Artwork for podcast Be EPIC Podcast
Exploring the Future of Digital Advertising with Kya Sainsbury-Carter
Episode 2528th November 2023 • Be EPIC Podcast • Brent Williams
00:00:00 00:36:27

Share Episode

Shownotes

This week on the podcast, Brent is joined by Kya Sainsbury-Carter, the Corporate Vice President for Microsoft Advertising. During the episode Kya kicks off by sharing her personal journey, from studying international business at the University of Arkansas to her unexpected but rewarding career in technology. As they continue in the episode, Kya discusses the rapidly changing landscape of advertising and how Microsoft is driving innovation in this space. Kya also highlights the diverse range of products and platforms that Microsoft offers for advertising, including MSN, Bing, Outlook, Xbox, and Skype. She explains how Microsoft Advertising works closely with advertisers, agencies, and publishers to find audiences within the Microsoft ecosystem and extend their reach across the web. Finally, Kya emphasizes the importance of building a business that matters and the goal of making a substantial impact in the industry.

Transcripts

Speaker:

Kya Sainsbury-Carter: Advertising. It's funny. I always say like,

Speaker:

we're in this really rapid period of change. And people

Speaker:

around me say like, it's always in a rapid period of change.

Speaker:

That's not a differentiator.

Brent Williams:

Welcome to the Be Epic podcast, brought to you

Brent Williams:

by the Sam M. Walton College of Business at the University of

Brent Williams:

Arkansas. I'm your host, Brent Williams. Together, we'll

Brent Williams:

explore the dynamic landscape of business, and uncover the

Brent Williams:

strategies, insights and stories that drive business today. Well,

Brent Williams:

today I have with me Kya Sainsbury-Carter, and Kya is the

Brent Williams:

Corporate Vice President for Microsoft Advertising, and is a

Brent Williams:

proud Walton College alum. So Kya, thank you for joining me.

Brent Williams:

Kya Sainsbury-Carter: Thank you so much for having me. I'm

Brent Williams:

thrilled to be here.

Brent Williams:

We're excited to have you engaged and well, one,

Brent Williams:

what an exciting time I would think to be at Microsoft

Brent Williams:

advertising. And maybe just let's start there sort of like,

Brent Williams:

tell us a little more about what you do at Microsoft.

Brent Williams:

Kya Sainsbury-Carter: Sure. And you know, probably it's helpful

Brent Williams:

to tell you a little bit about my how I got here from from my

Brent Williams:

experience at the University of Arkansas. I have spent most of

Brent Williams:

my career in technology. And I got started in tech, probably

Brent Williams:

pretty randomly, to be honest, I didn't, it wasn't wasn't the

Brent Williams:

plan, necessarily. But as I grew in tech, I became more and more

Brent Williams:

interested in getting closer to the customer to the end

Brent Williams:

customer. And in terms of how we use the internet, to facilitate

Brent Williams:

the engagement that we had with our customers, so that was at

Brent Williams:

Compaq. That was at Hewlett Packard, I worked at a startup.

Brent Williams:

And the way that I came to Microsoft is that when I worked

Brent Williams:

at a startup, I was running a whole product from sort of end

Brent Williams:

to end on the business side, you know, doing market research,

Brent Williams:

writing specs, doing business modeling, and I was also doing

Brent Williams:

the marketing. And as a part of the marketing, we were doing

Brent Williams:

some search marketing. And so I started learning about

Brent Williams:

advertising, and loved it, was super interested in it. And it

Brent Williams:

was a huge growth space. And so I transitioned from more of a

Brent Williams:

technology product angle in my career to moving into digital

Brent Williams:

advertising. I worked at an agency managing a big team at an

Brent Williams:

agency and then was hired by Microsoft, as Microsoft was

Brent Williams:

building out an ad business. So that's how I got here 17 years

Brent Williams:

ago. And I've done pretty much all the things there are to be

Brent Williams:

done except for technical roles in the ads business. And in this

Brent Williams:

role running Microsoft Advertising, I look across all

Brent Williams:

global sales marketing operations support functions,

Brent Williams:

and then work very, very closely with my engineering partner who

Brent Williams:

will be jointly manage the business together manage the p&l

Brent Williams:

together, to monetize Microsoft's assets through

Brent Williams:

advertising, and to act as a monetization engine for the web

Brent Williams:

for other companies as well. And so we have both a large, what we

Brent Williams:

call owned and operated business with MSN, with Bing, with

Brent Williams:

Outlook, Xbox, Skype, and more. And then we also work with many,

Brent Williams:

many partners outside of the company, as a monetization

Brent Williams:

partner, and of course, many advertisers and brands around

Brent Williams:

the world. So it's, it's a very fun and interesting job very

Brent Williams:

intense, high paced, building a business at Microsoft is really

Brent Williams:

interesting, because building a business here that matters means

Brent Williams:

it needs to get to be pretty big, we're an $18 billion

Brent Williams:

business now, and looking to grow and take share and become

Brent Williams:

substantially more impactful in the industry.

Brent Williams:

And so you know, you mentioned the various if

Brent Williams:

platforms is right, or products that Microsoft has, and so

Brent Williams:

you're able to sell, I guess, advertising on behalf of

Brent Williams:

customers across all of those different products. Is that, is

Brent Williams:

that correct?

Brent Williams:

Kya Sainsbury-Carter: Yeah, so we so we do a few different

Brent Williams:

things. So we will go out and work with advertisers and

Brent Williams:

agencies, ad agencies to buy inventory on our platform. So

Brent Williams:

it's find their audiences within the Microsoft ecosystem. And so

Brent Williams:

that's a big part of what we do. And then we can also help them

Brent Williams:

extend those audiences looking further across the web. And then

Brent Williams:

we also work with publishers very closely who are looking to

Brent Williams:

monetize their own content. And we are their ad tech partner, we

Brent Williams:

bring them demand from the advertisers and agencies that we

Brent Williams:

work with. So we have, I'd say a couple of different ways that we

Brent Williams:

work with the industry to either find audiences where we are or

Brent Williams:

to find their audiences elsewhere to to expand from

Brent Williams:

there.

Brent Williams:

Now was, you know, you found yourself in

Brent Williams:

technology. Did you really have technology in your background

Brent Williams:

academically I, or did really, that just kind of become the

Brent Williams:

path and you grew and learned throughout your career?

Brent Williams:

Kya Sainsbury-Carter: Honestly, it just became the path. When I

Brent Williams:

was at the U of A, I was focused on international business, that

Brent Williams:

was my passion. And I had transferred. And so as a

Brent Williams:

transfer student, I also had a bunch of other rigmarole that I

Brent Williams:

needed to deal with. So. But that was my that was my primary

Brent Williams:

passion. And then I went and got an MBA also focused in

Brent Williams:

international business. So my main focus was on how to how do

Brent Williams:

I get into roles where I can be navigating complex, global

Brent Williams:

multinational dynamics on the business end of things. And

Brent Williams:

that's both exciting, but also really, really broad, because

Brent Williams:

you could basically work anywhere, and do anything as

Brent Williams:

long as it was a company that worked outside the US. And so I

Brent Williams:

ended up actually, in my first job out of grad school, I was in

Brent Williams:

finance, because I had loved my finance classes. And I had a

Brent Williams:

great learning moment, which was I was decent at finance in the

Brent Williams:

classroom. But I was not, it was not my talent in the practical

Brent Williams:

world, and I didn't love it, it did not love me. And so I just

Brent Williams:

went looking for something else. And I applied for a job online

Brent Williams:

in 1996. So as you can imagine, dial up, that was a really slow

Brent Williams:

process.

Brent Williams:

Yeah.

Brent Williams:

Kya Sainsbury-Carter: And somehow out of the mound of

Brent Williams:

resumes, Compaq said, we want to hire you for a product marketing

Brent Williams:

role. And I said, sounds great. And we moved to Houston. So the

Brent Williams:

thing I would say, I think about myself, but in general is like I

Brent Williams:

was willing to take risks and move away from what I studied to

Brent Williams:

some degree from finance, in order to go and find this global

Brent Williams:

exposure and, and technology is what found me and I found it and

Brent Williams:

we really loved each other. So then I was on that path. And it

Brent Williams:

made sense. But no, I'm not a technologist. I'm not a

Brent Williams:

technical person by trade, or education, I think I have a

Brent Williams:

passion for what technology helps us accomplish. And I have

Brent Williams:

a passion for what technology helps us do in terms of drive

Brent Williams:

impact at scale. So I've always really been drawn to that. And

Brent Williams:

you can do a lot of really interesting multinational

Brent Williams:

business in these spaces, and there tends to be a lot of

Brent Williams:

building, you know, building a new business, a new product, a

Brent Williams:

new capability, going into a new market. And I'm a builder. And

Brent Williams:

so you sort of never seem to run out of opportunities to grow and

Brent Williams:

continue learning. And yeah, that's why I've been at

Brent Williams:

Microsoft for 17 years in the same business unit. Because I

Brent Williams:

have never run out of interesting things to do, where

Brent Williams:

I'm growing and have an opportunity to take on more and,

Brent Williams:

and be ambitious about the impact that we're driving. And,

Brent Williams:

and so I've never seen any reason to leave and and they

Brent Williams:

keep wanting me here, so I'll stick around.

Brent Williams:

Well, it seems like it's been a really good

Brent Williams:

fit, looking at your career trajectory. You know, digital

Brent Williams:

advertising, you know, over the last. You've been in it for many

Brent Williams:

years now. You've seen it, I know evolve probably rapidly at

Brent Williams:

times, maybe rapidly now. I'd love to have your view of how

Brent Williams:

you see it evolving and changing, and maybe even what

Brent Williams:

are some of the things you're excited about for the future?

Brent Williams:

Kya Sainsbury-Carter: Yeah, definitely. It's like

Brent Williams:

advertising. It's funny. I always say like, we're in this

Brent Williams:

really rapid period of change. And people around me say like,

Brent Williams:

it's always in a rapid period of change. That's not a

Brent Williams:

differentiator. But it's an interesting time right now,

Brent Williams:

because of a few different dimensions. You have, you have

Brent Williams:

this time where we have more and more and more content creation

Brent Williams:

on the web, of all types, whether that's, you know, social

Brent Williams:

media, whether it's niche news outlets, whether it's, you know,

Brent Williams:

creative type of stuff. There's there's more and more content,

Brent Williams:

which is great for consumers. And then there's also a need to

Brent Williams:

support that content creation, financially through either

Brent Williams:

subscription models or through advertising. At the same time

Brent Williams:

that that dynamic is happening where you need more advertising

Brent Williams:

that works and that is effective and relevant for advertisers.

Brent Williams:

Now their regulations are really changing the game. So you have a

Brent Williams:

number of well intended, and I think directionally correct

Brent Williams:

regulations that are happening globally and locally, that are

Brent Williams:

driving pretty tectonic changes in how digital advertising is

Brent Williams:

executed, and how efficient it is for advertisers. So that's

Brent Williams:

sort of an interesting juxtaposition, if you will. And

Brent Williams:

then you add on generative AI really exploding, which is going

Brent Williams:

to enable, you know, exponential steps forward in things like

Brent Williams:

mass personalization of offers and ad copy and mass creative

Brent Williams:

development where you could get one ad creative, and I could get

Brent Williams:

one and 10,000 other people could get their own based on

Brent Williams:

what would make most sense to us. So you have this this

Brent Williams:

period, that's that's happening or starting to kick off now that

Brent Williams:

is going to drive this like really remarkable level of

Brent Williams:

increased experiences for consumers. And it should be more

Brent Williams:

efficient for advertisers. And it should drive improved

Brent Williams:

outcomes for content owners, news publishers. So all of this

Brent Williams:

is happening at the same time. And I think all of it together,

Brent Williams:

at the same time means that you advertising is in a period not

Brent Williams:

of rapid change, which is generally what we would say, but

Brent Williams:

is in a true period of transformation. And our position

Brent Williams:

from a Microsoft advertising perspective. And as a partner of

Brent Williams:

these primary stakeholders in the advertising ecosystem, you

Brent Williams:

have consumers, you have advertisers, and brands, and

Brent Williams:

then you have publishers, is that these changes that that

Brent Williams:

we're driving and participating in, should be grounded and

Brent Williams:

purpose driven transformation versus massive disruption.

Brent Williams:

Because it feels like a very disruptive time. And disruption

Brent Williams:

can be great. But it also can be exhausting and take a lot of

Brent Williams:

resources. And so you have companies, advertisers, brands,

Brent Williams:

agencies, whoever, you know, they they're tired, people are

Brent Williams:

tired, they're spread thin, they're taking on new

Brent Williams:

capabilities with fewer employees, the market needs are

Brent Williams:

shifting, and they're complex. And so we look at advertising

Brent Williams:

shifting and say, okay, this is exciting transformation is

Brent Williams:

exciting. How can we work together with our stakeholders

Brent Williams:

to innovate with purpose, versus to disrupt, so that we can all

Brent Williams:

come along on that journey in a way that's pragmatic and

Brent Williams:

realistic. And I think that is very helpful in terms of us sort

Brent Williams:

of speaking the same language with our clients, with our

Brent Williams:

partners, and working constantly to make sure that we're aligned

Brent Williams:

versus often running, doing our own thing.

Brent Williams:

What a wonderful point and thought, and that is

Brent Williams:

that that positioning of purposeful transformation, I'm

Brent Williams:

sure it allows you to sort of ground yourself, it almost feels

Brent Williams:

like it allows you to gather yourself in a in a space that

Brent Williams:

I'm sure if you allow it to look chaotic, could because there's

Brent Williams:

so many options out there. But I assume that that's a way to

Brent Williams:

really start getting alignment toward where you want to go

Brent Williams:

together as partners.

Brent Williams:

Kya Sainsbury-Carter: Absolutely, absolutely. And we view it as a

Brent Williams:

as a big part of sort of our brand promise is, it will

Brent Williams:

absolutely we are innovative. We have the power of Microsoft

Brent Williams:

behind us from a machine learning and an AI perspective.

Brent Williams:

We have the power of Microsoft behind us in terms of running on

Brent Williams:

trust and viewing privacy as a human right. And these are very

Brent Williams:

important things to drive meaningful innovation. But

Brent Williams:

grounding ourselves from a brand perception and a brand promise

Brent Williams:

perspective in innovating with purpose does help us focus and

Brent Williams:

it also helps I think our clients feel like we're not

Brent Williams:

disrupting for disruptions sake. We're not disrupting for our own

Brent Williams:

sake and our own benefit. But we are looking at at how do we

Brent Williams:

solve our joint problems and pursue our joint opportunities

Brent Williams:

and ways that are purposeful for both of us. And it's very

Brent Williams:

clarifying.

Brent Williams:

The yeah, the societal benefit, if you will,

Brent Williams:

that that advertising allows, I think is truly very purposeful.

Brent Williams:

And I can understand why, why you and your team would would

Brent Williams:

rally behind that purpose. You know, you mentioned AI, and you

Brent Williams:

know, it made me think about how do you think we will see AI,

Brent Williams:

conversational AI really start to transform search marketing

Brent Williams:

and the future probably already is but what are some of the

Brent Williams:

things you're seeing and interested in going forward?

Brent Williams:

Kya Sainsbury-Carter: Yeah, it's, it's an exciting time to

Brent Williams:

be in this job, I'll be honest, you know, there's not always

Brent Williams:

something so exciting going on as the entire world's changing.

Brent Williams:

So I feel very lucky to be in this job, particularly in this

Brent Williams:

moment. And I'll start with saying, you know, we're in a

Brent Williams:

period of learning, both, both internally and together with our

Brent Williams:

clients and partners. So I think the definitive answer on how AI

Brent Williams:

will say will change search marketing is is somewhat of an

Brent Williams:

evolving topic, which makes it both really exciting, it also

Brent Williams:

makes people a little bit nervous about the unknown. But

Brent Williams:

but I, I constantly feel like it's important to sort of state

Brent Williams:

that we're not in a place of definitive knowledge, we're in a

Brent Williams:

place of evolving knowledge, I'd categorize the change that we're

Brent Williams:

seeing, and that we anticipate continuing to see really in

Brent Williams:

three areas. One is around the consumer behavior and consumer

Brent Williams:

experience. One is around the advertiser opportunity. And then

Brent Williams:

the third is around the publisher evolution and how

Brent Williams:

publishers are engaging. And we're seeing probably the most

Brent Williams:

on consumer behavior, because that's sort of the tip of the

Brent Williams:

spear on this. But when you think about consumers engaging

Brent Williams:

with search, which is now not a new thing, that's a very

Brent Williams:

standard thing that people do if they have broadband access. But

Brent Williams:

it was a few things that we're observing that will drive change

Brent Williams:

include things as basic as, like search queries, if you go in to

Brent Williams:

Bing, you, you had search queries are become becoming

Brent Williams:

longer and more conversational. And that makes sense. I mean,

Brent Williams:

you would anticipate it if you've used chat. But it's been

Brent Williams:

interesting to see in practice. So you previously, I might have

Brent Williams:

gone in and typed, like three words to try and explain what

Brent Williams:

I'm what I'm trying to accomplish. And now I'll type

Brent Williams:

like three sentences that really get extremely precise on what

Brent Williams:

I'm trying to do. So that that's the first thing. We're also I

Brent Williams:

think, naturally seeing more queries in the form of a

Brent Williams:

question. And so you're, you're seeing people behave a bit

Brent Williams:

differently there, which enables a lot more as an advertiser,

Brent Williams:

because you understand, actually, and it of course,

Brent Williams:

enables a lot for Microsoft advertising, because we

Brent Williams:

understand what someone's actually looking for. So we can

Brent Williams:

provide it to them and provide a better experience. We're also

Brent Williams:

seeing the consumer decision journey like that, you can see

Brent Williams:

online has more searches and more breath, because it's easier

Brent Williams:

to converse, essentially. So that you don't get annoyed and

Brent Williams:

walk away and go into a store you, you keep asking questions

Brent Williams:

and keep refining your understanding. But we're seeing

Brent Williams:

that that the length of time in that decision journey from

Brent Williams:

starting to do some high end, or high funnel level research to

Brent Williams:

actually like making a purchase decision is decreasing. So that

Brent Williams:

is really interesting. If you're, let's say in the

Brent Williams:

automotive industry, if that decision journey goes from a

Brent Williams:

couple of months, where you do a ton of research, and you go to

Brent Williams:

some dealerships, and you test drive some cars, and then you do

Brent Williams:

more research, and you know, whatever your process is, and it

Brent Williams:

goes down to a few weeks. That's really substantial shift in

Brent Williams:

terms of the role that search marketing can play. Obviously,

Brent Williams:

it's only one piece in terms of all the forms of advertising

Brent Williams:

that exist, but it's really interesting. So there's a lot

Brent Williams:

going on on the consumer side, as well. From an advertiser

Brent Williams:

perspective, you know, it's very much it's, it will change many,

Brent Williams:

many, many things. There's the ad units that can be offered,

Brent Williams:

that will change and the way in which consumers are engaging

Brent Williams:

with those ad units, of course, but there's also, I was

Brent Williams:

mentioning before, the opportunity to drive mass

Brent Williams:

personalization. And so if you're a brand, and you're

Brent Williams:

trying to tell your story, or make an offer to Kya, that is

Brent Williams:

not the same offer that you are going to be interested in. Right

Brent Williams:

now, we're both going to probably see a similar offer.

Brent Williams:

Maybe there'll be geographically diverse, but we're probably

Brent Williams:

similar in age and you know, how we the things that are happening

Brent Williams:

in our lives. And so we're going to see the same type of

Brent Williams:

demographically oriented offer versus an opportunity to show me

Brent Williams:

something that really works for me and show you something that

Brent Williams:

really works for you to show me a creative that will resonate

Brent Williams:

for me and you you know want a different one and 10,000 other

Brent Williams:

people a different one. So there are some pretty substantial

Brent Williams:

shifts that AI will bring that are really very exciting when

Brent Williams:

you think about where you apply your talent, that you can apply

Brent Williams:

them to higher order work that's more valuable, more interesting

Brent Williams:

drives better outcomes, and get this incredible outcome for your

Brent Williams:

customers. So it's really, really exciting. And we also see

Brent Williams:

a lot of interesting outcomes on the publisher side of things

Brent Williams:

where, you know, people are investing tremendous amounts of

Brent Williams:

money, creating great content and great experiences, and

Brent Williams:

having an opportunity to monetize that in different ways

Brent Williams:

that makes sense in the context of a given publisher, given

Brent Williams:

vertical. So I think I could talk about this for days, but

Brent Williams:

the short answer is, it will, it will change everything, but it

Brent Williams:

won't necessarily be overnight, because the consumer has to

Brent Williams:

change first.

Brent Williams:

Yeah. Yeah, do well, you've already you

Brent Williams:

answered this, to some degree, you know, the consumer's

Brent Williams:

changing the way they're engaging with search. Did you

Brent Williams:

say has there been a change happening over time? And then

Brent Williams:

maybe, you know, the, I guess the launch of publicly available

Brent Williams:

chat tools have really caused that to explode. Did you already

Brent Williams:

see some of these trends? And have they increased with like,

Brent Williams:

for example, you know, the release of ChatGPT earlier in

Brent Williams:

the year?

Brent Williams:

Kya Sainsbury-Carter: Not to my knowledge, in terms of the what

Brent Williams:

we look at. No, I wouldn't say that we were seeing some of

Brent Williams:

these trends, the technology, I think, the way that search grew

Brent Williams:

up, created an unnatural inorganic behavior, right, like

Brent Williams:

the way that you typically have searched. And then you see 10

Brent Williams:

blue links. And you know, we've, Bing, on Bing, we've innovated

Brent Williams:

on those 10 blue links quite a bit, but the way that you search

Brent Williams:

was ground into you. And so people started to search in a

Brent Williams:

way that is not how they would have actually asked a question.

Brent Williams:

So this is Kya's opinion, this is not Microsoft, well

Brent Williams:

researched opinion. But in that construct, it feels like we're

Brent Williams:

going back to what, what is more natural, and is, of course, more

Brent Williams:

conversational. But the technology needed to enable it

Brent Williams:

by by creating a good outcome. Because if you use the

Brent Williams:

traditional surge, you know, as I play around with this a lot,

Brent Williams:

put something in chat. And then to put the same query in, in

Brent Williams:

traditional search, you know, you do not get at all the same

Brent Williams:

type of outcomes. And so they're actually both very valuable. If

Brent Williams:

I want something really, really simple, I still use the

Brent Williams:

traditional search route, because it's easy, and it's

Brent Williams:

fast. If I want something that I don't think is simple, and that

Brent Williams:

really requires me to provide more detail, then I use chat.

Brent Williams:

And so that I think is another interesting behavior that we're

Brent Williams:

seeing is you come for chat, potentially, because it's cool,

Brent Williams:

and it's exciting, and it's different. But you will end up

Brent Williams:

using both. And that's also really empowering for consumers,

Brent Williams:

which is that we're not saying now shift over here and only do

Brent Williams:

this, we're saying this is really great in certain

Brent Williams:

scenarios, and we're going to make it a great experience for

Brent Williams:

the consumer, we're going to help advertisers make money from

Brent Williams:

it, we're going to make sure publishers benefit. But this is

Brent Williams:

also super valuable. And so let's not lose sight of this.

Brent Williams:

And together, they are powerful.

Brent Williams:

I love that. It's an and between between the

Brent Williams:

tools that we can customize as we learn as consumers. You know,

Brent Williams:

when you, one thing I was wondering, as you were talking

Brent Williams:

maybe particularly let's let's focus on advertisers. It seems

Brent Williams:

like you know, there's a lot of options out there. And how do

Brent Williams:

you help advertisers really understand the value that

Brent Williams:

they're creating through your platforms? I'm assuming closed

Brent Williams:

loop reporting and analytics are a key way to do that. But just

Brent Williams:

what's the what's really important to advertisers as they

Brent Williams:

think about why do I want to partner with Microsoft

Brent Williams:

advertising to reach consumers?

Brent Williams:

Kya Sainsbury-Carter: Yeah, well, it's the million dollar

Brent Williams:

question. Of course, there is a lot out there. And and we look

Brent Williams:

at it. I mean, certainly, if you get down to the very tactical

Brent Williams:

and practical levels, you know, having all of the right type of

Brent Williams:

measurement and attribution reporting and tools that help

Brent Williams:

advertisers build confidence that they're seeing outcomes

Brent Williams:

from the money that they're spending, of course, those are

Brent Williams:

table stakes for even being in the conversation, you know,

Brent Williams:

viewability those types of things. If, if you're coming and

Brent Williams:

you don't have that, then that is a very difficult conversation

Brent Williams:

to even be to even get to the table and be in the actual

Brent Williams:

dialogue. But I think, you know, at sort of the higher order,

Brent Williams:

like why do business with Microsoft advertising, we look

Brent Williams:

at it as we have something that no one else offers in the

Brent Williams:

market. And breaking that down into its component parts. And

Brent Williams:

helping advertisers understand that and then helping them

Brent Williams:

understand how they would execute within that ecosystem is

Brent Williams:

the story that we have to tell. But, but we believe that we have

Brent Williams:

something that no one else offers in the market, in terms

Brent Williams:

of the breadth and depth of our ecosystem. From an audience

Brent Williams:

perspective, if you look across what Microsoft brings into the

Brent Williams:

market, the users of those those products and the audience that

Brent Williams:

that creates, for us, it's incredibly powerful. That

Brent Williams:

encompasses you know, everything from windows, all the way to

Brent Williams:

Xbox, and sort of everything in between. Then, if you drill down

Brent Williams:

a little bit into how we bring that to life, you know, we have

Brent Williams:

full funnel marketing solutions that cross every channel, every

Brent Williams:

segment, we're global. But that audience piece is the big piece

Brent Williams:

in terms of, you know, no one else has this because at the end

Brent Williams:

of the day, advertisers, brands, agencies are looking for How can

Brent Williams:

I find my valuable audience, as much of it is possible, in a

Brent Williams:

reputable environment, that is privacy first, that cares about

Brent Williams:

my data, that that is less, you know, not so focused on making

Brent Williams:

their own money that they will, you know, make decisions that

Brent Williams:

are bad for my business, and then how do I bring that to life

Brent Williams:

in an efficient way that works within my ecosystem so that I

Brent Williams:

don't have to, like, hire a whole new team to work with

Brent Williams:

Microsoft or to work with whoever. And then of course, it

Brent Williams:

has to perform. And those are the table stakes. But I think

Brent Williams:

that that's really that's where I have our team focused is

Brent Williams:

telling that higher order story and making sure that advertisers

Brent Williams:

see that value that we can bring, that is really unique. If

Brent Williams:

you look from you know, from windows, to, to having a news

Brent Williams:

publisher with MSN, to having a social business network was

Brent Williams:

LinkedIn to having a retail media platform to having Outlook

Brent Williams:

to having Xbox as a gaming platform to having Bing as a

Brent Williams:

search engine, like you keep adding these pieces, we've,

Brent Williams:

we've acquired several companies in the last few years that have

Brent Williams:

really brought a lot to our tech stack, so that we can execute in

Brent Williams:

ways that make sense for advertisers. And then at our

Brent Williams:

core, you know, we are an advertising business. So we have

Brent Williams:

all of these other pieces that make sure that it is performant,

Brent Williams:

which is of course, at the end of the day, what is going to

Brent Williams:

bring that advertiser back to do it again. So it's all of that

Brent Williams:

and, and we are, I think right now in a really interesting

Brent Williams:

place around telling that story and having all those pieces

Brent Williams:

together in the same place.

Brent Williams:

Well, it is truly an amazing suite of

Brent Williams:

products that you get the chance to, to provide to the

Brent Williams:

advertisers. Truly amazing opportunity. Well, you know, we

Brent Williams:

started a little bit with your journey to to where you're at

Brent Williams:

today. And maybe just a slight twist on that, you know, as

Brent Williams:

you've gone through this career journey, might get you to

Brent Williams:

reflect a little bit on a couple of questions. And the first is

Brent Williams:

just like, how have you seen your leadership style develop?

Brent Williams:

And, and who are you as a leader that's leading a really large

Brent Williams:

business and assumably a pretty large team?

Brent Williams:

Kya Sainsbury-Carter: Yeah, it's it's been an interesting

Brent Williams:

journey. I think, lots of people and I certainly always thought

Brent Williams:

this about myself, have some natural leadership skills or, or

Brent Williams:

interest at least. And then of course, you need some actual

Brent Williams:

experience to help you bring those skills to life and, and

Brent Williams:

really develop them. I think, you know, my leadership style

Brent Williams:

has changed probably the most dramatically from leading by

Brent Williams:

doing versus, you know, leading by coaching and enabling and

Brent Williams:

empowering and of course, you have to do that as you scale.

Brent Williams:

That's impossible to be effective as you scale if you

Brent Williams:

don't make that change, but, but I started making that change

Brent Williams:

much earlier when I was managing smaller teams by just seeing

Brent Williams:

that leading by doing doesn't really resonate with people.

Brent Williams:

People don't feel empowered to grow if you step in front of

Brent Williams:

them to do it for them and then hope that they learned. And you

Brent Williams:

know, I remember I worked at Piggly Wiggly when I was in high

Brent Williams:

school, which people outside the South would not know Piggly

Brent Williams:

Wiggly, but I'm sure you do. And I had this really distinct

Brent Williams:

memory of, we had someone new who had started who was older

Brent Williams:

than I was, by probably, I don't know, four or five years maybe.

Brent Williams:

And, and her the age is only important in that I'm sure she

Brent Williams:

had lots of wisdom and capability that I didn't have

Brent Williams:

because I was 16. And I was training her and I just kept

Brent Williams:

stepping in front of her and doing things at the cash

Brent Williams:

register. And finally, she was mature enough to say, this is

Brent Williams:

not helpful to me. I need you to teach me so that I don't need

Brent Williams:

you anymore. And I can do my job by myself. And so even from the

Brent Williams:

earliest of times, I think you you receive leadership lessons

Brent Williams:

from people that consistently say, help me be great, so we can

Brent Williams:

be great. And that that has been probably my biggest life's

Brent Williams:

learning because I have a bias for action, I like to get things

Brent Williams:

done. I don't mind rolling my sleeves up. And so at each stage

Brent Williams:

of leadership, as I take on a bigger team, or broader scope,

Brent Williams:

or more global or whatever it might be, there's a need to

Brent Williams:

continue reinventing yourself in that way. And you know, I lead a

Brent Williams:

team of about 1,500 people, I can't obviously roll my sleeves

Brent Williams:

up and do everything. That would both be ridiculous, and also me

Brent Williams:

failing to do my job effectively. But I need to roll

Brent Williams:

up my sleeves sometimes, and do some things. And so finding that

Brent Williams:

right balance, and building an environment or cultivating an

Brent Williams:

environment where people feel valued and empowered, and like

Brent Williams:

they will receive coaching, where it's okay to take risks

Brent Williams:

and to fail. And to try again, has been an evolution that I

Brent Williams:

have been very aware of. Because I've been I've had the gift of

Brent Williams:

lots of feedback. And, and lots of people in my life who've been

Brent Williams:

willing to be super honest with me and say, hey, these things

Brent Williams:

work, and these things don't and, and a lot of them have been

Brent Williams:

sort of on that, that trajectory and that topic.

Brent Williams:

Well, Kya, that resonates with me personally,

Brent Williams:

just that that transition, you know, from doer to leader,

Brent Williams:

actually can be a real challenging one. But, but you're

Brent Williams:

exactly right. You know, you do find I agree with you, that you

Brent Williams:

find that when you work on empowering and serving and

Brent Williams:

helping and teaching your team that, you know, the the

Brent Williams:

multiplicative impact is so much greater than anything you could

Brent Williams:

have done as a doer that becomes very, very rewarding. You know,

Brent Williams:

the Walton College, you know, we have, we have about 8,000

Brent Williams:

undergraduate students and, you know, 600 or so graduate

Brent Williams:

students. And, you know, if you were to put yourself back in

Brent Williams:

those shoes, of being, you know, an undergraduate student that is

Brent Williams:

about ready to go out into the workforce based on everything

Brent Williams:

you've learned, what's one piece of advice that you would give?

Brent Williams:

Kya Sainsbury-Carter: My biggest piece of advice is to take

Brent Williams:

risks. And I think you have to frame risk taking against your

Brent Williams:

own personal risk profile, which is important. What is risk to

Brent Williams:

one person that's acceptable is not the same to another person.

Brent Williams:

But take risks with things that make you uncomfortable, that

Brent Williams:

aren't conventional, that aren't what all your classmates did.

Brent Williams:

It's not for everyone, but it's definitely been right for me,

Brent Williams:

and I'll share a couple of examples. You know, I when I got

Brent Williams:

out of high school, I couldn't wait to get out of Arkansas and

Brent Williams:

I went away to school. And I was livin' my non Arkansas dream.

Brent Williams:

And it wasn't for me. I didn't like the city I was in the

Brent Williams:

school was expensive. I was going into debt. And I

Brent Williams:

transitioned to back to Arkansas, the place I was trying

Brent Williams:

to leave and everyone around me thought that was absolutely

Brent Williams:

insane. And it felt risky. Because everyone said what are

Brent Williams:

you doing? You're on a track. Why are you changing your track?

Brent Williams:

And it felt right to me. I had been to summer school in

Brent Williams:

Fayetteville. I had loved it. I had lots of friends there. It

Brent Williams:

was affordable. The classes were great. And so I did it. You know

Brent Williams:

and I similarly when I moved to Houston to work at Compaq, like

Brent Williams:

I didn't know technology. I don't know why they chose to

Brent Williams:

take a chance on me. But I seize seized that chance and said,

Brent Williams:

okay, like, I'm gonna try that. And I had never worked in

Brent Williams:

advertising. But the the sort of opportunity presented itself as

Brent Williams:

I was learning. And it was a growing space where I knew that

Brent Williams:

I would be able to do some really interesting things. And

Brent Williams:

so I took a chance on that. And it's been an unconventional

Brent Williams:

path. But it's been a path where I have learned businesses in a

Brent Williams:

very breadth and depth way. And I've always had a job that I

Brent Williams:

liked. And that was interesting. And so that's my, my advice. It

Brent Williams:

doesn't have to always be financial risk. That I mean,

Brent Williams:

that makes me very uncomfortable. I don't like

Brent Williams:

taking financial risk. It doesn't always have to be

Brent Williams:

existential risk. But you have to be stepping outside your

Brent Williams:

comfort zone and taking chances on yourself, and taking chances

Brent Williams:

on new functions, jobs, companies, cities. And when you

Brent Williams:

do, I think really interesting things happen. And sometimes it

Brent Williams:

doesn't work out and it's okay.

Brent Williams:

We're certainly proud of the of the career that

Brent Williams:

you've made, and particularly at Microsoft. So thank you for

Brent Williams:

being willing to share your wisdom with us today.

Brent Williams:

Kya Sainsbury-Carter: Oh, well, thank you so much for having me.

Brent Williams:

On behalf of the Walton College, thank you for

Brent Williams:

joining us for this captivating conversation. To stay connected

Brent Williams:

and never miss an episode., simply search for Be Epic on

Brent Williams:

your preferred podcast service.

Links

Chapters

Video

More from YouTube