In this episode, we go through some of those struggles that fellow travelers and aspiring CA go through – particularly our foreign student travelers.

We have 3rd-year accounting student at University of Cape Town – Adele Mamba share here story so far on the road and her experience as a foreign student.

We also chat about: 

• The Four Majors of Chartered Accountancy,
• The Power of Creativity in Accounting,
• How we can use Accounting Skills to Make a Positive Impact,
• Challenges of Foreign Students, and more.

Enjoy!

P.S. Video episodes are in the pipeline. Subscribe to our YouTube so you don't miss the upload... ;-)

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Connect with me on LinkedIn:

https://www.linkedin.com/in/alunga-madala

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Subscribe to our YouTube - @TheRoadtoCAPodcast

It's what you're in land, so it kind of makes sense. makes sense. Not

Not really, it's not like that but like it's just okay the beach is a bit overrated but like when you're like looking at the mountains and I mean people enjoy hiking so it should tell you something about the mountains that they have that sentimental feeling to it.

Okay.

So.

So you like hiking as

I wouldn't say I hiking. It's a bit of work. It is a bit of work. But it's more of like I just like being in the mountains. I suppose I can walk there and just chill there, just see everything from the top. Because really looking at the things from the top, the view from the top of the mountain is very amazing. It's like spectacular. Because I think back home,

Alunga Madala (00:39.682)

Mm. Mm.

There's like a mountain. I wouldn't say overlooking, but let's say from my house, there's a mountain in front of it. So yeah, I like, maybe I once went hiking with my best friend and kind of saw the whole city from that view. was quite refreshing. Very.

Okay, so you like views. That's your thing. It's the view.

Yeah, it's the view. It's just beautiful. It really is.

But what about the ocean? The ocean view is also beautiful.

Hey, it's just one color. Yeah, but like this is just one color. It's just blue. That's it. It's blue. That's it. There's no variety.

You're even then Cape Town.

Okay, okay fine.

Okay, fine. So what you're going to see, I'm sure you can you see a little percentage with a red dot on the left of

Yeah, it's like 95 percent 99 percent. Okay, I don't understand why it's going that way

Mm -hmm.

I'm going to explain that to you now. So the way that this software works is that as we are recording, it's uploading the video and the audio. So it uploads it to like a cloud infrastructure while we're doing it so that our videos are not compromised after we are done recording. So it might look like or it might sound in some cases

the audio is a bit shaky or the video is a bit shaky. But as it's uploading, it's going to sort that out, basically. Yeah, that's basically what it's doing is basically just uploading as we're recording. And I just get started recording because gold happens even in that pre conversation setting, you know. So I've started recording. I edit the stuff out.

Okay. Okay.

So there's no pressure. If you want anything taken out, we can take it out in post just so that you know that. And so if you have peace of mind to be yourself, really like you could swear by mistake and we could just take it out type of thing. But yeah, but

I hear lightly, but I hear you.

Could you do you think you could literally turn your whole infrastructure so that the lighting is is hitting your face? If that's possible, if it's not possible, it's not a

lighting is a bit okay i don't know how i can do that i genuinely don't know because okay the thing is the light is this way but okay let me see if we can try this side

Yes. Yes. Work it girl, you're getting there. You're getting there. Okay.

Wait! let me just... ...change this... ...frame.

Okay. Alright.

Is it okay?

Oof.

Is that okay now? Is it fine now?

wait.

Okay.

Okay, where's the light is the light above you or is is there any light that goes like this that's the

It's a bit.

It's it's a no, it's just it's literally right above me, right?

Is there no way you could get to a point where it's like shining down in front of

in front of me. Okay, I don't know.

Yeah, so if the light is... Okay.

Okay, wait, let me just try use my phone and then I'ma see how it works. Okay.

Did you initially come on your

I tried, but it didn't.

Okay, I have to maybe let me try sitting on the, I don't know how, my laptop is connected to the charger. But let's see. Let's see. Let's see. Okay.

should be fine.

and be trying.

Adele (05:59.232)

We just have to hope and pray.

Okay, okay, okay. it's looking good already.

Alright. I think... Alright.

You're looking fantastic!

Yes, okay, that is you're looking beautiful now finally yeah, okay I think it's perfect. I think we're ready I'm going to count us down from four and then from there Do the intro and then we'll just chat just like the last time. I'm just gonna chat have a conversation And give value through your amazing story

Okay. All right.

Okay, I'm gonna count this down

So,

Welcome back my people. This is the Road to CA podcast. The show for aspiring chartered accountants to inform you, inspire you, and empower the difference makers of tomorrow. Today, we're joined by another aspiring CA. An Alan Gray candidate fellow might I add.

a third year accounting student, financial accounting student at the University of Cape Town. She's a sister. She's a lifelong learner. She is the bubbliest, most interesting introvert I've ever met. It's very interesting that you said you're an introvert in your pre -information. We're joined by Adele Mamba. Adele, how are

Bye, now are you a lunga?

I'm excited to talk with you because you're immediately when we had our first conversation, I learned that you are a curious person. And even in your diction, when we were talking, you spoke of finding the answers as you're going along the journey, which I think is everything that this podcast is trying to do. It's trying to find the answers. So I'm excited, man. I hope you

I am excited, I am excited and this will be fun. This will be fun. It's quite the adventure, know. Never been on a podcast, but this is quite the experience and yeah, I'm just glad I'm here to join you today this morning.

Mmm. Mmm, mmm.

Hmm. Yes. Hmm.

The first of many, Adele, the first of many because I think podcast is going to be every day and it's a medium that we can showcase, for an example, amazing stories and perspectives such as yours. So let's get started. Let's get started. Take us back. Take us back to when this whole chartered accounting thing started and why you started

Okay.

Well, I'd say it started, I suppose in like 2017. I was doing a form two, which is called grade nine.

and I just happened to be like the highest in the class in accounting and I just talked to my teacher Mr. Gama and we're just talking about like accounting I think he had just started doing his B .Com accounting science at FITS if I'm not mistaken and I was like okay what is accounting science and he actually told me a lot of things that I didn't understand eh he talked about auditing like all the four majors and

I didn't understand what it was. I felt like okay, I get it. There's a lot going on but hopefully we'll get there and just understand because I felt like

bookkeeping, is what most accounting students in high school think is accounting, but it's just, yeah, it's the tip of the iceberg. And I felt like there's more to explore. I didn't have enough to say, okay, I know accounting. I just felt like there lot of gaps.

Yeah.

I didn't understand why we're debiting, why we're crediting, but I could do it. It was more of a process type thing where you could just remember, do questions, because we did a lot of past papers at my school. So you just do questions, memorize how it's done, and then apply it.

And then my teacher would just happen to add extra information. He was just that guy. He'd just say a lot because he was doing the course, right? So as I was like informed to, he was doing his first year in the BCom accounting. So he started with us. He was just more of like he was studying, studying through us. But it's more of like when I talked to him, he told me that, OK, I have the potential to go higher and actually reach the top. We even talked about like the the board that decides on the

You know the IFRS standards he told me about that He was like if you can go further be a chartered accountant and then end up in that board We even talked about like the World Bank at some point and I was like I could actually go there if I do CA I was like, okay No, and I do CA because wow, there's a lot to explore and I just liked the fact that he said we should just keep on pushing and like really applying ourselves to the schoolwork and then just pause and he always said the view

the top is always amazing really. He always said that he was like no we should keep pushing because once we reach the top honestly the obstacles down there won't even matter whatever was happening in the valley doesn't matter because you could have been at the top seeing everything so it was more of like that just having a conversation with my teacher was doing accounting science and I was just so

proud of him when he finished because when he finished I was like finishing high school in the same so it was more of like you can do this Adele I'm sure you can you can do it if he could do it then I could do it and I was like okay I'm gonna do it because my teacher did it and that's how it started and accounting was always just so easy I suppose and I suppose when I applied for accounting I was like I'm good at accounting so I might as well just apply it apply for it and yeah I did

and I just loved how accounting was... I always said it's me, like it's who I am.

because it's really guided by principles. Okay, I know it's kind of limiting to just tie yourself down to one perspective. think I just, I'm starting to work through that now to just not be tied down to one particular trait. But like back then it was always like, okay, accounting is just me in the sense that it's embodied by principles, their guidelines. It's a very kind of disciplined career.

or maybe subject, you you can't just be doing things haphazardly. must follow a certain protocol or certain standard. And I was just like, yeah, this is me, you know, it aligns with who I am. You know, I'm always just straight, never taking a lot of things. We're not fiddling here. We're just going with the straight line. If it doesn't work, it means I'm not the problem. Obviously, it's the person who's doing something that doesn't make sense.

Hmm. Hmm.

It was like that. Because if a balance sheet didn't balance, obviously, you know, you're the one who didn't calculate the correct thing. It was that type of thing. So yeah, it was that kind of thing. But then the more, you know, we explore accounting, the more we just continue with the journey, we realize that...

Yeah.

There different aspects to it. mean, there's financial accounting, which is also called financial reporting. And then there's management accounting, which is costing. And there's auditing, there's taxation. I would say taxation and financial reporting follow a very rigid sense of...

approach because you can not work without the legislation and the standards. So it doesn't really give you room to think. You're always in a box. You're always in a straight line, essentially. You can't maneuver. So it's more firm. It's very solid. It doesn't give you room to think. You can't think.

You just have to think using what other people have already decided upon, which is very subjective. I wouldn't necessarily say it's a nice thing. It's a very interesting thing. I mean, other people love it so much. But I feel like

Mmm.

maybe people would explore management accounting a bit more because that is one module in accounting that just really tests you as an individual to say like how can you really apply yourself? Like how can you just think, you know, think different? You're given the tools but you should figure out how to maybe build a train you know, you don't have the manual but you have to figure it out.

Mmm.

And if you figure it out and it works properly, then it's correct. There's no way it won't work out. That's like management accounting for me. It's just logic. It really drives a sense of enthusiasm and a lot

You get so interested in accounting, like you can think outside the box. You're not in a box. Then as for auditing, auditing is more for like, that supervisor, you know, that you have, can, you just, it's just checking if you know what you're doing. That's all. It's just checking. But yeah, I think.

Mmm. Mmm.

All in all, it all started with my teacher. I really don't give much credit to teachers, but Mr. Gaba really inspired me to pursue accounting because he really had a passion for kids and teaching and essentially for accounting. know, when a teacher is passionate about the subject and they're not just doing their job because they just want to feed their family and all that, they actually want to change your life and they're actually concerned about

Mmm.

the other maybe subjects that you're doing because I feel like people who Okay, anyone who was taught by mr. Kamma would say would tell you that he really was concerned about like how you were doing in like other subjects Maybe your English your maths your swahili your Literature and all that he didn't want you to just focus on accounting also wanted you to establish a sense of balance But in the sense in that way he also kind of he just used accounting as a

to change our lives as a whole, as I suppose. But yeah, this just did, really. This just did.

Adele, I saw that you aspire to also publish a book and I was really pleased to see that. I think everyone who becomes valuable should publish a book because that's the way that you can cement and also live on so that other people can leverage off of your value and your mistakes. I call it becoming a lost leader.

And it's great that I can hear you've written about things. know, your vocabulary is vast. And your ideas also. I think you've probably already gone back

and seen, it was Mr. Karma. have you gone back before this conversation?

Wow, funny that you mentioned that eh? And the Lost Leader, I actually listened to that podcast and it was quite interesting. Well, I did at some point, I felt like...

okay.

At some point in high school, I just started writing about the journey, you know. When I started high school, I had like a chapter one, which is called, it was chapter one, because that was my first grade, like grade eight, which is form one. Yeah, I wrote about that. Like I wrote about all the chapters until like I did my A levels. So there were six chapters in a sense and all I elaborated on all of that. I had a manuscript and I don't know

Adele (19:39.178)

But yeah, I did kind of reflect upon everything. At some point as I was going through everything, I think every December I would just sit down and write about what was happening the entire year, by like tell it in a narrative form of thing. And yeah, I really don't know where that manuscript is. I have to check it at home because it was handwritten. And I think at some point I typed it.

Yeah

Yeah, I typed it, so I don't know where it is, but yeah, I did. I just hope, hopefully I find it or I'll just start afresh. Doesn't matter. But yeah, it really is kind of cool in a sense to see that maybe if I were to write something, it might inspire someone.

okay.

You'll find

Yeah. Yeah.

and really drive them to do accounting maybe but like maybe pursue their dreams and know that it is possible it is possible regardless of the circumstances you can achieve what you want to achieve and as well just listen to your teachers like guys listen to your teachers

They might have valuable information and that can really get you very far, know, because they've been through this journey called life and they've seen a lot of things. They might have networks and people that you don't know how to help you, but like they'll help you somehow. Yeah.

Yeah, that's true. Teachers have networks. think we also, I guess like, I don't want to become a teacher. So why would I chat to my teacher? Because everyone's all obsessed about talking to the person whose x steps ahead of you. the teacher and I even want to actually just go back to Mr. Gama, right? The teacher, that can just be someone's medium.

to realize what, you know, I think actually all professions are just mediums of realizing what's always been there. And I think everyone comes out perfect, but it's a matter of taking that and channeling it through a profession, through a craft. And I see accounting being that for a lot of people, you know, we come in very general, we come in sort of just open

business, I just want to get into business. I know that a numbers guy is always required to be in business. So accounting is a good bet on my path. But there's something in that, that, you know, even in that topic of business, what is it that you are going to be in the business of? What is it? What is the passion that you are going to bring to the profession? Because I

The highest leveraged thing that we can do as aspiring CAs is lean into our strengths, our passions and inclinations, because that's the way we're most effective. If you know in your heart you want to start this business or you want to teach like Mr. Kama, I think Mr. Kama, what do you think his passion was?

Well, he mentioned he wanted to be like a soccer player. So that's like the last thing I remember. He told me he to be that. He wanted to be a soccer player. then, but like his dad was like, no, has to like find something that will sustain him for life. So yeah, he ended up doing accounting and somehow he ended up being a teacher while...

Eh.

maybe working towards something in accounting, something maybe he didn't want to like go to corporate very early but somehow he wanted to be around people so students were like a better alternative to rather teaching I think he couldn't teach in varsity so he taught in high school so I don't know what happened along those lines I'm not quite sure, not quite sure.

Mmm.

Mr. Karma is an interesting guy. Your story, it's already, they're even learning from the people in your story. That's the thing about writing. now you're like, I'm learning because when you said maybe teaching was this medium, that's what it for me. Everything that we do is a medium. Like even just our existence. We're all just trying to

You

with the human condition, like we're all just trying to cope. Our pursuit of success is just trying to cope, I think, with

with our finite time. think subconsciously, we want to be successful, we want to be rich, we want to pursue careers because we all know that we're gonna die one day. I'm getting a bit too hectic, I'm gonna be a bit too deep, but I don't.

Yeah, you're going deep right now. You're going deep. like, I think maybe with everything we do, we're just striving to be content.

Because in all things that we do as human beings, we can never be content. That's why we have wants that are like an ending, but our needs are very limited. So we try to find something that might bring us closer to being fulfilled. If let's say you aspire to be a CA, but like as you progress or take the journey to a CA, you realize that maybe back home, I could just perhaps start a kindergarten.

Mmm. Mmm.

or maybe have a learning center where I help people upscale, know, financial literacy skills and just teach people how to have maybe, what do they call them, stockfills and teach them how they can work around that. And as well as this, Africa is very rich. The soil is very, it's a gold, it's our gold. So you can teach people how to maybe tap into agriculture more and use those accounting skills to help them manage their finances so that it doesn't appear that they

Mmm.

Mm

money even though they're making a loss you so you just help people with your your knowledge you know it does like impacting people or you could just I don't know how you could use accounting more but it's not really tied down to just working a nine -to -five job well accounting is a nine to five for a CA maybe it's a nine to nine job so it's not tied down to that it's more of

At the end of the day, what you do, you do for others and I think that's how we become contained because that's how happiness is. know, people say make yourself happy but I don't know why it's always tied down to other people because you can't be happy without doing something good for someone else. So it always has been about doing something for someone else to make yourself feel fulfilled. Really, it's always been like that.

Hmm. Yeah, I think I think. Yeah, more and more, even as we know, we were young professionals or young aspiring professionals pursuing our career, you know, my career, my life. I'm just realizing it can't just be about me and it just.

Yeah, it's not fulfilling. It's just like, it's just not fulfilling. Yeah, I could do it all for myself. And obviously I would gain a lot, but there's something like deep that just won't work. And I actually want to circle back to that point that you made of...

You like accounting being like that thing that can help everyone, maybe in agriculture, maybe in just financial literacy, studying even like kindergarten. Like it's such a great thing to be able to channel whatever it is you want because the numbers don't lie. I was talking to my brother the other day and no matter where you are, basically what accountants can do, what they have the capacity for.

is to bring us all back to the facts. Numbers are not subjective. As you said, you mentioned in the beginning how there's a science to it, there's a right, there's a wrong, there's a straight, there's a discipline, and numbers don't lie. Therefore, if you're the guy who says, whoa, whoa, guys, I know there's opportunities everywhere. Just look at the numbers. Look at this capital project versus that capital project. Look at them on the return basis. What's the return that this one's gonna get? What's the return that this one's gonna get?

And that is a much better place, much more factual place that people can make decisions. And therefore we all make better, more informed fact based decisions. And that's the space that you occupy as an accountant. You get

I understand and you're right, definitely bringing people to reality in a sense.

Mmm. Mmm.

Yeah, Adele, Adele, you are a foreign student, right? You're a foreign student now studying in South Africa. And I wanted to draw attention to this because I think that even as like in a class, there's 300 of you. There's so many people you've talked to, three of them. That's how we tend to do it in these classes and varsity. We don't know that there's people.

Yes, alanga

from another country that have struggles because of that very instance. Like, know that some programs don't accept you because of the fact that you're not a native of the country. Can you just talk to me and everyone about some of the struggles that you've experienced as a foreign student to just show some light on what is

to be a foreign student in South Africa studying CA.

Well, it all starts with getting accepted into these universities in South Africa. It's very tough. There a lot of processes. I think most of the time, we have to do a check because our certificates that we get from our countries are not really scaled properly to the level that is required by the...

Mm -hmm. Mm -hmm.

Okay, the matriculation exemption board.

So we have to like do my check or you have to do A levels and that requires a lot of money It's a very expensive program because it's a Cambridge type of course if you do A levels, so it's very expensive and Well after doing that we still need to get your results processed by the exemption board. So that's an extra fee it's around 700 800 Mind you haven't actually even started

That's just the first part of it and then you have to apply. That's an extra fee and then whilst you're doing that you still need to pay for like medical aid Yeah, that's like the first part of it when you're just doing the study visa and all that and

Yo!

When you're applying for residence, course, student housing always has complications. And as foreign students, we struggle because we don't really have relatives, some of us, and we don't really know a lot of people here in SA. So it's really, it complicates a lot of things. If we find that we don't have a place at risk, because we need the place at risk, and if they're full, then it's, you might find yourself maybe...

at the library, I suppose, but it has never happened, but it is a possibility.

So yeah, a race is very important and it's usually the problem. At the beginning, accommodation is usually our biggest struggle. And finances, of course. Okay, but like finances, you can always balance it out because your parents have to have money if you're going to come to South Africa. There is a requirement by the South African Commission when you're making your study visa that you have to have at least maybe 10k, if I'm not mistaken.

in your bank account, your parents also have at least 10 to 20k in their bank account and half of the time it's very tough to have that kind of money because you're spending a lot already just to come here and you have to spend extra to have maybe sort of like a cushion your parents just have to have a cushion for safe landing in case you fail and stuff like that and then whilst you're here maybe learning adapting is an issue but nonetheless if you're a public

Hmm. Yeah.

you can always just fit in but if you're a curiouser

Like a bubbly introvert like you.

You know, I just, I've learned how to communicate over time, but like I'm really interested.

Mmm.

But like, yeah, if you come here and you're from a different country and you know no one, let's just say you don't know anybody and you just don't know how to talk to people or you're just quiet, you have to figure things out yourself and you learn the hard way. Like it's a struggle because everybody's running their own business in Fossey. So you will struggle a lot. You will struggle doing things on your own. But eventually you will have you have like set up and then you'll be fine. You get settled.

Mmm. Mmm.

Mmm.

Yeah,

And then maybe applying for jobs. Okay, that's another thing. Getting a job is another difficult thing because you need a work permit. And maybe let's just bring it down to...

CA, we need articles, right, three years. And most firms really do shy away from kind of employing foreign students. Okay, Namibia is lucky because they have like Deloitte and Namibia I think the last time I checked. they're a bit, maybe they can maneuver a bit. But let's just say in general, all foreign students.

It's very tough because firms really don't want to be with you in that process of getting your work permit. There's a lot of documentation required and it takes a bit of time. And because of that, they're opting for South African citizens quite a lot.

because it's a bit tricky. So it's like one out of 50 foreign students get selected to kind of have their articles in South Africa and then the rest will have to like find jobs back home. And that is really not something you'd want to do because there's a reason why you actually chose to come to South Africa to get an education because you're hoping maybe you're going to get a job in South Africa. But yeah, that's the reality.

Yeah.

there.

Yeah, and it's cutthroat, like 1 in 15. That is an interesting, for me, red pill because the foreign students, like I have some foreign student friends, right? I don't know particularly if they intend to study in South Africa to finish their articles here. I'm sure some do, but those are the odds that are stacked against them. 1 in 15, so there's a 14

15 chance that, you know, it's time to pack your bags and go home, go back home. Like, that's hectic. And I think on the issue of the foreign student problem, my problem with it is that if you are in accounting, it means that Adele, are not, you know, one, illegally in the country.

Two, you are very competent. So an Adele Mamba being employed here is a skilled worker. And we have this thing called the brain drain where a lot of us, a lot of us CA students, they're like, I think I'm gonna go to UK. I'm thinking about going to the US. We all wanna leave. And now the skilled foreign students, they have to jump through crazy hurdles and they can't stay. It's

We're chasing away all the talent and all the skills, which is for me a problem. I don't know. It's a tough one. It's a tough, tough

Yeah, it's really tough. It's really tough.

But I think it's more for your unemployment rates in South Africa is really high. So I think the government is really doing their best. They're trying their best to just accommodate everybody. You should take first priority as South African citizens and the other people can then be accommodated. So it would be unfair to you guys if maybe other people took priority because you are also struggling. mean, even doctors are

home.

So it's kind of like the government trying to sort this issue of unemployment out. So in a sense it is understandable if you think about it. But it's a bit unfair to the parties that affected. But it's okay.

It's such a complex issue, such a finicky one. Let's go deeper down the struggles path. I'm sorry to be going down this difficult road, but this is the road to CA, so it's You experienced something really tough back in first year, and it was not your choice.

It's okay.

It was not your doing, it was a matter of circumstance. Can you walk me through that really tough time so that aspiring CAs can also get through similar instances back when you came to UCT all the way from

Okay, maybe I should just start from the beginning and how it actually happened. Well, at the beginning of 2022, I wasn't aware that my mom... (to be continued in Part 2)