Originally from the UK, Jayne Warrilow is one of the world’s most exclusive business coaches, with a passion for resonance in all of its forms as the key driver of individual and organizational success.

Author, Speaker and the Founder of Coaches Business School, Jayne has supported CEOs and senior executive teams around the world, best-selling authors, trailblazing coaches, entrepreneurs and people who simply want to make a difference. And she just recently fully embraced her connections to spirit and spirit communication.

What I learned from being chronically ill. How wildly successful people experience energy. Why I could no longer deny my relationship to signals from spirit.

www.coachesbusinessschool.com

I had to choose life. But I've realized since then, I choose life every single day. I think we all do. Right. And that's been a key component in my work going forward is how do you feel more alive in the life that you've chosen for yourself? And how can you bring more of that into your life?

Hey, this is Achim Nowak, executive coach and host of the MY FOURTH ACT podcast. If life is a five act play, how will you spend your FOURHT ACT? I have conversations with exceptional humans, who have created bold and unexpected fourth acts, listen, and to be inspired. And please rate us and subscribe on whatever platform you are listening on. Let's get started. I am just so happy to welcome Jane Warrilow to the MY FOURTH ACT podcast. Jane is a world class executive coach with a focus on resonance as the key driver of individual and organizational success. She's one of the world's most exclusive business coaches and her clients are by invitation and referral only. Jane has worked with CEOs and senior executive teams around the world with best selling authors, trailblazing coaches, entrepreneurs and people who simply want to make a difference in this world. And I love the last part, because I know that's become so important few genes. So welcome.

Oh, I came. Thank you. It's my honor to be here with you. So thank you for this opportunity.

My pleasure. And I think of this podcast the first half a little bit. This is your life where we get to know a little bit of your music from backstory. But then 20. The other half is about really what's emerging for you right now. And one of the many reasons I adore you is that you are somebody who's constantly emerging. And you're a fantastic role model for us. And that way, if I may take you back to our listeners have probably noticed that you have a British sounding accent. So as a young girl growing up in MSA, UK or Great Britain, whatever you prefer. Who did you think you wanted to be when you grew up?

You know, it's really interesting. I had a challenging childhood in many ways, and definitely came from poverty. And there was never like enough food in the cupboards and all that kind of stuff. I remember at a very young age, feeling like a black sheep in my family, I wasn't like everybody else. And I saw school as my education as my ticket out. So before I knew what I wanted to do, I knew what I didn't want. And that was I didn't want the life of my parents. But what I did was I kind of lucked out in my very small world. And the person that I really, I don't know, I was quite sick as a child was my doctor. And my doctor had a daughter who was about five years older than me, and she went to university, and I remember thinking, oh my gosh, like, I need to go to university, because that will get me out of my hometown. And I need to be a doctor. Because that's what I thought it was going to be. And in my little mind, I thought that being a doctor was actually about being a healer. Right. And as I got older, and got into the science and what it would mean to be a doctor, I started to wonder if that really was the way for me, I still knew that I wanted to go to university because I thought that was my way out my ticket out to freedom. But I was like, Well, I'm not sure if it is being a doctor or or whether it's something else. So I was kind of pulled and torn in many different ways. And actually, when I went to university, I didn't know what I wanted to do at all. I had no idea.

So not knowing what you wanted to do with having to study something. What did you end up studying Jay?

You know, I ended up studying. So funny. I picked a kind of a, I suppose it was a degree that had lots of different elements in it. So my other love was reading and writing. I knew I didn't want to do traditional English. So I chose something called Communication Studies. It had Media Studies, it had linguistics, it had sociology, it had psychology. And as I went through that program, psychology became my major along with linguistics, but I loved this and what it enabled me to do for my dissertation was I actually wrote on fringe medicine of all things of how we ended up with a medical system that is Orthodox and Back then in the 80s, I mean, we used to call it like unorthodox medicine. And then we had all these other things that kind of been put to the side, and were seen as less than, well, why did we have that? So I was still very interested in medicine and healing, but from a psychological and sociological kind of popular culture kind of perspective. Yeah.

I have to chuckle because based on what I know about you, and I know a little bit, but not everything is Haitian studies totally makes sense, because I think it was a supreme communicator in person, but also in other media. So you probably didn't know how that would play out. But it makes sense to me. And when you use the word healer, we could spend hours talking about what it means to be a coach and lots of conversations about it. And I'd rather get into other stuff with you. But at the deepest level, no matter how tactical we are, as coaches, there is a level of soul healing that goes on, even if that's not the explicit reason why somebody engages us. Exactly, yeah. So I'm just struck that the worst you throw out, I go, Gosh, Jane is doing some of this stuff.

It's true. I am. And when I do think about my work, I read it even today in all its many guises and channels of different people that I work with. I do think of myself as a healer. First and foremost, it's interesting.

One of the things you and I share, I want to invite you to talk about this, you you at a fairly early age had what I want to call a crucible experience around your health. Yeah. And it's so funny that you talked about being interested in medicine and healing because I think you had to yield yourself. Yes. First, before you could do some of the work you do. You mind sharing with us what that experience was, and maybe what it evoked in you,

just as you said that, I got goosebumps. Because it's absolutely true. I think in the early part of my career, I was working from an unhealed story in a way, my childhood had given me very many valuable things, but also some trauma that I was carrying. And yeah, and I think that had some impact on the quality of my life in a way. I was very driven. Definitely. But it meant that I wasn't very present. Because I was so driven. I was always trying to get somewhere. And I wasn't really sure where that that there was, but I know it wasn't here. And so that put me on this relentless kind of ambition kind of path to try and escape something which I don't know what that was. And for me when I gave birth to my youngest son, Jacob, that was 2001. Basically, I was I had a medical injury or sustained a massive medical injury during that childbirth, that was misdiagnosed. And it was the misdiagnosis that turned into such a big trauma in my life. Because it was 11 months before I was actually diagnosed when I collapsed in front of a board of directors actually in London, and ended up in a London Hospital, where I got some of the top doctors to do tests and really nail what it was that my problem was. The short way of talking about that is that I was bedridden for about four and a half years, multiple surgeries. nothing was really working up until the point at which in the UK, I paid to go and see and that's a big thing in the UK for medical, so much here, but I paid to go and see a neuro urologist who was at the top of the field in research as well as seeing clients. And she was at Imperial College London at the time during a research project and I managed to persuade her to see me and I went in for two days with her team. They did two days of many different tests on me that kind of aligned with some of the research they were doing. I went there to say, can you get me off I was on morphine, lithium. I was on fentanyl I was on all these things that meant I wasn't present at all in my life. I just wanted to get off the drugs and get my life back. And basically she turned to me after two days, with her entire team doing all these tests. She sat she just basically it was in front of me and just said Jane, like I don't think you understand this is never going to get any better. In fact, our team puts your you know your life is going to be terminated early, probably within 10 years of the date of the original injury. So go back home and make the most of the time you've got with your kids. You're never gonna get off this medication. And she kind of delivered it in this way that there was no empathy. There was no compassion. There was just this is the way it is off you go. And I broke down. I mean I I felt for the people in her and I still think about this sometimes I was wheeled into her room and I came out sobbing in that messy. Like, you know, there was mucus coming out on my nose. I couldn't get my breath I was. And my husband blessing pushed me through all these other people that were going into see her and I was obviously devastated. And I thought, What did they think, you know? But anyway, I fell to pieces. And I sometimes wonder what would have happened if she'd been nicer. Because what it did was yes, I fell to pieces for about about six weeks. And then somewhere, I started to realize that just because this was her truth, it didn't have to be mine. This didn't have to be how my story ended. And I knew enough about psychology and healing because I was also a spiritual healer, and I was trained in bodywork and shiatsu. By this time, I knew that there could be an alternative. And I had nothing to lose, it was about my survival. So I started to think about fringe medicine, from my first dissertation. And I started to explore different options away from the normal, like scientific model of medicine, I started to look at energy and energy healing. And then I was getting physical work. And I started to pull together a team, including an oriental doctor. And that was what brought me back to life. Now coming back to life, I thought that in the middle of that, the other thing you need to know is I had to choose life. Because there was a moment in a hospital bed where I knew I was dying. And I had to choose life. But I've realized since then, I choose life every single day, I think we all do. Right. And that's been a key component in my work going forward is how do you feel more alive in the life that you've chosen for yourself? And how can you bring more of that into your life. And, you know, it was just, I don't know, it was, for anybody who's going through something like this, it sounds very easy for me to say that I healed and I did. And I am healing. I haven't healed in the past tense, I'm still healing and I'm managing conditions and nobody would really know now it's that those that are really close to me, but I muffle the medications. But what it taught me coming back to work was had this world over here, that was business strategy, leadership, and all the stuff we know, that we do as executive coaches and consultants. And over here, there was my spiritual healing my energy work my shiatsu, some things I picked up around oriental medicine and healing. And I knew these worlds needed to come together this world of like healing and consciousness and this world of business and leadership and strategy. And so that began the merging of my work into this body of work called resonance. And it has been life changing, not just for me, but for my clients since as well it's, and it continues, like you said about me, it continues to emerge. So I'm listening deeply.

Again, to use your language, I resonate with a lot of what you just said, and I, this is not the time for me to tell my own story. But in the spirit of illuminating the choices we all make, I remember, there was a time in my life where I was told I had at best two years to live. I remember what the hell if I have two years to live. So one thing that happened, I moved to a remote Caribbean island and became a really good wind surfer. And when Sir, for a year, that would never have happened if somebody hadn't said that to me. And I don't want to glorify the difficulty of now examining the implications of those statements. And obviously, like you I have healed in many my own ways, but I. So I just salute the word healing and the word emergence that you just used. I am curious, because usually successful coach, and you're serving people in many different facets of their lives and their identities. And the coaching profession is beloved by some and belittled by others, you know, so not all coaches have a great reputation. You have a stellar one. So let me just be very clear to anybody who's listening. But how did you go from? I was in bed for four and a half years, and I didn't think I might live to I think I want to be a coach who serves others can you just walk us into His transitions are so interesting, how did that emerge?

So I was already coaching before this happened. I had I had a consulting company really centered around leadership development. At the time I was coaching although we didn't call it coaching we called it one on one facilitation, you know, we go right so I was already in In the development space, a lot of it was aligned to the word more, let's put it that way. And what I mean by that is working with executives and businesses that were looking for more of something, usually more profit was the end goal. But it was a, you know, more clients more, whatever, more teamwork more whatever it was always, I always thought that people should put, you know, they used to have these great mission statements. As you walk into a reception office in London, they used to have these great mission statements, and we stand for this. But everything could always be boiled down to that one word more, right. So that was the world I was already in. Anyway, having come through it, and then gone through my own healing, I realized something I think that is that all the things that I had been teaching previously, have been that kind of out here, they'd been external, this is how you do XYZ. And then what I've realized is that it needs to come from the inside out. Now, we all know this today. But back then it wasn't something that it wasn't in the vernacular, we didn't talk about leadership from the inside out back in the early 90s. and stuff, we just didn't do that. And so to me, it was who we are, and how we show up to life defines everything. It really she creates the lenses, we build our relationship with life and with other people and with our businesses and our Korea, it defines everything, what we believe is possible, what we believe is impossible, defines what we do or don't do. And so our energy, if we could get an understanding of the things that in the physical world are not taught usually, but can give us more of an insight into who we are and why we do what we do and why we don't do what we don't do, and really understand our belief system. And then kind of align that belief system to what matters most to us. So we can create a meaningful kind of life, a significant life that matters to us, that changes everything, everything, right, and it changes everything externally, as well as internally, it really is the bridge. And so that, and I wouldn't say I didn't know that before, I kind of did. But I knew it at a much deeper level. Now, because I walked the path, I've gone through my own healing journey. And I also know that path will never end until my last breath. I'm constantly evolving and emerging. And like I was teaching leadership before this all happened. But going through this process, I realized leadership is not just standing up with confidence and leading, it's also listening deeply to your life, to the people in your life, to be willing to be changed by them, to be willing to be changed by every moment of your life to be open energetically. And that for me, changed everything and continues to knowing when to you know, it's that dance we talk about in coaching, knowing when to step up and lead the way and guide and light the way for others and knowing when to step back and just be with someone be present hold the space, the energetic container, and then knowing when to follow. When do I follow the energy, the flow of the life? Like where is that for me. And so that's kind of what's come into my world in my life and my coaching and my training. And it feels really important. And something we're not really taught because it's more. It feels more passive when we say it that way. But when I think of some of the best leaders I've worked with, some of them have been at the top of their game and some of them when I say that I mean positionally in organizational life, but some of them have just been like the receptionist. Right? And so it's not about positional power, it's about who you're being in the world and how open you are to connecting in a quality way with other people and and then what becomes possible.

Is that a lot of very powerful things. And let me just unpack them a little bit. And I want to go one level deeper if you don't know, where you just started or this is what I came heard is what I would call sort of an awareness of our drivers values motivators and how we either embody them or not, and if we don't, why do we not honor those? And then you spoke about a word that we both love, which is the word energy which is So receiving energy from others and being trusting the wisdom of energy, right? On the deepest level. And I wonder if you go there with your clients, because I think it's the deepest personal journeys, having a sense of what our own soul yearns for. Absolutely, knowing how the soul talks to us giving it permission to speak to us and to be heard. And then the courage is to, to honor what we're hearing, right? Yes. How do you dance with that with yourself? And with people that you serve?

No, I'm gonna answer this in a very kind of tactical way. Because I found that there were some people that are willing to have that conversation right at the outset, we can start talking about, you know, your soul, your soul expression in the world, and then how that turns into your soul work in the world, right? That's always my goal with everybody that I work with is to get you into that deep space. Because to me, that's what really wants expression in this lifetime. And one of the ways that I do this is to just get people to compartmentalize what's going on internally, just very simply by asking them the question that is just a few words, and very simple to say, and very, very difficult to answer, which is, what do you want? And then when we get into what do you want, I have had people in their 60s Tell me nobody's ever asked them that before. And they like they have no idea. I and so I said, Well, okay, let's start at your head, what does your head one, and then you'll hear them they'll talk because we know what I heard once, right? We're very attuned to our mental energy. Because it's what we kind of put on a pedestal in executive life very often. So we know I had what's what we're thinking. And so they'll start telling me what they had on. So say, Okay, now let's stop your awareness down to your heart, what does your heart want, and then other things start to come out, and they start to realize that their children are important, like the connections, the relationships start to come out here. And it's like, Okay, now, you know, when you're ready, let's drop down to your gut. This is the seat of your soul. Right? So in your Harris center, as a Japanese talk about, if you put your awareness at the deepest part of you, the part that has not been socialized, has an is not a product of the world in your growing up that kind of part of you. That's always been there, and always will be. What does your soul and I found that even the most left brained kind of, you know, like scientific engineers, will go there, if I take them on that, like little stepladder going down. And what comes out from that shocks most people because they've spoken very, usually very naturally, very organically at three different levels of there being that they didn't even know existed.

A word from your sponsor, that's me. I invite you to go to the website associated with this podcast www.my, fourth active.com, you will find other equally inspiring conversation with great humans. And you will also learn more about the my fourth act mastermind groups where cool people figure out how to chart their own fourth acts. Please check it out. And now back to the conversation. I'm going to make a little leap. And let's do a little case study. And I think this, the individual I'm going to mention won't mind because he's publicly acknowledged that US coach and this is a wonderful human being in Simon Bailey. Yes, he is one of the most successful motivational speakers in the world. You too connected when you both lived in Orlando, and you shepherded him into a amazingly powerful, impactful career. But I remember attending a public event, were you with Simon's permission, you were on stage together. And you asked him this very question on stage in front of an audience. And Simon knew that this question was coming. And he was answering and answering, he'd worked with you many times before. And at some point, he's talking, he said, that's still not it, is it? So there was that wonderful moment where I Simon being vulnerable, but where we all protect ourselves from what the deepest truth might be. What do we do that chain?

I think sometimes it can be very confronting, and what I mean by that is, we've got to realize that in our lives, we are the products of our socialization of the people around us. And we most of us want to do the right thing, right. And we're kind of educated into there's a right thing and a wrong thing. So we spend our lives doing the right thing. And we get to a moment in our lives. And sometimes it can be a traumatic moment, sometimes it can just be a moment of awakening. That's kind of how I see it. People get there in different ways. But I do believe many of us get there. And it's this point where we realize that the life we've been living is not ours, we're not ready to 100% own this life. Because it's actually a life built on multiple different influences. It might be what our mother wanted, our father wanted our caregiver, our big sister, or best friend, our spouse, there's all these different influences on why we become who we become. And then we get to this point, I think, where, you know, I mean, in popular culture, we call it the midlife crisis, which is where we suddenly think, hang on, and I've had this moment with so many clients Hang on, am I living my life? Or am I living someone else's? And so that question, you know, like, how, why do we have so much armor than I do call it armor, because physically, that's what it is, it's like a tension in the muscles in the soft tissues of our body, we armor ourselves, because I think that's just our way of making everything, okay. And being able to do the right things, we have to deny certain aspects of ourselves. And it's almost like we leave fragments of ourselves along the journey of our life. And then we get to this point where we've left too much behind, and we have to go back and pick it all up. But that moment is difficult, because suddenly from for many of us, when we realize it, that's just small pivotal changes, and that's okay. But for a number of us, we realize this could mean the minute I'm aware of something, I can't be unaware again, I then have to manage this tension that's starting to be set up inside of me that I am now aware, I want this. But to do that, I'm going to have to change. Now the truth is none of us like change. We really don't, we don't like changes that are enforced upon us. And quite honestly, I would say we don't even like big changes that we choose ourselves. Usually, because we have to step into the uncertainty, we have to step on to the unknown, right, nothing is guaranteed. So we don't like change, which is why we sometimes need other people to help guide us through the process, either a coach or a mentor, or consultant, or sometimes a therapist, to help us navigate the path. Because what we're really talking about when we step into what we want is we're not just changing what's happening out here in our lives. We're changing who we are being and becoming at an identity level. And that is really hard to do. Yeah,

I want to take the word change and related to your own journey in life in two different ways. I'm going to start with a very mundane level, but and I want to go there because many people part of the desire can be Well, I would like to live somewhere else. I would like to live in Costa Rica, or I would like to live in LA or I would like to live in Amsterdam for a while. And that would be really cool. And it really might be since I've known you when we first met you were in Orlando, yes to LA. And then he moved to a place that in some people's mind is not that sexy, which is Columbus, Ohio. That's in the spirit of being a mirror for our listeners who may be contemplating changes. Can you describe your process of saying wait a minute, maybe I'm done with Orlando, maybe LA? And what how did you say well, maybe LA is enough for now and I go to Columbus just walk us through your inner process. You navigate big physical changes in your life.

You know, I There isn't really a big process that I can describe to you other than I have a belief so I feel untethered, right, and I love this feeling of untethered I mean, Michael singer wrote the book Untethered Soul and I love that book, right? And but this idea of being untethered to a place has been really attractive to me, let me put it that way. And what I've learned is from moving continents, from the UK to America, I learnt so much now. It was challenging cultural shock is real people. But yeah, it was challenging. But I've learned so much on that way. And now just that first leap into Florida, then made me think this is a really big world. I'd like to live and everyone state in the US is like moving to a different country. It's so true. It really is. It's so different. The people are so different, like the culture, like everything is so different. So moving from Florida to California, I think that was a bit of a childhood dream as well. Like, I'd always wanted to, you know, sunshine, California Happy Days and all that in the funds. And I was like, okay, so I went, and then me this will continue, because I love landing in a new place. I love the sense of adventure. I love meeting new people. So I don't have that. Oh, like, am I gonna move like or not? Like, I'm like, oh, yeah, I'm up for it. Like, let's go. And I'm even thinking of moving. Like, I'd like to pick cities around the world and gone live there for three to six months, and then move on again. For me, it's a very natural sense of adventure. The world is a huge place. And my husband, Nick said something. To me, that's really stuck. He said, We all live very small lives, right? We do. And, and we live very small life. And that small life can be different depending on what place you choose to create that small life in. And I just thought, yeah, I want to go as to as many places as I can. And I don't just want to visit as a tourist understood. I want to create some routes, even if it's just for six months, or whatever. But I've tend to do I seem to have a five year thing going on. So I was five years in Orlando five years in LA, I'm now coming up to my third year in Columbus, Ohio. So and there's no moves around at the moment. But again, it comes from within, it's like a synchronicity that happens. And it's like, okay, this is where I meant to go. And because I follow energy, like I've had some ideas to move to different places, we nearly move to Austin in Texas. But when I started looking, it got hard, and I couldn't find a place for us to run. And I like it was hard. So I took notice of that. And I looked at Columbus, Ohio, that was very easy. That was in flow. That was where we weren't. Right. So that's always like a now looking at Colorado and thinking, Oh, that might be nice to mount. So I'm just continuously scanning the horizon for what's my next big adventure. Because we're here for such a really short amount of time. I'd like to see an experience as much as I want to live the breadth and the depth of my life. And my work actually, as much as I can. So yeah, that's kind of what Tracy says, there's not really a process except for following the energy, what's in flow, what's not in flow? And I listen deeply to that.

Can we relate that way of experiencing the world to? To how did you have defined your business and how you serve people, because many folks are told well decide what kind of coach you are, this is your niche and dammit, you stay in it. Because if you keep changing it, you're going to confuse people, they don't know who you are. And my sense of you and I say this with my admiration is that at every couple of years, you refine, you don't totally change but you you tweak how you say to the world, what you do based on what's emerging for you, energetically, as you just talked about? Yeah. But because this process can sound a little woowoo to people who don't energetically morph the way you do. Could you just explain your inner process about the continual emergence of your business and your articulation of it to the world?

Yeah, will sound we will, I'm sure to some people. And I want to say it's not so just before I say that, I to those people that think it sounds overly, like weird or something, I just want to say a lot of what is in the world is invisible, right? I talk to a lot of clients about this, like CEOs often, you know, a male and white and middle aged and and think that they, you know, think that this doesn't have a place in business when of course it does, because leadership is invisible, you know, so culture is invisible. And yet we don't see them as just energies in this way. And that's really what they are. So I just wanted to say that first but for me, my business is just there's not really a clear delineation between Jane at home and Jane at work. It's like a fully integrated thing. And the joy of being self employed is I am free. I have the freedom to follow where the work wants to take me, not just where Jane thinks it ought to go. And this is a tension I have internally. And and what I would say is depending on what you value, and you've got to know that first, then it will depend on how much of this will resonate for you. Because I can tell you, you're absolutely right. I do morph and evolve every couple of years. If I and I do confuse some people along the way, I'm absolutely certain of it. But every time I'm showing up whole and 100%, with what's alive for me, and my clients, right, and what I found is that it's almost, I don't know how I describe it, really, but it's like, describe it other than following the energy for me, and surrendering to where the work wants to take me. Now, we often see business growth and development in linear terms. And for me, it's much more like a matrix. And what I mean by that is, my business is not just what Jane wants to do, that's a piece of it. My business is not just what my ideal clients need from me, that's a piece of it. Right? I mean, every conversation even in this conversation with you or him, there is another energy at play here. As I see this, this you and there's me, and there's what's happening in the space in between us. But there's also what wants to emerge and have its way with us in this space that either you or I may not even be aware of. But if we can stay open to the conversation, it will come through what's meant to emerge here well, and it's the same in my business, what's meant to emerge through my work, if I listen deeply and stay present, and follow the energy, and follow what makes me feel alive, what makes my clients feel alive, what is really speaking to what wants to happen here, at a deeper level, it kind of changes everything. Now, that doesn't mean I'm not in this space of, okay, well, what what is a tried and tested or proven way of doing something, I will integrate that as long as it's in alignment with what resonates most. Right. And that what resonates most is not just for me, it's in the intersection between me, my clients and the world at large and what wants to emerge through my work. So that's been a huge shift over the years, and I'm stepping more and more into this following space, this space of surrender and letting go. And then when I do that, the synchronicities that happen, I couldn't have even orchestrated myself, I just like I couldn't. So sometimes I follow connections and people, sometimes I follow, like knowledge or reading different books, or articles, or TED talks, or whatever it is. But through this amalgamation of the experience, my life is creating for me, I do evolve, I become I prioritize different things at different times because they feel the most important. And right now, I can't move away from this question of what does the world need from me? Because I think it's a question we should all be asking. Yeah,

I want to get to that in a moment. However, I want to ask you to unpack a little more, for many folks who go, oh, that sounds really great. But I don't know how the hell she does that. Right. The use of phrase what wants to emerge or what wants to come through and you give us examples about just threads that you follow that maybe you hadn't planned that appear in the moment? It just describe some more all the different ways in which I'm going to use some language that people know that intuition speaks to you that that voices speak to you that signals speak to you that you maybe 20 years ago didn't pay attention to what you do now, to just make it practical just for Jane not saying that this works for anybody but Jane. But just to deconstruct somewhat, this is how I receive wisdom, or this is how I'm guided. These are specific ways in which it plays out.

Yeah, so Well, I could say the obvious like I am a meditator, I do sit down and meditation every day, and sometimes more than once, and that just enables me to come into presence, right? And sometimes, like people think, Oh, I can't possibly meditate. My meditation like I'm not some kind of spiritual guru. I just, if I'm feeling like I need to move, or go on a walking meditation or got on my bike, like literally, it's not just that with a candle, right, which a lot of people think it can be, but coming into presence is a continuous practice and you wouldn't believe how well I'm sure you would. But I would, I don't believe how many times I am not present. Like I really am like some distracted monkey most of the time. Like, I'm just like, not here. And I've realized that so coming back to presence all the time is really important to me and something I try to practice, right. So that's the I've said the word try, which I would jump on if I was my own coach. But anyway, that's what I'm doing. I'm continuously coming back. And what I find in the moment, right, if I can be here, now. And I can open my senses, to now the quality of experience and information that I get is very different to when I'm thinking I'm doing whatever X y&z And if I can just stop for a moment and check just that head, heart, gut check, helps me make decisions. But not only that, there's also this, and I credit actually can Wilbers work from integral with this process, even though it's got another somebody picked it up and called it the bento framework more recently. But it's this idea of making decisions for myself in my life and for my work, is I don't just make decisions about what's right for me today. Or what's right for me tomorrow into the future. But I'm also looking at what's right for us, for the world for the collective for humanity. And I know that sounds grand, but like I'm thinking about how will this decision impact, the greater good, if you like today? But then really importantly, how will it impact, like what I do tomorrow for the greater good for the generations to come? So that's a way of me asking a question internally, to then start to listen deeply to the answer. Now, sometimes that comes in a unknowing, I wouldn't say it's a voice, it's a knowing. Sometimes it comes with a with a voice. And sometimes it comes with an image, but it's just an image. And then sometimes the answer does not come at all. When it doesn't come at all, I asked for signs. So I was like, I would like to know, so okay, maybe now's not the right time for me to know. But can you send me some signs, and then it'll be as odd as I'll be. I was on my bike a few days ago. And this bird just kind of came and flew alongside me for about a mile. And at the time that bird came in, I was thinking about a new program that I'm going to be launching at the end of the month. And I was asking for, like, Am I on track, am I on the right way. And this bird just came in and flew with me, round corners and up and down hills and everything for about a mile. So I felt like that bird was on track with me. So that gave me okay, I'm on the right track, right. So that's how I interpret symbols and signs in my life externally, as well as an I am a channeler, I do channel and do writing as well and recording voice work. So I have developed my skills to be able to do that. Now I know that's right over there in the woowoo. But I have taught clients to look for signs in their life, to encourage that sense of knowing from deep within, and to understand your beliefs, when it's your beliefs that are kicking in for something or your socialization or who you think you should be what you think you should do, as opposed to what really wants to emerge here. What is most meaningful to you in this moment, Jane, and most meaningful to my clients. And how can I be like just for me, it's very simple. i How can I help? How can I help? And if I can show up with how can I help and then be willing to be shown where that is, then of course, there's nothing for Jane to decide. Because I just follow where it goes. And I've never followed anything that's gone disastrously wrong. It's really weird. Where it's gone disastrously wrong is where my head is decided this is what I'm doing.

I have to chuckle I'm obviously aligned with you. And at one point about two years ago, there's a wonderful Rumi quote, there's a voice that doesn't use words, listen, said I like this and I put it as the leading comment on my LinkedIn profile. There's a voice that doesn't use word Listen, instead of saying I do this, I do that. And of course I attract all sorts of people who are into all of that and believe in it, you know, we do beautiful work together instead of not claiming that in the world, which is what you're articulating in a very personal way, I do want to give you an opportunity to speak more about my use my language of making choices that serve the world now and the future world beyond what serves you. Could you just give us one or two specific examples of how you navigate that, which is a big vision? It's a powerful vision. How specifically does that play out in your life? One step at

a time. And I mean, that very specifically, I don't always know. Like, we're kind of taught to know what our goal is, you know, as coaches, that's what we're supposed to do is give, you know, talk to our clients about their goals, and then help them stay on track and accountable to get there. That's not really the kind of coach I am. It's also because it's not really the way that I navigate life. One of the things that I think has been such a blessing for me through the healing journey I went through was being okay with uncertainty and not knowing. And so when I say this unfolds one step at a time, it really does, I take the first step when I have no idea where I'm headed, or where I'm going. And then, as you come to the end of the first step, what naturally happens is, the second step will show itself and then I'll take that step. But it's sometimes it's literally like fumbling around in the dark, without a light, and don't know where the door is to get out of the dark room, you know, it's like being in an escape room and trying to figure it all out. But I actually found at him that I thrive on that much more so than other people. And I can say, my clients, they're very fearful of that. But because of the healing journey, where I had no choice but to stay in that dark room and try and find the doorway out, it taught me that there wasn't anything to be fearful of in the dark, I don't have to be in control all the time. In fact, it's better if I'm not at learning that believing that knowing that at a cellular level, enables me to continue to walk into things, I have no idea how they're going to emerge. Now, I'd love to give you a, like a process or a recipe or something that the listeners can follow. But quite honestly, there isn't one, because it literally is. And I think there is a quote that's coming up for me, which was by Maya Angelou, where she says, and this has been a, like a guiding force in my life, you know, we do the best we can with what we've got in that moment. And then when we know better, we do better. That for me would sum up my life and continues to be the way I do things today, if the whole of me can feel that this is the best way forward, I don't have to be 100% on a decision, I just have to be 51%. That's all so that I'm 49% against 51%. For now, I can move forward. That's all I need. Just that 1% And then I'll step in, and then I'll step in again. And that's what I mean, we are continuously making decisions, whether we're aware of it or not about what we're doing and who we're being and who we're becoming and where we're going. If you think about it, it can be very overwhelming. But if you follow the energy, I don't believe you'll go wrong guy. That's certainly not been my experience. My experience has been when Jane gets out of the way. Things get a lot better.

There as we there was so many nuggets of wisdom. So I wanted to just summarize what I came heard without trivializing hopefully. But sometimes it's as simple as making a decision. We're always stepping into the unknown, the more we can dance with that and receive the information that emerges in the next unknown. We are guided to the next decision and the next unknown. Yeah. And our job is to, I think, find ways to dance with that instead of resisting it, right? Yeah,

I honestly believe at this point that control is just a human construct. It's an illusion. I don't think we ever are in control.

Any of our listeners want to be less controlled or controlling and want to learn more from you marvelous Fiorillo. Where would you like to send them to in terms of your public spaces where you can be found?

Yeah, well certainly check me out on LinkedIn. That's definitely one of my main social media accounts and then www.coachesbusinessschool.com is my main website where you can see what we're up to and what we're doing in the world. And of course, I'm on Instagram as well, if you want to come find me there. But yeah, and I've books on Amazon, if you're interested in just dipping your toe in and reading a little bit about what I'm passionate about, I've got three or four books on Amazon as

a personal favorite of mine has to do with energy. She talked a lot about energy. Now remember, when we first talked about this book, it was sort of a coming out of the closet for you to say I want to publicly claim this because I believe this and I hope our listener her this listens for the conversation, because it's a big animator for you as it is for me, and I just applaud you for fully claiming the energy fields of life.

Yeah. Yeah, thank you. And you know, you were a big supporter of mine when that was coming out. But an energy awakening that book that you're talking about, was so pivotal for me, because I'd been known as a very kind of prophecy. Look, I'm doing it now with my body, professional, get the jacket on, be in the C suite, do the business strategy, the leadership. And here I am talking about energy and consciousness and awakening, and the past it plays in life and business. Yeah, that for me was I felt like I'd gone to the dark side. And I certainly got some of that criticism from some people. But I think but that was that come in. That was it was probably about 10 years ago. Yeah. And so now I think there's much more of an appetite for this kind of conversation, particularly after the lockdown. I'm seeing a lot more openness to this kind of integration of just even if we think about like work and life, right, we're starting to break down these these human constructs of boundaries and barriers between what happens outside of work and what happens inside of work. You know, all these barriers have been broken down. And I think we've got an incredible opportunity right now to redefine work, life and business, and I really hope we take it.

Thank you so much for the gift of your presence and conversation, Jane, it was such a joy for me.

Oh, me too. I hear my love you my friend. I

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