Do you know the difference between being reliable and being accountable?
In this episode of "The Business You Really Want," hosts Gwen Bortner and Tonya Kubo break down the concept of true accountability and why it’s crucial for achieving sustainable success in business. Learn the key differences between tracking, reliability, and accountability, and how fostering a culture of non-judgmental accountability can transform your business operations and outcomes.
Here’s what you can expect in this episode:
Key Takeaways:
Ready to build a culture of true accountability in your business? Try this:
MENTIONED IN THIS EPISODE
The Everyday Effectiveness team practices true accountability internally and in partnership with their clients. If you’d like to experience the Weekly Course of Action for yourself, join the waitlist here: https://forms.gle/eqSzk6oktYdoCUaM9
If you enjoyed this episode, please subscribe and leave a review!
Also, be sure to check out Episode 10, where we discuss building a resilient business strategy that can adapt to any challenge.
Gwen Episode 9: Accountability is saying.
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:Did you get the result that
you were wanting to get?
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:If you didn't, why not?
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:And is that a problem or
is that not a problem?
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:EPISODE 7 TONYA: Are you feeling
overwhelmed, stuck, or uncertain about
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:how to grow your business without
sacrificing what really matters most?
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:Welcome to The Business You Really
Want, the show for women ready to build
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:a sustainable, fully aligned business.
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:Aligned with what, you ask?
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:You.
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:Your values.
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:Your life.
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:Seriously.
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:It is possible.
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:I'm Tonya Kubo, and along with
business advisor extraordinaire Gwynn
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:Bortner, we're here to show you how.
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:Tonya Episode 9: Tanya here with
none other than my co hostess
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:but the mostest, Gwen Bortner.
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:Gwen, if you're just catching the
show for the very first time, is
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:an expert in business operations.
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:She is the CEO of Everyday Effectiveness.
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:And she is probably Hands down
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:the best person I have ever met
when it comes to accountability.
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:And so today what I want Gwen to do
is I want Gwen to educate all of us,
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:including me on What true accountability
is and how it fuels sustainable success
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:because I'm not gonna lie I'm one of
those people who did not go into business
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:for myself to be told what to do by
other people So I'm resistant to this
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:But I know you well enough Gwyn to trust
you that when you tell me it's good
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:for me I will take the bad medicine.
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:So tell me what is true
accountability and why should I care?
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:All
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:Gwen Episode 9: So,
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:the first thing that people get
wrong is they think being reliable
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:and accountability are the
same thing, which they are not.
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:Um, so, you can be completely reliable
and not accountable, and you can be
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:completely unreliable and accountable.
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:Tonya Episode 9: explain that to
me because I just heard You Okay.
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:Gwen Episode 9: here's the thing,
accountability takes two people.
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:Reliability is about an individual.
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:Okay.
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:Tonya Episode 9: Okay.
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:Gwen Episode 9: and so, but people
will conflate the two, thinking that if
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:I'm doing the stuff that I'm supposed
to be doing, then I am accountable.
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:Well, or they'll say I'm
accountable to myself.
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:Well, no, that actually is not.
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:If you look up an actual definition
of accountability in like a Webster's
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:Dictionary, it will say, Reporting.
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:to and you can't report to yourself.
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:I mean, you can think about it,
but it's, not the same as reporting
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:to And so it takes two minimums
to can, you can use more, but
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:Tonya Episode 9: Mm hmm.
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:Gwen Episode 9: two to
have true accountability.
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:Now, part of the true accountability where
it really makes the difference is it's
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:not just reporting, but that the person
that you're reporting to or people, but
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:the person that you're reporting to.
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:actually is, cares about your
result and that they're also
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:owning part of this relationship.
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:It's not just like, well, um,
you know, send, send me the
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:information and, you know, I'll,
I'll, I'll keep track of it for you.
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:Well, that's not actually
true accountability.
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:Saying, Hey, I noticed
that you haven't sent it.
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:And or saying, I saw this happen.
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:Let me give you some feedback.
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:Where, where I'm really paying
attention to the details of what.
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:the back and forth is of whatever
we're being accountable about.
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:That's where true accountability happens.
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:So it's not just, you know,
checking it off like a task list.
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:That, that, that is not
true accountability.
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:That's tracking.
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:And that's Data, and that's
information, and you know how I
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:feel about data and information.
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:I love that stuff,
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:Tonya Episode 9: Right.
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:Gwen Episode 9: but that
is not real accountability.
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:Real accountability takes both people
caring about the result of the person
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:who's being held accountable, and it
does take at least two people, and it
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:does take a back and forth interaction,
not just a one way interaction.
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:Tonya Episode 9: Okay.
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:So, and you've taught me
three things just now.
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:So you've taught me, um, tracking,
which is like done or not done, right?
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:It's my list of things.
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:I did it or I didn't do it.
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:Then there's reliability, which is, I
said I was going to do it, so I did.
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:Or I trust that that person's going to do
the thing that they said they would do.
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:And then accountability is related,
but it's this whole other thing
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:that, isn't just independent.
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:You said that's key, right?
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:It has to involve at least one
other person and there has to
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:be some back and forth with it.
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:And the reason I'm making the face
I'm making is because mentally and
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:you know, I do this all the time.
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:Like I run everything through a
use case in my brain and it always
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:looks like I'm rolling my eyes at
people when really I'm just thinking.
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:I, you know, I think of all the
accountability groups out there and
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:all the ones I've been in, right?
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:I've been in an accountability group
where my job was, you know, at the
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:beginning of every week, I was supposed
to write out my task list for the week.
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:Like, these are the things that
before my head hits the pillow on
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:Friday, I'm going to do these things.
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:And I've had ones where it was the end of
the week where I was supposed to report
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:on everything I did this past week.
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:And In some cases, somebody was looking.
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:Um, in many of those cases, you know,
really the bounds of the program was
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:simply, it would be checked off, right?
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:My name got a check mark because
I did the thing, but nobody really
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:circled back with me on any of it.
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:And in other cases, they'd circle back,
but it was really like, good job, good
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:job doing the thing you said you would do.
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:But, Nothing else, right?
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:And, and definitely not an inquiry in
maybe like what came up that I wasn't
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:expecting or any sort of examination.
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:And when you're talking about the
two way conversation, it sounds
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:to me like part of accountability
is also not just, did you do it?
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:But that exploration
about what else came up.
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:Is that accurate?
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:Gwen Episode 9: I will say
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:it's accurate for my definition.
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:Um, you know, this is where probably
other people would argue with me and
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:say, no, no, no, that's not needed.
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:But
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:Tonya Episode 9: Yeah.
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:Gwen Episode 9: for for me,
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:true accountability says, not only
are we making sure that the thing
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:that we're doing is getting done,
but we're also examining, and I like
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:that word that you used, examining is
really a great word for it, that we're
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:examining what was done and saying,
Was that actually the best thing to do?
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:Um, it, did we learn anything from it?
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:Are, are there, you know, and sometimes
sometimes we don't learn anything from it.
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:That's okay, and maybe
there's not a lot to examine.
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:That can be true.
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:That, but for me, part of the
accountability is, is is doing that
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:examination on an ongoing basis.
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:And, you know, sometimes it is about,
woohoo, nice job, you got something done.
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:You know, I mean, it doesn't
always, everything doesn't have to
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:have this deep, important meaning,
because that's not the way life is.
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:But there are things that do, and not
paying attention to that means that you
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:aren't really being held accountable.
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:And, and, and to me, we often can't see
the things that have meaning, um, for
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:ourselves, unless either someone has
asked us to really think about it, because
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:we're, you know, we're entrepreneurs,
we're busy, we're doing things.
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:Um, or, um, We just can't see it
for ourselves because sometimes,
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:you know, it, it is hard to
do true, true self reflection.
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:I don't care what anyone says.
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:It's, you know, it's,
it's why therapists exist.
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:It's hard to do.
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:It's hard to do true self reflection.
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:And so that, that to me, that's
part of what the accountability is.
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:Someone saying, huh,
this seems interesting.
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:You might want to pay attention to that.
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:Tonya Episode 9: Okay.
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:So
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:like, I hear you.
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:And I believe you.
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:And yet, I can also imagine, okay fine,
pull from my own recollection, examples
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:of business owners who would resist that
because they would feel micromanaged.
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:So help me understand, how is what
you're describing not micromanagement?
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:Or how is it, like, maybe you could say,
well, it would be micromanagement if we
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:did this, but it's not when we do that.
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:very much.
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:Mm hmm.
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:Gwen Episode 9: me, micromanagement
has a couple Key elements that I don't
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:necessarily see in accountability.
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:Okay, one of them is It must be
done a specific way or it is wrong
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:Okay, that to me is micromanagement.
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:It's not just where you know,
we're starting here and this is
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:the result we need It's you've
got to do this step this step.
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:That's it That's micromanagement Okay,
that, that to me is one of the first
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:and key definitions of micromanagement.
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:The other is that we're
checking in also at every step.
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:To me that also is micromanagement.
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:That we're, we're saying, did you do it?
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:Did you do it?
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:Did you do it?
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:Did you do it?
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:Which
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:Tonya Episode 9: about now?
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:Did you do it yet?
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:Gwen Episode 9: yeah, how about now?
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:Yeah, to me all of that
is, is micromanagement.
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:Accountability is saying.
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:Did you get the result that
you were wanting to get?
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:If you didn't, why not?
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:And is that a problem or
is that not a problem?
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:Um,
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:because micromanagement would pretty
much always say that's a problem.
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:Because I'm expecting this result.
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:Uh, where for me accountability is
like, you know, I didn't actually
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:do the thing that I was going to do.
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:And, and to be able to say, So is that
a problem or is that not a problem?
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:I say, no, it's actually not a problem.
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:I realized that I was doing this
because someone told me I should, and
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:it's not actually going to move my
business the way I want to move it.
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:Okay, great.
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:That's actually outstanding
accountability, but it has nothing
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:to do with, with micromanagement.
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:Does
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:Tonya Episode 9: Okay.
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:And
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:Gwen Episode 9: that make enough
of a distinction for you or do
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:Tonya Episode 9: It does.
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:No, no, no.
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:That is, but it, just a quick follow up
question is, do you think the motivations
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:behind each are different or do you think
the micromanager actually Like thinks
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:they're holding the person accountable.
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:Gwen Episode 9: Oh, I think often
a micromanager feels like that's
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:how you hold someone accountable.
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:Uh, and, and, and there's a whole giant
conversation that we can talk about
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:why that may be and all the rest of it.
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:We don't need to do that today.
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:But, um, but I do think people feel
like that's accountability where
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:part of my definition is we're
looking at what was the result.
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:And what do we, what did we learn
about that particular result?
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:And is that, whether it was the result
we expected or not, and you know, based
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:on that, what do we need to, what do
we need to know going forward with it?
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:That to me is very
different accountability.
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:I can,
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:Tonya Episode 9: Got it.
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:Okay.
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:So, okay.
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:So now I understand how micromanagement
and accountability are different.
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:I also understand the difference between
tracking Reliability and Accountability.
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:I want to ask, this is going
to sound very trite, right?
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:I want to ask, so what's the big deal?
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:Like, why does this even matter?
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:Um, but rather than ask that, I'm
going to actually be much more
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:specific with you and ask, can you
give me an example of where your
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:definition of true accountability,
where putting that in action actually
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:made a difference in a business?
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:Gwen Episode 9: I can give a great,
great example without revealing
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:actually very many details, quite
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:Tonya Episode 9: Mm hmm,
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:Gwen Episode 9: Um, I mean, we
work together so you know that I
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:have been using an accountability
process with my clients called
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:the Weekly Course of Action,
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:Tonya Episode 9: mm hmm, mm hmm,
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:Gwen Episode 9: for years now.
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:For years and years and years.
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:And, um, One of the things that was
interesting is the first thing I noticed,
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:because at first it was completely
voluntary and I wasn't really, you know,
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:strongly encouraging it and whatnot.
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:I just thought it was a good idea.
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:But what I, the first thing I noticed
was the clients that went through the
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:process regularly, which isn't this
giant, giant, giant process, but they
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:were actually every week going through
the weekly course of action process, um,
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:were actually making progress faster.
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:than similar clients who weren't.
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:And, and what I realized in that process
was this taking a little bit of time every
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:week for the self reflection aspect that
we have in the accountability was allowing
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:them to make better decisions faster
than continuing to do the same thing
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:that wasn't necessarily really providing
the results that they were looking for.
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:So, so that's the,
that's the very generic.
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:But I will say, uh, it was, I don't
know, a year or two ago, we had someone
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:come in who was only doing the, the
accountability aspect, um, uh, with us.
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:They were not getting any one
on one coaching or, you know,
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:any of these other things.
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:And, um, they said at the first
quarter review period, I got more
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:done in this quarter that actually
is moving the needle on my business
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:than I have in the last two years.
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:And, and she said specifically because
I knew someone else was going to look
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:at my report and give me feedback.
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:So it wasn't because I didn't know
how to do any of these things.
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:She said, because I, I've not needed
help in that kind of capacity, but just
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:knowing that someone else actually cared,
helped her do the things she needed to do.
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:And she said, and I knew if
I did it, she'd get stuck.
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:That there was someone who was actually
going to give me some good advice on
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:options or things to consider or a
resource or, or, or something else.
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:So it wasn't that I would just
be stuck and there I would be.
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:That there were, there was
someone who was on my side.
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:Tonya Episode 9: Okay, so your sort of
real life example then is taking that
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:business owner who, like all things
being equal, they weren't actually doing
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:things any differently than they were
doing before except for reporting their
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:activity or their goals and then having
somebody mirror that back to them.
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:You know, read it,
respond, reflect with them.
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:And so what I'm hearing there is
there's just, I think there's a piece
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:of us that if we think we can hide or
we think nobody will find out, we're
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:just not as motivated to do the things.
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:And I don't even want to say the things
that aren't fun, cause there's a lot of
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:aspects of business that aren't fun, that
people go about doing all the time, right?
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:But there's certain things
that are just easier not to do.
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:If nobody's watching.
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:Or, can you think of specific aspects
of business that that's true for?
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:Gwen Episode 9: Um, I
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:do think it's for a lot of the
operations of the business, because
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:very few people, except for a
few weirdos like myself, find the
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:operations actually fun and interesting.
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:They, they find the, the
customer interesting.
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:They find the product interesting.
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:They find the service interesting.
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:They may even find the marketing
and the sales process interesting.
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:Even often when they say they don't
like it, they still find it interesting.
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:Um, because it's, It's, it's creative
and it's innovative and it's, and, and,
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:and they get to use all of the skills
and a lot of times the operations
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:is a little more, um, mundane,
repetitive, um, not as exciting.
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:No one's giving you kudos, um, when.
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:You've cleaned up your books because
no one actually knows that you
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:cleaned up your books other than
you and possibly your accountant.
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:Um, and so, you know, there's a lot
of stuff on the back end that, that
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:doesn't get the same, um, feedback loop.
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:Tonya Episode 9: Mm hmm.
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:Right.
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:Gwen Episode 9: so I really think a
lot of those things are the things
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:that people know need to be done, but
they don't do, not because they aren't
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:capable, not because they don't know
it's important, not, not for any of the
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:reasons, but they're not getting that.
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:Feedback loop that's actually helping
them move forward with their process.
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:Tonya Episode 9: And I can see that.
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:I'm, again, just thinking through
all the things, going, Yeah, well,
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:I wouldn't want to clean those up if
nobody was going to pay attention.
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:Because, you know what?
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:Those things are not fun.
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:And I want gold stars
when I do not fun things.
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:So if nobody's going to notice
that I didn't do it They're not
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:going to give me my gold stars.
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:Gwen Episode 9: Right.
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:But we notice the process,
the course of action.
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:We notice and we, we actually, when
you're doing, if you're reviewing it,
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:you definitely give them gold stars
because you are the emoji queen.
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:But I've started even giving emojis of,
you know, the little, you know, party hats
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:and, you know, the champagne bottles and
the thumbs up and all because, because we
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:did, we all are kindergartners at heart.
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:We all want gold stars.
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:Tonya Episode 9: Yeah, well, and I'm
a big fan of the heart eyes and the
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:star eyes in addition to the party hat,
because I feel like, like, when was
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:the last time any of us got a sticker?
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:Emojis are my version
of stickers these days.
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:Gwen Episode 9: Yeah,
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:Tonya Episode 9: So, okay,
um, so one more question.
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:It may take us a while to go
through, but I think it's important.
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:Do you like how I preface that?
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:Just like, it's okay if you have
to talk long when I know that
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:before I'm asking the question.
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:Gwen Episode 9: it is helpful.
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:Tonya Episode 9: When it comes to
establishing accountability, I just
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:See that it could be possible for
somebody to start out on this path
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:and just do a lot of things wrong.
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:And I think we've already addressed
one of the primary mistakes, right?
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:Which is confusing or conflating
accountability with micromanagement.
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:Okay, do not decide tomorrow you're
going to hold your staff accountable and
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:in holding them accountable you start
to ask them what their process is for
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:processing through their email each day.
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:You're not going to win
any friends if you do that.
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:Do not.
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:Let them just do their
email however they choose.
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:Okay, all that matters is, did they
respond in an appropriate time?
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:But, aside from that, right,
where one mistake being starting
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:to micromanage versus actually
practicing true accountability, what
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:do you think are some other mistakes
that business owners would make?
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:Gwen Episode 9: The first one that
popped into my head, and I'm sure
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:there are others which hopefully will
come into my head also as we, as I,
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:because as an extrovert I'm processing
as my mouth is moving, so there's
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:a good chance more will come to me.
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:But the first one is actually the other
end of the extreme of micromanaging,
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:which is just saying, Did you do it?
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:Okay, good.
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:Tonya Episode 9: Mm hmm.
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:Gwen Episode 9: Which, which for
me is fundamentally the opposite
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:and is the checkbox of just
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:Tonya Episode 9: Mm hmm.
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:Gwen Episode 9: okay, great, you
know, still no processing of it.
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:Now, not everything in life
constantly needs to be processed.
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:Let's, let's
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:Tonya Episode 9: Mm hmm.
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:Gwen Episode 9: know,
serious about that as well.
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:Um,
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:we don't need to process
everything all the time, but
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:looking at the accountability.
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:in, in just the yes or no is, is
not true accountability either.
368
:It really is about saying what, you
know, what did we learn from this?
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:What do we know about this?
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:What, what are, what are
some pieces of information?
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:And like I said, not on everything,
every time, all the time, but things
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:that are really, Feeling core at the
moment, this, this is the important
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:part is at the moment to the business.
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:Certain things are core of the business
today that won't be core to the business,
375
:um, in four weeks because they're
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:Tonya Episode 9: hmm.
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:Mm
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:Gwen Episode 9: running
super, super smoothly.
379
:And, and so the kind of the checkbox, did
we do it is, is all, all that we need.
380
:But when things are feeling, Not
quite right for whatever reason.
381
:Either, should it take more time?
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:Should it take less time?
383
:Are our customers happy?
384
:Are they not as happy as they should be?
385
:Any, any of those things that
we think is touching that, to me
386
:that's where that reflection piece
of the accountability comes in.
387
:Not only did we do it, But could
we think about it differently?
388
:Could we try something different?
389
:Do we actually need to be
doing all of these things?
390
:Or
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:Tonya Episode 9: Mm hmm.
392
:Gwen Episode 9: eliminate some things?
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:Should we be doing more things?
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:You know, it, it, it's, it's all, all
of those, those pieces and being open to
395
:that That thought process all the time.
396
:That, to me, is the real piece of
the accountability, and I think,
397
:like I said, the opposite extreme
is making it so performative
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:Tonya Episode 9: Mm hmm.
399
:Gwen Episode 9: we don't ever get there.
400
:Tonya Episode 9: Right.
401
:Gwen Episode 9: It really
just becomes the task list.
402
:Tonya Episode 9: Yeah, well,
403
:that sounds to me like part of, This
practice of, of accountability and
404
:establishing accountability is okay.
405
:You have to recognize that.
406
:Did you do it or did you not do it?
407
:Right.
408
:That that's not, that's a starting point,
but that's not the only part of it.
409
:But also just doing it isn't
always automatically the win.
410
:Sometimes it is right.
411
:Sometimes, you know, you're supposed
to make, you're supposed to make 10
412
:calls on outstanding invoices and
you don't want to do it because These
413
:are uncomfortable conversations.
414
:On one hand, just making the calls is a
win, but how you have those conversations
415
:and I would imagine the relationship
you have with the other person on
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:the other end of the conversation is
also an important piece to document
417
:in this accountability process.
418
:Gwen Episode 9: Well, and so
419
:let's just use that as a,
as a great, great example.
420
:Luckily, this is not a problem that
we actually deal with very often
421
:within, within my own business.
422
:But, but let's, but let's, let's pretend
because I think it's a great example.
423
:So, um, you know, someone needs to
make 10 calls about past due invoices.
424
:Great.
425
:So did we do it?
426
:Yes.
427
:But did we hear anything consistent?
428
:Right?
429
:So, for instance, they're not actually
receiving the invoice at a place
430
:where they're paying attention.
431
:They don't realize that they
haven't paid the invoice.
432
:Okay?
433
:Well, that's actually a really good
accountability piece of not just
434
:making the call, but saying, hey,
what I'm hearing is out of ten, you
435
:know, eight of the ten people don't
even remember receiving the invoice.
436
:That means we've got a
different, you know, Issue there.
437
:We've got a root cause problem
that we need to, to address.
438
:Um, because my guess is at least half
of them probably would've paid the
439
:invoice if they would've gotten it
440
:Tonya Episode 9: Right.
441
:Gwen Episode 9: Right?
442
:And, and so paying attention
not only to just doing the
443
:thing, but saying, is there any.
444
:And this to me is what the
accountability process is.
445
:Is there anything I learned from that?
446
:Um, and, and the answer
may have been no, right?
447
:If, if we're processing a thousand
invoices, you know, a month and 10 of
448
:them didn't get paid, they're just the
random 10 that didn't get paid this
449
:time, you know, for whatever reason.
450
:Okay.
451
:So just making the calls was
the thing that we needed to do.
452
:Um, but it also could be something
that in three weeks, you notice that
453
:All of them were paid, except for
one, within a week of that call.
454
:And it's like, oh, making these
calls actually is important, right?
455
:Tonya Episode 9: Right.
456
:Gwen Episode 9: And so, so
it's, it's about bringing things
457
:forward into our consciousness
458
:Tonya Episode 9: Okay.
459
:Gwen Episode 9: that we may not know
that we need until further down the road.
460
:Tonya Episode 9: Yeah.
461
:Well,
462
:and I think that's important too,
right, is that what's important
463
:now, or what seems important now,
may not seem important later.
464
:but that true accountability
function helps you figure that out.
465
:Gwen Episode 9: does.
466
:Tonya Episode 9: so this is really good.
467
:Um, anything else that you
think a listener should know
468
:about true accountability?
469
:Cause I do feel like you talk about
it differently than other people.
470
:So
471
:Gwen Episode 9: Um.
472
:First, I will say, I never realized it
until you and I started working together.
473
:Tonya Episode 9: I was like,
wait, you're a unicorn.
474
:I never hear this.
475
:Gwen Episode 9: helpful because
it was like, what is different?
476
:And I will say, the first is, I or someone
on my team is going to read every weekly
477
:course of action document every week.
478
:Um,
479
:And they know that.
480
:And, you know, if I'm out
on vacation for three weeks,
481
:then usually, Tanya, it's you.
482
:But, but also, Andrea, who is technically
the person doing the, I'm just checking
483
:the box piece to make sure that you
did it, um, I'm thinking a couple
484
:weeks ago, she, as she was checking,
checking the box, noticed a comment
485
:and said, hey, let me reach out to
you, I've got some resources on this.
486
:So not her job.
487
:Tonya Episode 9: Right.
488
:Gwen Episode 9: At all, um, I mean,
truly, that is not her job, but because
489
:we use this accountability within our,
within our own team, she's used to
490
:looking at it, she's used to thinking
about it, she's used to responding, and
491
:when she saw that she could, she could
help, she just immediately did that.
492
:Tonya Episode 9: Mm hmm.
493
:Gwen Episode 9: Which is
back to, it creates this
494
:ongoing behavior for everyone.
495
:Tonya Episode 9: Right.
496
:Well,
497
:and it also, I mean, Like, it
just opens the door for people
498
:to help each other out, right?
499
:Because you're not so siloed.
500
:Gwen Episode 9: And, and you're
not seeing it as a criticism.
501
:It's
502
:Tonya Episode 9: Mm hmm.
503
:Gwen Episode 9: oh,
well you didn't do this.
504
:Shame on you.
505
:It's, so that didn't happen.
506
:Is there a reason?
507
:Do we need to fix it?
508
:Is something broken?
509
:Do we need to be doing it at all?
510
:It changes the conversation.
511
:One of my very, very early on customers
who was doing the Weekly Course of
512
:Action exclusively, um, described
it as non judgmental accountability.
513
:And so I think, I think that's actually,
you know, you said what else is important?
514
:Okay, that's the thing that's important,
is that we don't, we don't approach it
515
:as, Well, what you did was wrong, right?
516
:Or you have failed, or
517
:Tonya Episode 9: You get
518
:Gwen Episode 9: you get an F as
opposed to getting your gold star.
519
:We only give gold stars,
we don't give Fs, right?
520
:Um, and so instead of approaching it
with that, um, right or wrong, yes or
521
:no, good or bad, you know, those kind of
things, which I think often people assume
522
:accountability is, If I didn't do the
thing, then I'm bad, I'm wrong, I failed.
523
:It's, to me, accountability, and this
maybe is part of the thing that makes
524
:what I do different than for some
accountability, is to say, So why?
525
:Why did I not do the thing?
526
:What's preventing you?
527
:Was it actually important?
528
:What, you know, we're asking
other questions, not saying,
529
:Well, obviously you failed.
530
:Tonya Episode 9: Right.
531
:Gwen Episode 9: Right?
532
:Because, you know, we, we've had folks
on their accountability process have
533
:something that they were going to do
this week, and next week, and the week
534
:after that, and the week after that.
535
:And, you know, for a few
weeks, you know, life happens.
536
:I don't get too excited if someone
doesn't get something done in a few weeks.
537
:But at some point it's like,
so I notice this is continuing
538
:to get pushed to the next week.
539
:Do you know why that is?
540
:Is it because you're actually
stuck and you need some help?
541
:Is it because you don't actually So,
if you don't know how to do it, is
542
:it because you realize that maybe
it's not actually that important?
543
:Do you need to even
keep it on here at all?
544
:Tonya Episode 9: Mm
545
:Gwen Episode 9: You know, we're
asking, we're asking questions without
546
:saying, well, obviously you suck
because you pushed this particular item
547
:Tonya Episode 9: Right.
548
:You promised
549
:you would do it this
month and you have not.
550
:Gwen Episode 9: Yeah.
551
:Tonya Episode 9: Okay,
let me recap really quick.
552
:Um, but thank you for this one because
this is, I, I say this, I know at least
553
:every third episode but I feel like this
one could be the most valuable one to
554
:date because You know, if you've been
listening all the way through, you now
555
:know the difference between tracking,
between accountability, and also between
556
:Good golly, what was the third thing?
557
:See, I've already forgotten
when there's tracking.
558
:There's accountability.
559
:Reliability.
560
:We also understand now the
difference between accountability and
561
:micromanagement and where we landed
that I think is so important because
562
:we went through a few different
mistakes that a lot of people make,
563
:but the big one is the judgment piece.
564
:I think Gwen is not only do you need
somebody else to work with you on your
565
:accountability because it has to be a
two way street, but that person has to
566
:to either be non judgmental or they need
to be able to communicate their questions
567
:in a way where you don't feel judgment.
568
:Uh, and I think that is an
important one to land on.
569
:And so what I would love is
for you to email me, right?
570
:Cause we are all about the conversations
around here, both me and Gwen.
571
:Email Tanya.
572
:That's T O N Y A at EverydayEffectiveness.
573
:com, and I would love to know your
experiences with accountability.
574
:Have you had this true sort of two
way reciprocal relationship that we've
575
:been talking about in this episode?
576
:Has it looked different?
577
:And kind of, what do you think about that?
578
:Right?
579
:No judgment, no blame, no shame, but just
very interested to have that conversation.
580
:And thank you again, Gwen,
and we will see you next time.