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Heart Centered & Difficult Conversations on Antiracism with Dr. Eleonora and Dr. Ali
9th November 2022 • Balance Boldly for Ambitious Women in Business • Naketa Ren Thigpen: Balance (and) Relationship Advisor
00:00:00 00:47:11

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Today’s episode of the Balance Boldly Podcast is a double hitter! Naketa Ren Thigpen sits down with two women who are having a difficult conversation, shifting the dehumanizing conversation of systemic racism from one that tells lies to one that supports the people disproportionately affected. Dr. Eleonora Bartoli and Dr. Ali Michael are heart centered professionals who are NOT OKAY with white people being at the top of the racial hierarchy. They are teaching other white people how to lean in and understand how powerful it is to listen, speak up, take feedback, and know when to break the unspoken rules that keep people from their empathetic humanity. 


What to expect in today's BBP episode:

-Why it’s important to do antiracism work now

-The link between difficult conversations and unlearning

-What you can learn from writing someone else’s life story

-The importance of having a support system that’s willing to walk a new path with you

-How recognizing your inner resilience is only one ingredient in the pie of success

-Why you can’t compare or compete with another person or culture’s pain

-How racial conversations with someone who has a white identity can add value


More about the Authors

About the Authors: ALI MICHAEL: pronunciation: ALI (Alee) Michael (no S) - as the Co-Director of the Race Institute for K-12 Educators, Ali Michael, Ph.D. works with schools and organizations across the country to help make research on race, Whiteness, and education more accessible and relevant to educators. Ali is the author of Raising Race Questions: Whiteness, Inquiry and Education, winner of the 2017 Society of Professors of Education Outstanding Book Award. She is a member of a multiracial editorial team and sits on the editorial board of the journal Whiteness and Education. Her article, What do White Children Need to Know About Race?, co-authored with Dr. Eleonora Bartoli in Independent Schools Magazine, won the Association and Media Publishing Gold Award for Best Feature Article in 2014. When she is not writing, speaking, or training, Ali is striving to be an antiracist co-parent to two amazing kids. Her writing and speeches are available at

ELEONORA BARTOLI, PH.D. pronunciation: Elee-uh-nor-uh (pronounced every vowel) - Bart-oh-lee - is a consultant and licensed psychologist, specializing in trauma, resilience-building, and multicultural/social justice counseling. She earned her Ph.D. in Psychology: Human Development/Mental Health Research from the University of Chicago. After receiving her clinical license, she opened a small independent practice, which she has held since. After 15 years in academia (12 of those years as the director of a Master’s in counseling program), she became a full-time consultant. Her mission is to share the tools of counseling and psychology in support of social justice work. Throughout her career, Dr. Bartoli has held leadership positions in professional organizations at both the state and national levels. She has also presented at numerous conferences and is the author of several publications. In all her work, Dr. Bartoli integrates an understanding of neuroscience, focusing on how it informs symptom development as well as healing and resilience-buildin

Naketa Ren Thigpen is a Balance (and) Relationship Advisor activating power couples (and) potent humans ready to self-actualize wholeness |Architect of Intentionally Selfish Suite Incubator- Training & Certification for Women Entrepreneurs| Podcast Host & Transformational Speaker. Interested in learning more, visit

Ready to activate joy in work/life (and LOVE), enjoy this Complimentary Masterclass at




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