Finances can often feel overwhelming, but the Bible has plenty of practical wisdom to guide us toward freedom and peace.

This past Sunday, Pastor Phil shared a powerful message on financial health—and today, we’re continuing the conversation by exploring the role finances play in our overall well-being. In this episode, Pastor Ken sits down with Austin Staub, a longtime banking professional, to talk about financial health—from budgeting basics and tackling debt, to embracing a generous heart and planning for the future. You’ll hear why money is often so emotional, how biblical principles can transform the way you handle finances, and how a simple mindset shift can bring renewed hope. Whether you’re drowning in debt or just wanting to steward your resources better, this conversation will encourage you to take a next step toward true financial well-being.

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- All right, well, welcome to the

podcast, faith for Real Life.

Uh, we are in a series

called New Year New You,

where we're looking at

five elements of health.

And today we're talking about

financial health and finances.

And money is something that

people generally don't really

love talking about, at

least with other people.

There's a lot of, you know, privacy about

that, and that's understandable.

But God loves talking about money.

You know, in the Bible there

is about 500 verses on prayer,

about 500 verses on

And so the reason why the

Bible talks much about money

is because it's important to us.

And so, because it's

important to us, God wants us

to understand what it looks

like to flourish in that area

and to be healthy in that area.

And so we wanna help you do

that through a conversation

with, uh, our guest today.

And so we have Austin with us.

And so Austin, tell us a

little bit about yourself

and, uh, where you work

and why you're here.

- Absolutely. Uh, so I've

been in Hope City for about,

uh, 15 years.

Um, and I work at a bank.

Uh, so talking about money,

I've been at, uh, TD Bank

for about, uh, 12 years now.

Been a bank manager for about eight.

Um, and you know, like my

favorite thing is just being able

to learn about people's

lives and their situations

and, uh, truly be able to digest that

so I can live out my best life as well.

Um, and then share those stories, be able

to help other people

through different situations

and struggles, um,

and truly just authentically give advice,

um, which is really neat. Yeah.

- So we'll be talking about

financial health today,

and as we go along, you know,

that definition will

become clear and clear

and what we mean exactly

when we say that, you know,

this isn't gonna be,

uh, investment advice.

So if you're looking, you know, for a way

to two times your money in the next 30

days, this is not that.

Okay? Uh, this isn't gonna

be, you know, in competition

with Grant Cardone or Robert Kazaki

or the Rich Dad, poor Dad

or anything like that.

You know, we're not pumping

a meme coin or anything like that.

You know, we're talking

about financial health,

and really what we're

doing is we're looking at

how does the Bible talk about money

and how does that play

out in the flourishing

of people's finances as you see

it in the real world, right?

Because you work with people who may

or may not be Christians,

but let's just assume

that they have no understanding of

what the Bible says about money.

And you would see on a

day-to-day, uh, basis

where you're like, oh, man, if

you just, if you just listen

to what the Bible said about this

would actually solve

a lot of your problem.

So we're gonna talk about

how the Bible is so practical

and so useful about money, um,

but also how you see that kind

of play out in the real world.

But before we kinda get to

that, I'd love to just kind

of hear some personal reflections from you

and your own story about

money and financial health.

And so how has your experience with, um,

money shaped your view on

what it looks like to be,

you know, financially healthy

and, and flourished in that area? Yeah,

- I think it's changed over the years.

Growing up, I was never

really given a, you know,

weekly allowance or anything

like that. You never

- Given an allowance.

I know, you know, how'd

you buy them chips at

the store? Man? You know, I'm

- Just,

- Did you steal them?

- I'll tell you later, . Um, right.

But I, but something like

that where it's like,

when I got money, it was

like you tried to hoard it

and then you'd spend it

on something really big.

Right? Um, because it was so scarce to me.

And, um, I think when I

think about my relationship

with money over the years,

it's become a lot more, um,

uh, a lot less scary.

Hmm. Um, because I've just tried

to understand it a lot

more, um, prior. I love

- That.

I love that because money

is so scary to people. It

- Can be, well, and I

say this all the time,

that money's very emotional, right?

And so when, um, you know, when you talk

to your friend about money, um,

or like if you're saying

like, oh, can I pay back

for something like, it, it almost hurts

to even say those words.

I can't pay back for that. Um, but

whenever I tell somebody I'm a banker,

it's like the floodgates open up

and then they're telling

me their life story.

They're telling me how much debt they have

or like, what's more, what,

what are the mortgage rates right now?

Um, and it's, it's a safe space

that I love creating. Yeah.

And so over the years,

it's gone from, I used

to hoard my money because I

didn't know when I would see my

next dollar as a kid to,

I got my first job at,

when I was at 14, I worked at Arby's,

literally down the street

from the church. Really?

- Yeah. It was great. Oh man.

I won't tell you it's Arby's,

- But Oh, oh.

- But it's, I can't,

- Once a year I'll treat

myself now. Um,

- They just opened one up by my house.

Oh, don't tell me that.

And I was like, the,

those things still exist,

nothing against Arby's.

Okay. I actually have a friend

who is sponsored by Arby's.

Okay. And, uh, she's like this

TikTok star, she's awesome.

And they gave her this Arby's, uh,

smelling tracksuit . It's like,

- Did they soak it in the meat?

- I don't know what they did. I don't

know. Okay. But anyway, that's a thing.

- Don't go near a dog park.

- Okay. . Um, so working at Arby's,

- So I worked at Arby's, um, you know,

and I first saw my first

paychecks, you know,

and I, like, I was, you know,

nothing against my parents,

but like, I was just

never taught about money.

Yeah. Right. I was never

really like told like,

put your 10% away or do

this with your money.

Um, so all I saw was money coming in,

and I'm like, well, now I have money.

So I just blew it all.

Yeah. Every single paycheck.

And, you know, when I,

uh, I think right now

where I'm at in my life

is really props to my wife

because she really helped me say

like, we need to save money.

Yeah. You know, if we're

gonna get married one day,

if we're gonna like, have

a down payment for a condo

or a house, um, you know, you

need to learn how to save.

And so then I started working at the bank,

seeing people's stories, um,

and really putting that

into practice. Yeah.

- Did she have some sort of financial

background or Not at all.

- It was just like her parents

instilled that in her. Okay.

Uh, right. And so like, they came

to this church, uh, their whole lives.

And so they were like,

this is how you tithe.

This is how you save. Um,

you don't buy something

unless you have all the money for it.

Yeah. And so where my, my, my

story was a little opposite

where it's my parents' financial

health was if you could

afford the monthly payment on something

that was healthy Right.

And Right. Yeah. And both

perspectives in a way are right.

You know, and there was nothing

being taught that was wrong.

Um, but one of those gets

you a little bit farther

ahead than the other.

- Yeah. Right. I bet you there's

a lot of people listening

who would say something similar.

Maybe it was their parents, I don't know.

The psychology of, you know, our, our,

our behavior with money.

It's, you know, in childhood experience,

but the reality that so many

people don't have really any

sort, not even just formal education,

but any, you know, principles of money

that have been passed down to them.

Um, whether it's from their parents,

but even school, I always

thought that was so strange

that they never taught

the stuff in school.

Totally. You know, they teach you about,

you know, many different things.

You know, character stuff,

which is obviously important.

How to play nice with others, right? Yeah.

How to have grit and get things done.

And they prepare you to go

to college or prepare to get a job.

But then typically people

work to get money. Yeah.

That's usually why

people work, right? Yeah.

Work is a blessing in of itself.

And we're actually be

talking on this podcast

what professional health

is, and it is a blessing,

but we work to pay the bills.

Totally. So, but no one

ever really teaches us

what to do with that end product.

Right. With that money. Where does it go?

- Even like you were

saying, like in school

you have calm, right.

Career life management. Yeah.

Which I'm like, however long ago I took

that and it was kinda a joke.

- Mine was a couple years ago. Yeah.

- It was kind of a joke, right? Like it's,

they don't actually teach

you practical things on

how do you, what do you do with your money

that are actually, um,

applicable in the real world?

Yeah. They give you surface level

information about all these topics.

Um, and it's frustrating

because when I see people

coming in to the bank

or just having conversations

like friends of mine,

they are starting at the

ground level every single time.

And it's frustrating.

'cause I'm like, I wish

our education system, I wish

there was just better things

to give common sense

finances to everybody.

Yeah. And, and there's not really, and

- I actually think the church

can really play a wonderful

role in that, um, in society.

Yes. But let's say more

particularly within families

and within kids youth

ministries, even kids ministries,

to be able to teach some of the things

that the Bible has to say.

'cause you know, as I mentioned

earlier, the Bible has a lot

to say about money.

And my conviction of a pastor

is that money is one of the,

if not the most reliable

indicator of the condition

of somebody's heart a lot of times.

Oh, it's totally true. Yeah. A lot

of times we don't put those

two together, but it really is,

Jesus says that Matthew six,

right where your treasure is,

your heart is totally right.

So don't store up your,

your wealth here on earth.

- Absolutely. And like, it's

funny 'cause it's like if you

show me your account statement, I know you

what priorities you have.

Yeah. Right? And so it's

like, I'll go through

and like, somebody's trying to be like,

oh, I wanna buy a house.

I'm like, well, you went

to McDonald's every day

for the last 30 days.

Yeah. If you didn't,

you'd have enough for

a down payment. Do you

- Think McDonald's is more expensive

or less expensive than regular

groceries right now? Off topic? Well,

- The CEO just came out and said that

we're gonna try to make

food more affordable.

So they actually lowered

their prices for who?

The first for McDonald's. Oh, really?

Yeah, just a little bit. Oh, interesting.

Um, which was actually

very impressive. Yeah.

- Plugs for McDonald's and

Arby's already. There you go,

- Man. Yeah.

- Although our plug plug

for Arby's wasn't really for

them's

- , but I think,

um, it, it's very true.

When you look at

somebody's account history

or if you look at their statements

and like, I just do that

whenever we're doing an

application for a mortgage

or something like that,

you, you really see

where people's priorities lie, right.

Like are is, I can tell if

somebody's tithing or not. Yeah.

I, and not that I'm judging them,

but you can just, you, you're able to see

where are you actually

spending your money.

Yeah. Do you have some kind

of savings plan in place?

Are you, um, you know,

thinking about where your money's going?

Or is it just kind of coming in,

going out without a thought?

Yeah. Because nowadays it's so easy for us

to just tap our cards, tap our phones,

and it's not physical cash.

Right. Like, it's not like I'm,

I'm not sacrificing this money.

Like when I was a kid and

I got a dollar, I'm like,

I physically have this

loony in my head. Yeah.

- My kids love money.

- Yes, I know. And, and

now it's just different

because it's not like you

see your money anymore.

You're like, oh, I got a email

saying my paycheck came in,

or a notification and you

just see the dollar amount.

Right? Right. And then

you just kind of go along

with your day where before

like, you know, even 15,

20 years ago, like people

would get their physical check,

they'd have to go into the bank,

they would either take out cash

and you know, like we

still see a lot of checks,

but like, it was just different mm-hmm .

Right. And so whenever we were

telling people, even nowadays

to budget or to think about

those things like take out cash,

it's harder to give it away.

Mm-hmm . Even to Starbucks, if you're used

to gonna Starbucks, it's harder

to give your $10 bill over

to the barista than it is

to just tap your phone or load your app.

- I learned that when I was 25, 26

and I read, uh, Dave Ramsey's

Total Money Makeover.

That really was my first dip into any sort

of financial education that

actually revolutionized my life.

And I still adhere to those

principles in a lot of ways.

Um, but it's just Bible.

That's kind of all it is. Yeah.

Yeah. Uh, that's fascinating.

Okay, so let's get a little

bit into the nitty gritty.

Thank you for sharing

kinda your personal stuff.

I'd love to hear from your

perspective, what are some

of the financial habits

or behavior patterns of people

that you would consider

financially healthy?

Right. You see all these

different statements

and what I like about it is, is that

for you, it's not a judgment thing.

When you look at this,

it's not an emotional

thing, it's data.

Right. It actually kind

of tells you Right.

What's the priorities to you? I

- Appreciate you saying

that, that it's data.

Because if you ask my wife,

like I'm a total Excel nerd,

I love looking at reports and

charting and stuff like that.

And so it's like, that's good time.

If I, if I see a friend or something

and they're like, oh, here's my personal

information, I'll forget it.

The moment we start

having that conversation.

And so there's like zero judgment.

I just love digging into

those numbers. I would be,

- I would be so nervous.

I don't know why. Yeah.

Like, I have nothing to hide,

but if I printed out my bank

and gave it to you, that would actually

be super fun to do that.

Like live. Yeah. Like, ooh,

- Let's go

- .

- Excellent. Um,

- Maybe we can like superimpose

it on the screen right here.

And you can see my, my

January. It's like ai. Yeah.

I actually don't want you to

see my Christmas spending.

This was an expensive

Christmas. We didn't even try.

And it just, man, it's

hard. It is expensive.

Anyway, let's talk about .

What are some of those financial habits

that you see people have or behaviors

or patterns that you would consider

financially healthy? Yeah,

- I think if I were to break

it down to something really

simple, it would be people

that are financially healthy,

whether they're in the church or not,

have a really strong budget.

They have goals that

they've set for themselves

and they just have a

regular check-in process

with their spouse or with a,

with some like their

financial advisor or something like that.

Okay. And so essentially,

you know, where your,

your money is coming in

and going out, you know,

what you're trying to save for

or what your priorities

are for your money, um,

or what you want God

to do with your money.

And you have a regular process for you

to check in with yourself mm-hmm .

Because it's funny how like

New Year's, for example,

if somebody sets like, I wanna

lose this amount of weight,

if you don't check in with

yourself daily, weekly, monthly,

you'll probably forget about that goal.

Sure. Right. And so you

need to make sure that

with your finances, which are so critical,

every single person in the

world deals with money.

You have money coming in, it's in your

pocket, it's in your bank account.

And we don't spend enough time

working out that muscle. Why

- Do you think that is?

Do you think it's fear? Is

it shame? Is it, it's back

- To emotions, right?

Yeah. Like it's, um,

you're trying to, living

with the Jones is you're

trying to, you know,

it's a consumerist society

where all you see on social media,

all you see everywhere

is, I don't have enough.

And it's frustrating when you

don't need everything. Mm.

Right? Mm-hmm . We we're

in a pretty blessed

society right now.

Um, and I think, you know, you

don't need the latest iPhone.

You don't need the, the latest

Lululemon Mickey Mouse shirt.

Right. Um, with that you're

gonna wear once mm-hmm .

That I did at Disney. I know. Oh,

- Personal.

- I know. Um, but you

don't need all that stuff.

Right, right. It's nice to splurge,

but like set aside a certain amount

of money every month to splurge.

- So this is interesting

as you're saying this,

because this ties in again, pastorally on

that contentment piece that,

you know, when, when Paul says,

I've learned to be content

in all circumstances,

I've learned to, you know,

be content in plenty.

Right. And I've learned

to be content in want and in scarcity.

And I think that, I imagine

as I hear you talking, that

that has a huge part

to play in people's finances versus

I'm actually just not content.

I would just be happier

if I had this thing. Yeah.

And I don't have this thing, so I'm going

to maybe fudge some,

um, common sense things

or logical ideas, because

money's emotional in order

to reach happiness.

Right. And then you get that

new Mickey Mouse movement.

Absolutely. Absolutely.

Or for me, a Tacoma,

I imagine if I got a Tacoma, a new Tacoma,

that my life would be perfect.

You know, we all have those things.

We just kind of, but we

realize we get those things.

You're like, ah, it didn't do

it. Right. And it's a cycle.

- 'cause 'cause you're trying

to fill something. Yeah.

Right. But I actually

see some of the happiest

and most financially healthy people, um,

are the most frugal in giving.

Hmm. Which is really cool.

And so one of my peers, uh,

he's a branch manager in Vancouver.

He drives, I think it's a

And it's worth like $2,000.

And he's like, you know, he's well off.

Like he could definitely afford any car.

- Have you ever seen a souped

up neon before? Oh yeah.

It's a, those are

awesome. It's pretty fun.

- Yeah. Um, it's not his by the way. Yeah.

Uh, but yeah, it's crappy.

It's rusted, it's dark green.

It's gross. Um, he sent

me a photo of it. Yeah.

- Like,

- Why are you still driving this thing?

He's like, 'cause it works. He's like,

I just need to get to work and back.

Yeah. I'm not driving my little ones.

I'm not like, it's just me. It works.

I don't need a new car. And,

you know, he's like, like it's,

I'm content with the image.

It, uh, it poses. He's like,

he wears a nice suit to work.

You know, like he looks

all well put together.

He just drives a crappy car. Yeah.

Because he doesn't need a new car.

He doesn't need to impress anybody.

And I think, uh, when you

start comparing yourself

is when you lose, I

- Think that's the principle here.

It's not drive a bad car. Right.

The principle is I don't need

to prove myself to anybody Right.

Where my worth is. Yep. Right.

And again, as a believer,

it's like to know

where your worth is, which

is not in your bank account,

which is not in your material,

but in being, you know, made

in the image of God being loved

by him, if you can kind

of get that in your bones,

that would change your

money habits. Totally.

- And you, you change how you see, uh,

your actual money and

what it does for you.

Right. Yeah. Um, you know, I see a lot

of my non-Christian clients,

or my Christian clients

have the same mentality,

which I'm like, ah, I just

want you to become a Christian

because you would be

such a good Christian,

um, with how you spend

your money . But, um,

- But this is a problem for Christians

too. Absolutely. Absolutely. A

- Hundred percent Right.

Because like we see a lot of

people that are, um, because

- We live in this world.

Right. Totally. Live here.

And it's, you cannot be affected

by the 24 7 messaging all

around you in what you see. Right.

- Unless you fully unplug

and go live as a hobby farmer out

in Saskatchewan. Yeah. But

- Even then you'd still have greed

because I mean, Jesus is talking to people

who didn't have social media or Amazon.

Right. And it was still an issue. Greed.

- Isn't Amazon's a bad one?

- greed isn't one click buy.

Yeah. It's true. I did that

this morning for deodorant.

I needed it. Um, anyway,

it's like the nons

sweat sometimes when I'm

preaching, yo, I sweat.

So I found this clinical deodorant.

It's a little bit more expensive,

but it's worth it. . Okay.

- Lemme know because I mean,

- I'll send you a picture

after links in the show notes

below to , to Arby's, to

McDonald's and to deodorant

- Amazon. Yeah.

- Yeah. Okay. So maybe on the

flip side, talk about some

of those healthy patterns that you said.

Yeah. You, you talked about,

Hey, just talking about it,

checking in some of the basic stuff.

You mentioned budgeting, which maybe

we'll we'll talk about a little bit.

Um, you know, budgeting is

telling your money where to go.

Absolutely. Wondering where it went. Yeah.

- Literally having like

whether it's sticky notes Yeah.

And you're like, I took

this sticky note, moved it

to this side of the page,

or it's an fancy excel.

Yeah. It's whatever works for you.

And so, um, like for

myself, I have an Excel

where it's like I have all

of my income sources Yeah.

Uh, which is one. Yeah. Um,

and I have all of my expenses.

Yeah. Right. Which are many.

And so then you're like,

where am I landing? Right.

Or what does my budget

look like when it, I get

to next month and I'm checking in

with myself to make sure it

got there. Yeah. Next month.

- And if you see at the end of the month,

there's not enough Yeah.

Right. To meet my bills.

There's not enough to meet my goals.

It allows you to shift things up.

Now there's, there's a plan

for it. There is periods

of people's lives and

there's people watching.

It's like, you know what? I, I don't

know how to generate any more.

Because the way to fix that

is to generate more income.

Yeah. Right. Or reduce expenses.

Those are the two things that you can do.

And I do want to be sensitive

because there are, um, people listening

and watching who they're

in a period right now

where they're trying to find work

and that income thing is

tough or they're in a job

but they just dunno

how to make more money.

They don't have the time for

it. Or there's an extraneous

circumstance or there's a really big

bill that they can't get around.

Um, there, there's those scenarios

and so we're not necessarily

talking about that.

Right. We're talking

about, you know, just that,

that scenario where

people just aren't aware

of what's coming in and what's going out.

And so they kind of just keep on spending.

I was reading that, uh, for every dollar

that a Canadian makes,

they owe a dollar 80.

- Yeah. And it's actually

just gone up to about two 10.

Okay. Yeah. Which is over double.

- So that's scary. Yeah. Right.

And I imagine for some people,

if they saw that on paper,

they'd be like, I got, I gotta change.

Yeah. Right. And so budgeting Yeah.

Is, is a key one. Yeah. It's

- Massive.

And I think like when you're

able to budget, you know,

biblically you're able to feel like

you actually have more control mm-hmm .

Because you can relax a

little bit more. Right.

Um, you know, as a Christian,

like I don't feel like I

am living by God's rules.

I don't feel like he's controlling me.

I feel like he's, um, set up

a parameter for me to have,

you know, the, the most successful

life I possibly can mm-hmm .

And I just have to like listen to him.

I have to have a relationship with him.

If you're able to think about

that with your money as well,

where it's like, if you're

able to set up parameters

for your money so that

you can be as successful

as you can within your finances,

you're actually gonna be more free.

- Which is cool. Not less

free. Right. Yeah. Yeah.

Budget actually creates freedom. Yeah.

Some people think kind of the

more restriction in that area,

but it's just, it's just not true.

Totally. Um, maybe just an aside,

I have a, I have a story about that.

Um, , I remember I moved into

my home about four years ago

and there's this big old

ugly house that, um, we got

for cheap because he

was big, old and ugly.

Right. . And it had a really

dilapidated fence. Okay.

And we had a dog at the time,

and we actually still have a dog.

What happened to it didn't die. Sorry. .

I got really sad quick. Um,

and we had three, three daughters.

We still have three daughters

as well. . Okay. Good.

And you know, when we didn't

have that fence up, it was,

it was sort of miserable

because it's wintertime

and the kids are stuck inside,

but they couldn't really go

play outside in the backyard

because they didn't have

have a fence because we had a

little bit of a coyote infestation

and we were living kind of

closer now with Tee Lion.

So there were some people kind of moving

behind our hosts that mm-hmm.

You know, we didn't exactly

trust around our kids.

And so that was less free

when we didn't have a fence.

But as soon as we put

that boundary up, uh,

we can send our kids outside

to have snowball fights

or we can make forts with them

or let the dogs out, whatever.

It actually created freedom,

the restriction and,

and the boundaries created freedom.

And I'd say that that a budget,

but also the kind of biblical

guidelines I'm giving, that's

that fence that allows us to

actually enjoy the backyard.

Yeah. That's that fence that gives us the

freedom. Yeah. Right.

- But you couldn't keep the old

one up either. Right. Right.

Like sometimes you need

to update things. Yeah.

You need to make sure that it's

relevant, that's actually

gonna be working.

Um, and so, you know, a

lot of people just don't

continuously look at their budget.

They don't continuously

check in with themselves.

So you might set a budget at

the beginning of the year.

It might not last all year. Right.

Things change. Yeah. You

know, you need to make sure

- Netflix prices go up.

- Oh, right. Subscriptions

you might like, oh,

I didn't realize I'm 18

subscriptions in Yeah. Right. Like,

- It's actually crazy.

Oh, that's a whole nother

podcast subscription creep.

Absolutely. Anyway, we'll talk about that

- Whole, you save money

on subscriptions. That's

- Crazy.

So we talked about checking in

and just being familiar with

what's coming in, coming out,

and then actually creating

a, a physical budget, right.

So you can know where your money's going

and, um, how much is coming in.

So that's vital. Uh, I'd like

to kind of broach a topic

of generosity because

when it comes to faith,

Christian faith and money, um, tithing

and giving, that's always a topic.

And that actually, you know,

, when I preach on that

or when I see Pastor Phil preach on that,

you always see people kind of

get up and leave. Right. It's

- No way. Oh, it

- Is the sermon that people's like,

oh my God, I don't wanna be

here. . And, and there's a variety.

- I can see people tensing a

little bit like, oh no, they're talking

- About me.

Oh, you could feel it in

the room. And I love it.

Oh, I love it so much.

When I just know that I'm hitting a nerve.

There's something about it, I don't know.

Anyways, something that the Lord needs to

work on my heart message is hitting hard.

Well, you just know that

you're dealing with something

that really matters to people.

Yeah. And they just don't

want to go there often

because there is shame Totally.

When it comes to money. Right.

There's disappointment in there

and people don't want to face that.

Right. And so the same thing

can happen when we're talking

about, you know, a sexual sin

or something that someone's going through.

You can feel it in the room

when it's connecting with people.

And so whenever you're

preaching on, on money,

particularly on the giving

and tithing aspect of things,

you can just feel the

room, just be like, mm.

Don't tell me where to put my money.

Right. And there, there's

something about that.

- So I remember a couple years ago, uh,

pastor Phil did a sermon

and he's like, here's, here's

a couple different examples on

how to break down your budget.

Yeah. And, uh,

after out in the lobby, I'm like,

all I heard was complaints. .

People were like talking

to each other, like,

who's gonna spend 10% on clothing?

Who's gonna do this? I'm like, guys,

it's like, it's a format.

Like Yeah. Yeah. All they wanted

to do was complain when he's

trying to give you tools on how

to be better or not how to be better,

but how to like help yourself.

Right, right. Just think

about it a little bit.

- Yeah. He preached

one a couple years ago.

I wonder if I could

pull up. It was so good

and so helpful on it.

One of the best when Phil,

man, he can teach sometimes,

and he does a really good talks on money.

Forget what series it is.

Anyway, maybe I'll pull it up.

Okay. But I do wanna

talk about generosity.

I have seen personally,

generosity has been, I'm not,

I'm not over exaggerating when

I say that it has been the

catalyst for my faith

over the last 10 years.

Really. Um, it has been. Yeah.

I would say that if there's one

thing that I could link back

to, to becoming financially healthy,

it has been generosity,

which is counterintuitive.

I know, I know.

Because, you know, when you give

and it's a, you know, a

large chunk of your money,

it feels like the opposite of that.

It feels, again, restrictive

and like, oh, what am I doing?

But God has done something in my heart,

and my story is, you

know, when I became, uh,

a pastor when I was young, 21, I,

I started my first ministry appointment

and the church at the time,

which I had a wonderful experience there.

Um, but what they did financially

was they required all the,

the pastors to tithe.

And the way that they

did that was they took

it right off the paycheck.

Gotcha. So it was, you know,

when I got good chance

when I get my pay stub.

Yeah. Right. Um, pastors

do get pay stubs. Okay.

, we still are subject

to CRA and, um, auditing.

Um, anyway, when I got that

paycheck, I just had my,

my tithe taken off right

underneath the federal income tax.

Right. Love that. It was

like a God tax. Yeah.

And so I was there for

10 years. Totally was.

And I just sort of paid the God tax. Yeah.

And there was no, and

that, and that's fine.

I checked the box. Right.

And I, I was okay with that.

I allowed it. Yeah. Yeah. But my heart

wasn't connected to it at all.

It just was, was, was

something that I, I just did.

And then when I, when I moved to Edmonton

and I got a different ministry appointment

and I had to actually be

confronted with the, am I going

to give, it was hard, you know,

even though I'd just been

doing it for 10 years,

technically, when I actually

was forced with this idea of,

of sending my mind, there was something

that was new that was happening.

There's this new questions of trust

and who, you know, who was gonna provide?

Was it gonna be all on me? Was it gonna,

and I've gotten into the habit.

I really take, you know, the first

fruits idea very literally.

I'm not saying that

everyone should, but I do.

And the reason why is, is I found

that the more I'm confronted

with the question,

who am I gonna trust with

my money, the more I realize

that I can trust God with my money

and your, the greed that is, um,

wrapped in your heart just becomes free

because I trust God, he's

gonna provide for me.

And so anytime I get a little

notification, you know,

on my banking app that I got,

you know, income come in,

whether that's through my

wife's paycheck or mine

or something else, you know,

Facebook marketplace, you know,

$50 toaster sale, uh, I stop and I tithe.

There you go. I give on, I give on that.

I don't wait till the end

of the year. Some people do.

That's totally fine. Uh,

or monthly or whatever.

I do it every single

time. And it was funny

'cause my, my mom is

a bookkeeper here. Oh,

- She must hate

- That.

Oh man.

- Sold you 50.

- It's just like 10 times a month.

You know, you're, you're

getting in as etransfer.

But I have found that I'm

just confronted with that.

I'm constantly saying, no,

God, I trust you with this.

And so that has been my story, that,

that generosity has been

such a catalyst for my faith.

And my biggest regret as a

youth pastor, my first 10 years

of, of appointed ministry was

that I actually didn't teach

that to, to kids.

Right. Yeah. I didn't

teach that to students

that they will never, you

know, someone else has

to pick it up, but they, I

never taught them the blessing

of generosity and God's

plan for it in their life.

So my question is, for you,

you're in a different world, right?

Um, have you seen generosity

impact people's, um, behaviors

with money, uh, their financial health?

Have you seen that in, in your world,

in the banking world? Yeah,

- Absolutely.

And I think, um, you know,

like the United Way is a big contributor

even for bankers, right?

Like internally, we have like a really

big campaign around that.

And they try to really amplify

what does your generosity

go towards as a Christian?

And you're looking at like,

what does your money go towards?

Right? You're kind of,

you know, some people like

to think about it like, not as a God tax,

but like you're buying

into the church, right.

When the church has successes,

um, when they are able

to say like, Hey, we, we took

our youth kids to this event.

Right. And they only

had to pay half Right.

Because of the generosity of the church,

or, um, we're able

to build this building

in, you know, Uganda.

Yeah. Right. And because of

the generosity of the church,

when people connect that to, well,

my $10 a month helped contribute to that,

they look at it a lot differently.

Hmm. Right. Where I think a

lot of people are, um, blinded

by, you know, the automatic, uh,

withdrawal from their account

to, to the church as a tithe,

which is great, by the way,

because then sticking to your budget

or you're just blindly giving

or, um, you know, you're not,

your heart's not in it,

like you said before.

I think that's where it loses its luster

because, you know, when you

are constantly surrounded

by something special,

it becomes less special.

Hmm. And so when we think

about tithing, yeah.

It's really important. Or giving,

or being generous, it's really important

to constantly remind

yourself of like cool stories like that.

And so, like, even with my team at Work,

every day we have what's

called a DSU, super cheesy,

but it's like a daily, daily standup

where we talk about stories

that get us excited, you know?

And so yesterday, let's

say we had an appointment

with a client and we're able

to help consolidate their debt

and, you know, their

monthly payments now going

to making them save and tithe more or save

and be more generous.

That's so cool to see. Yeah.

It's, I'd much rather help,

it's rewarding somebody completely fix all

of their money problems

and then still be able

to get a chunk of change out of it.

And then to see them say like, oh,

we actually wanna make sure

that we're like giving gift

cards to a homeless

person when we see them

and having them stacked in our car.

Or like, I want to help with

this organization. Right.

Like, that's just amazing for us to see.

And like, I love being able

to be part of those stories,

but the catalyst

of this whole thing is reminding

yourself of those stories.

Yeah. And so too

- Often, which we try to

do sometimes now, Hey,

this is what we're doing as a church.

Yeah. Right. And you gotta

be a part of, and so I, but

- Too often we're just

in our own little bubble.

Yeah. Right. Where you just see the world

through your own land,

your own perspective,

your own your own set of glasses.

And it's hard for you to

change that perspective

and hear those stories of generosity

because we're not constantly

being reminded of them.

Right. Yeah. And so,

um, you know, if I were

to even ask you the question of why,

what generosity did you see come out of

what you gave? Yeah.

- Like in what's the, the

impact of that, right? Yeah. So

- 'cause it's, it's one

thing to do it, it's another

to see the repercussions of it.

Yeah. Yeah. Right. Where I

think like you're connecting the

dollars that you gave my,

my daughter would say

dollar bucks from blue E

but dollar bucks, the

dollar bucks that you gave.

Um, you know, what did

that actually impact?

- Yeah. Right. Yeah.

And, and we see that and

people wanna see that.

You know, I come from the

other angle where, um,

I am motivated.

I don't wanna say this is, I

don't wanna say it like this,

like it's altruistic, but

I, I just love the idea

of trusting the Lord with my money.

I'm actually not as interested as

what happens with it afterwards.

Okay. You know? Yeah.

There's just, there's just sort of a trust

where I'm actually not,

you know, I'm giving this

to the Lord through the local

church and I just trust that.

And I mean, I'm part of those teams.

So I mean, that's a

little bit, um, you know,

I guess there's a conflict

of interest in some ways

there, but I just trust.

Right, right. I'm just

like, I just, I just,

but then if someone comes to my door,

which they have regularly,

especially with,

you know, um, new Year.

Yeah. You know, about fundraising,

I'm kinda like, I'm a

little bit more suspicious.

Right. I'm like, well, I I don't

wanna give to you right now

'cause I actually don't

know anything about

this organization, .

Right. But I trust the church. Do I wanna

- Give you my bottles? Yeah. I don't

know,

- .

And so for me, I'm

actually not as concerned

and I have seen the dark side

of people being overly concerned,

like, I'm not gonna give,

because the bathrooms are

really nice at this church.

So, and you're not giving to, you know,

poor people in the way that I would.

Right, right. And so and so,

because the, the charitable

reaches of the church and the,

and the social components

of the church don't align

with their preferences.

They're saying, well, I'm

not gonna withhold my tithe.

Then it almost becomes a

justification of a lack

of generosity because there's

a preferential disagreement

with how that's spended.

Where if you can kind of

just, if you're not part

of local church and you

don't trust the leadership,

it's like, okay, that

there's a problem there.

Yeah. Right. And so I

think the stories are fun

and they're motivating, but

they're secondary Right.

In, in, in why we give.

- Yeah. I think too, like,

um, the happiest people

that I see, whether they're Christian

or not, are the most

generous people in the world.

- A

- Hundred percent. And so, you know,

whenever I see clients that

have a lot of money Yeah.

Again, going back to like

looking at their account history,

they're constantly giving

or they're constantly

spending time with people.

Yeah. Because even those, uh,

people that can't spend a lot

of money on things, they

can still spend a lot of time with people.

Yeah. Right. Or they

can give in other ways.

Um, but when you're able to

allot saying like, this money is not mine.

I might've worked hard for it,

but at the end of the day,

it's still the Lord's.

Right. And so how do I

make sure I'm giving him

his right amount?

Right. Whatever that sacrifice looks

for you is gonna be different.

And so, you know, if we think

about the parable of like, um,

you know, the giver

that or the beggar, um,

and she gave as much as she could mm-hmm .

And then the rich guy that came up

and he just gave his his little

stipend. Right. Right. Um,

- Even though it was

more than, even though

- It was more, it was a

bigger sacrifice to her.

- Right. It's not the

dollar amount. It's not the

- Dollar amount.

And so, like, you know, so

- People could be embarrassed,

oh, I only gave $5.

Well wait, hold on. Absolutely. Right.

And so God can take that

and do, I mean, he created

the world of nothing.

Right. . Right.

- He doesn't need your

- Money. Yeah.

He's not sitting up there

like, oh, I'd really like

to do this for the world, but oh man,

person X only gave me $7. . Yeah.

- Yeah. But Right. So it's

a hard issue. Right. Yeah.

And so, but the happiest

people in the world

that I've seen are those

that are able to say,

I'm sacrificing this for my church

because they can do

more with it than I can.

Yeah. Right. And I don't need it as much

as I know that they can do with it.

Yeah. Um, and so it's really

cool to see people go out

of their way to say, you

know, I don't need Starbucks.

Like every single day May I'll

get it once a week. Mm-hmm .

Right. And I'm gonna try

to give Starbucks gift

cards to people that I see.

Right. Just out of random

generosity, which is

super amazing. Yeah. Um,

- If you're gonna do that, I'd probably go

with like McDonald's or Tim Horton's.

Right. 'cause you give a $10

gift card that's like half a drink.

There you go. Starbucks. That's fair.

- Or like one their little donuts or

- Something.

Yeah. So, uh, in short, biblical pattern

for giving is quite simple.

It's gift first, save

second spend third, uh,

which is upside down for our society.

Totally. Yeah. Our

society would be make your

- Budget give at the top.

- Yeah. So give, that's the first thing

in my expense line, right.

Is give. Yeah. Um, so biblical,

biblical prescription is

gi is give, save, spend.

Right. Spending last. Yeah.

And so you're spending according

to what comes out of giving

and what you wanna save

for long term, our,

our world, our society.

Right. Would be very different. Right.

It'd be spend and if there's

anything left over save

and there's not gonna

be anything left over.

So, you know, you don't give this kind of,

so, so it is flipped around.

Um, Proverbs is a big part

of our culture when it comes

to money is credit.

Right. And so, as we mentioned,

uh, you, you said that

for every dollar owed

it's $2 and 10 cents,

or sorry, for every dollar

in income made. Yeah.

- It's $2 and 10 cents owing, which is

- Insane.

Oh. So Proverbs 22 says

that the borrower is slave to the lender.

And it's not saying that that

debt necessarily is a sin,

but it can cross a line where

there's a lack of stewardship

and there's a lack of financial health

and a lack of responsibility, um,

that can come with with debt.

And so I wanna talk a

little bit about debt.

There's people listening today

who are overwhelmed with that.

They're looking at their future,

they're looking at their statements.

The banks are calling, they're

getting the notices in.

And it's just like fear.

It's just straight up fear.

Uh, there's no hope. Mm.

What would you say to that person

to start working their way out of

that scenario towards financial health?

Financial health just feels like it's

a, it's a, it's not for them.

Yeah. Right. You know,

it's not gonna happen.

What would you say to that person?

Because I know that you see people

who every day who move forward.

- Yeah, absolutely. So

- What would you say,

- Uh, the biggest success

stories are those that

just come in and talk.

Right. Uh, I would say a high,

high majority of the people

that just come in and say

like, I have questions.

I have no idea where to start.

Um, are those the people that

start to get ahead? Mm-hmm .

As long as you're in the mindset

that you need to have a behavior change.

Yeah. Right. It's one

thing to say like, oh,

before this podcast,

you know, I never tithe

and now I'm just gonna tithe.

But you need to have a purpose behind it.

There needs to be a heart

change, there needs to be a, um,

a reason why you're doing it,

otherwise you're not gonna stick to it.

And so when you think about

somebody that has a whole lot

of debt, it's because

naturally it's okay for you

to look at a line of credit

or look at a credit card

and not think about the consequences.

And so it's, it's really teaching people

what happens when you max

out your credit card, look at

how much more money you

actually have to spend on it.

Where are you gonna be in 10

or 15 years if you had

that taken care of or not.

Right. And so, uh, we do a lot

of goal planning, a lot of,

uh, like life adjustments to make sure

that we can either take all their debt,

make it into one simple

consolidated loan payment mm-hmm .

Maybe close out some other products.

Um, but at the end of the

day, we need to help make sure

that the behavior is different.

And so is it wise to leave a bunch

of these credit cards open

even after they're paid off?

Yeah, probably not.

- So what I hear you, is this Right.

That you're suggesting the first

step to getting out of the,

the, the hole, right.

That we can get in financially

with debt is like humility.

Absolutely. Like to be

able to say, okay, well,

- Because, you know, money's emotional.

It's, it's, you know, shameful.

Like, it's hard, especially

when you have debt.

Um, people don't wanna talk about it,

but the most healthy thing

that you can do is just open it all up.

Here's my wounds. Mm-hmm . Right.

Who can help me heal them up.

- Okay. So I've come in, okay.

I've said, Hey, Austin, I'm in trouble.

Look at my stuff and I want

to get, I want to, I need

to tackle this, this debt.

What would you say to me?

Where do I start? Good luck.

Yeah. , good luck. I'm outta here.

Gimme my feed. See you later.

- No, um, really, I mean, you

know, what's funny is that,

uh, Dave Ramsey has the

idea of the snowball effect.

Yeah. Right? Yeah. And so, like,

uh, from a simple approach,

uh, that's typically what we like to do

to build up your confidence

around a behavior. Okay. And

- So explain what that is. So

- The simple approach would be,

let's say you had three different debts.

Okay? Let's say it's a thousand

dollars, $5,000, $10,000.

Okay. Regardless of the interest rates

and regardless of the payments,

you're always gonna tackle the

smallest balance owing first.

Okay? So let's say you paid

off that thousand dollars,

that monthly payment

that you had going towards

the thousand is gonna be added

to whatever you had excess

of to pay that down quickly.

Okay? So let's say it was

an extra 50 bucks, okay?

That $50 is gonna be added

to whatever you're

paying towards the 5,000.

- Okay. So I got a thousand

dollars loan. Yeah.

I'm paying a hundred

dollars. Let's say my,

my interest is $50 on that, you're saying?

- So no. Like let's say you

have a thousand dollars loan.

Yeah. A $5,000 loan and a

$10,000 credit card. Yeah. Okay.

So your a thousand dollars loan,

you have a hundred

dollars payment on Yeah.

Once that's paid down,

your a hundred dollars

that you're used to already paying Yeah.

Is gonna be added to

the $5,000 one. Right?

So let's say on their $5,000, you're used

to paying $200 a month.

Gotcha. Yeah. Yeah. Now

you're paying $300 a month

to try to tackle that down. Okay.

- So it snowball a lot of

- People, it's a snowball. Right?

But it's uphill. If you try to

tackle the biggest one first,

it's gonna take you the longest

and you're gonna get discouraged.

It's gonna be the hardest. Um,

and so people are like, oh,

I'm just gonna give up halfway through.

And then you still have three

debts if you tackle the tiny

guy first, it's rewarding.

You're able to see, like,

I'm able to do this,

and you're able to actually move faster.

Right? Which is really cool.

At the end of the day,

from start to finish,

you're gonna spend the same

amount of time paying it off.

If we did the math roughly

about the same amount of time,

mentally, you're gonna be

on your own track a lot

faster, which is really cool.

And so being able to either

set up the behaviors like

that help you realize what's

actually important to you, um,

and then setting yourself

up for success, right?

Like, if we think about,

if you're not responsible

and you wanna be able

to know yourself, right?

Like if we, if you did the

analogy of like, if you want

to be on a new diet, but you're

gonna keep all the same food

in the fridge, it's gonna be

really hard when you open up

that fridge and you see like, you know,

a bunch of stuff that you are

- You that Christmas

person that sees all the

sweetss and just throws 'em out? Yes. Like

- Absolutely.

Well, like all,

all the ladies in my family like

to get together and make

cookies. Yeah. Yeah.

- So many cookies, so

- Many cookies.

And like, I'm like, I can't

even look at these things. Yeah.

Like, I need to like

get rid of them. Right.

And I'm like, oh, honey,

there's stale. Yeah.

Like, they're in the garbage, right? Um,

she's not watching this, but, uh, ,

- She's probably too

known a long time ago.

- It's true. Yeah. She knows.

Um, but the same thing is true.

You need to clear out the things

and the behaviors that are

not making you successful.

Right. And so, whether

that's closing those products

or whether that's, um, you know,

changing your behavior in

a different method in order

for you to find success,

taking out cash instead

of using your debit cards.

Like those things are just so

important for you to Right.

Change your mindset. Yeah.

Even like on your phone, like

if you reorganize your apps

because it's so easy for you

to just open up your phone,

click on Instagram, click on whatever,

and mindlessly scroll.

If you make, even if you keep Instagram,

but you make it harder to find the app,

you'll think twice sometimes about

- I don't have the apps on my phone.

- Well, just in general,

like any apps that are

- Distracting.

Yeah. No, but I'm saying for

That's true. Right? Yeah.

Because when I get rid of

them, it's like I don't,

I don't spend time on my phone.

Right. Right. Yeah. And so I actually,

by making those behavior changes,

I change my behavior totally. Right.

- Weird to where that, where

- I actually want to be and

how I wanna spend my time.

Yep. Okay. I wanna move maybe

to the opposite end of, uh, the spectrum.

When we talk about

finances, we talk about,

I wouldn't say the opposite

end of the spectrum, but,

but let's talk about long-term planning.

Yeah. Okay. We talk about debt.

Um, the long-term idea,

it's a biblical idea.

Like, like Proverbs 13 says

that a righteous person

leaves an inheritance

for his children's children.

Yeah. Right. Grandchildren.

So that's like, that's deep.

Right? That is providing a legacy that is,

that is financial health, right?

That's flourishing, that's freedom.

And so, um, a lot of people

either don't know how to plan

for that, or they're

not even thinking that

because they're just thinking

of the end of the month.

And, and I understand that

there's a lot of pressure

that people are facing right now.

And so, um,

however time, uh, is

the key factor when it

comes to long-term planning.

Yeah. So it is something that

you do have to think about.

Right. And the best time to

do it was yesterday. Right.

The second best time to start

thinking about that is today.

Right? Yep. Taking action on that.

I'm interested to hear your

perspective on the tension

or the balance between

planning for the future

and enjoying the moment.

Right. You, you never know, uh, life

and death are in the hands of the Lord.

Right? And there are common graces

that God has given everybody to enjoy.

Whether that is a vacation

or whether it is something for your home,

or, you know, whether it is a nice meal,

these aren't bad things, right?

These are good things that

God has given us to enjoy.

The problem, of course, is excess

and doing these things right when

you don't have the funds for 'em.

Yeah. Um, so what would you

say to somebody who's trying

to balance these two worlds?

I, I, I'm a saver.

I would prefer to negate the pleasures

of the moment for the future.

Or my wife's actually a little

bit more balanced than me.

I would say. She's not the opposite of me,

but she's a little bit

more balanced than me,

where she would say,

can we should do this.

Right. Not that we deserve it.

We don't deserve a nice

vacation. I don't feel like that.

Right. Did Jesus deserve a

nice vacation? I don't know.

Anyway, but it's more like,

um, Hey, we should do this.

Let's enjoy what God

has given us. Totally.

Why wouldn't you? That almost feels wrong

to not, you know, so there's

this balance. It's a double

- Set edge Yeah.

Of the sword. And so,

like a lot of people,

what's frustrating is they

don't even know how to dream.

They don't know how to,

um, set a goal long term.

Like even think about

retirement, if anybody listening

to this right now is like,

what do you wanna do in retirement?

If you actually have a

structured idea about

what day-to-day life would

look like in retirement? I

- Have no idea. Right?

- Yeah. And so, I mean, that's a,

- I'm just saving everybody

- Typically retires.

Yeah. You know, like, if

you're able to live that long,

what age do you wanna retire?

What are your hobbies?

- Well, unless they don't think about it.

Right. They can't retire if

they don't think about it.

- Right. And they don't think

about it. But then people

don't, in general,

think about their goals.

Yeah. Right? And so people get

discouraged about even saving

if they're not not saving for something.

Right. And so whether it's a vehicle,

whether it's a vacation,

retirement, being able

to send your kids to

school, uh, give your,

uh, kids like a wedding gift.

Yeah. Uh, stuff like that, you

need to be really specific.

So if I were to say, like,

start there, be really specific.

Make a dream board if you want

to mm-hmm . About your goals.

Doesn't matter the dollar amount.

Just be very specific about

what goals would you wanna do

with your money, and then work backwards.

Mm-hmm . Right? So

like, I wanna retire by,

let's say I'm 65 years old,

average retirement age.

Um, you know, how do I make

sure I get there? Right?

You gotta just work backwards.

I wanna be able to give

my kids a wedding gift.

My, my son is four months

old, so I have a lot

of time to say, which is great.

Um, or send them to school, right?

And so, um, you, you just wanna make sure

that you're very specific with that goal.

So it, same thing if I said I

wanna send my kid to school,

um, when he's 18 years old.

Um, if I'm like, oh, he's

just gonna, he needs,

he's gonna be a doctor one day.

I need to save a lot more than,

than if I'm just gonna

give him 10 grand mm-hmm .

Right? In 18 years, I need

to start saving like over a hundred grand.

Right? And so being very

specific with your goals

actually gives you a lot more

power to say what's workable,

what's feasible, and

what are you able to do?

And then humble yourself and

say, I'm not making enough,

or I need to cut my expenses here

to make that budget kind of work.

Mm-hmm . Right? And so it

all kind of comes down to

not being afraid to have that conversation

with somebody at the

bank with your spouse.

Um, as I say that too, the

other thing that I would say

that people trip up on

is the nu you'd be surprised

the number of people

that don't have joint

accounts with their spouse.

Mm. That everything's still

separate. Right? Right.

Like, my wife pays this bill,

my husband pays that bill

and my wife, the mortgage

comes out of her account.

I just e transfer her

every two weeks. Yeah.

Like, that's exhausting. Yeah. I agree.

And you know, especially

as a Christian couple,

if you're one flesh,

why isn't your account

at least Yeah. One

- Account, you're gonna have people who

vehemently disagree with

that. But I'm on your side.

- Absolutely. And so,

and that's my opinion.

If you're truly as a

married couple trying to get

to the same place financially

and you're ashamed of

your financial history

or you're ashamed about

your spending habits,

there's nothing better

that you can do than just

be on the same page

with your spouse. Right.

- Transparent.

- And so even if those are baby steps

where it's like, let's have

a joint savings account.

Um, you want to get to a place

where it's an open book to each other.

Yeah. Right. And so I know for myself

that made a huge difference

on my responsibility

of second guessing should

I buy something? Right?

- 'cause it's ours, not

just mine because it's ours.

- Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. It's

not the money I made. Right.

It's the money that's ours. Right.

My income is now my wife's income. Right.

And so, but even, even if

that's already true, it's

a different mindset. Yeah.

- Well I'd say, you know,

when it comes again pastorally

and challenges in relationships,

there are the usual suspects that, um,

that cause problems among spouses.

Right. Um, one is sex,

one is communication,

but one big one often is money.

Money. Yeah. It's hard. It's money. Yeah.

- Thanks for inviting me here

to talk about it, . Great.

- Okay. So thanks for your time. Yeah.

I want you to say one more thing. Okay.

There's people again watching

listening who, um, have fear

and no hope about tomorrow

and the end of the month

and next year, let alone 65

or what retirement looks like.

What would you say to them,

how would you encourage them

as a Christian man who also,

um, understands kind of

what financial health looks like?

What's, what's one or two

things that you just say just

to encourage them today

- With anything?

Like even when you become

a new Christian, you,

you wanna learn as much as you can about

God and about the Bible.

So what do you do? You start

reading about the Bible,

you start reading about the Lord,

and you put yourself in a situation

where you're surrounded

by Christian people.

Why isn't that true with money? Hmm.

Why don't you want to

surround yourself with people

that are financially successful?

Go to the bank, talk to people, um,

- And we're talking about success.

You're not talking about

billionaires and millions, you're what

- You're talking about.

No, but it's just people that are

comfortable talking about money.

Right? Yeah. Um, you

want to educate yourself.

You want to truly be able

to look up free financial

literacy courses.

Mm-hmm. Whether that's

YouTube, hopefully not. Yeah.

Um, but,

but there's actual courses

that are offered at like the

libraries set up by United Way

or other things that are free

financial literacy courses

that you can actually just say like,

I'm now smarter on this topic. Right. Um,

- That changed things for me. It's huge.

- Yeah. And you know, like if

you're truly passionate about

wanting to be more financially

free, set up parameters,

have a strong budget, you

can't just walk away from this

and say, I'm just gonna do it.

Mm-hmm . Right?

That's like saying, you don't know how

to ride a bike now I'm just gonna do it.

I'm just gonna hop on the bike. Right.

Where why wouldn't you want somebody

to hold those handlebars with you

and make sure that you're taking

those pedals the right way?

Yeah. Right. Yeah. And

you're going down the

street at a right speed.

Um, because if you just

try to jump into something,

you're either going to your sink or swim.

Right. And so I would say the

best thing you can do is try

to educate yourself on financial literacy,

Google financial literacy courses. Um,

- Our church actually

has one coming up, right.

Um, financial Peace University.

I dunno if we call it that,

but it's based off that

and it is great.

- It's awesome. Great. I

hosted that for four years.

Oh, did you hear? Yeah.

Oh, cool. It's great.

- And, uh, we have one

coming up like right away.

- I don't think I'm hosting

it. I wasn't invited to.

You probably don't. Um Right.

But yeah, educate yourself.

Right. Get comfortable with it.

The more you talk about

money in a safe environment,

the less scary it becomes.

Right. The more aware

you are about your own

money and how it comes in and out.

Yeah. The less intimidating and

less shameful it's gonna be.

- And it becomes fun. Right. Right.

When you start saying,

oh, okay, this is what,

what greater health looks

like, I can do this.

Yeah. Right. And when you

apply some discipline,

when you apply a prayerful

heart towards this area of,

of your life, it actually becomes fun.

Yeah. To see, just like

when you're in the gym

and all of a sudden you're

like, Ooh, I have an ab.

Right. I never thought I

had an AB before. Right.

When you start to see

a little bit of that,

you're just kinda like, I can do

this. Yeah. And it actually don't

- Be the person taking

selfies in the band mirror.

Right.

- And that speaking of

snowball, that snowballs. Right.

Totally. Where you're like, I can do this.

Oh, what's my next goal? Right.

But just that, that first

step can be so, so tough

- And like, you know, I grew up

as a kid ho hoarding my loonies.

Yeah. Right. Because I didn't

know what was happening with them.

And now I'm really confident

with where I'm at today,

what money's coming in and going out

and you know, like right

now I'm pat leave, I've,

I've been off with my

newborn four month old.

Yeah. Um, and, uh, we haven't really had

to worry at all, right.

Like, because we had everything

in place for me to be off so

that we could spend time with family.

- So that to me looks like

financial health. Yeah.

Right, right. Not millionaire, you know,

not driving around enough.

No, not at all. Right. But,

but there's financial health there, right.

Where there's, there's