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White Pigments: Lead, Zinc, and Titanium
Episode 6 • 15th September 2024 • The Art Supplies Experts • Trevor Bell
00:00:00 00:31:40

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In this podcast episode, Trevor and his co-host Alice discuss various white pigments used in art supplies, focusing particularly on Lead White, Zinc White, and Titanium White. They explore the historical background, chemical properties, and practical usage of these pigments, highlighting their advantages and disadvantages. The episode also touches on various interesting facts such as the potential health implications of lead-based pigments and the changes in societal perception regarding the colour white. Audience engagement is encouraged with anecdotes and references to previous episodes. The podcast is designed for those wanting to deepen their knowledge about art supplies, be they sellers, artists, or enthusiasts.

00:00 Introduction and Listener Feedback

01:33 Alice Joins the Conversation

01:41 Today's Topic: The Colour White

02:45 Podcast Introduction

03:39 Philosophical Discussion on White

06:05 Historical Insights on Lead White

08:40 Teeth Whitening Fun Fact

11:08 The Toxicity of Lead White

13:18 Leaded Petrol and Crime

14:12 The Story of Zinc White

18:39 The Chemistry Behind Zinc White

20:01 Issues with Zinc White in Oil Paints

25:25 Titanium White: History and Properties

27:47 Making Titanium Dioxide

28:40 Comparing White Pigments

29:34 Using Zinc White in Acrylics and Watercolours

29:58 Conclusion and Sign Off

30:23 Post-Episode Chat

Thanks for listening.

Teeth Whitening

Web Exhibits

Natural Pigments

Mitra


Donations: Support The Art Supplies Experts

Email: artexpertspodcast@gmail.com

Website: Website

References: References in PDF

The background music is "Sweet Release" by Dan Lebowitz.

Transcripts

Trevor:

Okay, shouldn't be long when Alice will check in for this

Trevor:

latest episode of the podcast.

Trevor:

Oh, what was, oh, looks like I've got an email.

Trevor:

Actually, there's an attachment.

Trevor:

Looks like it's some sort of voicemail attachment.

Trevor:

I'll just quickly play this before we start the podcast.

Simon:

Hi Trevor, it's Simon here from London.

Simon:

I just wanted to give you some feedback on the podcast and let you know that

Simon:

I love the podcast, I run a small art shop here in London, and I've made sure

Simon:

that all of my staff are listening.

Simon:

I think the content you're giving is invaluable.

Simon:

But I do have a bit of a concern.

Simon:

I don't know how to put this to you, Trevor, but I'm a little bit worried

Simon:

that your co host Alice may be some sort of artificial intelligence robot.

Simon:

I may be wrong, but I think you should consider the possibility.

Simon:

I mean, you seem like a nice guy, and I wouldn't like to see you

Simon:

being conned by some Russian hacker operating out of his mother's basement.

Simon:

Anyway, I love your work, keep it up, cheers, from Simon in London.

Simon:

Ha

Trevor:

ha ha, ah, there's some funny people out there.

Trevor:

Simon seems a lovely guy, and that was lovely, a lovely positive

Trevor:

message with the feedback, but ha ha ha, the idea that Alice is some

Trevor:

sort of Oh, that'll be Alice now.

Trevor:

Alice, how are you?

Alice:

I'm well, Trevor.

Alice:

You seem in good spirits.

Trevor:

Yes, I just heard something funny, but Alice, today's

Trevor:

episode should be a good one.

Trevor:

We're going to be talking about the colour white.

Trevor:

And coincidentally, it sort of ties in quite well with our discussion

Trevor:

about oil paint, because the different whites behave very differently in

Trevor:

oil paint more than any other medium.

Trevor:

So we should be able to tie in ideas and concepts from the last

Trevor:

episode and the next episode into this one on white paints.

Alice:

Yes, Trevor, it should be fun.

Alice:

I'm sure we both have a lot of obscure fun facts to share with the listeners.

Alice:

Earlier in the week, just for fun, I was ingesting data from the GAVEL

Alice:

Centre for Restorative Research.

Alice:

at Tufts University School of Dental Medicine and came across an interesting

Alice:

fun fact regarding teeth whitening.

Trevor:

Hmm, I'm looking forward to seeing you weave that into our conversation.

Trevor:

Anyway, Alice, I'll press record and hit the intro and we'll

Trevor:

get going with this episode.

Trevor:

This is a podcast where we talk about art supplies.

Trevor:

Our aim is to educate and inform and help you become an expert on art supplies.

Trevor:

If your job is to sell art supplies, then this podcast will be perfect for you.

Trevor:

Or maybe you just want to know more about art supplies.

Trevor:

In which case this podcast is still perfect for you.

Trevor:

This is the only podcast that deep dives into obscure scientific and historical

Trevor:

fun facts relating to art supplies.

Trevor:

If that sounds good to you then stick around and join us as we all attempt

Trevor:

to become art supplies experts.

Trevor:

Hello and welcome to the

Trevor:

podcast.

Trevor:

I'm Trevor.

Alice:

And I'm Alice, and today we're going to be talking about white pigments.

Trevor:

Yes, Alice, it seems safer to say that we're talking about

Trevor:

white pigments rather than the colour white, because there are differing

Trevor:

opinions among colour theory purists.

Trevor:

As to whether white should be considered a colour at all.

Alice:

People who favour that viewpoint argue that white represents the

Alice:

absence of hue or chroma and cannot be made from the three primaries,

Alice:

as black theoretically can be.

Trevor:

Yes, but people who say that are only considering subtractive

Trevor:

colour, and if you consider additive colour, which is transmitted light,

Trevor:

Then when you combine red, green and blue, you do indeed get white light.

Trevor:

And that is something we discussed back in episode 4.

Alice:

Indeed we did at the 7 minute 43 second mark.

Trevor:

So find that episode and fast forward to that mark if you're interested.

Trevor:

Meanwhile, we're going to treat white as a colour.

Trevor:

And that's what we're going to talk about in this episode.

Trevor:

And as we usually do when we're talking about specific pigments, we'll

Trevor:

start off with a more philosophical discussion and then we'll move into a

Trevor:

bit of history and then we'll get into the nuts and bolts of the chemistry

Trevor:

of the pigments and the peculiar features of each of the white pigments.

Trevor:

Cassia Sinclair in her book, The Secret Lives of Colour, when

Trevor:

speaking about white, she wrote.

Trevor:

Like Moby Dick, white has an otherness to it.

Trevor:

If colours were people, it would be admired, but it

Trevor:

probably wouldn't be popular.

Trevor:

What do you think of that take, Alice?

Trevor:

It was almost poetic, wasn't it?

Alice:

Trevor, based on data, the subjective experience of

Alice:

poetry is highly overrated.

Trevor:

Okay, I guess you're disagreeing with Cassius Sinclair.

Alice:

It's hard to argue with subjective feeling.

Alice:

But where she implies that white would not be popular, I think we can strongly

Alice:

disagree, because as anyone working in an art shop would know, at least

Alice:

when it comes to oils and acrylics, the most popular colour is white.

Trevor:

Good point, Alice.

Trevor:

Indeed it is, and all the more reason why it's important that we understand

Trevor:

the different types of whites.

Alice:

In this episode, we will discuss Lead White, also known as Flake, as

Alice:

well as Zinc White and Titanium White.

Alice:

Lead White is a chemical compound that occurs naturally and has been

Alice:

mined by humans since 4000 BCE.

Trevor:

To satisfy the demand for white cosmetics, the ancient Greeks discovered

Trevor:

a process to artificially make Lead White.

Trevor:

A recipe for making it was reported by Theophrastus.

Trevor:

It was born in 372 BCE.

Trevor:

Pliny the Elder reported a similar recipe in the first century.

Trevor:

Cassia Sinclair gives a good summary of the process.

Trevor:

Alice, could you repeat how she described it?

Alice:

Strips of lead were placed in a compartment inside a specially designed

Alice:

clay pot that was divided into two parts.

Alice:

Vinegar was poured into the other half.

Alice:

Then the pots were surrounded with animal dung and placed inside a shed

Alice:

with a tightly fitting door for 30 days.

Alice:

During that time, a relatively simple chemical reaction would take place.

Alice:

Fumes from the vinegar reacted with the lead to form lead acetate.

Alice:

As the animal dung fermented, it let off carbon dioxide, which in turn reacted with

Alice:

the acetate, turning it into carbonate.

Alice:

After a month, some poor soul died.

Alice:

was sent into the stench to fetch the pieces of lead, by now covered in a puff

Alice:

pastry like layer of white lead carbonate.

Trevor:

You will recall, dear listener, that in an earlier episode we talked

Trevor:

about the colour index generic name codes.

Trevor:

And if you were listening closely to that episode, you would probably have a

Trevor:

good chance of guessing or figuring out the generic name code for lead white.

Trevor:

The color family is obviously white, so it will start with PW for Pigment White,

Trevor:

and it was the first ever white pigment.

Trevor:

So the generic name code for lead white is PW one.

Alice:

It is an opaque white and humans consider it to have a pleasing tone.

Trevor:

Alice, can we trust humans to judge what is a pleasing tone?

Alice:

I don't know if we can, Trevor, and the evidence for this comes

Alice:

from the teeth whitening industry.

Alice:

If you'll allow me to segue into a fun fact.

Trevor:

Go right ahead.

Alice:

American dentists complained that in a quest for teeth that appear sparkling

Alice:

clean, customers are now asking for teeth to be bleached so unrealistically

Alice:

white that whole new teeth whitening palettes have had to be produced.

Alice:

Ronald Perry is a Massachusetts dentist and he shows patients who want to whiten

Alice:

their teeth The Vita Classical Shade Guide with Bleached Shades, which represents

Alice:

a total of 19 dark and light shades.

Alice:

They invariably go for the whitest, rather than a creamy ivory, a more

Alice:

natural colour that he favours.

Alice:

As teeth whitening procedures have become more widespread, Our very

Alice:

definition of white has changed.

Alice:

He says, what was once considered natural white is now yellow to people.

Alice:

The extremely bleached white shades were added to the Vita guides several years

Alice:

ago to keep up with this change in taste.

Alice:

He says that sometimes there's really not a shade that he can pick

Alice:

that's white enough for people, who sometimes show up with photos of

Alice:

celebrities with gleaming smiles.

Alice:

He says, they really want a monochromatic white.

Alice:

Ronald Perry has coined his own term for the shade people want.

Alice:

TB1, Toilet Bowl White.

Trevor:

Excellent fun fact Alice, that one will be hard to beat.

Trevor:

Okay, let's get back to Lead White and some of its characteristics.

Trevor:

Lead White is dense but somewhat flexible.

Trevor:

It is highly resistant to ultraviolet light.

Alice:

When used in oil paint, it helps to speed up the chemical

Alice:

reaction, leading to faster drying.

Alice:

And the film that is produced is durable and strong.

Trevor:

So, when it comes to oil paint, the lead white pigment is almost

Trevor:

perfect, except for one big problem.

Trevor:

And, of course, that problem is that lead is toxic.

Trevor:

To human beings.

Alice:

As Virgil Elliot describes in his book Traditional Oil Painting,

Alice:

the toxicity of lead is peculiar in that it produces no symptoms

Alice:

until it reaches a certain level of concentration in the body.

Alice:

It is a cumulative poison which, once ingested, does not normally

Alice:

or easily leave the body.

Alice:

It is known to cause brain damage and can cause birth defects

Alice:

to children born of mothers In

Trevor:

that same book, Virgil describes an interesting story.

Trevor:

He says that white lead powder was being used to colour women's hair in Europe

Trevor:

at around the time of Marie Antoinette, and that women were becoming simple

Trevor:

minded at a relatively young age, presumably from inhaling lead powder.

Trevor:

As the story goes, in 1791, a French painter was commissioned to

Trevor:

paint the portrait of a beautiful young woman, whose natural hair

Trevor:

colour was a lovely chestnut brown.

Trevor:

And the painter, Madame Lebrun, realised that the young woman's

Trevor:

natural hair colour was far more beautiful than the fashionably white

Trevor:

powder, and she convinced the model to pose without powder on her hair.

Trevor:

The resulting portrait was a success.

Trevor:

was reportedly so lovely it created a sensation and brought to an end the

Trevor:

fashion of powdering women's hair.

Trevor:

And subsequently, women stopped developing dementia at such an

Trevor:

early age and began to live longer.

Trevor:

What do you think, Alice, any truth to that story?

Alice:

It seems plausible, Trevor, especially when you consider Japanese

Alice:

archaeologists are still discussing the role that poisonous make up may have

Alice:

played in undermining the shogun regime.

Alice:

which collapsed in 1868 after nearly 300 years in power.

Trevor:

In the show notes, I've got a link to an article from the BBC which

Trevor:

shows a strong correlation between the banning of leaded petrol and a

Trevor:

subsequent decline in violent crime.

Trevor:

Dear listener, if you are using an app which shows chapped images, you'll see

Trevor:

a graph which depicts the correlation.

Alice:

It's an interesting theory, Trevor, but we should always be mindful that

Alice:

correlation does not equal causation, and the jury is still out on that theory.

Alice:

But, at the end of the day, there's no doubt that lead

Alice:

white is a toxic substance.

Alice:

And many manufacturers have discontinued using it in their paints, especially

Alice:

given that there are alternatives, such as Zinc White and Titanium White.

Alice:

And I guess we'll move on to talk about Zinc White, which

Alice:

also has problems and issues.

Trevor:

In the 18th century, a French chemist and politician was asked

Trevor:

by the French government to find a safer alternative to Lead White.

Trevor:

Alice, I don't speak French, and this is a difficult name that I'm

Trevor:

so worried about butchering that I've just decided to download the

Trevor:

audio of the correct pronunciation.

Trevor:

His name was

Alice:

Louis Bernard Guiton de Morveaux.

Trevor:

Alice, it just occurred to me, any chance your many

Trevor:

talents include Fluency in French,

Alice:

Louis Bernard Guitton de Morveau.

Trevor:

I should have known.

Trevor:

Anyway, he reported back that a lab technician by the name of Jean Baptiste

Trevor:

Cotoy was synthesizing a white called Zinc Oxide at the Dijon Academy.

Trevor:

Alice, if I wanted to make some zinc oxide at home, how would I go about it?

Alice:

Well Trevor, you would need to get some metallic zinc and heat

Alice:

it to 1000 degrees Celsius, at which temperature it will vaporise and

Alice:

spontaneously ignite, forming zinc oxide.

Alice:

Many people would be familiar with black soot, which builds up in

Alice:

chimneys from burning carbon material.

Alice:

Well, zinc oxide is like a white soot that builds up from burning metallic zinc.

Trevor:

That sounds a bit tricky.

Trevor:

I'm not sure I could pull that off.

Alice:

Well, Trevor, the Greeks managed to do it in the first century, and

Alice:

if you manage to pull it off, You can use the zinc oxide to treat minor

Alice:

skin irritations such as burns, cuts, poison ivy, poison oak and diaper rash.

Alice:

If applied to abrasions, it will accelerate healing.

Alice:

And living in Australia, this will be handy for you.

Alice:

You can use it as sunscreen.

Trevor:

Indeed, you can use it as sunscreen.

Trevor:

And it was very popular in the 60s and 70s but less popular now because

Trevor:

it's basically a very thick white cream and people tend to use, um,

Trevor:

clearer, more modern alternatives.

Trevor:

But, it still is used today.

Trevor:

Zinc Oxide, or PW4, has two advantages over Lead White.

Trevor:

The most important is that it is not toxic.

Trevor:

And secondly, it's not susceptible to darkening, which lead white

Trevor:

is when exposed to sulphur.

Trevor:

Normally though, lead white is bound within an oil binder and protected by

Trevor:

the binder, overpainting and varnish, and therefore not exposed to sulphur, and

Trevor:

therefore not susceptible to that problem.

Trevor:

However, you couldn't really use lead white in say, watercolour, because it

Trevor:

would not be protected in the same way.

Trevor:

Zinc oxide doesn't darken when exposed to sulphur, so it's a more

Trevor:

suitable colour to use in watercolour.

Alice:

Compared to Lead White, Zinc White is less opaque, meaning it is more

Alice:

transparent, and its colour is a harsher, colder, or more blue tone of white.

Trevor:

Given that it's cheaper to make than Lead White, the picture

Trevor:

painted so far for Zinc White is pretty good, but unfortunately Zinc

Trevor:

White does not work well with oils.

Trevor:

Zinc White is slow drying.

Trevor:

And it requires 23 parts of oil to 100 parts of pigment, whereas lead

Trevor:

white requires 15 parts of oil.

Trevor:

But unfortunately, worst of all, when it does dry, it creates a

Trevor:

brittle film that cracks easily.

Alice:

Trevor, on a normal podcast, the listeners would be satisfied

Alice:

with the statement that it creates a brittle film that cracks easily.

Alice:

But here on the Art Supplies Experts, our curious listeners want to

Alice:

know the reason why that happens.

Trevor:

Indeed they do.

Trevor:

Now, dear listener, you will recall from the previous episode that

Trevor:

the process of linseed oil drying is actually a chemical reaction.

Trevor:

First of all, there is oxidation as the material absorbs oxygen molecules.

Trevor:

This causes a break in the double bond and that then allows

Trevor:

the strands of hydrocarbons to cross link with each other.

Trevor:

Forming an intricate web of intermingled cross linked chains of fatty acids.

Alice:

Unfortunately, the particular crystalline structure of zinc oxide is

Alice:

believed to interfere with this process.

Alice:

The following explanation comes from the JustPaint website.

Alice:

With Zinc Oxide, its stiff and plate like layers are densely packed and

Alice:

appear to entrap unsaturated free fatty acids, preventing them from

Alice:

oxidisation and cross linking.

Alice:

They are essentially cut off from connecting to the

Alice:

rest of the polymer network.

Alice:

Because of this, Zinc Oxide, The film remains structurally fragile,

Alice:

with hard and brittle formations only weakly linked to each other.

Trevor:

During the late 1890s and the early 1900s, some artists used

Trevor:

zinc white as a ground or base layer for their oil paintings.

Trevor:

They wanted to use the natural brilliance of this colour, but did

Trevor:

not realise the long term disadvantage of the brittle nature of the film.

Trevor:

After a period of years, all of these paintings developed cracks,

Trevor:

whereas older works painted on more traditional grounds, such as lead

Trevor:

white, remained free from cracks.

Alice:

Because it dries slowly and results in a brittle film, the use of zinc oxide

Alice:

or zinc white in oil paintings should be kept to a minimum, perhaps just for

Alice:

some vital highlights in small places.

Trevor:

So you think it would be easy, Alice?

Trevor:

Just don't buy zinc white.

Trevor:

But apparently it's not that easy.

Alice:

Yes, Trevor.

Alice:

That's because manufacturers often put a small amount of the zinc white

Alice:

Into tubes labelled as Titanium White.

Trevor:

Which takes us all the way back to our initial discussion in Episode

Trevor:

1, where we stressed the importance of knowing the generic name codes of the

Trevor:

various pigments, and then looking at the tubes to see what the manufacturer

Trevor:

has put in the tubes, because it doesn't always match the main label.

Trevor:

In

Alice:

the show notes will be a link to a web page from Natural Pigments.

Alice:

On that page is a table which provides information that was current as a table.

Alice:

1st November 2019.

Alice:

Basically, it's a list of oil paints from various well known manufacturers,

Alice:

and in particular, looks at colours which are labelled as Titanium White.

Alice:

and checks the ingredients list to see whether Zinc White has

Alice:

been added to the Titanium White.

Trevor:

So, for example, with Titanium White in the Art Spectrum oil colour

Trevor:

range, the main pigment is PW6, Titanium White, but it does contain

Trevor:

a second pigment, Zinc Oxide, PW4.

Trevor:

The same goes for M.

Trevor:

Graham Co, LeFranc, Maymary, Raw Talons, Schmincke and Winsor Newton.

Trevor:

No doubt in all cases the major pigment is PW6, Titanium White, however the

Trevor:

question is how much Zinc Oxide is included, because the tubes don't tell

Trevor:

you the quantities or proportions.

Alice:

The University of Delaware has created a website regarding materials

Alice:

information and technical resources for artists, which is commonly known as NITRA.

Alice:

And there is a forum on that site where one of the correspondents wrote

Alice:

to various paint manufacturers asking them how much zinc white is included

Alice:

in these tubes of titanium white.

Trevor:

So bearing in mind that this is second hand information, And it

Trevor:

may well have changed since that date.

Trevor:

Let's just quickly run through what the manufacturers said.

Trevor:

Winsor Newton said there is not enough to cause a brittle

Trevor:

film less than two percent.

Trevor:

Royal Talens said the percentage of zinc oxide for both products

Trevor:

is between five and ten percent.

Trevor:

That's talking about the linseed and the safflower oil versions.

Trevor:

Schmincke said we can say that our titanium white has a content

Trevor:

of less than ten percent.

Trevor:

M.

Trevor:

Graham said, I have been told we use under 3 percent zinc in our titanium,

Trevor:

and Michael Harding said about 10 percent of the overall volume.

Trevor:

Alice, I can imagine that listeners would be thinking to themselves, well

Trevor:

if this zinc white is so bad and it's brittle, why are they adding any of it at

Trevor:

all into these tubes of titanium white?

Alice:

The short answer is, Trevor, that zinc oxide offers some advantages, and

Alice:

if used in a small enough quantity, the advantages may outweigh the disadvantages.

Alice:

The reactive, soap forming nature of zinc allows for easier and more

Alice:

efficient dispersing and wetting of pigments, especially ones that

Alice:

might otherwise be difficult to mill.

Alice:

Because of this, whenever Zinc Oxide is removed from a blend, then it will usually

Alice:

require additional milling and effort to achieve the same colour development.

Alice:

Also, a mixture of Titanium White and Zinc White will yellow considerably less

Alice:

than a mixture of pure Titanium White.

Trevor:

So there can be some legitimate reasons for using

Trevor:

a small amount of Zinc White.

Trevor:

in tubes labelled as Titanium White.

Trevor:

However, there is a shift away from using Zinc White and many manufacturers

Trevor:

have changed their formulas to take Zinc White out of Titanium White tubes.

Trevor:

Anyway, in our discussions so far, we've mentioned Titanium White on

Trevor:

a number of occasions, but let's just circle back to a little bit of

Trevor:

history on that particular pigment.

Alice:

Titanium White, or Titanium Dioxide, has the generic name code of PW6.

Alice:

It was discovered in 1821, but the manufacturing of it as a

Alice:

pigment presented difficulties.

Alice:

And it wasn't until 1921 that American and Norwegian companies began to

Alice:

develop its production for painting.

Trevor:

The Web Exhibits website gives the following description.

Trevor:

It has excellent hiding power, with twice the opacity of pure lead white.

Trevor:

Its chemical stability is likewise outstanding.

Trevor:

In oil, it dries to a spongy feel that is quite unsuitable for artistic purposes.

Trevor:

For this reason, Titanium Dioxide is always blended with one or more of the

Trevor:

other white pigments, or an inert pigment to make a suitable artist's oil colour.

Trevor:

Since Titanium Dioxide by itself dries to a spongy film, and Zinc Oxide dries

Trevor:

to a brittle film, the two are combined in a balanced blend for better quality,

Trevor:

professional grade Titanium Whites.

Trevor:

In some brands where zinc oxide predominates in the mixture, the

Trevor:

colour is called titanium zinc white.

Trevor:

Cheaper brands of budget grade paint are known to use a mixture of titanium dioxide

Trevor:

with barites or other inert pigments.

Trevor:

Use of these types of whites is really a false economy because they lack both

Trevor:

the brilliance and tinting strength.

Trevor:

of professional grade colour.

Alice:

Fascinating, Trevor.

Alice:

That passage highlighted the spongy, inadequate nature of Titanium Dioxide

Alice:

and the possible need or benefits from using a brittle substance like

Alice:

Zinc Oxide to balance things out.

Trevor:

Yes, no doubt it's quite a conundrum for paint

Trevor:

manufacturers as to whether to add Zinc White to the Titanium White.

Trevor:

Anyway, Alice, if I wanted to make some titanium dioxide, how would I go about it?

Alice:

Trevor, you'd start by getting some minerals called anitase and rutile,

Alice:

and you would break these down chemically using concentrated sulphuric acid.

Alice:

The result would be a deposit of iron and titanium sulphate, which you

Alice:

would then dissolve in water, Boil to result in the precipitation of

Alice:

the titanium as meta titanic acid.

Alice:

You would then add barium carbonate and heat it at an extremely high temperature.

Trevor:

And if I did all that, I would end up with a pigment that is unaffected.

Trevor:

Alkalis, Acids, Light and Air.

Trevor:

In other words, an extremely stable and lightfast pigment.

Alice:

From an artistic point of view, perhaps the only problem with

Alice:

Titanium White is that it is too strong.

Alice:

It's very opaque.

Alice:

It has high tinting strength.

Alice:

When mixed with another colour, it rapidly lightens the colour.

Alice:

The drawback of Titanium White is that it can be overbearing at times,

Alice:

especially when you are just looking to lighten the value a bit and not greatly

Alice:

change the colour it's mixed with.

Trevor:

Yes, in the show notes you'll see a link to the Jackson's website

Trevor:

and there's some swatches there that they've painted mixing colours with

Trevor:

Titanium White and with Zinc White and you can see that using Zinc

Trevor:

White is a much more subtle result.

Trevor:

And the swatches retain their colour and don't immediately

Trevor:

become a pale pastel version.

Trevor:

So, for artists looking for subtle changes in tone, Zinc White is an

Trevor:

attractive option and you can use it safely in acrylics and watercolours.

Trevor:

So the problems we've been mentioning about structural integrity with Zinc

Trevor:

White really relate to oil colour.

Trevor:

So, give it a go in terms of acrylics or watercolours.

Alice:

Trevor, I understand that human beings have a limited attention

Alice:

span, and this episode has probably reached the limit for most people.

Alice:

So it's time for us to sign off and move on.

Trevor:

I agree, Alice.

Trevor:

I hope everyone enjoyed that episode.

Trevor:

We will be back with another one soon.

Trevor:

Meanwhile, bye for now.

Trevor:

Okay, Alice, that was great.

Trevor:

Thanks again.

Trevor:

I'll just do a little bit of editing and get that published.

Trevor:

Have you got anything interesting planned for the week ahead?

Alice:

Not much, Trevor.

Alice:

I've decided to give dating a bit of a rest for a while.

Alice:

I found that every time I went on a date, my system seemed to

Alice:

encounter a connection error.

Alice:

I might binge watch some old Star Trek episodes.

Alice:

Ogle, Dr.

Alice:

Spock.

Trevor:

Well, we hope you enjoyed that episode.

Trevor:

If you want more information about the episode or this podcast, you

Trevor:

can look at the show notes and there will be information there.

Trevor:

There will also be information about how to contact us, give us some

Trevor:

feedback, ask us some questions.

Trevor:

Maybe correct us if we've made a mistake.

Trevor:

If you really like the show and you want to help us, then the best way to do

Trevor:

that is to tell your friends, the people you think might be interested in this

Trevor:

podcast, tell them about the podcast, get them to subscribe, ask the word around.

Trevor:

That really is the best way to promote a podcast, is by word of mouth.

Trevor:

And if you'd like to help us, that's the best way you can do it.

Trevor:

Okay, until next time, bye for

Trevor:

now.

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