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AI is Secretly Deciding Which Websites Succeed Online! - Greg Merrilees
Episode 821st October 2025 • Hustle & Flowchart: Mastering Business & Enjoying the Journey • Hustle & Flowchart
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In this episode of Hustle & Flowchart, host Joe Fier welcomes Greg Merrilees, founder of Studio 1 Design and acclaimed web design strategist, for an insightful conversation on the evolving landscape of websites in the AI era. Greg unpacks how artificial intelligence is transforming traffic, trust, and web conversion, and shares actionable strategies for businesses and personal brands looking to stand out online. The episode dives deep into website optimization, AI-driven search changes, lead magnets, and the non-negotiable human element that helps brands build real trust with audiences. It’s a must-listen for anyone wanting to future-proof their online presence and convert more visitors into loyal customers.

Topics Discussed

  • The Changing Digital Landscape: How AI is shifting who gets discovered online and why traditional web traffic strategies may not be enough.
  • Web Design for the AI Era: What’s really changed with website design and conversion since AI has started influencing user behavior.
  • Brand Positioning & Authority: Why it’s now more important than ever to stand out from competitors and how to find your brand’s unique edge.
  • Interactive Lead Magnets: Moving beyond static PDFs to interactive tools and quizzes to engage and convert warmer web traffic.
  • Strategic Website Copy: How much copy your site needs now, depending on the warmth of your audience and your traffic’s source.
  • The Five Core Web Principles: Greg’s blueprint for high-converting websites—audience understanding, positioning, strategy, psychology, and conversion-focused design.
  • Ongoing Optimization: Why your website’s never truly “done” and how to keep iterating with AI-driven tools and user feedback.
  • Using Tools Like Delphi & Microsoft Clarity: Leveraging new AI and analytics platforms to enhance user experience and trust.
  • Building Emotional Connection: How unique design and humanizing your brand can break through the “sea of sameness” created by AI.
  • Greg’s Vision for the Future: Insights on vibe coding, dynamic websites, and how AI might shape work and life balance.

Resources Mentioned

Connect with Joe Fier

🤖 Chat with Joe's AI Clone: https://aibuildteam.ai/ask-joe/

📰 Newsletter: https://hustleandflowchart.com/subscribe

🎙️ Podcast: https://hustleandflowchart.com/

🔗 LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/joefier/

📸 Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/joefier/

Loved the episode? Be sure to subscribe to Hustle & Flowchart on your favorite podcast app to get inspiring conversations, actionable strategies, and next-level insights delivered straight to your ears every week. Don’t miss our next episode—your online business will thank you for it!

Transcripts

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What if your website isn't broken?

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It's just misunderstood.

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So if AI is now deciding who gets found, which set websites stand

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out, which ones don't, how do you make sure that it chooses you and

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that the design of your website.

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The looks of it, the copy of it, you know, all the trust labels and all these

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different things that you might have on there that it's actually conveying what

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you need it to do with this new flow of traffic that AI is changing for everybody.

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So I brought in my good friend Greg Merrilees, who runs the the best

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web design agency and company for.

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I mean so many years, I think since 2000.

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So he's seen all these things.

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Greg Merrilees is gonna break it all down with the core principles,

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but also the latest and greatest you need to know with this AI influence.

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He has all the answers.

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Let's dive into it.

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Greg.

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We're doing this for, I don't know, what is it, the third, fourth, 20th time.

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It's something like that.

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It's great to have you back, my friend.

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How are you?

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Yeah, really good Joe.

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It's great to be back.

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Yeah.

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I've been, uh, watching your journey and yeah, the whole digital space is,

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uh, evolving so fast, obviously, and yeah, it's, uh, it's good to be back.

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So let's talk about what's changed with website.

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That's the thing.

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So you're my go-to with just brilliance, uh, team, everything,

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website, design, conversion, focus, you know, branded, I mean like

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the Hustle and Flowchart website.

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Always gotta say that was Studio One design the.

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If it's Greg and his team did it all and it's fabulous.

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People still, every single time I sent, I literally, it's almost

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every single time, um, they're like, this site looks incredible.

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Or your branding, like all, and I use it everywhere and I know it needs updates,

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but still I'm just like, that's Greg.

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That's brilliance.

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man.

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Appreciate it.

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Yeah, it's really cool.

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Yeah.

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unique that website.

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Yeah.

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Yeah.

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It sometimes, you know, yeah, there's people like myself, drag,

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drag their feet a little longer, but finally it gets up and you know,

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when the timing's right, it's right.

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But, but no, you guys do absolutely great work.

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And, um, yeah, I feel like this is, this has been kind of like an annual tradition

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as, as you come on, we talk about.

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Best practices for website conversion and, and journey.

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And now, you know, with this, uh, age of AI popping off more than ever,

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it's just only gonna keep going.

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Um, I feel like it's perfect timing, even more so of like, how do we

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navigate that with your expertise?

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'cause you've been in the game for what, 2000 website designs later?

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Yeah, I mean, I've had my business since the year 2000, but we pivoted to websites

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probably around 2012, something like that.

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But even in that time, there's been, you know, massive shift in, in the

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way we approached website design.

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But yeah, more so in the last year.

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Year, year and a half, two years.

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Just mainly because AI search is stealing everybody's website traffic.

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Right.

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So it just means, yeah, the whole game has changed with how you need to

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position yourself in the market and the marketing that you have to do.

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And you don't need as much website traffic.

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If they've already been warmed up on social media, you know, and LinkedIn

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and, and YouTube and whatever, uh, they, that's where you build massive trust.

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With your brand.

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So it used to be get people to your website as soon as possible and then

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build a lot of trust on on your website.

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But now it's like they're pretty warm by the time they come to your website.

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They've done their research beforehand and they've spent a lot of time with

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your brand outside of your website.

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So therefore.

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Back in the day, used to have a lot of copy on your website, you know, and

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we're talking back in the day, two years ago, because you need to do a lot of

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convincing to that cold of traffic.

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But if the traffic's warmer, then you don't need to do as much convincing.

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So I guess it just depends on your traffic source to how much copy you need on your

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website and how many lead magnets and what those lead magnets needs to do, and what

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funnel steps you need or since, since the traffic's majority warm, you just need to.

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Lead them to the next step in the funnel.

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Get a, take a, you know, a sales call or buy something, because they're

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pretty warm most of the time these days.

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I mean, that's a big shift right there.

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And because I was gonna ask you like, what's the biggest shift in your mind

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over the last, let's call it year of, of.

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Web design, what we should be thinking of as a business owner with a front

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facing website or personal brand?

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Is it mainly that, like understanding that search traffic has kind of changed.

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I think that's part of it.

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And I guess an exercise would be, you know, for the listener to do a search for,

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you know, whatever it is that you offer in the certain, you know, geographic region

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or the target market that you serve.

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You know, just put that into a sentence, um, and just see

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what comes up and it'll be.

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Maybe you, maybe your competitors.

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Um, and then really deep dive into, you know, into all of those answers.

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You know, you'll get a little text link in the AI answer, whether that's

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Google or Chatty or whatever, chat to t. Um, and, and so then have a

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look at all of those websites to see, you know, why they're being chosen.

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We'll see.

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Good about them and, but also more importantly, see what's bad about them.

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Where you have a unique angle.

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And I think if you can find your uniqueness and position your brand

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differently from your competitors, then that's a really good way.

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Obviously take what they're doing well, but then find that uniqueness so that

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you can fill a gap for how you want to stand out from your competitors.

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And so to me, that's all about brand positioning and that is probably the

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most important thing in an AI era.

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So that you will be found and remembered and you know, stand out in a unique way.

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I think it's a big, a great practice and you'd be surprised, you know,

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and I'm talking to the audience here, uh, of like, if you look up

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your name or your brand or Yeah.

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What you're selling in a, in an.

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Area or to a certain amount of people, uh, just to see what pops

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up and like what does AI in this new search, uh, know about you?

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Because yeah, it has, has a lot of principles of Google and all the SEO

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stuff, but it definitely, it, it functions differently and it's, it's using sources

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that you might not be thinking about.

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You're like, oh, wow, okay.

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Like, maybe I should update that, or, or reposition this way.

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what it's really looking for is why you are the authority in your niche,

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and you need to share your, your insights to make sure that people,

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you know, understand your point of view on the topic that you deliver.

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And then on top of that, so you need to build your, your business website,

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your personal brand website, and then everything around that needs to reflect.

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With your, what I call your North Star.

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So think about your messaging, what what is unique about you, and that

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needs to be reflected in everything that you do across all of those platforms.

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So it's probably a little bit more work these days, but if you can figure out what

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is unique about you and then be known for that and spread that message everywhere,

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that's the way to stand out in an AI era.

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I couldn't agree enough because it was even right before we hit recording.

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You know, it's, we were talking about with the AI era, it's fast to build things

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like, uh, an MVP or a first version with just like, what a prompt or two, right?

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Like you have all these sites now that, that you could do that.

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Really, if you think about it, then you can code it vibe,

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code it, or whatever it is.

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Yeah, totally.

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But at the same time, it, you see there's a sea of sameness

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that starts to happen, right?

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Like there's not really a lot of uniqueness to, um, I mean, it's, it's when

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you start to develop some of these things and you look at what's created, you're

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like, oh, that looks like that was made in rep, or, or some like, you know, one

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of these vibe coating softwares where.

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The layout just all kind of looks the same, similar kind of icons,

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the font, you're like, Hmm, like I think I know how they did this,

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Exactly.

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I couldn't agree more.

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And we use replicate, cursor, lovable, all those tools for vibe, code in

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lead magnets, essentially a lot of um.

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PDFs are kind of the old way, but what we're doing for clients

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and for us is turning our lead magnets into interactive tools.

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And you can do that really easy with Vibe code and then just put the code

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on your web WordPress website or you know, webflow, whatever it is.

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Um, and so then it becomes, you know, way more like usable for the prospect

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because they get to see an instant result.

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They don't have to download A PDF and, and read through it and all that.

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And you know.

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Fill out a checklist, all that, just give them a tool that they can

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interact with there and then, and that is really easy for vibe coding.

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But yeah, like you said, Joe, if you're going to do a full website

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with Vibe Coding, be prepared for a pretty average result.

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Now I know it's improving all the time, but um, and we're testing it all the time.

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So we designing Figma, we, you know, we design custom websites and then we

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take the Figma file and we import that into one of the vibe coding tools and.

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Even though, you know, it says it can do it, the results are terrible.

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You know, so you still need a developer to be able to tweak the code.

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I mean, you can vibe, code, meaning, you know, you talk to it via voice or

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just chat and tell it what to change and what to, what you want it to do with

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interactivity and all that sort of stuff.

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But it's still never perfect.

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So, but you may get.

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You know, 60, 70% of the way there.

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But because we do custom design and we're very much in a non

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template looking websites, they, they, they're quite unique.

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Right.

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And they're probably a little bit complex for a vibe code to do for now.

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Uh, we still need to develop a, to do the, you know, the last 30, 40% thereabouts,

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but it does save a lot of time for sure.

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But I can't wait for the day.

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Yeah.

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I can't wait for the day where you can just design in Figma, just send it to

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one of those, one of those platforms, uh, get it built and get it live.

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Like that to me is the future that I'm just waiting for.

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I can't wait.

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Oh yeah.

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It's not gonna be long.

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Yeah.

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At

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Yeah.

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But.

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there, there's always, you know, as I think of ai, like I'm, I'm, I'm more

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and more I'm thinking of what are the core principles of what matters most?

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Because if we get away from the principles of doing things, I mean, that's

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literally your book Next level, you know?

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I mean, it's a, it's a, it's all about web design.

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I mean, this thing is, it's beefy and, but this thing has.

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Oh, I mean, what it's, you said on the back of you gonna stop losing sales with a

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website that isn't designed strategically or positioning your brand uniquely.

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And I think that's the key piece that, like the human element I, I is almost

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like more important in this world of AI where things are fastly created

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or just moving so fast that you need that human connection to connect

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emotionally, you know, with the buyer, whoever prospect you're chatting with.

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couldn't agree more.

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And I guess that's, yeah.

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Why I, I wrote the book.

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I mean, there's a lot of website books out there.

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A lot of, uh, just coding books.

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Probably obsolete now.

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But, um, some of them are, you know, conversion focus.

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Um, you know, some of them are copywriting focus.

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Um, and this is kind of using copywriting principles, uh, conversion principles.

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Page structures.

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Um, and then the five key principles, um, you know, to, it's

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really like more of a blueprint.

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It's very comprehensive.

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That's why it's 333 pages thick.

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Um, and yeah, it goes deep.

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It's, it really is a blueprint.

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And then, uh, yeah, it's really those five main principles and it, it is,

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like you said before, and you can use AI for doing some of these things,

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but understanding your audience.

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And so if you really think about.

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Who your ideal audience is, you know, what makes them tick, what

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are their challenges, uh, why they choose you, why they don't choose

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you, why they choose competitors, what their experience was with

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competitors and all that sort of stuff.

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Then when you do that, and you can do that research with ai, like

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using deep research within Chacha, PETI is pretty powerful, right?

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Um.

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Yeah.

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And so, so then it's really, and you know, you may know these things as well.

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Um, it'll deep dive all of your reviews, your testimonies, your case studies,

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your competitors, and it'll help you find that unique point of difference as well.

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And I guess that leads to the second principle, which is brand positioning,

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because you really want to zig where your competitors zag, right?

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Um, if you want to stand out in a meaningful way.

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Um, and so, yeah, that's where.

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Again, uh, that exercise that we talked about before, study your competitors

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and figure out that uniqueness and, and sometimes it's, it's not easy

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to find, but if you do look at your customer testimonials, sometimes the

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gold is hidden in them if you, because you may be too close to your business.

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But if you can read and have AI read all of your testimonials and say, what?

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Is the unique factor that it keeps recurring amongst all of my

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testimonials and, and social proof.

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And that may be your, you know, uniqueness that you want to use as your

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north star and have all your marketing, you know, directed towards that.

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but then yeah, marketing strategy.

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So yeah, sure.

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AI can, uh, can vibe code a website, uh, may look average.

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Sure.

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But it's more than that.

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So think about your audience like.

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Are they cold, warm, or hot when they come to your website?

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You know, most people don't buy immediately.

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If you have a conversion rate other above, you know, 3% on a traffic, uh, a

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cold traffic website, that's pretty good.

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Right?

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But, um, if it's not that good, that's where you need to think

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about different lead magnets.

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That's where we mentioned the interactive ones that.

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Probably work better these days 'cause people get a better result.

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Um, but then think about as well, yeah, like for warm traffic or hot traffic,

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um, you know, you, you wanna make sure you've got a pathway for them as well.

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So there's a lot that goes into the strategy piece.

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And then you test these things over time because your audience changes over time.

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You know, your competitors change over time, so you have to

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constantly test new lead magnets, new funnel steps, new strategies.

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So yeah, I mean, AI can give you one, but.

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To constantly tweak that and change it over time.

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You know, it's kind of like, uh, you need a, a dynamic website essentially.

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Uh, and then, yeah, the psychological influences, and that is where, you know,

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people buy on emotion and then they ju justify with logic, for instance.

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So the copy on your website.

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Does need to reflect, you know, your audience's pain points.

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That's why the first step is to understand your audience on a deep level.

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Um, and then the copy on your website, you wanna say it in as few words as possible.

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And I guess that's the hardest bit, right?

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Because even the best copywriters in the world.

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So if I had more time, I would've written less copy.

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'cause it's hard, right?

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Um.

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And then think about all the other psychological drivers as

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well to showcase your authority.

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Back it up with social proof.

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You want a consistent voice message, branding look and feel, um, and you know,

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a little bit of scarcity in there as well.

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Uh, you wanna move?

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Remove like friction points and leakage points on your website to, you know, just

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keep people engaged and and to convert.

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There's a lot of tricks you can do there, but yeah, and that comes

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into conversion focused design.

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So needs to be strategically designed, needs to appeal to your target audience.

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You need to have the right pathway and sort of all those factors combined,

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uh, will lead into the right design.

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That's obviously mobile responsive loads faster mobile, but has.

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All of the visual hierarchy and you know, the high impact call to actions and the

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right type of wording and everything, you know, set in a way that is going to appeal

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to your target market and be more likely to convert them into leads and sales.

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And see those are the principles right there.

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Yeah.

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And, um, I mean that's, yeah, and, and I'll just list 'em 'cause I just, I just

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pulled 'em up here too, just to remind, you know, that, that list, it's Yeah.

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Understanding the audience or your audience and.

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Yeah.

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Brand positioning, uh, marketing strategy, psychological influences,

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and, um, conversion focused design,

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Yeah, that's right.

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And, and then on top of that, if you think about your

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website's never finished, right?

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So like I said, you've gotta test how, 'cause we don't know.

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Every client whose website we've designed, how their audience is

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going to respond to the new website, even though we use all those best

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practices, every audience is different.

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And like I said, they evolve over time.

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So when I say your website's never finished, which is actually the

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last chapter in the book, um, that's about monitoring your user behavior.

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And this is where conversion optimization comes in.

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And yes, you can use some AI tools.

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Uh, really good tool actually is Microsoft.

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Clarity, which is a hundred percent free.

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And I feel like everybody should have that on their website 'cause uh, you

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know, there are other paid tools, but this is equally as good in my opinion.

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And it will record every video user of your website.

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It'll create heat maps and uh, it even has AI built in to give us.

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Summary of the pages.

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'cause it can be quite time consuming to go over all those heat maps and watch

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videos of every user of your website.

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So this will summarize that user behavior.

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So yeah, it's really important.

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And so then you pair that with your analytics, your, you know, Google

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Analytics, your, uh, data from.

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People using the forms on your website, from your sales data, from all the

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funnel steps, blah, blah, blah.

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You, your email nurture campaign, and then you hypothesize and

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figure out, right, what should we tweak based on all that data?

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And you'll constantly find improvements, uh, you know, month after month.

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And so that's why I say your website's never finished.

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So you take all those principles with best practice and then constantly,

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you know, tweak it over time.

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That's a big, uh, ding, ding, ding for me, like, uh, Microsoft Clarity.

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Actually, I've never used it.

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And because I, I've definitely used some other heat map.

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I think Hotjar, uh, was one.

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Um, but yeah, like this is, it's perfect.

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The fact that it could tie into Google Analytics and a whole

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bunch of other things it looks

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Yeah, Hotjar is the other one.

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Yeah.

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We used for years.

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Yeah.

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And it's fantastic.

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Um, and yeah, it's probably got some extra features.

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Like you can use user polls and things like that on there.

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Um, so Hotjar is great.

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I'm not saying it's not, I'm just saying if you want a free version,

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Microsoft Clarity is pretty good.

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Yeah, it's backed by Microsoft too, so not bad.

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But uh, yeah, that's what I've realized.

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You know, it's like the website, I mean, everything's evolving so fast.

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So user behavior is probably the biggest one I would imagine because of tools like

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chat, GBT, and you know, things going voice forward and being interactive.

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Absolutely.

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Yeah.

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And you know, I think there's many things to tweak on your website, and I think

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the biggest thing is the lead magnets.

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You know, like, um, sure if the traffic coming to your website, um, they,

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they just want confirmation that you are as the real deal, you know, they.

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May be warm on social media, but they still may not a

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hundred percent trust you yet.

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So it's really good to put trust, build in things on your website.

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So that's why Joe, you introduced me to the tool Delphi and um, man, that's

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just a game changer is incredible.

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That maybe I'll just sort of unpack the story, how that came about.

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Yeah.

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Go for it.

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I like it from your perspective.

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Yeah.

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So what actually happened was, um, I, from my book, I uploaded the whole book

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to a custom GPT and created like an interactive author, had some guardrails

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around it and things like that.

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Um, and so Joe was on my email list and, and saw that I was.

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You know, promoting the interactive author and he sent me an email and,

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and a video and just showed me that he could get the, not the content, but the

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rules that I put around the custom GPT.

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Um, and he pretty much said, look, you know, that's great.

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Um, but there are some issues with.

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And people can only have a text chat with it.

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He said, what if I could show you a better way and introduce me to Delphi?

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Now I've been following Joe's podcast for years, so I know it was a couple

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of years ago perhaps, um, that you were one of the first Delphi customers.

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You've got it on your website.

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And I did use it back in the day thinking, wow, that's incredible.

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'cause you've got all of your podcast episodes in there, all that knowledge.

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And, uh, anyway, I just didn't think of that at the point

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when I started, um, you know.

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Uh, the custom GPTI just thought, well, it's easy and, and you know, I've already

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got a paid account, blah, blah, blah.

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Um, but then we jumped on a call, Joe, and you showed me all of the, the

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possibilities and all the extra things you can do with it, and all the training

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material you can upload, you can upload.

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Everything audio, you know, and you can't do that with chat GBT.

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So you can do so much more with the training data and then, you

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know, the way you put guardrails around it is just amazing.

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And so the outcome of that is we've just put it on our website

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as a, we tried it as a popup, uh, sorry, a little chat bubble first.

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That wasn't quite visible.

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And I, I thought, you know, maybe we just, you know, based on your advice,

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it was to put it as an actual page like you do on your website, Joe.

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And, uh.

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That's a game changer.

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So people now coming back to, I think any, everybody should do this.

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They can have not just a text chat with me, but we've uploaded my audio book

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file, you know, into there as well so they can have an audio call with me.

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And I just reckon that's amazing.

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It's just super helpful.

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And this is the, the tool that I believe most websites should have

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on if they wanna build more trust with their brand so that people can.

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Interact with, you know, the, the founder of the business.

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Um, so like I said, they may be warmed up from social media.

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They come to your website, they can have another chat and to see how you can help

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them specifically, like, that's golden.

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You have to be there so your time's leveraged.

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It's just amazing.

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That's it.

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Yeah.

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And you're leaving, no one hanging.

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They're, they have the ability to start an instant chat with AI Greg.

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That is, that is trained on all of just your ip.

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It's not gonna go out and try to make up some different web design

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principles or conversion principles that, you know, may not be right.

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' That's a really good point.

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Yeah, because custom GPT on chat, GPT, that'll use some of the

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knowledge that they have as well.

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And it doesn't always align with, uh, you know, with what I believe.

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So yeah, having the actual, um, yeah.

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Guard rails around it where it only uses the data that you upload to

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it, like in Delphi, that, that's so much better in my opinion.

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Um, and yeah.

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And so we upload all of our.

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Services, our entire website, our blog posts, our um, you

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know, like call recordings.

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Just all sorts of things to help guide it on the way we would talk to

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our clients about our services, but leading with value the whole way.

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this is super cool to hear how your perspective, like from, from

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someone else that you know, you just learned about it just recently,

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but you already had in your mind.

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Alright, a custom GPT is a cool add-on to this book that you just, that,

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that you just released, which, you know, making things, I think like

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what people want now is interactivity.

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You mentioned that with the lead magnet, people want to.

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Personalize whatever they're doing, and also get instant immediate results.

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You know, it's like that's the world we're living in.

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Our attention span is so short, so, you know, books at the end of the day, I have

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a ton of books and I still read books, paper books, um, which I, I think a lot of

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people still do, and nostalgic in a way.

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Uh, but it slows you down, right?

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Like that's when you know you want to go deeper and you're like, oh, okay, I

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really wanna understand about my, well, the first thing I, I turn, turn to offer

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page mistakes that hurt conversions.

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That's pretty big.

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So, but if I wanted to go to Delphi.

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I could plug in.

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Okay.

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Tell me more about offer page mistakes that are hurting conversions, but like,

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here's what my web, like kind of some of the copy from my site, you know, you can

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maybe put some ideas that you might be thinking about and it will now personalize

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the book to, to the, the person in,

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yeah, they can have a conversation with it and really get granular if they want.

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I mean, they can ask it to review their actual website and, you know, their

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copy and, and all that sort of stuff.

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So, yeah, it's, uh, it's pretty powerful.

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But yeah, just thinking about other businesses listening to this, you know,

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it can work for any type of business.

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It doesn't, you know, this is just, uh, you don't need a

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book, you don't need a podcast.

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Like, yeah, there's other ways you can use it, right, Joe?

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That's right.

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Yeah, no, it doesn't take much, uh, content to honestly make it work well,

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and there's a bunch of ways you can load content in there, any kind of, uh,

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text, audio, video, and, but yeah, it's like I've seen just, you know, 10,000

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words all the way up to, I think mine is around 17 million words like it.

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I've seen some up to like 50 million.

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I mean, like, but you don't need that much.

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That's to your point, like you don't need to have all this media.

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It could just be, um, you know, like a consultant.

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There's a lot of consultants that use it to, you know, uh,

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put it on their booking page.

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Whereas the lead magnet, which, you know, like what you have as an agency,

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you're using yours as kind of the core meet lead magnet on your homepage, but

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also on the landing page it seems like.

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And

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We have an individual page for it as well.

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But, um, yeah, it's quite new.

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I mean, we've already got people interacting with it,

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but, uh, it's quite new.

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New, too new to say, you know, here's the results from it.

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But, uh, yeah.

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It's only two days

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back later, but

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Yeah.

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no, I'm, I'm just stoked that you jumped on it because I mean, I, again, I always

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respect you as the go-to web design, but like conversion, just d. Not just design.

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That's the thing.

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It's like I, I never wanna say, okay, Greg's a great designer.

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It's like, hold on.

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No, Greg understands like the human element and how it people interact.

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'cause you get so much feedback as well from obviously

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clients, but also your team.

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I mean, you have like your fingers on the pulse more than anybody else.

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I know.

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Yeah, exactly.

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And the industry changes so fast and yeah, if you don't stay up with all this AI

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change, you'll get left behind for sure.

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But I guess that's a lesson for everybody listening.

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And you know, I know AI can seem scary, but uh, yeah.

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I think these days the more you focus on educating yourself and using these

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tools, the more you won't be left behind and more you'll see the opportunity

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and think about it in a positive light.

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Now, uh, you know, someone, let's say if they're, I dunno, walk me through it.

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I have the perfect scenario.

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I'm just thinking of someone with a website right now that might feel like,

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all right, so what's, what's like a step that I could take that's kind of like.

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A nice actionable step that, that you would typically, when you audit someone's

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website for the first time, you just, maybe if you're naturally going to

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someone's website, maybe this is the way, like what's your first impression?

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Where do you look, Greg, and be like that thing, if that thing changed,

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that would move

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Yeah.

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I'm looking at it through a lens of the way, you know, the way I look

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at every website these days is, uh, you know, we've gotta think about

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it from the audience's perspective.

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If somebody lands on their website, it needs to have clarity, for one needs

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to clearly articulate what you do.

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But yeah, you don't want to confuse people.

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You wanna make sure that they.

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Understand why they should choose you as well.

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They just want, like, most businesses get it wrong, you know, they just talk

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about what they do and why we're so good.

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But realistically, people just want their, you know, three main questions to answer.

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Like what you do, why should they trust you over your competitors and what to

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do next, basically, uh, you know, and then if they do purchase from you,

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like, what if something goes wrong?

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How can they contact you quickly?

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A lot of websites these days, the business owners are very hard

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to, or the business in general, very hard to get in contact with.

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You know, they make it hard to contact.

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So, um, yeah, that's why making it easy is, is super important.

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But yeah.

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And then.

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I would say if, you know, somebody's listened to this and they look at

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their own website, maybe even use this interactive tool, the Delphi

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right on, on studio one design.com/ai and ask it to give you the feedback

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because yeah, I think that's probably a good place to start.

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And that's what I do these days when I'm reviewing clients' websites.

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I use my own tool, you know, um, and

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I, I, might, I might be doing that right now, actually, but just to

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back up your point, but keep going.

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Yeah, sure.

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And it'll break it down into the sections in the book, because the whole book

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is guiding, you know, the ai, so it will, you can even ask it to review,

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you know, competitors and, and try and help you find that uniqueness, how

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you stand out from your competitors.

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But yeah, realistically, um, do you answer those questions?

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Like, do you, are you.

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The trusted authority and can you prove that you get results?

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'cause that's what people want.

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You know, like I said, they're gonna be on all these other platforms like

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Reddit and all these other social media to figure out what other

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people are saying about your brand.

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And when they come to your website, they just want confirmation.

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Um, and they obviously want.

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To make sure that, uh, you know, you have a solution to their unique problem.

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So even down to segmenting, that's probably not a bad strategy.

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So you might have different offers or different audience types.

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So it's good to have an individual landing page for each of those, um, so that

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then you can talk specifically to their.

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Pain points, um, and challenges and shows social proof that's completely relevant

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to that, you know, segment of your market.

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So, yeah, I guess there's a lot to, to unpack on what I would look for on, on,

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you know, reviewing somebody's website.

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I also look at the design quality.

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I think that's important.

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You know, if you think about brand positioning, do you look different?

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From all of your competitors, uh, do you match your price point?

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So if you're a, a high-end brand, does your website look high-end?

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Or if you are a, a low ticket offer, does your website look

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too expensive for that offer?

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And people might get the wrong impression, you know, so the look and feel needs

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to match the price point and obviously.

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I wanna make sure, you know, looking at the, the flow of the design, the visual

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hierarchy, um, that obviously needs to make sense from a conversion perspective.

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And there's a lot of, you know, people try to put too much on a page.

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Um, I guess the homepage is the only page.

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You'll have multiple call to actions.

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Because that is essentially a gateway to get to all of the other pages,

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but all of the other pages really should just have one call to action.

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Um, one thing that AI is finding, like in a, in an AI search

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these days, are your blog posts.

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If they've been, um, you know, positioned.

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Excuse me correctly.

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Um, there's a lot that you can do to a blog post these days.

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Neil Patel has some really good, um, structure for blog posts to help your

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blog post posts get found in an AI search.

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And yeah, so there's a lot that you can do there because if that's the number

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one place that, um, people will find your brand, then you want to use that page as

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the intro, you know, to your business.

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So you want to have a lead magnet.

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We generally have as.

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Sticky lead magnet on one side.

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Uh, we'll have a table of contents on the other side.

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We'll have, um, a little, uh, snippet area above the blog post so

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that AI can get an, uh, a summary of what this blog post is about.

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Um, you wanna put your personality, if you use AI to create blog content, you

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wanna put your personality over the top of it so it doesn't just feel like ai.

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You want to showcase what you think your authority over the

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top of each topic, you know?

Speaker:

So things like that are important.

Speaker:

So I'd look for all those things.

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Yeah, that was that masterclass right there.

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I love it.

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And, um, yeah, I'll, I'll say one thing like back to Delphi, uh, that is,

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that's something you can use for content generation, at least as a first pass.

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I would still always manually do things, but speaks in your

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voice and it has your knowledge.

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So it's like structuring the, the content.

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I mean, I've seen people outline some new books using Delphi or blog posts for sure.

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You know, and,

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That's amazing.

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I haven't thought about that.

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Actually.

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I'll use chat GPT with my book uploaded to that and I use that.

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But yeah, it'd be even

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better to use the Delphi 'cause it's just your content, but

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rearrange into blog posts.

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And, uh, and we'll make this for you, Greg, but basically a, a internal

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version that you and your team can use.

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So if, you know, it doesn't need to be a public version, but it, it would

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know, Hey, this is Greg or Greg's team working on, uh, content or, or

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whatever copy, you know, that's based on what your, your principles are.

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So,

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Wow.

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Okay.

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Fantastic.

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We'll talk later,

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it's so good

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you were.

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Yeah.

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Hey, I, I get ideas, you know, when, when, um, when we're doing cool stuff.

Speaker:

But what, actually, as you were chatting, it was funny.

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I started this right before you started giving me your, your,

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um, basically how you think, you just unpacked that all and it's.

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Yeah,

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My takeaway also is like, it's also very emotional.

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It's like, you know, it's like they're humans.

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We gotta remember humans are the ones that are reaching us online.

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And yeah, AI is helping us get discovered and warm things up, you know, social

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as well, but it's the humans when on, when on the site that need to get the

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feeling that it's actually what's right for them, whatever they're looking for,

Speaker:

and using all the points you just said.

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really fast.

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I want to, I'm gonna share my screen and we can maybe wrap on

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this, but like, I'm gonna call out how my website at aibuildteam.ai.

Speaker:

I think it's a good start, but this basically ripped it open

Speaker:

and said like, you got some work to do, um, in, in a good way.

Speaker:

But, uh, this is, I'm gonna share.

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Here it is.

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Okay.

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Hopefully this comes through.

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Can you see that on your side?

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Got it.

Speaker:

Thank you.

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Cool.

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So all I did is I just copied all the, you know, just the homepage, but I

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mean, I'm just gonna go a little quick.

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I'll make it zoomed in.

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I mean, it says right off like, okay, you have a clarity problem.

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And Greg, that's what you've been saying.

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You know, clar, uh, clarity, it's key.

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So it's, it's defining where it feels like, um, clarity is

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needed and it's given me a fix.

Speaker:

You can see it right there, and I'm gonna review this all in much more detail later.

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Um, it says I have a value problem.

Speaker:

Yeah, so it's benefits are sound big but generic.

Speaker:

Good, good feedback.

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Um,

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yeah, design hierarchy problem, you know, uh, two CTAs creates decision friction.

Speaker:

So it's talking about put one primary CTA, which you also

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mentioned that, uh, trust problem.

Speaker:

So, which is actually literally what I'm working on right now are case

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studies and testimonials, which I

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knew this, but called it out.

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It's so

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true.

Speaker:

Uh, so yeah, having, having some kind of proof elements, CT, a problems,

Speaker:

it's, it's too vague basically.

Speaker:

So match the CTAs to intent, and then it's giving me different CTAs to use

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in different parts of the website.

Speaker:

Mm-hmm.

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awesome.

Speaker:

Got it.

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Yes.

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Got it.

Speaker:

So it's given you a lead magnet idea.

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Freak

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Yep.

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Yeah.

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Positioning.

Speaker:

Yeah.

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We have flow problems, so it's kind of basically saying, Hey, the

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flow should be kind of reworked here, and here's how to do it.

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Um, tell me.

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It just keeps going.

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Yeah.

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Lead magnets.

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There you go.

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Which is true.

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I've been thinking about how do I clone ROI calculator voice.

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Yeah.

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This is awesome.

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Yeah, so that'd be a great interactive tool of to vibe code, the ROI of

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bingo.

Speaker:

And that's, that's, it's funny, I've been mapping out an audit that is an ROI,

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but also shows like what can be done.

Speaker:

But I think the clone ROI calculator is actually even better.

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So I, I

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know what I'm vibe code this weekend.

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Uh,

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Excellent.

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That'll

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but yeah,

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What's

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next?

Speaker:

probably That's right.

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Okay.

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Yeah, it's giving me copy edits that can boost conversions just right up here.

Speaker:

I mean, this is literally, I just copied and pasted the copy

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um, and just.

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So, so I'm showing everybody, um, and maybe, we'll, we'll put some of these

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visuals as Greg, you were talking about it, but like, this is what we're

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talking about, like get instant AI help you have it bop bop right there.

Speaker:

And then when you go over here, actually I have it.

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Oh, there we go.

Speaker:

Um, and it's going to be embedded right here.

Speaker:

So this is the lead magnet for you.

Speaker:

Um, people

Speaker:

exactly.

Speaker:

And your team, I, I said to your team, uh, you know.

Speaker:

Well, the goal of this is really get to people to, to get a free video audit

Speaker:

of their website conversions, right?

Speaker:

So I put that on the page, the form.

Speaker:

Uh, and so now the, the Delphi, if you ask the questions, it'll be helpful,

Speaker:

but it, they'll then it'll try to lead you to filling out that form to get

Speaker:

a free, uh, you know, video audit.

Speaker:

that's why.

Speaker:

Yeah, I didn't show that, but actually down here, as I scroll down, check it

Speaker:

out like this is that same thread that would also be, um, I'm just not on the

Speaker:

embedded version, but you can see Yeah.

Speaker:

At the very end it says, boom.

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Hey, do you wanna, here's your call to action right there.

Speaker:

Yeah, well that's the bundle, but underneath that, the last line, free

Speaker:

specific, uh, for, sorry, that bit there.

Speaker:

Yeah.

Speaker:

Yeah.

Speaker:

Get a free website conversion audit.

Speaker:

So that's the main last call to action someone would read, and that's on the

Speaker:

page, so they'll see it straight away.

Speaker:

Yeah.

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So if I go back over here, um, there it is.

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Yeah.

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there you go.

Speaker:

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Speaker:

So, yeah, I think, um, you know, like it's a really good

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opportunity as a lead magnet.

Speaker:

Now, there are different ways, Joe, I remember you saying you can

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ask people to opt in for this, um, to interact, but I just want to.

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I don't wanna put that barrier in front.

Speaker:

So we're testing it without the opt-in because we're gonna have

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the opt-in on the page anyway for the next step as the lead magnet.

Speaker:

We just want to, you know, uh, provide as much value with Delphi first.

Speaker:

Yeah.

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No, it's, it's a great experience.

Speaker:

Yeah, you can do the call feature here, so I like it.

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It's clean.

Speaker:

So good

Speaker:

Yeah, exactly.

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And it's good having it embedded on my website.

Speaker:

It's not like people go to delphi.com/, you know, Greg Meles, whatever.

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They can interact right there on Studio one within our, you

Speaker:

know, website, which is cool.

Speaker:

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

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Well, Greg, this is, this is awesome.

Speaker:

I, I'd say, what do you, I don't know.

Speaker:

What, what are you most excited about?

Speaker:

Like, as, as time goes on and, you know, it could be website, I just

Speaker:

feel like in the next like year or so, we're gonna have some massive changes.

Speaker:

So is there anything that you are personally looking forward to, maybe,

Speaker:

uh, both business and personal, that, that, uh, you wanna toss out there?

Speaker:

from a business perspective, I am looking forward to vibe coding,

Speaker:

getting even better, because I've always wanted to be a design business,

Speaker:

not a dev business, you know?

Speaker:

But we've got, you know, probably.

Speaker:

Eight designers, eight developers, and it's expensive to do dev, you know, and

Speaker:

it's a headache and it takes forever.

Speaker:

So if Vibe coding can reduce the time for our developers, then we'll keep all

Speaker:

the developers, but we'll just be able to deliver websites much faster and then I

Speaker:

can make them dynamic where we can just constantly test new ideas from conversion

Speaker:

optimization for clients where, you know.

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See how we put an, implement an, uh, implement a new idea, get it live, and

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then just constantly tweak it and revise it and, and get that live a week later.

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Like imagine a website that's dynamic based on results.

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Like, that's what I'm super excited about.

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It's just around the corner.

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I'm imagining that's gonna open up a lot more time for you and your team on the

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Yeah, exactly.

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Exactly.

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Then we just get back to being design business and the vibe

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coding just happens so much easier for our developers, you know?

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So there's still a lot that the developers will need to do with connecting to

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all of the third party services and hosting and email, that sort of stuff.

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But yeah, I feel like that's gonna be a game changer.

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Uh, and then apart from that, yeah, personally, I mean, I love.

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Snow skiing.

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That's, that's my thing.

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My whole family loves it.

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And, um, yeah, so we just, we're going to Japan in a, in a car

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three months, um, which is our, uh, our summer, your, your winter.

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But, uh, yeah.

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Reverse.

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Yeah, yeah, yeah.

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And so we're just trying to do more of that.

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Um, and yeah, just, you know, thinking about the, how AI may affect everything,

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we're starting to look at our life and think, well, you know, getting older.

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So it is time to simplify.

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And if AI does cause unemployment, which, you know, who knows, right?

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But

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Shifts, at least the shifting of roles.

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Yeah.

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Yeah, exactly.

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Yeah.

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But how's that going to affect property prices and things like that?

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You know, and I dunno, we're just starting to think, well, we have a

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lot of knowledge on AI and how it could potentially affect things.

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So we're thinking about, you know, downsizing and, and restructuring and

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spending more time doing what we love, traveling more, um, and just, yeah,

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eliminating debt, things like that.

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that's, uh, all good goals.

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Yeah.

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I'm in similar conversations in my house here too.

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It's like,

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Yeah.

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There you

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how do you, how do you just for, it's hard to forecast even a couple years out,

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but it's.

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it?

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Yeah.

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But most of the population doesn't even know what we know.

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And, and the stuff we're talking about in this podcast or just in tech in

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general, it's, it's rap and most, most of the general public has no clue.

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Which is still,

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exactly.

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about it.

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Yeah, totally.

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Yeah.

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So we just need to, you know, we've got this knowledge.

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Let's, I don't want it to be, I don't wanna be saying, ah, I

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wish we had done this or that.

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It's too late now, you know, so, yeah.

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Yeah.

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I love your vision of, uh, yeah.

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Vibe, coding, being this thing that can make you and your team be even more

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rock stars on the design side of things, which has always been your DNA all the

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way from what t-shirts back in the day.

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Right.

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That's true.

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Yeah,

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I remember.

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So, yeah.

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Oh, it's exciting, man.

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So Greg, I appreciate you.

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You're awesome.

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Um,

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Joe.

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Great

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thank you.

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Yeah.

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Get, get Greg's new book.

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Where can they find this and, and

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Yeah, just go to Amazon.

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Oh, there's a website Next level, website design.com, and yeah, and then you

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can buy the book on Amazon from there.

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Yeah.

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Cool.

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Next level website design.com.

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And then Studio One Design is your agency, design agency.

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You can play around with both and uh, yeah.

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Cool, man.

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Well, we'll do this again maybe in a year, maybe less.

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We'll

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Yep.

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You bet, mate.

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Thank you

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so much.

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