This week, Kristin chats with her old friend (with a new mission), Rachel Kinley. Rachel has seen a lot of change in her life with a cross-country move, a series of jobs, time spent being a stay-at-home mom and divorce being just a few major life events.

But it was finding new meaning in a career that she wasn’t even sure she wanted in the first place, that led her to start her direct trade business empowering women, Meridian Lee. 

For more on Rachel, Meridian Lee and its mission, or to buy their fab bags, go to https://meridianlee.com. Original bags made by survivors!

Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/meridian_lee/

Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/meridianleedesign

Rachel is offering a discount for The Second Chapter listeners as well with the code TheSecondChapter

For more on the statistics of empowering women and their investment into their communities, see Half the Sky: Turning Oppression Into Opportunity for Women Worldwide by Nicholas D. Kristof and Sheryl WuDunn

https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/6260997-half-the-sky

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#womenover35 #wearebadass

On The Second Chapter, serial careerist and founder of Slackline Productions, Kristin Duffy, chats with women who started the second (or third… or fifth!) chapter in their careers and lives, after 35. You’ll find inspiring stories, have a few laughs, and maybe even be motivated to turn the page on your own second chapter!

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From Fashion to Free Trade, Rachel Kinley

Hello! I’m your host, Kristin Duffy. This week, I’m chatting with my old friend with a new mission, Rachel Kinley. Rachel has seen a lot of change in her life with a cross-country move, a series of jobs, time spent being a stay-at-home mom and divorce being just a few major life events. But it was finding new meaning in a career that she wasn’t even sure she wanted in the first place, that led her to start her direct trade business empowering women, Meridian Lee.

[00:00:03] Rachel: Great. Thanks so much for having me. I've been really looking forward to this.

[00:00:18] Rachel: I was looking back yesterday. I think it's, I think it's actually been 16 because I got 18 because I hung out with you for a minute in New York one time, but

[00:00:28] Rachel: Yeah.

[00:00:31] Rachel: Well, don't be weirded out by this, but I have an imaginary board of directors and you're on it. So I've been talking to you.

You might not have realized this, but you've been giving me some really good advice.

[00:00:48] Rachel: I don't know. I'll have to check notes with you later, but yeah. So keep up the good work,

[00:00:58] Rachel: I think you're on my imaginary board of directors because you are a serious organized person, but you're also, have a good sense of humor about life. And so I chose you to fill that role.

[00:01:18] Rachel: It's a tough balance. I think you're a good mix of those qualities.

[00:01:41] Rachel: Yeah,

I think I feel a little sorry about this, but I just, I think I just felt like that major at our school wasn't a very, it seemed like it was people who liked shopping. I just didn't take it seriously as a design, career. But when I, foundation year, when we had to submit our portfolios to see which area we would be in, I was like, I'm definitely going to graphic design that's my mom had been a graphic designer and it's just what I was going to do.

And the professors put me in fashion, the, board who decides those things put me in fashion. I think it was probably because my grades were not super up to par, but I was really disappointed about that, but it's really turned out to be such a good thing. And I still do a little graphic design.

It's not really my best area, but and I also do a lot of product development. So I feel like I just had a really good base from that school. And it ended up that fashion really was the best place for me.

I don't, I would not react well to.

[00:02:56] Kristin: So for me, it was, I was planning on, well, I started in a completely different major, had come in with a lot of high school credit or, AP credits. So I didn't have to take a lot of this stuff that you normally take at the beginning of college. And I was really bored. So all my friends were out, I was out partying and all the people that I really admired were going to studio late at night.

And I was like, why are these people so committed? And it turns out most of them were architects. So I thought I was going to be an architecture major.

[00:03:24] Kristin: And similarly, because probably I wasn't paying much attention in school at that point migrate. Well, I don't even remember if I had enough to recommend me, cause I didn't really have a portfolio.

[00:03:41] Kristin: Exactly. Or people who had done stuff like that, their entire

life.

And that was not.

[00:03:49] Kristin: So I got into pre architecture and really felt that's what I was going to do, and then realized I'm not an architect, not it's. So not me though. What you said about being organized and well sense of humor, I liked the idea of logic meets

creativity. So, I ended up thinking, well, what am I always loved?

And I had always loved fashion. So I went and with the full intention and foundation of fashion, and I thought, I couldn't talk myself out of it, but yet I also had the idea

[00:04:21] Kristin: probably because it was mostly women.

And so I wonder how much of me was like choosing based on this is the kind of person I want to be and not really based on here's something that I enjoy. I think I would be good at it. It was more like here's the sort of profile I would like to have.

[00:05:07] Rachel: Yeah. But all are, I really enjoyed our professors and I still think about them sometimes when I'm deciding on something. Or Yeah, Margie might be on my board of directors, and Ms Meachem.

[00:05:25] Rachel: I just, I feel like it really was a great school because of the co-ops and everything. I still have a handful of friends who really were able to stick with that and carry it through.

[00:05:41] Rachel: And life experience like that, the time in New York. I know you lived there after graduation, but I just had a couple of internships and just the other day I had to deal with sort of a difficult person. And my friend said, you need to get your new Yorker on because I had interned there, seven months, I was like, yeah, I'm going to get my new Yorker on now and switch out of my, like my nice,

you know,

Kick some ass now.

I could channel that, I knew what she was talking about.

[00:06:13] Rachel: So I will do it.

[00:06:27] Rachel: Yeah. I really was growing up. I had a lot of great people in my life who were doing interesting aid work and going on mission trips. And I had pastors and people in my family who were just really helping people. So I remember being little and thinking I'm going to be a scientist and I'm going to come up with a cure for something.

And then, so to be placed after all this hard work in a pretty superficial place, I just, it was really hard like, great. My skill is choosing pretty colors. That's really disappointing, but I feel like it has really taught me to. To keep taking the next right step. And that was really important for me to learn fashion.

design for the work I'm doing now, that is actually helping people, and just to know that, whatever you're good at, you can use, not that everyone needs to have a bleeding heart, but just it's okay. To just be good at choosing pretty colors and matching zipper tapes. There's value in that too. And we live in such a weird time where I remember a few years ago, my dad's saying I was trying to explain to him, like I want to have a meaningful career.

And I, he understands that, but he's, I think it's a new idea. It's a luxury. We have to be like, oh, I want to, I want my life to mean something instead of just I'm gonna take care of my kids and pay my mortgage and be part of my church and call it good. There's honor in that too. So we live in a funny time where people have this new idea, I think, where they could have the desire to save the world or, grandiose in some ways too, but

And, but that, wasn't a thing until fairly recently.

I don't know.

and in a way people are going back to a certain I don't know, I don't want to say back to the land kind of values, but I guess that's the best way to describe it. That there are people that it's like hipster to make goat's cheese and you live in Portland.

I don't know.

friends will make fun of me for saying that's normal, but

[00:09:32] Rachel: A few years ago I had like a miniature pink cowgirl hat and I just decided I was going to wear that around town, to run my errands for the day and no one even looked at me twice. It was awesome. No one was like, oh, are you celebrating something? Or no one gave me the side-eye.

It was just like, yeah, that's it it was like boring to people that

[00:09:51] Rachel: maybe I got some eyerolls, but I just love that you can really do whatever you want.

[00:10:14] Rachel: I don't know. I feel like it was a massive failure, but I wish I could go back and do it over, but it was fun. And I was just thinking about that project because I went through sort of a, a course lately where you, I guess it's, I hate the word life coach, but she was walking me through some different exercises and she was like, I want you to this week, just make something for yourself just to be delightful for yourself.

And I realized that's such a basic assignment, but I haven't done that in so long. It's hard to remember what it felt like to just make something that I thought was cool. And I was around other creative people like you in studio who might walk by and be like, oh, what are you doing?

They're like, have you thought about this? Or, just to have that collaborative spirit to,

[00:11:02] Rachel: We visited sometimes too. Or we're like got on each other's nerves, but it was, I wished that I had a space. I could go to that now and just be like, what are you guys working on? Here's what I'm working on.

[00:11:18] Rachel: Yeah, definitely. Yeah. I miss that.

[00:11:24] Rachel: So after school, I basically just knew where I didn't want to live. And so it just I felt like I wasn't right for New York. Even though I really enjoyed being there and I interned in Chicago and a little company in France, but my brother was doing an internship at Adidas out in Portland. And he just said, I think he would like it here.

So I packed a duffle bag and bought a one-way ticket, which I thought was really special and cool, but it turns out pretty much everyone I meet from the Midwest out here is yeah, I just packed a duffle bag and bought a one-way ticket.

[00:12:02] Rachel: yeah, until you realize like everyone from Minnesota, Indiana, Ohio, and Iowa also did the same thing.

There's a group of us out here. Who bought their one way ticket

[00:12:16] Rachel: saying,

[00:12:20] Rachel: well, it's interesting because I knew I could move out here and just walk into a Starbucks and get a job. So I didn't really have any money, but I just walked into the Starbucks downtown and filled out a resume and pretended like, I love coffee and people which are both true. And then I just worked there for three weeks until I could get a job at a backpacking store as the clothing buyer.

And it actually paid less than the Starbucks job, but it was, a step forward. And then I found an ad in the newspaper and it was for Hannah Anderson, the children's wear company.

[00:12:58] Rachel: It was just funny. I just remember like circling the little ad and it was, the designers were right below the dancers, the classified.

So I was just remember being like, just keep going you can do this and don't be a dancer and all that was ever an option for me. But because I can't dance, but anyway,

[00:13:16] Rachel: like a little bit like, oh man, Yeah.

just alphabetical. so I circled the little ad and went down and they hired me.

But that was, that was a really good job. Like I remember calling our professor and it's embarrassing, but she was surprised that they had hired me. So she was like, well, I guess if they're hiring, she wasn't like gradually, it was like the backhanded compliment.

There was somebody who graduated a couple years ahead of us who had worked there and she was the rock star, so I think I was not the rock star.

So I think she was trying to be nice, but it was like, she was surprised, but that was an awesome job. And I still keep in touch with some people and the owner, the founder of Hannah Anderson was she had started a part of their profits, went to helping children going through the adoption process.

So that was probably the first time I encountered someone who was, had a really successful business who was also giving back. That was a new idea. So that was really instrumental in, it was this thing, I thought about a ton, but it just introduced that idea that businesses could be a source for good.

doesn't stop them from being a good person.

[00:14:54] Kristin: And were you enjoying children's wear as a

even if I got the fancy dinners or the cars home, it just wasn't exciting to me. And children's wear it was an area where people were not even that people weren't really necessarily had kids, but people tended to leave at five or six.

that was a good fit for me. Like I wanted to have a life outside of my work.

I have to meet people outside of work. And thankfully triathlon came along because that was the only way I ended up making non-work friends in New York.

[00:16:03] Kristin: Yeah, definitely. And it just it was so important to me. Cause I do think now we can say, yeah, I don't want to work till midnight every night, but it feel very much I don't know. It just felt like the culture

[00:16:21] Kristin: to not have a life.

[00:16:33] Kristin: So what took you back up to Portland

[00:16:43] Kristin: So at that point, did you have, in your mind that you were going to start thinking about doing your own thing or

[00:17:06] Kristin: yeah, Yeah. They definitelyused to come in. I was like, I won't remember. And then you said that. Yes, of course.

[00:17:25] Kristin: Rachel, this is your life. Look back. Tell me what happened next.

I wasn't really doing the Martha Stewart stuff I enjoyed it though. Yeah. I would do it like that again.

[00:18:07] Rachel: Yeah. That's a really good point.

And, and not necessarily be Martha Stewart, but just it was cool hanging out with my kids.

And I remember people just being like, what do you do? And telling them, and basically them just like walking away For boring. But I just, it was just funny. I remember at one point telling someone that my grandfather had invented the paperclip so I don't have to work. Just to mix it up a little bit and they didn't really have anything to say about that.

But.

[00:19:13] Rachel: What they're saying there is, like, what is your value? Can you help me get ahead? How much money do you make? Are you an interesting person or not? And just to be written off immediately oh, you're a mom. That's so boring, but I don't know. It's it was interesting to grapple with that.

[00:19:43] Rachel: Yeah.

[00:19:45] Rachel: Yeah. So I was basically working as a contractor for different companies and through that process and also the, some of the other companies I've worked for part of my job was to l ook over cost sheets, which was really boring. I don't know if you've ever had to do that

at your

[00:20:02] Rachel: awful. Yeah, it was so boring, but I realized after the first couple of seasons that the numbers actually told a story. So when I was looking at what it costs to make something I naively thought, wow, it's so inexpensive to live there. People must have such a great life because they only need, like 10 cents an hour or whatever to live.

And the more I looked into it, the more I realized that people were making subsistence wages. So, and it just seemed like when I would talk to people about it or the people that I worked for, they were like, yeah, but you should see the line around the corner when we are hiring or when that factory is hiring.

And I just felt like at first I tried to accept that, but it just seemed like that's not good enough. So, I decided I would try to look for ways that I could support fair trade companies. And the first Christmas I was into this idea, I tried to find Fairtrade gifts for all my family, but they were at the time, this was like maybe 10 years ago.

Everything was really Crunchy Is that a word you can?

[00:21:05] Rachel: Yeah. Yeah.

But like my dad doesn't want to crunchy Christmas present. So I realized, I just feel like there was a gap in the market for more classic minimal designs that were also where women were being paid fairly or the people were being paid fairly.

So that was the start of Meridian Lee. And then from there I started volunteering for a nonprofit who was doing product development and that's how I kind of dipped my toe in the water of Fairtrade. So I started out working basically as a volunteer and then launching my own business with some of the people I met there.

making things, at a good wage. And how did you connect initially, was it through that the people that you met at the volunteer organization or.

It's I don't know if anyone will get this reference, but it's remember the show Iron Chef where you had to use like really weird I shouldn't say weird, but pretty random. Like here are the ingredients

and

[00:22:51] Rachel: salmon or something. So it's not that extreme, but a lot of times it's ... okay, how can we?

And sometimes it's like some of the women I work with have diminished fine motor skills. So we might we'll change the design based on, they don't need to be doing this, like really using like particular motions. We can change the design. So it can be something that has like a bigger circle or it's to their abilities, which I think is it's really fun.

It's really interesting puzzle to try to create something based on the needs of the artisan

how much,

[00:23:26] Kristin: and how much are you in these factories? And it seems like, you know these women personally, it's not just oh, I opened up a factory and they make stuff for me. They're artisans

and you have a relationship.

And some of the ladies I get to talk to every day, like yesterday, I got to chat with people in Uganda, Kenya, India, and China. And it, I know that's a lot more common now, but it just totally makes my life. It's so fun to just see this person is in the market. Now they're sending me a swatch and I have to be careful to not work into the evening because it's just so fun, to see like they're sending me pictures and I can match them to my Pantone book.

It's just feels like I get to be on an adventure still, even though the travel is so much more limited, obviously the past year or two,

[00:24:32] Rachel: Because we built that relationship. I know they're not going to send me something that's a little off just So they can move on and get paid or get that contract. We're in it together,

[00:24:51] Rachel: It really depends on the place and the product, but most of what we do sending pictures from the market is color. Since I can't feel the fabric, but I'll ask them to send a swatch to me. It's funny. Cause obviously we're in such different time zones. So sometimes I'll set my alarm to wake up at three in the morning so I can just, So they don't have to wait around, like they can go to the market sometimes that stall might not be open until, you know, it's not like they can just come back later and they maybe there's a woman going to Kampala today and it's, it's like a four hour bus ride.

So, it might seem like a little bit of a pain to wake up at three, but it totally energizes me. It's I think it's really funny and fun to do.

But you sent me a couple of statistics just about how it really works. And I was so intrigued.

And when they are paid a dollar, studies have shown they're going to put 80 cents of that dollar back into education, food, clothing, medicine. So yeah, not to throw men under the bus, but for some reason it's 30 cents on the dollar for men. And I don't know why that is. I really. Tried to look into it, but all I know is the best, most efficient way to lift up a whole community is by.

investing in the women who work there and to just make sure they're being paid fairly.

my hope is really that organizations would start to learn that and instead of coming in to build a well, or, donating bed nets, they would just pay people fairly to do the work they're doing so that they can decide for themselves what it looks like for their family to survive and be thriving.

thing.

And part of me goes why is it a bad thing if somebody is coming to help. But if it's this is what I've decided you need,

versus people know how to make choices.

we shouldn't assume that because we live in a quote unquote, first world country, we know better.

They would be able to move on like, okay, we've eradicated that problem. And I think some, like of course the Bill and Melinda Gates Foundation is doing amazing work and some others. And I think there are places where, especially now with COVID people, sometimes people just need some money to get back on their feet.

Maybe they don't even need job training. At this very moment, I think we need to stop the bleeding and then we can talk about, okay, what skill would you like to learn? Or do you need a loan so that you can start your micro enterprise? But it is, it's a difficult time. Like people just need to be bailed out sometimes. But my hope is that, a hundred years from now, I'd love to be alive then and see what it looks like because I can transfer money on an app on my phone in 10 minutes to somebody in Kenya, I don't have to go through an organization. I don't have to even pay. If there's a fee it's very minimal, it's just seems like the world is becoming so much smaller and more connected.

So I don't have to go through the government or an aid organization. I can just work directly with that person and direct trade is I think and even better word than fair trade. Is just working directly with that person.

[00:28:44] Rachel: Yeah. It's Yeah, In some ways it's, it reminds me of organic food. Of course you're paying people fairly, or like these, this is the food that has chemicals and this is, I don't know. I just feel like that it should be like, obviously these are the, this is the food that doesn't have pesticides sprayed all over it.

And it just, I hope it will just be like, this, these are the vegetables. I feel like it should just be normal to pay people.

shouldn't be called out. It's just like,

a special label. It just should be normal.

[00:29:20] Rachel: I know, even in Portland last year we had a power outage and I feel like people in our neighborhood even mobilized to make sure okay, this elderly couple had hot water and, you know, people figured it out. And if somebody from another country had tried to come in and assess what we needed, I really doubt they would have known.

But because of our little community, we were able to fill in the gaps and make sure everyone was going to be okay.

in New York, because it was like people were

checking in on each other to make sure they were okay.

If somebody, I lived in Brooklyn at the time. So my ex was like staying at a friend's in Manhattan because she just knew that he would have had to get back to Brooklyn and why go by yourself. And

there was a lot of really interesting communal things that happened.

[00:30:27] Kristin: Don't take this the wrong way, but looking from the outside at your business, and you can get this small business, you focus on bags at this point. It's a small company in non COVID times, you're traveling to all these places. You're, you are empowering women.

From The outside, it could easily look like what you're talking about with the Angelina Jolie thing. It feels very you're really lucky in a way, or really privileged to be able to do something like this. So what kind of, I guess what happened that you can do this?

[00:30:57] Kristin: a little bit of both. Financially mental, like any of it, cause it really, I think it's, I think a lot of us say we would like to do these kinds of things, but money holds her back or fear holds us back. Or, there's something that, that stops you from doing it.

[00:31:43] Kristin: Not an imaginary board.

and so they were, their idea was to bring in, it was mostly minority, small business owners and to create a round table where we could all trade advice.

And so that was really a safe place to be able to, it was also a kicked my butt. But there were, people would just say oh, okay, you better do that by the time I see you next week. They would hold you accountable for your ideas. so even though it was scary, I felt like there was a group of people who had my back and could point out some basic, more business skills that maybe I hadn't gained in college just to fill in some of those areas that I was lacking.

Their mantra was fail fast, fail forward. And so it just, and maybe it's cliche, you jump off the cliff and then you build your parachute, which is terrifying. But yeah, I've had a lot of friends give me good design advice to, and I think the first year I was in business, my aunts bought probably more bags than they actually wanted. That helped. Just my main advice is just have a lot of cousins.

[00:33:01] Rachel: Yeah. Yeah. The first few times I saw a stranger carrying something , I definitely freaked out.

[00:33:13] Rachel: oh yeah, Oh yeah. Pretty much non-stop for two years my son wore a Buffalo sweater that you designed.

you're talking about.

[00:33:28] Kristin: I love it. I love it. This is Gap. So it was like, the chances of me seeing somebody wearing it was like, a good chance versus you have this small business and being the owner and the originator of this business must have been like,

[00:33:47] Kristin: I'm still intrigued what you were talking about, with like your mom having, this is what my career will be, and this is what my life, and then it'll lead to a little bit of this and then it'll

[00:33:56] Kristin: and, whatever.

But I think we live in a kind of weird in between time where there's maybe a little shame in, okay. The narrative I had planned out at 22 is different. And now I'm proud of that. I feel like this, I couldn't have seen my job that I have now did not exist when I was growing up. So I've, made the best decisions I could as I went along.

But in my mid thirties, I felt really ashamed of having to start a new chapter. Whereas now I would embrace that. So I'm really glad you're having these conversations in this podcast, because I hope it, I think it's an encouragement to other people who are going through this also,

[00:35:03] Rachel: which is something it's really cool.

I'm like, these people don't have an hour to listen to me. Say, sometimes they do this and

sometimes they do this.

[00:35:23] Kristin: I'm borrowing that because at least that way. I can just be like, oh yeah. Here's my quick answer.

And even though I know it's way more acceptable now, most of the time, if you're at a party and it's small talk, people just

want you to be like, I'm an accountant

because they're like, yeah, I know what that is.

Versus

I do some acting and I'm a triathlon coach, or, I do direct trade bag design,

[00:35:44] Kristin: and manufacturing.

Like goodbye.

I feel like it's almost a better question to say, how do you like to spend your time? because it's not connected as much to income. Cause I feel like also I know a lot of really interesting people who maybe they're driving for Uber right now or waitressing , but they're really passionate about ceramics or baking or, you know, I feel like that's kind of a more respectful question or interesting question is how do you like spend your time instead of how do you make money?

[00:36:39] Rachel: And can you connect me on LinkedIn to somebody I want to connect to, or it's a little bit self-serving maybe I should give people more credit, but

[00:36:53] Rachel: Yeah, I don't know. I sometimes I just lean into it if I'm in a weird mood and cause I just want, I'm not good at small talk. I want to talk about death and the cool, like the interesting obituary I read this morning and not a lot of people really want to talk about that sometimes. Although you find your people .

[00:37:21] Rachel: Does she live in Portland by chance?

And it really changed, my thoughts about it talking to her.

[00:37:58] Kristin: So, I want to ask about your quote...

will you share it with me and the listeners, please?

[00:38:11] Kristin: I love it. Cause I do feel like you are, you're living that quote, keeping your soul alive.

[00:38:18] Kristin: I haven't. And I've had such an extensive between the podcast and the reason I started doing the quotes after my divorce was like, positivity. And I feel like I have searched high and low.

It's such a good quote.

So it must've been a place where people were coming to figure some stuff out,

[00:38:55] Rachel: It's, there's a group of Trappist monks, a couple hours south of here and they have this place. You can go. It was formerly a Native American place where you could go and. I'm not sure channel different spirits, but it's not really something that has come that's easy for me, or that wasn't an easy thing for me to do, but I was just sort of like in a place where I was like, I'll just I'll try anything, so, and it was, so it was really good.

I would recommend it. I don't think I can do it every year, but

I remember my friend from my grandmother who I think of as a really spiritual person telling me one time, she tried to have a day of praying and fasting. And after an hour she got bored and went down and made a sandwich

and

Fasting's making me hungry.

[00:39:41] Kristin: How long were you there?

but.

[00:39:47] Rachel: It's weird. After the first day, this is the only time I've ever done it. So I'm not an expert, but you forget the first day I was like, I'm hungry that the I'm hungry, like every couple of minutes.

And then by the second day, you that voice is quieter and quieter, so it gets easier. I would recommend it. Have some sandwiches ready in the car for afterwards.

[00:40:17] Rachel: I can't even. Sometimes I try to give them advice or wisdom and it's just so different from what they're actually going through, but I just, I'm really encouraged to think that they, I think they'll have just a lot more freedom or options to think about what they're good at and where they want to go in their life and not feel bad to change courses.

I just think that's going to be a lot more normal. But specifically I think about my daughter and she's said from the time she was pretty little, probably not going to have kids, I just have a lot, I want to do. I want to be in a rock band and I want to be an artist and a writer. I just really love that that's just one of many choices for her. And of course, if she decides to have kids, that's awesome.

And it was always if I felt I got to that point, but I did what I wanted to do then maybe it was time, but there's a lot I want to do still.

[00:41:30] Kristin: Yeah. If they have pets instead of children, I think,

[00:41:38] Kristin: yeah.

[00:41:39] Kristin: I think we need to embrace the fact that like having kids or not having kids or being a stay at home mom or not being as it's not about selfishness. And if you have kids, when you don't want them, that is far more selfish and far more bad for the world.

How am I helping the world if I have a kid like that, you know? oh, well, your kid might solve cancer. Yeah, well maybe, but I also might be a shitty mom cause I don't want to have a kid.

[00:42:19] Kristin: So what's next for you and Meridian Lee?

Do you remember this?

[00:42:52] Rachel: Yeah,

[00:42:54] Rachel: I just remember thinking like that's so boring. Why would you use your design skills for that? And now I'm the person who's oh, we could use like this weight of organic flannel. And it's interesting. Cause I think, I feel like it solves a real problem. Just going back to what I said earlier about not feeling like I had the skills or, I had these boring color skills, like, how's that going to help anybody, but to be able to use fashion design, to help with a problem is really fun.

And life-giving, I think. So of course I never thought that would be possible, but yeah. I feel like everybody has a little something they can put towards a little better world.

[00:43:39] Rachel: yeah.

you can't go

to school. You can't

go to

work.

We're just, we just need to get our heads together and reallocate some of those resources.

And the longer a girl can stay in school, obviously the more money she can make, the more self-sustaining she can be. And

as we know, the more we'll be contributed to the society

because 80 cents on The dollar.

And then, I have some new products coming in the spring. I think the last year has really forced me to look at just reevaluate where I'm getting some of my materials and, the whole supply chain disruption issues, but it's, I feel like it's really good and I'm not the biggest or most successful company, but I remember I was on this really bad soccer team in high school and we were pretty bad, but for some reason when it rained, we either won or came close to winning. And I don't know what that is, but I feel like there's something about like, I'm used to struggling with some hard things. And the women I work with are, I think I was baffled by how hard COVID has been for other countries, because they're just really used to overcoming, you know, being a refugee or living with HIV.

And they're used to really just really difficult things. So they've taught me a lot about resilience and anyway, all of those things have just been running through my mind about how I can. You know how those things will shift my business and my focus. So a nebulous answer, but

[00:45:35] Rachel: yeah,

[00:45:40] Rachel: Yeah. I realized I don't even care exactly what I'm working on anymore. As far as the particular type of product, I just, if it can solve an interesting problem, that's what I really want to focus on is how does this help somebody? And sometimes it's just a pretty thing. Like some of the earrings were pretty and they gave a good income to that group of women, so that's awesome.

But yeah, I just want to keep interesting problems.

[00:46:07] Rachel: That's a good point. Yeah.

in my opinion, you have more esteem a designer, so you've done it.

[00:46:24] Kristin: Just, don't forget to set your alarm for 3:00 AM.

[00:46:28] Kristin: Well, I really appreciate you coming , it's really interesting to talk about, to talk to someone who has continued with the same career, but really changed how they look at it

I'll have something else I don't even know about yet. That's going to come up and it's just fun to think about life on those terms.

Thanks, Rachel!

Rachel: Thanks for having me