Ever wondered what it would be like to go from 30 clients a week, burned out and underpaid, to a thriving private practice built around your values and strengths? In this episode, I chat with Natasha Dean, a clinician in Baltimore, about her incredible three-year journey from group practice overwhelm to confidently charging $200 per session and attracting right-fit clients.

Natasha shares the pivotal mindset shifts that helped her trust herself, market authentically, and stop playing small. We talk about how she found her micro niche (therapy for Muslim adult children of immigrants), transitioned off insurance panels, and discovered the joy of brainspotting intensives. She also opens up about how Confident Copy helped her write copy that truly resonates—not just for therapy, but for other creative projects too.

Whether you're on the edge of burnout or dreaming of a more aligned practice, this episode will leave you inspired to believe in what's possible.

Here’s what you’ll learn in this episode: 

1️⃣ Why being a "blank slate" therapist might be burning you out—and what happens when you finally show up as yourself 

2️⃣ The power of choosing a micro niche and how specificity actually attracts more of the right clients 

3️⃣ How Natasha reframed a "slow market" and leaned into long-term networking that continues to pay off

Resources & Links Mentioned:

• Natasha’s practice: goldenhour-counseling.com
• Confident Copy: walkerstrategyco.com/cc
• The Walker Strategy Co website: walkerstrategyco.com

Connect + Subscribe 

Enjoying the podcast? Subscribe so you never miss an episode—and feel free to share it with a fellow therapist who’s building their private practice. Explore more marketing support for therapists: The Walker Strategy Co website: walkerstrategyco.com

About Marketing Therapy 

Marketing Therapy is the podcast where therapists learn how to market their private practices without burnout, self-doubt, or sleazy tactics. Hosted by Anna Walker—marketing coach, strategist, and founder of Walker Strategy Co—each episode brings you clear, grounded advice to help you attract the right-fit, full-fee clients and grow a practice you feel proud of.

Hey, hey, welcome back to Marketing Therapy.

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I'm so excited to share this one with you.

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In this interview, I sit down with Natasha

Dean, who is a clinician in Baltimore.

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We talk all about her story, and we

cover a lot of ground here, but Natasha

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shares about going from working in a

group practice, serving 30 clients a

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week, whoever she's assigned to, to now

attracting right fit clients at $200 a

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session, and doing it in a way that feels.

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Really authentic and aligned and

creating a practice now where she has

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margin for exploring other ways of

serving people, other revenue streams.

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We talk about a lot here.

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I can't wait for you

to get to know Natasha.

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And so enough for me.

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Let's get into it.

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Alright, Natasha, welcome to the show.

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Can you start with introducing

yourself, who you are, where

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you're located, a little bit about

yourself and your background.

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Natasha Deen: Yeah, so I'm Natasha.

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I am A-L-C-P-C and I am located

in Maryland, but I'm licensed

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in both Maryland and Virginia.

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And I support Bipoc clients, adults,

individual adults in doing deep

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work, trauma-informed care and brain

spotting, and my micro niche, um, it's

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therapy for Muslim adult children of

immigrants and kind of helping them

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take care of themselves the same

way that they take care of others.

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Yeah, I

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Anna Walker: think that

answered all of your questions.

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Perfect.

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Perfect.

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Tell me about the season of life or kind

of practice that you're in right now.

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I, we're gonna talk about your

journey and how you got here, but

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where are you finding yourself today?

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Here, 2025.

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And in this wild world we're living in.

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Natasha Deen: Yeah, so I am almost three

years into my own private practice.

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And there've been a lot of shifts

lately, so I have a few new

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offerings, so that's really exciting.

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But I'm definitely in a place

that I didn't expect to be at all.

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It was like a dream to be in this position

that I'm in now, and I really didn't.

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Think that it was gonna

happen especially so soon.

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'cause I worked with you almost

three years ago when I first started.

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So like the amount of change that

I've gone through in just the three

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years has been, I've surprised myself.

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Anna Walker: Okay.

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Well I wanna know all about that,

but first take us back like to the

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beginning, three years ago, even before

that, what was life like when you

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decided to jump into private practice?

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Where were you in your

life as a therapist?

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Tell us more about that.

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Natasha Deen: Yeah, so I was working

at a different private practice

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for working for somebody else.

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It was their practice and we

accepted insurance, so I was

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like getting a cut of a cut.

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You know, insurance takes their cut

first and then the practice owners

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take their cut and I think I was seeing

like 30 people a week on a good week.

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Yeah.

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Wow.

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Yeah, it was, it was a lot.

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And then, you know, not

making as much as I felt like.

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Compensated for seeing that many people.

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I was actually at a point where I

contemplated leaving the field altogether

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'cause I was just like, I'm burnt out.

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I don't like this.

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We also didn't get to

choose who we worked with.

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They just kind of assigned people

based on availability and to some

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extent like what you offered.

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So it felt like a fit more

so on the client end rather

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than like a both way fit.

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Yeah, so I really thought about

leaving and I think I had a couple of

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friends at the time who were starting

their own private practice and I was

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like, maybe that's what I need to do.

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Maybe I just need to do this in a way

that feels really fulfilling to me.

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Working with the clients that

I knew best how to help and

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felt like a really good fit.

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'cause I did have some on my caseload

who were a really good fit and I actually

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felt, I noticed I was feeling more

energized when working with those clients.

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So I was like, okay, maybe

I don't have to leave.

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Maybe I just need more

of this and that's what.

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Really the, the big thing that

pushed me into private practice.

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And then I found you, like from one

of my friends, Katherine, actually,

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she told me about you and I was like,

okay, let me see what this is about.

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And that was actually, um.

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I started my practice in September,

2022, and I think I started working

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with you like very shortly after that.

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I went and looked

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Anna Walker: it up before this talk.

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Yeah, and I believe it was

November maybe that you joined.

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Yeah,

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Natasha Deen: yeah,

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Anna Walker: yeah, yeah.

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I remember it being fall closer to

winter time, so that sounds right.

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Yeah.

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So when you decided to go into

practice, obviously you were hoping

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to work with people that you enjoyed,

to avoid or, you know, really remedy

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this burnout you were experiencing.

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Mm-hmm.

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Did you have any other big goals

for what this practice would be?

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You mentioned that right now you're

in a place you never would've

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imagined, but back then, what were

you, what were you hoping for?

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Back then I was hoping

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Natasha Deen: for the bare

minimum, I was just like, I

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just wanna do good therapy work.

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I wanna feel more balanced and in a better

position as a therapist to be like my, you

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know, my best self, be supported in what I

need so that I could be a better therapist

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to the clients that I was working with.

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And that was really my only priority.

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And of course, you know, make

more money than I was making.

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But that was really it.

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I didn't have as big.

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What at the time felt like lofty dreams.

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And now like the more that I'm in

it and every time I hit a new goal

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or a milestone, I'm like, well,

I could, like, I could do more.

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I could, you know, I could dream for more.

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I could ask for more.

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I could do more.

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Yeah.

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And I think, you know, when

you're, especially as a therapist.

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You don't really feel like

you can dream that big.

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It feels like I have to just like,

I'm here to just serve other people.

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And that's really it.

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That 'cause like, you know, I think for a

lot of us that generally does, genuinely

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does, um, make us feel fulfilled.

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But then when you can do that and

take care of yourself and see how you

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can continue to support and help your

community in all these other ways when

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you're not burnt out, just trying to

like work with any client that comes

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through your door and you're, on

insurance panels and taking a cut of a or

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getting a cut of a cut, like you are not

really thinking much further than that.

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Anna Walker: Absolutely.

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It's hard to when it's just, you

know, paycheck to paycheck session

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to session in those early days.

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Yeah.

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Early on when you decided to make

this leap from group practice, did you

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do that all at once or did you, like

build your private practice on the

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side while still working at the group?

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What was that transition like for you?

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That it was actually, in

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Natasha Deen: some ways

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Anna Walker: it

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Natasha Deen: was really difficult and

in other ways I think it helped me.

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Be in the position that I'm in right now.

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So like when I decided to leave my

practice and I had had the conversation

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with them, I was originally planning

to slowly build on the side, but.

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It just didn't end up going that way.

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There were some issues and I had to leave

a lot sooner than I wanted to, and I just

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kind of had to like jump straight into it.

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And thankfully at the time I was living

with my parents still, so I was like,

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okay, let me just do everything then.

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Let me get off insurance.

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Let me start my practice, let me,

you know, set a higher fee and just

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do everything at the same time while

I have the safety net, which is also

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why I think I didn't have as big.

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Dreams and goals.

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'cause I was like, I need to just, I

need to just like survive on my feet.

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Yeah.

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Yeah.

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So,

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Anna Walker: okay,

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Natasha Deen: so you kind of ripped off

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Anna Walker: the bandaid.

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You did all the things all at once

there and just took the big leap,

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Natasha Deen: which is why I was like,

okay, now I need to go talk to Anna

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because how do, how do I like, not speed

up the process, but like, how do I do

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this right and get it right from the jump?

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Anna Walker: Sure, sure.

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Okay.

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Interesting.

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When you were in those early days,

and obviously we met pretty soon

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after, what felt, if you can remember,

the most daunting at that time?

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So you'd made these decisions, you

started the practice, you raised

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your fees, you deep paneled.

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What was the biggest like dun, dun, dun

like thing you had to do or overcome?

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Natasha Deen: Where am

I gonna find people?

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How are people gonna find me?

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Like through insurance, it's

really easy for people to find you.

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You get full really quickly through

insurance, but now it's like, I'm.

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I'm start and I was pretty early

into my career at that point too.

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Anyway, I had graduated in 2019, so then,

you know, between 2019 and 2022, still

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being a fairly new therapist at that.

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And then I'm like, okay, well I've

spent all this time not trying to.

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Really make a name for myself, but

just trying to get, get into the swing

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of things as a therapist, just trying

to figure out how to help people.

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And now I have to continue doing that

and figure out how to be a business

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owner, how to start a practice, how

to do all these, and then do all these

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things that I didn't go to school for.

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Running a business, marketing,

you know, all of that.

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Had to figure out how

to do all at one time.

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So that was, I think, marketing.

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And figuring out how clients will find me.

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Were the, like that they kind

of go hand in hand, but it was

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the scariest part of all of it.

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Yeah, absolutely.

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Anna Walker: Making that

leap is, is terrifying.

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So you heard about Confident Copy

from, from a friend, from Catherine.

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You joined.

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What stood out to you?

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It has been a while now and we got

to work together again as you sort of

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rejoined confident copy earlier this year.

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But in your original experience,

what support tools, breakthroughs

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did you have or, or did you

find really stood out to you?

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Natasha Deen: I think the biggest

takeaway from all of it was the

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emphasis on the copy, right?

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Like how to write copy and how

to write it in a way that is

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gonna attract your ideal client.

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While every like there was, there was

truly so much that was really helpful.

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I think.

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That was the biggest takeaway because

even in some of the things that I'm

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doing now, the things that I learned

from Confident Copy and how to write is

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benefiting me in all of these other ways.

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So like marketing in other areas

in some of these other like

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non therapy related spaces.

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So that I think just that you

were like, okay, I am gonna

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teach you guys how to do this.

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I'm not gonna like, you know,

you have the done for you.

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Programs, which is great, but you're

also like, I'm gonna show you how you

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do this thing so that you're set up in

the future, which is so much of how I do

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my work as a therapist, where I'm like,

I don't want you to be dependent on me.

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I'm gonna give you these tools

and these skills so that you can

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figure it out and I'll be there to

support you, and then you're gonna

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be fine to go do that on your own.

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So it, that resonated with me so much.

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And that's exactly what

I got out of the program.

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And I, I can't even tell you how many

times I've gone back to the vault and

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revamped my website or how many times

I've even gone back to the vault to

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use it for non therapy related things.

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And it's just been incredibly

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Anna Walker: helpful.

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Yeah, I think it, it's interesting,

it's easy to discount words, um, because

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words don't feel as sexy or shiny as

SEO or Google Ads or Instagram reels,

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and yet none of those things work.

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Well, if you don't have

the words figured out.

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Right.

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So I love hearing that

reflection from you.

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It's, it's one of the coolest parts I

think about Confident Copy is not only

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are you hopefully leaving with an idea

of your niche and a good website, but a

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way of talking about and thinking about

your work and your marketing so that

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whatever it is you do next, even if it's

non therapy related, you have a strategy

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you can return to and you can trust.

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Natasha Deen: Yeah, yeah.

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No, I agree.

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I think it's, and it like

confident copy is the perfect.

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Name for it too, because it's

like, you also were encouraging

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us to be confident in these skills

and building these, um, building

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these skills and using these tools.

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And I think that that was another,

like really big piece of all of

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this, being more confident in how

and, and how to express myself.

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Like have that come across in

a really authentic way, not.

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Therapist speak, but speaking to

an ideal client and really hitting

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their pain points so they feel

like they're heard and understand,

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understood before they even come in.

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'cause I, it was like, I could do

that, I could do that in a consult

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call and I could really connect

with people on a consult call.

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But how, how do I write that on

a website for like, you know,

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the general public, basically,

how do I connect with everybody?

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And even that, I think, I can't remember.

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Where I heard this before, but it's like.

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As a business owner, you have

to say no more than you say yes.

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'cause you're making room for all

of the, you know, right fit clients

256

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or the right fit opportunities.

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And I think like when we're talking about

niching down and when you're talking about

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speaking to an ideal client, it's like

saying no to the people who are not a

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good fit right up front, which is really

scary, especially when you're in a place.

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When you're like, I, but I need clients.

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I don't have any clients, or I

need, you know, a certain amount of

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income and I'm just not there yet.

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So it, it made me think a lot of how.

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You kind of like teach things

incompetent copy, where it's like,

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it's okay to say no to these people

who aren't, aren't a good fit.

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That just means you're gonna attract the

people who are a really good fit, who see

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themselves in the way that you're writing.

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And so when I could get out of that

head space of I'm writing so that

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everybody can see themselves here,

it's more of you're writing so that the

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person that you really do wanna work

with and do your best work with knows

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that you're the right person for them.

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Mm-hmm.

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Just like you put in a consult call.

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Anna Walker: Yeah, that's

a powerful shift for sure.

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What surprised you most about

your own growth through the

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process of Confident Copy?

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You know, having gone from working with

this wide range of clients, whoever was

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sent your way in the group practice to

now essentially getting to choose, getting

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to say yes and say no, figuring out

your niche, what, where do you feel like

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you grew the most through that process?

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Natasha Deen: I think maybe just

like understanding a little bit more.

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Of where my skillset lies, like

what I'm really good at, but

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what I can do, what I can't do.

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'cause before when it was just like you

have to, it felt like you have to fit.

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Yourself into this box that like the

client brings into session versus

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like, you are just here and this

client is also just here and you

287

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guys just work from the beginning.

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You've established that before

they even come in and you can like

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authentically help them and even in ways.

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That, and I've been really surprised

how I like my, some of my, I guess

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like techniques even have changed as

a therapist where I went from trying

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to be this blank slate to like, that's

not gonna work with my ideal client.

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Like, I disclose a lot more, obviously

in ways that are appropriate, but like

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having such similar life experiences to

some of my clients when just sharing.

295

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Oh yeah, I, I know what that's like.

296

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And not saying anything more,

they're just like, oh, okay.

297

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Like, you get it, you get it.

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Then I don't have to explain this.

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And that really resonating with people.

300

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But I couldn't do it before because one,

it wasn't true, it wasn't authentic.

301

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And two, like it also felt like if I.

302

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You know, going back to that

idea of fitting into a box.

303

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If I couldn't fit in this box in

this way, then I had to like try and

304

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figure it out in a different way.

305

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And then you spend too much obsession in

your head and trying to figure out, well,

306

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what do you need and how do I be that?

307

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And that's not helpful to anybody.

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Anna Walker: Interesting.

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That's a cool, that's a

cool byproduct that as you.

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Get clear on the work that you do

well and you attract the people

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that you're designed to serve.

312

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Like it, it serves everyone better, right?

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What you, the therapist, you're able

to be in the room is a better therapist

314

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because you're sitting down and you're

not in an uncomfortable box, right?

315

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Yeah.

316

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Yeah, exactly.

317

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Cool, cool.

318

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Um, alright.

319

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Tell me about what you're up to now.

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You mentioned having experienced

things you never would have, uh,

321

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dreamt of, and you've also done

some kind of niche evolution.

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Yeah.

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So give us a little bit of an update.

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Where's, where does Natasha

find herself today in 2025?

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Natasha Deen: Yeah, so I think this was

something that you've also mentioned in

326

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Confident Copy, but it wasn't, and I don't

know if I just like didn't pay attention

327

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to it too much at the time, but you had

mentioned how like if you can get your

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copyright, you can set your rate at a rate

that you need it to be, you want it to be,

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and you will attract those clients and you

know, it's, it's not gonna feel like I'm.

330

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Stating this quote unquote crazy

fee, and then you're trying to

331

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desperately fill those spots.

332

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So my fee is 200, which

is average for my area.

333

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But it took me a little

while to get to that point.

334

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'cause I was just so scared that

like, people aren't gonna come,

335

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they're not gonna wanna pay 200.

336

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And like, what do I have

to offer that's worth 200?

337

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You know, those types of thoughts.

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And so as I've, like I just

mentioned as I've evolved as

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a therapist, seeing how like.

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You know, there are things that

I offer that people need and they

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would be willing to pay that amount.

342

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And so I've also been able to do

brainspotting intensives, offer

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Brainspotting intensives, which is

one of my favorite things to do.

344

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And one of my goals was to like do that

more often so that I could see less.

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People on a weekly basis and then

have brain spotting intensives and

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still be like, okay, income wise,

but do more of that work That feels

347

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really aligned with me and like, you

know, again, tapping into my skills

348

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that I'm just like really good at.

349

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So then doing that, making that shift.

350

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I think within the past year and a half.

351

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It's also given me more time in

my schedule to do other things.

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So now like I'm in the middle of

creating a guided journal and like I

353

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said, not like it is kind of therapy

related, but in a totally different way.

354

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And again, using what I've learned

in competent copy to help like market

355

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that journal and even some of like

the ways that I've written things in

356

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the journal too, but like getting to

have, I think just live a life that's

357

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more authentic and in a way that I get

to help people in so many different.

358

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Ways as well.

359

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Like not just feeling like my job as

a therapist is just to show up, see

360

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30 people a week, come home totally

exhausted and drained, but like, no.

361

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Now I get to come home and do more things

for people and support my community Yeah.

362

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In another way.

363

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Mm-hmm.

364

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And still have that time for

myself and still be able to

365

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meet my income goals and things

366

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Anna Walker: like that.

367

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So

368

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Natasha Deen: yeah.

369

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Anna Walker: How wonderful.

370

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So you're at 200 a session right

now, and how are most of your

371

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ideal clients often finding you?

372

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It

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Natasha Deen: used to be through

Psychology Today on my website now it's

374

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like my website and networking and mm-hmm.

375

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You know, both of that.

376

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My website, you

377

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Anna Walker: know, confident copy.

378

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Yeah.

379

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It all comes back to that.

380

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It's, it's interesting how that works.

381

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Yeah.

382

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How cool.

383

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To think back to, like you said, that

like seeing 30 clients a week burnt out,

384

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contemplating leaving the field to now.

385

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Having, like serving in all

of these different ways and

386

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feeling a lot more fulfilled,

that's quite the transformation,

387

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especially in just three years.

388

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You mentioned being surprised

that you are here now.

389

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What's the most surprising about them?

390

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I think when.

391

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Natasha Deen: You can really show

up to everything that you do.

392

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Like, especially work authentically.

393

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You open the door for so

many other opportunities.

394

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And I just did not realize that before

because I could not be authentic

395

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at work where it felt like I had,

again, fitting into that box and

396

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trying to be what clients needed.

397

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So that drains you too.

398

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That burns you out too.

399

00:18:07,834 --> 00:18:10,834

You have no energy left for

yourself, for your family, for

400

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like other things, friends.

401

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So when you're just like.

402

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Like not getting to be who you are

and share your skills, your talents,

403

00:18:18,699 --> 00:18:20,439

your strengths with the world, then.

404

00:18:21,774 --> 00:18:24,384

You're like not able to meet

some of these other goals.

405

00:18:24,384 --> 00:18:28,554

I think through confident copy, if I'm

able to express myself in a way that

406

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speaks to my ideal client, and it's

not, again, you know, like it's not

407

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about you, it's also about your client,

but in a way that works for both of

408

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you, then that helps you to accomplish

so many other things that feel really

409

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aligned with your values, your goals,

and it doesn't have to be in a way.

410

00:18:45,819 --> 00:18:47,379

Feels like icky or gross.

411

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Like I know when you talk about

marketing or networking, it's like,

412

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you know, people feel like, it feels

like it has to be in the, these like

413

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slimy, salesy, salesy kind of ways.

414

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And it doesn't have to be like that

when you just, you show up really

415

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authentically in your work, in your

copy, in the things that you do.

416

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And so I was really surprised at how

many doors that open just by truly

417

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being authentic and getting that across.

418

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Anna Walker: Mm.

419

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That's really powerful.

420

00:19:12,984 --> 00:19:16,674

I want to talk a little bit about

the, um, micro niche that you've

421

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identified and a little bit of the

evolution that you've experienced.

422

00:19:19,074 --> 00:19:22,704

So recent or earlier this year, you joined

CC Extended, which is where you kind

423

00:19:22,704 --> 00:19:26,094

of jumped back into the live calls and

things, which was so fun to see you again.

424

00:19:26,364 --> 00:19:30,354

Um, what led you to sort of add on

this micro niche, um, and how is

425

00:19:30,354 --> 00:19:32,064

that part of your practice going?

426

00:19:32,064 --> 00:19:32,754

How'd you get there?

427

00:19:32,754 --> 00:19:33,534

Tell me a little bit about that.

428

00:19:34,479 --> 00:19:37,569

Natasha Deen: Yeah, funny enough,

I feel like it wasn't super

429

00:19:37,569 --> 00:19:40,749

explicit on my website, but it

was what I was doing anyway.

430

00:19:40,749 --> 00:19:46,449

So again, so again, like just trying to

get that across in, in the copy because

431

00:19:46,479 --> 00:19:49,539

I think I had a client say I could tell.

432

00:19:49,944 --> 00:19:54,624

What you do and like, you know, how you

work, but it was kind of subtle and I

433

00:19:54,624 --> 00:19:57,294

was like, okay, well then I need to go

back to Confident copy and figure out

434

00:19:57,294 --> 00:20:02,394

how to make it like, you know, more,

more visible, more like very clearly this

435

00:20:02,394 --> 00:20:03,924

is what I do and this is how it works.

436

00:20:04,284 --> 00:20:08,094

Um, and that's how I ended up coming back

and like getting really specific in the

437

00:20:08,094 --> 00:20:12,834

micro niche because I think that there

was still a part of me that was trying to.

438

00:20:14,724 --> 00:20:17,064

Write more broadly, speak to more people.

439

00:20:17,064 --> 00:20:20,214

And like I said, even though there

were certain pages that I updated

440

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or pages that I added, I think the

core of my website had stayed the

441

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same since when I first joined.

442

00:20:26,094 --> 00:20:27,054

So when.

443

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Just like me being in a different

mindset after having worked with

444

00:20:30,939 --> 00:20:34,539

clients where I could feel more

authentic with, and I was going, like,

445

00:20:34,539 --> 00:20:38,259

I was trying to write this copy when

I was not quite in that place yet.

446

00:20:38,319 --> 00:20:41,169

So seeing how that's

shifted and how I show up.

447

00:20:41,169 --> 00:20:43,419

When I went back and actually

read through my website, I was

448

00:20:43,419 --> 00:20:44,889

like, oh no, this is not right.

449

00:20:44,889 --> 00:20:46,569

Like this doesn't resonate anymore.

450

00:20:46,599 --> 00:20:47,950

So yeah, that's, I think.

451

00:20:48,424 --> 00:20:50,584

Like you said that this was

kind of always my niche.

452

00:20:50,584 --> 00:20:52,744

I just didn't fully realize that yet.

453

00:20:52,774 --> 00:20:55,474

Anna Walker: Yeah, and sometimes

it does take sitting with it

454

00:20:55,504 --> 00:20:58,054

and meeting those clients and

working with those clients mm-hmm.

455

00:20:58,294 --> 00:21:01,324

To kind of feel like you have permission

to get a little bit more specific.

456

00:21:01,324 --> 00:21:05,284

I think it's one of the cool examples

of how evolution is healthy and

457

00:21:05,284 --> 00:21:09,034

normal and good and effective,

quite frankly, in your marketing.

458

00:21:09,669 --> 00:21:13,119

Natasha Deen: I think it's really

interesting too that despite not having it

459

00:21:13,179 --> 00:21:17,559

as explicitly stated on my website, like

the clients were still finding me and the

460

00:21:17,559 --> 00:21:19,149

right fit clients, were still finding me.

461

00:21:19,149 --> 00:21:24,279

So I think, like I hope that this

is kind of a proof to everybody that

462

00:21:24,309 --> 00:21:27,609

even when you micro niche, like in

you're worried that you're not gonna

463

00:21:27,609 --> 00:21:30,669

get certain people or you're worried

that like you need to speak more

464

00:21:30,669 --> 00:21:33,249

broadly, there is something about you.

465

00:21:33,484 --> 00:21:35,614

Something that you do that people need.

466

00:21:35,674 --> 00:21:40,654

And no matter how you may try to like hide

that, it's not gonna be totally hidden.

467

00:21:40,654 --> 00:21:43,744

It's gonna come out and people want

that and they're looking for that.

468

00:21:43,744 --> 00:21:47,824

But you know, if you could just

be a little bit more clear about

469

00:21:47,824 --> 00:21:51,664

it and explicit, then it's gonna

attract people so much more easily

470

00:21:51,664 --> 00:21:53,434

and quickly and obviously Yes.

471

00:21:53,434 --> 00:21:56,664

So I think, you know, that was

something else that surprised me too.

472

00:21:56,664 --> 00:21:57,684

Like, wow, okay.

473

00:21:57,714 --> 00:22:00,744

No matter what we do, even when we

try and be a blank slate, like that's

474

00:22:00,744 --> 00:22:02,124

not really happening in that way.

475

00:22:02,414 --> 00:22:02,984

Anna Walker: Interesting.

476

00:22:02,984 --> 00:22:03,164

Yeah.

477

00:22:03,164 --> 00:22:05,894

The power of of showing up to your

marketing in an authentic way.

478

00:22:06,334 --> 00:22:09,904

We find ourselves right now in 2025,

I know you've heard the same thing I

479

00:22:09,904 --> 00:22:11,434

have, that things have slowed down.

480

00:22:11,434 --> 00:22:14,824

People aren't paying for therapy, it's

hard to get clients, that kind of thing.

481

00:22:14,824 --> 00:22:16,954

Yet here you sit reaching goals.

482

00:22:16,954 --> 00:22:20,164

You didn't ever imagine, you

know, charging $200 an hour.

483

00:22:20,674 --> 00:22:23,644

Uh, you don't have to give me your

whole spiel on what you think the

484

00:22:23,644 --> 00:22:26,944

market is doing, but what would you

say to those therapists who feel

485

00:22:26,944 --> 00:22:30,934

discouraged or maybe do have those

thoughts or beliefs that success is.

486

00:22:31,474 --> 00:22:33,724

You know, not possible or

harder than it used to be.

487

00:22:36,229 --> 00:22:40,369

Natasha Deen: I, the piece about being,

it being harder than it used to be.

488

00:22:40,429 --> 00:22:42,769

I've tried to reframe that

as like, it's just different.

489

00:22:42,769 --> 00:22:46,129

It's, it feels harder because we got

used to something and now we have

490

00:22:46,129 --> 00:22:47,599

to shift, but it's just different.

491

00:22:47,599 --> 00:22:49,279

And like we had to do that

at the beginning, right?

492

00:22:49,279 --> 00:22:51,499

Like whenever you started marketing,

you had to figure that out.

493

00:22:51,499 --> 00:22:54,289

Most of us went to school

only for counseling.

494

00:22:54,289 --> 00:22:55,249

Only for therapy.

495

00:22:55,249 --> 00:23:00,679

So no matter what, I think it might be

just a little bit hard to shift into

496

00:23:00,679 --> 00:23:04,429

a different mindset, but it's not, I

wouldn't necessarily say it's like.

497

00:23:04,734 --> 00:23:08,124

Harder than anything that you,

you know, we've already done

498

00:23:08,124 --> 00:23:09,294

and tried to figure out before.

499

00:23:09,504 --> 00:23:11,574

And then I would say, look at the numbers.

500

00:23:11,574 --> 00:23:14,274

Like I listened to your most

recent podcast episode and

501

00:23:14,274 --> 00:23:15,534

that really resonated with me.

502

00:23:15,534 --> 00:23:18,324

I think sometimes we feel that.

503

00:23:18,844 --> 00:23:20,014

Things have slowed down.

504

00:23:20,014 --> 00:23:23,944

And that might be true, but if you're

still hitting certain goals, like income

505

00:23:23,944 --> 00:23:27,104

goals, if your income hasn't changed,

if you're still seeing, X amount of

506

00:23:27,104 --> 00:23:31,574

clients a week or things are balancing

out, then like it, did it really slow

507

00:23:31,574 --> 00:23:33,404

down or does it just feel different?

508

00:23:33,404 --> 00:23:37,114

And so I think, trying to go based

off of facts versus feelings, which,

509

00:23:37,174 --> 00:23:40,744

you know, as therapists we're all

familiar with, but that, that really

510

00:23:40,744 --> 00:23:42,784

stood out to me that really resonated.

511

00:23:42,784 --> 00:23:46,324

'cause I think in the

summer, for whatever reason.

512

00:23:47,734 --> 00:23:50,944

It feels like things slow down a

lot more than they actually do.

513

00:23:51,004 --> 00:23:53,584

When I, every single summer, I

go back and look at the numbers

514

00:23:53,644 --> 00:23:55,024

and I end up being really busy.

515

00:23:55,024 --> 00:23:57,724

I don't know, like sometimes I'm

seeing less clients, but I end up

516

00:23:57,724 --> 00:23:59,314

being busier and I'm just like, what?

517

00:23:59,314 --> 00:24:00,964

I still don't fully

understand what's happening.

518

00:24:00,964 --> 00:24:02,884

I actually have to sit down

and look at my numbers too.

519

00:24:02,974 --> 00:24:06,214

But I think like, you know,

other things might pick up.

520

00:24:07,054 --> 00:24:10,084

I tend to try and market more

and revisit my website, and

521

00:24:10,084 --> 00:24:12,034

so I'm busier in that sense.

522

00:24:12,064 --> 00:24:15,634

Um, and I may not be busy directly

with client related things, but I

523

00:24:15,634 --> 00:24:20,314

also find that doing brain spotting

intensivess people, because it's

524

00:24:20,314 --> 00:24:26,254

shorter term, people will like, do

that in the summer than necessarily

525

00:24:26,314 --> 00:24:28,144

be ready to do like deep longer work.

526

00:24:28,144 --> 00:24:30,754

So I, I kind of see it from both

perspectives, doing both like

527

00:24:30,754 --> 00:24:31,984

short-term and long-term work.

528

00:24:33,169 --> 00:24:36,589

Yeah, I, I think just, yeah,

like really sitting down and

529

00:24:36,589 --> 00:24:38,149

evaluating what's going on.

530

00:24:38,149 --> 00:24:41,379

And I think the other part of it too

is when you're, again, just being

531

00:24:41,379 --> 00:24:45,009

really clear about what you do,

people are always looking for that.

532

00:24:45,069 --> 00:24:48,519

Even if it slows down, there's always

gonna be somebody who's looking for this

533

00:24:48,519 --> 00:24:52,599

thing that you offer and this thing that

you do, or who you are as a therapist too.

534

00:24:52,689 --> 00:24:55,089

And it's just a matter of like

when they're gonna find you.

535

00:24:55,119 --> 00:24:57,639

The other thing I will say too

is, and I think you might have

536

00:24:57,639 --> 00:24:59,319

mentioned this in that same episode.

537

00:25:00,609 --> 00:25:03,329

It like the ups and downs

are always gonna be there.

538

00:25:03,359 --> 00:25:06,989

Especially as a owning a business,

there's always gonna be ups and downs.

539

00:25:06,989 --> 00:25:10,559

What you really have to look at is, does

it even out at the end of that year?

540

00:25:10,799 --> 00:25:14,639

Because if it is slower in the

summer, but then every fall it

541

00:25:14,639 --> 00:25:18,119

picks up and you make way more,

then like it kind of balances out.

542

00:25:18,124 --> 00:25:18,384

Right.

543

00:25:18,629 --> 00:25:19,049

That.

544

00:25:19,049 --> 00:25:21,839

And when I started looking at it,

and now because it's been almost

545

00:25:21,839 --> 00:25:23,399

three years, I have more information.

546

00:25:23,399 --> 00:25:26,549

I can see more trends, but at the

very beginning when it was like,

547

00:25:26,549 --> 00:25:29,339

well, this never happened when I

was taking insurance, this never

548

00:25:29,339 --> 00:25:33,029

happened when, you know, I was working

for someone else, it did, but I

549

00:25:33,029 --> 00:25:34,529

just didn't see it or notice it as

550

00:25:34,529 --> 00:25:34,799

Anna Walker: much.

551

00:25:34,829 --> 00:25:36,629

Yeah, yeah, absolutely.

552

00:25:36,629 --> 00:25:39,119

The seasonality and everyone's

seasonality is a little bit unique.

553

00:25:39,749 --> 00:25:42,149

And the longer you are in it,

the more comfortable you can

554

00:25:42,149 --> 00:25:43,529

be with those ebbs and flows.

555

00:25:43,529 --> 00:25:45,719

But there's, it's very, it's so

natural to have a little bit of

556

00:25:45,719 --> 00:25:47,069

anxiety when those things come up.

557

00:25:47,069 --> 00:25:47,909

But you're absolutely right.

558

00:25:47,909 --> 00:25:51,809

If we can zoom out and keep an eye on the

trends and the overall health as opposed

559

00:25:51,809 --> 00:25:55,889

to just how it feels, usually we can make

decisions from a much more grounded place.

560

00:25:55,889 --> 00:25:58,919

And, and if it is, like you said,

slower, then let's invest that

561

00:25:58,919 --> 00:26:02,129

time in improving optimizing, yeah.

562

00:26:02,429 --> 00:26:02,939

Dreaming.

563

00:26:03,359 --> 00:26:04,109

About what else could, yeah, the

564

00:26:04,109 --> 00:26:08,279

Natasha Deen: way that I look at it

too, I have summer be like my end of

565

00:26:08,279 --> 00:26:10,529

year rather than December because.

566

00:26:11,474 --> 00:26:14,654

Then 'cause you know, if you just look

at it from like summer to summer and

567

00:26:14,654 --> 00:26:18,494

when things slow down, how it typically,

you expect it to typically be at the

568

00:26:18,494 --> 00:26:22,334

end of the year and then look back at

that trend, then it, it looks really

569

00:26:22,334 --> 00:26:25,214

different and it feels really different

than when you go like January to

570

00:26:25,214 --> 00:26:25,784

Anna Walker: December.

571

00:26:25,844 --> 00:26:28,784

What an interesting, I have never heard

of that, but that makes a lot of sense.

572

00:26:28,784 --> 00:26:31,694

And I even just, that little reframe

could actually be really powerful

573

00:26:31,694 --> 00:26:32,624

when you think about your number.

574

00:26:32,624 --> 00:26:32,684

Yeah,

575

00:26:33,224 --> 00:26:37,374

Natasha Deen: I think, and that I feel,

this is like a part of a much different

576

00:26:37,374 --> 00:26:42,354

conversation, but I feel like the cycle

of things, like that's what's more

577

00:26:42,354 --> 00:26:44,244

consistent with human nature anyway.

578

00:26:44,244 --> 00:26:47,154

Like spring feels like the

new year versus in January.

579

00:26:47,154 --> 00:26:51,444

So when I kind of started following that I

was like, okay, yeah, I feel like things.

580

00:26:51,554 --> 00:26:53,084

Align a lot differently.

581

00:26:53,114 --> 00:26:56,864

'cause when you see it as a drop in the

middle of the year, that's really scary.

582

00:26:56,864 --> 00:27:00,044

But when you see it as like, I

think people think, oh, holiday

583

00:27:00,044 --> 00:27:01,394

time, it's the end of the year.

584

00:27:01,394 --> 00:27:02,504

Things will slow down.

585

00:27:02,534 --> 00:27:06,134

I don't know if it's just me and maybe

the population I work with, but I've never

586

00:27:06,134 --> 00:27:09,794

really seen it slow down at the end of the

year like that, like I have in the summer.

587

00:27:09,854 --> 00:27:13,004

And so if you're expecting that at the

end of your year, just shift your year.

588

00:27:13,334 --> 00:27:13,574

Anna Walker: Yeah.

589

00:27:13,664 --> 00:27:14,384

Yeah, absolutely.

590

00:27:14,384 --> 00:27:17,204

That's the, the solution here is to

just follow a different calendar.

591

00:27:17,204 --> 00:27:17,744

I love that.

592

00:27:19,224 --> 00:27:20,244

This has been so wonderful.

593

00:27:20,244 --> 00:27:21,504

Natasha, I learned so much about you.

594

00:27:21,504 --> 00:27:24,054

I didn't know all the ins and outs

of this journey you've been on.

595

00:27:24,114 --> 00:27:28,344

When you look back over the last three

years, what habits or maybe mindset

596

00:27:28,344 --> 00:27:31,494

shifts do you think have made the

biggest difference for you to, to

597

00:27:31,494 --> 00:27:33,114

be experiencing the success you are.

598

00:27:33,114 --> 00:27:33,144

I.

599

00:27:38,109 --> 00:27:40,959

Natasha Deen: One of the biggest ones,

again, with networking, it's just building

600

00:27:40,959 --> 00:27:43,569

connections and like as therapists

we're really good at doing that.

601

00:27:43,569 --> 00:27:47,079

Anyway, once I realized that

that's all it truly is about, I

602

00:27:47,079 --> 00:27:48,429

was like, oh, that's not so bad.

603

00:27:48,429 --> 00:27:49,419

That's not so scary.

604

00:27:49,569 --> 00:27:52,239

You get to just go out and make

friends and then hope that that

605

00:27:52,239 --> 00:27:53,979

brings, you know, brings you clients.

606

00:27:53,979 --> 00:27:54,219

Exactly.

607

00:27:54,349 --> 00:27:56,179

And that makes it way less.

608

00:27:57,334 --> 00:27:59,824

You know, stressful, anxiety inducing.

609

00:27:59,884 --> 00:28:03,484

And I think like now, again,

now that it's, it's been some

610

00:28:03,484 --> 00:28:07,024

time since I first planted those

seeds like three-ish years ago.

611

00:28:07,084 --> 00:28:12,244

I'm starting to see those, uh, client

referrals come in more so from people

612

00:28:12,244 --> 00:28:16,234

that I started talking to like almost

three years ago because now they,

613

00:28:16,234 --> 00:28:18,034

they can like put more of a face.

614

00:28:18,254 --> 00:28:21,254

To my name and they know

more and more what I do.

615

00:28:21,254 --> 00:28:25,274

If I'm like showing up at certain

events consistently or you know,

616

00:28:25,274 --> 00:28:28,784

responding in the group messages, then

they start to see like, oh, okay, like

617

00:28:28,784 --> 00:28:31,904

this is a, it's like, you know, you

become familiar in their mind or they

618

00:28:31,904 --> 00:28:33,674

get to know who you are as a person.

619

00:28:33,914 --> 00:28:37,844

So then they're more willing to, or I, I

think more willing to refer to you 'cause

620

00:28:37,844 --> 00:28:39,974

they know you, but you're also like.

621

00:28:40,864 --> 00:28:43,594

Come to the top of their mind

because you're just showing up more.

622

00:28:43,684 --> 00:28:48,094

It reminds me of election time when

people see certain names that it's just

623

00:28:48,094 --> 00:28:51,034

like, I don't know anything about this

person, but I see their name all the time.

624

00:28:51,454 --> 00:28:51,514

Yeah.

625

00:28:51,514 --> 00:28:52,468

So it's kind of like that.

626

00:28:53,008 --> 00:28:56,428

And so I'm seeing that way more

now, three years in than I was

627

00:28:56,428 --> 00:28:57,898

necessarily seeing at the beginning.

628

00:28:57,898 --> 00:29:01,648

So even if you're not immediately

getting the responses that you want,

629

00:29:01,648 --> 00:29:04,768

like you're, you gotta, you gotta

think of it like the long game here.

630

00:29:04,768 --> 00:29:06,688

You have to see way bigger picture.

631

00:29:06,748 --> 00:29:09,988

And I know sometimes it can be hard to

put in effort when you're not seeing

632

00:29:10,048 --> 00:29:11,788

some sort of result, but it really does.

633

00:29:11,853 --> 00:29:12,303

Payoff.

634

00:29:12,303 --> 00:29:13,533

It really does make a difference.

635

00:29:13,593 --> 00:29:13,893

Yeah,

636

00:29:14,133 --> 00:29:17,073

Anna Walker: that's a wonderful example

of, I think just staying in touch with

637

00:29:17,073 --> 00:29:21,723

your marketing and keeping that long

game, um, because it's very, very easy

638

00:29:21,723 --> 00:29:24,663

and in this market where networking

matters, I think more than it ever has.

639

00:29:24,663 --> 00:29:28,353

It's very easy to get discouraged

when you don't get the email back or

640

00:29:28,353 --> 00:29:30,813

you meet someone and they say they're

will send people your way, and they

641

00:29:30,813 --> 00:29:32,313

never do, quote unquote, never.

642

00:29:32,923 --> 00:29:36,163

You know, six months, a year, two

years, three years from now, like you

643

00:29:36,163 --> 00:29:39,703

are planting a seed that has so much

potential, but you do, you have to be

644

00:29:39,703 --> 00:29:41,203

willing to cultivate that and mm-hmm.

645

00:29:41,443 --> 00:29:43,483

I think in this market, that's

a huge trend that I'm seeing.

646

00:29:43,493 --> 00:29:46,643

The clinicians like you who are

experiencing success are the

647

00:29:46,643 --> 00:29:50,003

people who are keeping the long

game remaining consistent, being

648

00:29:50,003 --> 00:29:51,533

willing to evolve and pivot.

649

00:29:51,593 --> 00:29:53,633

Um, and you're a great

example of all those things.

650

00:29:54,263 --> 00:29:56,813

Natasha Deen: Yeah, and it truly

doesn't, like you can do it in

651

00:29:56,813 --> 00:29:58,223

ways that feel really sustainable.

652

00:29:58,223 --> 00:30:02,063

Like I'm in a few different group chats

and it can be hard to keep up with

653

00:30:02,063 --> 00:30:05,663

group chats, but I think even if you

just jump in when people are having

654

00:30:05,663 --> 00:30:09,743

more ca casual conversations or like,

I've seen people send funny memes.

655

00:30:09,743 --> 00:30:11,183

You know what's actually really funny?

656

00:30:11,183 --> 00:30:16,103

I had somebody reach out to me because

in a, a group, I think she asked for,

657

00:30:16,703 --> 00:30:19,733

or somebody else, actually, it was

a different therapist had asked for.

658

00:30:20,123 --> 00:30:24,253

A referral for like, you know, to

somebody offer X, Y, and Z, whatever.

659

00:30:24,313 --> 00:30:26,683

And I had responded and I was just like.

660

00:30:27,343 --> 00:30:29,353

Really, I, I was actually really short.

661

00:30:29,353 --> 00:30:30,973

I was just like, yes, I do this.

662

00:30:31,033 --> 00:30:31,903

And that was the end of it.

663

00:30:31,903 --> 00:30:34,693

And then she was like, you know, asked

another question about something else,

664

00:30:34,693 --> 00:30:36,373

and then I just responded with just that.

665

00:30:36,373 --> 00:30:39,163

Like, it was very short back and forth.

666

00:30:39,193 --> 00:30:42,853

And a few people in the chat were

like, I really like this conversation.

667

00:30:42,853 --> 00:30:45,253

Like, just direct to the point,

like, it was kind of funny to

668

00:30:45,253 --> 00:30:46,813

watch, but this, this was nice.

669

00:30:46,813 --> 00:30:47,428

And I was like, you know, it's.

670

00:30:47,768 --> 00:30:48,698

Day, it's the end of the week.

671

00:30:48,728 --> 00:30:51,038

This is what you're

getting from me as a joke.

672

00:30:51,038 --> 00:30:54,758

And then somebody else just saw

that interaction and she messaged me

673

00:30:54,758 --> 00:30:58,238

separately and was like, I don't know

what it was about, just seeing that.

674

00:30:58,238 --> 00:31:00,158

But I like, I liked that energy.

675

00:31:00,158 --> 00:31:02,888

So like, you know, wanted to

talk to me based off of that.

676

00:31:02,948 --> 00:31:06,068

And we've, I've referred a couple

of people to her and I'm sure

677

00:31:06,068 --> 00:31:07,298

she's referred people to me too.

678

00:31:07,298 --> 00:31:08,528

I just may not have seen it yet.

679

00:31:08,528 --> 00:31:11,108

But even just simple,

again, being authentic.

680

00:31:11,108 --> 00:31:11,348

Simple.

681

00:31:11,348 --> 00:31:11,733

Being authentic.

682

00:31:12,218 --> 00:31:13,028

I feel like that's the

683

00:31:13,028 --> 00:31:13,778

Anna Walker: theme here.

684

00:31:14,043 --> 00:31:14,703

Natasha Deen: Yeah.

685

00:31:14,763 --> 00:31:15,183

Yeah.

686

00:31:15,183 --> 00:31:19,203

Even that can be enough for somebody

to like have you on the top of

687

00:31:19,203 --> 00:31:20,883

their mind or wanna refer to you.

688

00:31:21,273 --> 00:31:22,263

It's the things that you wouldn't

689

00:31:22,263 --> 00:31:26,523

Anna Walker: always think about, and

just being memorable, showing up as

690

00:31:26,523 --> 00:31:29,613

yourself, being memorable, knowing

your zone of genius, your niche,

691

00:31:29,613 --> 00:31:31,473

who you serve well and trusting.

692

00:31:31,473 --> 00:31:35,163

I think there's a lot of self-trust and

just trust in your efforts here that Yeah.

693

00:31:35,163 --> 00:31:36,213

Eventually does pay off.

694

00:31:36,213 --> 00:31:37,353

Mm-hmm.

695

00:31:37,873 --> 00:31:38,203

Cool.

696

00:31:38,923 --> 00:31:42,643

Um, I know a lot of people are sitting

here listening to the story, Natasha,

697

00:31:42,643 --> 00:31:46,663

and probably resonate with parts of

it, with serving 30 clients a week

698

00:31:46,663 --> 00:31:49,663

or feeling like they are just working

with whoever comes in the door.

699

00:31:49,883 --> 00:31:52,553

Considering leaving the field early on in

their practice, however that, you know,

700

00:31:52,553 --> 00:31:55,433

they might resonate with your story,

what would you, what would you tell them?

701

00:31:58,228 --> 00:31:59,003

Uh, I

702

00:31:59,003 --> 00:31:59,543

Natasha Deen: think just.

703

00:32:00,143 --> 00:32:01,343

Try something different.

704

00:32:01,463 --> 00:32:05,363

You know, like it doesn't it, it

may not be like it was for me.

705

00:32:05,363 --> 00:32:07,673

It may not be that you totally

need to leave the field.

706

00:32:07,733 --> 00:32:11,003

Maybe you just need to do something a

little bit differently or see things

707

00:32:11,003 --> 00:32:12,203

from a different perspective, right?

708

00:32:12,203 --> 00:32:14,993

Like even marketing and networking, if you

just look at it a little bit differently

709

00:32:14,993 --> 00:32:20,333

or shifting the way you like, look at your

yearly cycle, and that can change a lot.

710

00:32:20,333 --> 00:32:21,233

So just try.

711

00:32:21,578 --> 00:32:24,848

To do something, just even if

it's one thing a little bit

712

00:32:24,848 --> 00:32:26,528

differently, and see how that goes.

713

00:32:26,558 --> 00:32:30,638

Because I, I think one of the things that

I often forget is this is my own business.

714

00:32:30,638 --> 00:32:31,538

I can do whatever I want.

715

00:32:31,538 --> 00:32:33,578

Like literally I can do whatever I want.

716

00:32:33,638 --> 00:32:35,438

And I have, yeah.

717

00:32:35,438 --> 00:32:37,748

And I have moments where I'm

just like, oh, I can't do that.

718

00:32:37,748 --> 00:32:38,318

Like that.

719

00:32:38,318 --> 00:32:40,508

And then when I sit back

and I'm like, well, why, why

720

00:32:40,508 --> 00:32:41,828

can't I do something that way?

721

00:32:41,918 --> 00:32:43,448

And there's no real reason.

722

00:32:43,448 --> 00:32:44,018

I think we're just.

723

00:32:44,333 --> 00:32:48,323

Either conditioned by some of the other

environments that we've been in, or

724

00:32:48,323 --> 00:32:52,223

you know, bigger picture things that

you were generally kind of conditioned

725

00:32:52,223 --> 00:32:55,373

into thinking you have to work a nine

to five, or you have to do, you know,

726

00:32:55,373 --> 00:32:57,053

these sort of things and you don't.

727

00:32:57,653 --> 00:32:59,063

So I would say just kind of.

728

00:32:59,783 --> 00:33:04,433

Take some time and sit with yourself and

really even start, like I said too at

729

00:33:04,433 --> 00:33:07,343

the beginning, start to just dream and

ask yourself, what do you really want?

730

00:33:07,373 --> 00:33:10,703

And I think truly that's how I've

accomplished some of my goals.

731

00:33:10,703 --> 00:33:13,853

I remember a couple of years ago, I

was like, it would be really great

732

00:33:13,853 --> 00:33:17,693

if I could see 10 clients a week

and do brain spotting intensives

733

00:33:17,693 --> 00:33:19,403

like once or twice a month.

734

00:33:19,523 --> 00:33:20,454

And I didn't really see.

735

00:33:20,658 --> 00:33:22,908

Set out and was like, this is

how I'm gonna do that and this

736

00:33:22,908 --> 00:33:24,018

is how I'm gonna make it happen.

737

00:33:24,018 --> 00:33:26,118

I just like brought that goal up Often.

738

00:33:26,118 --> 00:33:28,758

I talked about it with people in

my life and it was something that

739

00:33:28,758 --> 00:33:31,368

I just sat and thought about and,

and was like, that would be great.

740

00:33:31,368 --> 00:33:33,378

That would be really cool, and

here are all the things that

741

00:33:33,378 --> 00:33:34,998

I could do if that came true.

742

00:33:35,058 --> 00:33:40,248

And it was just from allowing myself

to want that and to, you know, think

743

00:33:40,248 --> 00:33:44,478

about it that I didn't even realize,

but I started making decisions that.

744

00:33:45,218 --> 00:33:46,808

Put me in that, on that path.

745

00:33:46,838 --> 00:33:49,388

So I think even just, you know,

thinking about things a little bit

746

00:33:49,388 --> 00:33:53,378

differently and then allowing yourself

to dream just a little bit bigger

747

00:33:53,408 --> 00:33:54,698

and a little bit more, and then

748

00:33:54,698 --> 00:33:55,598

Anna Walker: see what happens.

749

00:33:55,658 --> 00:33:56,948

That's really wonderful, Natasha.

750

00:33:56,948 --> 00:33:57,458

Thank you.

751

00:33:57,728 --> 00:33:58,808

I'm so happy you're here today.

752

00:33:58,808 --> 00:34:00,818

We are wishing you all

the success in the world.

753

00:34:00,878 --> 00:34:04,148

If someone wanted to check out the

wonderful website that you've referenced

754

00:34:04,148 --> 00:34:05,348

here, uh, where can they find you?

755

00:34:06,308 --> 00:34:11,318

Natasha Deen: Yeah, so it's

www.goldenhourcounseling.com.

756

00:34:12,023 --> 00:34:12,413

Perfect.

757

00:34:12,413 --> 00:34:13,672

We'll put that in the show notes as well.

758

00:34:13,672 --> 00:34:14,273

Anna Walker: Natasha, thanks

759

00:34:14,273 --> 00:34:15,143

Natasha Deen: so much

for being here today.

760

00:34:15,743 --> 00:34:16,402

Anna Walker: Thank you.