Welcome back Within Thin Lines.

In this episode, the Cadre of WTL come together and express their values and experience as stewards of instructors.

Join us in our conversation about how an instructor should be, and the traits that make an instructor a leader.

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"While Excellence is the Responsibility of those amongst these Thin Lines, the Discipline is Strengthened from Within."

Stay Safe, Stay Healthy, Stay Within Thin Lines.

And this is where it excites me because we, we, we change the

culture behind this this stigma that we have in EMS and fire and law and

nursing, is that like, why can't we be training as a conversation, right?

Why can't we influence this positive conversation of education, and this is

exactly the reason why we're doing the tonight's episode, is really talk about

the stewardship of instructors, right?

So without further ado, something that we have forgotten to do.

Good morning, good afternoon, or good evening.

Welcome back with lines.

My name is Vince and I've got the entourage here to my left

on the virtual world, right?

Cause you're, I don't know if the camera's following me.

Busho back.

Hope everything's well.

We've also got Dan Strike and Steve, here I am.

Nice.

Oh, he's pouring himself a little something tasty.

And then Steven Hines is on the the virtual end of the zoom as well.

And today's is Hayden, who is a, was a Currenting student for

our T E C CT Triple C world.

And is now being processed into the instructor position to be part of

that team and have this conversation amongst each other as a testimonial.

I wanted to get a voice outside of us cause it seems like we're

always preaching this whole mindset of education and reinforcement.

But I have somebody from the outside saying, Hey, you know what?

I like what you guys are doing.

I like the way you're doing it.

Just enforce our, our real realism behind it.

And the fact that he quotes our episodes and some of the statements and the

knowledge, and he comes to this show.

He's driven two and a half hours just to have the conversation.

Now he is going off with Dan about ketamine.

This whole thing just ignited to a score.

You know what I mean?

A, we actually got listeners.

That's, that's awesome.

But b, we have somebody who's been influenced by our culture

and our our ch our movement here.

So much so that he actually wants to come be part of it.

That is that is a key aspect here.

So nonetheless Mr.

Hayden, or Lieutenant, what did I call you earlier?

I don't remember.

I don't remember either.

Introduce yourself.

Tell us who you are, where you're from, what you're doing, why you're here.

My name's Hayden.

I grew up in Crystal Lake, Illinois, about two hours outside of where Vince lives.

Lieutenant Paramedic small department right outside Chicago.

Enjoyed the tactical realm of medicine, doing it in an austere environment

where there's not lights everywhere you go took the class, enjoyed it a lot.

Also teach paramedic program where I went.

I went back and taught just to pay it forward.

And it's, I think that's what we can do is if you, if you enjoy something,

it's helping other people find their love to enjoy it as much as you do.

So that's my main goal for going back and teaching.

How do you know that?

I love what I do.

You're very passionate about it.

I can tell.

That's right.

I feel like we are very passionate about it and I, I appreciate the fact

that we, we are a little different of a program and I, I, I definitely enforce

the and embrace that difference and the mindset of we are trying to break the

stigma of the instructor versus student.

That there's no inferior, no superior, but ultimately is to give the steering

wheel to the student of the program.

Like this, this class is, is gonna be exactly what you want it to be, plus

more if you want it to be a, and I hate these words and it's not my vocabulary.

You want it to be a walkthrough and you want it to be a familiarization

or a what do you call it?

A crawl phase.

Like just get out cuz you're in the wrong.

That's not what we're gonna do here.

We're gonna do the actual lessons that you need to know.

You're gonna learn it by hands on.

And we, we all work in a world where hands on training works best for us.

You can't really, yeah, it's important to read and, and look at articles and

understand PowerPoints, but you're not gonna remember that you can't

learn how to set an IV by reading.

You gotta do it.

And that's the same thing

One of the things I think we pride ourselves on is developing

relationships with our students.

Listen, 45 minutes was a little long, Vince, you know what I'm saying?

. Cause we had somebody timing that.

But I say we take pride in getting to know when you come in through the

door, we come up and shake your hand.

I want to get to know you.

What gives you passion behind what you do?

Many times you go into a class and you are with your instructor and they're

just feeding you the information.

But you don't get to know 'em on a personal level.

You don't get to see that passion.

Not saying that it's not there, but we wanna show you that we're passionate,

that you are there and that we're excited to give you the education.

What do you think?

This goes all the way back to, I guess the first position I was

in when it came to instruction.

When I was put into an FTO role maybe I was delegated that because they

saw that I was willing to work with individuals who were struggling.

An old agency I used to work for, it was one medic and two

EMTs on the ambulance, right?

We were a 9 1 1 in facility here and there, but that was really per membership.

If somebody had in a town or county were in, had a membership to our facility,

we would help them out that way.

But we were generally 9 1 1 calls.

Definitely it was a volunteer organization.

So you're paid by the hour.

I, I loved it because it was very personal.

You got to know the people who you work for, but ultimately, when you're

working as a medic and you're the lead you should embrace the fact that

people are looking up to you, right?

EMTs looking up to how you function.

They wanna know the why behind what you do.

And there was an individual who was struggling as an EMT, and she seemed

like she just really understand or grasped the knowledge well enough.

And she got, she got picked on she got, she got pushed and unfortunately of

pushed her out of the organization.

But beforehand I was spending hours upon hours to make sure Hey, what

can we do to help you succeed?

And, and ultimately now it went from me being an FTO to instructors, to

leads, to whatever, to an organization now that somebody put on a Facebook

post saying, Hey, we're doing a T E C C program that we haven't done before.

We're looking for people to volunteer.

And I was like, you know what?

I'm bored.

So I typed it up and I showed up, and within the first five minutes of me trying

to follow suit with everybody else of my PowerPoint slide, I was like, fuck this.

I can't do this.

I can't do this PowerPoint mindset.

You're not gonna learn this stuff.

I Yeah.

Is it cool to know that that statistics is 93% this and that?

Yeah, sure.

Maybe that's fun, but I only got 16 hours with these students.

Let's go outside and let's go put tourniquets.

And you know what?

Make sure they're actually training as if it's real life embracing

the suck, and that's the first thing we do in this program.

And ultimately that day the, the, the coordinator of the program was

like, this, this is your class.

obviously, you get it, you understand it, you have a way of

functioning with the students.

They look up to you and, and it's maybe that relationship but I'm

a believer that there's no rank, there is no, there's no command.

It's just, it's an opportunity whether you could influence somebody.

To be their success.

That's, that's how I want to end my military career.

I want to end as a drill sergeant and drill sergeants.

They don't see it as oh, I'm trying to make commission, or I'm making a

pay for all these, these candidates that are going through, or these

soldiers going through basic training.

Their, their commission is these brand new soldier success.

And that's, that's the way I see it in, in everything I do for education.

I'm glad you said that.

Thanks for asking me how I feel about it.

I could rant.

Yeah.

No, keep going,

Vince.

Ah, no.

It's just a long , it's a long, long thing.

We got, we got all this time to talk about it.

Yes.

Before we started, anything else now that we've been involved in for a

while, let's keep up with current times so Buso, Dan, and Steven.

What's going on in your lives?

What's going on in your world, or what's something good that you've achieved and

what's something that you want to possibly get some help on to be successful?

Start with Buso.

Ah,

noodles gonna be mean.

I know, man.

I've been having a lot more time with the family, which is good.

And I really like that.

I'm, I'm being there for my, for my girls they're doing a lot of stuff

at school, so it's it's interesting.

And then also just trying to get a lot of ideas spewing in my head.

I don't, it's like rattling back and forth.

So I, there's a couple things that I wanna do and a lot of them have

to do with the podcast as well.

And that's basically it.

It's not much going on.

I'm stuck at home right now for other reasons, but it's all good.

Good.

You look healthy though.

You look back on your feet.

I'm good.

I'm, yeah.

But that's about it.

Good.

What about you, Dan?

Yeah, I guess my life is very similar to years Boo Show.

Father, two daughters, and staying very busy with that.

It's I was gonna say to you, it's a real pleasure that we get to do that.

A lot of fathers don't get to do that, so That's true.

We're, we're blessed man.

We get to really pour into our family as fathers and really special.

So that's what's going on in my life on that end, something I'd really like to

work on with this busy season in my life.

I just am struggling with the motivation to stay fit like I used to eat, right?

Like I used to.

And that's, that's been heavily on my mind.

And I know that's something we are very passionate about is mental

toughness, but also physical.

And so that, that's something I'm, I'm really gearing towards and

that's been heavily on my mind.

I'm with you on that one.

I'm glad you said that cuz that is something that we've we've always

talked about on the show, but we've never really made into a lesson and I

think Steven here, who's very passionate about fitness and he is now into a

little bit of a bigger responsibility for fitness for his organization.

Maybe this is a good opportunity to identify a responsibility within the wtl

podcast of what is your purpose here?

You, you put me on a pedestal there with that.

But I'm still getting after my own fitness and just staying consistent and

kinda like Dan said, like the last few days have just been kinda tough with

the cold weather and getting after it.

And I, I ran yesterday and today I kinda struggle through a workout, but yeah,

I'm enjoying being a field training officer just kinda keeping me and my

Trainee out of trouble every day, every shift.

But

also making sure like we're not just like sitting in a hole dodging

calls and stuff like cause that would be an injustice to my trainee and all

that, as well as the department and the the citizens of where we work.

It's kinda like, how, how much exposure can we do without getting into a

situation that we're gonna regret later?

And there's various degrees of regret, obviously.

There's oh, I just got into a shooting or like a injury situation

versus oh, I'm just gonna be here for five hours waiting for like the

state's attorney to call me back.

But we can go, let's get, we'll get into a little bit of trouble, just not.

The whole thing.

But and then back to fitness I'm just, I'm working on becoming a instructor at

the academy for the Physical Skills Unit.

And that's stuff like hand cuffing, emergency take down, stuff like that.

Or some of the, they even touched on some of the stuff that we were

doing at T E C C, which is how do you buddy carries when like one

of you is injured and all that.

And then you you have to stay in a fight, but also be cognizant of

getting your down teammates out.

And then the other half of that is also like physical conditioning.

So I gotta take it, find myself to stay consistent with fitness

and then be like a, a model

for the recruits down the line.

So, But it, it is, bro, it's dad workouts, like that's what I'm doing.

I'm in my, my family room doing pushups.

I got some dumbbells and Like a tr some TRX bands and I'm just doing what I can.

It's not what I'm used to.

And it's not it's not really pushing me, but I'm trying something.

And it's, it's been tough cuz I, I want more.

And it's easy to give yourself that excuse of I got the

kids, I got so much to do today.

The kids she's not napping.

Whatever.

I'll throw any excuse at myself.

So I'm sure that's something we've all struggled, right?

Busho, you got a lot of kids.

And I'll walk up my

stairs, bro.

I walk up my stairs up and down.

Sometimes they start crying.

I grab 'em.

The biggest one is the heaviest one, of course.

And I just, I throw over my shoulder.

It's like carrying someone.

That's what I'm doing.

But, and I'm winded after I don't know, 20 times up and down with each one.

It's but.

But you're right.

Excuses are so easy.

It is.

Especially right now with the weather, like Steven was saying

I don't wanna, I don't wanna wake up early to go to the gym.

I don't even wanna go in the afternoon cause it's even colder or something.

It's it's just like there's an excuse for everything.

And, and obviously as dad's we would be me and you would be

able to pick it up real quick.

I don't know about Vince, man.

This guy is you're wired differently, bro.

I remember him going to like the gym and every single, you're not a real,

you don't have a real dad bod Vince.

I don't believe it.

Take off the shirt.

. VINCE: I had a dad Bo I had two dads.

Bos.

But yeah, man, it's, it's not, it's not easy and

I mean it wasn't, I wanna see it.

I wanna see a before picture.

You Vince, by the way.

That's

right.

We'll, we'll show that out.

Let's talk.

Yeah.

That needs, that needs to get out there.

I'll find it.

We'll dig into the actual fitness episode.

We'll make sure we acknowledge.

But I think one thing is that we

can keep, and it's

easier to say, like we can keep each other accountable.

I text you, I'll text you, whatever.

But even that sometimes doesn't, doesn't always work.

It's, it's just you just gotta find the time and do it.

And, and don't go and don't go work out with Vince.

They'll kill you.

Got my phone.

Phone came up yesterday.

It was a one year anniversary since I smoked you at that gym.

I remember that.

Yeah.

Yeah.

It came up you remember this a year ago?

I'm like, oh man, here

I was dying.

Dude.

Ike, walk out.

No, I almost did.

I just saw him again for like couple weeks.

Is good.

When

he disappears, he's still trying to recover.

That's why he's is at home right now.

. . It's, uh, it's very true.

Fitness.

Fitness is a big world.

It's a big part of what we need to be doing whether it's everybody has their

own reason behind why they need to, or why they wanted to go to the gym.

At some point heavier set me was like, dude, I'm, I'm tired of being tired.

I'm tired of of being outta shape can I still do the job?

Sure.

But I, I need to be able to do the job to stay alive, and how

many people around us are, are not committed to the fitness world and

they're, they're dropping like flies.

We've got line of duty deaths at fire stations after fires, because of

heart attacks and stuff like that.

You know what,

Vince, real quick you sound like you should be able to do the job.

The way I look at it is you should be able to do the job more than once.

Like after there's been, there's been houses that had multiple fires within that

hour.

That's exactly it.

One, you're done, man.

That's exactly it.

I, and I, I have conversations with people and, and I've.

I've had people say oh, you should be, like, trying to

bulk up as heavy as you can.

Like to the guys who can't even like, get through doors because their

shoulders are so packed out, but then it's yeah, I'm sure they could bust

through a door a wall faster than I can.

But then how many, how many times?

Thank you.

We got our food deliver . Thanks.

How many times?

They, they go through the wall once and they're, they're beat, they're exhausted.

Where I could tell 'em, I'll go through 4, 5, 6 different walls and,

and get the job done multiple times.

It's all about functional, right?

It's not about mass and, and aesthetics and looks and views.

It's about being able to do the job.

And we see this in the world we are in even in the military.

They've been posting the, the PT test standard for going on three

years now because they can't figure out the right rhythm or the right.

Standard of gender neutral versus numbers and age and this and that.

It's I hate to say it, but crime, fire, gunshots.

They're not discriminating towards your gender.

Yeah.

Or your size or your height so it, it, there needs to be a standard

of just getting the job done.

Get through, get through what you gotta do, fight the fire, and get

home and stay alive and be able to pull your partner out if that falls.

That scares me sometimes when I go to different jobs it's man, are

you, are you gonna be able to pull me out if something happens to me?

Yeah.

I don't know.

You make a point on it.

What about, what do you think?

Hey, then

? HAYDEN: I agree with you that it's,

struggle for maintaining all the fitness around, but the issue I

have a lot is you got guys that.

They'll like, like Dan, they'll make any excuse to not, to not

work out or something because oh, I don't, I don't wanna be gased.

If we, if we catch a job, we go to a fire.

I'm like, that's not what it's about.

I'm not saying you gotta go up in the gym and, and run yourself ragged.

You don't gotta be pouring sweat after an hour, but go

just do, be active during a day.

It doesn't have to be like you said, functional swing the sledge on the tire.

Do take a walk on the treadmill, do the, do the StairMaster.

Everybody every complains about doing the c p A.

The stairs are the hardest part.

Yeah.

So it doesn't mean it's one test you take once and then never do the stairs again.

Yeah.

I think the statistics just came out the other day.

It's 82% of people in first responder agencies are overweight

and outta shape, makes sense.

And I get it.

Your weight does not determine your.

That's not what it's about.

But we're talking about like even in the forces someone said that

like several, if something happened right now and we needed all hands on

deck, it was something outrageous.

Like 13% would be capable for wow.

Fitness for marksmanship, for all the, the basic military stuff.

And it's just that blows my mind.

I I hope other places are not listening to this podcast.

Cause I feel like that's the secrets being told out.

But are we really that prepared?

? Yeah.

We're strong force.

We got high tech stuff, but we gotta, you just get

a secret out, Vince.

Yeah, that's right.

Is there

any analysis of that number right, current number right

now compared to like years past?

Is it down trended or is this just a random statistic?

What the difference between current and past?

We've got people who are joining, or we're struggling to find people who

are joining because all they want to do is get the benefits out of it and

get the reward, but not do the job.

Whereas in the past, we had people lying about their age to go serve their country.

I hate sounding like an old salty dog about it, because now you

see all these other veterans who are like your grandpa or whatever.

He's oh back of my days you guys are weak and this and that.

And we always thought about old man, you don't know what you're talking about.

Now I'm starting to feel it.

The difference between us and new generation, it's man, we're, we're in.

So those old vets, they've got something to say nowadays in mm-hmm.

in my opinion.

Mm-hmm.

, they've got a lot to say.

So if an older vet tells me this is not a lot of said,

this is not what I fought for.

What we're seeing now, he, we need to listen to.

Time to

Have you guys heard that saying recently been not part recently, but

it's like hard talent create strong men.

Yeah.

Strong.

Yeah.

And it's that's, that's what it's leading to right now.

It's like going back to like soft, mm-hmm.

messed up up that saying we gotta say it.

Find, yeah.

Somebody's got it.

I was

pulling it up.

Pulled out who had it, who had it.

It says Hard times.

Create strong men.

Strong men create good times.

Good times.

Create weak men.

And weak men create

hard times.

Yeah.

It just circles around.

Yep.

Yep.

It's that's definitely a thing.

It's crazy, man.

And today, today's workout I had, right?

Cause I was at the gym from 12 nine Gym.

No, I was at the gym for 12 to two 15.

Did hour cardio and.

We could bust it out.

I'll show you on my, on my gps, on my Garmin.

It shows exactly what I do in my fitness world, but one thing I realized

when I got there, I went over to a suburb, LA Fitness, and I was like,

all right, I got everything I need.

But I was like, forget my shorts.

I forgot my gym shorts, man.

So I, I wore these pants and I wore my boots and I had

the best damn workout ever.

And I don't know if it's just like the ation of you're wearing

something you normally in, or somewhat military, somewhat uniform.

It just had me a lot more pumped.

I was lifting heavier weight than I was yesterday but that had me

thinking, looking around do I look mean?

Do I look angry?

Do I look pissed off?

Cause ultimately, when you meet people at the gym who are like, they're wearing a

hoodie and had little headphones in and they're just like dead silent, dead face,

those are the ones that are, are fighting those demons and they're there badly.

Oh yeah.

You know what I mean?

That is the best pre-work.

You could pre-work out, you could have.

Hey, you

never know, man.

You could walk up to one of those guys and open up their headphones and it's

Ray, it's like some prince you think it's like metal going on, but who knows, man?

Scream

Yeah.

No, it's Prince.

It's Prince.

It's definitely Prince.

I'm gonna do that next.

I'm gonna see somebody like that, but no . Yeah, we digress.

This is not the fitness episode.

No.

It almost became the fitness episode.

It almost did.

But if you guys are listening to this, we challenge you to go do go do 20, 10, 10.

Let's do it.

You know what?

Let's do it as a cadre, right?

Lead the example.

Okay, let's go.

Let's go right now, right here.

How many

you wanna do?

I'm in.

I'll pick a number.

You

won't see me when I load down.

Listen, I.

I'm down for 20 pushups.

Let's do 20 pushups.

20 pushups, right?

I'm taking my

headphones down.

20 pushups.

It's our oath.

As long as you're listening to the show and you hear us doing pushups, I dunno,

you're probably not gonna hear it.

We'll post pictures and videos of this snippet.

Yeah.

But oath that you are gonna do it as well.

And then oath that you are gonna do something from here on out every

day to be just that much better.

So start right now.

20.

Steven, if you fart, we all have to restart.

. VINCE: That'll be, I'm

Now's

Hi.

I'm making it so there's proof.

That was a good nap.

Pushups, right?

I like the view of Stephen, get it.

I don't know about you guys, but like I already

feel that much more enriched.

I feel that much more successful.

Absolutely.

I'm awake again.

Why can't you get it?

Steven's getting it.

We're warmed up cuz it's a little cold in this garage here.

It's all good, man.

There's nothing negative out of fitness.

Hey now we're warmer.

Now we're more Aw.

Whatever the new kids are saying, we're woke.

They're woke.

Sorry.

Is that what they meant?

Yeah.

Maybe that's what it is.

Next time I see someone say woke, I'd be like, do some pushups.

How about that?

let's go.

I'm gonna do pushups.

Damn.

You became that much more stronger.

Your muscles are that much more prepared.

Your mind has got more blood flow.

It's got more oxygen.

Your endorphins are popped up, right?

So whatever demons we thought we didn't even realize we may have been fighting

just got squashed that much more heavier.

You know what I mean?

Yeah.

So hopefully if you're viewing this or listening to this, you actually did it.

We'll give you another five seconds to finish.

But actually do it and embrace it, so I do know, because apparently we

do have viewers cuz Hayden really good about quoting our episodes

We, we've got people who respond to our show and, and talk about the conversation.

And you guys know who I'm talking about, right?

If you're hearing this, so right to us saying that you

did what we asked you to do.

So nonetheless, we digress.

Let's go back to the show which was a stewardship of the instructor.

Dan.

What guys?

Yeah, go ahead man.

Where you are now and why are you even doing this?

What is your reason?

What is your purpose?

So taking that instructor role was a big step for me.

And the reason I got here was because someone else equipped

me and pushed me to do it.

Step outta my comfort zone.

And the, I'll take the knowledge in, I'll take the education, I'll

learn it, but it took someone to say, Hey, why don't you teach something?

Why don't you, Hey, why don't you run the scenario right now?

That's all it took for me.

And I had to get comfortable being in front of people and sharing my knowledge.

But it, it started with somebody else pushing me to do that

as well, if that makes sense.

I guess give us an example of who you don't have the

name names or places, but Sure.

What actually occurred that you, that made you realize I

need to be pushed, I need to,

yeah, so I think the first time I was on probation when I got hired, and

what like the probationary guy, right?

Y y yes and no mouth shut.

Ear is open.

Yes, that's a thing.

But the lieutenant I was working for at the time, he trained me up

a lot and we had some recruits come in and he said Dan, why don't you

go take those boys out on the floor?

And run them through a rescue drill, the one that we went over last week.

And I'm like, alright, cool.

I haven't done this before, but I'll do it.

And so that was the first time I was given that opportunity to take

the knowledge that I was given and then pass it on to somebody else who

maybe hadn't learned that before.

And it, it caused me to think am am I portraying this or giving this training?

Am I being thorough?

Am I being clear about what I'm saying?

And it started for me.

There, it was in the fire department.

So who uio?

How about you, man?

Mine started a little bit younger of, honestly, when I was in I was in,

I've been in martial arts all my life, so

it was, it was kind of there.

You're like the, the kra MAGA.

Omega?

No.

Yeah.

Yeah.

So like I, I started there with with a couple martial arts teaching.

And then when I went to the police academy, that was no, actually

before that, that was before that, before I became a police officer.

I I met a guy who trained me in like defensive tactics and he's a really, he's

still like a really good friend of mine.

And he was a big mentor for me.

And he kept throwing stuff at me to teach people, to teach people in his

class and in his curriculum and the system to the point where he actually he

wanted me to fly with him over to Florida to teach police officers over there.

And this was way before I was a police officer.

Wow.

That's what kind of got me like, interested even more.

Cause like at one point he just left me in there by myself and I'm like,

dude, I'm a 21 year old guy that with all these cops and swap members,

I have no idea what I'm doing.

He said, oh, you know the curriculum, you'll be fine.

So he like walked away and that's gave me like the push to be like,

I can, I can do this, I can I can teach and not be, what's the word?

Intimidated, and they all, I didn't get anything.

I didn't get any bad reviews or anything,

which is good.

And that's the thing, like when that leader, that

instructor passes that on you.

I, I don't know this guy, but tell me if I'm right.

He's not passing the buck.

He's not taking something off his plate, pushing it onto yours and saying,

Hey, can you just handle this for me?

No, he had a method behind his, his uh, practice.

He wanted, yeah, he wanted to see how I would do under pressure and

if I knew the curriculum he gave me, for

sure.

I'm sure he didn't walk away far cause I saw him too . But yeah.

And then obviously, and then what the last thing I did before anything now

is that I was actually a defensive taxes instructor in my old department.

So that, that's what helped me, that led me to that.

So I was, that was fun.

So I've always liked teaching, I've always liked learning stuff and teaching people.

I think I'm a better teacher than I am.

Like competitor, I guess you could say.

For sure.

Yeah.

And this is all great stuff.

I We teach that triple CT CC class, that stuff is fun, man.

That stuff is

also really important.

So it's a reinforcement of what we're, we're taking in, right?

Yep.

It's, it's a way to reinforce and equip someone else to pass that along.

And you're just continuing to build that knowledge just by teaching somebody else.

It's building that knowledge even more.

And you might even

be inspiring other people to do stuff.

So to be instructors like Hayden here, right?

Yeah.

Yeah.

Hayden what, what got you interested to be moving towards the instructor role?

What, what gave you that push?

Were you in a position before where you were able to teach somebody?

So it started similar to yours.

I was a proby at my first department, and we're trying to figure out what to do.

One 30 rolls around, we gotta figure out, drill Lieutenant goes, Hey, hey, and take

the new kids out and show 'em ladder.

And I'm, I am the new kid, But and it, and it, and it helps you obviously

he sees something in me that he thinks I'm gonna be good at this.

So it's, that's where it started.

Class four, a couple years later, when I was a paramedic student, I had

instructors who like, I'm not gonna, it's, it's gonna sound of bad, but,

so I was, I was always on top of scenarios in class we gotta do, we,

we gotta do this, this, this, and that.

And I was always kind of like, put into the in charge position.

So the instructors were like, Hey Hayden, you're gonna be the patient today.

Oh man, so I'm out of the, I'm out of the drill.

But it helps and it helps helping them, helping the other students learn.

So now I go back to teach at my medic program.

And it's basically what, what I get out of it is I'm giving them the

opportunities that I didn't have, right?

Aeromedical that chapter right where our medic program is, we don't call

helicopters cuz there's five trauma centers within 10 minutes of us, right?

So my part-time place was rural, talked to the chief, Hey, can I bring the medic

students out killing land, the helicopter?

And they, they jumped on it, they loved it.

And I'm like, that's, that's something I didn't have and if I can give

them the opportunity to do that, I'm gonna jump on it every time.

Cuz that's phenomenal.

And then it's improving, helping them improve with things I had trouble with.

So I hated endocrine.

I was just so bad at it.

It was like my worst chapter in class.

So if I can help somebody understand it, just a li just

a little bit better than I did.

And it, it's, it's, it's that fulfillment feeling like, Hey, I did that.

I I helped you and I, I feel good about myself now I wanna go do it more.

For sure it does give you that fulfillment and it does reinforce

the knowledge that you you took upon yourself to, to learn more.

But beyond that for that student is giving them the opportunity

to turn around and then hand the torch to them, Hey, turn around.

Hey, teach your classmates the subject on endocrine that we just talked

about, that's what we're trying to to share here, is what we're finding

success in with the classes that we're teaching is passing the torch,

putting the ball in the students court to turn around and reinforce the

knowledge that we've been able to pass.

What do you think about that, Vince?

When it comes to to being an instructor or an educator there's

a lot of responsibility in that.

You can't just play it by ear you can't always just shoot from the hip.

It's gotta be a sense of what's the word?

It's kinda like a method to your madness.

Oh.

I love saying that.

I

know, that's why I said it.

I love that you guys are still remembering that.

Yeah.

Competency, right?

It's a, there's another word, I can't think of it right now, but

if you come up as an instructor and say that you know how to do CPR and

you're here to teach cpr, but then you actually don't, you lose a sense.

Credibility.

Credibility.

Credibility.

That's the word.

Thank you.

Thank you.

You have to have credibility.

You have to have a better foundation.

And you have to have a sense of I'm, I've got this.

I took the time to educate myself, to learn to experience, but I'm not

here to hold it to just my own wealth.

I'm here to share it to you all.

I'm here to be the steward of the trade.

I'm here to make you all inspire yourselves to be better and soon become

the future educator of this program.

And, and to think of it as a leader, this goes back into the leadership role.

You shouldn't be a boss that just tells people, Hey, this

is how you're gonna do it.

And, and that's it.

I don't, don't ask questions.

It should be, a leader should be saying, this is what we need to do

for you to su succeed, and then for you to be taking my spot, you should

be looking for your replacement.

That's right.

And enforcing and, and, and allowing them the opportunity to replace you.

You should be

those guys that are coming in so they can teach

others.

Yeah.

I guess what do you guys, when you were first given that whether a FTO

or a somebody else in leadership said, Hey, Dan, or, Hey Busho, you're

gonna go teach this class today, or Hayden you're gonna be, even though

you're new, you're gonna teach it.

What, what made, what did you feel out of that?

Other than like, all of a sudden it's stress and what do you call it?

Stage fright, but once you taught that day lesson, how did you feel?

Oh, yeah.

Reminded you gotta be on, if you give someone that like, Hey,

I need you to teach this, right?

I think it helps.

Teaching is the best form of yeah.

Like inner I, I gotta be on top of this so I can teach you.

So it's, it's like holding, like holding yourself to a higher standard.

If I got, if I don't know it, how can I teach them?

And I'm, I'm a nerd now, man.

My, my days are spent like flip.

I'll pick a, like every day on shift, I'll pick a random sop

and I'll just run through it.

Okay.

We got this one today.

Let's pick one burns.

Ooh.

Haven't done that one in a while.

And then I remember the dance that you taught N T E C.

See how that works?

See,

yes,

I swear.

And you giving 'em a full on read right now, you know

that, right?

I swear every single time I'm giving the opportunity, whoever's got

burns, I'm thankful that they were willing to say, Hey Vince's a dance.

You wanna show them?

Absolutely.

This is the dance I remembered from my education and it stuck

with me and helped me pass.

But to hear that I was able to share that little insight to a student and now

they are coming back what is a year ago?

Yeah.

And saying, I've actually used this on the streets and I've had success

for this knowledge with a burn dance.

It's by far that is like the currency to me.

That is the award for what I do.

And anyway, you get, go ahead.

You got me all geeked out.

That's the thing though, is it makes it was a goofy

thing, but I remember it now.

It's, it's burnt into my brain, but.

They're, they're trying to figure out, looking at her leg and

going, oh, I think it's this.

I'm in the back by the captain's chair, like 18.

Bam.

Like, how'd you do that?

I, I can't explain it right now, but yeah, man,

that's awesome.

That's, that's the reward, like I said but you said being a

educator, it puts you in a role that you need to have that pride.

You need to have that that accountability for yourself to truly have that

credibility of that knowledge.

But in reference to this subject, this last Monday, Tuesday, we had the Teach

Triple C class which is by far the best.

And I keep saying about every class that we hold, it was our best class

and it was our most dynamic class.

It was a lot of challenging points, a lot of movement.

Cuz we had live tissue or dead, live tissue, right?

We had lungs to play with.

And actually visualize and touch and put hands on, allow people to

innovate, see what a tension pneumo looks like and how we, why we do the

needle Ds and why we do chest tubes.

And you see the effect at hand.

That's the best learning possible but when we were progressing through this

this course and and you guys could all attest to it, cuz everybody here has

stepped into my, my philosophy teaching.

I say from the beginning it's you guys are in charge of this program.

You tell me what you want, you want me to dial it up, you want

me to dial it down however it is.

But this next 16 hours is not me telling you you have to be here.

It's 16 hours of me saying, I am honored that I could be here for you.

So what can I give you?

What do you want from me?

And when I see our students thriving and they're picking up this information

and they don't care about breaks they don't care about like lunch and this and

that, they're just, they're partying on this is the best time in their lives.

I'm like, man, this, this is a whole like school institute.

And these are people that are actually driven to, to learn more and want more.

Yeah.

They actually wanna learn, I'm gonna do it differently this time.

And I went to them, I was like, you guys feel confident?

You guys are showing me that you're, you're competent in

what we, we just taught you.

So here's the thing, I'm gonna go next door.

I'm gonna get all the fire candidates cuz there's a fire

academy at the same building.

We're gonna walk through and, and bring them in here and the other fire

instructors and you are now gonna have your, your own lesson to teach.

So teach these candidates what lungs are, are entailed, what

they look like, what they do, why they function, how they function.

And I, we just sat back and we just observed and we allowed them wear

gloves and we had them touch the tissue and oh, a lot of 'em were just aspired.

They're like, man, EMS is fucking fun.

Medicine is fun.

This is awesome stuff.

When are you guys doing this class more often?

And this, and people were already wanting to sign up.

But when I'm looking back and I'm seeing originally our students showing

and, and, and taking their knowledge and being able to be an educator,

like it almost brings tears to eyes.

You know what I mean?

It's man, this is, this is the most glorious moment of my education.

And seeing the people who, who are looking up to us now, having

people looking up to them, and and that's where we wanna build.

We wanna build leaders, we build competent people.

We wanna build individuals who want to make training fun again.

And there's that saying that I say at the end, every class is that

you do not rise to the occasion.

You fall to the level of your training.

And to know that these individuals come to my class and are wanting to, to get the

most out of it, and are expecting, like they said it, they, they have this level

of expectation and then we over exceed.

That is, that is the best feeling of of, as an instructor for this program.

Absolutely.

And

you're most likely inspiring people right there, making them

realize, man, I could teach this.

This is pretty good.

Yeah.

We're seeing it now.

Hayden's sitting at the couch right now he's coming back.

He's got that fire in him.

And you know what, let's talk about that because not everybody feels

the same way as we do about educating ourselves, pushing ourselves further.

I, I'm telling you, we all know who those people are.

Walkthrough.

What's that?

Walkthroughs and like walkthrough for sure.

Taking 45 minutes as an intro, getting to know your students, all those things.

But Hayden at your, in your agency, you could share, Hey, listen there's

this great podcast where we talk a lot about training and education.

Maybe learn something out of it.

Not everybody's, no, not everybody wants to take a dive and.

Educate themselves.

How do we deal with that?

Yeah.

I think it's, there's an issue too is a lot of people just, they,

a lot of people want to do training.

I think, I think this is fire law, ems, whatever, wide, the, the training,

the oh, it's, it's checking a box, right?

Oh, I did my training.

I did you go on whatever you're doing to, to your, say your, the

management of your license, right?

Oh, I got my four hours of airway, I got my two hours of

cardiac, I got my whatever.

And it's just checking boxes.

And I think that shows when something happens, like I did the burn dance, right?

And I.

So I was recently made an officer, so my role has entirely changed, right?

I went from a, a mainstream provider on the ambulance, right?

To now my job is not the patient, my job is my crew and making sure

that they're making the right moves and they're providing the best care.

So I'm back there doing the burn dance.

I'm like, all right, cool.

We got it.

And it's burn, right?

And they take off for the hospital.

I get in the ambulance, or I get in the engine, I look up and I go, oh, shit.

They didn't start saing like fluids, part of burns.

Like something, something little, right?

But and I like, it's on me.

Like it's, but it's it's, it's a whole group effort.

But in the end I looked at 'em like that.

That's my bad.

That's something that I held for a while.

I'm like I, I gotta be better.

I gotta be better.

I gotta be training on this stuff.

And that's where it came next day, bam.

Burn, burn, sop.

Hey guys, let's take a look at this.

Let's run through it real quick.

It's, it's, let me challenge you on that, Hayden.

Yeah.

Lieutenant now.

Lieutenant.

Now this might be how it goes for you.

Let me challenge you.

You mentioned you painted a picture of getting in the back of the ambulance.

Yes.

You are responsible for your crew 100%.

But are you the kind of lieutenant that gets in there to start a line?

Are you the kind of lieutenant that gets in there to drop medications?

Are you that lieutenant that gets in there to stretch

that line, whatever it might be?

So I,

I will, as long as they don't feel I'm in their way.

Cuz if, if, if I'm gonna let them have, I need them to have success.

And if I'm do, if I end up doing everything, that's my bad cuz

then they're not learning it, they're not doing it themselves.

So I will, I'm a hundred percent last.

Hey, you wanna drill?

Yeah.

Hell yeah.

I want to drill.

I'm in.

Let's do it.

Yeah.

My spot on ambulance calls now is the drug drawer.

That's my, that's not my

niche.

You have a go-to spot.

I have a go-to spot right in the stairwell.

That's my right, right there against the bench.

That's my spot.

For sure.

Whatever they need.

Awesome.

And then it's fun to, it's, it's nice because we have a lot

of new, a lot of new medics.

And it's, you just throw ideas out at them like, I don't know what this could be.

I don't know if it's this, you wanna throw 'em on end title?

Oh, that's a good idea.

Right on, man.

I love it.

For sure.

So

absolutely.

You're teaching them, you're teaching in that knowledge, man.

You're, you're teaching 'em in not a classroom.

Mm-hmm.

. And there's super,

people don't, and some people I think I mentioned this to Vince and

probably you as well, Dan, but I'm a person who needs to learn hands on.

I can't learn from a book I've had, I have the hardest time ever.

Same.

There's

no way that, you know, and, and that that's probably the best.

Oh, let's do it.

And sometimes if it happens in real life, it happens in real life, but you're

learning from it in the correct way.

You're not doing anything bad.

But I'm saying you're learning from it there.

That's the reason why I enjoy the TCC and the TCC classes that we teach.

Because those are just that's a whole different ballgame.

I've never had a class at that.

When I took it and now coming back to train and teach other people,

it's, it's fun, it's amazing.

It's really hands on and it really gets people going damn, like I could do

this, or I never thought I could do this.

Or it's good

stuff.

had a good training moment, Steven over here, quiet.

I had a good training moment with a fellow crew member and we were doing a

rich drill at a live fire scenario and I did a, a re in a way that I'm not used to

doing of a tactic in rescuing a down firefighter and it didn't go well for me.

And I walked out of there and, and it bothered me for a couple days.

And I talked to my crew member about it and I said, you know what?

I'm not gonna do it that way.

That doesn't work for me.

And he said to me, that's not the right attitude because.

You should learn to do it that way.

You should learn to buckle the harness under, lift the leg, take the, the, the

waist harness and buckle it under the leg.

Learn to do it that way if you struggled on it, get it down.

But it doesn't mean you have to do it that way, but don't have the mindset

of I'm not gonna do it like that.

So it, it challenged me to say, let's do this ritual again, and I'm

gonna get that way down and make my mind up from there, but I'm not

gonna say I'm not gonna do this.

And that allowed me to open my mind to having a better mindset towards

training and to not just do, this is the way I'm gonna, Nope, nope.

I'm gonna try the way that made me uncomfortable.

Says I'm not gonna need that strap around the waist to go under

the leg if we encounter stairs.

You know what I'm saying?

I just had to share that with you guys cause that was pretty impactful for me.

That comfortable with being uncomfortable type scene.

Exactly.

It

goes back to one of my favorite training quotes.

It's crap.

Don't train until you get it right.

Train until you can't get it wrong.

Absolutely.

What athletes do, it's you just, it's, it's like you said, it's

something you're not used to.

We're gonna do it and we're gonna do it again and again and again

until I'm proficient with it.

That's right.

Exactly what athletes do.

That's, I needed that reminder.

I needed that.

I think the valid point behind this, and unfortunately we can't always

do it when it comes to lives, right?

Cause we, we all here work for the community in, in some essence and lives

are at stake when we make mistakes, but sometimes it's those mistakes that

makes us realize, a, I gotta learn more.

Like I got a lot more learn to do.

Or B is Now I understand why we're not doing that, and when we start

this program when I, when, when I run and, and took over pretty much and

just said, Hey, we gotta change this.

It was I wanted their failures to be in the classroom and I, I start

the program and I say, you know what?

I wanna see what you guys are made out of.

Prove it to me.

Show me what you got.

We're gonna give you the scenario and then what you're gonna

test your knowledge, right?

Key or I dunno, key on learning.

Whatever they say it.

Ideally they should all know what a tourniquet is, right?

This is meant for licensed personnel or people of the uniform.

But unfortunately a lot of 'em don't realize or haven't really

been able to play with tourniquets.

So I tell 'em like, from here on out, we're gonna make sure we build

the confidence with tourniquets.

You're gonna put it on real time, we're gonna make sure of that, right?

You're actually gonna put it on yourselves and each other to where

it's actually stopping blood flow.

Through your limb, so you understand the discomfort and the pain

that it causes to the casualties.

You put it on and then people will walk around the room and they're

moaning and groaning and they're like, man, we can take this off yet.

I'm like, I'm not done yet.

We're gonna keep going, and I start telling them, it's embrace it.

Embrace it.

And they're like, what?

It's like, embrace what you're feeling.

Embrace that pain, embrace that discomfort, right?

Cause that discomfort and that pain that's telling you that you're alive,

and be proud of that, that you did something that saved your own life

or you did something that saved your buddy's life, and then that's when they

start, the light bulb initially starts in that first 30 minute of the course.

They're like, oh man, I signed up for something intense.

This is about to get, that's,

that's, we got guys sweating.

Yep.

We got guys moaning.

It's excellent.

Yep, yep, yep.

Just, just wait, I got you for another 16 hours of this, yep.

And.

We let them run the scenario.

And if we see a subject that they are questioning and they think

is right, and they're like, this, this has always worked for me.

And it's, it's been what I've always done.

And I'm like, okay, show me.

And then from, from that point on, when they fail, fail during that

scenario and they, they see the effect of that, that compromise they did.

So I hear that poor that's when they start realizing now I understand

why we don't do it that way.

And then we show them the right way and we show 'em the technique and they,

that's when they start embracing it.

This makes complete sense.

I'm not doing this because a book shows me I'm not doing this.

Because somebody stepped up in the class and said, Hey, this

is why or how you gotta do it.

I'm doing this cuz I, I, I witnessed and experienced the failure behind

it and that's what the whole subject about ketamine gets all heated with is

I see the failures behind ketamine and I'm like, there's gotta be more to it.

So I would do my own research and I'll try my own trials.

And I would see the effects of my, my, my own dedication of my, of education.

And I'm like, all right, this is why, this is why I'm gonna do it my way.

And clearly it's the, the appropriate way because I haven't had anybody overdose.

Ketamine I haven't had a, a malfunction of ketamine.

It's because I'm, I take it very seriously.

I take it like it's a, it's a it's a medication that could put you

under . You know what I mean?

That's right.

Myself.

And that's what it is.

Exactly what it's,

I'll tell you what Ketamine number two is gonna be coming.

Oh, we got a lot of, we got a lot of pressure for ketamine.

Number two.

Yeah.

Lot of tension for it.

So start rant about it.

But that's I mean that's, that's what makes a steward of the of the trade.

It's to be willing to not only educate and share your wealth but take the

time to continuously maintain that credibility, to keep yourself educated

build that rapport with the students you have and your co-instructors.

Try your best, even if you have some challenging times, try your

best to be a good moderator.

And if personalities can't always match that's what it is.

The win behind this is that we have a guy that drove two and a half hours just to

have a conversation and in a cold garage smoking a cigar and enjoying food, yep.

Podcast.

Who's that?

Steven Steven's.

Oh, he's all, he's all bitter, man.

Cause he told me, he was like, thanks for the invite.

Like

io, you're, are you in Vince's basement right now?

Not supposed to say that

out, bro.

No, Vince, I'm

nowhere.

Yeah, he always finds his way into your basement.

Yeah, that's where I

see.

Yeah.

Anyway,

you see it's right

there.

Socks.

That's,

yeah.

And I applaud you, man.

It's not a, yeah, you drove, I don't know, two and a half hours, man.

But I applaud you for coming here and taking a seat with us, man.

Ter, I appreciate it.

I hope, I hope your agency or your friends get to listen to this

and hear what you get to offer.

You're bringing some of the table too, man.

We're, we're just so happy to have you here and, and to take

some of your knowledge as well.

Heck yeah, brother.

Yeah.

Thank you guys.

Welcome to

the podcast,

. VINCE: Man, Ann and I have talked

is something we definitely wanna make a movement for, is bringing this

podcast to agencies, fire Academy.

Say, give us, give us a day or, or a module where it's education

and mental health, right?

And just say, we'll put up a couple, couple mics and then we'll have a

live show talking about something that they, they want to talk about.

Some of the challenges.

Bourbon.

Yeah.

We burn bourn.

We just won't let them drink it.

Cause it's ours.

That's right.

But it's, it's ultimately just making this more in person and then I think

that's been a thing cuz Dan, like I said, there's, there's an academy out

there that's actually listen to us.

You

know, there is Absolutely.

It is huge.

They, they have a, a board in their fire academy of podcast options to

educate themselves and we do bring that education and training, but we also bring

the importance of mental health and we can be that outlet for them as well.

So again, even if this academy's listening right now we would

love to come to you and bring this training and bring a training

topic that you want to talk about.

You wanna talk about mental health?

We'll do it.

You want to talk about some fire stuff?

Let's do it.

Even some police stuff.

We got everything.

We got police, we got fire, we got military.

You know what I'm saying?

Ems?

Absolutely.

We got it all, man.

That's right.

Communications Randy's got the background of the dispatchers.

Yep.

Management and all that.

So hey, even the upper upper management lieutenants, captains,

sergeants, commanders, you had 'em all.

There's one sitting right there.

There's a couple of 'em in that couch.

And I casting on the

couch,

, DAN: right?

Yep.

We just watched our Boys Man, Dakota wearing three different hats.

You made the new guys, you guys hit that link.

That was, that was sweet.

That was awesome.

Congratulations to Dakota, man.

He's he's out there just serving his community at the

best level as as possible.

For those that don't

know, Dakota's a is a firefighter, he's a police officer, he's a military

medic, and I think he's done them all.

He's still doing all three, I think, at the same time,

right?

Yeah.

And he's a ca show and a Yeah, of course.

He's, I know he is been a little absent cuz of I mean our timing

and everybody else's timing.

This is a rarity.

I think we're trying to make this emotion more scheduled thing.

Hopefully we got

something coming.

We got something come

with, we got something We keep saying that we keep

saying, oh, but this one,

but this one's more we had a meeting a little while ago, so

we're good.

More stuff is coming.

Sos gonna like it more person stuff.

Yes.

Like we just released our first credited episode.

People go earn con Where was that?

Imt I amm at.

Yes.

So it's definitely a big aspect for us.

And the one she, one share.

Can't forget that.

Making partnerships north America Rescue, they recognize us as a training center.

Oh yeah.

That's a big movement for us and.

Seven years ago when Randy and I first started and in the backyard of my place

and just like smoked cigars and said, Hey, let's try something different.

And now here we are.

And it's just boom.

It just exploded.

It's really, it's really good to have those partnerships, I'll tell you because

having those trauma, shes in the class not only was helpful for the training

there's a couple other guys that reached out and said, Hey, what were those shears?

I guarantee they went online and bought a pair.

Absolutely.

These partnerships are very important.

We utilize these tools.

We north American Rescue, right?

We, we brought it to a meeting with a police department to push medical

training for law enforcement officers and they're gonna be getting on

board with us and hopefully we're gonna get out there and get some

training, bring the training to them from the schoolhouse out to the field.

And so the partnerships are huge.

Really what, what Dan's also trying to

say here is that we're not just backing anything up.

We, the stuff that we use is, we actually use it.

We actually back it behind.

It's not just something, oh, they have, it looks nice now.

We we're using it real.

It works.

That's right.

Practical.

Yeah.

Functional.

There you go.

Mm-hmm.

functional.

Make it out.

. That's right.

While we've been talking about T C C and T triple C, let's

give this a little skit, right?

It's it's probably not gonna be a whole hours worth of education, but let's do

it a little bit of a snippet, right?

A taste of of the T e C program.

There is an algorithm that is studied and is portrayed in

this program and it's march.

And we keep saying, once you start marching, you keep marching on, right?

And it's a, an assessment tool in order of precedence of what's gonna, ideally and

realistically kill your casualty first.

And it's the things that you need to be reacting upon in that order

to prevent that loss of life.

Steven, cuz you've been silent, the spotlights on you.

I need to know what M stands for.

Massive hemorrhage.

What are you gonna do about it?

If you're coming from a field situation, you gotta do the finger

sweep, rake your victim, your down comrade for any major bleeding sites,

and then you just gotta address it.

Whether you need to slap a tourniquet on it, on a limb,

or

or put tourniquet like a wound.

. How do we put a tourniquet on?

High and tight?

Tight.

Okay.

Tell me.

If you have time, you wanna do four,

approximately four inches above the injury site.

Not on a joint.

And then you can't go from there.

No.

Oh.

Oh.

Stop the blade.

Carry on for now.

. Okay.

Until, like you said, if we have time, if there's more time down the road,

but don't neglect the rest of the March algorithm, ably to move on.

Especially when you're on the X, it's high and tight.

Get out.

Done.

Exactly.

Doesn't, it doesn't qualify for a tourniquet.

You can't do anything else.

Get off the X.

And what we classify as the X is the care under fire, right?

You're in a line of sight.

You are in a line of fire, you're in a line of damage.

And your, your main goal is to get your buddy or attach out after

you gain fire security, get a tourniquet on for those limb leads.

The limb bleeds.

Pull them out as any means possible, whether it's using litter or strap or

their their rig, their chest rig, or their body armor, whatever it is, a

handlebar mustache off a , whatever it is just get 'em outta the X And then after

we took care of massive hemorrhage, right?

What are we doing at this point?

And

I want a, still talking to Steven there.

I'll go to you, Dan.

Did we throw it?

Let's go with you.

So mass hemorrhage, airway carrying the fire's, been taken care of.

We've taken care of mass hemorrhage.

Now airway, we're gonna be speaking to your, your casualty.

Are they able to right?

Hayden?

If they're, if they're talking, they're breathing negative, sir.

negative, sir.

Why?

Why is that?

Cause ventilation does not equal profusion.

Tell me more.

That's great.

We, we just had this

conversation, . Yeah, but not with the audit.

This is me putting the education rule onto you, Roger, that.

Now you're the educator,

Roger that.

So ventilation air in and out, perfusion oxygen supply to the

brain and the rest of the body.

So just cuz they're talking doesn't mean that they're,

they're ventilating, but they're

not

profusing.

Okay?

So under a tactical field care right now that we're off the

X, what can we do to fix their

airway?

So this is gonna be, this is meant to be rapid, okay?

If you were to put yourself in a mass casualty situation, we don't got time.

We don't have time to, we've got time for that.

We ain't got time for that.

I got bunions.

We're, we're not worried about putting advanced airway airways in at this time.

So you're going to perform a head chill, head to head tilt,

chin lift, boom, or jaw thrust.

If you're worried about C spine, you're open up that airway or

you're gonna do nasal trumpet.

That's what we're, that's what we're taking care of.

That's, that's what we're gonna do.

We're gonna ma open that airway up manually and then we're gonna

put in a nasal airway and continue on with our March assessment.

Nice.

Nice.

Is there anything else we could do to open up the airway?

Like why would an airway be closed?

Tongue if your tongue is dropped,

nasal would take care of the tongue.

But why?

What else would cause a closure?

You can have blood in the airway.

So you wanna put your face on the recovery position?

Put 'em on their side.

NICE's gonna continue on with that March assessment cuz once you're

done with that March assessment, we've controlled the life threats,

you move on to the next casualty.

Nice, nice, nice.

So airway all you care about, is it open or close?

That's right.

Secured, unsecured.

Can I secure npa?

Go to Thet Triple C route.

Surgical cri or innovation, whatever we got.

Crash airway.

But after it's open or closed and you've maintained that, where do we go?

Mr.

Buso?

Don't necessation.

What you doing about it?

What's, oh, we do about it?

What do you assess for and what do you do about it?

Up?

They, they're actually breathing.

Chest is rising.

There's no well like, was it like tension pneumothorax, th thorax I see.

And need blood, the lungs or anything else of that matter.

Checking for that.

Maybe we can put the, the, the pulse checking their SPL two as well, isn't it?

Can we,

More advance.

Sure.

That's, that's when you got more time, right?

This is, again, you're not, you're not delaying the march cuz these are good

things are gonna kill you for a pulse.

Yeah.

We're not really worried about oxygen just yet.

We just need ventilation.

Checking for holes.

We're checking for holes.

GSWs, we're looking for sucking chest wounds in and out.

Chest rise.

We're looking for some sort of in and out ventilation,

right?

No, I'm talking about

Yeah, but I'm talking about in and out chest wounds,

so just in or out to the back,

oh yeah.

The, yep.

Entrance and exit wounds.

Entrance in and out.

Burger.

Baby.

But yeah, you're looking for, you're looking for the open chest wounds.

Can we seal it off with chest seals?

Our one side chest raising round back, so do we need a de needle?

Decompress that side of the chest.

Are we looking at flail chest?

Are we looking at an open chest wound?

You are we looking at what else?

What else are we looking at?

Hemothorax.

And that goes into the whole point of why are they transitioning.

Let's first start off, what is the prime, what is today's society?

Ems, in your protocols, what is your primary site for a needle?

D Hayden, is that that

third R down

before my system is now?

Is it changed?

Is the, what was it before?

It was second inter intercostal.

Midclavicular around fifth and intercostal.

Okay.

Axillary.

Above or below the rib?

Above, because the van runs under the bridge.

Nice vein.

Artery.

Nerves.

Nice.

Nice.

And that was the initial primary spot.

And the secondary used to be aary, mid aary.

What in cost?

Fifth.

And between which ribs?

Four and five.

Four and five.

Above the rib.

. And now they're saying the military's at least doing it.

Some agencies are doing it.

Like you said, your protocol just changed to it because everything originates and

changes for what the military's saying.

You guys do it first.

Hell yeah.

But they're saying the primary is now what used to be the

secondary, the mid aary site.

And the main reason behind that is also because anatomy, right?

For female male the packs and chest and all that, that could, that could

affect the location site, that could affect the insertion of the the needle.

Whereas the mid aary tends to be more or less cumbersome of tissue.

You could still feel the ribs of most patients, but also a line

patient, a patient that's lying down if you go for your secondary

site, which is now the primary.

And that'll immediately give you the signs of a hemothorax.

Absolutely.

So they're saying this kind of knocks out two birds in one stone situation.

And what do we do far First Needle doesn't work.

Put in another one.

And which direction do we go Away from the heart.

Right next away

from the heart.

But you can put it, you can go right next to it.

You can,

yeah.

Always work away from your heart.

Don't work towards it.

Cuz that's when you start stabbing the heart.

Yep.

That's a whole other world of problems.

Cool.

We fix the restorations.

We put some chest seals.

What's after that?

C, c.

What are we doing?

Circulation.

Are

we assessing?

You're assessing pulses.

See where we're at.