Shownotes
Welcome to GrocerTalk! In this launch episode, sponsored by Instacart Enterprise, Portager, and Vusion, Ben Miller is joined by Omni Talk President & CEO Chris Walton to unpack the news stories from global grocery this week that we believe are worth paying attention to.
This week, they discuss:
• Couche-Tard’s US$8.7bn bid for Żabka, and what it signals about the future of convenience retail. (Source)
• Kroger combining grocery and prescription deliveries, with Instacart, and what’s next for Kroger’s ecommerce strategy. (Source)
• Schnucks’ new AI shopping assistant, and whether conversational commerce is becoming table stakes. (Source)
• Just Eat’s AI Voice Assistant, and what grocers can learn from how foodservice companies are adopting AI voice tools. (Source)
• Amazon’s agreement with AutoStore, and what it tells us about grocery fulfillment automation. (Source)
Plus, GrocerTalk Grab & Go brings more stories to the table, including Walmart’s move into store-based micro-fulfillment, C&S’s Winn-Dixie ambitions, Ahold Delhaize’s savings kiosks, and Waitrose’s new AI assistant for store associates.
GrocerTalk is a new weekly podcast from the Omni Talk Podcast Network covering the trends, innovations and technologies shaping global grocery.
Episode 001. Welcome to GrocerTalk.
P.S. Be sure to check out all our other podcasts from the past week here, too: https://omnitalk.blog/category/podcast/
Music by hooksounds.com.
This podcast uses the following third-party services for analysis:
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Transcripts
Saying that the pace of change has never been quicker is just resorting to a tired old cliche.
Speaker A:But boy, the grocery industry is dynamic right now.
Speaker A:From E commerce acceleration to supply chain volatility agent E commerce to rapidly changing customer preferences.
Speaker A:Every grocery executive has a lot to manage right now and we're here to help.
Speaker A:Every week, this podcast will carefully curate the stories in global grocery retailing for that we feel are worth paying attention to.
Speaker A:Focused on trends, innovation and tech.
Speaker A:We'll look at what the news really means and how it ladders into the biggest trends in our industry.
Speaker A:We'll celebrate what's great and we'll call out potential missteps.
Speaker A:We'll do it honestly, authentically, without cliche, and hopefully in good humour.
Speaker A:A very, very warm welcome to Grocer Talk.
Speaker B:This announcement should scare the pants off US grocery.
Speaker A:They've gone from having 30% of their store base in Europe to 60%.
Speaker B:The future of US grocery is going to be more automated as opposed to less automated.
Speaker A:You have to keep it within your own digital ecosystem.
Speaker B:I'm not really sure what his modus operandi is here, Ben.
Speaker A:I love what they were saying in this next release about bringing in all the nutritional data as well, but there's.
Speaker B:Rarely any smoke without fire.
Speaker B:Grocery Talk listeners.
Speaker A:Fresh back from his summer vacation, Chris Walton.
Speaker A:Welcome, Chris.
Speaker B:Hey, Ben, how are you?
Speaker B:It's great to see you, man.
Speaker B:Starting off Monday morning.
Speaker B:This is great.
Speaker B:I'm so excited to be here with you.
Speaker A:Oh, thank you.
Speaker A:I'm really good.
Speaker A:How was your break?
Speaker B:You're back with friends and ready.
Speaker B:It was fantastic.
Speaker B:As my English teacher used to say, vacations are meant to be vacated.
Speaker B:And I definitely vacated out in California for two weeks.
Speaker B:Did almost nothing except sit outside and walk around and get as much sun as I could.
Speaker B:As you could probably tell because I'm not as pasty white as I normally am.
Speaker A:Ben, you're looking very healthy.
Speaker A:Very healthy.
Speaker A:Much healthier than I am.
Speaker A:Have been locked away in my attic.
Speaker A:But.
Speaker A:But look, Chris, before we dive into the news of the week, this is our very first episode, so it is.
Speaker A:I think we.
Speaker A:I think we should properly introduce ourselves, we should introduce the podcast and we should introduce the OMNITALK podcast network.
Speaker B:100, 100%.
Speaker B:And I think as.
Speaker B:As host of Grocery Talk, Ben, I think you should kick us off.
Speaker B:I think you should have the honors on that one.
Speaker A:So I'm Ben Miller.
Speaker A:I'm co founder with Chris of Grocery Talk, and yet I will be your host and editor each week.
Speaker A:So I'm A. I'm a retail analyst by trade with my real passion is grocery.
Speaker A:That's where I started my career at Safeway here in the uk.
Speaker A:I did roles in marketing, in commercial and ultimately in investor relations.
Speaker A:From there I joined a global grocery research and consultancy organization, igd.
Speaker A:I started first as international retail analyst focused on the US so that's when I started my sort of 20 plus year relationship with US grocery.
Speaker A:And look, I did a good stint with them and ended as chief Content officer.
Speaker A:And after that I then have spent the last four years as vice president at Shop Talk and Grocery Shop where I led research and insights globally right across the portfolio.
Speaker A:So in a nutshell, that's me, Chris, for those who don't know you, go on introduce yourself and the podcast network.
Speaker B:Yeah, for sure, Ben.
Speaker B:So you know, I mean for many listeners, I mean there's probably many listeners that are very aware of Omnitalk and are familiar with me, but I also imagine, and quite frankly, Ben, I think you'll agree, and I hope we have many new listeners tuning in to today's podcast for the very first time.
Speaker B:Because, well, yeah, you know, you and I met at Grocery Shop and Shop Talk, that's where you and I got acquainted.
Speaker B:But I myself am a longtime retailer too.
Speaker B:Spent over 20 years in industry at both the Gap and Target, held executive level positions in merchandising, e commerce and strategy.
Speaker B:And about nine years ago I went out on my own and I founded Omnitalk on a hunch.
Speaker B:On a hunch, Ben, that there was a real white space for honest, frank editorial commentary about the headlines impacting the retail industry from the people that have actually done the job, as opposed to journalists who oftentimes, you know, in my opinion, just regurgitate what they are told.
Speaker B:And I caught wind of that in your intro today, Ben too.
Speaker B:So I really enjoyed that.
Speaker B:So, you know, the effort, the effort started out with me writing articles.
Speaker B:I later got into podcasting, growing our weekly podcast, Omni Talk Retail Fast five into one of the most listened to podcasts in the industry.
Speaker B:And now today, with your help, Ben Miller, we are launching a full fledged podcast network.
Speaker B:With the debut of Grocer Talk, I couldn't be more excited, I couldn't be more excited to have you in the full, Ben, and, and, and possibly others.
Speaker B:I'm going to tease that possibly others into the fold very soon as well.
Speaker B:So yeah, let's do this.
Speaker A:Exciting times, Chris.
Speaker A:And it's amazing.
Speaker A:It's the, it's the editorial approach that you'd always brought.
Speaker A:That is what excited me and what I really want to bring to Grocer Talk too.
Speaker A:You know, look, I said in my introduction, there is so much to pay attention to right now.
Speaker A:If you're a grocery leader, there's, it's like an avalanche of content being thrown at you.
Speaker A:And what I want to feel for Grocery Talk is that we're an authentic, a regular voice that helps cut through the noise and helps with insights from across the globe.
Speaker A:Chris.
Speaker A:On innovation, trends and tech.
Speaker A:And I want to bring some good old merchandising best practice to the table as well to, to carefully curate the news and pick out the things that I believe separate the signals from the noise.
Speaker A:And I genuinely couldn't be more thrilled.
Speaker A:The Grocer Talk is part of the Omnitalk platform family and that we're going to be broadcasting every week on Omnitalk podcast feed and on the YouTube channel.
Speaker B:Yeah, 100%.
Speaker B:Here, here to everything you said.
Speaker B:But the other point that I point out and what you just said that I think is important for the audience to know is we're going to take an international perspective with this podcast, too.
Speaker B:We're going to look at grocery globally because, you know, for those that can't tell by your accent, you're actually in the uk, you're based in the UK and you have much more familiarity with the European grocer market as well as the international grocer market.
Speaker B:And so we're going to lean into that and that's intentional in terms of, of why we set out to do what we did in the vertical in which we're setting out to do it.
Speaker B:So, yeah, brilliant.
Speaker A:And look, Chris, you are going to come and you're going to be a regular host on the pod, sharing your expertise about once a month or so.
Speaker A:And what I'll also be doing is I'm going to be welcoming and introducing everybody to a wonderful group of other guest hosts.
Speaker A:And so it'll be another guest host each week and they will all bring their first retail experience to the show, which I'm really excited about.
Speaker A:But Chris, last but absolutely by no means least, in this uniquely extended intro, I did want to give a special call out.
Speaker A:And thanks to our launch partners, grocertalk is brought to you with the help and support of, firstly, Instacart Enterprise, which gives grocery businesses the technology to grow online and install with one modular platform built for how grocery actually works and built to scale with you.
Speaker A:So learn more at company.instacart.com and Portager a groundbreaking purpose built AI platform for retail negotiations and joint business planning, helping merchants prepare Sparta, negotiate stronger and maximize value.
Speaker A:So visit Portager AI that's P O R T a G E R AI to learn more.
Speaker A:And finally, Grossertalk is proudly supported by Vusion, the global leader in connected retail solutions, helping grocers improve productivity, execution and customer experience.
Speaker A:From shelf to checkout, go to www.fusion.com.
Speaker A:Okay.
Speaker A:And on to the news.
Speaker A:So Chris, in this week's Grocer talk, we have got news on Kroger, Bund grocery and prescription delivery Snooks launching new digital tools for its shoppers.
Speaker A:Just eat takeaway.
Speaker A:Rolling out its AI voice assistant across Europe and auto stores deal with Amazon.
Speaker A:But we begin today with news of Couchtard's plan to buy Zhabka.
Speaker B:That's right, Ben.
Speaker B:According to Reuters, Canadian retailer Alimentation Couchtard.
Speaker B:I hope I said that right.
Speaker B:You give me the hardest one here right out of the gate.
Speaker B:Bet.
Speaker B:Thank you.
Speaker B:They plan to buy by Polish sea store retailer Zabka for around US$8.7 billion in its largest ever acquisition.
Speaker B:Yeah, it's a big one, folks.
Speaker B:Couch chart operates nearly 17,000 gas stations and convenience stores across North America, Northern and Eastern Europe and Asia Pacific, mostly under the well known Circle K banner.
Speaker B:Zabka, meanwhile, no relation to William Zabka, is the convenience market leader in Poland with 13,000 convenience stores across the country and Romania.
Speaker B:Zabka is expected to maintain its brand name and operate with autonomy with no change to its established franchise model.
Speaker B:And the deal is expected to close by December.
Speaker B:Now, I'm cheating a little on this one, Ben, as this story broke.
Speaker B:How do you say, Ben?
Speaker B:A fortnight ago, I think.
Speaker B:I believe that's right.
Speaker B:Fortnight ago.
Speaker B:Two weeks ago.
Speaker A:That's right.
Speaker B:But it's our launch and I, and I didn't want to miss out.
Speaker B:I didn't want to miss the opportunity to slag you a little bit, but.
Speaker B:So, Ben, why do you think Couchtard is making the move to acquire Zabka and what are the implications here?
Speaker A:Yeah, I'm so glad we started with this one.
Speaker A:It's, you know, because the longer and the more time I've spent thinking about this, actually, the bigger I think this is because I think it signposts a really big change in direction from a really big retailer.
Speaker A:So, you know, just stepping back, Circle K, it's a really traditional, you know, US convenience format.
Speaker A:It's fuel, it's gas, and it's impulse.
Speaker A:And Zabca really isn't.
Speaker A:So Zabka is a European urban convenience proximity retailer.
Speaker A:So no fuel, more grocery, and really well known for its food service.
Speaker A:So Zabka has kind of really high urban store density, often overlapping catchments.
Speaker A:So it benefits from really high frequency of visits, especially because it's got a really good coffee offer, like very good coffee offer.
Speaker A:So much more frequency of visit than the standard Circle K. So it's a really different model.
Speaker A:And I think there's a number of things that could be going on to drive this.
Speaker A:I think some of this is about Couchetard's forward planning.
Speaker A:The impact of EVs mean that traffic to gas stations is going down.
Speaker A:So how do you build a convenience business without a driver?
Speaker A:And then the other thing I think about a lot is the dynamic of gas, particularly in the US We've got people like Costco who are building sort of whole ecosystems where they use price reductions on the gas to drive that total membership flywheel.
Speaker A:So if gas is your driver, it's an even harder model to compete against.
Speaker A:And I think the geographic diversification is fascinating.
Speaker A:They've gone from having 30% of their store base in Europe to 60% of the combined store base will now be in Europe.
Speaker A:So that's a really significant swing.
Speaker A:So I think there's some big factors that have led Couchetar to think about actually, what does it want its portfolio look like in the future.
Speaker A:But, you know, what do you think Chris got him?
Speaker B:Well, what number.
Speaker B:What?
Speaker B:I'm loving doing this podcast already, Ben, because nothing says the launch of a global weekly podcast on grocery like the acquisition of a Polish retailer.
Speaker B:I mean, this is.
Speaker B:This is fabulous.
Speaker B:But I mean, this, like you said, this story is important, you know, and we want to lead in on this podcast with the stories that matter most, and this one clearly hits the mark.
Speaker B:So, I mean, from my take, I think your point about the EV market is.
Speaker B:Is actually really brilliant.
Speaker B:It's a great diversification play when you think about that growth globally.
Speaker B:But the other point about this, that makes this really important is this.
Speaker B:This acquisition is huge.
Speaker B:I mean, it almost doubles the size of Circle K's footprint, which is.
Speaker B:Which was already enormous in store count.
Speaker B:And the other thing I'd say too, it's.
Speaker B:It's acquiring Circle K or Kushtard, I should say.
Speaker B:Couchtard is acquiring a retail operation that is quite respected by those in the industry too, from what I know about Zabka.
Speaker B:I mean, I can't tell you how many times in my past years, past, nine years of doing this OmniTok business, somebody has come up to me and told me I need to check out ZABCO when I'm over in Europe.
Speaker B:And I'm always like, my answer is always the same, but it's always like, yeah, if I could only get to Poland more regularly.
Speaker B:But like, you know, like, it's not the easiest thing for me to go and check out, but it's someplace I've always wanted to check out.
Speaker B:And people, you know, you can tell when you talk to a lot of folks where the esteem is held.
Speaker B:And it seems like there's a lot of esteem held for that operation.
Speaker B:So for that reason, when I look at it in terms of the size and scale of what couchtart is acquiring, this is pretty big news.
Speaker B:And I think you're hitting at the points too, in terms of, okay, yeah, you got to start thinking about how does the grocery convenience landscape start to change globally as technologies like EV and others start to impact where people decide to shop and spend their time?
Speaker A:And you know, Chris, I think one of the really interesting wrinkles in this story, which I think could be one of the reasons why ZABCA is often held in esteem and people keep saying to you, you should go, is because they are one of the most technologically progressive convenience operators in Europe, if not the world.
Speaker A:So they have been on the forefront of autonomous stores, checkout, free automation, front end as well as automation in the back end.
Speaker A:But some of that is trial and test and mindset, which is great.
Speaker A:One of the things that's really established is that they've got an incredibly highly engaged loyalty app.
Speaker A:I think it's like over 11 million digital users.
Speaker A:It's a real point of difference.
Speaker A:And it feeds into that frequency of visit.
Speaker A:And they've done some great things with gamification, AR, etc.
Speaker A:To bring that loyalty app into life and activate in store.
Speaker A:So I think for somebody like Couchard, you know, a very traditional North American sear operator, I think there's, there's.
Speaker A:They will have a lot to learn from that perspective, which is one of the other reasons why I think this is such an interesting story.
Speaker B:Yeah, so you think, you really do think this is a one plus one equals three acquisition here, Ben, you know, which is very, you know, because we cover a lot of acquisitions on the weekly retail Fast five.
Speaker B:And like, you know, I'd say generally speaking, I'm probably kind of negative on them for the most part.
Speaker B:But you really think there's a there there with this one huh?
Speaker A:Oh, absolutely.
Speaker A:I think what they.
Speaker A:Because what they're doing is they're buying something they don't already have.
Speaker A:And I think it was.
Speaker A:There was some.
Speaker A:Look, there was some rumors and who knows where the end and the finish to it was.
Speaker A:But just last month there was some talk about seven and I.
Speaker A:So seven eleven's parent company potentially taking a stake in Jabka.
Speaker A:So there's been a little bit of maybe a come and get me.
Speaker A:There's been a little bit of an in play.
Speaker A:And I think for Couchard, this is too big a.
Speaker A:Too good a retailer to not get after.
Speaker A:And do you know one of the other things I mentioned.
Speaker A:Look, Chris, you know, next month we're going to be in Paris, aren't we?
Speaker A:For.
Speaker A:For NRF Europe?
Speaker A:Yes.
Speaker B:Yeah, we are.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:So.
Speaker A:And.
Speaker A:And a gentleman called Tomasz.
Speaker A:Tomasz Blihaci.
Speaker A:And I apologize, I probably murdered his surname, but I said I think that's quite close.
Speaker A:Um, he's one of the leadership team at zabca and I think he is in the process of becoming the incoming CEO and I noticed that he's going to be one of the speakers talking about the future of convenience and that's going to be.
Speaker A:I think it's going to be super interesting and I.
Speaker A:That's right on my radar for next month.
Speaker B:Yeah, awesome.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:And you put about seven and I.
Speaker B:Makes me think it's good to be the prom queen when you got a lot of suitors.
Speaker B:It's a good position to be in.
Speaker A:Exactly.
Speaker A:Which takes us beautifully onto headline number two, which this week comes from progressive groceries which is reporting that Kroger is now offering its E Commerce shoppers the ability to bundle both grocery and prescription orders together into a single home delivery.
Speaker A:So the service is powered by Instacart, which already provides a similar service to Costco and is live in Kroger's Harris Teeter format banner stores.
Speaker A:Shoppers enroll in the My Prescriptions program via the Kroger app and then use the app to schedule a combined delivery with which is then made by Instacart.
Speaker A:Chris, this news hits the same week that Kroger has announced the arrival of Nate Faust as its new EVP and Chief e Commerce officer.
Speaker A:So I'm going to keep you with a two header here.
Speaker A:Firstly, this RX move, is it step change or catch up from Kroger?
Speaker A:And secondly, what do you think should be top of Nate's new to do list?
Speaker B:Oh God, Ben.
Speaker B:Oh man.
Speaker B:A two parter with so many thoughts.
Speaker B:Rumbling through my head.
Speaker B:I don't even know where to start, Ben.
Speaker B:I'll take the first part first, which you know is natural and sequential.
Speaker B:The RX move.
Speaker B:I, you know, I think that's just keeping up at the point, at this point, keeping up with the Joneses, so to speak.
Speaker B:I like it.
Speaker B:It's table stakes.
Speaker B:You know, it increases the basket size of deliveries which are essentially being powered by Instacart.
Speaker B:What it seems like is be a via white label servicing and delivery.
Speaker B:So fine, you know, I'm good with that.
Speaker B:Makes sense, let's do it.
Speaker B:But your second question, I think your second question is the far more interesting one.
Speaker B:What should Faust do on his first day in the job?
Speaker B:And I'm going to get a little salacious here, Ben, to start things off on our first grocery podcast.
Speaker B:But my honest take, he should march into CEO Greg Forens job or Forens office and tell him, you know what, I don't even think my job should exist.
Speaker B:I mean, head of E Commerce, a chief E commerce officer.
Speaker B:What is that?
Speaker B:I've never heard that before.
Speaker B: That's so like: Speaker B:I mean the best of the best retailers, namely Walmart, where you know, these, both these guys came from, they've gone omnichannel in their organizational design.
Speaker B:So I worry that putting so much emphasis on E commerce only plays into a non differentiating hand in the long run for Kroger because it's going to be really hard for Kroger to differentiate itself on the E Commerce side.
Speaker B:It's going to breed a ton of inflow.
Speaker B:Fighting on the organizational side of things, particularly against the stores, like who's going to lead merchandising now?
Speaker B:Is it the online side?
Speaker B:Is it the store guys?
Speaker B:Is it, you know, who, who gets the investments here when everyone's sitting at the same table in the C suite versus, you know, the E commerce guy reporting into someone that should have the visibility into how everything should operate.
Speaker B:So I don't know, you know, say, say not.
Speaker B:I'll just leave it there.
Speaker B:You can, you can take me off the ledge here, Ben.
Speaker B:But I don't, I don't like this at all.
Speaker B:Like I, I think this smells from a mil.
Speaker A:That's really, I think that's really interesting.
Speaker A:I'll tell you what, Chris, the other thing, having just mentioned you and I being on our travels after we've been in Paris, we're hot footing straight over to Vegas for grocery Shop.
Speaker A:And I noticed that on the opening keyNote on day one of grocery shop, Yale Cosset.
Speaker A:So Chief Digital and AI Officer at Kroger, he's speaking on the opening day.
Speaker A:I think that's going to.
Speaker A:I've always found Yale fascinating to listen to, so my ears are going to be pricked right up, right up for that one to try and understand how this structure works.
Speaker A:But okay.
Speaker A:Chris.
Speaker B:Yeah, There's a lot to what you just said there.
Speaker B:Oh my God.
Speaker A:So I'm banking on the fact that on his first day, having worked with Greg Forum before, he's not going to walk in and say make me redundant.
Speaker A:I reckon they've got a plan.
Speaker A:So.
Speaker A:So what do you think should be on a plan?
Speaker A:What do you think he's been brought in with this remit to look at Chris.
Speaker B:I mean, everything that's getting reported in the media is like the retail media side.
Speaker B:Like they're trying to use it as a profit engine now.
Speaker B:I don't.
Speaker B:I guess, I guess you can understand that.
Speaker B:I just.
Speaker B:The other thing I worry about, though, I don't know, I hate to say this, but I'm not sure that the chops are there.
Speaker B:I mean, it seems like there's a lot of writing of the coattails.
Speaker B:If you look at the resume with diapers.com jet.com had a failed startup, what seems like a failed startup for the past three years or four years.
Speaker B:So.
Speaker B:So I'm not really sure what his modus operandi is here, Ben.
Speaker B:Like I'm not sure what his marching orders are, whatever the right term is, you know, other than just basic blocking and tackling in E commerce, which I just don't know how much you're going to get from that other than just doing it well.
Speaker B:So I don't understand the elevation of the role for that reason.
Speaker B:You know, I mean, it's all the part and parcel.
Speaker B:As I try to step back to your question, like it's all the part and parcel things that we talk about every single week, you know, you and I like, you know, how do you get Geneva working on your site?
Speaker B:How do you get more options for delivery, you know, so that the customer can get the products when they want.
Speaker B:Similar to what you just read with the RX announcement.
Speaker B:Like that's a good move.
Speaker B:But like, yeah, you know, I don't, I don't understand the elevation here.
Speaker A:Yeah, I mean, look, I guess from my side firstly on the RX move.
Speaker A:Yeah, great.
Speaker A:I think, I think they're the same.
Speaker A:I think really good Move.
Speaker A:It helps lock customers in, it helps drive repeat.
Speaker A:Obviously it seems like a really good tie up.
Speaker A:There's a little bit of catch up going on but you know, versus Walmart for example.
Speaker A:But look, it's exactly what they should be doing and I'm really pleased to see them doing it.
Speaker A:So, you know, that's all good.
Speaker A:I think, I think if I was Nate there'd be two things on two things that I'd be looking at.
Speaker A:I mean number one, and I think this is interesting and this is where Greg Foreign and Nate Faust worked together previously was around supply chain in E Comm.
Speaker A:And I think that's one of the big questions for Kroger is, you know, we've seen the investment go in and then come back from Ricardo.
Speaker A:They're now building investment with partners.
Speaker A:How do you get the right mix?
Speaker A:There has got to be a sweet spot in terms of fulfillment.
Speaker A:Turning their back on automation completely can't be the answer.
Speaker A:Labor isn't getting any cheaper.
Speaker A:The penetration continues to grow.
Speaker A:So the fundamentals are moving towards automation.
Speaker A:I think we've got another story coming up in a little bit where we're going to be talking about that.
Speaker A:So I think that's number one.
Speaker A:What does that mix?
Speaker A:What's that sweet spot that profitability look like for Kroger?
Speaker A:And I obviously feel there's work to be done in that space.
Speaker A:And the other bit is about how does Kroger build out a really compelling digital moat and a digital ecosystem?
Speaker A:How do they grow, boost, how do they add more into it?
Speaker A:I think because if there is a grocer in the country that's got the scale, that's got the data, that's got the potential for retail media platformers as we know, it's Kroger's.
Speaker A:I think that's the other area that if I was bringing it ahead of E Comm and somebody to say to ring fence, I'd be looking, I'd be looking at those two things because I do think there is work to be done.
Speaker A:But it's also, there's a huge opportunity to get Kroger really, really, really singing from Ecom right now.
Speaker B:Yeah, I mean I think I said this on my weekly podcast like, you know, Kroger was talking about its E commerce statistics in its, in its latest earnings report.
Speaker B:But as I dug into them, I didn't actually think they were that strong.
Speaker B:I felt like they're actually potentially even losing share in the marketplace.
Speaker B:When you look at the brick meets click data that gets put out every so often.
Speaker B:And so I think, yeah, this is the signal here, Ben.
Speaker B:The marching orders are like, we need to grow e commerce.
Speaker B:Greg Forehand feels like he's the ones running the reins on the store side and the store improvements.
Speaker B:So maybe these two think they're going to be in cahoots in the C suite to drive things together.
Speaker B:I mean that.
Speaker B:But organizationally, like, I, it's not a place I'd want to work.
Speaker B:Organizationally, I'll just say that.
Speaker B:All right, headline number three.
Speaker B:Headline number three.
Speaker B:We're diving into the theme of how AI is being used to influence shoppers, which for sure is one of the big trends in the industry.
Speaker B:We'll be watching week over week at Grocery Talk.
Speaker B:Grocer Dive is reporting that Schnooks Markets is launching new digital tools for its shoppers.
Speaker B:Now Live is a conversational commerce AI tool that helps shoppers build lists, make suggestions, and offer personalized nutritional guidance.
Speaker B:Now Live is a conversational commerce AI tool that helps shoppers build lists, make suggestions and offer personalized nutritional guidance.
Speaker B:Built in partnership with Vitality ip, the agent can use weekly deals and recommended products to build lists.
Speaker B:Based on an intelligence layer of 6 billion lines of shopping, health and nutrition data, Snooks will maintain the ownership of the customer relationship, shopper data and brand experience while levering data from Vitality IP's nutrition guidance and health data platform.
Speaker B:Announced just three weeks ago, the tool is now live.
Speaker B:And Snooks COO Ted Schnook said in a statement that, quote, it is not a search bar.
Speaker B:It will be a personalized digital shopping assistant that understands Snooks aisles, sales promotions and customer lifestyles.
Speaker B:End quote.
Speaker B:And I kind of like that quote a lot.
Speaker B:Ben.
Speaker B:Ben, does the world need another personalized digital shopping assistant or is this functionality from Schnooks that is rapidly becoming table stakes for grocers?
Speaker A:Yeah, I think there's, there is, there's a lot in it.
Speaker A:But for me, it's actually quite a simple.
Speaker A:I think, yes, it is becoming table stakes.
Speaker A:And what do I mean by that?
Speaker A:I think on, on the broader picture, how shoppers are searching, how everybody, consumers, people are shopping is change, searching is changing.
Speaker A:The growth of tools like Claude and Gemini, the conversational commerce tools, but they are increasingly teaching people to make contextual conversational searches.
Speaker A:And I think that Google spent two decades teaching people to take sentences and squeeze it into words.
Speaker A:And now actually everyone's been told, you don't need to do that anymore.
Speaker A:So it's just returning to what feels normal.
Speaker A:And I think for any retailer, for any grocer, for any brand out there, they need their website to be able to cope with conversational requests, with contextual questions, and within that there is an increased expectation of personalized responses.
Speaker A:But really, if you don't provide the ability to be able to answer a contextual question with the detail that's being looked for, you're going to lose the traffic, Chris.
Speaker A:You're going to lose it.
Speaker A:To answer engines, people just go to Claude and we'll just go to Gemini.
Speaker A:So you have to keep it within your own digital ecosystem.
Speaker A:I think that's the key thing here.
Speaker A:And especially for the retailer, you get to own the transaction.
Speaker A:So you can build that memory, you can build that context layer which is so critical in all the AI elements to be able to do things like that.
Speaker A:Now, look, I'm not convinced that all of the examples that get trotted out every time we see a press release about this sort of things that people are going to use or building a.
Speaker A:Build a shopping list help me for my great Anne's party, who also loves the party.
Speaker B:Right?
Speaker A:Yeah, we see the same one.
Speaker A:I think, put that to one side.
Speaker A:The idea of, should every retailer be building the ability to be able to answer queries posed in a conversational style with context?
Speaker A:Build that muscle for me, that's critical right now.
Speaker B:Yeah, 100% agree, Ben.
Speaker B:It's table stakes.
Speaker B:I mean, like, the other point I make too is like, you need to have this on your site because you don't want them going and starting to shop at Walmart or Amazon for their online grocery needs, which when, you know, both those retailers are investing heavily in this regard.
Speaker B:And Amazon just last week said that they're actually seeing tremendous performance out of their Alexa plus for shopping capabilities on their website.
Speaker B:So, you know, so that's, that's what I see.
Speaker B:But, you know, when I step back from this, Ben, I think you brought up a good point.
Speaker B:Like, what is, what is all, what is all this stuff that's out there in the media around this?
Speaker B:To me, this is just the evolution of a product.
Speaker B:Like, you know, for.
Speaker B: commerce days at target, like: Speaker B:Like, there was a product manager over search, you know, and at the time it was like, you know, can you get the autofill going for the customer?
Speaker B:Right?
Speaker B:This is, this is, in a lot of ways, this is just the next evolution of search as a product.
Speaker B:Now, you know, I thought CEO Todd Schnook said, yeah, it may be more than that and I think it is, but it's still the next evolution of how people interact with your website and your web properties and your E commerce properties to find what they're looking for.
Speaker B:And it's all the same thing, it's all the same mission for the product manager.
Speaker B:So we can just strip all the AI sexiness away.
Speaker B:And if we think about it in that, that's what it is, pure and simple.
Speaker B:And that's why it's table stakes.
Speaker B:And you've got to keep up with the Joneses here too.
Speaker A:Yeah, you have to.
Speaker A:And I think that for me, that last bit, the keeping up is a slightly different bit because the risk of not doing this creates this sort of sword of Damocles hanging over you in that if you can't do it and you're taking people to a Claude or a Gemini, you're taking them onto a platform that can also do real time cross retail price comparison and et cetera, et cetera.
Speaker A:So I think the importance of locking in is critical.
Speaker A:And I also, as a minor point, I love what they were saying in this next release about bringing in all the nutritional data as well, because we know that we haven't got a GLP1 story this week that'll be a reoccurring theme on the pod.
Speaker A:But people are more interested in nutritional data as diets are dramatically changing.
Speaker A:So bringing that information in in a more accessible way, I think that's really important and a really nice move from SN on this one.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:Because searching for like, you know, sugar free items on a website or any, you know, any type of like taxonomical, if that's the word base search on a website is really difficult and this enables that.
Speaker B:That's the beauty of, Beauty of AI too, Ben.
Speaker B:But I got, I got to give you a shout out sort of Damocles.
Speaker B:That's hell of a reference, my friend.
Speaker B:Oh my God.
Speaker B:What is the sword of Damocles?
Speaker B:I don't even.
Speaker B:I don't even know that one.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:Oh, it's.
Speaker A:This is going back into mythology.
Speaker A:It's the.
Speaker A:It's a sword that hangs over you should.
Speaker A:You made the wrong move at any point will fall fall and ending your death.
Speaker A:But I think that's a bit too dark for right now.
Speaker A:Until I saw the Odyssey at the weekend, which was brilliant by the way.
Speaker A:If you haven't seen it.
Speaker B:It was really good.
Speaker B:Yeah, really good.
Speaker A:Yeah, it's so good.
Speaker A:Right, anyway, moving on, Christopher, Headline number four and I want to take us back to the wider theme of AI tools to influence shoppers, because headline number four this week comes straight from a corporate press release from just eat takeaway.com so following successful launches in the UK and Germany earlier this year, Just Eat is rolling out its AI Voice assistant across Europe and we do love a good rollout story.
Speaker A:The AI powered voice tool is available on Just eat apps on iOS and Android and allows shoppers to ask questions or request actions from where is open that can deliver for me in under 30 minutes to help me feed my family of four for under €40.
Speaker A:Or my personal favorite, please just order me my usual curry.
Speaker A:What's really interesting in this story though is the data that was shared as part of it, which actually shows what people are actually saying to Just Eat.
Speaker A:Looking at the earlier UK launch of the AI Assistant, customers using Voice found what they were looking for 40% faster than the previous text only AI assistant and were 30% more likely to choose a recommendation compared to traditional search experiences.
Speaker A:So Chris, once upon a time Voice was meant to be the answer to all our native search needs, but recently it does look like the food service industry is pushing ahead at finding real use cases and benefits from AI tools.
Speaker A:What do you think grocers should be learning from this?
Speaker B:Oh man.
Speaker B:Oh Ben, you're great.
Speaker B:They cracked me up.
Speaker B:First of all, I don't actually think there's much groceries should be learning from this one.
Speaker B:I'm curious to see what you think.
Speaker B:I have no idea what you think on this either, but I'm actually skeptical of this headline.
Speaker B:And the reason I say that Ben, is the data sounds a little ginned up to me.
Speaker B:It sounds like it's made for a press release to sound sexy and so I'm going to key in on what you said there customer and I want people to listen to this.
Speaker B:Customers using Voice found that they were looking found what they were looking for 40% faster than previous text only AI assistants and were 30% more likely to choose a recommendation compared to traditional search experiences.
Speaker B:Okay, but what if your traditional search experience wasn't up to par or it quote unquote sucked?
Speaker B:Does that mean voice is actually better?
Speaker B:And also another point I'd make customers using voice that is in itself biased because it's customers that are electing to use voice so they're going to show that proclivity by default in some ways.
Speaker B:So that doesn't necessarily mean to me, as this headline is trying to intimate, that more investments should be going towards voice.
Speaker B:So net net Ben, to answer your question, if I was another grocer reading this, listening to this podcast, I wouldn't be rushing out to go back to the Keeping up with the Joneses point from the last headline on this one.
Speaker A:That's really interesting.
Speaker A:And I think the counterpoint to that, and I don't disagree with what you've said, is that this isn't talking about a test, this is a rollout.
Speaker A:So having been operating in Germany and the uk, that's just two of just these biggest markets in Europe, they've seen enough to make them want to, want to roll it.
Speaker A:And I think it comes as.
Speaker A:For me, it comes as no surprise that voice in using voice to engage with an AI assistant is quicker than text because you don't have to type, has to be quicker.
Speaker A:So in a game where speed matters and increasingly speed matters to grocery.
Speaker A:I think that's really interesting.
Speaker A:I think probably more interesting is some of the things that I've seen in the US that are where the US is definitely ahead of Europe in terms of using AI voice ordering, particularly at drive thrus.
Speaker A:And that's, that's another area where I think the food, food service is showing more use cases, which I think is, is.
Speaker A:I definitely think there is stuff we can learn from.
Speaker A:If you take all that in the round.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:And the way I look at that, see, I see, I see that as a different, I'd see that as a different element.
Speaker B:Like I think voice ordering is when we're already using our voice and how do we improve the efficiency and the, the, the quality of the service when that is what we're doing.
Speaker B:But investing in voice as the way to interact with a property which isn't necessarily the native way to interact with it, I don't think that's where I'd be investing first and foremost.
Speaker B:And I'd go back to spending my money more on the things that we talked about in the previous headlines, like your AI search capabilities, for example.
Speaker B:Seems like a much, much better way or a much more important thing to hone than say getting, getting Voice search live on your properties.
Speaker B:That's, that's my take, Ben.
Speaker B:I see those as two very different examples of voice technology and its applications.
Speaker A:Yeah, I, I think that's very fair.
Speaker B:You do?
Speaker B:Okay.
Speaker B:Headline number five comes to us from the retail technology innovation hub, the rtih with news that Autostore has announced a supply agreement with Amazon.
Speaker B:Autostore, the Finnish automated fulfillment and warehousing company, has agreed to a framework for the supply of auto stores, products and solutions to Amazon on a global basis.
Speaker B:Whilst whilst you can tell who runs this podcast, whilst the agreement defies the terms of procurement, it doesn't actually contain any purchasing commitments at this time.
Speaker B:But there's rarely any smoke without fire grocery talk listeners.
Speaker B:Amazon has no shortage of automation already in its supply chain and famously usually builds its own solution.
Speaker B:So Ben, what forces do you think have led to this agreement between Amazon and Auto Store?
Speaker A:Yeah Chris, you and I, we've both recently been to see auto store technology in action and E commerce fulfillment technology is another of the really big films, the really big themes in our industry right now.
Speaker A:So though despite actually no procurement having been made, the fact that it's just a framework, I thought it was really important to discuss this one and so I'm really glad and I'm really looking forward to hearing what you think.
Speaker A:What do I think?
Speaker A:Shaping and firstly Amazon's fulfillment centers, their automated, their robotic fulfillment centers are really impressive.
Speaker A:They're really impressive and I'm sure many people listening might have had a chance to go and visit.
Speaker A:Often I've open sessions where the public is allowed in or, or going on the trade visit.
Speaker A:They're well worth seeing but they the whole flow is based around single item purchases and a single temperature zone in environment so they're not designed around grocery.
Speaker A:And Amazon's grocery business is scaling.
Speaker A:So what's the first force?
Speaker A:I think the first force is that they've needed something specific and this growth in E comm is happening really quickly.
Speaker A:Particularly their US business is scaling quick so maybe that's a partner slash buy rather than build because they need to drive the automation in that quickly as well.
Speaker A:And Walmart obviously are already there especially because one of the things that's making the point of difference for Amazon is the speed of delivery.
Speaker A:You know it's the 30 minute hour to one hour delivery that's really driving the Amazon business.
Speaker A:So again that the quicker is required to be delivered, the quicker required it to be fulfilled, the stronger the case for automation.
Speaker A:And as that grocery business evolves, so too will be their need for multiple temperature zones for example.
Speaker A:And I think one of the things we know about Auto Store they run off a grid system not dissimilar to how Ocado runs, how a number of the other systems run.
Speaker A:Autostore is known for the flexibility of the grid so the ability to implement it in a whole range of different environments.
Speaker A:So I think that's probably another plus point.
Speaker A:And yeah, I think the last thing, and I'd love to hear what you think as well as building out automated warehousing autostore, also build our micro fulfillments.
Speaker A:They know how to build store based systems as well.
Speaker A:Amazon have already told us they're building this supercenter near Chicago and they've already said that's going to have micro fulfillment for before we even start to think about where they might want to go with, with Whole Foods.
Speaker A:So I think there's a range of grocery specialism that they need to bring in and this is a way to do it quickly.
Speaker A:But what do you think Chris?
Speaker B:Yeah, I mean I think, I think this is a, this is a really important headline.
Speaker B:I think we probably, you know, unintentionally or intentionally bookended this podcast with the two probably biggest headlines you know of of the week here for the overall global ghost industry and particularly this one, particularly for the US is really interesting because I think to your point Ben, Auto Store for all the ups and downs of micro fulfillment automation technology in grocery, they've taken their punches and stood in and they appear to be getting the job done where it matters.
Speaker B:And they're doing it just about as well as anyone out there.
Speaker B:And Amazon generally understands what it does well and what it does not.
Speaker B:And for this reason I think, you know, this announcement should scare the pants off us grocers because I would ask the question having seen the operation live myself in Vienna where Auto store is providing the technology for the roll IT group, you know, is this the first step in bringing you know like a roll IT group E commerce like model to the US by way of an auto store Amazon partnership?
Speaker B:And if Amazon can pull that off, you know that's, that's a dangerous thought to think about and it very well could be that, you know, as we're looking back on this announcement 10 years from now because Amazon has the storefront that has the traffic to get people that, that bring people back to it day in and day in and day out.
Speaker B:And so if it can stand up the operations underneath it to do E groceries like it's being done in Europe, this is a really, really big announcement.
Speaker A:Yeah and I think the other thing that I think about is just not taking a single announcement in isolation.
Speaker A:So just in the last week there was, there was two other stories about E Com automation and fulfillment in grocers that had this bid in.
Speaker A:So you know Walmart is installing its first MFC micro fulfillment center powered by symbotic into a store after they had a not dissimilar tie up last year and Ocado they are Putting their first fully automated warehouse, their CFC customer fulfillment center in South Korea with Lottie Mart.
Speaker A: nering with Lottie Mart since: Speaker A:They've learned the market, the requirement for early delivery times and they are now opening their first fully automated warehouse, which I was really interested to read includes fully automated grid based picking for free frozen products as well as fresh and ambient.
Speaker A:So it's another, another bit of the jigsaw.
Speaker A:You've got to add these bits together to see the investment continuing to be made.
Speaker A:Right, Chris, before we go, it's time for a bit of fun.
Speaker A:Okay, we're gonna go.
Speaker A:We are gonna go to Grossertalk, grab and go.
Speaker A:Okay, who's grabbing and who's going?
Speaker A:Ben, this is no comment.
Speaker A:This.
Speaker A:Look, this is where we both get to share a couple of stories that have caught in the world of grocery retailing this week.
Speaker A:Stories that, you know, beyond the major headlines we've been discussing, that we still think should be on everybody's radar and that we haven't got a clue what each other has chosen.
Speaker A:So Chris, go on.
Speaker A:What's your first story?
Speaker A:What's the first other thing that we should be paying attention to this week?
Speaker B:Yeah, this is great.
Speaker B:This shows you how the sausage is made too.
Speaker B:Because you would know based on that last headline that Ben has no idea what I'm going to share with him.
Speaker B:Because my first grab and go story comes from the file of anything Amazon could do, Walmart will try and do too.
Speaker B:So fresh off, pun intended, the auto store partnership, Walmart announced that automation technology Symbotic began installing its first SIM microsystem for e commerce fulfillment in the back of a Walmart store.
Speaker B:Ben alluded to it just a few seconds ago.
Speaker B:Which tells me again, Ben, the reason I bring this one up in my grab and go call out of the week.
Speaker B:It tells me that the future of US Grocery is going to be more automated as opposed to less automated.
Speaker B:When you look at the fact that the two biggest players in the market are trying to one up each other on the space Kroger, you know, when you step back and you look at Kroger, Kroger may have just taken the wrong approach for whatever reasons, organizationally, technologically, whatever.
Speaker B:I hope they haven't unwound it back so far that they can't keep up with Walmart and Amazon and the rest of the industry needs to pay attention to.
Speaker A:Yeah, I think you're, I think you're right.
Speaker A:I think the key thing for me is there is There is a mix, there is a sweet spot.
Speaker A:There are, you've got to get this, you've got to get the store fulfillment working correctly.
Speaker A:You've got to have the right partners, you've got to have the right operating platform.
Speaker A:And then when you've got all that going, you then build in the automation.
Speaker A:And I think that is something that I think they should be paying a lot of attention to.
Speaker A:So look, Chris, the first one I've got is some ownership news.
Speaker A:So this, this intrigued me.
Speaker A:So C and S Wholesale, so remember them from back in the Albertsons bit, is emerging from the consortium who bought Winn Dixie back from Aldi with a bid to take full control over the Florida operation.
Speaker A:So let me, let me unpick all that.
Speaker A: ldi acquired seven grocers in: Speaker A:They kept about 220 of the stores to the convert into Aldi units and then they sold the rest of the business back to a consortium last year, including CNS Wholesale.
Speaker A:And they renamed the new business as Winn Dixie after its core banner.
Speaker A:And what we now see is CNS as the company Sports spot and Nash only about a year or so ago saying actually we want to take full control over this oil operation as well.
Speaker A:So I think there are interesting vehicles, CNS Wholesale, and I think for me it's just a further indication of their appetite for expansion and acquisitions.
Speaker B:Yeah, look out for cns.
Speaker B:Yeah, CNS is coming out of the woodwork here in the US and all the headlines of the last few years for sure.
Speaker B:All right, Ben, my, my third, my second grab and go story.
Speaker B:Our third one of the day.
Speaker B:This one's a fun one.
Speaker B:Ben.
Speaker B:I tried to, I tried to pick something off the beaten path just for you.
Speaker B:But according to chain storage, Aho Delez USA is rolling out saving stations saving station kiosks.
Speaker B:Now, what is a saving station?
Speaker B:Well, they're going to roll them out beyond stop and shop.
Speaker B:That's where they started.
Speaker B:But they're going to all the giant food locations across Delaware, Maryland, Virginia and Washington D.C. well, a saving station bed is an in store kiosk that allows customers to instantly load digital coupons and personalized offers directly to their loyalty accounts.
Speaker B:They're located near store entrances and they enable customers to scan their loyalty cards or enter their phone numbers associated with their accounts to instantly load weekly digital coupons and activate personalized reward offers.
Speaker B:And bed and wait for it.
Speaker B:But customers can also print a customized savings list and all eligible discounts are automatically applied at checkout when they scan their loyalty card or enter their phone number.
Speaker B:I highlighted this today, Ben, we're actually going to talk about this on this Week's OmniTalk Retail Fast 5G because I have to ask because I think it brings up the question, who is ahold designing these saving stations for?
Speaker B:Is it not akin to building a better typewriter in some ways?
Speaker B:Or if it is, is that okay?
Speaker B:That's the question I'm gonna leave you with, Ben, because I don't know the answer to that one right now.
Speaker B:I gotta think about it for the in the next two days while I'm prepping the next show.
Speaker A:Well, I look forward to dialing in on Wednesday.
Speaker A:I think no matter where you answer that, I think anything that puts savings front and center in front of shoppers right now is a positive thing.
Speaker A:But yeah, I look forward to hearing that one.
Speaker A:So I'm going to leave you with one last story from here in the you in the uk, Chris, where Waitrose is rolling out its AI Assistant app that lets shop floor associates ask questions by voice or text on such things as availability, install locations, nutritional facts, or my favorite, because it's so terribly Waitrose wine pairing suggestions.
Speaker A:Waitrose has previously equipped its store staff with Quail digital headsets and Zebra handheld computers.
Speaker A:So a voice enabled natural language tool is kind of a great progression.
Speaker A:And I think it's really key for us to help keep listeners up to speed with AI deployments to help store associates as well as those that are focused on the shopper.
Speaker A:And, and Chris, look, it's got a name.
Speaker A:Of course it does.
Speaker A:It is called Rosie 2.0.
Speaker A:So Chris, I want to leave you with the old advice that you should never give inanimate objects names because they really don't like it 100%.
Speaker B:Ben, the question I have to ask you because you know Waitrose better than I do, if you're, if you're standing in the wine section, right, and you go up to get help and you want a wine pairing because the wine pairing is always, you said it in that, in the, in another headline.
Speaker B:Like you hear all these same examples over and over again.
Speaker B:If you're standing and you're asking a sales associate for hey, what would you pair with this, this, this Berf bourguignon, let's say.
Speaker B:And they say, hold on, let me ask the AI assistant, does that give you more or less confidence in your choice?
Speaker A:Yeah, well, actually the headsets are being used really extensively.
Speaker A:So yeah, I'm a Waitrose main shopper because the biggest supermarket in the town on the edge of London I live is a Waitrose.
Speaker A:So I'm used to a constant dialogue from the store associates.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:It's become a very natural way that they operate.
Speaker A:So I think if they're being able to add even more value to their shopping experience and your answer more detailed questions because of that.
Speaker A:Yeah, I think I'm all in on that.
Speaker A:I think it's good.
Speaker B:Got it.
Speaker B:So you're, like, okay with, like, the virtual sommelier that's just like the mouthpiece of the information being shared back to you because you're used to or accustomed to the fact that all their associates are wearing these devices anyway.
Speaker B:Wow.
Speaker B:Okay.
Speaker A:Interesting.
Speaker A:And if it.
Speaker A:If it gives you better recommendations, I'm all in.
Speaker A:I'm all in.
Speaker B:That's true.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:If my.
Speaker B:If my beef tastes better with my wine.
Speaker B:100%.
Speaker A:And on that note, Chris, I think that's a wrap for our very first episode of Grocer Talk.
Speaker A:Grocer Talk was produced with the help and support of Ella Seard, who has played a huge role in getting Grocer Talk up and running this week.
Speaker A:So a massive, massive thanks to Ella, and it's brought to you exclusively as part of the Omnitalk podcast network.
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