Vision without eyes? Intelligence without a brain? Are plants more akin to us than we have been prepared to acknowledge? Or are they different in ways we will forever strain to imagine? One way or another, a vine with some unusual abilities is shaking the field of botany to its foundations.
On this episode: Zoë Schlanger (author of the newly-released, New York Times bestselling book The Light Eaters: How the Unseen World of Plant Intelligence Offers a New Understanding of Life on Earth) takes us to the misty rainforests of Chile and back to report on what might just be the world’s most extraordinary plant — hidden in plain sight.
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With music by Modern Biology, Mort Garson, Hotspring, Thumbug, and Sunfish Moon Light.
For credits, citations, transcript, and more, visit futureecologies.net/listen/fe-5-10-everything-will-be-vine
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🌱 Future Ecologies is an independent, ad-free, listener-supported podcast.
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You are listening to Season Five of
Introduction Voiceover:Future Ecologies
Mendel Skulski:Okay, here we go.
Adam Huggins:You know the drill.
Mendel Skulski:Mendel,
Adam Huggins:Adam,
Mendel Skulski:Future Ecologies.
Adam Huggins:and this is the last episode of our fifth
Adam Huggins:season.
Mendel Skulski:Thanks for coming with us!
Adam Huggins:And don't worry, we will be back soon. In the
Adam Huggins:meantime, we're going to be keeping the podcast feed warm
Adam Huggins:and cozy over the summer with a few extra treats for your ears.
Adam Huggins:Today, we've got something really special. Because it's a
Adam Huggins:story about plants.
Mendel Skulski:It's more of a mystery about plants. Because
Mendel Skulski:despite our budding interest, our story today reveals that
Mendel Skulski:many leaves remain unturned.
Adam Huggins:The story comes to us from journalist and friend of
Adam Huggins:the show, Zoe Schlanger, the author of the newly released,
Adam Huggins:New York Times best-selling book, The Light Eaters — How the
Adam Huggins:Unseen World of Plant Intelligence Offers a New
Adam Huggins:Understanding of Life on Earth.
Mendel Skulski:Zoë took one of our recorders to the jungles of
Mendel Skulski:Chile and back to report on what might just be the world's most
Mendel Skulski:ordinary, extraordinary plant. We'll let her take it from here.
Mendel Skulski:So, without further ado, this is Everything Will Be Vine.
Introduction Voiceover:Broadcasting from the unceded, shared and
Introduction Voiceover:asserted territories of the Musqueam, Squamish, and
Introduction Voiceover:Tsleil-Waututh, this is Future Ecologies – exploring the shape
Introduction Voiceover:of our world through ecology, design, and sound.
Introduction Voiceover:Zoë Schlanger: Journalists in my line of work tend to be focused
Introduction Voiceover:on death. Or the harbingers of it — disease, disaster, decline.
Introduction Voiceover:That is how climate journalists mark time as the earth passes
Introduction Voiceover:benchmark after grim benchmark on its way into the foreseen
Introduction Voiceover:crisis. There’s only so much of this that one person can take.
Introduction Voiceover:Or perhaps my tolerance was thin and easily worn out after years
Introduction Voiceover:of focus on droughts and floods. In recent years I’d begun to
Introduction Voiceover:feel numb and empty. I needed some of the opposite.
Introduction Voiceover:What, I wondered, is the opposite of death? Creation,
Introduction Voiceover:perhaps. A sense of becomings instead of endings. Plants are
Introduction Voiceover:that, given as they are to continuous growth. They’d
Introduction Voiceover:soothed me all my life, long before studies came out
Introduction Voiceover:confirming what we already knew — that time spent among plants
Introduction Voiceover:can ease the mind better than a long sleep. Living in a dense
Introduction Voiceover:city, I’d walked in the park under a canopy of yews and elms
Introduction Voiceover:when I needed to clear my head; I’d spent long minutes gazing at
Introduction Voiceover:the new leaves forming on my potted philodendrons when my
Introduction Voiceover:nerves were fried. Plants are the very definition of creative
Introduction Voiceover:becoming — they are in constant motion, albeit slow motion,
Introduction Voiceover:probing the air and soil in a relentless quest for a livable
Introduction Voiceover:future.
Introduction Voiceover:A life spent constantly growing yet rooted in a single spot
Introduction Voiceover:comes with tremendous challenges. To meet them, plants
Introduction Voiceover:have come up with some of the most creative methods for
Introduction Voiceover:survival of any living thing, us included. Many are so ingenious
Introduction Voiceover:that they seem nearly impossible for an order of life we’ve
Introduction Voiceover:mostly relegated to the margins of our own lives, the decoration
Introduction Voiceover:that frames the theatrics of being an animal. Yet there they
Introduction Voiceover:are all the same, these unbelievable abilities of
Introduction Voiceover:plants, defying our anaemic expectations. Through
Introduction Voiceover:conversations with scientists around the world I would learn
Introduction Voiceover:that their way of life is so astonishing, that no one really
Introduction Voiceover:knows the limits of what a plant can do. In fact, it seemed that
Introduction Voiceover:no one quite knows what a plant really is.
Introduction Voiceover:This is, of course, a problem for the scientific field of
Introduction Voiceover:botany. Or it’s the most exciting thing to happen to it
Introduction Voiceover:in a generation, depending on how comfortable you feel with
Introduction Voiceover:seismic shifts in what you once thought to be true. As I looked
Introduction Voiceover:deeper, I would find a scientific field eating itself
Introduction Voiceover:alive with contradictions — points of contention multiplying
Introduction Voiceover:as fast as the mysteries. But something in me was attracted to
Introduction Voiceover:this lack of neat answers. Who doesn’t feel both drawn to and
Introduction Voiceover:repulsed by the unknown?
Introduction Voiceover:In the 19th century, naturalist Alexander Von Humboldt wondered
Introduction Voiceover:aloud why being outdoors evoked something existential and true.
Introduction Voiceover:“Nature everywhere speaks to man in a voice that is familiar to
Introduction Voiceover:his soul,” he wrote; “Everything is interaction and reciprocal,”
Introduction Voiceover:and therefore nature “gives the impression of the whole.”
Introduction Voiceover:Humboldt went on to introduce the European intellectual world
Introduction Voiceover:to the concept of the planet as a living whole, with climatic
Introduction Voiceover:systems and interlocking biological and geological
Introduction Voiceover:patterns bound up as a “net-like, intricate fabric.”
Introduction Voiceover:This was Western science’s earliest glimmer of ecological
Introduction Voiceover:thinking, where the natural world became a series of biotic
Introduction Voiceover:communities, each acting upon the others.
Introduction Voiceover:The question that I found mired in controversy was whether
Introduction Voiceover:plants could be considered intelligent — and, for an even
Introduction Voiceover:bolder minority, whether they could be considered conscious
Introduction Voiceover:and communicative. For all of their amazing, adaptive
Introduction Voiceover:behaviour, were they sensate agents? Or, were they each
Introduction Voiceover:simply acting out a predetermined genetic script?
Introduction Voiceover:Although I had come to this corner of the scientific world
Introduction Voiceover:at an exciting time, these questions were anything but new.
Introduction Voiceover:At the turn of the 20th Century, Jagadish Chandra Bose, a
Introduction Voiceover:physicist-turned-biologist in Kolkata, India, had begun to
Introduction Voiceover:experiment and measure the electrical responses of plants,
Introduction Voiceover:and became convinced that they shared a functional similarity
Introduction Voiceover:to those in animal tissues.
Introduction Voiceover:JC Bose biopic: 1901, the Royal Institution, London. He gave a
Introduction Voiceover:lecture demonstration of his latest experiment.
Introduction Voiceover:The Secret Life of Plants: Touching the leaves of Mimosa pudica with
Introduction Voiceover:a cotton soaked in ether, Bose demonstrates the fainting
Introduction Voiceover:response in a plant.
Introduction Voiceover:The Bose experiments were denied publication by the Royal
Introduction Voiceover:Society. By daring to suggest that electrical responses are
Introduction Voiceover:present in plants, he had offended the learned members.
Introduction Voiceover:Zoë Schlanger: Despite inventing instruments of unprecedented
Introduction Voiceover:precision across several disciplines, Bose would be
Introduction Voiceover:expunged from the scientific canon for his fringe beliefs — a
Introduction Voiceover:fate not shared by Alexander Graham Bell, who was driven to
Introduction Voiceover:invent the telephone in hopes of communicating with the dead; or
Introduction Voiceover:Thomas Edison, whose experiments ranged into telekinesis and
Introduction Voiceover:telepathy. Dark-skinned and Indian, however, Bose and his
Introduction Voiceover:ideas were denied a place in Western textbooks for nearly a
Introduction Voiceover:century.
Introduction Voiceover:Popular books were a different story. In 1973, the publication
Introduction Voiceover:of The Secret Life of Plants took the world by storm. 5 years
Introduction Voiceover:later, a film by the same name, with a soundtrack by Stevie
Introduction Voiceover:Wonder.
Unknown:Plants have been wired into a complex computer. The
Unknown:change of mood as they react to the crowds of visitors will be
Unknown:converted into musical expression. As the people move
Unknown:among the plants, the sounds they hear are the plants
Unknown:reacting to their presence. An ephemeral exchange of energy
Unknown:linking to diverse life forms, becomes a symphony of emotions.
Unknown:Zoë Schlanger: At the dawn of New Age culture, the world was
Unknown:ready to inhale ideas about how plants were just as alive as we
Unknown:are. It was an immediate and meteoric success, offering an
Unknown:elysian new way to attend to the living earth.
Unknown:In some mysterious way, the plant which is attached to
Unknown:the instrument is able to feel the mutilation of its comrade.
Unknown:Zoë Schlanger: The Secret Life of Plants was a glimpse at a
Unknown:society on the verge of direct communication with its leafy
Unknown:brethren. It would inspire thousands of hours of one-sided
Unknown:conversations, and some very worn-out cassettes of Wolfgang
Unknown:Amadeus Motzart.
Unknown:And it would turn out to be a beautiful collection of myths.
Unknown:The Kirlian Witness: During intensive periods of meditation
Unknown:with plants, I learned to channel my energies and enter
Unknown:new states of being. After spending many hours in deep
Unknown:concentration, I am able to transcend my physical boundaries
Unknown:and allow my own spirit to commune with the spirit of my
Unknown:plant.
Unknown:Zoë Schlanger: Many scientists would try and fail to reproduce
Unknown:the tantalising “research” the book presented, eventually
Unknown:deemed “fallacious and unprovable”. According to
Unknown:botanists working at the time, the damage that Secret Life
Unknown:caused to the field cannot be overstated. The twin gatekeepers
Unknown:of science — funding boards and peer review boards — closed the
Unknown:doors to any proposals with a whiff of plant “behaviour”.
Unknown:Over the last 15 years, that tide has finally begun to turn,
Unknown:with a gentle swell in both research funding and academic
Unknown:publications. The march of technology, genetic sequencing
Unknown:and advanced microscopes, has made it possible to come to
Unknown:previously outlandish conclusions with real rigour.
Unknown:But, still sensitive to the fallout from the Secret Life,
Unknown:and due to the squishy, nebulous implications of the word, most
Unknown:scientific authors don’t use terms like “intelligence” to
Unknown:describe what they find. Nonetheless, their results
Unknown:suggested that plants were much more sophisticated than anyone
Unknown:had dared think.
Unknown:From the nerve-like action potentials first observed by
Unknown:Bose, to capabilities of memory, hearing, recognition of kin, and
Unknown:incredible interactions with insects, the papers probing
Unknown:remarkable plant behaviours are growing from a trickle to a
Unknown:fairly robust stream.
Unknown:One such paper caught my attention. It documented a vine
Unknown:doing something that should have been impossible — a magic trick
Unknown:that few animals have mastered, and that no accepted plant
Unknown:mechanism could explain.
Unknown:So, in April 2022, I flew due south for 13 hours — first from
Unknown:New York City to Santiago, and from there to Puerto Montt.
Unknown:Then, after driving for another 2 hours, past seemingly endless
Unknown:fields of potatoes bordered by rivers and lakes, I arrived into
Unknown:the Valdivian temperate rainforests of southern Chile.
Unknown:Not unlike parts of the Pacific Northwest, the climate was cool
Unknown:and misty, and every available space was absolutely brimming
Unknown:with plant life. The constant sights of green and sounds of
Unknown:rain blanketed my senses in a vibrant static hum. In 2014, a
Unknown:Peruvian ecologist named Ernesto Gianoli had discovered that a
Unknown:vine, common to these rainforests, was able to mimic
Unknown:the shape of almost any plant it grew beside... a botanical
Unknown:chameleon.
Ernesto Gianoli:[Spanish]
Ernesto Gianoli:Zoë Schlanger: I'm not finding what I'm looking for. It seems
Ernesto Gianoli:like they may have cut them.
Ernesto Gianoli:[Spanish]
Ernesto Gianoli:Zoë Schlanger: I thought they were right here.
Ernesto Gianoli:Unfortunately, the sudden notoriety had made this little
Ernesto Gianoli:vine a target for poachers. It's appropriate then that it has a
Ernesto Gianoli:particular talent for camouflage.
Ernesto Gianoli:But here I found...
Ernesto Gianoli:Zoë Schlanger: Oh, wow it's so tiny.
Ernesto Gianoli:This is Boquila, yeah it’s so tiny, This
Ernesto Gianoli:is Boquila and this is Rhaphithamnus. At first glance
Ernesto Gianoli:you’d say it’s the same. Quite difficult to tell who's who.
Ernesto Gianoli:Zoë Schlanger: This is Ernesto Gianoli himself. And in his
Ernesto Gianoli:hands, Boquila trifoliolata — a slender, climbing vine, with
Ernesto Gianoli:leaves in clusters of three. Here, one strand of Boquila was
Ernesto Gianoli:winding its way up a tree, Rhaphithamnus spinosus. On the
Ernesto Gianoli:part of the vine climbing the tree, its leaves had
transformed:now a dark glossy green, shrunk to a fraction of
transformed:their original size, and tapered to a point. And this was just
transformed:one example of Boquila’s mimicry. Ernesto and his
transformed:colleagues have found Boquila modelling itself on more than 20
transformed:species, and counting!
Ernesto Gianoli:So far, what we knew about mimicry was a one to
Ernesto Gianoli:one relationship. This species A mimics this species B. But then,
Ernesto Gianoli:comes along Boquila and says no, I can mimic very different
Ernesto Gianoli:species.
Ernesto Gianoli:Zoë Schlanger: In the world of plants, mimicry is otherwise
Ernesto Gianoli:quite limited — shaped by special circumstances of
Ernesto Gianoli:coevolution. Like in the case of rye, once culled as an unwanted
Ernesto Gianoli:weed by early farmers. It was effectively selected to blend in
Ernesto Gianoli:so well with the fields of wheat that it became a cereal in its
Ernesto Gianoli:own right. Or certain types of mistletoe, which are each
Ernesto Gianoli:obliged to parasitize a particular host plant, tapping
Ernesto Gianoli:directly into its vascular system. The leaves of Australian
Ernesto Gianoli:she-oak mistletoe are strikingly similar to Australian she-oak,
Ernesto Gianoli:likewise the leaves of eucalyptus mistletoe resemble
Ernesto Gianoli:those of eucalyptus. Evolution has sculpted these plants to
Ernesto Gianoli:blend in with their specific surroundings, but on an animal
Ernesto Gianoli:timescale their appearance is fixed. Not so, with Boquila.
Ernesto Gianoli:The same individual can mimic two
Ernesto Gianoli:different species.
Ernesto Gianoli:Zoë Schlanger: Boquila’s mimicry is spontaneous and flexible. A
Ernesto Gianoli:single vine may climb across several different plants and
Ernesto Gianoli:change its leaves accordingly.
Ernesto Gianoli:I mean, in terms of size, one to ten ratio.
Ernesto Gianoli:And in terms of shape, and color, vein patterns — a broad
Ernesto Gianoli:array of traits. What is mimicry? Similar colours, maybe
Ernesto Gianoli:similar shapes. But this goes beyond that.
Ernesto Gianoli:Zoë Schlanger: What’s more, direct contact is unnecessary
Ernesto Gianoli:for Boquila to model itself after another plant. It may
Ernesto Gianoli:simply be growing nearby.
Ernesto Gianoli:Whoa. That's huge.
Ernesto Gianoli:Yeah it's huge. And also this, as I told, this
Ernesto Gianoli:wavy...
Ernesto Gianoli:Zoë Schlanger: Uh huh. The wavy edge.
Ernesto Gianoli:Yeah wavy edge.
Ernesto Gianoli:Zoë Schlanger: Wow. That's unbelievable. I mean, that's
Ernesto Gianoli:like, what 15, 16 times the size over there?
Ernesto Gianoli:Yes, exactly. Here, small Boquilas. But starts
Ernesto Gianoli:growing larger and larger. Not all the plants, of course — not
Ernesto Gianoli:all the leaves, of course.
Ernesto Gianoli:Zoë Schlanger: So if you were an herbivore, your first impression
Ernesto Gianoli:would be...?
Ernesto Gianoli:That it's another species.
Ernesto Gianoli:Zoë Schlanger: Yeah. Wait, is this Boquila?
Ernesto Gianoli:Yes.
Ernesto Gianoli:Zoë Schlanger: It's even got the yellowing.
Ernesto Gianoli:And if we look carefully around there are five
Ernesto Gianoli:more.
Ernesto Gianoli:Zoë Schlanger: We are in a spot totally surrounded by Boquila on
Ernesto Gianoli:all sides. It's sort of a glen of Boquila. There's maybe 10 or
Ernesto Gianoli:15 other species of plants, all growing up as thick bushes, and
Ernesto Gianoli:the Boquila is twining around all of them. And on almost every
Ernesto Gianoli:single one I'm walking by, you have to look very closely. But
Ernesto Gianoli:the Boquila has shifted its shape. In some areas of its
Ernesto Gianoli:vines to match. Most of these species, in some places, the
Ernesto Gianoli:leaf is almost the size of my hand to match long, large leaves
Ernesto Gianoli:of one species and 10 meters away, it's smaller than my pinky
Ernesto Gianoli:nail to match a species with very small, dark, glossy leaves
Ernesto Gianoli:that have a strong vein down the middle and the Boquila matches
Ernesto Gianoli:that vein and that gloss perfectly too. It's just
Ernesto Gianoli:astounding. And the longer I spend staring at an area the
Ernesto Gianoli:more Boquila appear, but it takes a while so if I was an
Ernesto Gianoli:herbivore, I for sure would be tricked. If I was a deer walking
Ernesto Gianoli:through here, I just can't imagine if they're visually
Ernesto Gianoli:guided how they’d distinguish between these plants.
Ernesto Gianoli:And not all of these model plants are endemic to this
Ernesto Gianoli:rainforest. Ernesto showed me it next to a plant, creeping
Ernesto Gianoli:buttercup, that had only recently been introduced,
Ernesto Gianoli:sometime in the last 20 years. Here, Boquila’s duplication was
Ernesto Gianoli:strikingly partial and imperfect. It almost felt like
Ernesto Gianoli:witnessing a young artist practising their still-life
Ernesto Gianoli:sketches — actively refining their skill in rendering the
Ernesto Gianoli:world.
Ernesto Gianoli:Every time Ernesto goes out into the field to study Boquila, he
Ernesto Gianoli:and his colleagues discover it modelling itself on yet another
Ernesto Gianoli:species. I was present for the addition of two plants to this
Ernesto Gianoli:ever-growing list. First, a species of maidenhair fern, so
Ernesto Gianoli:far the only documented instance of Boquila mimicking a fern,
Ernesto Gianoli:which I found myself. And second, an overstory tree known
Ernesto Gianoli:as Notro.
Ernesto Gianoli:This is the first record of Boquila doing
Ernesto Gianoli:something with Notro. This shape of elongated leaves is quite
Ernesto Gianoli:rare to observe in Boquila.
Ernesto Gianoli:Zoë Schlanger: Still riding high off of my own small
Ernesto Gianoli:contribution, I asked Ernesto what it felt like to be the
Ernesto Gianoli:first one to notice Boquila’s magic trick.
Ernesto Gianoli:What is the dream of a kid who likes
Ernesto Gianoli:science? To make a discovery, right? A dinosaur bone or
Ernesto Gianoli:whatever. It was close to that... Close to that dream of
Ernesto Gianoli:the kid. But still, for it to be really fulfilled, I need to see
Ernesto Gianoli:the mechanism elucidated.
Ernesto Gianoli:Zoë Schlanger: And in the hopes of elucidating the mysterious
Ernesto Gianoli:mechanism of Boquila, two competing hypotheses have been
Ernesto Gianoli:proposed — both of them revolutionary to plant science.
Ernesto Gianoli:To crack the code of Boquila immediately will
Ernesto Gianoli:lead us to crack a general code of plants. They go hand by hand,
Ernesto Gianoli:I mean. Understanding Boquila will imply understanding plants.
Ernesto Gianoli:That’s my feeling.
Ernesto Gianoli:Zoë Schlanger: The first proposal comes from František
Ernesto Gianoli:Baluška, founding member of the Society for Plant Neurobiology,
Ernesto Gianoli:later conservatively renamed the Society for Plant Signalling and
Ernesto Gianoli:Behavior. František is a controversial figure. Unlike
Ernesto Gianoli:most of his peers, he is a loud and proud champion of plant
Ernesto Gianoli:intelligence — in fact, he evangalizes the subjective
Ernesto Gianoli:consciousness of all cellular life.
Ernesto Gianoli:His hypothesis is as surprising as it is concise. He believes
Ernesto Gianoli:that plants can see.
Ernesto Gianoli:František Baluška: Vision in plants is controversial, but it
Ernesto Gianoli:is strange that it is. Because plants evolved from algae and
Ernesto Gianoli:algae have vision. So, if algae have vision, why should plants
Ernesto Gianoli:lose this very useful ability? So, I am surprised that people
Ernesto Gianoli:are surprised that the plant should see, because if the algae
Ernesto Gianoli:see why not plants?
Ernesto Gianoli:Zoë Schlanger: The suggestion that plants have a sense of
Ernesto Gianoli:sight goes back to 1905, when the German scientist Gottlieb
Ernesto Gianoli:Haberlandt described how structures on the surface of
Ernesto Gianoli:leaves could function as simple optics, affording plants
Ernesto Gianoli:thousands or even millions of tiny eyes.
Ernesto Gianoli:František Baluška: Of course, vision in plants is not like our
Ernesto Gianoli:humans vision. You know, they don't have an eye like we. They
Ernesto Gianoli:have cells on the epidermis, these cells will act as a lens
Ernesto Gianoli:and will transmit any object you will expose to these cells on
Ernesto Gianoli:the other side. This was experimentally shown but
Ernesto Gianoli:ignored.
Ernesto Gianoli:Zoë Schlanger: Haberlandt’s theory would go on to fascinate
Ernesto Gianoli:Charles Darwin’s son, Francis, but ultimately it was forgotten.
Ernesto Gianoli:How could a plant, apparently without a nervous system or
Ernesto Gianoli:anything we recognize as a brain, resolve an image?
Ernesto Gianoli:František Baluška: Everything is projected on the next layer. And
Ernesto Gianoli:how the cells in the next layer are processing the images and
Ernesto Gianoli:sending messages further in the plant, no one knows.
Ernesto Gianoli:Zoë Schlanger: Since Haberlandt, plants have been revealed to
Ernesto Gianoli:have more kinds of photoreceptors on their surface
Ernesto Gianoli:than are found in the human eye. There should be no surprise that
Ernesto Gianoli:light matters to plants. Light is literally matter, to plants.
Ernesto Gianoli:As any sighted person knows, the qualities of light convey a
Ernesto Gianoli:wealth of useful information. Still, it’s a big claim to say
Ernesto Gianoli:that plants are not just weather stations, but telescopes.
Unknown:Of course, this could be studied, but first, the
Unknown:science must acknowledge this ability and then the agencies
Unknown:which give money for research should be willing to give money
Unknown:for future research, but up until now, nothing happens, you
Unknown:know, all what is done now is just our hobby.
Unknown:Zoë Schlanger: František points to new research on several close
Unknown:evolutionary cousins of plants. A model cyanobacteria with an
Unknown:eyespot that can sense a light’s direction and move towards it.
Unknown:Next, a dinoflagellate that builds a structure that
Unknown:stunningly resembles a lens and retina — a chimeric assemblage
Unknown:of plastids and mitochondria, no less. And, of course, he points
Unknown:to Boquila.
Unknown:There is no way how we would explain this without some
Unknown:kind of vision.
Unknown:Zoë Schlanger: So, as outlandish as it may sound at first, a kind
Unknown:of plant “vision” is not entirely out of the question,
Unknown:and is one of the few explanations that has been
Unknown:offered to make sense of Boquila. But Ernesto is not
Unknown:convinced that vision is the mechanism behind this unassuming
Unknown:vine’s abilities.
Ernesto Gianoli:Plants don't need to see in order to do great
Ernesto Gianoli:things. How can texture, how can thickness be told from an image?
Ernesto Gianoli:And don't forget that there are some features that are hidden.
Ernesto Gianoli:Zoë Schlanger: Case in point, the very first plant I saw
Ernesto Gianoli:Boquila copy with my own eyes — Rhaphithamnus spinosus. This
Ernesto Gianoli:tree’s leaves curl over at the end, creating a spiny tip or
Ernesto Gianoli:spike. Likewise, in its mimicry, so does Boquila. But looking
Ernesto Gianoli:down from above, this distinguishing feature of
Ernesto Gianoli:Raphitamnus is simply not visible.
Ernesto Gianoli:You have to feel! You have to put your
Ernesto Gianoli:finger on the underside of the leaf. How this is able to see
Ernesto Gianoli:the underside of a leaf when they are placed in a particular
Ernesto Gianoli:direction that cannot make this possible?
Ernesto Gianoli:Zoë Schlanger: Could it be that Boquila was truly covered in
Ernesto Gianoli:eyelike organs, and was somehow able to integrate this
Ernesto Gianoli:information across different parts of its body — carefully
Ernesto Gianoli:observing the Rhaphithamnus from all angles? Or was it a hole in
Ernesto Gianoli:the plant-vision theory?
Ernesto Gianoli:I think this is too much of an anthropocentric
Ernesto Gianoli:view of the phenomenon.
Ernesto Gianoli:Zoë Schlanger: As we strain to understand how Boquila can
Ernesto Gianoli:accomplish the seemingly impossible, itself just one
Ernesto Gianoli:example from a wave of newly-discovered plant
Ernesto Gianoli:capabilities, the charge of “anthropomorphism” looms heavy
Ernesto Gianoli:in the minds of many scientists. The risk of discussing plant
Ernesto Gianoli:sensation, perception, or cognition is that such language
Ernesto Gianoli:is inescapably tied to our sensation, perception, and
Ernesto Gianoli:cognition; that habituation with our animal faculties biases us
Ernesto Gianoli:to interpret plants on familiar, human terms, rather than on
Ernesto Gianoli:their own.
Ernesto Gianoli:František Baluška: Most people are not very happy with these
Ernesto Gianoli:words like "pain", "cognition", and "intelligence", and
Ernesto Gianoli:"vision", and "hearing". So they think this is forbidden for
Ernesto Gianoli:plants, somehow. When you do a science, you should start with a
Ernesto Gianoli:simple system and then to go to the more complex. And we would
Ernesto Gianoli:not have this problem with anthropomorphism if we would
Ernesto Gianoli:start our sciences with bacteria, then algae, protozoa,
Ernesto Gianoli:protists, and then some plants — lower plants, higher plants —
Ernesto Gianoli:animals, and then humans at the end. You all the time are blamed
Ernesto Gianoli:by some kind of anthropomorphism, if you find
Ernesto Gianoli:something similar to humans, you know. Of course, we are in
Ernesto Gianoli:evolution connected. And now everything — every this term —
Ernesto Gianoli:is loaded with human activities. So if you say sleep, pain,
Ernesto Gianoli:cognition, anything, they say you try to humanize plants. We
Ernesto Gianoli:try to convince them that we say "plant cognition". It is not a
Ernesto Gianoli:human cognition. It is a plant-specific cognition.
Ernesto Gianoli:Zoë Schlanger: Intelligence is a loaded word, perhaps overly
Ernesto Gianoli:connected to our ideas of academic achievement. It’s been
Ernesto Gianoli:weaponized against fellow humans for millennia, used to divide
Ernesto Gianoli:people into hierarchies of worth and power. Yet it is, by its
Ernesto Gianoli:very definition, still a word that contains the germ of what
Ernesto Gianoli:we mean by alert, awake to the world, spontaneous, responsive,
Ernesto Gianoli:decision-making. From the Latin interlegere — to discern, to
Ernesto Gianoli:choose between.
Ernesto Gianoli:So do plants see? Or does an assumed primacy of vision render
Ernesto Gianoli:plants as lesser animals — diminishing these green bodies,
Ernesto Gianoli:and leaving no room for the recognition that they may deploy
Ernesto Gianoli:means that far exceed the human.
Ernesto Gianoli:It's very human in nature, to try to put plants
Ernesto Gianoli:within the frameworks that we are comfortable to deal with.
Ernesto Gianoli:But sorry, plans are different. So, prepare. Prepare to be
Ernesto Gianoli:challenged. Prepare to be proven wrong.
Mendel Skulski:When we come back, Ernesto has his own theory
Mendel Skulski:to explain this remarkable plant plasticity.
Adam Huggins:Plastic plants?!
Mendel Skulski:Those too... after the break.
Mendel Skulski:Zoë Schlanger: For all the times he has seen Boquila
Mendel Skulski:trifoliolata, Ernesto had noticed something. Its mimicry
Mendel Skulski:is rarely total. Instead, it’s patchy. Some Boquila just look
Mendel Skulski:like… Boquila, even on a vine climbing a tree. This patchiness
Mendel Skulski:reminded him of the stochastic look of leaf spots and wilts and
Mendel Skulski:mottling. That is, it reminded him of the infection patterns of
Mendel Skulski:bacteria and viruses.
Mendel Skulski:Over the past few decades, another biological revolution
Mendel Skulski:has been unfolding. A new appreciation for the so-called
Mendel Skulski:“microbiome” — the communities of single-celled organisms
Mendel Skulski:living in and on everything else. Famously, in any given
Mendel Skulski:person, there are about as many non-human cells than there are
Mendel Skulski:human cells. No longer are microbes considered to be
Mendel Skulski:exclusively vectors of disease and decay, but are now also
Mendel Skulski:recognized as essential collaborators in digestion,
Mendel Skulski:mood, and ultimately health. And humanity is not unique in this
Mendel Skulski:regard. Effectively all animals, like termites, fundamentally
Mendel Skulski:rely on their microbiome.
Mendel Skulski:To most people, the essence of a termite is its ability to digest
Mendel Skulski:wood. Research has shown that this ability is conferred not by
Mendel Skulski:the genes of the termite, but by bacteria living within them.
Mendel Skulski:Correspondingly, those bacteria rely on other, smaller bacteria
Mendel Skulski:living within them. This is the dizzyingly nested perspective
Mendel Skulski:that pioneering evolutionary biologist Lynn Margulis first
Mendel Skulski:popularized as the “holobiont”. She defined the holobiont as a
Mendel Skulski:composite organism made of many organisms working in concert. It
Mendel Skulski:includes the microbiome, but also the macrobiome — the larger
Mendel Skulski:beings in which and upon which the microbiomes live.
Mendel Skulski:Margulis proposed that complex multicellular life first came
Mendel Skulski:into being when microbes of different abilities teamed up,
Mendel Skulski:eventually fusing into one entity, most notably
Mendel Skulski:incorporating mitochondria and chloroplasts. She believed that
Mendel Skulski:these sorts of intercellular symbioses may have been more
Mendel Skulski:important to our evolutionary history than the slow, random
Mendel Skulski:mutation science believed to be the source of all evolutionary
Mendel Skulski:change.
Ernesto Gianoli:Don't forget that once the mitochondria was a
Ernesto Gianoli:bacteria. It was kind of a parasite that was welcomed by
Ernesto Gianoli:the cell, saying "Okay, you will make energy and I will give you
Ernesto Gianoli:a home." And that work very well so far.
Ernesto Gianoli:Zoë Schlanger: Although initially ignored and ridiculed,
Ernesto Gianoli:her theory of endosymbiosis is now widely accepted as fact.
Ernesto Gianoli:“The completely self-contained ‘individual’ is a myth that
Ernesto Gianoli:needs to be replaced with a more flexible description,” Margulis
Ernesto Gianoli:wrote, with her son Dorian Sagan, “Each of us is a sort of
Ernesto Gianoli:loose committee.”
Ernesto Gianoli:This state of nature is one of interpenetration and mingling
Ernesto Gianoli:that defies easy categorization. It occupies a middle place, both
Ernesto Gianoli:in the material reality of the world and in our understanding
Ernesto Gianoli:of it. To Báyò Akómoláfé, a Yoruba poet and philosopher,
Ernesto Gianoli:this middle “is not halfway between two poles; it is
Ernesto Gianoli:porousness that mocks the very idea of separation.” He
Ernesto Gianoli:describes our collective biological reality as a state of
Ernesto Gianoli:“brilliant between-ness” that “defeats everything, corrodes
Ernesto Gianoli:every boundary, spills through marked territory, and crosses
Ernesto Gianoli:out every confident line.”
Ernesto Gianoli:What if, Ernesto wondered, this was the key to Boquila? What if
Ernesto Gianoli:its flexible appearance was an expression of a flexible
Ernesto Gianoli:holobiome? He conceived an experiment.
Ernesto Gianoli:It is very important to understand the
Ernesto Gianoli:experimental design. There's this Boquila plant mimicking
Ernesto Gianoli:other plants. So we'll focus on one particular interaction —
Ernesto Gianoli:Boquila and this tree called Rhaphithamnus. So Boquila and
Ernesto Gianoli:the tree. We spotted this tree with Boquila growing onto it.
Ernesto Gianoli:And specifically, we took leaves of Boquila doing the trick, I
Ernesto Gianoli:mean, leaves of Boquila resembling leaves of the tree.
Ernesto Gianoli:And — this is very important — leaves from the same individual
Ernesto Gianoli:Boquila that we're not mimicking the tree leaves. So we have
Ernesto Gianoli:these triplet. Leaves of the tree, Boquila doing the trick,
Ernesto Gianoli:and Boquila being just the standard Boquila.
Ernesto Gianoli:Zoë Schlanger: Each pair of Boquila leaves, both mimicking
Ernesto Gianoli:and non-mimicking, were picked from the same vine, and the same
Ernesto Gianoli:distance from the tree. They gathered these three sets of
Ernesto Gianoli:leaves from 5 sites, and brought them all back to the lab.
Ernesto Gianoli:We analyzed the communities of leaf endophytic
Ernesto Gianoli:bacteria,
Ernesto Gianoli:Zoë Schlanger: Leaf endophytes are the microbiome of the leaf.
Ernesto Gianoli:The bacteria living within its tissues.
Ernesto Gianoli:There is not one species of bacteria, there's
Ernesto Gianoli:hundreds.
Ernesto Gianoli:Zoë Schlanger: Ernesto’s hypothesis was that if the
Ernesto Gianoli:microbiome played some part in Boquila’s abilities, then the
Ernesto Gianoli:community of bacteria in the mimic leaf should resemble that
Ernesto Gianoli:of the tree, and differ significantly from the
Ernesto Gianoli:non-mimic.
Ernesto Gianoli:And that's exactly what the results showed.
Ernesto Gianoli:Zoë Schlanger: The leaves that successfully mimicked the
Ernesto Gianoli:Rhaphithamnus shared 255 distinct species of endophytes —
Ernesto Gianoli:more than triple those shared by the non-mimicking leaves.
Ernesto Gianoli:I think this is strong evidence of the
Ernesto Gianoli:involvement — I cannot say more than that — the involvement
Ernesto Gianoli:somewhat of bacteria in this phenomenon of leaf mimicry. One
Ernesto Gianoli:possibility, I think, is that in a way, these microbes partially
Ernesto Gianoli:control for instance, leaf shape, and this opens the avenue
Ernesto Gianoli:for research on this direction of genetic control, epigenetic
Ernesto Gianoli:control by bacteria and so on.
Ernesto Gianoli:Zoë Schlanger: Ernesto is hinting at something with
Ernesto Gianoli:profound implications. He suspects that bacteria and
Ernesto Gianoli:viruses exert influence on the shape of all plants — perhaps by
Ernesto Gianoli:ferrying genes and RNA directly, or perhaps by selectively
Ernesto Gianoli:activating or silencing pre-existing parts of the plant
Ernesto Gianoli:genome.
Ernesto Gianoli:What literature tells us is that microbes are
Ernesto Gianoli:able to modify gene expression of other organisms. This can be
Ernesto Gianoli:airborne, like a bath of microbes, cloud of microbe,
Ernesto Gianoli:whatever you prefer.
Ernesto Gianoli:Zoë Schlanger: The holobiome makes it difficult to delineate
Ernesto Gianoli:where one organism ends and another begins, metaphorically,
Ernesto Gianoli:but also very literally. What lives inside also often lives on
Ernesto Gianoli:and around. Each of us creatures, like Pigpen from the
Ernesto Gianoli:Peanuts, a blurry cloud of activity; a burst of flavour in
Ernesto Gianoli:the atmospheric soup.
Ernesto Gianoli:And then we are forced to conceive that all
Ernesto Gianoli:plants are constantly exposed to this process.
Ernesto Gianoli:Zoë Schlanger: But why then just Boquila? Why aren’t all plants,
Ernesto Gianoli:or animals too for that matter, integrating each other’s
Ernesto Gianoli:features on contact? Well, we can’t know for sure that they
Ernesto Gianoli:don’t — at least on some subtle level. Boquila itself was
Ernesto Gianoli:described by Western botany in 1782, and it took us more than
Ernesto Gianoli:200 years to notice it could do this. Could there be other
Ernesto Gianoli:mimics all over the world, hiding in plain sight?
Ernesto Gianoli:Or is Boquila simply unique, and particularly porous? Maybe most
Ernesto Gianoli:plants only speak in the holobiome code of their own
Ernesto Gianoli:species, while Boquila cracked some universal cypher —
Ernesto Gianoli:permitting its appearance to be overwritten by its neighbours,
Ernesto Gianoli:for its own adaptive advantage.
Ernesto Gianoli:In the first paper ever published on Boquila’s mimicry,
Ernesto Gianoli:Ernesto and his colleagues measured how copying the leaves
Ernesto Gianoli:of its surroundings correlated with less herbivory. From this
Ernesto Gianoli:view, Boquila’s talents could be the undirected outcome of
Ernesto Gianoli:natural selection — agency and intelligence not required.
Ernesto Gianoli:One experiment poses a threat to Ernesto’s microbial hypothesis.
Ernesto Gianoli:In 2021, a study was published claiming to demonstrate Boquila
Ernesto Gianoli:growing on, and mimicking, a plastic plant. Of course, such a
Ernesto Gianoli:synthetic model has no holobiome to offer, and the authors
Ernesto Gianoli:claimed it as a strong support for plant vision.
Ernesto Gianoli:However, this paper was met with criticism. Ernesto felt that the
Ernesto Gianoli:experimental controls were very weak, and took issue with the
Ernesto Gianoli:analysis. The study was a collaboration between an
Ernesto Gianoli:unaffiliated independent researcher — an amateur
Ernesto Gianoli:scientist — along with a student of František Baluška. František
Ernesto Gianoli:himself is editor-in-chief of the journal in which the paper
Ernesto Gianoli:was published, drawing complaints of an undeclared
Ernesto Gianoli:conflict of interest.
Ernesto Gianoli:But all the negative attention hasn’t discouraged František and
Ernesto Gianoli:his student, Felipe Yamashita, from looking further. František
Ernesto Gianoli:reports that they have yet-unpublished data detailing
Ernesto Gianoli:how Boquila is capable of mimicking nothing more than a
Ernesto Gianoli:photograph of a leaf.
Ernesto Gianoli:František Baluška: Yes, because we have no data that the Boquila
Ernesto Gianoli:is mimicking, not only a plastic houseplant, which is published,
Ernesto Gianoli:but we have now data that it is mimicking even pictures. So, if
Ernesto Gianoli:you provide the Boquila with the pictures of leaves, different
Ernesto Gianoli:kinds of plants, then the Boquila start within two, three
Ernesto Gianoli:days, making some mimicking of these pictures.
Ernesto Gianoli:Zoë Schlanger: Ironically, František and Ernesto have a
Ernesto Gianoli:very similar intuition about why the other’s hypothesis is wrong.
Ernesto Gianoli:That is, the sheer breadth of Boquila’s ability to emulate.
Ernesto Gianoli:František Baluška: Because the Boquila is mimicking many
Ernesto Gianoli:physical parameters, it is mimicking the shapes, color,
Ernesto Gianoli:texture, size and so on. So, it is not easy to transmit such
Ernesto Gianoli:information by some kinds of bacteria. And even if there are
Ernesto Gianoli:some different bacteria on mimicking leaves like on the
Ernesto Gianoli:non-mimicking, it is not any evidence that the bacteria are
Ernesto Gianoli:having something to do with the mimicking. For me, this story is
Ernesto Gianoli:really not able to explain everything. I think it is only
Ernesto Gianoli:possible with some kind of the vision
Ernesto Gianoli:I would say very lightly, "Show me the
Ernesto Gianoli:pictures." Because there are no pictures in that paper. If
Ernesto Gianoli:Boquila is mimicking plastic plants, this is very easy. Take
Ernesto Gianoli:a picture and show it to us, as I've done in every paper or
Ernesto Gianoli:article I have written.
Ernesto Gianoli:I am a scientist. I want to understand. I don't want to be
Ernesto Gianoli:proven right. I don't want to be famous. I want to understand.
Ernesto Gianoli:Hopefully be able to see the solution of this mystery within
Ernesto Gianoli:my lifetime.
Ernesto Gianoli:Zoë Schlanger: One of the strangest things about Boquila
Ernesto Gianoli:isn’t the plant itself, it’s the near total lack of research
Ernesto Gianoli:attention. To the few scientists attempting to tease out its
Ernesto Gianoli:mysteries, even Ernesto, it remains a side project.
Ernesto Gianoli:This may partly be lingering skepticism or trepidation from
Ernesto Gianoli:within the scientific community, but it’s also partly practical.
Ernesto Gianoli:Boquila is just not easy to work with, compared to typical
Ernesto Gianoli:laboratory plants — so called “model organisms”. So far, it
Ernesto Gianoli:has been challenging to grow from cuttings in a greenhouse,
Ernesto Gianoli:although František says they are making good progress. Still, the
Ernesto Gianoli:patchiness of its mimicry challenges traditional
Ernesto Gianoli:statistical methods.
Ernesto Gianoli:For the time being, Ernesto and František may disagree on the
Ernesto Gianoli:most promising mechanism to explain Boquila. But they share
Ernesto Gianoli:at least one thing: an admiration for the 20th century
Ernesto Gianoli:philosopher Karl Popper.
Ernesto Gianoli:Popper is widely held to be a father of the modern scientific
Ernesto Gianoli:method and its premise of falsification. Briefly, he put
Ernesto Gianoli:forward the idea that scientific theories are never really proven
Ernesto Gianoli:to be true, they may only be falsified — or in other words,
Ernesto Gianoli:disproven. According to Popper, science does not sit upon a
Ernesto Gianoli:bedrock foundation of truth. Instead, the great scaffolding
Ernesto Gianoli:of all scientific theory is supported only by pilings in
Ernesto Gianoli:swampy ground. To quote Popper, "the piles are driven down from
Ernesto Gianoli:above into the swamp, but not down to any natural or given
Ernesto Gianoli:base. And if we stop driving the piles deeper, it is not because
Ernesto Gianoli:we have reached firm ground. We simply stop when we are
Ernesto Gianoli:satisfied that the piles are firm enough to carry the
Ernesto Gianoli:structure, at least for the time being."
Ernesto Gianoli:So we will always have more questions than answers. Are
Ernesto Gianoli:plants more akin to us than we have been prepared to admit? Or
Ernesto Gianoli:are they different in ways we will forever strain to imagine?
Ernesto Gianoli:Can we call them cunning in their own right? Or will such
Ernesto Gianoli:language always be too human?
Ernesto Gianoli:We share our planet with and owe our lives to a form of life at
Ernesto Gianoli:once alien and familiar. On what basis do we owe them our respect
Ernesto Gianoli:and appreciation? In the words of ethnobotanist Timothy Plowman
Ernesto Gianoli:"They can eat light. Isn't that enough?"
Ernesto Gianoli:The more we learn about plants, the more their complexities seem
Ernesto Gianoli:to multiply. The swamp, it turns out is full of life.
Adam Huggins:Zoë Schlanger is the author of “The Light Eaters:
Adam Huggins:How the Unseen World of Plant Intelligence Offers a New
Adam Huggins:Understanding of Life on Earth”.
Mendel Skulski:And in which the story of Boquila is just one
Mendel Skulski:chapter. “The Light Eaters” is available now, wherever you get
Mendel Skulski:books.
Adam Huggins:This episode of Future Ecologies was produced by
Adam Huggins:Mendel Skulski, and me, Adam Huggin
Mendel Skulski:With music by Modern Biology, Mort Garson,
Mendel Skulski:Hotspring, Thumbug, and Sunfish Moon Light
Adam Huggins:Cover art by Ali Silva
Mendel Skulski:And with special thanks to Fiona Glen, Gianni
Mendel Skulski:Fontana, and Eden Zinchik.
Adam Huggins:Thanks also to our patrons. Future Ecologies is a
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