a CRM. Apparently that's a thing you're supposed to have. Did you know that?
Larry Roberts [:Well, they say you are. They're like, you have an email list, right? You have a CRM, right?
Sara Lohse [:I thought it was a rumor.
Larry Roberts [:Yeah, yeah.
Sara Lohse [:Well, I had an email list, right. I just didn't have, like, an actual CRM. And the worst part is I. When I used to work in finance, they had salesforce And I hated it. And I actively rebelled against it and refused to use it or learn it because I thought I never would have to. And now I own a business and I need a CRM and I have no idea how they work because I actively refuse to learn it. What is. I forgot the word.
Sara Lohse [:The consequences of my actions.
Larry Roberts [:There it is. Yeah, they do exist.
Sara Lohse [:The word I was kept saying coincidences in my head. I'm like, that's not the right word.
Larry Roberts [:Sip on your coffee.
Sara Lohse [:It's the consequences of my actions.
Larry Roberts [:There you go. Take another sip. Just let that caffeine hit a little bit.
Sara Lohse [:Oh, I need it. I need to streamline caffeine today.
Larry Roberts [:This is an unexpected recording because guess what? One of the mistakes that we continue to make is we don't find time to record the podcast. If you're an avid listener of Branded, which we hope you are, you may look back over the last several weeks and there's a sprinkle of republished articles that's in there. I think there's three or four over the last six weeks or so. And it's because we've been on the road. It's because of this, it's because of clients, it's because of commitments, it's because of networking. It's because the list goes on and on and on. But the bottom line is that we need to record. What do we tell our clients? Record in batch.
Larry Roberts [:If you have to always have three or four in the can in case you have to go on a trip. In case you get sick. In case. In case. In case. And in this case, we once again did not follow our own advice.
Sara Lohse [:No, we've. We've kind of been for months now. We'll have a guest on the show, and then we'll. They're like, so, when is this going to air? And we're like, in three days.
Larry Roberts [:Yeah.
Sara Lohse [:Because tomorrow, actually, it's coming out tomorrow, the next episode. Because we're very unprepared. And if our clients were to tell us that they were doing that, we'd be like, excuse me.
Larry Roberts [:Yeah, go play.
Sara Lohse [:No, no, no, no. We need to fix this. And for us, we're just like, yeah, no, this is totally fine and sustainable and everything's okay.
Larry Roberts [:Yeah. I mean, even the last couple episodes that did get published, I think we recorded a Monday morning, got them edited and knocked out that night in time to publish on Tuesday morning. So, I mean, we were in sheer panic mode. Go, we gotta release something. And it just. Man, it bites you in the backside. So we Gotta make sure that we don't do that again.
Sara Lohse [:Yeah. All right, so we've got not posting on social media, not understanding CRMs and not recording content.
Larry Roberts [:Not recording your content on a regular basis. You know, it's funny too, because I just. Tomorrow's issue of the newsletter, you know, I do the podfest message messenger newsletter for podfest and the lead article is how to stay consistent during the Holidays. And a lot of this advice. Yeah, we should probably, we should probably read that together. That might be an interesting article to kind of follow along. And granted that's just about podcasting and how to stay consistent with your content creation, but I think some of those same things may apply to staying consistent on a day to day basis, even if it's not the holidays.
Sara Lohse [:Yeah. And it, I mean, it's easy when things are like going to like on schedule and everything's normal and routine. But like my October was insane. I was, I had multiple trips. I ended up like in the hospital. Like I got really sick. All of this stuff happened. I don't think I posted on social media one time in all of October.
Larry Roberts [:Wow, that's, that's a lot. And I was just cussing myself out this morning because I was on LinkedIn. I'm like, man, you haven't published on LinkedIn in like a week.
Sara Lohse [:Oh yeah, no, I didn't publish in like a month.
Larry Roberts [:Yeah, well, I mean, you were gone for, I don't know, 22 days or something.
Sara Lohse [:No, I was gone for like half a month.
Larry Roberts [:Yeah, 10 or 11 days. In one trip? Just in one trip. So it makes it, it makes it difficult, especially when you over commit. So I think that's something else that we could kind of focus on there is over committing. I think that's a huge mistake that we want to be everywhere for everyone at all and you just really can't do that. And I think you and I both demonstrated that the month of October. I'm super stoked that I did get home Sunday from my trip and that's my last trip until January. So super excited about that because it's going to give me a time to refocus and gather my thoughts and catch up on some much needed rest and implement this CRM that we're working on and these workflows that we're working on and doing all the things that I'm supposed to do.
Larry Roberts [:But I think a lot of people make that mistake of over commitment.
Sara Lohse [:Yeah, I think this month was definitely. Or last month. October was definitely a testament to that. And now we're in November, and I have one trip, and it's only two nights, so it's. It's an easy one. It's next week or when this releases. It's this week. But I'm just glad that that's the only one I've got and that I'm done until Podfest in January.
Larry Roberts [:Yep.
Sara Lohse [:But I got it. Like, I think the both of us need to rein in our travel.
Larry Roberts [:Dude. Okay, here. Here's the thing, okay? I said I was gonna do that. I told you. I told everybody.
Sara Lohse [:I said that.
Larry Roberts [:After this year, next year's different. I'm gonna focus just on creating content, and I'm gonna hammer YouTube and I'm not traveling. Well, I've already booked through June. I've got at least one gig up through June of next year. One gig a month through June of next year. And I just got hit up for another one this morning someplace in Jersey. Not sure where that's gonna land. So, yeah, yeah, I think I made that mistake of saying I was going to do it, and look, I turned right around and go, no, I got to be everywhere for everybody every time.
Larry Roberts [:And, yeah, I'll do it. Yeah, I'll do it. Yeah, I'll do it. Stop saying, yeah, I'll do it. Dial it back, bro.
Sara Lohse [:Yeah. The thing we're bad at is saying no.
Larry Roberts [:Yeah, yeah.
Sara Lohse [:I feel like that's a lot of people, though.
Larry Roberts [:I think so, too, because, again, you know, branded as a company's brand new. I mean, you know, it's not even a year old yet. And when you're laying that foundation of a new company, and, I mean, let's just be honest, you know, I've only been outside of corporate for going on four years now. You know, it was January 21st was when Red Hat really took off as my primary venture. Granted, it was established in 17, but it really didn't, you know, get going until 21. So it's still new and in its infancy as well. And when you have a new business and you have a new brand, and even then, I think when I left, I don't even think Red Hat was a thing. When I left, I think.
Larry Roberts [:I don't think Red Hat had. The Red Hat had been discovered yet. I think it was fall of 21 where the red Hat was finally discovered. Might have been 22. No, 22.
Sara Lohse [:And you didn't even. You didn't actually rebrand it until, like, last year, officially.
Larry Roberts [:Yeah. So, you know, and my point in saying all that, it's not going down memory lane. It's to say that when you're starting new endeavors, it requires a lot of effort. And you're trying to build a brand and you're trying to get your name out there, and you're trying to get your brand out there, and you're committing to all of these things, whether it be speaking engagements or networking organizations or going to lunches. I mean, I've had to cancel meeting after meeting and recording after recording for the podcast because I have a lunch that I have to go to in person. And it's again, it's that over commitment. But when you're. When you're starting out and you're just starting to grow, you fall into that trap of trying to be everywhere.
Larry Roberts [:And I think that's something that we all need to be more cognizant of.
Sara Lohse [:Yeah. And I mean, I'm. I'm like you. I've been saying that I'm gonna do less, and I said this year was gonna be less, and it ended up being ridiculous. But for next year, I only have two things scheduled. I've got podfest and then I'm speaking in Nebraska at the marketech conference. And I'm excited about it. But.
Sara Lohse [:And that's in March, but I have nothing else right now on the books. And that. That's actually a really good feeling. And. But the interesting is like, but before, that would have felt like I was like failing. It would have felt like I'm not doing enough.
Larry Roberts [:Yeah, yeah.
Sara Lohse [:And now it's the opposite.
Larry Roberts [:Well, now I think it allows you to focus on the things that matter because you've laid that groundwork, you've established that foundation, and people are. They know who you are, they know who Branded is. And now not. There's never an end point to that of building the brand, obviously, but there's a solid foundation in place, and Branded is growing to the point where more attention has to be given to the business as a whole and not so much as the brand building aspect of it. And I think that's a huge transition that a lot of folks go through, and they don't manage very well. You know, they do get to the point where, oh, my gosh, I've got clients, I got a lot of clients. What do I do now? And that can be very overwhelming. But I think that's what makes or breaks a business, is to be able to step back and look at what you've been doing and what isn't necessarily working anymore and then reformulating that plan to make it continue work.
Sara Lohse [:Yeah, Speaking of, that brings me to another thing that I haven't been doing or I haven't been doing. Right. I'm working with a business coach right now, someone that I'm actually working on trade with, because I'm working. I'm helping with his brand messaging. And he asked me, like, of all the things that I'm doing, like, what's been the ROI on them? And I have no idea. He's like, well, these last conferences, like, did anything come of them? I don't know. I wasn't tracking anything. So I was doing all of this marketing and spending all this money, but having no idea if it was actually impactful.
Sara Lohse [:And that's not right. That's not what you're supposed to do. You're supposed to know these things well.
Larry Roberts [:You're definitely supposed to know them well. I think that's super common, too, because you're not really. And I think this is a mistake, but you're not really looking at what the ROI is. You're looking at. We're big on saying return on impact, and I've already said that once in this episode. But that's how we describe podcasts, because a lot of podcasts, very difficult to get an instant return on that investment. But you do get more exposure, you get more attention, all that fun stuff. But there comes a point where you have to look at all the things you're doing, not just your podcast, but all your appearances, all of your networking, all of your travel, and you have to look back and go, hey, what was the net of this effort here? Did I lose money? And you're going, you.
Larry Roberts [:Maybe you don't look at it as losing money. Maybe you look at it as investing money because you're investing in your brand. But at some point, that investment needs to mature and you need to start seeing a return. And if you're not tracking that, it's very easy to go, well, I'm still just building. I'm still just building. Well, how much have you invested? How much have you built? And when you start looking at it, you go, oh, holy crap, look at all the. All the money I've lost. You know? And it.
Larry Roberts [:It can be very humbling when you start looking at it that way. And at the same time, it can be a little frustrating, too. It might be a little detrimental to your energy when it comes to consistently representing your brand in your niche.
Sara Lohse [:Yeah, one of the things I've been feeling, I mean, I'm. I'm an anxious person. So me feeling anxious about things isn't exactly groundbreaking, but I've had this, like, overwhelming feeling that I'm doing too much and not enough at the same time, which is not fun, not a comfortable feeling. I don't know what to do about it, but I think it comes down to figuring out what to focus on, like, what's working and what isn't and getting rid of the things that aren't. But because I haven't done the tracking part, I don't necessarily know what isn't. And yeah, y'all, don't be me. Moral of the story, be better. Don't.
Sara Lohse [:Don't emulate me. I'm. I'm struggling.
Larry Roberts [:I think we all are. But it's good to be able to hear something like, you know, here you and I have in this discussion, and other people can listen. And once again, you know, like, when I open the show, realize that they're not by themselves.
Sara Lohse [:Yeah.
Larry Roberts [:That they're not the only ones that are having these problems. And they need to continue to persist through the problems, implement changes that would rectify the problems and continue to evolve in their business and continue to evolve in their brand. But that's what is so frustrating for a lot of folks. And they're not able to do that. They're not able to progress. They're not able to overcome the disappointment of not getting that massive return on. Well, for instance, three years of travel and speaking across the country. They're not able to see that.
Larry Roberts [:And, you know, if we want to break it down as simple as podcasters, most podcasts now, what are they all fail before episode seven. You know, because people start podcasts, they have their Joe Rogan delusions of grandeur, and they end up not making millions by episode seven. So they quit podcasting. And I think that's a very. It's very similar with businesses and brands. You know, they quit building that business and quit building that brand way too soon. They get overwhelmed. They make the mistakes, and instead of correcting the mistakes, they just throw their hands up and call it.
Sara Lohse [:No, it's. It's hard to, like, see the big picture sometimes. And we all. Everyone is so busy. Everyone has all these different things that they're doing in their business and for their business. So when something isn't immediately, it's like that, like, delayed gratification. Like, we don't want that. We want instant gratification.
Sara Lohse [:So this is not a media that really supports instant gratification. But one of the things that I, like you had said, lead by example. I have been really dropping the ball at promoting my guest episodes.
Larry Roberts [:I mean, guesting on other shows. Is that what you're saying?
Sara Lohse [:Yeah, yeah. And I talk. I mean, I talk about podcast guesting, and I tell people, like, you need to be promoting it, and here's all the different ways you can use it. And all of October, I didn't even think about it, and I just looked on Spotify, and several episodes that I guessed it on had gone live in October. I didn't even notice. And now I'm going back and, like, making posts about them and promoting them and everything. But I'm like, I feel so bad. Like, I dropped the ball and, like, I let the host down because it's.
Sara Lohse [:That's my job as the guest, is to make sure I'm promoting it. So I, like, that made me, like, feel, like, actually, like, feel guilt that, like, usually I don't actually feel guilty for not doing something. I'm just like, well, crap, I forgot. Let me start doing that. But, like, I actually felt, like, guilty for this one.
Larry Roberts [:Well, yeah, because other people are depending on you, you know, and when you. When you. When you view somebody else's platform to promote yourself and promote your own goods and services, and then you don't return the favor of them promoting you. Yeah, it should sting a little bit. And I'm not saying that to scold you. I'm just saying that in general for everybody, because I'm just as bad. You know, Ross Brand just released an episode with me on his podcast. This sent me all the assets, all the resources, and here I still haven't even shared it yet.
Larry Roberts [:So when I hang up off of this recording, I'm going to go in there and promote that episode from Mr. Ross Brand. So I appreciate that, but. Yeah. So the cool thing, though, about podcasting is you can promote it at any time, and it's still going to have just as much impact as it had when it originally came out. And then just, you know, reach back and let those folks know that you've been there. And then you have shared it now and you really appreciate what they did for you to either put you on their stage or put you on their podcast or whatever it may be.
Sara Lohse [:Yeah, I remember one of the first, like, big posts that I made way back when I first started my company. Like, one of the blogs I wrote was how to Think a Podcast Host, because it was a question that I got during a webinar, and my answer was, promote the podcast. Like, I've had people send me chocolates. I've had people send me mugs and coffee and all this stuff. And like, thank you. I love this. But at the same time, the best thank you isn't a gift. It's sharing the podcast.
Sara Lohse [:So that is a thing I need to get better at with paying attention to when my episodes actually come out.
Larry Roberts [:Well, there's a lot of things that we all need to get better at. And again, the whole purpose of this episode, what, to dog us ourselves or put ourselves in a negative light? Or to walk away from this recording depressed as I'll get out Too late. No. I felt it starting to spiral. Our voices were. They were getting lower and we were speaking.
Sara Lohse [:Suddenly became therapy. And where we are not qualified.
Larry Roberts [:We really reached for an answer. And dear, no, but seriously, the whole point, once again in this episode is to make sure you know that you're not out there by yourself. We continue to make mistakes. I know we'll continue to make mistakes. But as long as we acknowledge those mistakes, put a plan in place to correct those mistakes and continue to move forward, we'll all continue to build our businesses, grow our brands, and if you have a podcast, grow your podcast, too.
Sara Lohse [:It's time for us to start making that.
Larry Roberts [:All right, well, let's wrap this recording up so we can get to planning. Hey, guys. If you found some value in this episode, and I know you did, or.
Sara Lohse [:Just want to commiserate with us.
Larry Roberts [:Yes. If you want to commiserate. I don't even know what that means, but if you want to commiserate with us, then please subscribe to the show. I know what that means. Subscribe. Hit that subscribe button so we can continue to bring you these commiserative episodes each and every week. And with that, I'm Larry Roberts.
Sara Lohse [:And I'm Sara Lohse, and we'll talk to you next week.
