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Episode 66 Shake Up Writing Time
Episode 66 • 21st May 2024 • Getting Students to Write! Helping Elementary and Middle School teachers transform writing time • Melissa C Morrison, Elementary, Middle School Writing Consultant, Literacy Coach
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What does writing time FEEL like in your elementary or middle school classroom?

Is that feeling something your students need in order to enjoy and engage in writing?

Writing instruction needs to be explicit and effective, but in order for our students to WANT to write, writing time needs to be enjoyable, collaborative and engaging!

If you want to see a classroom full of students excited to write, taking risks and writing more,

this episode will help you reflect on the structure of your writing time and provide ways for you to create an environment that is conducive to writing for your students.

Ready to Shake Things Up? Press play!

About Melissa:

Melissa is an enthusiastic educator and continuous learner with over 19 years' experience in education.  Her passion and expertise is transforming writing programs so that teachers are confident in writing instruction and student writers thrive! She strongly believes teachers are the key to effective instruction and their writers are their best resources.

Melissa knows that too often, explicit writing instruction is pushed aside in elementary education, and she feels it is her calling to help schools make it front and center, providing teachers with the knowledge and support necessary to implement effective and engaging writing instruction. 

Teaching to Transform, LLC was started by Melissa in 2018 and partners with school districts to provide professional development in writing instruction.

If you would like to refer Melissa to your district, check out her website below!

Website and Blog Read the latest blog posts and find out more about services provided by Melissa

Instagram Follow Melissa for tips and support with writing instruction!

YouTube Find out more about teaching writing as you watch webinars and model lessons taught by Melissa

LinkedIn Connect with Melissa!

Transcripts

Speaker:

Hey there, fabulous teacher.

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Have you been wondering how to

make writing time in your classroom

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more effective for your students?

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Do you want your students

to love writing time?

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If so, I think it's time for you

and I to start transitioning.

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Transforming your writing instruction.

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I'm Melissa Marson and I have a

passion for helping teachers to feel

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confident in teaching writing and

help them grow successful writers.

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I've worked with numerous teachers to

guide them through this transformation

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and in this podcast I bring you the

practical strategies you need to make

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writing the best time of your day.

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Microphone (Yeti Stereo Microphone)-1:

Hello, and welcome to this episode

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of getting students to write.

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I'm glad you're here.

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Um, I've been thinking about this

topic for a little while and I thought

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this might be a good time to talk

about it as the year is winding down.

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So I want to ask you a

question and think about it.

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What is the feeling in your

classroom during writing time?

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So, imagine it, picture it, listen to it.

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In your mind.

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And what do you think the feeling is?

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Is it serious?

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Is it collaborative?

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Is it busy?

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Is it quiet?

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Is it stressful?

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Is it buzzing and creative.

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What does it feel like for you, but then

most especially, or most importantly

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for your students during writing time?

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I have visited many classrooms and.

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Most of the costumes I visit,

I visit multiple times.

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And there always is a feeling.

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And sometimes I'm able to

speak to that feeling or in

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some way helped to adjust it.

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If I think that might be needed.

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Um, so I just wanted to talk about

what the feeling can be or could be

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or should be, you know, and I want

you to think about that too, for

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your writers and how we can create an

environment that is conducive for our

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students to be successful as writers.

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And I think it's a little bit different

than many of us might believe that it is.

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So I have mentioned in other

episodes that I know that.

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We have.

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S T I'm sorry.

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We have students who are graduating

high school, going to college

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students in all sorts of grade levels

who are not able to communicate.

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In a written way.

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Well,

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And we need to do something to change it.

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And so things that are

typically happening.

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Probably shouldn't be happening anymore.

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We need to shake it up a little bit.

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We need to switch it up a

little bit and think about what

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students really need and want.

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And we know that in order to

really be engaged in something,

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we have to want to do it.

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We have to enjoy it.

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We had to be invested in it in some way.

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And so let me just paint

a little picture here.

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If you.

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And hopefully you've done some writing

because I did have a recent episode

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about why teachers should write

to, but hopefully you are a writer.

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Maybe you have a journal.

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Maybe you just like to put

thoughts down before having a big

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discussion or something like that.

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But when you think about you

having to write, even if you want

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to think back to when you've had

to write for school for college,

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We as adults might need something

quite different from what our students

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need, as they are learning to write.

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And really getting to it for the first

time, and haven't been doing it for long.

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We might need quiet.

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And calm and serious and, , no

distractions, which, which some,

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we're going to get to this for the

kids to some might need that as well.

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But.

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You know, we, we have

learned how to write.

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We just need to write.

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And everyone needs something different.

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Now, some of us are good

with music playing and, and

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you know, things like that.

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But.

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It is a little different.

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And I think traditionally,

when you imagine school, We

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think about sitting up street.

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Staying quiet.

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And you know, when we're

doing work, sitting up street,

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good handwriting position.

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Um, being quiet.

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Being focused.

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And all of that.

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But think about, go back to yourself.

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Writing.

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Do you really sit in one position?

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With no distraction.

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When you were writing something.

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For a half an hour, an hour.

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No, I don't think that you do.

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I think that when you

were in college, yeah.

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Maybe there were times when you had to.

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You know, you sat in the

library and you got stuff done.

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Yeah.

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There are times when that happens, but

is it always going to happen that way?

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No, sometimes you're going to be in

your dorm room or in your apartment

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and you're writing and then you have

to stop and you have to get a drink

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and you have to like, just kind of.

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Stretch out a little bit.

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You have to get your mind

off of it for a minute.

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You know, there's all these

different things we do.

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And this, this is going back to

why teachers need to write, because

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it brings you into what actually

happens when you're writing.

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And it helps you with

teaching your writers.

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But.

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We have kids.

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And especially when you think

about kindergarten through even

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fifth grade, Sixth grade I, me

and my son is in sixth grade.

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And although he can be a very studious.

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Student.

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He's going to need to injury.

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He's going to need to have fun.

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And he complains a lot

about how boring school is.

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Unfortunately.

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So when we have these kids, they

need to be interested in it.

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They need to be energized.

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They need to have fun.

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Doing things and it might seem like it's

easier for that to happen in kindergarten.

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When, you know, in the beginning

they are just drawing pictures.

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Um, And it might seem like it's a lot

easier for them, but I think we can do

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it for everyone for all grade levels.

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Microphone (Yeti Stereo Microphone)-3:

Now, this doesn't mean that there won't

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be quiet time or they won't there won't

be times where students need to focus.

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But there came be a lot of different

ways to structure the environment.

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So that everyone has the

thing that they need.

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When they need it.

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For the most part, I mean, I know

you have a lot of students, you can't

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make it perfect for everyone at the

same time, but so that you're also

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keeping it interesting and engaging

and fun for these young writers.

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One day I was in a classroom.

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Of third graders.

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And they were working on a

persuasive piece of writing.

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And.

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They had.

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The structure of the, of the piece,

which, you know, we know they need

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to learn about having the thesis.

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In the beginning and the way they

wanted the intro to be set up.

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And then when students were

writing independently, what I

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noticed was that they all seem to.

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Try to start.

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With the opening paragraph.

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We're with their thesis team.

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And at least, even if they didn't

quite have their hook, but a lot

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of them were trying to do the hook

and then they were moving into

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the next one into the next one.

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And they most likely, I don't

really remember, but they

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most likely had their list of.

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Um, things that are going to talk

about each of their power graphs.

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And I also noticed that everyone

was just writing so neatly, almost

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like they were doing a final piece.

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It was super quiet.

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Um, and all I could think about was.

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This is not how I write.

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For, you know, just to, just

because of course that's going

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to be what comes to my head.

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, and also like how long could

these students Sistine this,

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you know, , And so what I did.

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Was I asked the teacher, if I could

talk to them a little bit about.

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Well, here's the thing

I wanted to shake it up.

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I just wanted to shake it up because.

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I also felt like it was very focused on

the right teaching and not the writer.

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You know, we, the, I felt like the

teacher was trying to make sure

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they had the perfect structure.

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Even if everyone was kind of

writing it, this seem, at least they

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would end up with the right thing.

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But I don't think that

students were really.

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All the way writing to, to their

level because not all of them

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are going to have a great hook.

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If they were to just write on

their own or a great thesis,

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unless they were kind of copying.

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What they saw.

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, and, and I don't want anyone

to think that you can't give

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them that help and that yeah.

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You do need to teach them how to

do that, but it just, in general,

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I felt like it wasn't natural.

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And so I talked to the students a

little bit about how the first time

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that you write your first draft.

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Is going to be not good.

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It's not supposed to be.

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And I felt like because they were

so worried about it, having this

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perfect structure and starting at

the beginning, you know, these are

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all the things you have to have.

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They really weren't able to

completely be free and open to

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think about things in their way,

you know, in, in their unique way.

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That's what I wanted to get out of them.

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, I also know that, you know,

I could think I have great

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ideas for what I want to write.

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And then when I start to write the

first time, it takes a while to really

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get into the good stuff, you know?

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And then I know that when I go back

to revise, I'm going to have more to

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say, I'm going to have better things to

say, I'm going to move things around.

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All that stuff is going to happen.

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And I want them to be

able to experience that.

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And so I told them I just

wanted them to write.

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It could, they could start at the

beginning again, they could start,

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they could continue on where they were.

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And I just wanted them to write

pretty quickly, not worrying about

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handwriting or anything like that.

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And I might've said this before

on here, so I apologize if I have,

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but when I write, even if I'm

not super fast, it's messy and I

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spell things wrong all the time.

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I add letters, I leave off letters.

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It's just how I have to get it down.

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And not everyone is like that, but

so I wrote with them, um, I thought

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of it topic and I started to write.

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And I even got to the point where I

said, oh gosh, I know exactly when

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I want to include in the next couple

of paragraphs, but I'm just going

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to like jot down the notes of it.

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And I'm not going to write it

yet, but it came to my mind.

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So I wrote it down.

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And then when we were done, we just kind

of looked at it and talked about it.

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I shared mine.

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And I really thought it was helpful

for them to be able to do that.

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I just feel it's really important.

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That T that students are able to

write in the way that works for them.

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They have to find what works for

them so that they can move on.

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To be themselves as a writer.

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We're teaching the

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writer, not the writing.

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And so, although we are teaching the

writer, things they can do in their

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writing in order to grow their writing,

we don't want to teach the writing.

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We want to teach the writer.

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We want the writer to do what

they can do and then grow from

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there, develop from there.

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And so we have to let

them do it in their way.

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And we, again, going back to, you know,

just, it needs to be enjoyable and fun.

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And so if we are directing all of

it and we're telling them to do.

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In certain way.

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That's not fun.

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It's just not going to be.

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Natural, either an authentic for them.

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So I'd like to share a few ways

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that I think are helpful to.

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Allow this to happen.

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Okay.

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So first of all, my advice

is to let them lead.

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Let your students show you

how writing time can go.

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And in order to do that, you have

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to trust them even the youngest one.

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So.

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Um, when you're I was working

with a group of kindergarten

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teachers and for the most part.

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Writing instruction in the past had

been more of grammar, instruction,

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sentence writing the there wasn't

a whole lot of composition.

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, There wasn't.

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You know, drawing pictures for writing

and then developing from there.

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And so we first implemented just the

authentic, independent time where they

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are allowed to write whatever they want.

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And we started with telling them

they are writers, writers, write

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this and that and the other.

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And then let them go.

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And some.

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Teachers.

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Started with students

sitting in their desks.

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And then there were a couple of

teachers who said, I'm just going

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to tell them, then you are allowed

to choose a spot around the room.

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You can use your clipboard.

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You can stay at your desk.

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, and they had all these different options

for where they could sit that they had

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to teach them how to get their things.

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They taught them how to, you

know, choose their seat quickly.

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They talked about ways to pick

their seat and all those things.

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So yes, you do have to teach them.

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But honestly, they didn't do a whole

lot of that before they let them do it.

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They gave him some guidelines

and they saw what happened.

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And I.

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Myself was actually amazed.

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And I know the teachers were amazed.

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And when the teachers that didn't

do this, saw the classrooms that

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were doing this, they were amazed.

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That these students.

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We're so.

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I think just happy to be

able to have this choice.

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And they just went.

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And started in.

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Some students took longer than others,

but I really tried to make sure

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the teachers just took a step back.

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Watch what happens because not everyone's

getting, you know, it's not going to

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happen right away for every single

student it's going to get better.

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As you practice it.

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But.

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They each have to find their own way.

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Right.

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But these kindergarteners did it and

they went and sat and there were no

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rules about not talking because we

know that writers need to collaborate.

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And for, especially for that younger

greed, like they are they're social

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creatures and they did write and talk.

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Sometimes they were talking

about something other than

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what they were writing about,

but they were still writing.

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Some of them were talking

about their writing.

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I'm writing about this.

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And when that doesn't happen,

you can model it for them

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and then help them to do it.

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We do stress writing, talk.

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But not so much in the beginning

because we just want it to be fun.

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We want them to feel safe.

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We want them to feel like they can, you.

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You know, it's okay to just kind of

do what they want to do because we

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need to get that built up in them.

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So if kindergartners can do that,

any other grade can do it too.

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Okay.

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So.

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You know, when you think about,

okay, well, it can't always be noisy

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or it can't always be one way or

the other, and that might be true.

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But I do think it's okay for students

to, you know, you can say, you know what?

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I think we need a little

bit of a quiet time.

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Some people might be struggling

because they're getting distracted.

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So let's turn off the talking for now.

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Let's take some time to write on our own.

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Um, and then we'll take a break and

see if anyone wants to work with a

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partner, um, or things like that.

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You might even just have a room

big enough where some students who

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you could have a quiet section.

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Some students who want to write

quietly, they move over to that

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section and there's no talking.

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And then if you want to collaborate

with a partner, you go to the part of

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the room where you are able to do that.

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So I think there's a little, uh,

there are different ways to manage it

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and to give students what they need.

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I also think students

can put headphones on.

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You know, get their computer headphones

and put them on to kind of block

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out some sound when they're writing.

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If that's more comfortable for them.

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But I do think that letting

them lead is helpful.

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And then once you try something,

you see what's happening.

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You talk to them, ask the students,

how is this working for you?

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You can ask them individually.

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You can ask them in a class.

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You can ask them on a survey.

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And then you kind of adjust as

needed, but you want everyone to

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have a chance to have the environment

that really works great for them.

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And you also just want to make sure that

it is collaborative and it is engaging.

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Um, you know, I want it to be buzzing.

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I, at times, at least, because sometimes

we need everyone's energy or we need

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other people's ideas or thoughts.

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Now again, you can build that in.

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You can say you're going to do a

mid-workshop, you know, break or

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stop or discussion, but I honestly

think that it can work where

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sometimes students are writing.

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Are talking and, you know, mostly you want

it to be of course, about their rating.

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And then my second piece of

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advice is to just in general.

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And I mean, I think you kind of

hear it with what I was just talking

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about, but to loosen up the structure.

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I tend to feel or believe that the

structure comes from teaching the writing.

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Now I don't mean that you can.

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Or should accept writing that

has no structure not accepted,

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but you know, you're not going

to grade a piece of writing

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perfectly when it has no structure.

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I'm not saying that I'm talking

about the structure of your classroom

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and the structure of writing time.

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Again, when I think back to that

teacher who, you know, And even if

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she didn't say it, she had, she kind

of somehow set it or inferred to

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them that this is the way you write.

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You start with the beginning and then

you do this and then you do that.

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And we have neat handwriting

and you know, all the things.

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But that's not how we write.

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This is not true, first of all.

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And then second of all that you.

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So that's the structure, but

that's not the way everyone writes.

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You have to, again, allow the

writer cheat, you know, teach

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the writer, let the writer grow.

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So they have to do it

the way they can do it.

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In order to get to the end result

or as close to that end result as

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you are expecting, because they're

not all going to get exactly what

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you want, but we also don't want

them all to have the same thing.

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The same structure of a

persuasive piece of writing.

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Sure.

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You know, the same text features

in an informational writing.

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Yeah.

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But not the same piece of writing.

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And that is what you

tend to start getting.

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When you keep such a structured

way to run your writing time.

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Let them do it in their own way.

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It doesn't mean it's not going

to end up good at the end.

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You want to teach them the process.

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You know, this is what we want to

get to, but you're going to start

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the way you start things do not

end up the way they have begun.

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That never happens for me for a piece of

writing, unless I'm just having like a

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great day or I'm just like, ah, this is

good enough and I'm going to leave it.

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And so maybe it doesn't change

much from the beginning to the

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end, but for the most part, there's

a big change when it's a really.

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Uh, important piece and it's something

that I really want it to be good.

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It's going to change from the beginning.

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Any journey is that way.

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And so it's the same for their writing.

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It should not end up the way it began.

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So we shouldn't have it looking

like a final piece when it's

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not, when it's a first draft.

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And then.

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You know, a way to help them

with that is to just have them.

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Right fast, you know?

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They can be a little messy in the

beginning, as long as I can read it.

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I don't care about that.

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And then my third piece of

advice is to honor what they do.

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I think this is a big one.

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Because part of the reason why writers

don't enjoy writing time or don't

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feel like they are good at writing is

because all they hear is the criticism.

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All they hear is well, but it needs

to be better than that, you know,

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or kindergarteners have their.

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The underwriting under their words.

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Cause that wasn't spelled right.

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So that's not, you know, you try,

but it's not really good enough.

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We need to honor where they are.

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That was great.

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That's amazing.

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And then you tuck it away in your brain.

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Oh, this is what they're having trouble

on so that you can teach them later.

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You know, when you are coaching.

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Um, a baseball player or soccer player.

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You have to build them up and

tell them what they're doing.

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Well, you have to give him the compliment.

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You have to make them feel good

about what they're doing as a player.

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In order for them to be able to

accept the constructive feedback.

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Right.

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And it's the same thing for our writers.

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We want to take what they're

doing as it is, and then use it

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in order to help them move on.

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So every time you come to them and

see their work, you praise them.

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You give them a compliment for it.

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And it's not just what's on the paper.

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It's what they're doing.

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Like, wow, you are really focused today.

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Um, or you, you know, took your

idea and planned it out really well.

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Something that's the action of the

writer that you can also praise.

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So honoring what they are doing.

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Not just trying to go up and

fix it, because again, that's

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thinking about the writing.

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And not the writer.

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And I think that is just crucial in

creating this environment where they

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feel like they can do it in their way.

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Um, and they feel confident

to be able to write.

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And they're confident to share and talk

to someone else about their writing.

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I think that's extremely important.

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Microphone (Yeti Stereo Microphone)-8:

So as you come to this time in your

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school year, where testing is over.

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Or, you know, things are

just kind of winding down.

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This is the time that you can shake it up.

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This is the time that you can,

you know, maybe lose some of that

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structure you've had and make sure

your students are enjoying writing

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time and that they have different

ways to write, you know, meaning.

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Um, With some talking or with some music

or with some, you know, standing up

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and sharing in their middle or writing

really fast and making sure they're not

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worried about the perfection, anything

that you think is going to help them.

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And if you're not sure, ask them.

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What do you guys think about writing time?

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What can you tell me?

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Um, what works really well

for you when you're writing?

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What makes it hard?

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What do you wish we did more

of in writing and then do it.

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And then next year.

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Try it again.

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And trust your writers to tell you

and just show you what they need

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for writing time, so that it can

be enjoyable and then effective.

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Hey, again, I am so happy to have

had you listen in again today.

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I would like to ask a little favor.

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If you're enjoying the podcast, could

you take a moment to go wherever

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it is that you listen and write

a review and tell others what you

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find so great about these episodes?

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I would love to be able to share

it with more teachers to help them

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in their writing instruction, just

as hopefully I've been helping you.

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So thank you so much.

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