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Conversations: We Don’t Go To Church
Episode 3643rd January 2022 • Everyday Disciple Podcast • Caesar Kalinowski
00:00:00 00:20:15

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The church is not a building; it is the family of God on his mission. This may seem simple, or just a matter of semantics, but language creates culture. This is actually a very important distinction to make with people. In this episode, Caesar kicks off a new series of conversations that you'll need to start having with folks if you want to lead them outward on mission, starting with a simple yet crucial topic: We Don't Go To Church! In This Episode You’ll Learn:
  • Why helping people move towards discipleship and mission can be confusing.
  • How you may be swimming against the tide of tradition and misunderstanding.
  • The 5 stages that we all go through when learning new things.
  • A sample of how a conversation about BEing the Church might sound.
Get started here… Conversations: We Don’t Go To Church From this episode: "If you’re tired and frustrated with trying to get people to actually care more and DO more...you’ll definitely want to pay close attention to this series of conversations. If you are leading a church, or are responsible for helping the folks in your church’s small groups or missional communities get on mission, you’ll want to pay close attention, because you will be having these types of conversations a lot."
Each week the Big 3 will give you immediate action steps to get you started.
Download today’s BIG 3 right now. Read and think over them again later. You might even want to share them with others…

Thanks for Listening!

Thanks so much for joining us again this week. Have some feedback you’d like to share? Join us on Facebook and take part in the discussion! If you enjoyed this episode, please share it using the social media buttons you see at the top of this page or right below. Also, please subscribe and leave an honest review for The Everyday Disciple Podcast on Apple Podcasts or wherever you listen. Ratings and reviews are extremely helpful and greatly appreciated! They do matter in the rankings of the show, and we read each and every one of them. Links and Resources Mentioned in This Episode: Free Download of the Big 3 For Episode #364 Coaching with Caesar and Tina in discipleship and missional living. Get Caesar’s latest book: Bigger Gospel for FREE… Click here. Join us on Facebook

Transcripts

Caesar:

If you're tired and frustrated with trying to get people to actually care more and do more, you're definitely gonna want to pay close attention to this series of conversations.

Caesar:

And if you're leading a church or you're responsible for helping the folks in your churches, small groups or mission communities, get on mission and move towards multiplication.

Caesar:

And you're going to really want to pay close attention because you'll be having these types of conversations one way or the other a lot.

Caesar:

I actually think that these 10 topics and conversations would make a great preaching series, wink, wink.

Caesar:

Now, if you're not a church leader, but are getting more and more serious about moving your faith from a Sunday only experience to a lifestyle of discipleship and mission and community with others.

Caesar:

These same conversations will be important for your heart, for your family to have for, for you to have with your family and for you to have with others that you're inviting into community with you either way.

Caesar:

There's no getting around these 10 critical issues.

Caesar:

Needing to be discussed.

Announcer:

Welcome to the Everyday Disciple podcast where you learn how to live with greater intentionality and an integrated faith that naturally fits into every area of.

Announcer:

In other words, discipleship as a lifestyle.

Announcer:

This is the stuff your parents, pastors, and seminary professors probably forgot to tell you.

Announcer:

And now here's your host Caesar Kalinowski.

Caesar:

Okay.

Caesar:

Here we are kicking off the new year.

Caesar:

It's hard to believe.

Caesar:

It really is.

Caesar:

I feel like the last year just flew.

Caesar:

Oh man.

Caesar:

But I am kind of glad to see old 20, 21.

Caesar:

In the rear view.

Caesar:

I really am.

Caesar:

We've talked a lot about that in the last couple of episodes.

Caesar:

Anyway, did you have a big new year's Eve celebration?

Caesar:

Did you, did you go out and party with the amateurs or did you stay home?

Caesar:

We're more at home people these days.

Caesar:

Cause we find we can do exactly what we want and have all the food and types of beverages we want.

Caesar:

Did you go out and bang some pots and pans together outside at midnight?

Caesar:

Or maybe blow off some fireworks.

Caesar:

That's what my grandma did.

Caesar:

I remember one time when I was a kid, we spent the night on new year's Eve at my grandmother's house.

Caesar:

I mean, me and my cousin and we made it up and my grandma never stayed up that late.

Caesar:

But with dish day we made it till midnight and then she didn't have fireworks.

Caesar:

So we just went outside and she said, here, bang these together.

Caesar:

And we bang pots and pans together real loud and not sure why, but anyway, that was a little weird.

Caesar:

So do you have a bunch of new, new year's resolutions?

Caesar:

Did you line those all up?

Caesar:

You get that.

Caesar:

Yeah, I've told you before.

Caesar:

I don't make tons of new year's resolutions, but you know what?

Caesar:

Here's one I'd like to give you.

Caesar:

Can I give you a new year's resolution?

Caesar:

You're going to share this podcast with some folks that you love.

Caesar:

Yup.

Caesar:

That's what you're going to do.

Caesar:

It won't even be a hard one.

Caesar:

You can pick up some new year's resolution momentum just by doing that right now, just by getting in your, in your phone and texting some people Everyday Disciple dot com slash podcast, or sending them a link to when your favorite episodes on Spotify or in your apple device or whatever.

Caesar:

How about that?

Caesar:

You make that a resolution right now.

Caesar:

I'm going to share this podcast.

Caesar:

Yeah.

Caesar:

And you could even make it a, like a once a month.

Caesar:

I'm going to share it or something.

Caesar:

That'd be awesome.

Caesar:

And here's a bonus one and you're going to join the Facebook group this year.

Caesar:

If you haven't done it already, I need to see in there, I need to hear your voice.

Caesar:

I need your ideas in that Facebook group for new episodes.

Caesar:

All that stuff.

Caesar:

So please go over to Facebook, look us up and you'll find Everyday Disciple dot com or Everyday Disciple Podcast.

Caesar:

Or you can go to Everyday Disciple dot com forward slash Facebook.

Caesar:

Take you right there.

Caesar:

No problem.

Caesar:

Now here's something new for us.

Caesar:

We have a new sponsor for the podcast, for the show.

Caesar:

It's in fact, our first official sponsor and that's Missio Publishing.

Caesar:

You may have heard me mentioned them before, uh, Missio publishes some of my books.

Caesar:

I have the gospel primer there, right?

Caesar:

Eight weeks to greater gospel, fluency and community, and all that.

Caesar:

Many of you have used that if you've not, oh, it's been such a blessed resource by God.

Caesar:

So many people out of 50, 60,000 people at least have gotten that and done that.

Caesar:

My bigger gospel book is with them and they're going to be putting out two more of my books in the coming year.

Caesar:

Pretty excited about that.

Caesar:

But Missio publishing.

Caesar:

I really do think the collection of the best Missional Community resources for moving people towards mission, like the tangible kingdom primer or growing them in their gospel fluency, like the gospel primer, helping them get out and love serving people and doing acts of mercy and justice through the justice primer.

Caesar:

There's other books.

Caesar:

There's lots of stuff there and it's all from practitioners and field tested and you're going to love it.

Caesar:

So I hope you'll check that out.

Caesar:

If you're leading a small group or Missional.

Caesar:

And you want the best resources for developing your folks on mission, please visit them there@missiopublishing.com.

Caesar:

Pretty easy.

Caesar:

Right.

Caesar:

Missio, just like it sounds.

Caesar:

M I S S I O Missio publishing.com.

Caesar:

Thanks.

Caesar:

Now to kick off the new year here on the podcast, we're starting a new series called conversations in the coming weeks.

Caesar:

I'm going to be giving you 10 super important conversations.

Caesar:

You'll want to be, or need to be having about discipleship and mission with folks.

Caesar:

If you want to help them and help your people in your community, your family, or your whole church, truly grasp discipleship as a lifestyle and Missional living.

Caesar:

In order to help them embrace the gospel, lived out in all of life.

Caesar:

And I know you, if you're listening right now, this is your hope and your goal, and you're either doing it or you're moving towards that type of life and helping folks in your life, your church and small groups and all that move towards greater Missional engagement.

Caesar:

And there are a lot of conversations that you're going to have to have along the way.

Caesar:

And as the conversation around being Missional has come kind of front and center again within certain church circles.

Caesar:

For sure.

Caesar:

And as many in the church are waking up to this idea of having smaller micro church types of groupings and gatherings.

Caesar:

It seems that many of us struggle to grasp and, or explain the basics to others.

Caesar:

What's different about this, or what's this going to cost?

Caesar:

Or how much time are you talking?

Caesar:

All that kind of stuff.

Caesar:

There's a series of conversations.

Caesar:

That we've had with people over the years.

Caesar:

And I want to share with you now.

Caesar:

So even when you feel like, I think we're getting it, but maybe you're struggling to explain it or help people move towards that.

Caesar:

The reality of who we are as Christians, as the church and as disciples, while having historical and eternal implications has become somewhat muddled in our modern understanding.

Caesar:

And.

Caesar:

dialogue This series that we're going to start today is a series of short conversations.

Caesar:

And it's meant to offer kind of a starting point, a way to get, or keep the dialogue going around.

Caesar:

Some of the key issues surrounding who we are as the church and what our mission really is, which is making disciples of Jesus.

Caesar:

That's it.

Caesar:

So if you're tired and frustrated with trying to get people to actually care more and do more.

Caesar:

You're definitely going to want to pay close attention to this series of conversations.

Caesar:

And if you're leading a church or you're responsible for helping the folks in your churches, small groups or missional communities, get on mission and move towards multiplication.

Caesar:

And you're going to really want to pay close attention because you'll be having these types of conversations one way or the other a lot.

Caesar:

I actually think that these 10 topics and conversations would make a great preaching series.

Caesar:

Wink wink.

Caesar:

Now if you're not a church leader, but are getting more and more serious about moving your faith from a Sunday only experience to a lifestyle of discipleship and mission and community with others.

Caesar:

And these same conversations will be important for your.

Caesar:

For your family to have for, for you to have with your family and for you to have with others that you're inviting into community with you, either way, there's no getting around these 10 critical issues needing to be discussed.

Caesar:

Otherwise you'll feel like you're trying to swim against the tide of tradition and misunderstanding.

Caesar:

And that's because if you want to see movement from one thing to another, from unbelief to belief, Static to active or from traditional forms to more Missional forms or people who are consumeristic.

Caesar:

You want to move them towards active participation.

Caesar:

There are five stages that all movements and changes like this follow.

Caesar:

Everybody follows the same five things.

Caesar:

I call them the five E's.

Caesar:

This is what they are that they have to be exposed before they can embrace new ideas.

Caesar:

And if they don't embrace it, then probably they won't engage it.

Caesar:

And desire equipping and, but if they do, then they can begin to expand that outward.

Caesar:

And so if you think about those five E's that movement, people have to be exposed in order to embrace.

Caesar:

If they embrace it, then they can engage it and then get some equipping and expand.

Caesar:

So what I want to do is I want to help you learn how to have these really important conversations.

Caesar:

In some ways to expose people to these ideas so they can embrace them because often what happens is we go, Hey, our church is moving towards this.

Caesar:

Or, you know, our small groups have been so inward focused and we're going to start doing this now.

Caesar:

And what we do is we try to go straight to engage.

Caesar:

That's the third E without helping them be exposed first in some ways that they can process so they can embrace it.

Caesar:

Otherwise they feel forced.

Caesar:

Things start to feel like law.

Caesar:

So let's get started.

Caesar:

The first conversation today's conversation is we don't go to church.

Caesar:

The church is not a building.

Caesar:

It's the family of God on his mission.

Caesar:

And this may seem simple or just a matter of the words we use, but language creates culture and this is actually a very important distinction to make and understand in order to truly live the life that God has for us as his people.

Caesar:

It's sort of the starting point.

Caesar:

Now I know that the short dialogue that I'm about to share this conversation may seem a little canned or even a little corny in places.

Caesar:

Well, that's how it is.

Caesar:

Sometimes when you write down things that are more spontaneous, forgive me.

Caesar:

I'm trying to give you handles for.

Caesar:

And other important topics that you're going to run into all the time.

Caesar:

And I know that you'll need to be having a lot of conversations like this.

Caesar:

As you help folks who have spent years in traditional church settings, if you want to move outward.

Caesar:

By the way, this conversation that I'm about to share with you and all the others that will be in this series, they're available in a free e-book that I'll give you called be the church it's available right now at Everyday Disciple dot com.

Caesar:

It's right on the homepage.

Caesar:

So if you want to download that.

Caesar:

I'm taking you a little bit deeper, but if you want to have those conversations in print form with a really cool image, that kind of illustrates it to go with it.

Caesar:

Go and get that.

Caesar:

Go ahead and jump on that.

Caesar:

It's right on our homepage at Everyday Disciple dot com.

Caesar:

Okay.

Caesar:

So here's how a conversation about today's topic.

Caesar:

We don't go to church might sound, we'll see you at church on Sunday.

Caesar:

Are you bringing your friends from work hollered, Sherry as she walked across the parking lot?

Caesar:

What do you mean mark playfully responded.

Caesar:

You are going to church next week.

Caesar:

I'm planning on seeing you this weekend, but I'm not going to church.

Caesar:

In fact, I'm never going to church again, Sherri looked puzzled.

Caesar:

If you mean, am I going to the building where the church gathers together this Sunday, I'm hoping to, you know what I mean?

Caesar:

Are you mess with me?

Caesar:

Sherry shot back.

Caesar:

Mark opened up his car door and grabbed a napkin out of the glove box.

Caesar:

Let me show you something Sherry.

Caesar:

It may seem obvious and I've only got a minute before I have to go, but this is kind of a big deal.

Caesar:

Mark started out by drawing a simple picture of a building with a cross on top.

Caesar:

This is what most of us growing up have come to refer to.

Caesar:

As the church are building the place where Christians go usually on Sunday to worship and listen to the preacher.

Caesar:

Then mark added arrows pointing toward the building.

Caesar:

As he talked, indicating people heading to the building together.

Caesar:

But the Bible never describes the church as a building.

Caesar:

It always refers to the church as a people.

Caesar:

God's people in Christ who are now sent by the holy spirit, out into all of life to be the body of Jesus.

Caesar:

Mark added another simple drawing to the right of the first one that showed a group of people with arrows indicating outward.

Caesar:

I think this is a better picture of the church.

Caesar:

Uh, people who are sent by God who are outward focused, certainly not a building or contained within four walls for an hour or two each week.

Caesar:

Sherry ran her hand through her hair and responded.

Caesar:

We don't go to church.

Caesar:

We are the church.

Caesar:

I like it, but maybe that's just semantics maybe, but I think it's more important than that.

Caesar:

It might just be the beginning of straightening out.

Caesar:

Our thinking about who we really are as Christians does going to that building and Sunday or any other day, make us a Christian or a child of God?

Caesar:

No, it doesn't mark said, I'm not sure when in history we started referring to a building as the church, but it's pretty bad theology and has only added to the pattern of doing our religious activities and living out our faith apart from the culture.

Caesar:

And in everyday life, we live separate from those in our city or neighborhood who need to hear and see the gospel in action so they can come to belief so they can experience Jesus.

Caesar:

I can see that Sherry said, and I don't want my kids growing up thinking that the church is just a place.

Caesar:

We go on weekends or during the week for Awana meetings.

Caesar:

I want them to see themselves the way Jesus does.

Caesar:

They are the church every day, wherever they are.

Caesar:

Cool.

Caesar:

I'm working hard to change my thinking on this.

Caesar:

I think it matters.

Caesar:

Anyway.

Caesar:

I still plan to see on Sunday when the church gathers together, mark said with a smile and I hope my friend will be there to meet you.

Caesar:

See you then.

Caesar:

Now I think you can see why this is an important conversation to be having and rehaving.

Caesar:

If we cannot get this simple distinction across to folks, then we're going to have a really hard time helping them understand, believe and live out of their true gospel identity.

Caesar:

Which by the way is the topic of our next conversation.

Caesar:

Next week, see early on for us, we realized that if we didn't help break some of that bad theology and bad language that we all inherited, we were really sort of sledding uphill, trying to get people to believe other things and start to live out of their identity.

Caesar:

In the early days of Soma, we had this conversation.

Caesar:

All the time with people and with our kids.

Caesar:

And we'd say things like on Sunday, even like, Hey, if you came to church today, this is the last time you get to come to church because you are the church or you're not, but we hope that you'll trust the father.

Caesar:

You'll trust Christ.

Caesar:

And you'll begin to walk with us in his ways as we live on mission together.

Caesar:

See, we had that conversation a lot because we knew that we needed to help our folks increasingly live out of our being.

Caesar:

And that, that had to start by them understanding that we don't go to church.

Caesar:

We are the church, which has really big implications that does.

Caesar:

So don't think this is no big deal or fear having this type of conversation with people.

Caesar:

If you love them, you will.

Caesar:

We don't want to leave them with this bad, crazy theology.

Caesar:

That's kind of a roadblock to other stuff.

Caesar:

And I think you'll see how this type of conversation will lead all sorts of other really important discussions as well.

Caesar:

Hey, if you're interested in learning more of this kind of stuff and having a full framework and having all my resources for discipleship and missionand that's what we offer in our coaching cohorts.

Caesar:

So you've heard me say this before.

Caesar:

I would love to set up a short zoom call, get to know you better and tell you all about our coaching and hopefully get you started with Tina.

Caesar:

And I soon we coached together as couples.

Caesar:

You can get a lot more information on that and even set up that little zoom call.

Caesar:

Real simple, just go to Everyday Disciple dot com forward slash coaching it's Everyday Disciple dot com forward slash.

Caesar:

Now as always, I want to leave you with the big three takeaways from today.

Caesar:

So if nothing else, you don't want to miss these and you can always print these off, get a PDF of the big three for any week you want, by going to Everyday Disciple dot com forward slash big three.

Caesar:

Now here's the big three for this week.

Caesar:

One language creates culture.

Caesar:

How we talk about things, especially if they're, so well-worn that they've lost.

Caesar:

Their meaning is really importantmany of the challenges you'll face when trying to transition your family, your church or community toward discipleship as a lifestyle will require you to give new fuller meaning to many of the things we've been taught in church, all of our lives without having Frank conversations sometimes over and over for a while around the simple, yet crucial issues.

Caesar:

It only leads to further misunderstandings and unspoken expectations.

Caesar:

To understanding that we don't go to church.

Caesar:

We are, the church is the beginning of the process of helping people move away from the do to be distortion.

Caesar:

You know, you've heard it.

Caesar:

We go to church because that's what Christians do.

Caesar:

No, you are the church.

Caesar:

And we get to do all kinds of stuff together on his mission.

Caesar:

Not just attend meetings while sitting in rows on Sunday.

Caesar:

And number three.

Caesar:

Who do you need to have this conversation with today?

Caesar:

You probably already have people in your mind's eye that you've already been thinking about.

Caesar:

I need to have this conversation with them or with everybody go for it, or maybe send them a link to this episode.

Caesar:

And then after they've listened, get together and discuss all of this.

Caesar:

And if you're married, be sure to listen to this and have a conversation around this topic with your spouse and with kids.

Caesar:

Like Sherri in the conversation I shared you don't want your kids growing up thinking that the church is just a place you go on weekends or during the week for Awana, you want them to see themselves the way Jesus does.

Caesar:

They are the church wherever they are every day.

Caesar:

Okay.

Caesar:

Well, like I said, these are short conversations.

Caesar:

And maybe somewhat shorter episodes on the podcast, but I'm hoping you'll listen to all of them in the conversations series and share these episodes with others that, you know, will need to hear this.

Caesar:

Maybe you'll start to change their thinking.

Caesar:

You may want to actually send links to each of these 10 episodes in the series, as we go along to your elders and community group leaders, church staff, and this'll be a bit of a conversation starter for you.

Caesar:

And don't forget to go and download that.

Caesar:

Be the church ebook that has all the conversations we'll have in it to use.

Caesar:

As you start to have these conversations, you can read these out loud or just use it as a.

Caesar:

And you can get it right now on the homepage.

Caesar:

Remember I told you Everyday Disciple dot com.

Caesar:

It's right there at the top.

Caesar:

You can't miss it.

Caesar:

Well, that's it for now.

Caesar:

Join me next week as we continue on in this conversation series, and we're going to talk about who we are, and this is about having a conversation on our gospel identity with folks who have never really thought about it much, and you're going to dig it.

Caesar:

I'll talk to you soon.

Announcer:

Thanks for joining us today.

Announcer:

For more information on this show and to get loads of free discipleship resources, visit Everyday Disciple dot com.