My guest on the podcast this week is Demi Pendakis. Demi created his business Find Your Glow (FYG) in 2020 through the covid pandemic, an affordable luxury, sustainable home fragrance brand producing scented candles, diffusers, washes & lotions. In the 2 years they’ve been trading they have won the prestigious 2022 Home Fragrance Gift of the Year Award for their Memories Collection.

I met Demi at the Top Drawer trade show, and immediately wanted to have him as a guest on the podcast as he had so much to share. Demi has been through a complete career change, and it was fascinating talking to him about how winning a prize has helped his business, how he has built his brand and the importance of trade shows. Demi does a lot of sales directly to shows and has lots of great advice to share about being comfortable selling, having conversations and running stalls at Trade Shows.

Listen in to hear Demi share:

• An introduction to himself and his business (01:53)
• How he entered and won an award (02:15)
• What winning an award has changed for his business (03:03)
• His corporate background in the fashion industry (04:19)
• The inspiration for setting up Find Your Glow (05:52)
• Using Lockdown to teach himself new skills (10:39)
• Designing his range (13:36)
• Researching prices (16:06)
• Focusing on selling B2B (17:24)
• How Trade Shows have worked for FYG (18:55)
• His top tips for Trade Shows (26:22)
• Being comfortable selling your product (27:36)
• Tips to prepare for Christmas (33:53)
• His number one piece of advice for other product creators (36:55)

USEFUL RESOURCES:

Find Your Glow Website

Find Your Glow Instagram

The Giftware Association

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Welcome to the Bring Your Product Ideas to Life podcast, practical advice

and inspiration to help you create and sell your own physical products.

Here's your host, Vicki Weinberg.

Today on the podcast, I'm talking to Demi Panakis.

Demi created Find Your Glow in 2020 through the Covid Pandemic.

So Find Your Glow or FYG as it's known, is an affordable, luxury, sustainable

home fragrance brand producing scented candles, diffusers, washes, and lotions.

In the two years they've been trading, they've won the prestigious 2022

Home for Fragrance Gift of the Year award for their memories collection.

So, um, as you will know, and 2020 isn't actually that long.

Two years isn't that long to be in business really.

And what Demi has achieved of his brand is yeah, is fantastic.

Um, I met Demi at the Top Drawer London trade show back in September and, um,

immediately wanted to come on the podcast.

We got chatting within minutes.

I realized he had a story to tell, um, as you will hear for

yourself in just a moment or two.

Um, Demi.

Yeah, he's, he's really passionate about his business and, and life, I think.

Um, and had so much wisdom to impart.

Um, as he'll share with you, he went through a complete check, career

change during the pandemic, um, left his corporate career, which he

has been in for many, many years.

Um, at, to create his own brand of fragrances, which in a

completely different industry.

Um, and we talk a lot about what that was like, how you can draw

on the strengths you have and the experiences and the skills and you

know, how they're transferable.

Um, yeah, we cover a lot of ground here actually.

Um, it's a really great conversation and I'm not going to say anything else.

I'm now going to introduce you to Demi.

So, hi.

Thank you so much for being here.

My pleasure.

Thank you for having me.

So can we start with you please give an introduction to yourself,

your business, and what you sell.

So my name is Demi Pendakis.

My businesses is Find Your Glow.

Most people refer to it as FYG now.

And we are a home fragrance business supplying scented candles,

diffusers, wellbeing pods, et cetera.

And we won amazingly and totally humbled the Home Fragrance

Gift of the Year for 2022.

I saw that, and I wasn't going to start

here, but let's go into that.

Is that, how does these awards work, Demi?

Is that something you enter or the customers?

It's something I enter.

Yeah.

So, so, so you enter through the, through the Giftware Assocation.

I, I, I thought I'd put my memories range forward because that's

really where it all started.

It was, uh, takes you to a place in time and, and a lot of what

we do with our fragrances, all about mental wellbeing and um.

Uh, I just remember the emails coming through.

Yep you've been shortlisted, yep you're going through to the semis, yep and, uh,

the final was, was fantastic because it was voted on by industry experts, uh, both

retail publishers, agents, you name it.

So, real spectrum of it.

I had no idea.

Um, I turned up to the, to the event ceremony for a nice

meal and some, some champagne.

And lo and behold, they called out my name.

So it was, um, yeah, a bit crazy.

That was back in.

That's amazing.

Well done.

And have you found, I'm just really curious now, is have you found that having

that award to your name, has that, has that changed anything in your business?

Yeah, for two, two reasons, really.

Uh, I think the naturally more eyes on the product, more eyes on the brand.

Who, who is this Find Your Glow that HAS only been running for two years?

Um.

But also for, on the flip side, an affirmation to myself

that actually I am not mad.

Or rather, I'm, I'm a productive man and what I am doing is,

is hopefully, is working.

Um, and, and it's honestly, it's been really, really lovely.

And even if I didn't win, I mean that some of the brands that were up

before that, my, my, my competitors, my peers, they were amazing.

But just to get up there and yeah, just to pick it all up and almost

because there's a lot of, you, you would know and all your other people

listening would know there's a lot of graft in trying to set up a business.

So just to get recognized like that, uh, by some industry

experts, it's just incredible.

Just really gives you almost that uh kick up the bum to carry on

and keep doing what you're doing.

Yeah, it's a nice bit of sort of validation, if

that's the right word, isn't it?

Yeah.

As I know when we met, and we spoke a bit about how your background before doing

this was completely, well, not completely different, but you, as you say, you've

been doing this for two years, so it must be, you know, I'm sure there has

been times over those two years where you've gone, is this the right thing?

The hardest thing I found was, uh, and I've,

I've come from a, a corporate background, always been employed.

Um, you know, uh, some, I worked for some of the largest companies in the

UK, in the world and, and supplying some of the biggest customers, but always in

fashion and to, to, to leave that and to, and I, I have three kids, you know,

married, three kids to leave that, I want to say at my age, and think, well, I'm

going to do something totally different.

Very, very scary.

You know, and I had a lot of people saying to me, Are you mad?

You can't do this.

You can't.

I was like, but I, I, I, I'm also quite stubborn, so whenever somebody

says to me, you can't do this, immediately the, the terminology

changes to, okay, how can I do this?

How can I prove these guys wrong?

And, but it's been, it's been a, it's been an incredible journey.

I wish I could have taken everything that I'd learned in my previous

corporate life into this, but naturally it's a different product area.

But from a sales perspective, things, you know, there are things that I'm

more comfortable with and there are certain things that are totally new.

Yeah, because I guess there are things that you are doing

now that perhaps someone else was handling back in your corporate career.

Well that, and also unfortunately I can't call

on any of my fashion connections that I've had in the last 20 years

because it's different industries.

So I'm having to meet so, so many other people.

Um, other production route that, that otherwise, uh, you

know, couldn't approach before.

Um, and yeah, so it's just, just trying to manage it all and then you've got

the finance and all that sort of stuff, so it's just, yeah, it's, it's all in.

Yeah, it's a lot.

So let's start right at the beginning, um, if you're okay, maybe we'll, I mean,

you've touched on the fact that you worked in the fashion industry for years.

Should we start there and then talk about what led up to

you starting Find Your Glow?

What your inspiration was?

Um, yeah.

And how, whatever much you're happy to share with us around that.

No, sure.

Sure.

So, um, I, I, I'm first generation born in the UK.

I'm, I'm a British Greek as it were.

My dad came on a boat and, um, well, what I, what I really loved about him

and I, and I look at him as kind of my hero and my idol, is that he taught me

everything business, business related.

But from a young age, like from the age of 14, 15, I was, I was

never really allowed a holiday.

It was always a case of, right, I mean, how many weeks have you got

for summer, for example, I'd say six.

Right?

Take a week, 10 days now.

Sit in accounts, sit in production, sit in sales.

And he was grooming me and his, his, his background was fashion, so he

had, back in the day when you could supply clothing in the UK, manufacture

clothing, that's what it was.

So I always remember seeing the money almost like as, as in fabrics and

commodities, like fabric roles, et cetera.

So I got really excited by that.

Um, when I left university, I, uh, started marketing.

I set up my own business at the age of 21, um, really with

his, with, with his pushing me.

And, and I thought, you know, let me give it a go.

And I ran a business for three years.

Um, which was amazing and, and him in the background is mentoring me, et cetera.

And, um, he passed away when I was 23, 24.

And that took a real, it hit me a lot.

I, I went through a very, very dark phase and there was a lot of things

that happened personally to me.

So I, I, I took a few months out thinking, what am I going to do?

Um, but I always thought, you know, there's your dad that's built

whatever he has built in the UK off the back of nothing really.

Like coming off a boat, and he's giving you the benefit of education, a

drive, and a real sense of work ethic, Demi, you can get on with it and,

and, and, you know, and do something.

And fashion was all I knew.

So I, I restarted my life at the age of 24 acting as a sales exec, and then

slowly, slowly, and to cut a long story short, slowly working for some of the

largest clothing manufacturers in the UK.

So if anyone's ever bought a pair of Jamie or Joni Jeans, for example,

from Top Shop, I've, I've helped produce and manufacture them and all

your Christmas novelties and all the supermarkets, that was me to, to a point.

So, um, yeah, and, and I, I worked with it with a number of amazing

companies and, you know, I had a, had a, really, really enjoyed it up until

the last four or five years where I, the industry took a real big turn.

Um, I, it got to the point also for me where, you know, with my, with my

daughters and thinking about how I can inspire them or how I can teach them

going forward, just like, and, and, and I just thought some of the customers,

some, well, some of the customers, some of the suppliers, some of the

people in the industry who were just taking too many shortcuts and that

didn't, just didn't work well with me.

Um, so it was 2000 and 19, Uh, I had a meeting with a large

retailer and um, there were certain things said in that boardroom.

I thought, you know what, this isn't, this isn't the sort of

industry I want to be in anymore.

Um, I, and it's difficult obviously.

You've got a whole lifestyle et cetera.

And, and I remember going back to, to, to my, to my, to my wife and, uh,

she's like the pragmatic accountant and she's, uh, you can't leave.

I was like, you know what, mentally I'm struggling here.

Uh, I, you know, I can't, I can't be doing the certain things that, you

know, these people want me to do.

And, um, I caught Covid, uh, beginning of 2020 before anyone

knew what covid what, what it was.

I, you know, I lost my sense of smell and I just thought, Greek guy, big nose.

I thought, okay, I've got sinusitis.

That's genuine.

I thought I had, but they gave me antibiotics.

That really, that took my immune system all the way down.

That hit me.

Um, and then I, I went to hospital for a little bit.

Came out, uh, thank God.

And when I finally got my senses back, my wife brought me bowl of figs and

that smell just um, took me back to my late Grandma's garden in Greece.

And I just felt for the first time in a long time, just really elevated just

that nostalgia of the innocence of youth.

Just playing with my brother, because she had like a little bungalow in,

in the Sawnic in Greece and we used to play football amongst the fig

trees and all that sort of stuff.

And it just really, just took me back to a place in time and I thought, wow,

is there any way I can recreate this?

I didn't know anything about candle making.

Then I thought, how, what can I do?

How can I, you know, and I just love the, the, the evocative nature of fragrance.

So I started researching.

I, I, I, I read, uh, a number of books.

I went on, God, YouTube, you name it.

I went everywhere.

And then slowly, slowly, little idea popped in my head.

And, um, I finally decided to, to, to leave an industry that I,

that I'd loved, and I still do, to to extent that I've loved, um, to

try something totally different.

Wow.

That's amazing.

Thank you.

No, it it, and it was hard, but don't get wrong.

It was, but at the same time, I just, you know, you had lockdown for six

months and I thought, come on, I never want to sit on my hands anyway.

So I, I thought, okay, come on Demi.

You know, let's, let's, let's learn something new.

And the hardest thing, I suppose, Vicki, the hardest thing was,

was my skill set transferable?

You know, at times you sit there and think, oh, can I, can I move

everything I've learned to here?

There are new connections you've got to make.

You know, are people going to take me seriously?

Where am I going to buy my stuff from?

So there's a whole, I went, I went the old, um, flip chart route, just

wrote everything down and just make sure I managed to tick everything.

Just because I, I love being a little bit old school.

I, it's the only way I can just see it visually and, and slowly.

So I just started creating something and it, it got, it got really, really

exciting and the most important thing that, that, that I wanted to create.

I, I, I've always lived on three pillars and one is quality, beauty,

um, and the other one's sustainability.

So as long as I have all those three ticked, whatever decision I made

going forwards, had to make sure that I have every one of those.

And it's, it's been a bit of a crazy journey the last two years.

Yeah, it sounds like it.

So during lockdown, were you furloughed or were, were you still working then, or.

I was that person.

I was that person that unfortunately got nothing because I'd resigned and left.

And obviously I had covid and I was not furloughed.

I was not self-employed.

There were no handouts.

Um, you know, I'm not looking for a soft story or anything, you

know, but I, I just sat there.

I thought come on Demi, you're going to have to make something

work, in order to get some money in.

And, and, and that was it.

So, yeah, I did, I didn't have anything.

Yeah.

I hope you didn't mind me asking.

I was just trying to get a sense of the timing, whether this was

something you were sort of working on.

So it sounds like actually you took the leap to leave your employment before you

even had the new business up and running.

Yeah, yeah.

Then I, I, I, I, I didn't realize just.

I was new to the industry.

I didn't realize all the testing, et cetera, that that was involved.

Um, but as a result of realizing it, I was working days from seven in

the morning till two in the morning.

I, I just had to, I realized it was something I wanted to get out there.

Um, there was a lot of research I obviously had to do.

Um, you know, you entering a home fragrance market, it's saturating as hell.

Every, everyone's, everyone thinks they're a candle brand.

Everyone wants to make a candle.

Why not?

You know, they're so beautiful and ambient and just so warm and, you

know, and, and, but I wanted to really create something special.

I, I, I, I knew from the outset that I wanted to create something

that was an affordable luxury.

I, I had no interest in High Street because I could make

all their things abroad.

I wanted to be hand poured British, but at the same time I wanted something

that can give um, my customers a viable option than the beautiful, you

know, your boutiques, are generally are a little bit more expensive.

Something kind of at an affordable luxury sort of level.

And, um, to do that and to be able to compete, everything had to

be perfect from your burns, your timings, everything had to be perfect.

So that was a lot of work.

Yeah, I can imagine.

And actually, let's talk a little bit about that process of sort of designing

your candles, getting them manufactured.

Because as you said, that's a, that's a massive feat.

Um, and we can go into as much or little detail as you want.

I am interested, um, in how you went from, okay, I've got this idea

to, okay, now I've got something, but an actual product to sell.

Okay.

So, um, the branding that I love.

I, I love simplicity.

Um, I love Chanel's branding just really, really easy.

And what I wanted to create was something in my head I thought, I'm not going to

be, I don't see myself going to farmer's markets and that sort of stuff, just

purely because I, I cannot do that.

And I, and I always wanted to create a lifestyle brand.

You know, we look at our high streets today, this is kind of what inspired me.

You look at our high streets today, and they're all the.

They're all with, we expect they're all rather boring.

You know, you have the same shops, the same cafes, the same everything.

So looks, I thought in my head, I thought the vision 10, 15 years down

the line, not today, is like Demi, you want to create a brand that's

long lasting that could potentially go in there and make a difference.

I like being a bit of a disruptor, so that can make a difference.

Um, how are you going to do that?

It's not just going to be fragrance.

So we've obviously started with home fragrance, but the idea

is we'll move into other areas.

Um, and, and in order to do that, you need something that can transcend that.

So not, not go too cottagey because that won't really sit well with maybe

what you want to do down the line.

So I, I.

I got approached by, by a branding agency who, who had seen a

couple of things, got my testers.

Um, we had at the same time the, um, the NHS Rainbows and all

that sort of stuff going on.

Um, so my first, first memories, uh, candle collection was a lovely, uh, again,

just nice and simple that can fit in.

And almost Scandi looking.

They can fit in any home.

Matt White Glass, with a golden inlay, with FYG.

But the boxes themselves off the back of the NHS Rainbow,

so they're all multicoloured.

Disbursement of color, uh, which really can give you a, and I also

thought, if I'm going to be in a shop, how's somebody going to see me?

So here we go.

Let's go with a bit of colour.

That's also a nice pick me up.

So that's where we started.

Um, but I really wanted to capture moments of my past because I was, I was on this,

I was also on this personal journey.

So I, I, I started looking at, for example, I love the Amalfi.

The Amalfi is beautiful, Lemon and freesia.

So I, I, I, I, I developed a, a fragrance for that.

Um, we have ones that take you to a place something like St.

Lucia, Bali, um, the Maldives, and it's just been, it, it was really

lovely, but also it, it was fun, you know, at the end of the day

it was, it was fun creating these.

So, but in order to start off, I also needed to understand exactly

what people would've expected to pay.

So I.

I did a 300 person, uh, survey just to understand what, what sort of

fragrances are people referring?

Have I gone mad?

Have I gone totally left field?

You know, are are people genuinely looking for something?

And, and most of it was yes.

So I identified a couple of different price points and so my memory section was,

um, I mean we retail those at 35 pounds and they really take you down memory lane.

They're beautiful.

Um, they last for a good 45 hours.

But I also thought, let's just do some, what I call back to basics, which are

kind of like my fragrance favourite.

So, Like something that smelled beautiful, like a nice black

fig, really, really lovely.

Uh, my lemon grass has done really well, or even now, frankincense

and myrrh leading up to Christmas.

So I just like real fragrance favourites.

Um, and they're 25 pounds, um, for, for a count again, they

last for like 40, 45 hours.

And it's, and they've worked really, really well.

Thank you.

And I mean, I have seen your candles in real life.

I've even smelt your candles in real life and they are beautiful.

I mean, I can see, I can still see in my mind your display.

You were, I obviously met you at Top Drawer and from down the

aisle you could just see you were so visible because you had this

beautiful wall of colour behind you.

And I can see you've got on your backdrop now.

It's just, it's just absolutely stunning.

And I think you're right that, that in a, in a store it would turn heads.

People will spot you.

Um, and so actually, let's talk a little bit about that, if that's okay,

because I know that when we chatted, you mentioned that you do mostly sell b2b.

Um, I can see that your candles look just stunning on, in a shop.

So how have you gone about getting stocks, getting stocked?

Um, honestly, uh, some cold calling.

Um, I, I did my first show, uh, this time last year, actually this time 2021.

And, um, the show paid for itself, which was good.

Uh, but we, we got in one key stockist in London.

And I think at the end of the day when, when you do shows,

there's always that reservation.

It's, "Oh God, it's going to cost three, 4,000 pounds".

Okay?

Even in the first show, if you don't cover it, people start remembering you.

Um, and 1, 1, 1 message I give to anybody is, you know, obviously think

authentic and think about how you're going to make it, how you're going to

make yourself a little bit different.

Um, because there are thousands of candle brands out there.

And about this, this, I mean, across anything, whatever you do,

how you're going to be different.

And, and I, I picked up a few stockists, but then slowly,

slowly they started ticking along.

Um, there was a little, I didn't really do much marketing, and in all

fairness, the irony is I was doing a marketing degree, 20 years later,

everything I love was obsolete.

So, you know, you're, you're trying to do, you're trying to

do so many different things.

Um, but, but for myself to, to customer, I've never done it before, but I've

always worked with businesses, so I'm never really shy to pick up the phone

and say, listen, are you looking for another home fragrance brand with

a little bit of a difference here?

Or look, but there are certain things that you should do.

Um, and um, and things started kicking on, and it was in the spring actually,

that we really took that leap.

Um, and yeah, Spring fair at the NEC for me was, was just fabulous.

I, I couldn't believe the turnover we took on there, but more so just

the, the, the level of stockists.

I mean, there were, there for myself, there were garden centers, there

were stockists with, uh, 13 shops, nine shops, and all of a sudden

the name started getting out there.

Um, and I think a, a, a lot.

What we also try to do, which, which I haven't, I haven't talked about just

yet, but what we also try to do is we try to, it's not try, as I said, everything

is quality, beauty, but sustainable.

So all our waxes are natural.

Uh, they're a vegan wax, uh, rapeseed and coconut.

So there's a beautiful burn.

But I plant a tree for every candle I sell.

Um, and literally up until about, I still need to count now, but

up until about three weeks ago, we planted 10,000, over 10,000.

And I also give 5% of all my profits to help prevent teen suicide and self harm.

So we're a little community, eco brand.

I think that struck a note with quite a few different people,

quite a few different stockists.

It's just wanting something a little bit different that, that does that.

Um, but yeah, no, from my perspective, once you start moving, um, and,

and your stuff sells, it's, it's one thing getting into stockists.

You know, selling is one thing you're not selling.

There's a lot of more trust in it.

But I think a lot of, a lot of our stockists have loved the

authenticity behind the brand.

There is nothing contrived about it.

You know, we, we are like, like it or loath it.

It it's me.

You know what I mean?

So I've just, I've just shoved me in the brand and, and I think,

I think that's kind of what, what works really, really well.

Um, but yeah, but I've never been shy to pick up the phone and have a conversation,

I think to, to get down the stockist route um, there is an element of that.

That was really useful.

Thank you.

And I'm also wondering, um, what your take on, is when you spoke about the fact that

your products look amazing, do you think that's helped you get into stockists?

The fact that if someone looks at your products that emulate, they have

got great branding, great packaging, um, you could see them on a shelf.

Do you see what I mean?

Because.

You have to yeah.

I what I'm thinking is, is that's important.

Yeah.

I, I, i, I remember, I remember any shop I go into, I we're all

magpies in some sort of respect.

So wherever you go and you're like, wow, look at that.

And I, I wanted to try and create, um, that sort of buzz and, and, and I, and

I think I have, um, um, and, and I, I think, you know, my products excite, so

what's really lovely and you know, is then the appreciation of the work that goes

behind the candle will really then comes to play because the, the way that we've

done it, the way that, you know, the way that it burns, the way that the fragrance,

you get bang for bucks with fragrance.

So the, the, the visual is, is fantastic, but ultimately then we've got to produce.

Right?

And I think that, that for me is, has been, has been very, very good.

But the memories range, um, which is kind of our, our signature range

is all is is literally all just about, you know, place and time.

And for me, whilst the, the, the wellbeing aspect of the fragrance of something,

the pick me up with a colour is also something that's really striking.

Yeah, absolutely.

And so obviously we met at Top Drawer and that's what actually led me to ask

you the question about how about your products, how they were displayed.

Because something that I noticed just wandering around is that a lot of

people, yourself included, have done a really great job of displaying the

products in a way that you could imagine.

Yes.

That's on a shelf somewhere.

Um, I mean, you touched on this a little bit, but how have trade shows

sort of fit in for, for your business?

Um, Have they been a big part of you finding stockists or?

They've, they've, for me, they've been a key part, um, that,

that, and not just finding stockists.

There's, there's three, there's three aspects to a trade show.

Excuse me.

In my opinion.

One, yes, of course finding stockists is key.

You know, you, you pay the money for a trade show in order to get some of the

business back, which is, which is great.

Um, and, and I've, I've taken on a number and.

But the, the real important thing, and I was told this, um, right at the

beginning, and there were a hundred percent tight is that don't do too many

to begin with because you obviously need to show a certain level of

loyalty to a trade show because then those customers see you all the time.

They, they'll be certain customers that will buy a few straight off the bat, but

there are other ones that want to see, okay, I remember him on the last one.

Is he still here this time?

Is he still going to be here tomorrow?

Were a young brand, you know, they want to make sure that you can deliver.

So there are, there are, especially just over the last year, there are

stockists that I realized that saw me a year ago, saw me in spring.

And then decided to buy off me now, just purely because they can

see now that we're, that we're moving and they remember it all.

You know, they, they, they, oh, you're the guy with those colours.

They remember all that.

So definitely we've had success with customers.

What I also do with trade shows is I use them as inspiration.

You know, you have got.

What I genuinely love about the gifting industry, which, which I

struggle with at times with fashion.

What I love about the gifting industry is you, it's full of entrepreneurs.

Whether you're a retailer, whether you're a stockist, whether you are

a, a budding designer, or whether you're somebody with a brand, everyone

has got an entrepreneurial brand, you should be inspired by everyone.

And I sometimes am, you know, there are certain displays that I might do

and I thought, I wish I could this.

There's a peer down, down, down the, down the aisle, for example,

that's gone so much more into that.

You, you, you really bounce off each other and there's an almost

an unspoken sense of camaraderie.

Yes, you are competing, but there's, there's an unspoken sense of camaraderie

and, and you can really get inspiration.

But also after that, there's, there are agents that are moving around.

They're looking for the next, for the next brand.

And I've taken three of my agents off the back of, um, uh, these trade shows.

So it works in multiple facets, but ultimately, yes, uh, you,

you want to make some money.

Yeah, that makes sense what you've said about inspiration and

I think if, perhaps if you are, I don't know if, even if you're not looking

quite at the point in your business where you are ready to exhibit going to

a trade show and just walking around, I'm obviously, I'm not saying copy

what someone else is doing, but just to get an idea of, okay, what's going on?

What, who else?

A lot.

I think its a great idea.

I give a lot of time.

Um, maybe I shouldn't, but I don't care.

I give a lot of time to a lot.

They come and say openly, oh, you know what, Demi, we love what you do.

We think about doing a candle brand, and I know they won't copy me because

their brand will die tomorrow.

Yeah.

That's not the point.

But to even for some advice, you know, I, I was a, well, you were a top job.

I was a top job.

I counted at one point in the morning with a cup of tea.

There were 34 candle brands in there.

You know, we all need business.

Everyone's doing something different.

And there, there is, there is a way that you can do something different

so long as you're true to your brand.

And I think that that for me was, um, really striking about, about Top Drawer.

Um, but yeah, I, I, I think I must have had about six or seven budding

brands coming and I think that's better than just copying something and just

trying to do a, trying to do a stall in one of these because you'll fail.

Because people will always remember the first people that do it.

Whereas going and understanding and asking the questions that your podcast is, is

doing, you know, we're approachable.

We, we were them a year and a half, two years ago.

You know, it's so, I wish, I wish I knew about it.

I mean, I, I did all the reading.

I had no idea.

And then, then I joined the Giftware Association and all of a sudden

it's like, I was like having all these experts that I can just speak

to, that I can look up the phone or email, um, that, that really helped.

And that's brilliant.

Thank you.

And if you don't mind, while we're on the topic of trades that shows,

because I know this is something that a lot of my audience are

starting to get interested in.

Do you have any other advice for, you know, things to do or that maybe not do

if, if you're thinking of exhibiting?

Um, I, I, well, regarding exhibiting.

Plan your stand.

Um, I think just try whatever, however you do it, try and make

it look like a shop within a shop.

That, that, that's how I always try to do it.

You know, let let the stockist imagine what your store, what your

stuff's going to look like in a store.

Um, rather than just putting some tables out, some candles or whatever

you're doing, jewellery or whatever.

Just, just let them feel like, ah, this is a corner of our store

that we really, really need.

Uh, that, that's one.

Um, And you can do that by cost, cost effectively or spend whatever

money that, that, that's fine.

But I, I, I, I agree with what you say.

Walk.

Walk, walk a couple of trade shows.

You will know which one suits you.

One of the reasons I did Top Drawer was because it's very designer led

and my product is very much like that.

But I, but I was conscious that when I was doing Autumn Fair in Springfield,

which had been amazing for me, but I didn't want to rush into things.

Um, but it was, that was very, very good for me.

But you might find that some trade shows might not be right for you.

Um, so do some research definitely before you spend your money, because

they're not cheap and you, you, you, you're going to want to at least say

two by two or something like that.

You know, if people are charging 500 pound a square meter, that that's a lot

of money that you need to make back.

So you've got to be very careful.

Yeah, that's true.

And I was also thinking kind of that's what you were saying earlier

about you, you know, you pick up the phone and you, you call stockists.

I guess you probably also want to be sort of comfortable with doing that

and having those kinds of conversations as well before you sort of get into

a situation where you're going to be having lots of, hopefully lots of

conversations with potential buyers.

Everyone's a salesperson, that that's the thing.

And that if you're not comfortable being a salesperson, then I, I would strongly

suggest, um, re-looking about what it is that you want do, because whether

you are a stockist, well, so whether you are, you're sitting on your stand and

you've got to remember, I mean, as you probably saw loads of people are passing.

You've, you've got to almost put a hanger on your mouth and smile the whole time.

Um, and, and, and be able to relay everything across and it takes a lot.

Um, and I suppose my, my, you know, I'm still learning every day.

My thing is how do I get somebody to do that for me with the same sort of passion?

Because I love my product, you know, how, how do you do that?

So that, that's something I need to look at.

But whether you do that on a trade show or whether you do that over the

phone, you need to be able to do that.

And, and a lot of people will, um, really jump on the back of your passion.

And, and, and couple with that authenticity.

Yeah, that make, that makes sense.

And I know that I, I wouldn't, I don't want to say strangely, but

I think it may, a lot of what I'm trying to say is a lot of people I

think are a bit scared of selling.

They might have a great product, um, that they really believe in, but when it comes

to selling it, they're a bit hesitant.

I see this a lot.

I mean, I see this in, I see this in myself.

I'm not always brilliant at selling, but selling and.

I think, I think, I think the way around that is

envisage where you want to be and what, what you want your product to

do and how you going to get there?

How are you going to do that?

You're not going to get there by just sitting on your hands

and not speaking with anybody.

You want to scream and shout about it.

You're proud of your product, right?

That, that, that, that's the main thing.

So, and, and don't get me wrong, it's hard.

It's half.

The first trade show, it was the first one I ever did on, on, on candles, et cetera.

I thought, my god, you know, my, am I saying the right stuff.

Am I, am I working on the right markup?

You know, my, are people wanting me to speak, but all of a sudden,

you've got to be personable or any sales person will be personable.

All of a sudden you just realize that it's, it's just a lovely conversation.

People are interested in your stuff.

So once, once people are interested, I don't, I don't want to say

get the sell because it's, but just really just relay and form.

Um, and if they're exactly what you want, then yeah.

Have, have the further conversations.

But it's been.

They've been good fun.

I look forward to the trade.

I don't look forward to the buildup and the breakdown.

I've got to say, Oh my God, that's awful.

Um, but, but I love the trade shows.

Generally.

You meet so many different people.

And so I get inspired by so many stockists.

I mean, there's, there's a stockist that I've, I worked with and they were

the, they were the big one I took at Autumn Winter last year, Autumn Fair.

Last year they had seven stores.

Then they've now got 14 going up to 22.

I mean, good on them.

That's an inspiration in itself that just shows you if you want

to get something done, you can.

Um, so it's been brilliant.

Yeah, absolutely.

And something, I mean, you probably won't say this about yourself, but one

thing I will say that I think you've done, you do really well, and I thought

this when I met you, is you, you've got a lot of, you know, when you talk

about your products, when I met you, you talk about the wellbeing aspect.

You talk about the memories they invoke.

You had a lot of things to talk about.

It wasn't a hard sort of sell.

It was you had a lot to share about your products, about what they meant

to you, about where they came from.

And, um, I think that we're all people, right?

We all, we're all people, we all like to buy from people.

And that's the kind of thing that makes you memorable and also makes

it more a conversation and less a sales pitch because there's, you

know, there's something you are telling your genuine experience and

story and me as the person listening, genuinely me, that's why you're here.

Because I was genuinely.

Yeah.

Yeah, this is really, this is really interesting because if there's a

story behind this and there's a passion and, and I, I think we're,

you know, people love stories.

I, Yeah, I, I, I, I'm a bit of a hopeless romantic.

I, I do love to, I do love to take people on a journey.

So one of the things I launched, um, in spring, um, and now it's really coming

to the four, is I launched the seasons candle, uh, or of my seasons range, and

they've gone down an absolute treat.

So I, I thought, I thought, how do I do things a little bit different?

And I, I wanted to really do a nice, I, I didn't do big candles before

and I wanted do a nice, really, really big candle, kilo candle.

But I thought if I'm going to do a kilo candle for somebody, I need it to

adapt somehow throughout the season.

What's the point?

They're going to smell something, for example, in, in March that they're

going to want to smell again in August.

How do I change it?

So I thought I'd do a candle that changes fragrances as you burn.

And the reason I did that is in fashion, we're working

spring, summer, autumn, winter.

So I thought, let me take the two seasons.

Marry them up.

And the idea was.

I, I can't remember if I showed this to you on my, on my, on my, uh, table, but.

You did, I was very taken by this.

Oh, sorry.

But carry on there.

I, I've seen it.

No one else has.

Carry on.

Okay.

So, um, they're in beautiful luxury metal containers.

And the idea is that one candle goes, burns from a spring fragrance, uh,

and then goes into a summer fragrance, and it lasts 120 hours in total.

And the other one goes for autumn to winter.

But then at the same time, um, I've created a seated dust card.

So when you finish, you rip up the dust card, you plant it in the pots and it

grows meadow flowers from the same pots.

It's part of the whole, as I said, we're an eco sustainable brand.

It's product reusing it all again, but it's, it's, and that's pure essential oil.

So something totally, totally different and, and yeah, it's, it's taken me aback,

it's took me about nine, 10 months to develop because obviously you want to

make sure that the fragrances work, the wicks work and all that sort of, you know,

um, but then also the design aspects.

You know, we have a lovely umbra effect on the boxes and, and yeah, they're striking

and, and they're really, really good fun.

So try to do something a bit different.

So I'm glad you remembered it.

I was, I think that was an amazing gift.

I, I saw, that was one my wife thought yeah, that's, that's

just a brilliant gift, isn't it?

Yeah, I can see that.

You know, hopefully Christmas you do really well with those.

Because I think that.

I've already had some pre-orders yes, yes.

Yeah.

So we, we we're tied up with, um, one of the best things actually that's happened

off the back of one of the shows is I got introduced to a, to a Marque Hotel group,

um, Marque Hotel, um, I don't know if I can mention the name or anything, but is,

is, we've done so, so, so well with them.

So they've taken our memories range, um, and they want to feature on some kind

of like their 12 days of Christmas now.

So the, these candles I'm talking about are part of that 12 days of Christmas.

Amazing.

And while we're on the subject of Christmas, is there

anything else that you do?

So obviously we are speaking in end of September, Christmas isn't that far away.

What, what are your, what are you doing and what would you advise people do to

start gearing up for your Christmas sales?

I mean, obviously we are getting a bit late now for Christmas.

I'm well aware.

Um, well, from, from a, from a buying perspective

or, or, or, yeah from a selling?

From a selling.

I, my biggest advice would be, and I was actually talking to

my, um, to my production team about this today, is one thing I have noticed is

that people are buying a lot earlier.

Um, and I think a lot of that is due to the reservation of what's going

on with the dollar, what's going on with freights and what's basically

going on with stock positions.

So, if any of your, uh, your listeners are looking at getting in somewhere

for Christmas, getting the stuff, then, then I think have the conversations now.

Um, because leaving them in later will be, will be a real problem.

And also, um, if any of your listeners are looking at potentially doing, for

example, corporate gifting, et cetera, have conversations with the corporate

guys early because please, God, they'll sell out, but they want to make you able

to get their, their proper bang for buck on, on, on some of those big orders now.

Um, it's, it's a real, real difficult time.

We were very, very worried about.

What was going to happen with the energy prices in October, et cetera.

Hopefully the government's kind of alleviated some of that,

but we've noticed a lot of our stockists are buying big early.

Um, so yeah, just that, just something to keep in mind for this year.

I think that's great advice.

Thank you.

And actually, I have also noticed this year a lot of retailers, um, and

small independent businesses as well, who have maybe Christmas special,

you know, special Christmas items or Christmas ranges have, have released

them a lot earlier than normal.

And I guess that's down to what you're saying, that we, um, you

know, people are buying early.

So, yeah, I think we're maybe not going to see the massive December

sales we sometimes see, and maybe sales are going to come off a bit earlier.

Well, I, I, I didn't, um, I didn't expect to have,

uh, August sales the way I did.

Um, it's, it shocked me.

I remember I was on holiday.

Um, I was panicking thinking, what are these orders coming

in now all of a sudden?

So, yeah, I listen, it's, we don't know, but I just, from what I can

tell, I've spoken to a few people.

Um, there seems to be a big emphasis to buy early, make sure

you've got your stock position set.

Um, and then move on.

I even have somebody at the moment who, who's my candles have sold really well

in one stockist um, he's just rebuying now for Christmas and also wants to do

a pre-order for Valentine's, I think.

Anyway, bit too early, but, you know.

But good for you.

But yeah, it's lovely.

Um, but, but honestly, I, but everyone's, everyone's worried about their stocks,

even from, from our perspective, you know?

I mean, I, I was.

You know, when I'm, when I'm importing things et cetera, you know, the

dollar rates come from 130 to 105.

So, you know, one point, do you, do you take a call, buy a little bit extra?

It's, it's tough, but you've got to, you've got to manage those things.

Thank you.

So I'm just, um, be mindful of your time, Demi.

Um, I've, one more question, just question I ask everyone who comes on the podcast.

Which is, what would your number one piece of advice for other product

creators or potential product creators be?

Oh, just one.

Um, authenticity.

I'll let, I'll let you have more than one if you need to.

Ok.

Authenticity.

Just be true to, to, I would say be true to what it is you're trying to create.

Don't vear from that.

Have it all written down.

Every decision you make, just make sure that it's authentic and nobody, everyone

can tell a contrive brand straightaway.

Everyone can tell a copy cat straightaway.

Um, so yeah, a authenticity and do that by, by researching.

Um, but what I would say is, as a second one is do whatever you can to

keep your costs down, because it's very, very easy to get out of control.

Um, you think about all the research and developments, et cetera that you're doing.

Um, it just, yeah, just make sure you got, you got an eye over your costs.

But authenticity and that, because ultimately it's all cash flow for a young

business, so many, so many businesses close within the first three years, just

purely because of cash flow as well.

So from my perspective, you've got, you've got to have an eye on that

and whatever you're developing.

That's great advice.

Thank you.

Because I think also it's quite easy to kind of lose track of the cash

you're spending when you're sort of, especially when you're in the

development stage and you're spending a little bit here and a little bit there.

Mm-hmm.

Um, yeah, I'm, I'm with you.

You need to just make sure that you, you know, you know where you are

financially and everything adds up.

Well, thank you so much for everything that you've shared.

I've really enjoyed talking to you.

My absolute pleasure.

Thank you for having me.

Um, it's been great.

And I'm gonna link to your website and your

socials in the show notes.

People can come over and have a look at your candles.

Unfortunately, you won't be able to smell 'em unless you buy them,

but you'll see them at least.

You'll be able to go and take a look.

Um, yeah, so thank you again.

Thank you, Vicki.

That was lovely.

Thank you.

Thank you so much for listening all the way

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Take care.