This week's guest, Chris Shipferling, is the managing partner of Global Wired Advisors, a lower middle market investment bank focused on sell side engagements.
Are you dreaming of one day selling your business and moving to Tahiti? Then there are many factors that you need to consider now. Listen as Andy and Chris discuss how to determine your company's valuation.
Building a brand vs. being a commodity. Do you know the difference? This difference is the main focus in determining a company's valuation.
In addition, this episode reveals what a business needs to do to maximize the value of their company as well as what type of businesses are more readily sellable and the options available when selling your company and finally why you should not want to sell your company yourself.
Episode Action Items:
To learn more about Chris Shipferling and Global Wired Advisors or a free valuation visit www.globalwiredadvisors.com
ABOUT THE HOST:
Andy Splichal, who was recently named to the Best of Los Angeles Awards’ Fascinating 100 List, is the founder and managing partner of True Online Presence, author of the Make Each Click Count book series and Founder of Make Each Click Count University found at https://www.makeeachclickcountuniversity.com.
He is a certified online marketing strategist with twenty plus years of experience and counting helping companies increase their online presence and profitable revenues. To find more information on Andy Splichal visit https://www.trueonlinepresence.com, read the full story on his blog at blog.trueonlinepresence.com or shop his books on Amazon or at https://www.makeeachclickcount.com.
New episodes of the Make Each Click Count Podcast, are released each Friday and can be found on Apple Podcast, Spotify, Google Podcast, Apple Podcast and on Make Each Click Count at https://podcast.makeeachclickcount.com.
Andy Splichal 0:02
Welcome to the Make Each Click Count Podcast. This is your host, Andy Splichal. And today we're happy to welcome our next guest to discuss today's topic of how valuable is your company? This guest is a managing partner of Global Wired Advisors, which is a lower middle market investment bank focused on sell side engagements, put a bit more simply a company that works preparing businesses for a sophisticated sales process to ensure that they get the most optimized deal structure with the right buyer. Say hello to Chris Shipferling. Hi, Chris.
Chris Shipferling 1:26
Hey, Andy, thanks so much for having me on. I appreciate it.
Andy Splichal 1:29
I'm glad you could join us now, before we dive into today's topic, which is how valuable is your company? Let's first hear your backstory and what ultimately led you to do what you were doing now?
Chris Shipferling 1:44million. Around:
Andy Splichal 3:10
What year was that?
Chris Shipferling 3:11This:
Andy Splichal 4:06
So how did you become? How did you get hooked up with global wired advisors?
Chris Shipferling 4:12
Yes, great question. So, so myself and I actually was utilizing a local, I was utilizing a local digital marketing firm here to run that brand where I pivoted you know, the Barcelona brand and I stayed in touch with him when I started my own consulting gig and I actually sent clients their way and etc. And I, they they said, Hey, you really need to meet somebody, someone. One of our clients is really interested in putting products on Amazon. So at the time, it was my future partners, they had a private equity effort which we which we now all have together, that has that owns a supply business out in Oregon, Southern Oregon, and it was in the cannabis space and so We met on a pretty cold morning at Panera Bread around 6am and started talking about this particular effort. And then it quickly, really just blossomed into, hey, I think there's a bigger picture here, when it comes to selling businesses when it comes to helping business owners exit, and that Exit Planning and Exit Strategy process because they asked their own effort called Provident Advisors, that was a lower middle market investment bank focused on traditional businesses, then we started talking about this space. And it was it was very evident, that it was lacking strong acumen and pedigree to help a successful business owner brand really go through an optimized exit. So that's when I met them.
Andy Splichal 5:45
You know, I've heard that term. Again, you just mentioned a lower middle market investment bank, and that's the same description is the company are working with Global Wired Advisors? What is a lower middle market investment bank?
Chris Shipferling 5:59
Yeah, you know, and without, without trying to, you know, act like this, as, you know, get to professorial you know, financial markets, always, always will, will tear, you know, specific assets into specific markets. And so really, lower middle market is just a way to describe kind of the size of an asset. And so in particular, the way we define it is, companies, consumer, consumer product companies that are yielding between call it five to 7 million in revenue, all the way up to like 60 70 million in revenue. That's what we consider the lower middle market below that would be mainstream, we hear that term a lot through the media. And below, above, that would be middle market above that middle market is where you find that institutional level at the fortune 100, fortune 500 companies.
Andy Splichal 6:45
So what year then was it when Global Wired Advisors was launched?
Chris Shipferling 6:49And yeah, it was:
Andy Splichal 6:49
So 3 3 years 18? How many companies in that time? Have you take it through the sales process?
Chris Shipferling 7:47close to about I think, since:
Andy Splichal 8:40
In deals? So you are actually kind of like the broker on set up with somebody to buy it or?
Chris Shipferling 8:49
Yeah, broker is kind of how I would say, people outside of the financial services would would, would describe it right now, Business Brokers tend to have a bad reputation. They're 10 and 9, or passive or listing agents, right. And there's a very large distinction between how a business broker runs a process into sell a business, and how an investment bank runs a process to ultimately get you an optimizedtrade for your company.
Andy Splichal 9:22
This is a great episode. I mean, people who start business, most of them are dreaming of getting big and getting to the point that one day they're able to sell it and live on a beach in Tahiti. Very excited, very excited. Now, on your website, I see there are tools for immediate valuations.
Chris Shipferling 9:41
Andy Splichal 9:42
What are some of those calculations that go into evaluation? And what can make a business more or less valuable? Just a couple things?
Chris Shipferling 9:52
Oh, wow. Great. Tough, tough and great question. There's a lot there. I'll say that from from our specific valuation tool, you know, we created that because we were meeting we were trying to meet the market where, where it is. And, you know, in, in traditional investment banking, you know, you wouldn't go to Bank of America or Goldman Sachs and find a valuation tool. That's just not, it's not, it's not necessarily a real thing, kind of in that middle of market to institutional. But, you know, there are a lot of solopreneurs, who are dreaming of Tahiti. And so there's and, you know, utilizing online tools is their everyday business, right. And so we thought, hey, this would be a really good way to create something, try and do what we can to put some very valuable, you know, in real time market data, as our deals are closing, as we're hearing about here and hearing about other fields and specific nuances of their business. Hey, let's let's feed it as much data as we can and try and give some decent output. But it's still an 80,000 foot view, right? So devil is always in the details, which leads me to answering, you know, the next piece, right, you're asking about, like, what makes a company valuable? And what's what makes it not valuable? Wow, having a brand versus having a commodity, that's what makes you valuable or not valuable.Andy Splichal:
And brand brand versus commodity.Chris Shipferling:
That's I play if I boiled it down for you, without having literally a series of probably two or three podcasts, I would say, building a brand versus building commodity. That's exactly right.Andy Splichal:
But can that brand can't be the ownership? Right? So the brand has to be a product?Chris Shipferling:
Yeah, it has to be absolutely. I mean, if you have, even if you run a service business, if you run a digital agency, or you're running a, you know, SaaS is a little bit different, because you're actually running, you know, revenue, kind of in an automated manner on a monthly subscription manner, and annual, but you know, if you're running a service business, you're still a brand, right? There's a reason why the engine runs. And if the owner is the only thing that's making the engine run, then you don't have anything that's valuable. You have a cash flowing entity. But it definitely is more of a commodity than stay than, say, a brand Ogilvy as a brand. Right? But it overly is a service based business. But it's a brand. It's recognized, you know, and people want to use it, because when they hear that name, Ogilvy, they they attribute it to being something grandiose, right, something more than just a pure commodity, like a service commodity.Andy Splichal:
What about length, the time of Business has been open, is that matter? Or is it again, brand versus commodity?Chris Shipferling:
No, well, you got to have a little bit of prove it to me time, right, you got to have something, you got to have something that that financially indicates that there is real proof that the business can can cashflow on its own, that it's sustainable has real staying power. And, you know, brand is funny, it's the subjective term, right. But but we all know it when we see it. It's something that we understand from a cohesive perspective. It has a message to it, that message resonates with consumers. But it is a subjective piece. However, you know, you've got to have some type of history. And to get nuts and bolts with you, you know, have at least two years of history, you got to have at least two years of operating history in order to really get a strong valuation to get a strong tradeAndy Splichal:
and a Ecommerce company be valuable? selling other people's merchandise? Or does it have to be private label that they're selling their own stuff?Chris Shipferling:
Yeah, I would say, if you're PetSmart, you can sell anybody's stuff. Right? If your Best Buy, you know, you're extremely valuable. So really, at that point, you've got to have real market share, like real market share. You know, you've got, you've got retailers like Moosejaw that were that were sold to Walmart, right. So I mean, you can be valuable, but you're still best buys a brand. You know, that means a brand. All these retailers are our brands first, and then they're selling other and even TJ Maxx, they're a brand to treasure hunting brand, right. So while you're buying other people's stuff and some of their private label, the brand itself is drawing you in. So if you're selling other people's product, and you don't have size and scale, not very valuable.Andy Splichal:
You know what you mentioned to the PetSmart, The Best Buy and then one of those things that all of them have in common as well as they're selling them in their own platform, whether it's their own store or their own website. Are you going to be a valuable company and don't know what you're gonna say? I'm thinking it's no but I don't know. Are you going to be a valuable company if all you're doing is selling on Amazon and you're selling other people's stuff?Chris Shipferling:
The answer is only if you are a category leader, you might, maybe, and also the category that you're selling. And so if you're really focusing in pet, and you're the category leader, but you're a reseller, but you're category leader, then you're you're clearly grabbing and stealing market share, that could potentially be valuable. You also have a scalable operation. So there's real operational leverage that someone could find very valuable, that could make it scale from 150 to a billion dollars, maybe in the next four or five years, maybe six years, 10 years, that's that that's where things become valuable. If you're, if you're on another platform like that, it kind of still, that's that same spirit, but you got to have real scale.Andy Splichal:
But you would be much more valuable if you were selling as much or not more off your own website or in your own store?Chris Shipferling:
I would say that, yes, I would agree with that, especially if it's if you know, if the store itself, even if you're doing, you know, even if you're driving lots of digital marketing activity, like Google, AdWords, Facebook, etc, to drive the traffic. Yeah, you're owning all that data that's highly valuable. But then, you know, you're becoming even if it's within a, if it's in a category a niche, you're not say PetSmart, but you're something pet and you get to a certain size, and you're starting to become a real threat, because consumers are leaving chewy, or they're leaving Petco to go buy from, you know, retail or brand X that might be might be smaller, but those strategics want to buy that, that market share at this point. So it's all about size, genuinely, but But yes, then you get nuanced. And you go okay, well, what is more valuable? Of course, yeah, running everything through your own website through versus the Amazon marketplace, 100%.Andy Splichal:
Now, can you share a story, anything come to mind about an evaluation that that may have surprised you recently?Chris Shipferling:
Huh? Yeah, I got a I got a positive and a negative.Andy Splichal:
Let's start positive. It's always better to start with.Chris Shipferling:
Yeah, yeah, we took a business out to market it was close to 7 million of EBITDA was in home improvement. And we knew that it would get a good trade. But the ultimate, the ultimate deal structure. My three partners who all came from institutional investment banking, they've seen some some pretty sizable transactions. All four of us sat back and went, Wow, we cannot believe the trade that this thing got. And so that shocked me, and it had everything we're talking about brand. They ran everything through the Amazon platform, by the way, because they couldn't rotate off. They had so much demand through that platform. But they started selling through Home Depot. Home Depot was just anywhere they touch, they had the The Midas Touch. So went to Menards, boom, immediately started seeing, you know, a strong revenue, Home Depot, strong revenue. Home Depot now wants to look at putting them in store. It's brand brand brand, but we were like, Yes, lots of lots of business running through Amazon. So we'll see if that gets discounted. It did not and it shocked us. And what about the negative story, the sad story, the sad story was we had we had a commodity a commodity type business that had three different three or four different brands within one seller sentral. Everything run through Amazon, they had a run rate that was that was sizable, larger than what I just mentioned, as far as the EBITDA down that last company, and our thesis was because it has size, it's going to get a lot of bids. Because there are a lot of people who want that entree into Amazon and it was all private label. And we were dead wrong. It got barely any bids only actually one bid after sending it to 300 people that we thought were really good fits and ended up getting a pretty, pretty saturate. It got it got over the goal line. But it was not easy getting there.Andy Splichal:
You know, that brings up another another question I have, how do you your company? How do you and your company manage people's expectations when they begin to work with you?Chris Shipferling:
We do a lot of that thing. And that's kind of part of that whole investment banking process versus a business broker. This is brokers want volume, and I'm not here to pick on them, I promise but it's good contrast, I think for your audience, right. And so, you know, they're looking for volume, they want to bring in, you know, hundreds of deals into the fold. And they're okay playing the numbers games where you know, 10% of them 20% maybe 30% closed, totally fine with that. On the other hand, when you take a long term strategic approach to your to your client relationship, where you spend a lot of time with them that hang out their business. And before we send an engagement letter, we are going to have a conversation. In some cases, they're tough. In some cases, they're very easy, where we're going to outline what their expectations should be. And what we always say is, hey, look, this is on this is inside the house. Talk, right? We're giving you the realistic view. Because the last thing you want to do is go to market and have the unrealistic view. However, our job is to represent you, it's not to get you the realistic view is to get you the unrealistic view. And that's, that's what we're going to go and try and do, we're going to try and push the envelope as much as we can. But that's where we are setting expectations. And if we're not aligned, we won't sign an agreement with the client.Andy Splichal:
Is your fees based on if it sells? How much like a commission percentage? Or is it a fee for just marketing companies?Chris Shipferling:
It is a it is a success fee. It's a really cute marketing way of saying commission. But it's, it's a success fee. And so you know, I'd say, you know, we charge a very small upfront, but that's really just to just to try and it's honestly, it's mostly to make sure that our clients have skin in the game. That's it. And I say small, it's very small. You know, you're ranging from, you know, 7500, and the most we've ever charged is somewhere like 25-30, somewhere around that, right? So you're not talking about a large sum of money that's that's charged up front. Are we are fully incentivized to make sure that this deal closes, and lion's share where we make our money is going to be at the table with you.Andy Splichal:
You know, you had mentioned before that if somebody is the face of it, they're really a commodity not a brand. How can an owner that is the face of a business? How can they work on removing themselves? If they're thinking of selling somebody?Chris Shipferling:
Yeah, I mean, look, this is really mainly for service based businesses. You know, because obviously consumer products, it's, there is no face, right? The product is the brand and the product, that's the face, right? So that's really not for for that for anybody listening to this, that's brand or consumer products. And then anybody listening that is service based? How do you get yourself out of it? Well, typically, the owner is the Business Development guy, right? He's the he's the salesperson. And you got to start early, hiring talent, to get yourself out of the company. And to test start taking slow steps back. And if you go wild on how to do that, then I recommend you start formulating a board, and advisory board. If you already have an advisory board, but you haven't had the conversation and start having the conversation, I need help. I need help formulating a good solid strategic plan to get me out of this business in the next two years. And then you start to execute on that, by the way, it's going to suck. I mean, as an owner, you want full control. And you hate giving that control to anybody to try and run your baby. But it gets easier. You know, it's an exercise. Look. We're for partner led firm, that means we're for owners, and we talk about this type of stuff. We're service based business business, I'm on this podcast as an owner, right. So we're already having conversations pretty early on for the next five years to say, okay, you know, it's not me cruise ship for LNG that's going on podcast per se, in the next two years. It's it's going to be some incredibly awesome talent that we're hiring inside of the firm. By the way, you're gonna have to pay him really well. Right, you know, because if if they're going to be the if they're going to be kind of the the new quote, stakeholder of the business driving driving real real revenue, you got to pay him.Andy Splichal:
Sure. Yeah. No great, great talent Saatchi.Chris Shipferling:
Nope. That's right.Andy Splichal:
You know, I was reading a few weeks ago that here during COVID It has been a great time to purchase businesses. Is that true in I guess, does that mean it's been a bad time to sell businesses as well?Chris Shipferling:
If you're a traditional business that went through like real kind of COVID depression, yeah, it's a great time to find distressed assets but ecommerce flew like flew, I mean, it was fast forward about 10 years. So if you're looking to come into the this new asset class and purchase a digital digital consumer product company, whether it's running through Amazon or whether it's running through their own website, you know that sheer mo I think you're going to be sorely disappointed that all of the demand is going way up right now for those businesses. And the supply is not as is as heavy as the demand. So it's driving valuations but yeah, like, you know, can any any travel company Travel + Leisure, you know, service businesses, restaurants, got nailed through kind of COVID depression? Yeah, it's a great time to pick up some distressed assets. But that's not our business because we're consumer products, specifically digitally native businesses.Andy Splichal:
So, you know, talking ecommerce, what are some things that you've seen that that this ecommerce specifically businesses might get wrong when they're trying to scale?Chris Shipferling:
A good question, I think, you know, I think every solopreneur needs to do some some us humility, check and realize that, you know, either Google ads, Facebook ads, you know, SEO strategy, or even just the Amazon marketplace has gotten to a point where it's beyond their acumen. And they need to hire, and they need to go find, you know, an outsourced agency to take them to that next level. And where they get it wrong is they they don't have that humility. And they have the hubris to actually think they're the ones that can continue doing it. We've seen that happen, I think, too, they try and do way too many things all at one time. So they're saying to themselves, Oh, I need to diversify ASAP. And so they try and get into WalMart, they try and run more sales to their website, they try and set up international business, they try and set up, you know, wholesale relationships in brick and mortar, and they just do everything all at one time, or way too fast. And it drains the resources of the organization. And it really drains the cash flow of the organization as well. So it's got being a bit more methodical kind of actually thinking through a good strategy. And just making sure that you're also, you've also got yourself fully resourced in order to do those activities.Andy Splichal:
So you would recommend outsourcing your paid marketing? Finally, this question is sponsored by true online presence, handling all of your marketing needs?Chris Shipferling:
That's right. I would 100 Look, I mean, there's so much new capital flowing into Ecommerce right now. I was just had this conversation with a guy before this podcast, and we were talking about the new competitive pressure that's on the Amazon platform itself. You know, you've got a lot of these venture funds that have been raised only to buy Amazon businesses. You know, perch just announced that they raised 775 million from Softbank and Spark Capital, mostly debt. So there's a little bit of a nuance there, but at the same time, they're filled with a giant coffer right now. Do you think internally they're about to have conversations that say, I think we should go conservative with our with our PPC spend? No, they're going, let's buy as much as we can. And if we have to have lost leaders, we're just we're building brands right now we're in building we're in brand building mode. And that's a lot of competitive pressure both them through in specific categories through a lot of different a lot of different activities right now. So yes, 110% I think I think a solopreneur you know, someone like you and if you start a business tomorrow, you probably you obviously have the skill set and acumen to get it to a specific place. But but but every business owner, because you're doing more than that, you're running a lot of functions need to have kind of a come to insert religious figure here, you know, and kind of sit down and go, What should I start outsourcing now?Andy Splichal:
That really brings me to my next question. And if you are someday planning on selling, wanting to sell your business and retire to that island or retire to Tahiti, what is the best time to begin thinking about an exit plan?Chris Shipferling:
Day one, hands down. Day one, you should be already in your mind formulating when when you are going to exit the business? How you're going to exit that business? And what are your goals for that particular exit? And I would even say maybe day negative 50 when you're in your business planning mode.Andy Splichal:
What about you personally? What what motivates you personally? What what gets you out of the bed and going in the morning when what's exciting about your job or what you're doing?Chris Shipferling:
Man, I love talking to business owners honestly, there's a real passion for that. I love hearing their stories. I know that sounds really cliche and so everybody listening please bear with me. But it's true. I really enjoy hearing it's just everyone has a different everyone has a different story and I don't want to romanticize this but it's like it's like a snowflake man. You know, everyone's different and every single story every single business every single you know every business owner has a way of of creating success and it is so much it's it's a it's really fun to hear how how someone took something from nothing to what we're talking about on the phone. I love it.Andy Splichal:
I can see that. Yeah, I'm sure that's very interesting. Are there any business books out there that you can attribute to your success?Chris Shipferling:
Good to Great by James Collins, I read that early on in my business career, you know, kind of just understanding of different levels and that level five leadership and what that really means to be that Michael Gerber The E-Myth Revisited. That was another book that I read early on, which was, you know, a game changer. I'd say, Purple Cow was one of my first Seth Godin books. And just kind of got my brain thinking differently about marketing in general. And then there are some various other that just are not coming to my headAndy Splichal:
How about the the Oren Klaff books?Chris Shipferling:
Which one I'm sorry,Andy Splichal:
Oren Klaff? I've never switch and Pitch Anything.Chris Shipferling:
No, I've never I've never even seen those books.Andy Splichal:
Oh, okay. I was gonna ask, because his are really dealmaking. And I thought I was gonna get a pinion on some of these true.Chris Shipferling:
Yeah, no, I think only the only sales books I've read is like Jeffrey Gitomer, I think is his name. He, he writes some decent sales sales stuff. But yeah, I call that I take a little bit of a peripheral approach to book reading, I try and read things that are a bit like, just kind of outside of my day to day and things that I know are gonna kind of stretch the brain a bit.Andy Splichal:
Now I see on your website you offer valuations for for Ecommerce businesses, but as well, you offering for digital agencies and SaaS companies.Chris Shipferling:
Of those three, what is the most valuable?Chris Shipferling:
Um, wow, I mean, SaaS is really, really, really hot, it's a hot category. Those tend to fetch, you got a really strong SaaS business, you've got strong ARR, strong MR, MRR, you know, good compounded growth, and you've got strong strong tenants, like you're not having to spend, you know, a ridiculous amount of your revenue on on marketing. Those and you have real size to sap that SaaS platform plus tons of scale left, those are going to be the most valuable assets for sure.Andy Splichal:
For Ecommerce businesses, does it matter what vertical you're in?Chris Shipferling:
Yes, 100%. There are specific verticals that have have more value than others. Just to give you a great for instance, pet pet, pet is, is really hot baby products, very hot. Gift in jewelry, not as much cosmetic and beauty hot category. So yeah, I mean, I could keep going through and tell you what's what's better than the others. But yes, absolutely, there are. There is more demand on specific categories and others. And a lot of it has to do with watch trend, you know, strong research within specific categories that are showing kind of future demand. And then forward demand. travel companies in the next two to three years, swimming pool companies in the next three to four years. Phone any type of phone accessories in the next two to three years. I mean, these are going to be very hot, hot categories.Andy Splichal:
Can a company say they don't want to give up a piece of their sale? Kind of like listing your house for sale by yourself?Are there ways for companies to do that?Chris Shipferling:
Oh, yeah, absolutely. I mean, you know, private equity, private equity has been poaching businesses direct for a long time, and you know, wanting them to sell just directly to them. Same for you know, there's there's been a strong flood of new venture that has been raised to buy Amazon based businesses and even some cases Shopify based businesses. They all want you to sell direct to them. So there's absolutely a way to do that. You run into so many different issues with that. One of which is how do you actually know what the true value of your businesses if you only let one person do the work to try and buy it? Right? How do you actually,Andy Splichal:
That's a big one.Chris Shipferling:
That's huge. How do you actually run a process if you've done it never done it before? I'm not going to wake up tomorrow, if I'm in trouble, and I have to go to court and I'm going to represent myself, I'm going to hire a marquee law firm to make sure I'm not in trouble, right? If I'm, if I got to do some, you know, you're a business owner. And so I we have some pretty complex taxes, do you think I just, you know, go to TurboTax do that stuff. There's no way I could do it myself and probably save the money of the CPA, but I want to make sure I'm optimizing the entire approach to my taxes, right. So lots of good examples plus you signal to the market you're not taking it seriously you signal to the market, you're more of a commodity because you're not taking it seriously. And and trust me if you are a strong brand and you've got real size. And you could sell to a corporate strategic or private equity firm.I mean, just know you're a minnow getting in bed with sharks. So yeah, there's a lot of reasons why you shouldn't do it.Andy Splichal:
Now, if somebody's interested, how could their listener reach you?Chris Shipferling:
Yeah, pretty simple. So if for majority of us who use Google, go to Google and type in Global Wired Advisors, we're the first ones to come up, obviously, globalwiredadvisors.com, for the 3%, that are using Yahoo, and Bing, you can do the same thing. And then on the site, there's plenty of places to get in touch with us, you know, my email addresses on there, my phone numbers on there. I do that for a reason, because I want to be extremely accessible. And I'm really the first point of contact for the firm, you know, I'm the one really talking to clients at first and vetting them out. And then of course, we got our valuation tool, which as I mentioned earlier in the podcast, nine, like a 90,000 foot view. And then if you want to have a consultation with us, we offer you know, free consultations, to really kind of dig in and get to know your business so.Andy Splichal:
That was great. This has been very informative and extremely helpful. I would think for anybody who's thinking of selling soon or planning on doing so one day, before we wrap up, is there anything that you would like to add?Chris Shipferling:
I think we covered a lot of ground today, man, I can't thank you enough for having for having us on. And, you know, for letting Global Global kind of represent itself here and yeah, really, really appreciate your time, Andy.Andy Splichal:
Great. Well, thanks for joining us today. Well, that is it for today. Remember, if you liked this episode, please go to Apple podcasts and leave an honest review. And if you're looking for more information regarding Chris or Global Wired Advisors, I will put the link into the show notes below. In addition, if you're looking for more information on growing your business using Google paid ads request to join to Make Each Click Count Facebook group I have been releasing some all new free live trainings and more will be happening soon. In the meantime, remember to stay safe keep healthy and happy marketing and I will talk to you in the next episode.