Episode Summary: In this episode, Leekei and Jenn discuss incentives used by businesses to reduce waste and integration to a circular economy

More and more businesses are offering incentives and replacement initiatives to reduce waste, maximize use and ensure integration into end-of-life recycling channels. Examples can be found in the following:  

• running competition with t-shirts as a goodies option to reduce waste
• bylaw reusable cups in coffee shops in Vancouver
• deposit when buying a garment to ensure proper recycling at the end of life
• replacement of broken parts in kitchen appliances 
• …etc

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Don’t Take Our Word For It, Look It Up!

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Featuring Carbon Almanac Contributors Leekei Tang and Jenn Swanson

Leekei is a fashion business founder, a business coach, an international development expert and podcaster from Paris, France. 

From Langley in British Columbia, Canada, Jenn is a Minister, Coach, Writer and Community Connector, helping people help themselves.  

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The CarbonSessions Podcast is produced and edited by Leekei Tang, Steve Heatherington and Rob Slater.

Hi, I'm Emma.

I live in his colon.

Hi, I'm Jen and I'm from Canada.

Hi,

Oh, I'm leaky and I live in Paris.

Okay.

I'm Rob I'm from fruit.

Welcome to carbon site.

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Hi, I'm Jen.

Hi, I'm leaky.

What are we talking about today?

Leaky?

We are talking about incentives.

. Incentives.

Yes.

Incentives to, um, to have better behaviors, to our better behaviors.

I like that.

. Yeah.

And incentives with money.

What are we gonna start with?

What kind of incentives?

Well, um, okay.

Let's start with an incentive of something that I, that worries me

a lot because, uh, um, um, I'm kind of cpri to the whole system is that,

you know, I am a casual runner.

I mean, I like to think I'm a runner, but, um, I mean, yes, I do run.

So I guess that's, I'm a runner because I run, but I'm not a very, very good runner.

But still, I like to, you know, to take part into small competitions because I

just find it fun because, um, it's, uh, it adds a little bit of, um, tension.

Uh, it's exciting.

So I do a lot of small competitions and, uh, one thing that really,

really bothers me is that every time we go on a competition, there's

a run of t-shirts and, um, okay.

I can show you, actually, I'm wearing one of . Okay.

This is the one I get from my last run.

Um, ah, so yeah, see, it's, um, it's made of, uh, polyester most of the time.

And as you know, polyester.

Is, it's not very good for the environment because it's plastic based and, uh,

it is really difficult to dispose of.

And, um, and actually I don't need all those t-shirts.

I mean, if you look in my drawers, I have dozens and dozens of t-shirts.

I don't buy any new t-shirts because I've got so many, but I can't wear them all.

I mean, I, I try to use them, but no, I can't.

So I try to give them to people.

But, you know, people find kind of weird to wear, um, to wear t-shirts

where it says, oh, you, I ran this race and, and where they didn't.

So it just love junk and I find it very, very annoying.

But things are starting to change.

Oh.

So what are the, what's the change?

What's happen?

It's the beginning, I would say.

Um, one thing, one pattern that I noticed in some of the competitions

is that they give you the, or the runner, they give the opportunity to

the runner to not get the t-shirt.

Um, because running is a kind of minimal sport, but.

Actually the environmental footprint is quite big when you think about, you

know, the traveling and you think about, you know, all the plastic bottles.

And a lot of them of the organizing companies are trying to, to have better

behaviors, to give the possibility to runners, to, to, uh, to do things better.

There are more and more competitions that say, okay, if you don't want to get

the t-shirt, we offer you a discount.

Which is great actually, because, um, I don't need a t-shirt and it's

cheaper for them because they don't have to manufacture the t-shirts anyway.

That's really good.

Yeah.

And is this happening more and more like in different places

or, or in the circles that you've discovered are, is it catching on?

Do.

Yeah, I think it's catching on.

Um, now what I see more and more is, um, if you want to just sign up for the

race and get the medal, because it's one of the, of the pleasure of the race is

to get the medal at the end of the run.

So if you want to buy the t-shirt, it's, it's offered as an option and actually

they're all the goodies that you can buy.

But, um, but , looks good.

So that environmental incentive in a.

Yes, it is well with money.

Well, and, and yeah.

So, so do you think that was driven from, you know, runners having

too many drawers full of T-shirts?

Or was that driven from a money saving perspective, or both?

I think it's both because, um, yeah, it's becoming quite expensive if you

do all the competitions you want to.

Of course I'm an okay runner, but not a good runner, so

I will never have sponsors.

So yeah, it's quite a budget, you know, if I want to do all the competitions

I want to do in the season, if I sign up to, for all the races,

it's becoming, uh, quite a budget.

Right, right.

Wow.

So I wonder what other incentive things, um, are out there that.

either a little bit of both, you know, or one or the other money or

environment or a little bit of both.

I think often it comes together.

Um, I think those two objectives are quite aligned because, you know, if you

want the stuff, there's cost to make it.

Right.

So if you remove the cost of making it, uh, you can offer an

incentive for, to the, to the user.

Say, okay, you don't get this thing.

Yeah.

Then it will be cheaper.

Yeah.

I, I, uh, I live, um, in Canada and on the west coast and Vancouver

is a, has a huge coffee culture.

Mm.

Um, people go everywhere with something in their.

You don't go anywhere without your, your cup or your, you know,

I carry a water bottle around.

And, uh, people say it's an emotional support water bottle,

, but emotional support coffee cups happen around here too.

And, um, there are coffee shops on every corner.

Uh, we have, uh, you know, Tim Hardens and Starbucks and yeah, I

mean, you name it, there's coffee.

and in Vancouver, they decided, um, I can't remember maybe a couple of

years ago, to, um, start charging people an extra 25 cents if they

don't bring their own reusable cup.

Um, so if you show up at a coffee shop in Vancouver with nothing and buy a coffee,

they are charging an extra 25 cents.

And I.

The idea was a, to incentivize people to bring their own reusable

cup, which is excellent for the environment because the garbage cans

are overflowing even though the cups that they serve things in are cardboard.

Um, sometimes the cardboard gets thrown in with the, you know, the,

the, even if it's compostable.

And the same with the, um, the, uh, plastic cups that are made

out of corn that are supposed to be compostable will sometimes.

Parts of things aren't.

Um, we don't have plastic straws anymore around here, which is great.

It's all, uh, recyclable or compostable.

But, um, but now there's some pushback against this charge, and I think

it has to do with affordability.

It's a very expensive place to live, and it also has to do with, uh,

people who don't have access for whatever reason, to a disposable mug.

. So that means that if you don't show up with your, your

mug, you have to pay extra.

Yeah.

So in a way it's, you need to pay for the, for the mug.

Yeah.

Even if it's, um, a mug that you can throw away, you still have to pay it.

Yeah.

If you bring your own, it's less.

And if you don't bring your own, then you pay for the one that gets thrown away.

And I don't know if there is a.

For what happens with that money or if that money is just going into the,

the, the company's coffers, like I don't know where that money is going.

If it was to be used for recycling or something, that would be good, but I

kind of don't think that's the case.

So I think they're arguing for getting rid of this idea.

, right.

Is it a legal thing or it's a, is it company policies that

No, it's a city citywide thing.

It's a like a city bylaw.

Mm, yeah.

Yeah.

So the city council, there's people speaking against it and there's been

news articles about it, and I don't know if they're going to revisit

it, um, or what they're going to do, but it took a while to get it going.

And now it's happening.

And now the complaint.

Yeah.

Well, I mean, I can understand that it sounds like a good idea.

Um, but I can understand that some people complain because it's becoming

more expensive for people who have, um, have less access to things and

maybe there's an initial investment.

Might be quite expensive.

I don't know.

Yeah, those, they're quite expensive.

Well, everything's expensive in this corner of the world.

To give you perspective, years ago, 10 years ago, I went on a trip to New

York and I was prepared for everything to be really, really expensive, and I

was really, really surprised that it.

Yes, . I know what you mean.

You know, Shannon's like Wellow.

It's really not that expensive in New York and the dollar factor makes it mm-hmm.

, uh, you know, our dollar here in Canada is terrible, so the dollar factor,

the exchange rate makes things much more, but, you know, uh, you know,

the prices were pretty comparable or pretty similar or even a little bit.

Um, than, than what we were paying for for restaurant meals and

things when, when I was there.

And I was really surprised cuz I was prepared for it to be, you

know, it's New York for heaven sake.

probably really expensive.

And I'm thinking, well, when you compare anything to Vancouver, . Oh man.

You were telling me earlier before we turned on the recording about a clothing

company and I'm fascinated about.

Me about that.

Oh, okay.

You know that in fashion we are trying a lot of different things because fashion

is a very polluting industry and it contributes a lot to climate change.

I don't have the exact numbers, but it's like maybe the second or the

third, um, highest, no, the industry, which is the second of, uh, highest

contributor to climate change.

And so we are working on a lot of different solutions.

To make this industry still work because people need clothing and there are people

that are involved in this industry and, uh, yeah, we need clothes and it brings a

lot of joy, but we need to find solutions.

And so one of the solution is to develop more businesses

based on circular fashion model.

One of the idea of solo fashion is that the, uh, the clothes can be recycled.

. And the problem with a lot of things that can be recycled is that it's

not because it can be recycled, that it is guilt-free and you can buy

it and then you're done, you know, you've done your part of the work.

Um, you actually really have to make sure that it is recycled properly.

Otherwise, you know, it's not because something is, can be

recycled, that it will get recycled.

. And so that is a big problem with fashion, the textile stuff, uh, because

a lot of pieces of clothing can be recycled, but they don't eventually

get recycled because, um, it doesn't go through the right channel, through

the, the right networks of recycling.

And, um, so one of the companies that has um, you know, has really

pushed, uh, this concept to the end is that, okay, I'm selling you

this piece of globe, it's your.

And, uh, you can use it for as long as you want, but I wanna make

sure that it's properly recycled.

So what I'm going to do is to charge you a deposit.

So here's a piece of clothes, and once you're done with it and you

don't want it anymore, we return it and we'll give you back the deposit.

Wow.

So what do you think of this idea That is really interesting.

Now I'm a person.

, I would say 95% of what I wear is from the thrift store.

Um, and when I do buy something new, I buy from a sustainable fashion organization.

Um, so I, and I wear my clothes forever, , so what that, so I don't know if it

was something I really, really liked.

I may never return it, but , sorry.

I mean, I was wearing, I was wearing something the other day that, um, I love

this little, it's a little velvet, dark chocolate, brown velvet little jacket.

And I love this thing.

And it occurred to me that it was handed down to me when my children were

little from, uh, a young babysitter who used to spend a lot of money

on clothes and didn't want this.

And she brought a whole bag of clothing.

and I found this little jacket, and this was when my kids were little and they're,

you know, 30 and , 31 and 29 and younger.

So, um, so this is a really old piece of clothing and it still

looks great and I still love it.

So for me, that might not work.

But I can see that if it's, uh, somebody who just wears something

for a year or two and then gives it away, then that would be a great.

Yeah, well, it just, you know, it's something on top the.

Yeah.

So it's part of the price, I would think, uh, because yeah, I don't know

if you noticed, but yeah, I mean, you've noticed you just say that you, you love

some pieces that you've been wearing since when your kids were, were born, I

should say that, but you know, no, no.

Well, , but I don't know if you paid attention to it, but, um, clothes from

three years ago last much, much, much longer than the clubs that of today.

Yeah.

See, I don't, because I don't buy fast fashion except second.

. Um, and when I buy secondhand, I look for real quality pieces.

So, um, yeah, I, but I know that that is a big, big thing, so anything

that helps incentivize to reuse and recycle is a good idea, I think.

Yeah, I, I mean, I see a lot of things happening in fashion.

They'll also, uh, like, you know, swap markets.

Um, okay.

To use the technical term, it's peer-to-peer.

So instead of going to like a, a big store, you join a group of

people and you swap your clothes.

So that's one way.

Um, then you maximize the use of the, of the peer of clothes because it's

one of the pillar or circular fashion is to use it for as long as possible,

and then also you can repurpose it and, um, make it less longer or change

the usage of the, of the piece of.

Yeah, no, it's good to do all of those things.

While we were, uh, talking, I thought of another incentive, um, that I read this

week and just, it just came to me now.

Um, we, we bought, oh gosh, it's, it's way past warranty.

It's gotta be pretty old now, maybe, maybe 12 or 13, 14 years old.

Um, a high powered blender, and we use this blender every single.

every single day, sometimes more than once.

We love this blender so much.

We take it with us to the cabin in the summer , because we make

our breakfast smoothies every day.

And the blender, uh, container has just started leaking

at the bottom a little bit.

Mm-hmm.

, the, the, the bowl, the, whatever you call it is plastic, but the whole

thing is a really heavy machine.

And I, I went on their, Um, because I don't believe in just throwing stuff out.

Yes, I wanna, I wanna know if it can be fixed.

I wanna know if I can get a replacement part, what I should do.

And on their website, I was really pleased to see that they, if you, if you really

can't fix it, they will take a trade-in of any old blender that you have and give

money back, like quite a lot of money.

Towards buying something new.

And I thought that is really good because then they can refurbish it.

If they can, they can take parts and use it for something else.

If it's not their own blender, um, maybe they know how to dispose of it properly.

I was, I was really happy to see that and it made me love that company even more

Yeah.

That's funny you talking about this because it's, um, It's

an incentive that is used by a lot of fashion brands as well.

Dell are brands that, you know, that sell jeans or shoes and, um, and if you

return, you use items, you get a discount.

Wow.

Even if it's not from the same brands.

And, uh, I see it more and more often, and those brands just wanna make

sure that those items get recycled and reused and repurposed properly.

So I think it's a very, very good incentive.

That's very good.

Uh, on the, on the note of another appliance, um, we had a little

rice cooker that we bought and the bowl had, was all scratched up.

Like the, um, yeah, the k ick thing was all gone and so we recycled the bowl.

, but the machine was fine.

Mm-hmm.

. So I ended up, I ended up looking it up and I found the company and it turned

out the company was a Canadian company, which is, you know, not always the case.

And I, I phoned them or emailed them or something and I was able

to buy just the replace part.

That's so cool.

I, and they sent me the replace.

Bowl.

So I still had the lid.

I still had the machine.

Everything else was good.

We recycled the metal at a metal recycling place and they sent me a bowl and the

whole thing, uh, works great again.

So it's like, yes, how could we do that more ? Wow.

You just gave me a great idea because I have a pressure cooker and I have a

problem with, um, uh, with, um, Lid.

It's called the lid.

Um, yeah, yeah.

I cannot turn it anymore.

And I, I mean, I've tried many, many different ways and I

thought, oh no, I have to buy.

That could be dangerous.

Well, I cannot close it at all, so it's just, um, so I cannot, it cannot

be dangerous, so I cannot close it.

I cannot use it, except if I don't put the light on, which is probably use.

And I thought, oh, well, I really enjoy using the pressure cooker because

it's, um, it's, you know, it's, it's, it's a great way of cooking faster.

So, but then I thought, wow, that means I need to buy a new one.

But then probably I will fund the company and share my problem with them.

And maybe they have, um, maybe they can, you know, they can help me with just,

um, just the part, just the paw that is.

. Yeah.

Yeah.

Oh, I think, I think, I think it'd be great to get back to that, um,

instead of this disposable, this disposable, uh, world we're in now, huh.

Yeah.

Any other incentives?

Any other things?

We talked about incentives?

Um hmm.

Well, we start this conversation by saying, oh, oh, we have no ideas.

But actually there are so many, many, many examples around us.

Um, Let's see.

I know there's a mascara company.

I don't know what it's called, but you can return the makeup

containers and, um, and the brushes.

And they, they will do something with them.

I don't know what, but they re recycle the brushes, mascara brushes on the tubes.

and, um, oh, and the contact lenses too, because I was reorganizing and

decluttering and I, we have this little bag, uh, from the contact lens company,

and you're supposed to put the packaging and, uh, the old packaging and everything

into this bag and then return it.

Oh, really?

And they'll recycle it.

Yeah.

Oh, that's a great idea.

Because one of the reason I'm, I don't like wearing contact lenses is,

uh, there's so much plastic in it.

cool.

It's.

So if you can return it, that's a great idea.

You have to give me the, the name of the company.

Can't remember it.

I can't remember right off the top of my head, but I remember

looking at this bag that came with something and I Oh, that's great.

Oh, fantastic.

Yeah.

Yeah.

I think that's all the incentives I can think of for today.

But if, you know, if people have incentive programs for reducing waste

or for recycling that they wanna share with, They can come over to the carbon

almanac.org, um, to the podcast and go down and tell us there's a way

that you can share your story and give us your, uh, your tale, explain what

you found, where you live, and, uh, and we would love to hear from you.

Yeah.

I'm sure that you'll have a love examples and ideas because, uh, we

start with no ideas and, uh, and we, I don't know how many we got.

I got quite a few.

Yeah.

Okay.

So nice to talk to you, Jen.

Nice talking to you.

Lake was fun.

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