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Every Conversation Matters with Dr. Keith McNally | RR262
Episode 26211th June 2024 • Relationships Rule • Janice Porter
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I'm thrilled to speak to Dr. Keith McNally, a US Marine, educator, and a three-time podcast creator. He opens up about his battles with PTSD, including two attempted suicides and a heart attack. But here's the thing – instead of letting those dark moments define him, he found a way to turn his life around. Dr. Keith shares how COVID-19, which initially plunged him into despair, led him to reach out to strangers on LinkedIn, fostering meaningful connections that transformed his life.

And get this – Dr. Keith's mission doesn't stop at personal growth. He's gearing up for an epic thru-hike of the Appalachian Trail in 2025, all in the name of suicide prevention and supporting at-risk veterans. This episode is filled with inspiration, resilience, and the power of genuine connections in navigating life's challenges.

In this episode, you’ll learn:

  • How a supportive community can be the difference during difficult times.
  • About the power of building meaningful connections through personal development and relationship-building strategies
  • The importance of self-care and nature for mental well-being
  • Every conversation has value
  • About Dr. Keith’s project: Thru-hiking the Appalachian Trail for personal transformation and raising awareness for mental health


You can reach Dr. Keith at: mcnally.keith@yahoo.com

Website: www.drkeithmcnally.com

YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@DrKeithMcNally

LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/drkeithmcnally/


A little about me: 

I began my career as a teacher, was a corporate trainer for many years, and then found my niche training & supporting business owners, entrepreneurs & sales professionals to network at a world-class level. My passion is working with motivated people, who are coachable and who want to build their businesses through relationship marketing and networking (online & offline). I help my clients create retention strategies, grow through referrals, and create loyal customers by staying connected. 


In appreciation for being here, I have a couple of items for you: 

A LinkedIn Checklist for setting up your fully optimized Profile:  

An opportunity to test drive the Follow Up system I recommend by taking the  

3 Card Sampler—you won’t regret it.   


Connect with me: 

http://JanicePorter.com 

https://www.linkedin.com/in/janiceporter/ 

https://www.facebook.com/janiceporter1 


Thanks for listening! 

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Transcripts

Janice Porter:

Hi, everyone, and welcome to this week's episode

Janice Porter:

of relationships rule. My guest this week is Dr. Keith McNally.

Janice Porter:

And I'm quite excited to talk to him and I'm being completely

Janice Porter:

distracted by his legal structures behind him. So I, I

Janice Porter:

have a, I have a nephew who's very much into Lego, an adult in

Janice Porter:

there for nephew who's very much into Lego. And so I find this

Janice Porter:

really fascinating because it's another whole world that I

Janice Porter:

haven't really gotten into yet. So sorry about that. But it is

Janice Porter:

what it is. I want to tell you a little bit about Dr. Key. And

Janice Porter:

then we're going to get into the conversation. He How did we meet

Janice Porter:

we met because somebody asked if I was interested in having in my

Janice Porter:

podcast him on my podcast, but I think we had been on a

Janice Porter:

networking event together as well, that a bunch of people I

Janice Porter:

met there were very cool people. And there are podcast people as

Janice Porter:

you are. And Dr. Keith has a three podcasts that he has

Janice Porter:

developed over the past few years. And we'll get into that a

Janice Porter:

little bit. But he's a US Marine that. And I'm not sure and I

Janice Porter:

will ask you this in a minute. If the reason for your attempted

Janice Porter:

suicides, one or both of them was PTSD type of situation. But

Janice Porter:

you were in a low place at one point or twice in your life and

Janice Porter:

things have and you had a heart attack that you survived as

Janice Porter:

well. And so you, I don't know, I'm gonna get you to tell me

Janice Porter:

this, you turned your life around in so many ways and made

Janice Porter:

other people well, as well, because of what the work that

Janice Porter:

you do. So I know that in during the horrible pandemic, you

Janice Porter:

needed people to talk to, I think we all need people to talk

Janice Porter:

to you. And it's just a question of, you know, how who, what, and

Janice Porter:

you actually reached out on LinkedIn to people, so I'm gonna

Janice Porter:

get you to tell that story. So welcome to the show. First of

Janice Porter:

all, I'm going to call you Dr. Keith, or just keep,

Janice Porter:

Dr. Keith McNally: you're gonna call me Keith, because this is

Janice Porter:

gonna be a casual conversation sounds

Janice Porter:

good. And something else was gonna say,

Janice Porter:

Can't remember. So start there start with telling me about, you

Janice Porter:

know, where you were, what happened, and how you you know,

Janice Porter:

how you brought yourself to where you are now, to amazing,

Janice Porter:

Dr. Keith McNally: okay, that sounds like a good point, you

Janice Porter:

know, a good place to start. So I blame my life on COVID. And a

Janice Porter:

lot of people will say that in a very negative way. But I'm gonna

Janice Porter:

flip the coin and say, in a very positive way. And so it, we all

Janice Porter:

recognize the situation COVID brought upon, you know,

Janice Porter:

basically the world and so all of us were dealing with it in

Janice Porter:

very unique but very specific ways. And many of us lost loved

Janice Porter:

ones, friends, homes, money, jobs, you know, whatever it is,

Janice Porter:

whatever, you can put a name to it, you probably lost it. Um,

Janice Porter:

the other side of the coin was that, and this is what I was

Janice Porter:

finding when I when I was having this conversation. So and we'll

Janice Porter:

get to how I got there was when people were waking up in the

Janice Porter:

morning, and they may not have lost a whole lot. But in a

Janice Porter:

sense, they had lost their identity, meaning that when they

Janice Porter:

looked at themselves in the mirror, they weren't either

Janice Porter:

happy or proud of what they were seeing. And so everything that

Janice Porter:

they had accumulated career wise, basically, you know, in

Janice Porter:

life, whether it be the houses, the cars, the money's no longer

Janice Porter:

held the real value that it thought it should have. And

Janice Porter:

either side of the coin, people were making intentional pivots

Janice Porter:

and changes to do something about their life, whether to

Janice Porter:

survive it, and thrive through it, you know, the chaos of COVID

Janice Porter:

or to align themselves with a better version of themselves

Janice Porter:

that they really wanted to be proud of, and find value in and

Janice Porter:

my story regarding the COVID situation was, you know, through

Janice Porter:

a set of variables, I had lost my job and it happened to be at

Janice Porter:

the tail end of COVID through the quarantine. And

Janice Porter:

unfortunately, I was unemployed for 12 months and being now 54

Janice Porter:

going on 55 So my younger 50s That took an incredible hit on

Janice Porter:

who I was as a person as a dad. You know, me career, I'm losing.

Janice Porter:

Basically I'm trying to hold on to white knuckled you know fists

Janice Porter:

With everything that I was losing, and it wasn't working,

Janice Porter:

and so yeah, I had thought and made the attempt to take my own

Janice Porter:

life. And so, and that was the second time in in 12 years. So

Janice Porter:

2013 and 2021. Were specifically, it wasn't

Janice Porter:

necessarily around post traumatic stress. Now I am a US

Janice Porter:

Marine and I have a combat background, I was an I was

Janice Porter:

directly in infantry, and specifically in mortars as a

Janice Porter:

Marine. But that I'm not going to credit any of that passed to

Janice Porter:

why I took, you know, took the attempt to take my own life, you

Janice Porter:

know, it made the attempt, it was really life circumstances

Janice Porter:

that I was never fully prepared for. And because of that, I felt

Janice Porter:

the only way out, the best way out was to literally be out. And

Janice Porter:

so that's really kind of the nature of my story.

Janice Porter:

Had you been were you primarily an introverted

Janice Porter:

loner kind of person.

Janice Porter:

Dr. Keith McNally: You actually, I actually call myself a misfit.

Janice Porter:

And so you know, growing up, you know, grade school, middle

Janice Porter:

school, high school, college, never really fit in, I'm

Janice Porter:

definitely an introvert. My parents divorced when I was 10.

Janice Porter:

And so, all the chaos that was involved with, you know, my home

Janice Porter:

life really kind of stuck with me. And so I didn't develop

Janice Porter:

friendships, well, or if I did, I didn't develop many of them.

Janice Porter:

So a lot of what I lacked was was resources, you know, family

Janice Porter:

resources, friends, the ability to connect, the ability to

Janice Porter:

socialize, basically, in a very, what would seem a very natural

Janice Porter:

way that most kids, college students adults do, I have never

Janice Porter:

really developed those skills until basically, a couple of

Janice Porter:

years ago. So, right, so.

Janice Porter:

So you say that you needed people to talk to, to

Janice Porter:

network with, and you needed to find a job I imagined so that

Janice Porter:

that's why it started on LinkedIn, and starting to reach

Janice Porter:

out to some connections that you had there. And I find that in a

Janice Porter:

way safer to talk to a stranger, you know, it's not as hard to

Janice Porter:

talk to someone you don't really know, I find, even though I'll

Janice Porter:

talk to anybody and everybody, I'm an I'm more the extrovert in

Janice Porter:

that respect. And I can usually get pretty deep with them quite

Janice Porter:

quickly. But for some people, I think that's much harder. And so

Janice Porter:

I think, to to reach out to, you know, people that were a name

Janice Porter:

and on a connection list on LinkedIn, you may not have known

Janice Porter:

them all very well, in fact, probably didn't. So how did that

Janice Porter:

evolve and turn your life around? How did that help with

Janice Porter:

that?

Janice Porter:

Dr. Keith McNally: It was either a spiritual or subconscious

Janice Porter:

need. And so I recognized that everything about my life needed

Janice Porter:

to change. And so how I interacted with myself, how I

Janice Porter:

how I thought about myself, how I interacted with people, and

Janice Porter:

when I found about people, so throughout the job search, but

Janice Porter:

it was really more about making the connection, talking with

Janice Porter:

people. And like you said, I didn't have but maybe 2000, and

Janice Porter:

some change people on my LinkedIn connection list. And I

Janice Porter:

may have only really known a handful of them. Do you know,

Janice Porter:

no, no, you know, right, not just on a professional basis,

Janice Porter:

but maybe something on a personal basis as well. But what

Janice Porter:

I did was just simply tap on the virtual door and say, Would you

Janice Porter:

like to have a conversation? And that was really the foundation

Janice Porter:

of it. Now it was at a risk for me? Absolutely. Because of my

Janice Porter:

introverted nature, definitely a risk. And, but what I was

Janice Porter:

finding was the very thing I talked about earlier, people

Janice Porter:

were making changes, and by the nature of humanity, they wanted

Janice Porter:

to tell somebody else about it. And I just happened to be that

Janice Porter:

one person, if I'm inviting to a call, just like this, you know,

Janice Porter:

let's jump on a zoom call. There, you know, as people were

Janice Porter:

saying, yes, you know, but it was only the people who were

Janice Porter:

making the investment in their own life and making changes in

Janice Porter:

their life that wanted to have those conversations. It wasn't

Janice Porter:

everybody, you know, I got more, you know, people just ignored me

Janice Porter:

or just said no, blatantly said, no, no, no, thank you never. So

Janice Porter:

the conversations happen slowly, but as I continued, it was just

Janice Porter:

something that I needed to do so I can To the process, would you

Janice Porter:

like to have a conversation? Now, they didn't start getting

Janice Porter:

recorded. Until I saw the idea that, you know, these people

Janice Porter:

were sharing. We cried on Zoom calls, you know, people had gone

Janice Porter:

through some stuff. And they wanted to share their story. No,

Janice Porter:

I wasn't necessarily being fully open disclosure with my own

Janice Porter:

stuff. But at the time, it really didn't, I didn't need to

Janice Porter:

be because they were really sharing their stories. And so I

Janice Porter:

simply asked the next person, would it be okay to record this?

Janice Porter:

And somebody said, Yes. And so, with that, first, yes, I started

Janice Porter:

recording conversation that began with some of the folks

Janice Porter:

that I did know, personally and professionally, and then grew it

Janice Porter:

from there. So initially, what was a podcast or basically a

Janice Porter:

YouTube playlist called level up? Within 15 to 20 episodes,

Janice Porter:

and I do 40 Episode seasons. I change it to the question guy.

Janice Porter:

I'm a college professor by trade, I ask a lot of questions.

Janice Porter:

And the question guy stuck. And so the question guy podcast

Janice Porter:

became, you know, that series of playlists that started, you

Janice Porter:

know, these are 2120 22. Interesting.

Janice Porter:

So, what were you teaching? By the way? Do you

Janice Porter:

teach now still,

Janice Porter:

Dr. Keith McNally: I do I still teach, not at the not at a

Janice Porter:

college. I, my background is in it. And my doctorate is in

Janice Porter:

educational leadership. So by all intents and purposes, I

Janice Porter:

should have gone into an administration, but I'm very

Janice Porter:

comfortable in the classroom, and so sharing knowledge, yeah,

Janice Porter:

yeah, I'm very comfortable. So now I work for an international

Janice Porter:

business solutions company, and I'm a tech I'm one of their

Janice Porter:

technical trainers.

Janice Porter:

Okay. Wow. Okay. And that's so different to this

Janice Porter:

journey, that you're towards leadership. Right? And

Janice Porter:

Dr. Keith McNally: very, very different. Yeah. To some degree.

Janice Porter:

Yeah.

Janice Porter:

So one of the things that, that I noticed on

Janice Porter:

your bio, was that you that topics that you like to talk

Janice Porter:

about, and this is the one that jumped below, they all did, but

Janice Porter:

this one jumped out at me discuss strategies for actively

Janice Porter:

building creating and nurturing meaningful connections, because

Janice Porter:

that's what I'm all about to I'm all about relationship building,

Janice Porter:

and, and business built on relationships, relationships

Janice Porter:

form that, you know, you form a trust with people, people can

Janice Porter:

trust, if you refer somebody to them, it's going to be the right

Janice Porter:

person, etc, etc, all of those things. So what would you say

Janice Porter:

are the, the, the, the best strategies for doing that?

Janice Porter:

Dr. Keith McNally: Well, everybody's gonna have their

Janice Porter:

unique take to that. And so what I, what I did is, I learned

Janice Porter:

about people, I made it my purpose to learn about people.

Janice Porter:

And so earlier, when you kind of, you know, read off pieces of

Janice Porter:

my bio, I do have three different conversations that's

Janice Porter:

actually grown to five and will grow to six by the end of this

Janice Porter:

year. And because my hashtag is commerce, all conversations that

Janice Porter:

matter is my hashtag to one of them that I use in conversations

Janice Porter:

for change, because everything begins and ends with the right

Janice Porter:

conversation. And that's kind of been my, my, my gut. Since all

Janice Porter:

of this began. And I mean that to say, the first set of

Janice Porter:

conversations were all about people's personal story. And

Janice Porter:

that's what the question guy is all about. Right? Because of

Janice Porter:

their transformation. People actually create business models

Janice Porter:

from their own personal stuff, became coaches, speakers, or

Janice Porter:

book authors, and are now helping people going through the

Janice Porter:

stuff that they originally went through, or helping other people

Janice Porter:

go through that same stuckness whatever that is. And so, I

Janice Porter:

credit Coaches Corner specifically to talk about

Janice Porter:

business expertise. On the brink, grander, global, more

Janice Porter:

broader scale, I created the Envision speaker series and I

Janice Porter:

brought back panels members, panel people, people who have

Janice Porter:

already been on my show, I wanted to start talking about

Janice Porter:

what it takes to make social change happen, you know,

Janice Porter:

whatever that toxic work, you know, workplace toxicity, mental

Janice Porter:

health, illness, you know, mental illness, mental health

Janice Porter:

issues in men. Why do men have more suicide ideations now than

Janice Porter:

ever before? At any age level? How to heal how to be holistic

Janice Porter:

in your who you are not just about being this person

Janice Porter:

professionally and this person personally, step up and show up

Janice Porter:

as who you are. All the time. That's the start of the answer

Janice Porter:

to your question. How do we build that know like trust

Janice Porter:

relationship? It starts with two things and this is what I

Janice Porter:

learned over Coming in on my own suicide ideation, learn how to

Janice Porter:

breathe. One thing is to do is learn under breathe. breathing

Janice Porter:

calms the body and focuses the mind. And I don't mean just a

Janice Porter:

regular breathing, I mean, focus breathing, you know, close your

Janice Porter:

eyes sit down, and taking that breath and allow the oxygen to

Janice Porter:

do what it's designed to do. And that's give you energy. It's one

Janice Porter:

of the things it's designed to do. And then once you learn how

Janice Porter:

to do that, figure out who you are actually wrote a book.

Janice Porter:

Walking the Path of leaders journey is all about personal

Janice Porter:

development through a series of stages. But the essence of the

Janice Porter:

book is if you throw away the titles, and I had to because I

Janice Porter:

was unemployed for 12 months, so everything I did, as a doctor,

Janice Porter:

everything I did, as a college professor, everything I did,

Janice Porter:

prior to the chaos, I had to let go, because it was all those

Janice Porter:

things I was holding on to that I couldn't hold on to anymore.

Janice Porter:

They were slipping away. And so what I decided to do was, let

Janice Porter:

them go. And when I decided to let everything go, my whole life

Janice Porter:

changed, I found a job. People were beginning to help me do

Janice Porter:

what I needed to do to overcome, you know, suicide ideation, the

Janice Porter:

chaos of COVID building relationships. So I started

Janice Porter:

having more of those more and more those conversations just

Janice Porter:

like this one. And I began to appreciate every conversation,

Janice Porter:

every person that I would meet, because they were adding, if

Janice Porter:

anything, just a little gold, maybe a little bit of value to

Janice Porter:

my life. And I have to hope and think that as I was living

Janice Porter:

vicariously through them, and becoming comfortable with

Janice Porter:

myself, that I was exchanging that same value at some level to

Janice Porter:

them. That has to be true, because now I've had over 250

Janice Porter:

recorded conversations under five different platforms.

Janice Porter:

So this is what I'm picturing. I'm picturing

Janice Porter:

that, that you lost your job that you you were and COVID hid.

Janice Porter:

And you were alone a lot. As we all were, you know, unless we,

Janice Porter:

you know, have people live in our house with us, we have a lot

Janice Porter:

of, you know, alone time, and that brought you into negative

Janice Porter:

state. And you plummeted. But you also had the wherewithal to

Janice Porter:

get yourself out of it. I mean, did you have were you in

Janice Porter:

therapy, were you where you want? No, I

Janice Porter:

Dr. Keith McNally: didn't. I didn't have the wherewithal to

Janice Porter:

get myself, okay. I actually, for whatever, for whatever was

Janice Porter:

keeping me alive. I was showing up even broken. So I was showing

Janice Porter:

up to networking meetings, I was showing up to job interviews, I

Janice Porter:

was showing up to whatever I needed to do. Even on LinkedIn,

Janice Porter:

even the conversations I was having, I was still broken. I

Janice Porter:

actually met somebody His name is Mitch Cray, and I always give

Janice Porter:

him a shout out. So don't don't hate me for in this

Janice Porter:

conversation. He invested his life into me, you

Janice Porter:

know, I said, Why would I hate you for it? No,

Janice Porter:

absolutely.

Janice Porter:

Dr. Keith McNally: He invested his life into me so that I would

Janice Porter:

still have one. And at first, he was just a mentor. Now we're

Janice Porter:

really good friends. So it was one person making the investment

Janice Porter:

free of charge? No. It's because of who he is and what he does

Janice Porter:

and how he does it. That said, you know, Keith, we're going to

Janice Porter:

take this one step at a time. He's the one who taught me to

Janice Porter:

breathe. He's the one who taught me to show up.

Janice Porter:

I love it. No, I think that's great. But you did

Janice Porter:

I mean, give yourself some credit. Right? For keeping going

Janice Porter:

until that happened, right? Because, right. And actually,

Janice Porter:

it's making me think of something else too. Like when

Janice Porter:

you talk about the breathing and and I don't do that enough, I

Janice Porter:

don't stop and just, you know, relax and do that. But I've

Janice Porter:

noticed that I have a little granddaughter, she's four and a

Janice Porter:

half, she's almost five. And she's very hyperactive, and

Janice Porter:

she's never stops moving. But if you if you know she's getting

Janice Porter:

too, too much and too much going on, you kind of have to stop her

Janice Porter:

and look her in the eye and go, Okay, let's just breathe. And

Janice Porter:

take a breath and just relax for a minute. And you can see what

Janice Porter:

happens when she does that. She needs to do that. And the other

Janice Porter:

thing that she needs to do, which I want to come to with you

Janice Porter:

is she needs to be out in nature. It seems to ground her

Janice Porter:

and she is at her best when she's digging in the soil and

Janice Porter:

she's, you know, dig turning over a rock or getting dirty or

Janice Porter:

putting her feet in the water. That's what she loves to do.

Janice Porter:

Which is like the first Sing from me, I was the kid who

Janice Porter:

didn't want to get dirty when I was a kid. So it's really

Janice Porter:

interesting to see what she's teaching, you know, me, for

Janice Porter:

example. But I think that you must feel that too, because

Janice Porter:

you're going on this amazing journey that is also to raise

Janice Porter:

money, I think also for people in need. You can tell me

Janice Porter:

exactly. It's about suicide prevention, I think. Right.

Janice Porter:

Dr. Keith McNally: So I'm on a mission. And so I've

Janice Porter:

collaborated with a couple of different people to do a couple

Janice Porter:

of different things. One of the things that I'm working with is

Janice Porter:

any event in September 2024. So at the time of this recording

Janice Porter:

this year, in a couple of months, I'm working with Shane

Janice Porter:

Kramer, and Rick made down in North Carolina, in 2023.

Janice Porter:

Unfortunately, NC State University was in the spotlight

Janice Porter:

in the media spotlight, because they had incurred several deaths

Janice Porter:

by suicide at the colleges. So the college level 2018 1920 21

Janice Porter:

year olds are struggling for a variety of reasons. And so I

Janice Porter:

know a lot of people have, have raised the attention. This has a

Janice Porter:

focus, we just happen to have a really good team, and we're

Janice Porter:

bringing some services, and we're gonna do an event down

Janice Porter:

there. But because I'm a veteran, my specific focus is

Janice Porter:

with veterans and at risk veterans. I am you talked about

Janice Porter:

going back into nature. So one of the things I want to do is

Janice Porter:

raise awareness, provide educational services, mentoring

Janice Porter:

and training to veterans in the veteran community, including

Janice Porter:

their families, on how to redesign your life. Now, I am

Janice Porter:

not a crisis intervention specialist, I'm not there, when

Janice Porter:

you got the gun to your head, or whatever that situation looks

Janice Porter:

like. That's not my space. But if you're still alive, and you

Janice Porter:

still struggle with unknowns and variables that you think are

Janice Porter:

problematic to you. I am somebody to talk to. There are

Janice Porter:

many bigger organizations, Wounded Warrior, and all kinds

Janice Porter:

of other veterans and mental illness, mental health

Janice Porter:

organizations, and we all do our good job or due diligence, and

Janice Porter:

we all work well in our spaces. But I've been there, I've

Janice Porter:

actually made the attempt three times my first time as a college

Janice Porter:

student myself 25 years ago. But specifically, as an adult,

Janice Porter:

there's no scarier place to be than alone, and thinking that

Janice Porter:

your life is worthless. And so because of that, and because

Janice Porter:

I've got some friends, some veterans who, you know, did

Janice Porter:

their time and service, some of them retired, who also struggle

Janice Porter:

with life variables, and I always call them very, because

Janice Porter:

we never know when something comes up. I do want to give them

Janice Porter:

an opportunity, one to have a conversation to, to become real

Janice Porter:

with themselves. And like I said, and even I wrote the book,

Janice Porter:

but it's all about personal transformation, learn how to

Janice Porter:

breathe, or on the show up, learn how to be vulnerable. The

Janice Porter:

event that you're talking about is I want to hike through it's

Janice Porter:

called an actual thru hike in the community, the Appalachian

Janice Porter:

Trail. So in 2025, on April 1 is our launch date. So me and

Janice Porter:

Jodi's is a colleague of mine, friend of mine, we both

Janice Porter:

veterans, we're going to do a thru hike of the Appalachian

Janice Porter:

Trail. And so that's a 2193 miles depending on who you talk

Janice Porter:

to you from Springer Mountain, Georgia, all the way College in

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Maine. And so it's going through 14 states, on the east coast of

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the US contiguous states, it's going to take about four months,

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the way God keeps on putting it, probably five, and so we do need

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to raise a lot of money just to put us through the hike, food

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and some other supplies as well. But specifically, we're going to

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be bringing people in veterans service members, those who have

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overcome their own situations or those who are still struggling

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with their own situations, we're going to bring them on the

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trail. We are welcoming every possible section hiker so if you

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want to join us awesome, more than the more the merrier. Even

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if you only like one mile with us now. It's cool. No overnight

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camping, but at the very least, this is going to be

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transformational for for many, many people. And probably

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specifically for me and for Jodi because this is something we've

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never attempted before. So we're novice thru hikers haven't done

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it before. I mean, we have hiked and we have camped, and so we

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we've got the general idea of how to do this. But you know,

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hiking 20 plus miles a day across 14 states over four

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months, is different. You know, he's calling it a military

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mission and I'm I'm right there with him because it's all about

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logistics and planning and all this other kind of stuff. And so

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that's why we are raising money. But we're also specifically

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raising awareness, and providing education coaching as well. And

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mentoring.

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So hopefully you'll get some PR out of it.

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And as you go through it, you'll log it on video and all of that

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good stuff, right?

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Dr. Keith McNally: Yeah, well, so we did it, as long as we get

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the answer sheet and the Wi Fi, the Wi Fi, live stream, what we

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can do anything else gets recorded. He is he's a technical

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guru. So I've asked him to kind of bring some of his his toys

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with them, we might create some, you know, virtual or augmented

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reality segments along the way, which would be really, really

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cool for people who are in that space. But all in all, you know,

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we are really looking to, to really bring a new identity to

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the bedroom community, because like you said, you Mo's your

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niece, my granddaughter. Yeah, when she's out in nature, we're

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created, you know, I do believe we were created. And the book

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says we're created from dirt particles of the earth. And so

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part of part of us is connected to that, and you can't take that

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away. I from my belief structure, I can't take that

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away.

Janice Porter:

Wow, interesting. So I think that's a, it's a very

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robust plan, and got the word challenge that you're taking on.

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And I think it'll be quite, it'll be exciting for you. And

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I'm sure that the biggest thing will come from people's

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transformations. And so I'd like to ask you in all of the

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discussions you have with people and, and I know you're a

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teacher, your trainer, your Creator, your speaker in all of

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the people that you that you touch with the work that you do.

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Do you have one or two stories that's really stand out? As, you

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know, just really special? Um, I know I put you on the spot, but

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Dr. Keith McNally: no, it's okay. There is. I always say

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every conversation is important. And what I what, what I would

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like to see happen is more men step up to the conversation,

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more men step up to the microphone. Only because I don't

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get that often enough. Now. I have a lot of conversations on

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this is a lot of them with women. So women would step up.

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And because they're, it's easier for them to share my personal

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experience, you know, tragedy and whatnot. And very few men,

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at least, on my podcast, are willing to do that now if you

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have if you have cried. And so that's that I think is a very

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powerful thing is when I see a man cry in front of me, because

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of something that's happened in him in his life, and he's

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willing to become vulnerable. And he's willing to disclose.

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And so if more men can actually not every man has to do that,

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you know, I'm not saying that every man has to break down like

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a baby and cry. But for the expression of emotion in that

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way, that release of energy is so valuable and

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transformational. That I would like to see more men do that.

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And so that did happen in one of my conversations. And it wasn't

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even though the question God podcast, it was Coach's Corner,

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because he had lost everything. It might have been a mixed vote,

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he had lost everything, and had to go back to mom and dad as a

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grown man and say, you know, Dad, I failed. And that broke

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him. And it broke him on in the conversation. And so that was

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such a powerful moment. Both in our conversation, and I think in

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his own life, of course, that he changed himself. The other story

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wouldn't be, like I said, I have, you know, of my three. So

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personal, professional and social impact stories. I do have

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two other specific conversations, one around

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suicide and the impact of suicide in our lives. I have

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about eight or nine on my playlist on YouTube. And I have

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an a fifth conversation for those people who want to kind of

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drop the facade, drop the titles and just have conversations with

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me about what's really important in their lives. And I've had

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about, you know, a handful of those and I call them

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conversations. It's a conversations playlist on

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YouTube. And her name is Carrie Allen. She is very active on

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LinkedIn. She is the founder of the Hume Monterey with a

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colleague, Sara Cotterell. And they do, they taught me how to

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meditate. They taught me how to meditate and how to use words,

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to empower me before I have conversations, because what I

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wanted to do was get better at this, I wanted to get better at

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having conversations with people. And that meant, from her

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perspective, and probably from my perspective, is to be more

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present, not run from a script, not rehearse words or sentences

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or questions, but to be present in the moment. And she taught me

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how to do that. And I think since like, October, September,

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October, November, last year to now so at the time of this

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recording, I've gotten much better at that being present in

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the moment and being to exchange energies with the person or

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people I'm having conversations with. And so that they recognize

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that they're being listened to, and being validated. And that's

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probably the most powerful thing I've been able to learn to date.

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That's really interesting. Because I don't

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work from a script, I can't, and that's with anything I do, like,

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even when I have to go do a speech, which I don't do very

Janice Porter:

often because I'm uncomfortable having a script. But you know,

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I'm better off the cuff in a way. I mean, I have to do some

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prep, but I just have to feel it out when I'm speaking to the

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person. But what you're talking about for me, I think comes from

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Curiosity. So that's, I find interesting in what you're

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saying, because I don't always I sometimes ask my my guests the

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curiosity question, because I'm fascinated by that myself, and I

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feel I have a really good sense. And I have a sense of curiosity.

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And a lot of people don't. And I wonder if people think it's

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innate or learned. And that sort of is curious to me when you

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say, you know, learning about being in the moment and, and

Janice Porter:

being aware of what someone's saying and feeding off that. I

Janice Porter:

call that curiosity. So did you have to learn, you had to learn

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that?

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Dr. Keith McNally: I did. I would say it's a balance I I

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intentionally knew I wanted to be better at having a

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conversation, a real conversation to to literally be

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in that space, rather than, you know, the notorious thinking

Janice Porter:

about what I have to say, as as part of the interaction and so

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with with, you know, Carrie Allen, Sarah Cotterill, Eileen

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build Mitch cray. These people taught me how to focus one my

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energies to my thoughts through my subconscious. Breathe and be

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in the moment. Now, Am I perfect at it? Not yet, I am getting

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better. And I think with every conversation, I do get better.

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But it was something I had to learn. It wasn't necessarily

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something that was just jumping out at me and say, you know,

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this is just who you are. And it all works. Remember, I'm an

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introvert by nature. So for 50 years, I didn't have too many

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conversations.

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Right? Right. It's fascinating, because I know

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people that say that same thing, and they're not, they're not

Janice Porter:

curious at all. And so yes, it can be learned. And it can also

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be innate. So I don't know, I always in my mind, I think we

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all start as curiosity as curious kids, little kids, and,

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you know, but somewhere, something gets drummed out of us

Janice Porter:

in lots of school, maybe, no, I taught school. So I hate to say

Janice Porter:

that, but I think it's true. You know, in fact, you know, my

Janice Porter:

granddaughter starting kindergarten September, and it's

Janice Porter:

gonna be really interesting to see what happens with her

Janice Porter:

because she can't sit still for very long. And yeah, so we'll

Janice Porter:

see. We'll see what happens. We'll, we'll be monitoring it

Janice Porter:

and looking at how it affects her. But um, yeah, so curiosity

Janice Porter:

and the skills and the strategies like you said, for,

Janice Porter:

for how to better yourself in this in the situations you put

Janice Porter:

yourself in. So I love that you are really always working on

Janice Porter:

yourself. I love that. Yeah, that's

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Dr. Keith McNally: what I have to do now. I mean, if I'm going

Janice Porter:

to be, you know, a better coach, a better speaker, a better

Janice Porter:

podcast host. I need to do that because without that, it's just

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going to be a flat, boring conversation. There's gonna be

Janice Porter:

no energy, there's gonna be no exchange of value. All the

Janice Porter:

cliches but really I think as based on what you said earlier

Janice Porter:

earlier in the conversation, it's all about building that

Janice Porter:

relationship that know, like trust. And so because of that,

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you know, personal transformation process, and I'm

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putting myself through a continuing the know, like trust

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paradigm, you know, the triad is becoming more and more part of

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me. And I say that, because it's, it's part of the

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importance of what I do. Because I've talked with so many people

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that I've I know, there's two people out there that need to

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talk themselves, I make that connection. I'm not asking for

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anything in return, I do the same thing, John, that, you

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know, times and time again. And it's always been that, to my

Janice Porter:

knowledge, when they come back to me, that's always been the

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right connection. So it's like these people needed to me. And

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apparently, I was the facilitator of that.

Janice Porter:

Yeah, that feels so good. I know, I do that too.

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And I and when it works, you just know that it's like,

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there's the magic, right? And you've just been that. I don't

Janice Porter:

know, I, I find that so satisfying. You have to meet

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this person, I honestly, trust me on this one, and boom, it's

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just perfect. I love it. So this is fascinating. There was one

Janice Porter:

more thing I wanted to ask you about. So I know that you let

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your storyteller and you're now your conversationalist. You

Janice Porter:

You're, you're a speaker, which is also bringing you more of an

Janice Porter:

extrovert piece when you're a speaker, right? But are you and

Janice Porter:

your writer, so which do you like to do the most

Janice Porter:

Dr. Keith McNally: I would like to do all the make bank on a

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two, I can't do that access to have my nine to five. To be

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quite honest, I in joy, I enjoy all of them. So there's there's

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no doubt about any of it. The most nerve wracking of the bunch

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is being on stage. That's why I want more opportunities to do

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that. I think I have I can add role. And I hate to cliche, I

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could add real value to that space. Only because I want to

Janice Porter:

share my story. And that may be egotistical at this point, I

Janice Porter:

don't know. But the most converse, the best thing I enjoy

Janice Porter:

doing at this point is, is having these conversations

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because I do think I do believe that every conversation is

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important. And every conversation was meant to be

Janice Porter:

listened to by at least one other person who's going to take

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something from it. For some reason, I believe that in

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lately. And so even this conversation, and I know this is

Janice Porter:

your podcast, if only one person watched it, it's needed to be

Janice Porter:

watched by that one. Hopefully more. Yeah, that's okay. But

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there's somebody out there who needs to hear what we and it's

Janice Porter:

not just what I it's what we've had to say. And the energies

Janice Porter:

that we exchanged. Somebody needs to not only hear it, but

Janice Porter:

they need to experience it. So for every conversation I have,

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that's why I want to get better at them. I think I believe I

Janice Porter:

trust that there's somebody out there eventually. That needs to

Janice Porter:

experience that conversation. What happens the next day or

Janice Porter:

five years later. As long as it's evergreen. It can happen.

Janice Porter:

So I think that your book, a walk walking the

Janice Porter:

path, a leaders journey. That path is personal development,

Janice Porter:

right? I mean, yes, you're going on the Appalachian Trail. And

Janice Porter:

that's the physical path that you're going on. And, and

Janice Porter:

growing from it. But this is about becoming a leader of self.

Janice Porter:

Right.

Janice Porter:

Dr. Keith McNally: It is now the characters, it's both Oh, it's

Janice Porter:

disabled. I do apologize, but no, it's all good. So it's a

Janice Porter:

mixture of both, you know, contextual elements of

Janice Porter:

leadership and what that looks like, but not from an academic

Janice Porter:

perspective. So I pull out, we talked about mentoring, we

Janice Porter:

talked about team building, we talked about communication

Janice Porter:

becoming vulnerable, and all of the self development things that

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you really should have, if you're going to lead people and

Janice Porter:

then the specific circumstance falls within a story of fable

Janice Porter:

and narrative within the book, where a young man his name is

Janice Porter:

John So everything's kind of generic, needs to find himself

Janice Porter:

and so he's expected to take over his dad's farm in his

Janice Porter:

community, surrounded by mountains, so you know, very,

Janice Porter:

very sick, you know, segregated and separated from the rest of

Janice Porter:

the world. He's, it's mid basic course. Yeah, he feels like he's

Janice Porter:

a misfit. He doesn't fit in. I mean, he can he can do to things

Janice Porter:

but developing close friendships with a lot of people. He does

Janice Porter:

have his close knit friends. He leads then he decides to lead

Janice Porter:

them and they decide to follow him over the mountain, okay. And

Janice Porter:

he had to learn how to lead. And that's kind of the basis of the

Janice Porter:

story.

Janice Porter:

That's really cool. Okay, I'm gonna come full

Janice Porter:

circle. And we're going to wrap it up. And I'm going to ask you

Janice Porter:

about your Lego. So no, seriously you are you get kits

Janice Porter:

you make Lego creatures and characters and things.

Janice Porter:

Dr. Keith McNally: So everything you see behind me outside of the

Janice Porter:

happy birthday cards, and Father's Day cards are Lego

Janice Porter:

built. And so their basic sets their license sets. And so the

Janice Porter:

big red thing that you see, I think on over here, as Ninjago

Janice Porter:

Mac, and so he's stands about this tall. Now, Lego likes to

Janice Porter:

advertise themselves as toys. I would not ever play with him

Janice Porter:

because he's very, very fragile.

Janice Porter:

And probably how many hours of putting it

Janice Porter:

together, right.

Janice Porter:

Dr. Keith McNally: So each of these sets, they're not

Janice Porter:

necessarily the advanced the builds, but they do take a

Janice Porter:

couple of hours of dedicated time. Now the one I'm most proud

Janice Porter:

of is StormBringer. And Stormbringer is a combination of

Janice Porter:

Lego Boost, which is one of their it's not their advanced

Janice Porter:

brick, computer brick. It's just an application, you can download

Janice Porter:

it there's a robotic. He can, she wants to actually share it.

Janice Porter:

Stormbringer she is she. So it's a combination of the booths

Janice Porter:

product. This was like back in 2018. And the StormBringer

Janice Porter:

dragon product. So they combined the two. And she could walk, she

Janice Porter:

can roar, she can shoot lightning bolts out of her

Janice Porter:

mouth. She's just a lot of fun to play with. But she's an awful

Janice Porter:

lot of fun to build as well.

Janice Porter:

So I I always think of when I was young, I

Janice Porter:

went to bingo at the local fair, right in the summertime. And

Janice Porter:

some of my friends grandma used to go or something we'd go to

Janice Porter:

bingo and everybody that were real bingo people. They had

Janice Porter:

their 12 boards in front of them, and they had all their

Janice Porter:

different dabbers daubers whatever you call them, and all

Janice Porter:

their trinkets, sir. Good luck charms me. It was like a whole

Janice Porter:

underworld economy for bingo people. Does that make sense?

Janice Porter:

Yeah, every time he has it, and Lego would have its own people,

Janice Porter:

right? So you have people that you build Lego with are people

Janice Porter:

that you compare kits with and things like that?

Janice Porter:

Dr. Keith McNally: Well, I don't. Because of you know, I'm

Janice Porter:

an introvert. Well, let's put things into context. You know,

Janice Porter:

when I talked about hugging 12 miles a day, that's four hours

Janice Porter:

of my day. So I'm up at 230 in the morning. I'm in bed by got

Janice Porter:

it. All right. My time is now spent elsewhere. Unfortunately,

Janice Porter:

I would love to invest. Right,

Janice Porter:

you could see that being a thing, right?

Janice Porter:

Dr. Keith McNally: I could.

Janice Porter:

Personally, I've been trying to build the Lego

Janice Porter:

things with my granddaughter, and it's too hard for me to fit.

Janice Porter:

It's too intricate. And because she's gone from Duplo to Lego

Janice Porter:

now. So now it's like, long as it has wheels. She's happy. So

Janice Porter:

there you go. Anyway, this was so much fun. Thank you. I just

Janice Porter:

had to ask that. Because I find you know, it's just that we have

Janice Porter:

to have fun to write we have to do things that actually that's

Janice Porter:

Dr. Keith McNally: part of the human nature we have to play in

Janice Porter:

adults forget how to do it. But we have to add it back. We

Janice Porter:

do we totally do. I know. And I've started playing

Janice Porter:

these new games on LinkedIn. Have you looked at those?

Janice Porter:

Dr. Keith McNally: No, I don't know anything about games on

Janice Porter:

LinkedIn.

Janice Porter:

It's a whole new thing. It's under the just go to

Janice Porter:

linkedin.com/games. And they'll show up. And once you've started

Janice Porter:

to play with them, then they'll show up on your newsfeed or

Janice Porter:

something and tell you, but I'm a words game person. I love

Janice Porter:

words. And so these are that kind of thing like a mini sort

Janice Porter:

of crossword ladder and things like that. Anyway, I don't know.

Janice Porter:

It's an I'm just exploring it from a LinkedIn trainer

Janice Porter:

perspective, to see if it becomes another tool for

Janice Porter:

building relationships.

Janice Porter:

Yeah, so anyways, it'll open up a conversation. Exactly.

Janice Porter:

So thank you for this conversation. Thank you for

Janice Porter:

sharing your story and your verse, your expertise and your

Janice Porter:

wisdom with us and to my audience. Thank you for being

Janice Porter:

here. If you heard something you were you were pleased about or

Janice Porter:

interested in please look up Dr. Keith. I will put his

Janice Porter:

information in the show notes and and I assume you'll put will

Janice Porter:

give me or podcasts as well, right?

Janice Porter:

Dr. Keith McNally: Most of my stuff. Yeah, most of my sales

Janice Porter:

stuff sits on YouTube. I am on app on iTunes with the ambition

Janice Porter:

speaker series.

Janice Porter:

Perfect. And thanks for being here and

Janice Porter:

remember to stay connected and be remembered

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