What if productivity could feel less like a grind and more like joy? In today’s episode of Deeply Rested, host Maegan Megginson sits down with Uriah Guilford, a licensed therapist, group practice owner, and author of Productive Practice, to explore the complicated relationship between productivity and well-being.

Maegan opens up about her love-hate relationship with productivity—how societal pressures often tie self-worth to output—while recognizing its importance as a business owner.

Uriah, who runs Productive Therapist, a virtual assistant company for therapists, offers a refreshing take on productivity, showing how it can be fun, joyful, and aligned with personal values.

Together, Maegan and Uriah challenge the traditional “hustle” mindset and offer personalized strategies that are particularly helpful for neurodivergent individuals. Tune in to hear Uriah and Maegan redefine productivity in a way that emphasizes human connection and personal fulfillment over grinding away for metrics. Uriah shares practical tips on delegation, slow growth, and staying true to what matters most.

Here’s what you’ll hear:

Uriah’s fresh approach to productivity (00:08)

Techniques to combine productivity and joy (02:27)

Defining personal productivity (12:11)

Shifting goals and thinking critically about productivity (20:49)

Why authenticity in business communication matters (30:28)

The importance of slow growth in business (36:14)

The importance of rest and community (44:17)

Also, be sure to check out Uriah's book recommendations including:

* Ali Abdaal's Feel-Good Productivity: How to Do More of What Matters to You

* Uriah Gilford's The Productive Practice: Grow your therapy practice, get more done and have more fun!

* John Fitch and Max Frenzel's Time Off: A Practical Guide to Building Your Rest Ethic and Finding Success Without the Stress

*Cal Newport's Slow Productivity: The Lost Art of Accomplishment Without Burnout

Join us to discover how you can reshape your productivity mindset and embrace a more fulfilling, balanced approach to work and life.

For a full transcript of the episode and much more, check out the blog post on our website! To watch a video version of this, check it out on YouTube: https://youtu.be/l9oL-E6lCzA

Connect with Uriah

Check out Uriah’s personal blog at Hey Uriah: https://heyuriah.com/

Download Uriah’s Magic Call Script, a script with the exact words to say to turn more callers into clients.

https://productivetherapist.com/magic/

Mentioned in this episode:

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[00:00:19] Uriah is a technology nerd, a minimalist travel packer, and a rock drummer. I invited Uriah onto the podcast specifically to talk to me about productivity. To be clear, I hate productivity. I hate the word, I hate the concept, most conversations about productivity drive me absolutely mad. And yet, I'm also a business owner, and to have a successful business, you do, in fact, have to be productive sometimes.

[00:01:14] And on the other side of this interview. I've got to say, I do feel differently about productivity. I'll save the rest for your listening pleasure. I really hope you enjoy this juicy conversation about productivity with Uriah Guilford.

[00:02:22] Uriah: Hey Maegan, thanks for having me.

[00:02:42] So I just want to check in, and is it okay if I call you a productivity expert in this conversation today?

[00:02:53] Maegan: You will accept the title. Okay, great. What, and we're going to get into like, what, what makes you a quote productivity expert, but that's how I think about you in my mind, and it's important because I need to come clean with you about something.

[00:03:10] Maegan: I invited you on this podcast for purely selfish reasons today, purely selfish.

[00:03:19] Uriah: Free consulting.

[00:03:40] And during that time I have developed what I'm going to call just like a very strong aversion to the word, the idea, the concept of productivity. I feel like, most of the time, conversations about productivity are really just thinly veiled manipulations to keep me trapped in the matrix of exploitative capitalism, and I'm over it.

[00:04:30] I need to support my family. I want to do good work in the world. And I know that that does require a certain level of producing, of being productive. But I'm having a really hard time justifying these two experiences in my own mind and body. So, today, Uriah, productivity expert, I am laying my dilemma at your feet, and I am asking for your help making sense of how I can develop a healthier relationship with the concept of productivity.

[00:05:06] Maegan: Yes.

[00:05:11] Maegan: yeah, I think…

[00:05:13] Maegan: Deeply Rested Meets Productive Therapist. Okay, that excellent title for this episode.

[00:05:23] And this is especially pertinent for ambitious, goal driven people who have that in their mind that they want to do something big. They have a vision, they have a mission of some sort, they want to accomplish things in their life and in their business. Other folks don't worry about productivity or think about it, right?

[00:05:59] Like you're asking good questions and you're, you're challenging concepts that are not positive in our culture. Because productivity isn't just a word, right? It's a cultural obsession in America specifically. And that goes way back into history. I've read a couple of different books on this, of course, as the productivity expert. It goes way back to the early, early days of our country.

[00:06:40] Uriah: The only time that you spend productively doing things is the time that's spent well. But it's actually not true. So we can challenge that together.

[00:07:09] That's still with us. Isn't that wild? It's deep. It's in our DNA; it's in our bones. And it just shows up in different ways today, here in 2024. Tell me a little bit about what you think the benefits are of productivity. You know, how do you think about productivity in a way that feels healthy and inspiring instead of overwhelming and deflating?

[00:07:53] In fact, I, of course, use that word in my business name. So I love productivity. I love getting things done, but also my context is I'm self employed and I've been self employed for 15 years. So I am the one that writes my to do list. I create my projects, and I create my goals, and my quarterly goals and those kinds of things.

[00:08:39] Versus a business owner who is sitting down and doing strategic planning and deciding what do I want to accomplish this month. Very different felt sense of productivity, right?

[00:09:09] They become their own worst boss...

[00:09:11] Maegan: But that is part of why we say yes to this strange life of entrepreneurship, because we do want to be in control. So say more about defining productivity. You define what a productive day looks like.

[00:09:31] Maegan: Oh, I love confessions. Yes. I won't tell anybody.

[00:09:37] Maegan: No, no, I didn't say nobody will hear it. I said I won't tell anybody.

[00:09:54] I was legitimately a terrible employee. In fact, I got fired twice for just not doing my job. Right. I know, I know it's, it's very shameful. Those were good learning experiences for me. I would, I wouldn't say that I completely snapped to and changed my life by any means. But it took me starting my own business and creating something that I cared about enough to work hard.

[00:10:32] Maegan: Yeah, I love that. I think most business owners are terrible employees, like, were terrible employees... And I think so, yeah, because we fucking hated it, right? Like, we hated being employees, which is why we were like, I can't have a boss, I'm not made for it. I would say most people I know who, or maybe it's just the people I know, but most people I know who are business owners, were terrible employees.

[00:10:56] Maegan: Oh my god, you're so not alone. It's why we do what we do. So I love that. You were a terrible employee. You got fired from these jobs, but there was a bit of a reckoning. At some point in your life where you were like, I've got to get my shit together. I have two kids. I got this family I've got to provide for, maybe I'll step into doing my own thing.

[00:11:17] Uriah: Well, my first thing was starting my private solo practice. My therapy practice. Yeah. Back in 2008, that was my first actual leap into business ownership. And it was never the plan for me. I'm not that kid that was like, or that person that said, you know, when I was five years old, I was, I was an entrepreneur. Not really.

[00:11:54] Uriah: and my time, so that I can do amazing work and be that I'm proud of.

[00:12:05] Uriah: It's not just checking boxes for checking boxes. It's actually thinking about, what matters to me and what's... I don't think a lot about legacy to be honest with you, but like, I think about what can I create that I'm actually really proud of and that I want to show to people.

[00:12:28] Maegan: I love that, right? It's, you're really personalizing what it is you want to accomplish in your business. And we could probably break that into categories. What do you want to accomplish financially? What do you want to accomplish with your audience, with your clients? What do you want to accomplish with your team?

[00:12:56] Uriah: Definitely. Yeah. I'm an intensely practical person, too, because I love talking about concepts and philosophies and ideas. That's fun, but I always like to think, okay, well, what do I do next? What do I do now? Right. I'm very strategic and practical in that sense.

[00:13:30] Now let's see, you know, get this person, call them in over here. You're good at seeing how the entire engine room operates. Does that feel true to you?

[00:13:50] Maegan: Yes. Yeah.

[00:13:52] Maegan: In some ways productivity... We're heading in an interesting direction here that I didn't anticipate we were going to go today, but I'm going to take us there, and you can steer us away from this direction if you need to. But there's a way in which I'm listening to you and I'm like, this is a very masculine way of understanding the world.

[00:14:35] I'm going to, you didn't use that word, but you're going to just conquer, you know? You're to do the things on the list and, and that feels productive. So, you're talking about that and I'm like, okay. I hear you. Logically, that makes sense to me. It's just so different from how I, as a woman, experience the world and experience the ways in which the world and people kind of put things on me.

[00:15:18] Uriah: Definitely.

[00:15:22] Uriah: That's really great. It's honestly not something that I've thought very deeply about, but as you're talking about it, it makes a lot of sense, and I hope I'm not coming across as a cold masculine tactician, or something like that, but... Because I do love.... I love connecting with people and I have a team that I work with, and it's wonderful.

[00:15:53] Some of these you probably already read or seen or heard of. but the first one, of course, I'm going to tell you about my book, which is The Productive Practice. Yes. And, the subtitle of this is Grow Your Therapy practice, Get More Done, and Have More Fun. So...

[00:16:11] Uriah: It’s been out a year.

[00:16:14] Maegan: Congratulations.

[00:16:30] We're just different in so many different ways. And this is especially true for, you know, the example that comes to mind is neurodivergent folks, right? So the productivity hacks or tricks for somebody who has ADHD, for example, is just going to be different than somebody who is not. So personalized productivity is figuring out how to manage your time, your email, your calendar, your projects, in a way that works uniquely well for you.

[00:17:11] Maegan: hmm. That feels like a really good place to start in the, you know, how am I reorganizing my personal relationship with productivity? We'll come back in a minute to some of the larger societal pressures that bear down on us, but I really appreciate the clarity with which you are offering this advice,

[00:17:48] It is a reality. If you want to have a successful business, you have to do things. I haven't found a way around it. If I do, I'll be really rich, I'm sure.

[00:17:59] Maegan: But we have to get things done so you can have more fun. So there's also like a built-in, personalized reward system, too.

[00:18:23] Uriah: Right.

[00:18:26] Uriah: A hundred percent. 100%. And I think for me, to be honest with you, like I do feel good when I get things done, and when I check boxes and when I, you know, create a plan and accomplish the plan, that's, that's amazing for me. But when I look at my personal mission statement, it's actually more about

[00:18:58] And yes, I do love to make money as well. So that's, that's important to say.

[00:19:23] And yes, there are tangible things that we produce: products, you know, pieces of art, websites, these things that we make. And then there are services that we produce, too, right? That’s where my productivity is: how many clients do I see? How many people do I serve? But you're shining a light on something I hadn't thought about that really resonates, which is what is the internal motivator for me

[00:20:10] Am I getting that right?

[00:20:13] Maegan: That, yeah, and that becomes part of what it means for you to be productive.

[00:20:38] And that's true.

[00:20:51] They're just very different.

[00:21:03] Uriah: So I actually looked at my goals from last year when I was setting my annual goals for this year, and I completely changed the way I did it.

[00:21:31] Yeah, I've already won!

[00:21:50] Maegan: That's right.

[00:21:53] Maegan: hmm. Mm. This idea that you get to define your own goals. That's really important, right? Because productivity, if we're thinking about what it means to be productive, what it means to produce, it's really helpful to have some kind of structure, some kind of scaffolding around what it is I'm trying to do, why I'm trying to do it, so that I can know:

[00:22:34] Our whole conversation is making a lot of sense through the lens of the Enneagram.

[00:22:38] Maegan: So I'm appreciating that. But yeah, I, I think about this idea that I need to have something to measure myself against, to measure my business against, to know am I moving in the right direction?

[00:23:23] You don't have to worry about your health at all. It's a joke. You don't know. You don't know what's going to happen over the next 12 months. And I just, in my work with business owners, it just felt like. 9. 9 times out of 10, the achievement goals that people would create for themselves long term almost always ended in some type of disappointment, frustration, feeling not good enough.

[00:24:04] Like what if I change the metric of what it means to be productive, and give it more of a feeling element. Yes, I want to grow my email list, but instead of saying, I want to grow my email list by 10, 000 people, what if I just say I want to have fun growing my email list? And then you get to play, you get to be in this playful, flexible space.

[00:24:38] Uriah: It has been growing. Not as much as I want it to, but it's been growing. And, I think the more pressure or expectation we put on ourselves for anything, the more we set ourselves up for some sort of disappointment.

[00:24:49] Uriah: Expectations are kind of, kind of dangerous in that sense. I think one of my favorite things that I do every week is writing my email to my newsletter list, and I enjoy mixing it up and putting different kinds of content in there, and I, enjoy putting photos and videos and various different things, and I've actually really been working on my writing to make it more clear and more... Put more of my personality into it.

[00:25:29] It kind of ties into the next book I wanted to recommend to you, which you might've heard of. It's called Feel Good Productivity by Ali Abdaal.

[00:25:38] Uriah: You do?

[00:25:47] Uriah: The subtitle is How to Do More of What Matters to You. So you don't need to read this book. And in fact, I wouldn't recommend you do it because you already hate it. So why? Don't do it.

[00:26:00] Yes.

[00:26:21] When you get into a state of flow, you've heard of this before... You are actually more productive, but not because you're trying to be intense or trying to be super focused.

[00:26:35] I just love that concept and I think it applies in so many ways.

[00:26:43] Uriah: Look at you, Eight.

[00:26:45] Uriah: Coming at me.

[00:26:59] That there are so many messages out there that are trying to manipulate me, and women in particular, right? Are trying to manipulate us into being more productive for somebody else's sake, right? Who is going to benefit from my productivity? Is it my spouse, my kids, my family, my friends, my parents, right?

[00:27:44] So what I want to read that book and discover is like, okay, is this person having a more nuanced conversation about productivity? Is it really about coming into myself and deconditioning from the oppressive systems that have trained me to live my life in service of other people? That's a conversation I'm really interested in.

[00:28:24] Thank you so much. Take a break. Right.

[00:28:42] Maegan: Well, and this is where you're adding something to this conversation, Uriah, that I think is really valuable. And it's, it's the, why am I doing this? And Am I doing this? You haven't said it exactly like this, but the way it's landing for me, it's like, am I doing this for a good enough reason? You know? And you were like, okay, selling 2, 500 books?

[00:29:22] It's about being in the flow of the process and engaging with people in a more authentic, relational manner. So if we can just go back for a second to the example of your email list, growing your email list. I look at your emails and I've noticed... I opened an email from you a while ago where you were like, Hey, I started writing a blog just for fun. And I went to it and I thought it was so cute. I loved it. I was like, Oh, Oh, here's Uriah. You know, it's like that feeling of like, Oh, wait a minute. Now I'm getting to meet the person behind the business. Now I'm meeting... I'm engaging with the person behind this newsletter, and I start having a more human experience with your business, which draws me in.

[00:30:23] Our revenue grows more slowly, our sales grow more slowly, because this relational way of being is a slower, more organically paced way of doing business, way of being in the world.

[00:30:56] Uriah: Yeah. Thanks for saying that. And thanks for bringing up that email. That was a, that was one that I was like, I wrote this and I sent it. It didn't have any sort of business value. I wasn't obviously pitching anything or putting anything in front of people. But it was just something that I wanted to send, and people did like it.

[00:31:35] Maegan: We're over it.

[00:31:44] And I think when you and I both do these kinds of things, people go, Oh, That's different. I like that versus some other other things that they're seeing in their inbox, and there's just so many... There's so much noise out there that I think if we can be more ourselves and show up. And like I said before, bring our highest contribution to people.

[00:32:08] Maegan: That's right. Hey, Uriah. com. So great. Yeah, and it's interesting to me, going back a couple steps, that, that you defaulted to saying that email had no business value.

[00:32:36] Where we're like, if I'm not selling something, if I'm not providing value, then this has no value, right? If I'm not producing something that is business focused. It has no value and I think part of the deconditioning process is us, collectively, stepping away from that and going, Wait.

[00:33:23] Uriah: I appreciate that perspective. Yeah. I'm going to think about that differently.

[00:33:28] Uriah: Because yes, if my goal is, is creating more sales, then maybe that wasn't the most effective email, but if my goal is connecting with people and helping them understand who I am and the value that I bring, maybe that was the most important email.

[00:34:02] Right? It in so many ways. Yeah, it feels like we're decolonizing what it means to operate a business, and we aren't treating people like little walking credit cards, you know, we're treating them like people and that has a different feel to it. It lands differently in my body when I sense your honesty and your relatability.

[00:34:35] We know the difference. We get it.

[00:34:55] Maegan: Yeah.okay. I have one more question about... I'm just fascinated by the way you totally changed your goal setting system.

[00:35:10] Uriah: Of course.

[00:35:52] Uriah: I think the answer would be no. Nothing has changed dramatically, for the worse, or for the better, although I think things are trending up if I can be optimistic about that. And I'm feeling really positive about the things that I'm working on, and I've been intentionally working on less things and trying to do them better.

[00:36:16] Uriah: Yes, we, we talked about this before we hit record, but I'm essentially,minimizing from two businesses down to one. And that's been a challenging process, but it's also been a wonderful process. And, the book that I would most recommend that you check out is called Slow Productivity.

[00:36:34] Uriah: You've heard of this.

[00:36:47] But, um, I like it. I'm here for it.

[00:36:58] Maegan: I do wish that all of these books had... yeah... oh, that's a great idea. I often, when I'm reading these nonfiction books, I will be like, man, I wish there was like a two chapter summary at the end. That's like, hey, if you want to skip the fluff in the stories and just get the meat, here you go. I'd pay 25 for that.

[00:37:16] Anyways...

[00:37:18] It does exist.

[00:37:20] Uriah: It's called Blinkist. That's one of them.

[00:37:23] Uriah: And also if you...

[00:37:25] Uriah: That's all, that's all the service does. Yeah. They have an audio summary and then like a PDF summary. But if it's, if it's not like a brand new book, you can definitely go to Chat GPT or other AI models and say, give me a summary of Profit First by Mike Michalowicz, and it will spit it out in two seconds.

[00:37:45] Maegan: Yeah, this is one I can get behind.

[00:37:50] Maegan: Thank you. Thank you so much. Okay, Blinkist. Go to Chat GPT. Yeah, duh. Go to ChatGPT.

[00:38:00] Uriah: Yeah, so he has three steps, and these are the things that have stuck to me... And step number one is work on fewer projects, just like I mentioned. Number two work at a natural pace which I think is aligned with you know, deeply rested sort of work. And then number three is obsess over quality, and so on my desk, I have written obsess over quality.

[00:38:36] Maegan: Uriah, I'm curious, have you in your life struggled with perfectionism at all?

[00:38:44] Maegan: So I'm definitely a perfectionist. I would say recovering perfectionist, but is that really true? I don't know. I'm curious if there's a line between obsessing over quality and falling into a perfectionist pit. Yes.

[00:39:03] Maegan: Mm hmm.

[00:39:17] is good enough. Those, those types of things, but it depends on the project. It depends on the task, right? So like when I'm working on a page on my website, I just recently revamped the blog page on my site. Nobody cares about my blog page, but I decided I'm going to make it the best it can absolutely possibly be.

[00:39:51] But if it's something that really matters, like for my book, for example, like I definitely spent a lot of time on that and made it as good as it could possibly be, but I still gave myself a timeframe and said, like, I'm going to do this in three months.

[00:40:22] And he talks a lot about limits and deadlines. And because if you don't have them, you might swim forever in the obsession with quality.I like what you're saying about Slow Productivity and the invitation to do less, you know, focus on fewer projects, less but better, which actually I think is a, quote from Deep Work, I think, less but better. And to, to bring a focus of quality versus quantity, right?

[00:41:11] what projects are really worth giving our attention to. And this is where I feel like you are offering a more nuanced conversation about productivity. Because when I think about productivity in the big picture, it often is, Hey Maegan, in order to have a successful business, you need to do all of these 1000 things remarkably well, and you need to do it in the next six months.

[00:41:52] So if we just take a breath and one big step away from that, and instead we say, okay, hold on a second. How do I want to feel in my business? I want to have fun. I want to feel joy. I want to be full of the creative flow. Want to be full of creative flow. Then we start to think about what projects we're working on. Growing the email list, right?

[00:42:38] It feels more organic. It feels less externally imposed. And we have more room to breathe, more room to breathe as people, and more room to breathe as business owners. And what I want to say is that I'm really glad to hear things have stabilized for you as you're making these shifts. When I first started making these shifts, everything backslid for a while.

[00:43:23] My revenue went down, my email list started to shrink because I wasn't doing much to bring people in, and unsubscribes are natural.So things started moving backwards, and if I would have freaked out at that point, if I, and trust me, there were many moments when I was indeed deep in the freakout. So how about this?

[00:44:08] And then like you so beautifully said, we start to notice the trajectory trends positive, right? We're like, Oh, okay. I think things are moving in the right direction. Now I have to trust that if I stay aligned with my values, if I keep moving slowly, everything's going to be okay.

[00:44:47] It has made me feel less successful, but that's actually not true. So I've had to challenge that thinking, that just because I decided to give something up or change something, that doesn't mean I'm less successful or less valuable. It just means that I'm choosing to put my focus in a different area. And then the thing that I focus on now will grow because I have more to give to it.

[00:45:10] Maegan: Thanks for your honesty about that. Uh, I feel like we have to normalize that, you know, someone said to me once: the colonized capitalist road is like... people choose that path. They go down that road because it works. Right? It works. It, like, that, that's... our entire world, our entire economy is built on exploiting our bodies, and exploiting each other, for a higher profit margin.

[00:46:05] And then we do have to rub up against... We have to rub up against a values based business, a values based way of engaging with productivity, like you are offering us, with the way the 1 percent are doing it. And it's uncomfortable. So to be on the deeply rested path, you must be willing to feel discomfort.

[00:46:41] Uriah: Definitely. We need that. Yeah, because also, I was really anxious recently about something that wasn't going well. And I had to kind of step back and zoom out on things. And then I told myself, none of this matters. Like if you don't reach this goal, like if your business closes, it doesn't really matter.

[00:47:13] And I'm proud that I have a really good relationship with my kids. And I'm proud that I've paid off my student loan, you know? Like those things bring a lot more value to me than any numbers that I could put on my business success. So at the end of the day, you’ve got to realize what really matters, and living a life where you feel like you've created a meaningful purpose for yourself...

[00:47:37] Maegan: It comes back to step one of the process you lay out in your book, which is you have to make productivity personal, and you have to really think about, what do I want for my life, and what do I want my business to feel like for me? I often think about, like, my business is here to serve me

[00:48:19] that I want for myself. And I really appreciate you saying about your family. And we'll save this for another conversation, but I think there's a whole other exploration to have around that how we think about productivity at home versus how we think about it in our business and how we share

[00:48:46] Uriah: She does not.

[00:48:50] Uriah: She works full time, but not for someone else.

[00:49:00] And he helps with the finances of the businesses as well. He and I have to have really hard conversations sometimes about okay, how do we share this load? We'll save that conversation for another time. But I just, I think what I want to say here is that you can't isolate productivity to the confines of your

[00:49:45] And how am I choosing to engage with all of them in a balanced, hopefully, and aligned way? You know what I mean?

[00:49:56] Maegan: Yeah. Yeah. Like you can't just have a conversation about how to be more productive in your business without looking at the rest of your life.

[00:50:06] Maegan: Totally. Yeah. I mean, it's part of the beauty.

[00:50:16] No. You don't… if we know each other and we are really friends, I'll tell you all the bad things that are going on in my life and the things that I have no clue what I'm doing about.

[00:50:43] I'm running my race and I'm happy with myself. So.

[00:51:01] Uriah: It definitely can be true. Yeah.

[00:51:25] Comparing ourselves to what other people are doing online. Yeah. So your honesty, and your authenticity in this conversation, Uriah, are so incredibly powerful and I'm so grateful to you for everything you're sharing. I'm also aware that I think you've only shared three books so far, but you said you had four.

[00:51:47] Uriah: I think I've already told you about this one, but it might've been back in 2020. It's a book called Time Off. The subtitle of this book is A Practical Guide to Building Your Rest Ethic and Finding Success Without the Stress. This book is so cool because it goes through, It tells stories of people from way back in history up to the current time and talks about how they prioritize rest and this concept of noble leisure to actually accomplish more in their life when it looks like they're actually doing, not doing very much at all.

[00:52:17] Maegan: I have never heard that book. Okay, that...

[00:52:23] Maegan: Yes. Okay, that book actually makes me excited. The other book I know I need to read for shadow work purposes, you know what I mean? But this book, I'm into it. Sign me up. I don't even need chat GPT to summarize it.

[00:52:34] Uriah: This one was made for you. Yes.

[00:52:39] Uriah: I'm going to send it to you. It is actually John Fitch and Max Frenzel.

[00:52:57] Uriah: Well, since we talked about it, maybe people can go to my personal blog at heyuriah. com, which actually does link to my businesses. So if you want to know more about me and all the interesting things, go there.

[00:53:13] might want to check out?

[00:53:32] And, you can find that at productive therapist.com/magic. Because it's fun.

[00:53:48] Uriah: Oh, sure.

[00:54:06] We have some amazing short courses, and then we also have a team of us based virtual assistants who will be your customer service slash sales reps for you so that you can focus on other cool things. Honestly, we didn't talk about this. This is maybe a part two, but like in my book, I talk about how delegation is the key to productivity because the way to be more productive is actually not to do more, it's to do less and to get help with the things that you need to get done.

[00:54:38] Maegan: I want to give a personal shout out to Productive Therapist. I worked with Uriah and his team of virtual assistants years ago in my group practice, and it was such a game changer, and you, I don't, I've never told you this, Uriah, but you helped me realize what I know now is the obvious truth, which is that, I was in sales as a group practice owner. You were like, yeah, you're in sales. And I was like, what?

[00:55:25] And I've learned a lot from you, so I'm grateful for the work that you're doing. And if that is at all intriguing to you, listener, definitely check out Uriah's website, download his freebie, we'll put all the links in the show notes. Uriah, thank you so much for coming on the Deeply Rested podcast.