The second episode in the Kids Media Club's sponsored series with WildBrain Media Solutions brings in Emma Witkowski, WildBrain's VP of Media Solutions. The topic is one the podcast has been circling for a while: kids and family audiences have migrated to YouTube and FAST, but the advertising money largely hasn't followed — and the reasons are more structural than most people in the industry realise.

Emma unpacks why the standard programmatic buying infrastructure effectively locks advertisers out of Made for Kids environments, why COPPA compliance is being misread as a liability when it should be a selling point, and why Gen Alpha's influence on household purchasing decisions makes this audience far more commercially valuable than the ad market currently prices in.

It's a practical, clear-eyed conversation about how kids media gets funded, why that funding model is under pressure, and what a better approach looks like — essential listening for anyone working in or around kids content who needs to get their head around the ad landscape in 2026.

Key Takeaways:

• Ad dollars haven't followed the audience because the buying infrastructure is broken for kids — major DSPs either block Made for Kids inventory or have it turned off by default, and most brands don't know why.
• COPPA compliance is being misread as a barrier when it should be a selling point — Made for Kids environments are among the most brand-safe digital spaces available, but they're invisible to data-driven programmatic platforms.
• Gen Alpha are the household CMO — 89% of parents say their kids influence travel decisions, 80% say kids influence where the family eats, and the influence extends to cars and subscriptions too.
• Trust is the new currency in kids advertising — parents who grew up with the internet are becoming more intentional about ad environments, and structural compliance is winning over reactive compliance.

We really appreciate their support and sponsorship in keeping the work we do accessible for the industry.

Hello and welcome to another episode of the Kids Media Club Podcast.

I'm Andy Williams.

Welcome along.

I'm Jo Redfern.

I'm Emily Horgan.

And we're back again Today speaking with WildBrain.

Today we're speaking with Emma Wachowski, the VP of Media Solutions.

Hey, Emma, how's it going?

Hey.

Good.

Nice to be here.

Thank you for having me.

Really delighted to have you here.

I think advertising is becoming such a central thing that needs to be considered within kids media, and I kind of feel like there's plenty of groups out there who maybe aren't as familiar with all of the considerations around it, all the challenges with it, but people are needing to learn an awful lot about it.

I mean, what are the key things in the landscape that have kind of changed or sharpening this at the moment for you?

I mean, I know you can talk for hours about them, but what are the key things that you're considering?

Yeah, I mean, I think at a very high level it's about the role that advertising plays in the wider kids programming ecosystem.

And what I mean about that is, to date, kids content has been primarily funded by public broadcasters or by advertising.

And both of those streams of revenue are under pressure because what we've seen is that audiences have fragmented away from linear TV to many different places, including YouTube, including fast connected TV.

But ad dollars haven't migrated with it.

So because of that, there's a lot of pressure on the industry for how do we continue to fund great kids content for the next generation, the generation after that to come?

And then the other part of it, which is a big part of it, is, you know, the updates in compliance around COPA 2.0 and what that means to advertisers.

So I'm.

I'm so passionate about all this stuff, so I can't wait to dig in a little bit more on these meaty topics.

That first point is really interesting.

Why, why haven't the ad dollars moved with the audience?

It.

It is interesting and I think for me it's about the fact that they, they haven't flowed.

Whether it is dollars, it's euros, it's pounds, where wherever you're listening from, they haven't flowed.

The audience, the audience has moved.

Ad dollars are slow to flow.

The biggest challenge I see is really around these environments.

They're now digital, that brands expect to be able to apply digital logic to them.

So they're trying to do adult digital standards in kids media and it simply doesn't fit the mold, you know, it made for kids.

We can't have cookies, we can't have device IDs, conversion pixels, multi touch, attribution.

All these metrics and measurement things aren't available in made for kids.

And that's not because something is broken, but it's because it's doing what it's supposed to do and that is to protect children.

So this doesn't mean that kids media is any less effective.

It means it must be valued very, very differently.

So success here really comes from like context around trust, scale alignment with premium environments, success.

So I think the question for advertisers becomes how do we move away from what's easy to measure to what's actually meaningful?

Because it forms a completely different mindset right now.

Everyone is so used to having dashboards of data, but it's really uncomfortable to ask advertisers and media agencies to move outside of that.

Just I'm interested to dig into that and we can get through the other side of it in a minute in terms of how do we fix it.

But it does appear that advertising around kids media has always happened.

We tend to forget that we watched ads on linear TV as kids around kids content.

So it's always happened, but it was balanced by that funding, by that commissions and now we live in an ad funded world, as you said.

What's interesting, as someone who's been increasingly looking into this space, as we all have in the last 12 months, as Emily said, you kind of got to understand the ad market now because we live in an ad funded world.

The ad free viewing experience is due to go extinct this year as I heard recently at a, a conference, which is crazy.

But it, it seems to me to, to, to your point that unfortunately when the number of digital touch points expanded exponentially and the technology was there to kind of buy those against adult content en masse, you know, you just put in a few parameters and poof, you know, you're buying, your buying was done for you automatically through, through a black box.

What it failed to capture is that kids content is so very unique, the audience is so very unique.

Yes, they need protecting, but also they consume in a very different way.

And that just, it feels like it fell down the gaps down the Cracks, really of modern advertising buying.

Would you agree with that?

And what do you think the solution is moving forward then so it doesn't get stuck in those cracks?

Yeah, I think a big part of it was the shift to programmatic buying and automation.

So when I think about the trade desk, and maybe if I take a step back and talk about, you know, what the trade desk is, is a dsp, which is a demand side platform.

Essentially it's the buying tool that advertisers use to purchase digital media at scale across thousands of different sites using Data and Automation.

ESPs are incredibly powerful platforms, but they're built primarily for addressable data driven advertising, which is something that we cannot do within the Made for Kids space.

So there's a real issue here because some of the largest DSPs in the world don't even allow kids inventory into their platform platforms.

Wow.

And you know, they're intentionally blocking anything that is tagged as COPA compliant, which essentially is all Made for Kids inventory.

And they're not doing it because it's unsafe inventory, they're doing it because they can't collect data or the things that their platforms are really designed around.

Yeah, or they're worried about getting sued.

Exactly.

Broken a law.

Yeah, exactly.

But like the trade Desk and Amazon DSPs are a good example of this.

I have toy clients that are actively using Amazon's DSP who want to reach kids.

And parents literally cannot see or buy ads in kids content, even when it's broadcast quality, premium, brand safe, fully compliant.

And I.

The point, Joe, about, you know, they don't want to get sued.

You know, we are, we've been in the made for Kids business for a long time.

We operate one of the largest networks on YouTube.

We're currently operating about 50% of the fast real estate.

So we are experts in it.

We are safely delivering advertising to kids and their parents across multiple platforms.

So this is something that I think we could dive into because, and thank you for explaining it so clearly because I do genuinely think that there's a lot of people in and around kids media that don't understand actually that this is a problem.

Of course we want to protect kids, of course we don't want their data harvested.

But if that then turns off the supply of ad dollars which then at some point flows back into the ecosystem and might help get more stuff made, then we have to talk about it and we have to address it.

I think there is one, a misunderstanding of advertising.

Two, it feels a little bit grubby when you're in the business.

Of making good quality kids media.

But actually we do have to talk about this because we already know the supply of funding from commissioners is drying up.

If this is turned off too, because it's not accessible, because those big programmatic platforms just will not sell against it, then that's a real, real problem.

So, you know, thank you for explaining that because I do think it's important that we actually lay that out for a lot of people and a lot of our listeners who perhaps don't understand it.

And it's, you know, it's only something that I've really gotten my head around in, in recent times.

And actually it is a real problem.

There's a lot of kids producers that understand that they there's a problem with the monetization of content on YouTube, but they don't really understand why.

And, and I thought that background that you gave on that was really illuminating and really helps to kind of describe the landscape and also the reasons why monetization for kids content is a bit more challenging than other than others.

There's a second layer to it, and probably a third as well that I can come onto.

But the second layer is that for the DSPs that do allow kids inventory into them, they don't have it automatically turned on, so a buyer has to request it.

And a lot of people don't know that.

And that extra step in the process has a pretty significant impact on how much publishers are monetizing via DSPs.

And if we take this back, really, the challenge is, for decades, family brands, family travel, family auto, family insurance, have reached parents, especially mums, through kids content on linear tv.

And this was a very deliberate choice.

Brands knew that kids programming was where family decision making was happening.

So now the DSPs, which are controlling a significant share of media investment, aren't even giving brands the opportunity to reach this audience segment in an environment that's important to them.

The irony is as well is that these are probably the most safest digital environments that are out there because they're so heavily regulated.

Yeah.

And that audience, we've spoken for years about pester power, but let's not put it in a negative bucket.

You know, that audience, that kids and family audience, their decision making permeates across any number of household purchases.

I was reading an article recently where it, yeah, it stretches into what subscription services you, you don't churn from to which car you buy next, where you're going to go on holiday.

I mean, you know, jokingly, in the kind of prep call for this, we talk about kids as being the household cmo.

But it is actually, it's.

There's more than a grain of truth in that.

What have you found about that?

Because I know this is something that you look into and you research.

Yeah.

The idea of pester power has obviously been around a long time, but we're seeing it as so much more than that with this generation.

It really is real influence and that Gen Alpha is sitting at the heart of the family ecosystem.

And we absolutely do joke about them being the household cmo, but I think it starts with really understanding who Gen Alpha are and accepting that they're nothing like generations before them.

You can't dust off old playbooks for, you know, reaching kids because Gen Alpha have grown up in a very different world.

You know, they've had infinite choice, constant content, algorithmic discovery.

They are digitally savvy from a very early age and this is probably the first generation that's been like that.

So they influence what families watch, where they travel, what they buy, and they are that household cpc.

I nearly said cpm.

There's the investment person in me coming up.

They are the cmi.

So.

And I think that resonates with every parent, you know.

Oh, gosh, yeah.

And for brands, winning with this audience means you have to earn both their attention and their approval.

And we really see that at Wild Brain through our insights.

We see that 89% of parents say their kids influence their travel decisions and 80% say kids have a say in where they go out to eat.

They even have a say in what car their family should be driving.

And when 86% of wild brain families are in market for a new vehicle, this is a really, really valuable audience segment.

The last thing I'd say on this as well is whilst they don't control the wallet now, the opportunity for Gen Alpha is so huge, not just from a short term ROI and the influence they have today, but long term relationships as well.

For brands, you know, they're the future household decision makers.

So how brands show up now will define how they're remembered with this audience later.

Totally.

You said you say that a lot, Joe.

You say that a lot, Jo.

Right.

Like we're dealing in the audience of tomorrow.

It's the audience conveyor belt.

Right, like.

And you know, it's funny, we talk about this maybe more about.

I talk about it maybe more about, you know, landscape, media, landscape choices where you're like, lads, these people aren't going to start watching the 9 o' clock news once they hit 50.

They're creating a whole new way of consuming media.

And you need to get on board with that, you know, from media landscape point of view, from a brand's point of view early, because otherwise you're just going to be irrelevant as they grow up and they gain control of purchasing power.

Absolutely.

And if you see that recognition and that love with brands, whether you're talking about a sports team or whether you're talking about a bank or a car, if you do it earlier, it takes time to build affinity.

And we know that with kids in particular, you don't fool them.

It takes time to earn their love and their affinity and their trust.

But if you can do it over time, I, you know that, that love stays a lot longer, that lifetime value is likely to be much higher if you've invested in, in building that relationship when they're young.

And I think we've perhaps fallen into the kind of, the short myopic kind of cycle of return on advertising spend.

And actually again that it doesn't really acknowledge how you build affinity and love with kids.

And I always use the example, you know, we all, most of us as grown ups still love the cartoon character that we loved at 8 or 9 and that, you know, that stays with you into adulthood for a reason.

But you know, it could be the same model of phone, the same bank, you know, that's, that's the kind of affinity that you can build.

It really is like when you say the character that kind of grew up on for me, like Care Bears, Gummy Bears, Inspector Gadget, you know, all of these childhood shows that I grew up on that I love.

And that's actually a really big trend that we see here is the role of nostalgia.

And you know, at its core nostalgia is about invoking, you know, that feeling of joy, comfort, happiness, good times.

And that emotional response really, really matters in advertising because it helps to drive brand awareness, brand recall and purchase a tent.

I mean one of the things that really struck me in our conversation with Kate Smith last week was that the, the rise of connected TVs and the fact that that may meant co viewing was much more of a thing.

And it feels like that nostalgia viewing is a, is a classic example of a way that a parent can share that love of that show with their child.

And, and that kind of co decision making feels like that's something that may be underpriced for a lot of advertisers in terms of being able to reach, reach the whole family really in a way that they maybe couldn't have when it was primarily on mobile devices.

Do you think that's a factor?

Absolutely.

I think IP that has that nostalgia and we're lucky at Wild Brain, you know, we have the Teletubby shortcake Inspector Gadget, no IP that's truly stood the test of time and genuinely bridges generations.

So we see it as an active choice from parents.

It's not by accident they're landing on this.

They're actually seeking it out because they want to share the shows they grew up on with their kids now.

And there's something really special in that.

So then on the back of that, to answer your question, Andy, we are seeing that co viewing, or as we call it, shared screen time is really, really important to families.

91% Of UK families, wild brain, UK families co view and 99% of US families co view at least once a week with over half both audiences saying they do it multiple times a day.

Yeah, but that co viewing as well is in these, what from the consumer's point of view is free spaces, but from like a platform point of view is ad supported spaces.

Right.

Like YouTube has taken over the TV.

We know this places like fast channels, you know, people, people that access to content that, that, that, that free access to content seems to be expected from families.

Yeah, absolutely.

Look, we moved into fast.

We were early adopters, we saw, you know, subscription subscription fatigue kicking in.

Families, you know, are more budget conscious than ever at the minute and there's.

More subscriptions than ever that you can be paying for.

Exactly.

So, you know, we do see YouTube.

Two thirds of our audience come via the big screen.

It really is your TV of today.

And then the other part of our network is fast.

So free and supported tv, or as I like to refer to it, fans and super targeted.

Because I actually get a lot of feedback from agencies that fast is like low rent cable or rubbish tv, linear tv.

But we're seeing completely the opposite.

I think some of it is the structure of our channels that we have single IP channels.

So it really is the home of fandom.

So if you are a Pokemon fan, you can go.

It's the big screen experience.

It's programmed show after show of Pokemon and that is really where they're going.

They're spending a lot of time in those environments because it is that lean back big screen experience.

Yeah, yeah.

That's the thing I loved about the chat with Kate is like programming didn't go away.

Right.

And obviously you chatted with her from the newsletter even more like.

I think that's something that's so profoundly missing from premium streaming platforms.

Even YouTube still has programming, right?

Like, yes, it obviously has its algorithmic layer, which I think is super important, very potent, based on Google's data set.

So they know what they're doing.

But you still program your own channel.

Right.

And you're still responsible for your own channel.

And I think with fast as well.

Right.

That program, that thoughtful programming still has real value.

Right.

An audience's like that.

You guys are seeing it because audiences are building.

Exactly.

We are seeing it first.

Audiences up 50% year on year.

Thing is, what is an uncluttered environment right now?

Yeah.

Lower ad load than linear TV or some of the other areas.

So it's relatively uncluttered.

You can get that cut through.

Yeah, yeah.

How do you put packages together for advertisers who say, you know, they want to reach that family audience?

And you've obviously got YouTube, which is very much that top of funnel.

But then potentially the advertiser might want to drill down into a more kind of higher intent audience that might have, you know, decided that they love Strawberry Shortcake or they've found Snoopy and you know, on YouTube and then they've talked into a fast channel which is a single brand.

Okay, we're going to sit down, we're going to watch this for hours.

This is, you know, what my kid's not going to move from because they just love it.

They want to watch hours and hours of it.

Can you pull together those custom packages for partners?

We can.

So but I think one of the biggest advantages for us is scale across screens.

We can leverage our YouTube network, we can leverage our fast network to really understand what the client's objectives are.

In the Made for kids space, targeting is really, really difficult.

And you have a lot of brands, especially the toy advertisers or the studios that want to hit a very specific demo, say girls six to nine.

A lot of outside of publishers, third party resellers, they talk about AI informed video level targeting, but you know, algorithms are not flawless.

Where our targeting comes into play is that we either own the franchises or we operate them on behalf of our third parties like spin master, Lego.

So we know exactly what age demo those shows have been built for.

So we can really align an advertiser with that very specific age demo.

So we'll understand what the advertiser is trying to achieve.

We'll understand the role of YouTube versus versus fast.

And surprisingly, we did some research recently that showed that 50% of our fast audience is incremental to YouTube.

So we're actually seeing an audience there that's different.

How do we think that they're incremental?

Is it that they're, you know, it's a shift from cable or, you know, where, where are they coming from and migrating to fast if they're not necessarily.

Well, I suppose some of them come from YouTube.

But then do they just embrace fast and then maybe turn YouTube off for a while?

I think FAST is a very, very safe environment.

Parents can turn on a single IP channel and understand that all they're going to get is strawberry shortcake content.

And there is some hesitancy around that on YouTube.

I think YouTube have done a good job with their Made for Kids and app and all the policies that we put in place to protect kids.

But you know, there is a reality that some parents do have a hesitation towards it and I think FAST plugs that for them.

Is the quality of advertising on FAST higher?

Right.

It's that broadcast standard rather than, you know, on YouTube.

You know, that's one of the issues I have with YouTube as a parent is that like I can get served an ad for whatever, you know, like it's, it's not just high quality broadcast ads that are on there, this advertising for all sorts of stuff.

There's also sometimes advertising that's completely irrelevant or maybe inappropriate.

Right.

Like, you know, my, my.

I was watching YouTube the other day and you know, getting served ads for pregnancy tests.

Right.

Which is, you know, not necessarily ideal when you're watching with a younger child that you don't maybe don't want to have a conversation.

Yeah.

So I don't know what, what are the ads on fast channels like that?

They're, they're, are they higher quality?

It's not UGC ads like, like YouTube has.

I think it's the way it's accessed.

So because YouTube, there's a lot of buying happening through the auction.

I would guess that that pregnancy test doesn't even know it's showing up on kids content.

It thinks it's buying stuff outside of that on the wider YouTube auction.

And because of the contextual alignment that they've put in, some of the keywords they've put in, they're landing on that content that isn't really in place with fast.

You don't have auction buying across fast.

Like the only people accessing our channels on FAST are the platforms.

So Samsung, Roku and ourselves.

So I think that's why you're probably seeing FAST as a more premium TV quality type ad environment.

Yeah, but that's also that filters down then because the parents know like the parents know that the video quality is good, but they also know they're not going to get served anything random or problematic from an advertising point of view as well.

And do you think the ad buyers understand that distinction as well or do you think that's something that they're.

That kind of distinction between fast and YouTube and in terms of kind of the way that that ad buying works,.

I think is a continued education, to be honest.

Right.

There's.

When I think about the simple truth.

Right.

Brands wouldn't have invested in kids media for decades on linear TV if it wasn't effect effective.

Yep.

But all these big brands aren't yet doing it across YouTube, CTV and fast.

And it's like the audience is still there, they've just moved.

Yeah.

Right.

So I think for us a big part of what we're trying to do is educate the market of the value of this audience segment.

Why you need to be thinking about this.

We talked earlier about like programmatic.

We can't have the data, so it should be evaluated differently.

There's also, you know, an infrastructure within agencies that all set up differently.

You know, linear TV buyers, former linear TV buyers, are now video buyers who mostly buy fast, but don't always buy YouTube because YouTube falls into CTV, but also the other.

So sometimes it sits in digital.

There's a whole other layer of complexity on the agency side of how, how digital video inventory is being purchased.

Do you think that the sentiment around FAST is changing?

Because the more I learn about it, and I, and I will class myself as having fallen into the bucket in the early days of thinking about it as pretty low rent.

But actually now, when you think about it in the context of fandom, again, if you have fallen in love with Inspector Gadget and you want to binge it, actually that is the place you go.

And it feels like it's a much more intentionally curated, paced environment.

You talked about lower ad loads if the ads that show up there are very selectively bought because they don't go through a programmatic.

It's beginning to feel like good old fashioned tv.

And therefore you would assume that that value is going to increase.

Yeah, I, I think so.

I, I think it's just the continued education though of not just moving it to family first where you know they're reaching mom and other fast environments where they're reaching the parent.

Because not all FAST is created equally so transparently.

You wouldn't get me on a fast channel because it's just not.

I'm so used to on demand TV and that choice, although if they had my, my English football team as a fast channel, I probably would watch that.

So I think it's very, it's very audience specific and I think yes, it does have exactly the components it needs because kids get so obsessed with IP for, you know, a span of a year or two in which they're at.

That's the only thing they want to watch and they'll over and over again.

So long term fast for maybe adult audiences.

I maybe agree with the connotation that, you know, is it low rent tv?

Does it have, you know, the premium aspect to it?

But I think for kids it really does, yeah.

And it, but it also aligns with this kind of new, new expectation around consumption that you, you should be able to watch something for.

Well, and maybe it's not new because it was always there with commercial in your channels too.

Right.

Like you can watch something for free if there's ads supporting us.

How do you, how do you quantify the transparency and the brand safety that you guys are offering?

Like, how are you able, like, how would you communicate that value offering to, to, to buyers?

Yeah, for us, transparency is brand safety.

I think brand safety has been around such a long time, but in kids media it's simply table stakes.

When you're operating in the Made for Kids environment, there can be absolutely no room for ambiguity.

Advertisers need to know exactly where their message ran.

Not broadly, but very, very specifically.

And a big part of why brand safety has been a barrier in the kids media industry is trust.

And that's, you know, outsourced to algorithms.

And like I said, they're really not flawless.

So brand safety has to be built around transparency, which comes down to trust.

And I'm really seeing trust is becoming the new currency of the Made for Kids space.

Parents want to trust they know what their kids are watching.

And brands want to trust that they know where their ads are showing up and that they're not going to get caught up in a PR nightmare of what you're just talking about, Emily, the wrong sort of advertiser running on kids kids content.

I think, you know, transparency isn't a nice to have, is actually fundamental to everything.

And when I think, how does that show up for us?

It's about understanding the content and the environment before you run, knowing what you're buying.

So that's that transparency up front, front.

But then it's about demanding accountability afterwards as well, knowing at an impression level where every single one of your ads ran.

You know, there's people out there that say that they do that, but actually what they do is they give you the 30, 40% of top performing videos and then hope don't go down into the long tail of where the rest.

Where the rest ran.

I would also say making sure your partner's not just COPA compliant on paper, but, but COPA educated and experienced.

That's really, really important because lots of people can stick a COPA logo on their website or on their decks.

But like, do they have actually have experience in it?

Do they actually understand that?

And I think, you know, as they're strengthening child's online safety around COPA 2.0, this is a really important time for advertisers to ensure that their partners really are COPPA compliant.

Yeah, that makes sense.

And it's like, it's kind of like there's such a huge opportunity, but it sounds like Wildbrain have like it's basically in your, the structure.

Right.

Trust is building into your structure because you are being specific about your own TV network which you're serving ads against.

There's no like, there's no ambiguity.

There's no, you know, algo prayers, you know, on the whole thing.

Black box.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, no.

And I would agree with you that parental trust really feels like it's building as a battleground for, for media at the moment, kids at the moment.

It's funny that you said it's in the structure, Emily, because I always say for us it's structural compliance, not reactive compliance.

You know, our model is human vetted, COPA compliant, direct publisher control, contextual, not behavior.

We really are kind of the gold standard.

It's, it's interesting given that the parents of kids these days, you know, they got access to all the world's media.

They got phones when they were teens.

So they, they've seen how they view.

The Internet can be.

Yeah, exactly.

They have.

I've literally lived it.

But I do think that that is manifesting now in their being much more intentional with their own kids because they understand just how messy and how unsophisticated it can be.

Like Emily said, you know, sitting with your child, Emily, and then seeing wildly inappropriate ads is just not something that parents are willing to put up with.

And now they have choice and they've got access to fast.

They're beginning to say, do you know what we're going to draw?

We're going to draw a line.

And in a way that's good because it will force advertisers and it will force providers, you know, yourselves included, to look at how you can improve that system and make it better and more transparent.

And I think that's a good thing.

Can I get.

I think the rise of connected TVs again really amplified that because suddenly the parent was in the room watching the content as well.

And so yeah, I think that must have changed behaviors.

Can I geek out on something for a second?

Because we have emma here, Coppa 2.0.

You've mentioned this a couple of times.

You understand the details of it.

Can you give us some headlines on what that's bringing and what people should know about it?

Sure.

So.

Well, first and foremost, we support all efforts to strengthen children's online privacy and safety.

It's a pretty significant tightening of data and advertising rules in over a decade.

It introduces new safety measures like separate parental opt in for targeted advertising.

It includes a redefinition of personal data which now includes biometrics.

It has some language in there around AI.

So essentially it's moving from saying be careful with kids data to prove you don't monetize or misuse it at all.

That's quite a big shift and I think it disadvantages the open platforms and the resellers, especially when their product is centered around AI and machine learning.

Yeah, that's fascinating.

So it's like it does feel like it's moving with the landscape.

Right.

Because these things like biometric identifiers are becoming a lot more commonplace.

You've got like platforms like Roblox bringing in the need for biometric validation and I think they're bringing in AI, AI age validation, that kind of thing.

So it's moving with the landscape and it's, you know, it's tightening things up.

Yeah, that'll definitely be a challenge for the resellers.

It will.

And for anyone that doesn't know what COPA is, it's the Children's Online Privacy Protection act, which was a United States federal law that regulates how personal data for children under the age of 13 is collected, stored and used.

Yeah, yeah, we reference it quite often here on the.

It was the YouTube.

The YouTube.

Yeah, I mean we're talking ads.

We're into upfront season.

I mean what you've just said basically has articulated how buying ads against kids content or in and around that kids and parental co viewing has now become even trickier on those kind of mass platforms.

You really need to go to an Expert and a specialist.

So what does that kind of upfront pitch look like for you when you're going out and doing your job, Emma?

You know, what is, what is that headline pitch that you, that you know, we can do for you?

Yeah.

So it comes back to something I said earlier, that the simple truth is that brands wouldn't have invested so much money over the decades in linear kids content if it wasn't effective.

So it's about reminding brands that, you know, this trusted environment is still here, it's just in a different place.

So they should really be thinking about it because it has, you know, it is high value, it is high impact, it is an opportunity to connect with parents and kids at the same time.

And we see that advertising effectiveness when you reach a family as a whole is amplified.

So my big headline to brands is we need to take away the digital logic and start thinking about the environment that has effectively worked for years, just in a different place.

Yeah, brilliant.

That makes sense.

It is super, super pertinent.

It's that, that digital logic which seems to have obscured everything, doesn't it?

It kind of took over everything and people forgot that actually that kids space can be one very effective and very lucrative.

But it just needs a different approach.

But we have that conversation and loads of other things, right?

I would say the same about the streaming content.

You know, this obsession with 28day, you know, performance of streaming content.

We've talked about that forever.

Yeah, sorry, have I?

Maybe I have.

It feels like I have.

I'm just bringing it up again.

My favorite pet peeve.

Awesome.

Super interesting.

Thank you.

I mean this is this whole, you know, like you said, we live in an ad funded world now.

So we were duty bound to make efforts to understand it and help improve it.

Because if it brings revenue back into the industry then it's all to the good, particularly when sources of funding are drying up elsewhere.

So it's been a really good primer.

Thank you.

No worries at all.

I think that is such an important point to end on because it's not just about the ad dollars aren't following, it's then also about the flow of ad dollars and when they don't reach the publisher directly and the siphon through third parties, you're disenfranchising the content funnel to keep creating new content.

You know, it's not just about advertising, about the industry.

If you think about it, you know, kids content plays such an important role on the development of kids.

You know, they deserve content that, you know, drives curiosity, is joyful drives empathy, you know, some, like, core life values, not just unboxing videos.

So I would say that it's not just a media decision.

We need to really think about, you know, how the content that we fund today really does shape the adults we get tomorrow.

Yeah.

Very well put.

All right, well, that is a great note to end on, I would say.

Awesome.

Thank you so much for joining us, Emma.

Thank you for having me.

I'm such a fan of you three and the great work you're doing.

We just have to chat and you're chatting.

You can come back.

Great.

You want to do the sign off, Andy?

Yeah, I'll do the sign up sign off.

So, yeah, fascinating chat.

Great to hear about how ad dollars have the flow of ad dollars and the migration of the audience and the Gen Alpha household.

Cmo.

I've got two in my house.

Yeah.

The rnc, the podcast CMO is telling me to also let you know that you can find us wherever you get your podcasts.

And please like and subscribe and we'll see you all next week.

Don't.

But.