Last year we shared this episode discussing Pride as a riot, why business should care about pride, and how to create a riot of your own. Since what we offered to listeners is even more relevant right now, we thought we'd bring the episode back to share with you a refreshed perspective.

Listen now to learn about how your organisation and its leaders can actively and intentionally support the LGBTQ+ community.

Learn more about Within People and the work we do here.

Hey everyone.

Welcome back to Re-Imagining Work From Within.

I'm Jeff Melnick.

It's June, which means it's Pride Month in most places around the world.

Last year we shared an episode discussing Pride as a riot, why

business should care about pride, and how to create a riot of your own.

And since what we offer to listeners is even more relevant right now, we thought

we'd bring the episode back again.

The G B T Q fight for equality is everyone's fight.

A basic principle of equality is that if one group is not free, no one is,

the rights could be taken away from any group of people at any time.

This year we're seeing the usual attempts at corporate allyship.

And the backlash against businesses supporting Pride has intensified with

companies like Budweiser and Target backing down from their commitments

because of attacks by pressure groups and threats to their employees.

But all of this is with a backdrop of increasing intolerance.

So let's just paint a picture to give everyone a bit of the context

of where we are now here in 2023

in the last year, schools are being pressured to remove

books from libraries for fear.

They may coerce children to becoming homosexual or transgender.

This growing censorship movement has taken place in 138 school districts and

32 states impacting 4 million students.

Drag performances are being banned.

In Tennessee Republican senator Jack Johnson said that parents can

now take their kids to a public or private show and not be blindsided

by a sexualized performance.

This week in Canada, an adult verbally attacked a nine-year-old

child participating in a track and field event because he believed the

child was transgender and called her parents groomers and pedophiles.

Meanwhile, uganda has legislated the death penalty for homosexuals.

This legislation comes after years of lobbying from American Christian groups.

Anyone found guilty of promoting homosexuality in the country could

face up to 20 years in prison or death.

Uganda is now one of 11 countries where being gay can be punishable

by death, and 67 countries have national laws criminalizing same sex

relations between consenting adults.

But why does this matter for business?

Well, it matters even more than ever.

As a marginalized group, LGBTQ people are not visible.

Maybe like your Black or Asian employees or some of your disabled employees,

you cannot always see them, but they're there and they need to know that

they belong so that they can be free to be themselves without judgment.

If your employees are not gay, they may be the parents of LGBTQ children.

They need to know that where they work is an ally to them and has their

back, that their children can grow up unafraid of the world, that their kids

who may be gay, lesbian, or transgender are accepted, loved, and safe.

A next generation of kids who may one day soon come to work in your

business, but more than ever, the LGBTQ community does not need allies.

We need accomplices.

To fight alongside us to stop the injustice that persists and is growing

in our governments and to refuse to tolerate any intolerance towards any

human being for simply being who they are.

This podcast looks at the shift away from rainbow logos and sponsored pride

floats to real action you can take.

I hope it inspires you to think a little bit differently about not

only pride, but how your business can create social change from within.

I.

Why don't we just get started by just talking about

what Pride Month even means to us?

Cuz I think that's a really awesome , place to start.

Yeah.

Well, what does it mean to you?

Well, for me, pride Month is, it kind of brings up two things.

I get quite frustrated that we even need to have a month, which is kind of

a different part of this conversation.

But then I also do feel wildly proud to be bisexual and own that and have

a space to really like celebrate that and bring awareness to it.

So it's sort of two things.

It, it means being able to.

Celebrate who I am in a way that feels really safe actually and accepted.

And I can do that every day, but there's like a month for it, which is really nice.

And I think what it does is also create a space for us to talk

about our experiences in this community like we're gonna do today.

Like you and I have spoken about the word queer, we've spoken about

a few things, but it sort of gives like an invitation for a deep dive to

talk about things and to really like bring things into other our awareness

and other people's awareness too.

Yeah, it's almost like it's our time.

Goonies never say die.

It's our time now.

Which It's interesting though, to think like.

This is a thing that happens now, right?

Like why do we need these times or these observances?

But I think you've raised the point is like, if we don't shine a light

on something, how does the light get the chance to beam across the world?

And so mm-hmm.

So we get a month and I think it's different for me now that I live in San

Francisco cuz like, it's like living in.

The, the fault line of the epicenter of American queerness, and it means

more now and I think . I moved here in the pandemic and, and it shut down

and I got really angry about that.

I got really angry that they would cancel the pride march.

Because of Covid and I thought, a, this doesn't make any scientific sense

to me cuz like, can't we just march in like a really long elongated march.

But it was like, okay, now you've, someone else has decided that we

don't get to do the thing that.

That means something to us.

And pride was a riot.

And the march is important.

That's right.

So in the same way that churches were like, what do you mean we can't worship?

And the government said, oh, okay, maybe you can.

It was like, how did the government get to decide that Pride marches

across the nation would be canceled?

And I, I see that as homophobic and I see it as an affront to our culture.

So then last year there was a slightly diluted march as well, cuz we had

another kind of uptick this year.

Let's see what happens.

I think it's, it's all, it's all a go, but it, it does mean something

different and it means showing up.

It means stepping up as well.

And I think it's a reminder to us that the riot isn't over.

And I think for me, in my sort of journey of that is like, okay, now I really wanna

start a riot, so what's it gonna be?

Cuz I think as you, you know, maybe when you're in your activist youth era,

everything was a riot and everything's a revolution because that's how we

process things in our, in our youth.

And then you kind of get like complacent, don't you?

Like a riot is like, how am I gonna get a table at foreign cinema?

Right.

But it's not, so it's a reminder.

No, the fight's not over.

Let's go.

And I think that's really important for this, for this month to

remember, and especially with some of the SH that is going down.

Let's get into that.

So we know on this podcast we always kind of talk about workplace culture

and leadership obviously, but we're bringing this Pride month lens to

it, and we thought we could kind of highlight a little bit of why

companies, why organizations support pride should they, how do they.

Where perhaps are the missteps and things they could be doing

a little bit differently?

Cause we've got a lot of that out there.

But where do you think we should start?

Well, what do you think about corporations supporting Pride Month?

I think similarly to how we share with our leaders committed to

change that d e I should be integrated in everything, so should pride.

And that doesn't mean that you need to have like a rainbow logo year

round, but it does mean that inclusive behavior and inclusive activities should

just be happening all year, perhaps still celebrating during this month.

Cuz as we said, it brings a lot, it's a reminder, it gives us a

chance to share stories, to connect, to feel proud, all those things.

But, Again, it's one of those things, I'm a Libra, okay.

I'm balancing scales.

I can kind of see both sides.

I both am annoyed that this is a thing that we have to celebrate

and people put rainbow logos and I can see why it's important.

And I also just wish it was something that lived throughout the whole year.

And I used to work at WeWork and I was on our queer community, our

employer resource group, basically.

And one of the big last initiatives before I got unceremoniously

exited, Was the pride or not.

Another podcast was the Pride Parade.

So I got to help to design our whole float.

I got to be on the committee.

We put together a whole series of events.

It was incredible.

And I felt good doing that, and I felt empowered that WeWork

was like, please, let's do this.

And it was sort of a like, shouldn't we just be always doing this?

So I'm kind of of two minds.

I

don't know.

Yeah.

So, so you felt it must have felt good to make that float

and be represented in that way.

Right.

And feel proud of your company.

Right.

And I think there's, there's a bit of a corporation halo effect

that goes there from internal engagement point of view, right?

Like, we can be proud cause we're supporting.

Yeah.

I do think it, the, the story behind it has to go way further back around

the acknowledgement that actually this.

Is a group of people, the L G B LGBTQ Q community who are a segment of

the population that can spend money.

So it's, it's in many sense, it's a marketer's dream to go

in Pride Month we support you.

Please spend your dollars with us.

In America, it's known as the Dorothy Dollar, and in the

UK it's known as the pink.

Pound and the pink pound is worth an estimated sort of 6 billion a year to

the UK economy, and it's estimated being as a global force over several trillion.

Right.

Okay.

But those, those are big numbers, but is that what we're here for?

Are we a marketing segment, right?

Are we an ABC one, LGBTQ plus one?

Like that's not what Pride is about, and I think that's why people get.

Angry with the commercialization of it.

And if I walk into Target and I see the pride outfits that you've

got hanging on your cheap plastic like hangers, as I walked past the

chocolate aisle, that can infuriate me.

But I did see a post the other day on Instagram, which

I thought was really great.

I think it was a post to someone's tweet that said, Hey, yeah, it's

kind of gross what Walmart and Target are doing, but as somebody.

And I think this person was maybe late or early stage Gen X, so quite

a bit, a little bit older than me as someone who used to not be able to

walk into a store and feel that they could hold hands or be themselves with

the person they loved to walk into Target, which was one of the first.

Businesses to kind of support, I think and celebrate.

Yeah.

This is, and celebrate.

To walk into store now and see them celebrating our identity

is fundamentally different.

And so how do we understand that?

Not just go, oh, it's gross because the corporates are stealing our money.

Yeah.

But actually understand how much, how far we've come, where it used to be

shameful or hurtful to walk into a store and, and let's acknowledge that in

many places in the world and still many places in America, it is still that way.

And that.

Until the Equality Act passes.

Many stores in many states could still say, Hey, you can't come in here and buy

something from us because you are queer.

And so that's insane.

There's far to go and so, so yeah.

It's interesting to think, actually, can we see the positive

in the commercialization?

Of of our, not of our flag.

Cuz as you know, I don't believe in that.

We can't take an identity and merge it into our own and say, Hey look

for a month we are rainbow too.

That doesn't really work for me.

But can we say, Hey, we support you and actually we are doing something.

We're doing something in the community and we're doing something inside our business.

And that's where I think this really needs to move to.

Can we have in June companies saying We're not done yet?

We have a lot more in terms of equity and equality that, and inclusion that

we really need to do in our business.

I

really like that.

And when you were speaking, what was coming up for me is like, I think I

also really need to check my privilege when I feel the frustration because I.

Unlike you and other people, even older generations and people of my exact same

age, I have not had a traumatic experience as someone in this community really.

I had a couple of times when I was like ostracized and outed when I

was living in Utah and like was not allowed to do certain things.

But I've always been accepted by my family.

I've always been.

I'm a, a cis woman, like I can, I'm presenting, you know, like I

can show up and just be myself.

And that is, there's a real privilege to that.

So the trauma of walking into target and seeing rainbows is not

something that I have experienced.

I can empathize with that, of not being accepted into a target, but I,

it's not something I've experienced and there's a real privilege to

that, that I have to remember.

Yeah.

And I think it's like where we are now is great.

It's, we're not done, but where other places in the

world haven't even started yet.

And I think that checking our privilege of like, if we're fighting the

fight, but we live in San Francisco, the fight feels different, right?

Can we remember we're fighting the fight for people around the world in seven

countries that you can still face the death penalty just for being who you are.

You know, legal marriage is only what in 15.

D countries, I might get that wrong.

Apologies.

Uh, but it's, it's low compared, you know, so, so there's a lot more to do and so

can, if you're in a place of privilege of where you live and things feel good,

can you remember that you're here also as a community to fight for others?

And can corporations then, or businesses understand that they.

May have a role to play in that too.

Yeah.

And that that role is based around how do they create a system of

equity, inclusion, and equality in their own macro micro world where

they can actually affect change.

Yeah.

I really like the idea of like using June to say we're not done yet.

I think that is really powerful cuz I mean, don't say gay bill just passed

in Florida like a few months ago.

Like, hello, what are we doing people

right.

And there's many other bills on the docket in many other

states where it's That's right.

You know, there's gonna be a lot of don't saying gay and so how

are corporations right now saying gay and can they put their money.

Where their mouth is cuz always follow the money.

Listeners of this podcast know that that's where I believe the truth lies.

So if you believe in equity and equality and you've, and you want to change your

logo rainbow this month, can you tell us how are you gonna get behind that?

Like, are you willing to defund your PAC for politicians who will

not pass the equity act into law?

And if you're not, why?

And can you stand up as a leader in front of your business and say, this

is why we are not willing to defund politicians who will actively seek

to discriminate in our communities.

And I think we saw the backlash with Disney.

Yeah.

Where they wouldn't withdraw their support of the, don't say gay bill.

And then the bill passed and then, oh, wait a second.

Actually we do.

Mm-hmm.

Um, a little bit too late there, Mickey.

But the backlash internally and.

Externally for, for Disney fans was was very real.

And of course now Disney gets the backlash from the Florida

politicians, but who will win?

Mickey or Ron,

please let Mickey win.

I'm Team Mickey.

Okay.

So what should corporations be doing?

We started to get into that, but rather than just the rainbow logo, what?

What can we do?

Well, I've, I've sort of alluded to it already with my,

let's go with the defunding option.

I mean, I think that's the far end of the scale, obviously, the, like, how do

you listen to people understand the, the issues in the community that is important?

Like you said, this is a time for space, so how do we give space for those stories?

How do we actually hear and understand them?

I think one thing that I'd love to highlight is, I, I think it's time that

if you have a policy in your business that is equitable and inclusive, say

for example, adoption leave for same-sex parents or healthcare provided at the

fullest extent of your insurance, that might be quite different to what the state

would provide, say for H I V medication or something like that, that really

understands the needs of the community.

How are you extending that?

To everyone in your global workforce.

So if you've got employees in America, and I'm just gonna be bold here, and you

have operations in Saudi Arabia, how are you going to bring that level of equity

and understanding to your employees there?

And that's edgy.

Because that's going against the cultural norms of what's

happening in your business.

Yeah.

And in the places that you operate.

But I'm gonna plant a flag there and say, you own your system leader.

So if you believe in equity, then that has to go across the board.

It can't just be, oh, you live in California, so it must be more liberal,

so we're gonna give you more things.

Right.

. Yeah, so just extending it because I think as companies get more global

and also as the workforce gets more global, so we can work from anywhere.

Now if you live and work in certain places, not if you work for Elon.

Um, more on that maybe later.

Are we extending that same understanding of equity across our business?

Are we, are we packaging it up in more liberal places so that we

can attract the people who might be living more in those zones?

What do you think about that though?

I know

that's kind of interesting.

I'm just thinking like, so much of the work we're doing now as a

partnership is about attracting.

Talent because that is what workplace culture is calling for at the moment,

and I like the idea of it being something that's available for everyone

and making that equitable globally.

And it's a curious thing to package it up for more liberal areas if that's where you

are, hyper locally and wanting to attract that kind of folks because it's, I don't

know how I feel about that, to be honest.

Mm-hmm.

It's a really difficult one.

I mean, I, in my heart I'm like equitable globally, obviously, and I can see the

challenge of that for employers for sure.

Yeah.

And strategically, I mean it's right, you sort of go, okay, well we're probably

gonna have to spend more to attract certain people in certain markets

and we can make cuts in other places.

Right.

But I guess the other thing that's coming up for me now is

if you're in Saudi Arabia and you're a person who doesn't align with our

beliefs and your company has on their culture page or on their job description,

equitable working practices, and that is for some reason offensive to you.

Perhaps bug her off.

And maybe it comes back to like aligning on our values.

Like who are the people that we wanna

attract?

Right, globally, and this is always the crux, right?

It's always the thing is like, Ooh, maybe we don't wanna stick our heads

too above the parapet because we're gonna have people out there that

aren't gonna like what we stand for.

Well, you don't stand for it unless you're standing on the fricking.

Parapet bouncing up and down and saying, this is what we stand for.

So that's why I hate the word humble when it comes to businesses talking

about themselves around stuff like this.

It's like, we don't wanna rock the boat, we don't wanna shake things up.

The world needs shaking up.

And if you're gonna say that these are the things that are important

to you, you've gotta stand by them.

And so this is a challenge that I'm putting out there cuz I know it's hard

and I know it's particularly hard in regions where that's difficult and we've

seen a lot of things over the um, Over the past couple years as well, especially

with with social media where we can see what's going on in other parts of the

world and other parts of our community where you've got American posts saying

like, yeah, it's time for everyone to come out and here's our media, and

like, have a public outing and like, here we go, rebel Wilson's come out.

Isn't she great?

Let's like.

Post that and post that and post that.

And then you've got people in countries where they can't come out because doing

so would be harmful to their life going, well, that's really great that you guys

are saying that this is so important.

We can't do that.

Mm-hmm.

And I think it's not for us to go, oh, you should, but rather for us

to go, oh wait, how do we use our privilege to help you do that?

And that's gonna be a journey for your nation to get there or your culture.

But if we stand for.

Equity and equality and belief in who we are, then we have to be able

to stand for that in everything.

And as a company, I just believe you're gonna have to take that journey and

take that step, and you do it because it's the right thing to do, and you

do it because it makes good business sense, because the more you are able

to bring freedom into your business.

The more your people are gonna thrive, the more that you're gonna thrive.

And I think if you close that down and think, well, we're gonna, we're

gonna lose consumers or we're gonna be pushed out of areas where we, where

we're not accepted anymore, where will you, where will you be accepted?

How and how are you standing up for that?

Yeah.

Yeah.

And perhaps like the more they're standing up on the platform and being

explicit about values aligned or not, but the people they wanna attract,

the more allies they'll create.

Yeah, which is kind of interesting cuz then you've got like global allies

where, you know, there's the people in this community are struggling every

day to overcome bias that they're, they're having and it's, there's so much

discrimination in the workplace still.

Yeah.

And there's something about, if we talk about what corporations should

do, it's creating that safe space to hear from employees to make it okay.

To be able to talk about who they are and embrace their authenticity.

And really, I.

Each of us have a role to play in that.

And so if you have a, uh, a team full of allies, then you've got more people on

your side doing what's needed to be done.

And you kind of started to talk about this for a second, but the idea of

our really deeply held belief that diversity is actually what helps us grow.

Diversity unlocks creativity, unlocks collaboration, unlocks learning.

So the more room you make for it, the better you'll be as a

company commercially as well.

So one thing that I've been thinking a lot about is that the idea of being

mindful that LGBTQ inclusion doesn't fall behind diversity priorities on

gender or race, it's a part of it.

It should be a part of it.

And intrinsic throughout your organization.

Just like we feel the same way about d e I.

It shouldn't be just a D E I policy that stands alone.

It's.

Integrated into your employee experience at every place.

And part of that is representation at the leadership level.

Like we don't work with many leaders that are part of our community.

And there's something really interesting about that, and I'm curious what you kind

of think about that representation on leadership teams that can actually be a

reflection of the diversity that we're trying to create in, in our workplace.

Why do you think that gender and race win in the d e I conversations,

why did those get popped to the top?

First thing that popped in my mind was that sometimes

those things are more visual, where sexuality perhaps isn't.

Yes, but I don't know.

Why do you think

I've struggled with this as well?

I think there's two things there apart, uh, like visibility being number one.

I think number two is probably also volume, which is linked to.

Visibility.

So we have 50% women, we have 50% men.

Why don't we have equality and equity between gender?

So that's a basic one.

And why do we still not have that is an ongoing battle.

So there you go with that one.

I think in America, race is really important and as it

should be, and so it does.

Have a prime position.

So why aren't we seeing more people of color in leadership positions

is a really important discussion.

Whereas you hear that discussion in Europe, but not in the same way because

Europe isn't processing that trauma of inequity in the same way that America is.

Doesn't mean it doesn't exist, it's just not processing it.

And again, there's a numbers game there because people of color,

you know, Are also in America.

I think it's, we're gonna get to the point where if you, it's a bit of a

weird conglomerate, but like 50% white and 50% people of color, which in which

they've lumped in just other things.

So much intersectionality.

Yeah.

Yeah.

So that's a segmentation issue that I'm still not understanding.

But hey, so that's a numbers game as well.

So then people go, well, there's not that many gays is there.

And then I think the other thing that comes along with it in line with that

is like, well, gay men are still men.

So they still are in positions of power.

Well, that's interesting and possibly true, but that doesn't

mean we're not marginalized, right?

And so we're still not represented.

And at the moment, in the foots C 100, there are zero.

CEOs who are B LGBTQ Q are out as L g, BT Q, and in the Fortune 500 there are four.

That's insane.

So even in a numbers game, so if you go by the McKinsey rule of 10% representation of

G BT Q, I think McKinsey data is maybe a bit outdated because we were looking at.

The binaries of sort of gay or lesbian, and now we know

there's much more of a spectrum.

If you're looking at that, we're still way below the curve, but the stat that

I saw the other day was 25 out of 5,670 board seats at the Fortune 500 companies

are occupied by openly lgbtq plus people.

So that's 0.4%.

So when I, so you go four or 500, well that's okay.

You guys are in there.

You got four, you got Tim Cook.

I'm not sure I would include him as openly, L g Bt Q, but

that's for another podcast.

But four to 500, you could, people go, oh, you're there.

You got a number, but 0.4% of board seats.

Mm-hmm.

That sucks.

Not.

Okay.

Yeah, so, so this is called, again, with the, with the terms, I don't know why

everything has to be pink, but fine.

It's, why couldn't it be the rainbow ceiling?

But it's the pink ceiling.

There seems to be a point where representation at

senior levels is not there.

So why do you think that is an, is it the same for women and people of color to get

to the top?

I think there's some similar practices perhaps happening.

Yeah, like senior leaders, we talk to our clients a lot about this.

You have to stop hiring in your image.

If we go out and try to find people just like us, all of a sudden we're

surrounded by a team just like us, right?

So there's a real intentionality that has to happen about creating some

really real and serious diversity instead of Yeah, hiring in our image.

And what's interesting too is the like looking externally to hire folks, like

hiring from within and looking at your own community within, so that it's like a real

representation of who you already are.

Putting people in leadership and them representing who you

already are is another really interesting way to think about it.

And focusing on the growth and development of your people and like bringing

up the next generation of leaders.

Yeah, that's, you know, part of this community, part of the people of color,

community, whatever that one is for you.

But looking at how you can kind of grow your people from within

and hire people who, who should be in leadership positions.

We need more representation.

It's very important.

Yeah, it's, it's interesting to think like how many

transgender employees do you know, across the clients we've worked with

or in the businesses we've worked with.

I can only name a, a couple and, and I, yeah, me too.

Seen that journey happen over time as well.

If I think about when I started my career Zero and where I'm at now,

now I'm seeing a handful, so, I'm old, so 20 years of working at least.

So I haven't seen enough.

I haven't seen a lot of change, but maybe it's a hockey stick.

Let's see what happens.

So are the safe spaces being created in our corporate worlds and our

companies for people to come out is the first question because the, the

stats are openly LGBTQ plus people.

That does not mean that in their lives they're not.

Like even in their private lives or in their social life, perhaps they're openly

out, but at work, maybe they're not.

And so that's the number one thing.

But when are we gonna see a transgender c e o?

When, when do we imagine that's gonna happen?

So we think about the progress that's needed now, where transgender people

don't even have equal rights, right?

In this country and beyond to.

So to have one as a C E O, think of the power that would have in representation

for our youth and for politic.

Petitions to see that this is a person who is just as clever and just as good

and just as brilliant at what they do, and that this aspect of their cultural

dynamic is hugely important to them being a successful business person

in the mind of corporate America.

That kind of representation is really important and we don't have

it, and this is why I even advocate for if you are a LGBTQ sports.

Professional, how important it is for you to come out because the world

is needing you to stand on your own parapet and say, look, here I am, and

there are more of us because we know.

We know that there are way more gay footballers in the United Kingdom.

Yes, we know that there are way more lesbian sports people in across

the world, and we know that trans kids have the right to play for the

sports team that they choose to.

And until we start seeing more representation, that is not gonna happen.

We know how important that is.

Yeah, we spoke about that today also, while

I was getting my haircut.

Did the maths of all the football teams across and there's like

something around 4,000 athletes.

Yeah.

And there's like one bisexual.

That's impossible.

Yeah.

There's definitely more.

Its not, it's not a safe space, so it's really difficult.

And imagine what representation would unlock for future generations

and just the people around them.

Their peers as well.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Hmm.

Okay, so we've been talking for quite a while and I'm really

happy to be in this conversation.

And what do you think is important for us to talk

about now?

Well, what do you wanna see in this pride month?

What would be your dream?

My dream would be cis white men and women that are leading companies.

Going to the employees in the L G B T Q community and saying, Hey,

I really wanna create a space for you and I wanna support you.

How can we co-create together?

Hmm.

Because I think that in a lot of employee resource groups, there's many people in

our community who don't feel safe enough to create the space even for themselves.

Yeah.

And I think we need to see a lot more allyship from leaders to actually be

creating, or at least opening the door.

Putting the power in the hands of the community.

But we need some of these allies to open the door that are in senior

leader positions to say, I see you.

I wanna support you.

I wanna hold a safe space with you and alongside you, tell me what you

need.

Yeah.

Beautiful.

I think that it's such a simple thing to do and yet seems so hard, doesn't it?

And every leader could do that.

I champion your vision.

Oh, it's such a about you.

Hard question, isn't it?

Yeah, it's definitely rainbow mayo.

That was definitely what I wanted to see.

This pride month.

I would like to see pride become political again.

And I know we're in a very divisive political environment at the moment and

I'm all for it cuz we need to get to break down before we get to breakthrough.

I would like that breakdown to not be violent, but in many cases we have

to remember that bricks were thrown.

So what are the things that we're gonna overhaul?

. And I guess to put one more wish, if I may, Anique is I would love

in Pride month, and I know we have.

LGBTQ history month as well.

But I would like us always to listen to our elders, understand

our past and grow from that.

Cuz I think our history has been repressed for so long that there's so

many good stories to watch and learn from and listen to and we're missing that.

And I think if we can use this month to connect even just

to one that's very powerful.

I'd like to give a shout out to season three pose.

I don't know if you've watched Yes.

Yet.

Yeah.

Oh my God.

The blubbering mess.

I was, when Pray Tell Goes back, I'm just in the, so no spoilers everyone.

Yeah.

If you haven't watched it yet.

Yeah.

Oh man.

Watching the L word hoof.

Woo.

Anyways, this was an amazing conversation.

As always, you brought us some really good stuff, and I'm grateful to

be in this space with you, in this community, with you, and thank you so

much for the space to talk about this.

It's wonderful to be here.

I'd like to give a shout out to Emily, our producer, who's always

behind the scenes and has been giving thumbs up and claps and hands raised.

Preach girl.

We are here and thank you, Emily, for everything you've done.

For our podcast as well, cuz it's awesome.

It's so awesome.

Thanks, Emily.

Close

out.

I love being a part of it.

Thank

you.

So good.

Thanks everyone for listening.

Thanks for being here, Jeff and Emily.

It was an absolute pleasure.

Re-imagining Work From Within is available wherever you listen to podcasts, and

we release episodes every other week.

See you soon.