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182. PJ Harlow - Mold Myths and Transforming Home Health After Mold Exposure.
Episode 18217th March 2025 • The Accrescent: Bioenergetic Healing • Leigh Ann Lindsey
00:00:00 01:13:54

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Hello, welcome back to the Accrescent Podcast. I'm your host, Leigh Ann Lindsey. Today we have PJ Harlow on the show talking to us all about a holistic root cause approach to mold remediation. Mold is something that has been coming up so much lately. I feel like even in kind of pop culture on social media, there's so so much I'm seeing going around with mold and actually when I did a poll a few weeks ago about guests and podcast topics that you guys were really interested in mold was a really really big one that came up multiple times And I think PJ Harlow is such a phenomenal guest to have on. PJ has certifications as a holistic health practitioner a certified CRC professional, she has a virtual consulting company where she helps her clients go beyond just treating mold with chemicals like bleach or covering it up with paints or fogs.

rors a root cause philosophy [:

And she also was kind enough to give us a discount code for the ERMI test, plus an interpretation session with her. So that discount code is LEIGHANN. I'll make sure it's linked below as well, but L E I G H A N N will be that discount code on an ERMI test as well as an interpretation session with PJ. So with that, please enjoy this conversation with PJ Harlow.[00:02:00]

Well PJ, welcome to the Accrescent Podcast. Thank you so much for coming on today. Yeah, thank you for having me. I'm so excited. I've had, I want to say maybe two guests now on the show to talk about treating mold in the body, two different doctors looking at it from that approach, but your area of expertise on this topic of remediation, the home microbiome that I'm so excited to talk about, isn't something that, you know, we've been blessed to have someone on.

it was just so overwhelming [:

I was like, there needs to be a better way to do this, right? Where, where we're not making our homes potentially worse. Yeah. And spending thousands of dollars. These are some of the stories I've heard from clients is how expensive it is. And then it doesn't even really resolve the issue or not fully. And so I'm excited to dive into that.

coming from. Yeah. So, uh, in:

Got really sick. And, uh, I was pretty healthy at the time, you know, like went to the gym five days a week. And, uh, all of a [00:04:00] sudden I just started getting pain in my hands and it started to move into my other joints. And I started to just, it seemed like every week that went by, I would have another symptom.

in my mind, um, or, or, even [:

We, we want to make up stuff. Right. So, uh, so I Really, you know, not just experiencing having your body suddenly betray you, but also just feeling like your words have no meaning or no integrity behind them was just really a jolting experience for me. And, um, My kids started to get sick. My husband started to get sick.

dden. Um, but One day, thank [:

This wasn't normally his personality. He was the more patient of both of us. And uh, The showerhead, we're, I'm really short, he's really tall, so we're always back and forth with the showerhead, and he kind of palm fisted it, like, meh, and it broke, and when it did, all this water went into our wall, and the wall was our bathroom.

And our kitchen was on the other side, and all this water came splashing through the floor. And so we pulled back all of our appliances that were on the other side of this wall, and you could stick your finger through the drywall. Oh my gosh. And we knew That wasn't from that little thing that just happened, though the water was only on for like a few seconds.

And that was the [:

of two kids, two of us, um, we're constantly using that one shower. And so, um, Underneath it was our crawl space where our HVAC was. And additionally, on top of all of that, it was, that was right under it. So it was leaking, it had leaked through the floor, through the subfloor. Into where our air conditioning unit was and also the dryer vent had disconnected so it wasn't drying outside it was going down just shooting hot air into our crawl space.

So it was a total [:

Like I take care of my house. You know, there's this insinuation that like, if you have mold, like you're like lazy and you don't maintain your home. And that's not true at all. I've seen million dollar homes with mold, but, but that's, that's really was the beginning. And I went through, uh, a lot after that, just, our house was so bad, the, when, when we hired a very popular, uh, mold company to come in, um, there's two things in the mold world.

two manuals for both of them [:

All right. Thank you. Well, these people didn't do that. And even though there was visible mold, they put these giant dehumidifiers right next to where that colony was and just dried it out so all of those spores and particulates went airborne and it suddenly made us, like all of our symptoms, a hundred times worse.

walking in the door. I even [:

So I took all his stuff out and just, just, you know, a regular, like LL Bean book bag, right? And I, I put it on the dryer just to like let it dry and, and put all of his books away. The next day it was covered in mold. Oh my gosh. That, I have pictures of it. It's crazy. Like, you know, normally mold doesn't, you know, it usually takes about 48 hours, but that just tells you like how severe.

. Not being treated right by [:

I have to this is this is I have to do something about this and that's why I, that's why we do what we do now. That's really how it started. Oh my gosh. I am so sorry. It sounds though, I mean that was 2016 and your family has since recovered and is doing well. Yes. I'm so glad. Yeah, man. That's brutal. I had, I'll, I'll share really quickly.

There was, I found out the office I had been in for three years. Had mold and it was something similar where it just, I'd get in the office and my skin would start burning. Mm. And my eyes would start burning and I had a headache for months on end. And mold had just never, never even occurred to me. Mm-hmm

t got on my radar other than [:

But it sent me on a little bit of a deeper dive with this, but to your point, like we said, kind of, I think before jumping on, I've had some guests on some doctors on to talk about how to support the body in recovering from mold, but supporting the home in recovering from mold. Even the little tidbits I've heard about it, to me, it just sounds so overwhelming.

And I think what makes it extra tricky, and maybe you can speak to this too, is I would imagine that oftentimes by the time people find it, it's because they already are so sick. Yeah. Which I think only lends itself to the fear mongering and the urgency of, well, I just got to find someone to do something.

bunch of action that ends up [:

Sure. I think one of the key things that I want to, I want to say first that is really important that you brought up that is a great point is that By the time these things are happening and by the time you're digging into like mold. You're scared, you know, because it seems really scary and especially when you first start learning about mold and contamination And it's this thing that's like invisible and we can't see it and there's so much ambiguity because it's invisible Right.

ee anything. There's nothing [:

Not saying husbands aren't ever, but, um, but you mentioned the fear mongering, you know. We have been kind of conditioned to think of bacteria and mold as bad things, right? And, and instead of understanding that they are a part of nature, you know, there's that fear there. And there's so much of this industry.

our toilet just fell through [:

We need to take care of that. But if you find mold in your bathroom, it just didn't get there overnight, right? If it's in your ceiling and like if you're finding mold in some room or something, it took a while to get there. And even being affected with your health, it takes a while for this to happen. My symptoms didn't happen overnight.

They happened over a year period and certainly they increased to the degree where I became bedridden and this is often where what I see in my clients to some people are hypersensitive. That's a little bit different, right? But, um, most of the time it's exposure over long periods of time, so it's really about kind of.

work with first? And that's [:

You're like, Oh yeah, I'm just supposed to get a remediator and they come fix it, right? But, really, you need to very first out, start out, and have someone on your team. Because, as much as I love DIY, I mean, hey, I'm in the health industry and You know, I'm all about doing as, researching and doing as much as you can for your family.

now, and, and this is what a [:

And two, they're financially vested in your, your decisions. So they really can't be completely objective, right? So then you'd get an inspection. Where we, we actually will give you a referral for a class three or higher inspector. That's one of the things that we guarantee with anybody in the United States.

If you work with us, we get you on board stabilized and we provide you with it and an inspector. They'll come assess the situation and write a work scope. Then we were we go into remediation if that's what you want to do. Some people decide. Hey, I don't want to remediate I'm I'm don't want to invest anymore.

st sell it and get something [:

So I want to make that clarification. Now, traditional remediation practices is very much similar to how we have. Allopathic medicine and kind of like functional medicine, holistic medicine. Um, they're totally conceptually different. Traditional remediation can very much be focused on aesthetics and, um, you know, how can we make this appear.

want to clarify too, because [:

Yeah, and you know, just not even Having any type of experience at all for any of you who follow me on Instagram You'll probably have seen that a few weeks ago. I did my first prolon fast mimicking program and I was I was so blown away with how, how easy it was, how accessible it was, the unbelievable results that I experienced that I had to share it here on the podcast.

away was The impact because [:

In the cells, we start purging dead cells that autophagy happens. There's so much cleanup that happens when we're in a fasting state. And the only other way to get into the state is to do a five day water fast, which is. Super inaccessible and hard. That's not something that I don't think I would even ever do But I also did the in body scan at ascent adaptation before doing the diet and after doing the diet because I really wanted to measure Results and I was blown away.

I decided I'm gonna record a [:

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may have a diagnosis of mold [:

Some people are more sensitive. Even some people are hypersensitive. And some people may not even be sick at all. Maybe they are just really want a healthy home or maybe they're thinking of conceiving in the next few years and they just want to, you know, ensure that they're confident about their home's health.

So how we would remediate for someone who's very hypersensitive would not necessarily need to be the same way we would for someone who's not sick at all. Now, theoretically, somebody could come back and argue, well, we should remediate. At the same level at the same level for everybody, but that's just not realistic, especially when it comes to the actual labor involved with some of the cleaning and decontamination.

on the more sensitive scale. [:

What's your budget? And try to work all these things strategically in addition to the fact that at the end of the day, a lot of, uh, traditional remediation companies. much abuse, in my opinion, a lot of antimicrobials, you know, and disinfectants. And in our kind of philosophy, we kind of look at this like we're trying to salvage what's left of the microbiome, right?

ace and fogging all of these [:

It can start creating an environment where sure, maybe you just killed all the little guys and the medium guys and the purple guys, but the ones that really survive are going to be those stealth like organisms. And so you're almost regenerating. with an imbalance, right? You're starting from the negative.

that that environment is not [:

Sometimes you need to use antimicrobials in remediation. You know, there's a difference between, and let me clarify, physical mold removal. Like if you've got a situation where you've got a bunch of moldy drywall, obviously, we need to remove all that. And if there's, you know, some type of sill plate or something that's more permanent, that needs to be cleaned.

e just coming in and using a [:

Oh, PJ, well, what about this product? What about ozone? What about chlorine dioxide? What about, you know, ammonia? What about bleach? What about, you know, even hydrogen peroxide? All, it doesn't matter. Insert product here. If it's a disinfectant, right, it's the same premise, right? It's the same idea. And, you know, we're trying to, at the end, it's almost kind of like rewilding to some degree.

e some probiotic sprays, but [:

But the more I researched and the more I studied, I found that, well, that's not really the same thing because most of those products are, you know, maybe one species, maybe two. And so it's not really replenishing diversity, right? Sure. You may be inoculating with a couple species, but that's not, that's not the same thing, you know, As, as whatever that, that biome was that took, You know, years to develop in, in some ways, even the good biome, right?

hip with like, Mother Earth, [:

We're trying to, like, respect the Way mother nature is and also, you know Antimicrobial resistance is one of the biggest worldwide problems that nobody really talks about in this industry And so we try to really take all these things sure that might not matter to the average Person who's in the middle of a mold crisis who cares about antimicrobial resistance.

ealth currently, I'm looking [:

Mm hmm, completely. I want to take a sec to kind of reflect back some of what I'm hearing already this far. So it sounds like in kind of. Misteps people might take unknowingly or conventional versus holistic. One is either skipping assessment or maybe the not, not the right kind of assessment. And I do want to ask a follow up question on that, um, skipping assessment entirely, just going straight to remediation.

But then what I heard in that is conventional remediation. Sometimes it's just visibly removing the mold that we can see, and they're not looking at the bigger microbiome, or if they are, they're just decimating it entirely. Yeah, a lot of times, um, you know, even the removal part gets missed sometimes and it's just chemical treatments, you know, when you hear language.

eatment, that's almost a red [:

It requires, it makes it more expensive for your client. It makes it more time consuming. Um, and I mean, I hate to say this, but it does. Also give them the option to kind of take a lazy approach, right? Um, and even you, the use of what's called encapsulants, which are, um, it's, it's kind of like a, a fancy way of saying paint.

cause this encapsulate this, [:

This is again, what I was talking about earlier, after going through this remediation, most people are terrified and don't want this to happen again. So here. By this, this, you know, we'll encapsulate everything and the mold won't come back. Right. That's how they present it. But realistically, a lot of those encapsulates won't allow surfaces to dry if they do get wet again.

mold to grow. I often think [:

Even if we're taught everything that we just talked about, it's so easy to go back into, I, well, I don't want mold to grow. Um, yeah, put it on there. Right. But, but they're not really told that, you know, what again. What are we doing to our home's internal microbiome? And additionally, you know, water is the root cause, not mold.

mitigate moisture, you won't [:

I do want to ask quickly about assessment because I think this is also something even in my own experience that I found very confusing. So the, the office I was in, I, I finally spoke up to the landlord. I was like, look, I'm really not feeling well. I think we need to check who knows who they had come in.

They said they had someone come in who said, you know, no, actually the, the quality of the air inside. You know, what compared to outside air, the humidity is not more than the outside air. So there's no issues here and we didn't find any mold and, and that was kind of it. And they were like, bud, we can move you to a different space, this or that.

d I just was like, that just [:

In the traditional sector, air testing is the like numero uno, right? That is what they base everything off of. And unfortunately, Oftentimes, they're very wrong. Air testing, it's strong point is not to, they have like a little tripod and for anybody listening, it's like a little tripod and it has like a little cassette on it and a pump attached to it and the inspector will kind of turn it on for, you know, five minutes and they'll collect the Ambient air in your room.

d an ambient air sample. And [:

We're just gonna look at acorns, right? And so it also has to be acorns that or spores that are actually in the air at the time of the test. If everybody, you know, you think about it, when these guys come in to do testing, Usually, it's during the day, kids are at school, you're at work, maybe you came home to meet them or something, or maybe you stayed home.

s, you know, doing all kinds [:

So that is something that often. Is not really talked about. This is why aggravated air samples can sometimes show a little bit more of what's actually happening in a home. So air testing. I like air testing. For like cavity samples, or if you know that mold is particularly if you're thinking it could be an area and you're kind of using a little bit more strategically, but oftentimes just smack in an air sample in the middle of the room.

part of a lot of peer review [:

And who's really got time to do that? Yeah. It's just a snapshot in time. Mm-hmm . Now. What we usually use, and again, I want to clarify to everybody out there, nothing replaces a boots on the ground inspection by somebody who really knows what they're, they're talking about. Now, you mentioned having somebody to come in and do air sampling that will would be what I would consider like a, um, a level 1 or class 1 mold tester.

tors, even HVAC technicians, [:

Know how to use an air pump, right? And know how to maybe they got trained in house, but they don't have a lot of education in microbiology and building science. This is the science of of of how your home and physics and chemistry work together and really understanding insulation and air flow and dew point and humidity and all of those things.

gs. So it's really getting a [:

With my home and it, and it very often falls short for people who are symptomatic. It did for me, they told me my house was normal, believe it or not. And, um, you know, they said nothing was wrong with, with my house, which was unbelievable with the amount of mold that they found. Afterwards, like, I mean, that house almost killed me and so, you know, I think that there's usually what we usually a [00:40:00] lot of time what we do is we'll do what's called an army dust test, which is really DNA.

Um, and you can start with this or you can start with just going into an, an inspection, but many people like to have that kind of starter evidence. Maybe someone's not really on the same page, you know, oftentimes again, spouses may not agree and, um, you know, they might think, oh, there's nothing here. My house is fine.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Um, so it's usually a nice piece of data that we can start with. It's not going to give us everything, but it can kind of give us some crucial points to let us know what is, what is the biome acting like, you know, what is happening with the indoor common indoor molds or how are they behaving?

ly grow in certain areas. So [:

Lately I've been getting back into having a morning coffee, but after I first have my warm lemon tea Usually i'll even wait until after i've had breakfast to then have that first cup of coffee And i've been loving putting raw honey raw butter And half and half in it. I know it sounds so decadent and it is absolutely amazing And something I look forward to every morning recently, but when i'm drinking coffee, I want to make sure that first of [00:42:00] all It's free of molds because there was a study done that 90 percent of coffee has mold and mycotoxins.

And this is why I love Four Sigmatic so much because they're third party tested for molds, mycotoxins, bacteria, heavy metals. What I also love though is they have a number of different coffees available that are either ground or whole bean. I'm a bit of a snob so I love to buy the whole bean coffees.

But it's so neat because they have Their Focus coffee blend that has extra adaptogens to help support brain health. They have their Gut Health coffee blend that I'm really excited to start using because it has probiotics, prebiotics, turkey tail, and chaga mushrooms that have been added to it. They have their Calm Decaf coffee blend that has really calming adaptogens like reishi and chaga and a number of other different blends.

support you in the best way [:

And when I drink it, if you click the link in the show notes, you will automatically receive 20 percent off your first order. I remember I did, I'm completely forgetting the name of the company now, but I ordered some swab tests and some, and then like a plate test. And I swabbed a bunch of places. And, and then I actually did consult with a mold consultant, uh, before I had found you who helped me interpret it.

ut, but he's like, there's a [:

So that's what you need. Cause I was really trying to understand, like, is this something that I can just mitigate while I'm here? Or do I really need to leave this space? Cause the landlords had made it clear. They're not going to do anything about it. And it wasn't worth the fight. You know, if I wanted to legally for something, it wasn't going to be worth that.

And so that really helped me go, oh, okay, so there's mold here that isn't just latent from something, whatever, whatever, like this is active. It can only be here because there's water damage somewhere in this building, even if it's not in my exact unit. And I made that decision that, okay, for me, it's time to leave.

anyone out there, please do [:

Because there's a reason why they're on Facebook and not doing this for a living. And this is no offense, I think that people are just trying to help, um, but they're not professionals. Especially if you're using ERME dust testing, DNA. This is a very complex test that we're using off label. You cannot use the scoring system on there.

he EPA originally did back in:

Context goes [00:46:00] into the interpretation, your symptoms, you know, how the home is maintained, all those things go into, to understanding those results. So that's a really important factor. I want to clarify. That's exactly what I found with this consultant was he was able to go, tell me, tell me what your concerns are.

And of course he didn't make a recommendation. You know, he was very like, I can't tell you to leave or stay. You need to make that decision on your own, which I think is appropriate. But based on what you're saying and the symptoms you're experiencing and what I'm seeing in this report, here's what I can tell you about what's going on.

And I found that incredibly helpful. And, you know, I think you need those different team members. My doctor was doing all the deep. In depth blood work and testing and bioenergetic testing. She was the one who referred me to do this test, but then I went on my own and found this mold consultant to give me some extra insight.

is, it is oftentimes too, I [:

The more we're moving into the future, I think when this first started, um, and, and we were really just getting our eyes open to the mold industry. I think that oftentimes, sometimes, you know, Doctors would have to be providing people with information about their environment because there was nobody else right and vice versa.

listic health consultant and [:

The science that has, you know, from, Where we were, um, when we first kind of opened up into the world of mold with, you know, Dr. Shoemaker's work, and now we fast forward in Dr. Neil Nathan, Jill Krista, you know, all of these really great pioneers in the industry have really pushed this forward. You know, I know so many other doctors as well that are doing.

pecializing in their, in the [:

Um, and that can make it. More overwhelming when you're taking environmental advice from your doctor or, you know, health advice from your environmental, uh, you know, consultant. Yeah, take it. And they might have some insight over the many, many years of working with people. But I think to that point, it is important to have the specialists on each end of that, that can then, you know, bring it all together.

And it's, it sounds like what you do. So how, where you become so helpful for your clients is you're kind of like that team lead that point person of give me, let me get the bird's eye view of everything. Okay. So here's what we need to look at here. Here's where we need to look at there. Here's a couple of companies that we might want to bring in for this.

ir client and the client can [:

And you know, we don't make decisions for you, right? Just kind of how you were talking about, like, I'm not here to get on the phone with your remediation company and said, no, do this, do this, do this. That's not my job, right? That's your IEP's job, your inspector's job, is to write the work scope. But we do, in a way, Teach or empower people to manage their projects, right?

d they're like, this is what [:

And this is, and they, and they're all communicating in a way where, you know, At the end of the day, the expectations, you have to be able to define them to whoever you're working with in order for the team to execute it. You can't just say, make my home healthy. Right. That, that can mean a lot of different things to a lot of different people.

You have to be able to articulate. What exactly that means. And we're here to help you speak their language. We're also here to help you understand what, what are your goals and what does that, what does healthy mean to you? Does it mean sterility? Does it mean you want a healthy home microbiome? What types of products do you want to use?

nd, you know, remediation is [:

Really well, because it's not a one and done. It's not like they do the job. They leave. They never come back Very oftentimes they're coming back to get equipment or maybe they have to do something over or you know There's still parts to that. So, you know Finding a perfect company in every small town. It just isn't realistic at this point where we are, um, especially since this more medicalized holistic type of remediation is very new, but we can teach you if, you know.

team that is open to working [:

I mean, at this point, you know, we've taken thousands of people through remediation and we're also looking out for your finances too. On average, we save our clients about 12, 000. Um, in, in things that are unnecessary that are again, you know, feeding into that fear. We're not here to like, let that happen.

If something's really worth it and really healthy, we'll explain that to you and let you decide. But if it's just, you know, feeding into that fear mongering, I don't, I'm not really a big proponent of that, but again, it's not my decision. Some people may decide to do those things. But at least they know, right?

like going back and saying, [:

And at the end of the day, you know. Again, I can't promise there won't be any stress, right? Or that, um, you know, it won't cost any money and that there's some trick somewhere that you can make this, you know, snap your fingers and it'd be all over, but at the end of the day, I feel like There's a reason why some of us go through this and I try to look at like try to find the the light in that of like, what am I learning from this?

. Oh, I love that. There's a [:

One is the word project. And I think that's important for people to hear is it is, it's a project which insinuates on ongoing in the sense that it's rarely, I think, going to be just a pop in for a day visit done. And so if you're seeing that, that's probably a red flag to look out for. And if you want it done in a way that I think is going to be sustainable, We do need to think of it as this project, but I also love that you're pointing out the empowerment because to your point, if you're just swooping in telling them what to do, maybe in the moment that feels really good, but then when they have to sit down with that contractor or that inspector or whoever, there's still so much fear that rises up.

not this crutch, you're this [:

Like we're saving money, but really what I hear beneath that is it's about this bioindividual approach in holistic medicine. This is a lot of how we look at it, where the idea of just blanket protocols, although we see that sometimes in holistic medicine too, but blanket protocols. Are never going to be a perfect fit because no no one person is the same just like no one home is the same And so having someone though like you who can has a broader perspective and more information and insight you can go.

big on vocabulary and terms [:

I don't even think people really know what those mean and I don't say that to shame anybody I didn't know what they meant at first, you know at when I first got sick with mold I heard people saying hypersensitive and then I started picking that up and I was like, oh i'm hypersensitive too, right? And then when I really worked to Break down those definitions.

ow I can speak for myself. I [:

And you get so caught up in these diagnoses and kind of defining yourself by like, I have mold illness, right? Because you know, if I really dig underneath that, it's because I felt like. I didn't have any integrity as I spoke of earlier and I felt like people didn't believe me And you know, I wanted to be believed so much that I I was clinging to You know this terminology and I think when we really break that down oftentimes a lot of the people that we work with who Have filled out our paperwork at first, they checked off that they were hypersensitive, but we, I actually made like a little kind of questionnaire and it kind of spits out, you know, some, some information of like how [00:59:00] severe things are and oftentimes people are not actually hypersensitive, they may be sensitive, but not hypersensitive.

And that's a big difference there. Yeah. We would remediate. Okay. Or if we'd, we'd, we'd even remediate at all for somebody who's hypersensitive. It's very different for somebody lower on the scale of sensitivity. Even when you say the word sensitive, there's a spectrum to that. Right. You know, and, and I think that oftentimes we don't think of that when you're, when you're learning about risk.

m, you know, for my clients, [:

We have a virtual library. And a lot of members were coming to me and saying, PJ, can you make us like a checklist of like, what to look for in a healthy home? So I was like, okay, cool. I made a checklist. And then everybody was coming back and saying, okay, the checklist is cool, but it's not enough. Like we're still confused about like certain things and we don't understand, you know?

Um, so I was like, okay, so I made a blueprint to it. And then People were still coming back and saying, I'm still confused because I don't understand how this applies to me, right? And I always use this one example because it's a very easy example. Like, I could say chimneys are risky, right? Why are they risky?

ey're not flashed correctly. [:

And over time, a lot of times it can be a construction defect. It can be not the flashing might not be sticking there properly, or somebody might have missed a spot or over time it starts to, you know, um, uh, just erode. Yeah. Um, but it's a common problem that we see with Fireplaces is that they leak a lot.

say, okay, great, check, no [:

If that's the case, you know, there's no like perfect recipe. Sleep in a, sleep in a grassy yard. Yeah, yeah, but that's what I mean. It's more about, um, and this is where I really thought about it. I was like, okay. How do I teach people how to assess risk with context and their own context, right? And so I created a whole guide, um, called risk profiling and home health intelligence.

understanding, like, to your [:

You might not want a fireplace because you're just more sensitive at this point in your life. But if you're not sensitive at all, then hey, maybe that could work for you. In Michigan, you know you're going to need that fireplace probably because you might lose power. 10 times during the winter storms. So that must be an absolute for you.

So, you know, it's, it's learning how to work through all of these things individually, because as you said before, every home is different. There's not one perfect recipe for a perfect, healthy home. It's about understanding. How to go in, know what areas are risky, and how to really identify severity as well.

e able to triage that. Yeah, [:

I call it where it's like, we're here. Okay, great. We're just going to go to the opposite. I see this a ton in the therapy world where it's like, Oh, you're, you're dependent. We need to take you all the way to total independence or. You know, you have depression. We need to take you all the way into this joyful spectrum.

y, and I'm reading this book [:

And it's about like, What is my soul needing? What is my soul communicating? The psyche, the soul is always trying to be known. How can I tune in and hear it better so that I can make decisions that are really aligned for me. And that's even what I'm hearing you're doing in your own way is I want to help you.

No, you so that when you go out into the world and are assessing all these things, you know, what's important to you, because what might be important factors to someone else is completely different. Yes. Yes. Yes. Thank you. You just broke that down beautifully because even, you know, I, I tried to even teach this.

J, what is your favorite air [:

I was just like testing different things out of like, how can I do this? And for a while I wouldn't share because it was, I was like, you don't need to know what my favorite one is. It's about what's good for you. Right. But we live in the world of, Influencers, right? We live in that that world where everybody wants to know what you're using and they want to use what you use.

So I kind of was like, okay, fine. But it's still that kind of premise, though, where, you know, it really should be about, though, what works for you, because there's different types of purifiers for different purposes. Right. Reasons, and they're not all the same, right? And I use specific ones for my home, my, the size of my home and my personal issues.

, you pretty much nailed it. [:

Yeah. Oh my gosh. Well, I can already tell we're going to need a part two, maybe even a part three, um, because it's so fun to just sink so deeply into one of these facets. So I do want to ask really quickly, and then I'll make sure everything is linked below. Where can people find with you? What's the process of working with you or getting more information again?

ite, your socials are linked [:

You know, on the same as RN2, we're not going to be digging deep into your paperwork. We'll read it all in live time. Um, if you want to do an ERME interpretation, if you already have one, you can just drop in. Um, on the other side of things, if You're curious and you're just starting out. We also do have like our flagship product, which is an Ermi plus interpretation.

ve into our membership after [:

And then once you're a member, you get. Discounted access to like our a la carte sessions, um, but that membership package is kind of like a little on boarding type of package. And it comes with a few sessions, just really enough to get you stabilized, get, get, get an inspector out. You know, it doesn't include the inspection, you know, we're not, we don't have any financial relationship with any of the inspectors that we refer.

which are kind of like a new [:

That's encompassed in a guide called Home Check. It's a series of Seven different guides that are really built for, um, people buying homes, but it's also kind of like homeownership one on one it's got a lot of valuable info in it. And then we have another guide that is one of my favorites. It's also a lot, a big favorite.

It's called the pretty little guide to HVAC. And it's an HVAC guide designed for women. Um, and it's written for women. So it's not like. Totally boring. Like who wants to talk about ventilation? Like that's really exciting dinner conversation. Um, but it teaches you everything you need to know, you know, should you get the UV, should you really get your ducks cleaned, how to get.

you're not intimidated. Um, [:

We're such a, a reactive species that we wait till, you know, the, the, the S hits the fan. Um, and we don't want to do that. You don't want to do that. Like you, you have to learn how to maintain your home because it requires maintaining and. I didn't even know where my HVAC was when I, you know, first started in this and that's a, a big shame on me because I worked on the insurance industry.

. Oh yeah. You can have them [:

They're in my link in my bio on my Instagram. So you can find them really easy. Or if you go on my page, you know, you can, there's, you can comment one, two, three on any of my, uh, any of my posts or any of my stories, and we'll send it to you. Amazing. Oh, that's so wonderful. And I'll make sure as much of that as I can is linked in the show notes too, just to make it really easy.

But I always think it's nice to hear, hear from the guest explaining in more in depth. Okay. And here's what we do. Here's how you can reach out. So I love that. I'm so, so grateful to have met you. I just love, again, the nuance, but also how comprehensive it is and how accessible you've made all these different things.

e not taught how to care for [:

And you're like, Oh, all right. Like, I don't know. I don't know half the parts. What's a sump pump? Like, you know, so I get it. Yeah, and just making it accessible, digestible, all those things, and, and not from a shame based way of like, yeah, duh, no one taught us this. Yeah. And also it is our responsibility to take ownership over gaining that education that we might need.

Exactly.

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