What does it take to believe in yourself when you’ve grown up feeling like the problem?

For Corrie Mustafa, a small sense of purpose began in the 24-hour gym opposite his temporary accommodation. Boxing brought routine, friendship and people who wanted him to do well.

In this episode of The Lonely Chapter, Corrie joins Sam Maclean to reflect on growing up with ADHD, autism and Tourette’s, his experience of emotional neglect, and the loneliness of feeling misunderstood. We talk about how childhood experiences shape self-worth and relationships, finding belonging through boxing, and dealing with setbacks when you’ve put everything into something.

Corrie also shares what supporting other people now means to him, how his partner has helped him understand himself, and why having direction doesn’t mean the difficult days have disappeared.

Follow Corrie on Instagram (@coza_boxing) and LinkedIn.

Read Between the Chapters on Substack for my reflections on the ideas and stories from the podcast.

If someone came to mind while listening, send them this episode.

Follow The Lonely Chapter wherever you listen for more conversations about the chapters that change us.

What was life like when you started going to the gym opposite your temporary accommodation?

I'd say release would be the main word I use for it.

So it was more before that it was get up, find a way to occupy the day.

You're in a. I was in a temporary accommodation, which I believe is small, in a prison cell.

And it's one of those ones where it's like you don't want to just sit still because if you're sitting still, your mind's obviously playing with itself, whatever.

And it's.

As soon as I started going to that gym, it was a, it was a direction I was starting to do at the end of the day.

So my sleeping schedule was non existent.

I would have been waking up like 1 2pm, then I'd be going gym from like 11.

I didn't want to be around people.

So I would go from 11 onwards, be there to 3, 4am it was, I found a small bit of purpose and I found a good outlet and it was one of them things where like, it was a joy, but I'd say life was more, I would say tolerable, but it was more, it was.

I realized there was more stuff to be doing other than just sitting there and playing an Xbox.

So you pass out or sitting there and battling with yourself.

Do you know what I mean?

Yeah.

One of them ones.

What was the road to ending up in the temporary accommodation?

Should we go all the way back?

Should we go?

That's it.

All right, so obviously I'll go.

I'm going to go from the middle part because we'll probably go on some more stuff later.

Anything after that, it's still.

When you start realizing how people are.

It wasn't very knowledgeable on how big the autistic spectrum was, how certain levels of ADHD affect people.

And like when you say Tourette's to people, people think you're screaming at words.

Mine's motor.

Do you know what I mean?

So there's, there's a lot of stuff that I didn't have any idea about having it myself.

And then obviously people who don't have it had no idea about either.

So like growing up was difficult.

Obviously I was medicated.

I, my, I was, I was raised with my grandma for a good first portion of my life and obviously My mum was a young mum, so obviously going through all that.

We start.

I stopped seeing my grandma and all that.

My dad.

I don't want to get too much with my dad.

My dad was.

My dad's a Turkish man from East London.

Anyone can watch this, can put the two and two together.

But obviously I still speak to my dad now and now.

But it's like my upbringing wasn't.

It was stable, but my mom's first child and mom definitely had no idea about what I had wrong with me.

And obviously the solution to certain people would be medication.

I feel that medication nullified my understanding and ability to understand things.

So it kind of suppressed a lot of emotions and a lot of thought processes.

So as we're going through with that, growing up, I've obviously had problems at home.

I don't want to say neglect, I'd say emotional neglect, not whether direct or not.

It's kind of made me into one of those people that, like, I didn't do anything wrong in a sense of drugs, gang relation, anything like that.

I did nothing wrong as a child.

I was.

Don't even say a naughty kid.

I was a bit of a troubled kid in the house, not outside the house.

Obviously.

Kids make mistakes that you have to find out mistakes to do what you're doing.

And yeah, we go from all that bit of a bad home life, to be honest, through whoever's fault and go into supporting livings and those supported living systems I'm on.

If I'm honest with you, I'd say from the first one to the last one, every sport worker told me, why are you here?

Why are you in this?

Why are you in this place?

You shouldn't be in these places.

I.

On paper, yeah, disabled.

I've got autism, ADHD and Tourette's.

I'm classed as disabled and odd, which obviously obsessional defiance or you grow out of.

I feel after like the age of 16, I'm screwed on paper, but talking to me, no one will ever see that because I feel I have.

I don't know what it is in my Asperger's.

It's a superpower and I don't feel like it actually affects me the way it affects a lot of people.

Like, for me, when I was in these places, it was very isolating.

Yeah, great.

I'm now, what, 17, 18.

I've got.

Wow.

I've got my own place.

You don't because you've got support workers roaming around.

You don't because you're in a place where you can't actually get on with your life.

You can't go to work because the way it works is these places, like £3,000amonth care costs.

This, that I had no idea about anything to do.

Responsibility of money.

Because one was my appointee back then.

And it's like, that's an environment.

Realistically, if you're not actually like incapable, I'm saying something actually incapable of doing day to day things.

It will drive you crazy.

Like I've got people with like severe autism who like escape next door and they're running away, like, and I'm just sitting there playing my computer.

Do you know what I mean?

Yeah.

Okay.

And it's like from those environments, I got removed from the first one because I didn't like the landlord.

I think he was a bit of a bully.

So people with the suits, I don't mind whoever, whoever.

But we're, I'm coming in and I'm realizing people, I'm talking to people and they're getting very like scared when the guy comes around.

Like, they're disabled kids.

I get if you're running it as a business because we, we all know a lot of people do run care companies as business, but not with people like that.

Not people who are actually vulnerable.

It's, it's not nice.

Yeah.

So I had arguments with him.

Whatever.

It got to the, it got to where they were looking for any reason to get me out of there.

Realistically, me being me.

They said about, oh, you have to sign people in to have friends over me.

I had a three bedroom house to myself.

I'm not going.

My first inclination isn't when it's separate to the building, by the way.

It's let me go into the office at one in the morning and sign the thing.

Like I, I've got my first place.

I have no sense of response, responsibility or anything.

I'm just like, oh, come in here, my friends.

There's a pub across the road.

I'm meeting my friends, whatever.

And he got to the point then where it was like, he's looking for any reason because it's paperwork, I smoke outside.

And because I'm not dirty, I wouldn't throw my cigarette butts down.

So I bought a mug inside as an ashtray, whatever, whatever.

And it's, oh, you've been smoking inside.

Cool.

Got the eviction notice just as I was about to start doing something.

So I was doing laboring for Boris Construction, which is a big company in St. Albans.

And it was, it was one of those, like, wow, I'm gonna do something in my life.

I just finished working at home based part time, which I did from 16 and they shut down and it was like, I need something new to do.

So in that, in that process I was trying to do stuff.

But the way life is is when you start leveling up on things, stuff from before is gonna bite you in your ass.

So me having people over, me not signing people in, which is my fault, to be honest.

It's not, it's not no one else's fault.

Bit me back and it got me kicked out of that place.

We fast forward to Watford.

I'm in another supported living.

This one's a little bit more severe.

Not severe in a sense of like if you looked at it from the outside, but from what I've said, I've got a schizophrenic above my head who is scratching the floors now.

I don't know what he had upstairs.

I swear he had a generator in his room because it was bad, but like he was nuts.

Like he'd stand at the end of my window but it wasn't scary.

He just got a lot of problems.

And me being me, like I'm what, 21, 22 at this point?

I was in that spot living the previous one for like three years.

Yeah, 21, 22, man, I'm in this little, little light.

I say it's not really a bedsip, it's like a self complained flat and this guy's just at the end of my window staring at me.

It's not nice that you come outside and he's like talking to himself, which.

Everyone has disabilities, everyone has their own issues, I can understand that.

But being young and still being on the medication, I wasn't looking at it as this is really wrong.

I should not be here.

What does it feel like for you to be in situations like that when people are saying to you like, why are you here?

Because obviously you're functioning.

I'm battling the clarity because imagine this.

Imagine like, ok, you're blind on this side, but there's someone waving you from that side.

You can't see it.

And I feel like the medication for me didn't.

As soon as I stopped taking it or inconsist taking it, I started getting things a lot more.

And that scared me a bit because I never understood that stuff.

So when something new is coming across and I'm there, like, this is why I've reacted to this in this way.

It's like, okay, it was scary.

It was very scary because I'm like, why have I been put here?

I get.

I was put there because obviously I was upsetting my household.

I'm gonna say quotes on that because I wasn't upset in the family balance.

I love my brothers, love my stepdad.

My mum said I don't love my mom.

My mom was.

There's a lot of issues that have stemmed from our relationship with my mum.

She's helped me a lot.

Fair enough.

She's supported me admin wise.

But until I met my partner, I didn't realize the difference between a PA and emotional love.

Yeah, I didn't get emotional love.

Yeah, I got it from a young age.

I didn't get it after that and I feel that was my issue.

Like with these medications, you need someone next to you explaining to you what is actually happening.

Because when you're blind to certain things, do you get reminded then you still keep that level of like, understanding.

But I didn't have that.

So my mom put me in supporting livings, which isn't nice.

And it was the last one.

And the last one is.

It was daunting.

It was really daunting.

Like, I'm sitting there smoking 30 cigarettes a day, bro.

Like sitting there just chuffing, chopping.

And then I've got no money because I'm like, I'm doing this and that, I'm not working.

And it's just a constant, same cycle, same cycle.

And I start streaming, I get obsessed with streaming.

And it's just.

I look for anything to be obsessed with, whether it be people.

Like, it's just.

It was a negative environment for someone who was more able.

And I thought it was very like.

What's the word?

Not.

Not backwards, but unproductive in a sense, if you're putting someone somewhere to try and help them.

But in fact it's just doing worse.

Yeah, it's hampering your potential.

To answer your question.

Well, I felt isolated, bro, because I was.

They were understanding that, but they weren't there every day.

Like, support workers are a.

There's a big thing about.

Some support workers actually care and some supporters don't care.

And there was a few of them that actually they had themselves in tears over the way I was treated because they're like, what do you mean?

Like, you can't do this with him.

But this is what they say we have to do.

Like, I had some good relationships with some people.

There were some great.

There were some great people I met that actually, that really educated me in a sense of like, on what.

How life actually is.

Like sat Me down when this is how you deal with this, how you do with that.

I never got that.

Yeah.

And I feel them situate them places ain't very supportive in a sense of productivity.

I mean like moving forward.

I wouldn't say rehabilitation not present but you know what I mean?

Yeah, yeah.

Along those lines I feel they're very stagnant and it's very much monetary.

It's not, is it like they provide you a space to live, they look after you in that sense.

But they don't necessarily.

There's nothing else.

Their next step forward and support.

Live is meant to be a thing where it's like you move on to either semi independent or independent living.

I ended up having to do extremes to do this.

So my thing was I got to the point now where the meds.

When I bear in mind when I didn't take these medications my tongue would swell up to the point where I could not speak properly.

That was my.

That was my side effect because I was on that medication for so long.

A different medication like it really would have a negative effect for a good period of time.

But then going through all this and I'm honest with you mate, I had moments there where I tried to self section myself.

I had moments where I self harmed.

I had like not severely but myself hump isn't cutting nothing.

It was more blunt.

Yeah.

But I had moments where it was like I was drinking, I was smoking, I was smoking weed and it's just like I was with the wrong crowd.

I was going out doing stupid stuff.

I'd have little pipe, I'd have people over like it was negative, negative things.

And I feel like to me looking back on it, I'm glad I've done all that because at this age now I'm a dorm room for instance, I don't go, I don't enjoy going out drinking, I don't enjoy going out smoke.

I don't enjoy any of this stuff.

For me it's unproductive.

Yeah.

And those experiences I feel definitely played a big part into me sitting here today.

But all that stuff had to happen.

Looking back, there were so many things that could have been avoided.

There were so many things and it's like that's where I thought I was severely depressed.

Yeah, it was.

I felt McBR I had no purpose.

How do you feel now about those things that you feel that could have been avoided?

I said I'm happy they happened because if they can happen to me and my mind is as strong and I'm still sitting here with you today where there's been moments where I couldn't be here, there's moments where I nearly jumped off the train tracks.

I feel that happened and that gave me.

I wouldn't say stripes, but it gave me my stripes to be able to do this stuff and have a voice.

Because for someone in the river who hasn't gone through stuff, it's very hard for you to actually speak from a perspective of someone who's been through it.

It's like.

It's like having a general who's never been on the ground.

It don't work like that unless you actually understand what you're trying, what you're ordering.

Ordering what you're trying to.

What's the word?

We're trying to like, give to people.

Yeah.

You're not going to get the correct audience.

Like me, for instance, when I talk about this stuff, I've done it so long, it may sound a bit droney, but it's the same thing.

I say it from the same place with the same heart.

I. I aim to try and help people that.

That didn't have help.

So I. I basically want to be someone I wish I had.

So if.

If I was online or I was somewhere and I looked at, wow, look at what this guy's doing.

I'm going through.

Even though everyone's gonna have the exact same.

Because no one's situation the same.

They can look at him and be like, I've got.

He's going through.

Look at him.

Like, that's why I come back from losing.

If I would have lost my toe for those two matches.

That's why I come back from depression.

That's why I come back from everything.

And all this, all this stuff I've.

Been through, it's so important for people to have role models.

I think, like, it's a beacon, bro.

Yeah.

Yeah.

I think in this world, a lot of people are told what's wrong with them or told where they're going wrong.

To try and nullify the problem, not actually fix the root cause.

And it's not a positive impact.

So that positive voice, being a beacon is really, really good.

Exactly.

How's your.

How's life changed for you over the last few years in terms of.

There seems to have been a lot more awareness around neurodiversity.

Would you say that I actually want to ask somebody who's actually on seen, do you.

Would you say it's changed in the last few years, like heavy, like in a sense?

Because I. I thought for me, because I started doing This I thought, obviously the stuff I'm being shown is more relative to that.

Is it actually, like, really increased in.

Terms of, like, people speaking about it, is what I mean.

Like, I see more people trying to help people understand what different neurodiversities are like.

For me, personally, my girlfriend's dyslexic, okay?

And up until meeting her seven years ago, I didn't.

I.

Everyone knows the word dyslexic.

I didn't understand it.

And she showed me this video on YouTube and it was like all these letters were, like, spinning out and magnifying and jumping and swipping.

And she was like, that's what I see.

Every time I sit down and try and read, that's what I see.

And just that, like, opened my eyes.

I feel that's the way it needs to be.

Like an actual visual or, like, way to.

Problem with people is.

Yeah, I understand autism.

Explain.

Do you know what I mean?

Like, no.

Everyone can say they understand things, but actually, as you said, it's the key.

So for me, I'd say to people, they say about like, my Tourette's, my twitches, they say, oh, why'd you do it?

I say, okay, put your arm in an uncomfortable position.

Okay?

I said, if you're a little tiny, like that burn, move your arm out.

That's what it feels like when I twitch.

It's that release.

But my.

Instead of it being in the front of my brain, it's in the back of my head.

But that's definitely that.

It's good.

People are speaking about it.

But I do feel when people speak about stuff, as anything in life, people take the piss and people want to start monetizing off this.

Yeah.

Like, for me, and I've said it so many times, I don't care about money, bro.

Especially when it comes to this game.

I don't care about money.

I don't care about any of it.

When I say about people coming to my fight.

So it's more.

The more people I come to my fights, the higher the promoter values that.

This is general.

Not much my promoter, but the more voice you get.

And that's how it works.

Do you know what I mean?

But I forgot to say earlier, you said about the.

What got to that point.

So I met someone with bpd, and obviously bpd.

I don't know.

I haven't got it myself.

Bpd, Borderline Personality Disorder.

So it's one of them things that comes off severe trauma.

People go either one or two ways.

They've got bipolar, borderline personality disorder.

And BPD is scary.

It is a scary thing to be around.

And it's I in my back then it was like, oh, I'm with someone, they've got their own place so I'm gonna be there a lot.

So I'm there a lot.

And then I stopped taking my medication and I think that was the turning point which was when I stopped taking the meds.

I had the three, four week period of my tongue swelling up.

Me being completely lethargic, like really, really fatigued.

Like the medication was serious medication, bro.

It's, it's, it's heavy.

I've been taking it for so long.

And that's when things started me and more clarifying.

Yeah.

What changed for you coming off?

Are you medicated?

I've been on medication Since.

Am I 27 now?

Four years?

Five years?

Three or four years.

Three or four years.

And if I'm honest, I feel like I've started my life.

Yeah, it sounds crazy, but I don't feel like my, I look at my life back then as like a blur.

I feel like I've just come off it and now I actually, I have Clary.

And it's really, really interesting for me as a person to look at it.

But like I look at pictures and video me before I'm like, what the hell was I doing?

Not even because it's negative.

Just because like I looked so different.

I act so different.

Like my eating was, I was skinny as hell.

Everything was so negative.

But everything was basically in a bubble.

But a negative bub.

The whole thing was a bubble.

Stop taking their meds.

Pop.

The bubble popped.

And I've gone out into the world.

I've got my responsibilities, I've understood.

I, I, I can filter people.

Cuz one thing as well in these situations I was very difficult.

A lot of people with neur big neurodiversity issues don't understand.

People are a big factor around us.

Our environment's a big thing.

So I will always be with the wrong people.

I have a friend called Jordan.

He's been one of my best friends since Saint Albans.

And he's always been real with me.

He's one of them friends where you're doing something incorrectly, he will, he will tell you to do something correctly.

Not because he's trying to harm you, because his only way of explaining that to you because he cares is upfront.

And it took me until like the last two, three years to actually understand Everything he told me was correct.

Everything he told me was correct.

But back then, because I was medicating and because I'd be real, I entrusted in my mom's opinion on 90 of the stuff that I was dealing with, whether it was right or wrong.

But in the time it, it would have been right.

But now I could see it was wrong because it was keeping me in that bubble, which, fair enough.

I'm not sure she wants to keep me safe.

That's on if that's her thing, that's up to her.

But didn't need that.

I needed to be out.

I needed to get out of the bubble.

But it took me till now.

And then Jonah's lied to me.

You've really fixed up.

And for someone who I actually idolized back then, because that was my older friend, that's someone who I was my closest people.

And it was like for me to be that.

Now he's like, yeah, bro, I'm really proud of you.

He's doing.

He's doing his weight loss journey.

Like he's smashing it.

And it's just like, wow, it took this long for me to get to this point.

But as I keep saying, you people want to dwell on the past and have traumas and stuff, which is fair enough, but use them positively.

Look at me for it.

I've got a lot, a lot of stuff I've been through and I've seen a lot of bad and I've been around a lot of bad people and I've been around myself in really bad times where I don't want to be here.

That support of living in in Watford was probably the worst part of it.

I'm sitting there hearing this guy screaming and I'm just staring at a wall, bro.

It's depressing.

Like trying to self section I have no idea what section it was about then, but I was trying to self section myself because I felt that bad.

Like I got to where I kept feeling pressure in my head.

It's obviously phantom pain, bro.

It's not real.

But I'm just think I have no way.

And the only way I could probably describe it and say about neurodiversity.

I feel like with us there's a lot of things where we have like a barrier in.

In the middle of our head, in the back of.

It's all these traumas, all these emotions.

But the only thing that gets through is the emotion.

We don't understand what is telling us why we.

What's wrong with sense of that?

You know what I'm Saying.

And it's like one of the things where it's like the moment I stop taking those meds, I'm not, not condoning everyone stop taking medication isn't outcry, stop taking meds.

It's for me personally, in my experience, the moment I stopped taking those meds that the, the dam broke and everything flooded.

So I went for a big phase of being angry, being really depressed, being in on myself.

It's been horrible to then start into tick off boxes of what these things have made me feel.

Do you know what I mean?

Yeah.

And it's like I, I'm.

Yeah.

People call me delusional sometimes, but everything I've been through, I always.

Anything, I'll explain it positively.

Anything that's such a, that's a superpower in itself though, because like this Show, I've done 120 episodes now and I've spoken to so many people who've been through really horrific stuff.

And what always amazes me is the way that you can turn stuff into positives.

Resilience and like, stuff's never nice.

When you're going through stuff, there's obviously.

Is there joy and suffering.

Can I make one point on that as well?

Yeah.

When we go through stuff as well, it's really weird, but we don't see it for what it is.

Yeah.

So if you told me one thing you've been through.

I told you one thing I've been through.

I'm going to be horrified at yours, you'll be horrified at mine.

But when we talk about our own thing, we talk about it naturally.

Do you know what I mean?

Do you have that with other people where you've seen the way they talk about it sometimes is they've come to terms of it, but back then they're complacent with what's happening because that's survival.

Yeah.

Well, yeah.

I don't actually know if you know, I'm.

I work as a firefighter full time.

I can tell the Bill brother.

There's quite a few things that like obviously we see that if I told someone who maybe isn't in the job would be like, how'd you deal with that?

You desensitized to a point.

But you are desensitized to a point.

Exactly.

That's the same with our own, with our own things we go through like.

And the common thing that we do when we're going through something is we always go, yeah, but someone else has had it worse.

Or we start comparing ourselves externally, which is bad.

Exactly.

We're not them.

I could tell with me and you, it's very much.

We have that resilience in our brains where we've.

We've either seen or been through stuff where it's like it's chipped and chipped away to the point where the core is left.

And that.

That's kind of impenetrable, bro.

When you get to that point and you've been through, you've gone down, down, down, drowning as much as you can.

The moment you breathe again, you ain't going back down because you know your body subcon.

A lot of things are subconscious.

I feel like a lot of our stuff, our survival methods are subconscious.

And I feel like because we've been to that.

I've been to that bottom.

You've probably been to that bottom.

We understand our body knows we're never going back there.

So, yeah, we could feel sad for a brief period of time, but the next day we're okay because we've.

We have been through worse.

Not someone else.

We have been through worse.

And I feel that's many people's issue.

They want to deflect the actual issue itself, like, and not speak about it.

Speaking about it doesn't always mean speaking to other people.

Yes, that is the main point of what we do.

I feel like we want people to speak out to other people.

But what about when everyone.

People like us?

What about if people were like, I can speak about it internally and then I could speak to other people?

And it's the same thing.

You balance it.

Because, yeah, you can go out and talk to other people.

But I've noticed on some podcasts I've been on, I've gone home and I feel like, bro, I feel horrible because I'm not realizing that I've just basically been to therapy.

Like, I've basically just given out all the stuff that's in the back of my head and just flowed with it, but I haven't actually comprehended what I've just said.

Yeah, but then I go home when it's like, my partner will probably agree with us.

There's moments that you're right.

I don't know that I feel the release of it, but I don't feel the release of it.

I feel sad and I get the emotion.

But that's what I'm saying about that.

Damn.

Is slowly letting stuff out.

That's why I feel like I'm stable now.

I've done all these podcasts I've been on, and I feel rather than going to therapy, this was My therapy?

Yeah.

And it's, it's, it's enlightening.

But a lot of people, like, oh, I couldn't do it because there's cameras I couldn't do because this.

But.

But forget them.

You're talking to someone.

That's all it is.

I feel you need to speak, whether it be in a studio, whether it be to a counselor.

Speak, man.

And the moment you speak about stuff, trust me, that that was going to break in your head and you're going to start feeling better.

Yeah.

And when we say therapy, we always think, like, sitting down and talking to someone.

But like, you.

For you, boxing, I assume that's a.

That's a form of therapy for you.

Tell me a bit about the boxing.

How did that first come into your life?

So we went from the ymca, which has the gym across the road, and there was a boxing bag in this gym.

So obviously there was not going to mention names because obviously.

But the guy, it was a guy who lived just below in the ymca.

Bear in mind, you know what YMCA is, man.

There's a lot of people, ex prison, ex this and that, drug addicts, people, schizophrenia, whatever.

And it's like, I'm very friendly.

I'm friendly with everyone when it comes to.

Especially that in their environments.

So I made friends with people and, like, it was good.

And I started going to this gym and then there was one guy.

Mate, this guy was on everything.

Yeah.

Other than heroin and crack, I think this guy was a Xanax, Benzema, anything he could get his hands on just to nullify himself.

Used to carry a knife down his thing, like, anything.

And it's like, he'd be outside late, so I'd be going to the gym late and he'd be like, see me.

You're right, mate.

Yeah, you're right.

We started talking, constantly talking.

Every time I went past, and he's like, oh, where are you going?

I'm going to the gym.

I went to the gym.

The gym is literally down this little dirt track.

Oh, you might as well come one day, man.

I'm like, bro, it makes me feel better.

He started coming with me and then he started going more than me.

And then he got to that point where it was.

I was like, oh, how you feeling?

He's like, mate, I haven't done coke for two days.

Like, I'm still smoking weed, but that's my reward after.

I'm like, wow.

Like, I have just.

You got.

It sounds mad.

Yeah, you've got to some look at it from a selfish point.

Of view.

That's how our brains work.

When we're in the lowest point.

Our brains try to take anything to try and be like we're doing something.

Yeah.

And get that like dopamine.

And so I said, I've just.

I've just helped this guy.

Now this guy's helping me because he's going more than me and I want to be competitive.

So we're going to the gym and he's sending me videos in the gym up there.

He's like, I'm missing you, mate.

Where you at?

And I clock like.

He started being more positive.

So that kind of proved to me that it's possible to do it.

And I started going gym and I've started to meet people in this gym because there's people with the same problems as me to a point, man.

They don't want to be around everyday people.

They're going there late and like.

And my friend Mickey, who I went college with, was slowly just.

I saw he's done the boxing, obviously.

I don't know why I qualified a few years ago before that.

It was really good.

Mickey done it as well.

Me and Mickey staying in quite in good contact.

Bearing in mind I don't smoke anymore.

Mickey was the first person I smoked with.

It's one of those things where it's like as mad as it sounds like Mickey was, Mickey's a good friend and he still is a good friend.

Mickey's got a lot of stuff going on, which.

Fair enough, man.

But I do a lot of Mickey, man.

But he explained his all this stuff to me, but before I say it, anyway, sorry.

So Mickey was like doing the boxing.

He had a fight coming up.

I saw it on Instagram.

So I was like, wow.

I imagine I'll do that one day.

Let me start in this boxing bag.

Hit this boxing bag.

And it got to the point where that now become my addiction.

I wanted to get just outlet because I wasn't angry to my knowledge in the front of my head, but in the back of my head.

I mean, I was raging.

I was such an angry person.

Like, subconsciously I'd rather be angry with other people.

It'd be towards myself.

So I sat rather than being like, all right in my head and it's not nice.

And it's like that gave me that rhythm and that outlet where I'm like, wow.

And there was other guys coming in the gym who were like hitting the bag.

And they see me hitting the bag.

Hitting the bag in the commercial.

Gym is.

It's a bit mad.

Because I was in a boxer back then and it's just like, I'm hitting the bag of people.

Like, look at you like this.

I'm like, yeah, like, yeah, this is sick.

Kept doing it.

I don't go home for Christmas.

I never really.

I don't get on my family parama, which, whatever, but I don't get on with it and I'd rather it that way.

I don't talk to my mom anymore, obviously, but it's one of them things where it's like, back then, I didn't go over Christmas, so it got to the point now where it's Christmas day at one in the morning, I'm in the gym, hitting the bag.

Next day in the gym, hitting the bag, lifting weights.

I wanted to be confident in myself.

And I won't say body confidence in a way that, oh, I don't look good.

I'm not as big as you, bro, but you know what I'm saying, It's the thing where it's like confident in my head.

Yeah.

I don't care about superficial.

For me, it was like, because I was skinny, bro, you put your whole hand around my arms and my legs.

I was skinny.

That's because of the medication.

It messed up my metabolism to the point where it was bad.

So hitting the bag, hitting the bag.

And I saw Mickey, I was like, mickey, how'd you do this?

Me being me, uneducated.

I thought boxing was a thing where you go into a gym, a coach is going to see you and be like, wow, you're going to be a world champion.

Let's go.

That's not how it works.

You've got to graft yourself.

And it's one of those things where Mickey explained it all to me.

Took me to an amateur boxing club and I had my first bout before I was still in the ymca.

I had when I was in the ymca.

No, this was just as I was leaving.

So I was in there for a good six, seven or six, seven, eight months.

Yeah.

And I got my flat really fast.

Support workers are brilliant down there, by the way.

I've got to give a shout out to them because they go for a lot of stuff and they have to be mum and dad to everyone in there, no matter what the age.

There were some amazing people in there and they don't get paid enough, bro.

The stuff they go through, they do not get paid enough.

The abuse they have to endure.

But honestly, that place was a big turning factor.

But.

But from the gym, hitting the gym, hitting the gym and then I start, I keep the membership.

But then Mickey was telling me about West Arts abc, which is an amateur boxing club in Watford, Right.

And to go to a boxing gym, it's big for me because I used to go to a little MMA gym and all that, which was okay, but I never had directional attended classes properly.

So I'm training with Mickey now and I've got this.

And then he's sending me, oh, you can get these unlicensed fights.

So I've gone on to Instagram, signed up, whatever.

Nobody knows who I am because who am I, bro?

I'm a random geezer from Watford with autism and HD and Tourette's who's now boxing.

Cool.

I got mashed up against this geezer.

And this geezer is mahusive, bruv.

He's got a lot of.

He's built like a.

Like a brick house mate.

And I'm just okay.

But which I'm training with Mick and I'm realizing this is amazing.

Like, I never really had the family.

I had the family, but I wasn't welcome in the family through faults of my own or whatever.

Doesn't matter.

My belief is before the age of 18, any actions you do that are not illegal, that's household, bro.

And that should not be given to you in a sense where it's like, you are the problem.

Why am I the problem?

Media teach me correctly.

That's how it works.

Whether I'm rebellious or not, I'm a kid and now I'm gonna get too much in.

But I've got a relative now who's going through a bit of stuff.

And it's like, because she's a kid.

I understand it now because I went through not the same stuff, but I went through that level of people not understanding that I am a kid.

Yeah.

Do you understand?

Like, my household was a place, it was a bad place.

And that was because of.

Not towards everyone else.

That was because of me or towards me.

It was either because of me or towards me.

There was not in between.

And it's like, I feel mum resented me because of my father.

My father was a bad person.

My father now has had a stroke, as bad as it sounds.

And I've said this to him.

I love my dad.

But karma is a real thing.

When you do bad things in life.

Karma gets you back.

And that is a key point to be like, look what happened to you.

Do you know what I mean?

So this, My mom resented me because obviously I'm my dad's son.

And obviously, yeah, my stepdad gave me a lot.

He gave me everything.

I'm not his kid.

Respect.

I went see my dad again because that's, that's my blood.

Whether or not I know it or not.

I'm young.

I'm still going to want to see my dad because my dad then opens up to my nene, my grandma, my granddad, who if I'm honest with you, are more parents than my dad and my mom, my grandma and my granddad are my parents, bro.

Yeah.

And.

Yeah.

So that all happened.

And what level of family did that.

Gym give you that you.

That's what I was about to say.

So I, I feel like you see that with firefighting, for instance.

I don't know what you've been for.

I haven't had a proper conversation in that sense.

But I feel like, you know, when people lack certain things, same direction, environments are the key.

So it gave me that level of brotherhood and it gave me a level of belonging rather than joining the army which most people solution would be.

It was like, wow, these guys are doing the same direct.

Wow, these guys actually want me to do good because when I'm working with them, we're working with me.

Like it's that level of belonging.

Yeah.

And it was like, it was very new to me, but I was working, I was hot, I was working hard and then, yeah, it was great.

I was doing two days a week there.

It was great.

I really enjoyed it.

And I feel like that gave me my, my family fix and then it gave me my outlet and then it gave me my, my something to look forward to and then it gave me, gave me a good level of everything.

But I still was uneducated in how boxing worked and how everything worked.

So I was very hard on myself.

I'm one of those people in life and I've had this conversation with my friend Jordan and I feel it's a really good insight to have.

I'm never going to be content.

I'm never.

I'm always going to be looking to do something different.

Not in a way that's productive.

It's really, really sad.

But I'm never going to be content.

I'm never going to want to sit still.

But I'll be honest with you, I. I will win a world championship one day and I will still not be content because that's how my brain works.

My brain has always been repressed for so long.

It's got so much making up to do.

I can sit there and I've got my own flat.

I'm not going to take.

I want to be on a big house one day.

I don't drive it.

I want to get a nice car.

Do you know, I mean, it's the only things I can achieve something.

I'm never going to be content with it.

I'm going to be happy in the moment.

I'm not going to be content because my brain always wants to do more.

Do you think you are able to allow yourself to enjoy getting that?

The goal?

I think that's something people really struggle with is like, they get to a goal that they've been fighting for for ages and then immediately it's onto the next thing.

That's how it works for me.

Yeah.

And my partner would definitely agree on that because she does all my stuff for me on that front.

But it's like, I don't think the end goal is the rewards.

I think getting in the process is the reward.

Because in the process, you build so much internally that that's how it.

Having an end goal is great.

My end goal this year was to win on Fight Zoomy, which was my last fight.

I won in 40 seconds.

Do you know what I mean?

That was great.

But it didn't hit me till after.

That's the thing where I win a fight.

I'll be happy.

Happy.

And I got cry when I go home because I'm like, wow, you actually did it.

And my brain tells me, like, wow, like, well done.

And for me, for my brain to give me that affirmation, yeah, it's bigger than most things.

But, yeah, that.

That boxing gym gave me a very big base layer of what I do today.

And I feel I lost that first fight, mate.

I had no idea about boxing.

I had no idea how to box.

I was in there rocking my hands back and forth, but I rocked him.

I rocked him a good few times and I lost off points.

And even he said to me, I'm not gonna say too much.

He was like, mate, that was a really good fight.

And for someone who's had three or four bouts and that was my first bout, I'd done really well.

And obviously, big shout out to Ilgi, who was my first coach.

She took me on two days, two weeks notice.

I had no coach, bro, because I didn't have money to do one to ones.

I wasn't working really much.

She took me on.

I'm still in contact with her today.

She's a good friend of mine.

Two weeks notice took me on and she gave me.

She's a.

She's crazy enough.

She is now the number Two, the second only professional cut woman in the uk and she is doing some really big things with Turkey.

She's Turkish.

Yeah.

It's one of those things where there's a lot of.

There's a lot of things going to come from this, but it'll be an amazing person.

She really, really helped me out.

She provided, I think, that level of direction and training.

Yeah.

That I need to do today.

Yeah, but we've set you on that path from the side.

Exactly.

Giving me a bit of insight into actually how it works.

And to be honest with you, minus my partner, there's not many people in this world I actually trust in a sense of like, boxing wise, that they're not trying to monetize me.

Right.

And I trust her.

I trust her so much because I know for a fact she actually cares.

She doesn't.

She gained nothing off those fights.

I lost my first fight, but she's still there.

Do you know?

I mean, what, what does.

What has boxing changed in your life outside of the ring, outside of the gym?

Everything.

I feel like I've started my life again.

I feel now I'm.

I've trained in jab boxing, which is the one that's all Pappy training for the Toby Tony Ferguson fight.

It's an amazing gym.

It changed everything, bro.

So I had those.

I had that loss, which was experience.

Had my second loss in November that year and that one I should have won because the guy wasn't as good as me.

But my.

My mental broke and I feel this is a key point if things happen for a reason.

The first one was lack of experience, so I had to train more directional and harder.

The second one, my mum was there, my dad was behind.

I didn't want my dad to come.

Not because anyone's come from market saying it, if your dad's coming, I'm not coming, bro.

I don't care.

About as it sounds, looking back on it, it's stupid.

The arena's over a thousand people, dude.

Are we really going to move that petty.

Whatever you've been through is your thing.

But then you can't.

I can't excuse that because I've been through stuff and I don't expect people to make excuses for it.

So it's a thing where it's like, I saw my dad behind my mum as I got in the ring, right.

And bearing in mind I've lost last time, so my brain's a bit.

I've looked at him.

I'm sorry, mate, I lost that fight, stupidly.

I didn't get hurt, but I didn't box properly.

Do you know what I mean?

Did that affect your mind in the fight?

Were you Sort of.

My brain went left.

I had nothing.

My brain fried itself.

I was just going off reaction and muscle memory.

I didn't have much because I was only training for like four months, five months.

But I went to war with myself, bro, after that fight.

And I feel that this is.

This is the positive thing of things happen for a reason.

If I didn't lose those two fights, I probably wouldn't be boxing still.

I probably won two fights.

I'm like, yes, this is great.

Yeah, my outlet's great, but I wouldn't have the same care as I do now.

Me losing those fights was a key factor where we say about positive to negative to positive, I'm happy I did because it shows people come out from a loss.

Luckily I got keys to jab, which big up Josh for that.

It was really nice of him to let me do that till 4am, bro.

And I'm training.

I'm going to war with myself.

I'm crying.

I'm literally crying.

I'm sitting around crying.

I'm in all my.

It's one of their places, you know, like proving grounds within your own head.

And I feel like it's one of those things where I let everything out.

I was training, training, training, training.

And like, I was getting a bit of coaching now and again and it was.

It was great.

And then from November up until February, went to war myself, man.

And I've won every single fight since.

Nice.

And it's getting easier and easier not to win, just to prepare and like, less strenuous on my head.

Yeah.

Those responses to like losing and you say, obviously you went to war with yourself.

People to quit.

Do you think everything you've been through up until that point was a key part as to how you reacted?

It's the exact same thing and it plays in it.

Losing two fights is losing two fights.

But I've lost my whole life.

I've lost my whole life up until the age of 24, 25, bro, I lost my whole life.

What was I doing?

I was in support of livings bouncing around place to place, bouncing from woman to woman, trying to get love that my wish my mom gave me.

Do you understand what I'm saying?

And it's like I feel from 25, 26 onwards, my life began.

I met an amazing person who helps me with everything, mentally, everything, I'm grounded and everything's foundationalized.

And I feel like I had to go through all that stuff.

Not sure others can't go for it, because I'm not being rude.

Let's be real.

Everyone's going to go through stuff, and that's how life works.

I'm ever going to sit here and be like, oh, because I've been through it.

This is what to look out for.

There's no warning signs.

Life is life.

Life is shit.

But it's what we make of it.

And it's about, as we say, you do what you do for a living.

I guarantee you.

I know for a fact that behind your eyes there's a lot of stuff going on, but it's also a lot of it subconscious.

We don't realize the effect our subconscious brain has on the front of it.

But until you have to go through something to get you to that breaking point, you then realize how to differentiate from negatively letting it impact your life.

Yeah, cool, mate.

Mourn, be upset, do what you need to do.

But if you don't get up, much as we are good people, no one else can pick you up.

It's that level of getting past that barrier.

And I feel like me going to that gym, I was anxious so to go into that boxing gym.

When you start getting past these barriers, every other barrier becomes so much easier to go through.

Yeah.

Do you think people have to get to that point of maybe not breaking point, but like, they have to go through something difficult to learn the lessons out of it?

Because we can.

We can hear someone's stories like yourself.

You can tell us everything you've been through.

But someone listening who's never been through anything like that, can they truly understand it until they actually get to a point like that themselves?

Okay, look at it this way.

Did you become a firefighter because you wanted to see the stuff you see?

Or do you come a firefighter for some other reason?

Do you know what I mean?

Like, it's like, did I become a boxer because I want to punch people in the face or get punched in the face?

Or did I become a boxer for some other reason?

I feel like a lot of people are in a bracket of complacency.

And this isn't no conspiracy thing.

This isn't that.

This is.

People come to work, people go home, people go to sleep.

What else?

There's no difference between.

It's a nine to not saying nine to five is wrong.

But you're doing this.

You're doing this.

You're doing it, you're doing this, you're doing it to get by and get on with life.

I don't want to do that.

And because I went through different things, I'm neurodiverse, I see things differently.

I couldn't work a 9 to 5.

That would drive me insane.

That would drive me worse than anything I've been through.

Because that's the same routine every single day, which with autism, people love routine.

That's mundane.

And for me, I feel people can.

It's never going to be a thing where people can definitely match our stories.

Well, they can relate to certain things.

They can relate to isolation, they can relate to neglect, they can relate to the medication and a lot of people on antidepressants, they can relate to bad partner choices.

They can relate to getting in fights against so much stuff.

If one person can relate to a little point that I put done my job.

Because there's a.

There's a key thing that people ask me and I ask people.

How do you define legacy?

And people are money.

Oh, the women are.

This article, forget all that, mate.

Because end of the day for me, from what I'm hearing from you, your legacy will be the people you've helped, because you're helping a lot of people, whether it be from this, where it be from your work.

Every three in life, you help people.

Mine, mine's going to be the people that are helping people after me.

The.

The example I set.

The legacy you live in life is the people you changed on the money you make.

Yeah.

Look what Avicii said.

He done what he did.

And that's another person lost to an ongoing battle to have a lot of people go through.

And I feel like from going through what I've been through, I have covered various different points and everywhere I've been now, the key base there is stay alive, keep doing what you're doing, speak to people.

It gets better.

And for someone who hasn't gone through something to say it gets better, it comes across not offensive, but you battle that because you're like, it gets better.

But not.

Who are you to tell me that?

But what have you been through?

Have you been in my position?

No, I haven't.

Then why?

How can you tell me that?

Because positive affirmation is great when it comes from someone who's been through the stuff you've been through.

Do you know what I mean?

I think that's a lot of problems nowadays where people are like, oh, just it'll be better.

And then you get the other people like get on with it.

Whoever says get on with it, you're an idiot.

Because telling someone in a suicidal state to get on with it, you might as well give them a rope.

Yeah.

Because that's how it works.

And people do it on my Instagram, people that I know, they're like, oh, stop, stop posting.

Block me.

Go away.

Tell you like, oh, it's wet, it's, it's moist this way, it's this is that brother.

Because you're 35 years old and you're going into pub, sniffing coke and trying to chat to 18 year olds doesn't mean your life's good directly or not.

I'll say that because a lot of people is saving about complacency.

You're doing that nine to five.

And your outlet is your weekend when you're 45 with liver failure or kidney failure or drug induced psychosis, because you've gone out every single weekend from the age of 18.

Because that's how you live your life.

And you're unhappy and lonely when you're in, when you're in old people.

Some.

I have no family because, mate, you never made nothing in your life.

And you call me this and that, you do that.

But my point is you can't help someone don't want to be helped.

Yeah, because there's one other thing as well, I think actually really impacted my journey.

And he's a big part of everyone's life around me.

My friend Harvey.

And this is a key point of like from the gym thing else I went on to the second fight I'm gonna fight Zimbie show November, last November.

And there was a guy in there called Harvey.

Harvey's got schizophrenia.

Harvey lives in a church.

Do you know what I'm saying?

It's one of the things where Harvey has no direction.

I love Harvey like his family.

Harvey is more family to me than some people.

I love this guy with all my heart, man.

And Harvey is one of those people where like he.

I went in there and he was like, I don't think I meant to be here.

As in like boxing.

I don't know, questioning, because I've questioned myself internally.

I'm seeing him.

Harvey's my best friend to this day.

This guy will call me up and I will answer the phone to him at any point.

It's like he.

For him to be like, this guy literally saved my life to say to me, I rather that than the millions.

He said that.

He said it to me.

He's like, you saved me.

He's like, you actually like, without you, I wouldn't be doing this.

He don't box very often.

What's it like for you to hear that?

Selfish as it sounds, mate, it's my biggest reward because I have done something and I've actually done something.

It's like people say all this game is selfless.

Not selfless because we're not getting money from a note.

We're feeding our brain.

That's how it works.

We're feeding those points which we wish someone done for us.

That's what trauma is, man.

We try and fill the gap with something else.

My positive way of filling the gap is helping other people.

And when that gap's filled, I'm still going to do what I'm doing because as we say about legacy, that's my go in life.

I want to open a gym one day.

I want to do adaptive boxing.

People disabilities, people for anxiety.

I want to give people a place that I wish I knew was existing beforehand.

Yeah, like, it's the same thing about holding that beacon up, bro.

There's a lot of people in darkness right now.

Hold that beacon up and people can see it, they go towards it.

It's all about direction.

Because having no direction, I think, is more scary than going through anything because you can go through stuff, get over it, but you have no direction.

All that's going to happen is the moment you sit still, it's going to keep ticking around your head.

And that's the most dangerous part, I think, after all this, when you've gone through it and you're like, what now?

Yeah.

What's next?

Exactly.

Yeah.

You've mentioned a few times about the support around you and specifically your partner.

What's it like to have someone like that supporting you and what does it mean?

I'll give you one big word.

It gives me clarity because it helps me filter everyone else.

It helps me filter how my mum was with me.

It helps me filter how I need to write to interact with people.

Obviously, I love her to pieces and it's an amazing thing.

She integrated into my family, well, my Turkish side, great.

But it really.

It sounds mad, but it's not just the fact of relationship.

It's made me realize who.

How people are, how people perceive, how to perceive people.

So me back in the day would be like if someone told me, I'm taking it at face value.

Me back in the day would be like, yes, this person.

Oh, no, they don't mean it that way now.

I don't care.

It's one of those things.

If you're not.

If you're not with me on the same journey, you're gonna have to step off.

And that's how it works.

I feel like there's.

It's like a train and I think you've probably heard this before, it's up the train.

If people get on at the same station, people get off, you're still on the same journey.

I ain't reached my destination yet, but, yeah, she's with me.

She's with me.

It's one of the things, and I've honest, it's definitely.

It's eye opening to think that someone actually sticks by you through.

So, I mean, I'm not the best person.

I've got mental health, My mental health is always going to be present.

I can sit here and be like, oh, I'm better, I'm not better, I'm coping, I'm doing well and I've got my direction, which then is my outlet, which then makes it tolerable.

You'll never see that was ever going to get better, but it's never going to be cured.

There's nothing as a magical cure.

We're always going to be going through stuff.

It's about how resilient, how we tolerate these things.

So something that would have made me melt down, say a year ago now makes me a little bit mad.

Yeah.

Do you know what I mean?

Yeah.

It's interesting the way you speak that, because I've spoken to a man called Martin Seeger who's actually sat in that seat yesterday.

He's a psychologist, worked for over 30 years in this field and he said this line to me about.

He said, mental health, it's not a mental health condition, it's just a human condition.

That is key.

Mental health.

We often talk like you're saying there, we're.

I'm never going to be like cured or fixed.

What is normal, bro?

Exactly.

What is that?

So it's normal.

9 To 5.

The human condition is.

It ebbs and flows, it goes through.

We're.

We're always going to have new things pop up in our life.

As you said before, life stuff happens.

But if life stuff didn't happen, what would it be?

You have to experience these things to be resilient.

Exactly.

I feel like if you didn't experience certain things you experienced, you would be able to talk about it.

Yeah.

Do you know what I mean?

And then I feel like, mad as it sounds, nothing.

I've never been in them situations, but I feel you can.

You can only become resilient to Something, the more you expose to things.

Not there's extremes which obviously people take out of coin, but you know what I'm saying.

So if for instance, a car crash, I've seen a few car crashes, I'm never going to be able to go to a car, but let me do this.

Whereas you'd probably be able to because you're in that line of work.

Like it's.

The more you do something.

For me, boxing, going to ring.

I used to shake fear, man.

Now I love it.

Now I cannot wait to do it.

Now I'm smiling, I'm enjoying it.

But it's about building that confidence.

And that's not just about confidence.

I'm confident, it's confidence internally.

A lot of people don't realize a lot of the stuff that happens is behind is in the back of your brain.

And it's internal confidence comes from repetition as well.

I think a lot of people don't recognize that they.

A lot of people think that confidence is like, I'm not confident enough to step in a gym.

It's like, well, no one ever is.

There's like a little, you know, you never seen a cling film prank where someone runs through the door?

It's taking from the door.

That's all it is.

It's a bit of cling from on the door, mate.

Yeah.

When you step through that, it's like when you went to be a firefighter, would you feeling, oh, I can't wait.

You was probably yourself, mate.

You're like, whoa, this is, this is real.

Yeah.

Everything you start there is a level of I don't feel ready for this.

And that's how it should feel.

That's how, bro, there's, there's 1% of people that can go through and actually read be ready for it.

You know what we actually ready for?

Were we born and told you're going to do this?

No.

We found our own way.

And I feel like when you, when stuff gets hard in life, boxing, in your work, anything, it's when you're about to do something new, your brain's about to open a new pathway and then that pathway goes further than the other one and then you start moving away from certain things.

Yeah, I, I have, I have severe issues when it comes to like trusting people.

Like, because of whatever happened with my family, I trust her.

Do you know what I mean?

That's overall, like, it's one of those things.

Pardon me?

It's one of those things where it's like, the more you're exposed to.

I Think the more resilient you can be and the more confident you can be through repetition.

And the repetition doesn't mean the exact same thing, though.

It's not about, I'm gonna go to the gym.

It's about doing things within that environment.

This then builds that level of confidence.

Mate, I was really scared to walk.

I was.

I would have walked you on my own.

I had to make me.

I waited for Mickey to come in before I walked in there because I thought I was gonna be judged.

But then I realized boxing isn't.

It's one of them places where it's the safest environment you can be in.

Yeah.

Because everyone's doing the same thing.

But if they're.

If someone's judging you in a boxing gym or someone's being ego, you're in the wrong gym.

But a boxing gym is meant to be a place of belongings, place of broken.

I'd say some broken people go to it, and we're all broken.

Because who wants to get punched in the face for a living?

Do you know what I mean?

But we love it when it's the only sport, I feel like, where you can get punched up and be like, well done, brother.

Yeah.

You know what I mean?

Because you know for a fact he's just leveled up now.

It's your turn next.

So it works.

Yeah.

It's an interesting.

Like, it's a very unique place to be in.

And the closest I can relate to is having done a bit of jiu jitsu.

Yeah.

Everyone in that gym is there for the same reason, to get better.

There's also that competitiveness as well.

So that brings the best out.

And us.

Yeah.

Like, it's crazy to think that.

Oh, that, like, with you, you're sparring with someone, you're hitting the head a few times.

You hit them in the head.

We get you, like, at the end,.

You're like, mate, that was amazing.

Hug.

And it's like, that's great.

It's the biggest bonding factor, I think.

Yeah.

It's a big measuring contest.

At the end of the day, when the bell.

When the bell rings at the end, you're still human.

Yeah.

We're putting our life on the line.

It's not a funny.

There's two people have died in the past three weeks to, like, whether it one was by suicide and another one was from a brain bleed.

Within boxing every.

Happens every couple weeks.

Boxing is a dangerous game.

Like, all it takes is that wrong punch, that wrong slip, that wrong thing, the wrong this, and you're dead.

Mate, it's not a game.

And people are happy to judge and talk online, but you want to get in the ring.

Yeah.

There's one of the things where, like, that's where we saw that resilience as well about you don't react to these people because you realize, whoa.

Like, you have no idea.

Yeah.

And like, it's.

It's crazy.

How do you respond to comments like that?

I used to.

I used to.

I'd cuss people out and I'll be right.

Used to cuss people out.

Then it got to the point of being like, just here's the facts.

As my partner told me, you have a public image, whether it be, I'm not famous, bro, but I am someone who people look to for either inspiration or people look to for direction.

If I'm sitting there cussing someone out, that's not look very good.

Don't get me wrong.

When it's warranted, I'm gonna do it productively.

Why do you think that when someone's on my comments going, you shouldn't post this stuff.

Why does this make you feel the type of way?

Yes.

Then why do you think I'm posting it?

Do you understand when I say about someone about suicidal and their eyes is wet because you put underneath, mate, when you're not doing cocaine on the weekend and drinking beers, you feel this way.

You're doing that to cope.

It makes people look at themselves in the mirror.

And I feel the people who are negatively commenting, it's still comments, it's still interaction.

You've got to look at it positively.

You've got to look at it as there's 50 people telling you, yes, yes, yes, yes.

This helped me.

This has done this.

One person saying, no on the balance, mate, who wins on that scale?

Even people negatively reacting to stuff means they're still seeing it.

So all it is, your voice is bigger.

The more people that see it, whether it be negative or positive, obviously something productive, not something controversial or something where people are, like, posting it because it gets them clout online.

But I fully in there is one most dangerous places, but also me the most rewarding.

Yeah.

How long did it take you to sort of adjust your mindset in terms of looking at the social media aspect?

Doing podcasts like this as being a positive, like an addition to what you're already doing and helping other people doing it?

I'm still doing it.

I could talk clearly now because I've done this a lot, but it's confidence, repetition.

When I first started the podcast, man, I was like, what the hell?

Like, first I put a camera in my face, you know, interview with Cassra, who was the first guy to interview me.

I was shaking, like I didn't know where to look.

And I feel like it seems that you probably do your first podcast.

Oh, yeah, absolutely.

Yeah.

It's daunting because you're like, there's cameras on me.

There's this and that.

But then you realize, you look at the end, you're like, wow, you gotta forget about it.

You just gotta do what you're doing.

And I feel if you actually are.

What's the word?

Really passionate about something.

It's that barrier, man.

And it's the same for anything in life, whether that be having a conversation, whether that be, you're scared to go to the shop at.

This is it, people.

There's so many things people are fearful of and anxious about.

They can be small or big, but in everyone's brain is different scales in it.

Like, for me, walking into a box on my own was the scariest thing I got to think of.

Now I'll go in there on my own.

Now I'll do whatever on my own.

Because at the end of the day, boxing itself is the loneliest sport.

I'm 27.

I haven't got time to sit there and mope about and be daunted.

If I want to do this, I got to do it properly.

And that's what I've been doing.

Yeah, that's it.

So I feel like I'm still adjusting myself.

But you've got to remember one thing.

People don't do this.

Then the.

The buffer zone goes up and down.

People think, oh, I'm patient.

You will not always be patient.

You need to sit back sometimes and be like, before I respond to this, how would it look?

Yeah, look at stuff from another aspect.

I'll do most things in my life like this I say subconsciously is if I say this to this person or if I do this or if this.

If I was in that position, how am I going to feel?

But it's not a thing where it's like, how would I feel?

It's this.

Generally it's a in the back of your head kind of process.

And I feel like it's very important, especially when someone's in a bad mental state, how you react to them.

Because I look at certain people when they tell me this is wrong.

Why do you feel this way?

And I try to help it.

Yeah, because that's it.

That's the aim of the thing.

If so, some People's speaking out isn't positive.

Some people speaking out is you're wrong.

Let me prove you why I'm not wrong.

And you see what I'm saying?

Some people, because it's a bit of.

Curiosity under, okay, I see the message you've put, but what actually caused that?

Why has that triggered that in your brain?

Yeah.

Do you know what I mean?

And you can, nine times out of ten, mate, that person will open up to you or that person will either shut you down and then open their eyes.

Do you know what I mean?

So I feel like I'm still working on that though.

It's very hard.

We're human, bro.

People can sometimes really offend you.

And I said, not personally, but like, wow, like you're really that self centered.

What can we do about people?

Be people.

That's one thing you're working on.

Is there any other things that you're still currently working on in yourself throughout this whole journey?

I'm alive, man.

That's it.

That's my main goal.

I'm alive.

I'm alive and doing what I want to do, Doing what I love.