The United Jewish Peoples' Order is in the midst of celebrating their 100th year as a secular, leftist Jewish organization in Canada.

Three of UJPO's staff join Blueprints to share some of what they've learned working for the century-old organization, and reflect on how they might build for the next 100 years.

What UJPO does is largely a reflection of their origin story as outsiders:

"We began in the 1920s out of a need for mutual aid between secular, leftist Jews - the majority of them factory workers. They needed community." - Shayle Kilroy, UJPO Operations Manager gives a brief history of how socio-economic conditions led to the creation of a versatile network that understands the importance of collective liberation.

We hear how UJPO has navigated through extraordinary times, both globally and internally - and how they've remained Leftists through it all; Embracing change, and inclusivity, while holding onto their core values.

UJPO have a big event coming up on June 11th, titled "Joy and Struggle". Its an example of how the organization seeks to blend the cultural (the communal) with the political - an approach Executive Director Sarena Sarain and Cultural Director David Wall say have been critical to the longevity of the group.

The three guests also talk a lot about what solidarity means, how they practice collective liberation and the other elements that have made them what they are today.

Hosted by: Jessa McLean

Get Tickets to the 100th Celebration: Joy and Struggle

Related Episodes:

• Jews Say No to Genocide (Dec 2024) Serena Sairan and Lauren Moses-Brettle on the identity crisis being purposely crafted by the Israeli lobby to thwart the work being done to liberate Palestine.
• Return and Liberation (Oct 2022) A discussion with the Palestinian Youth Movement on how they organize as a diaspora, both culturally and politically, in an environment hostile to their existence.

More Resources:

• UJPO on YouTube
• Our History – Morris Winchevsky Centre | Secular Jewish Toronto

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All of our content is free - made possible by the generous sponsorships of our Patrons. If you would like to support our work through monthly contributions: Patreon

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Greetings, friends. My name is Jess McLean, and I'm here to provide you with some blueprints

of disruption. This weekly podcast is dedicated to amplifying the work of activists, examining

power structures, and sharing the success stories from the grassroots. Through these discussions,

we hope to provide folks with the tools and the inspiration they need to start to dismantle

capitalism, decolonize our spaces, and bring about the political revolution that we know

we need. Okay, so welcome to Blueprints. Can you folks introduce yourself? Hi, my name

is Shail and I'm the operations manager at the United Jewish People's Order. Also, uh

pretty much a lifelong member of the community as well. um Yeah. Hi, my name is Serena Serin.

I am the executive director for the United Jewish People's Order. I have also been a Shala educator.

And I've been immersed in this community on and off when I've been in Toronto since the

1990s. My name is David Wall. I am the cultural director at the United Jewish People's Order.

And I, like Serena, have been around, hanging around this community, these communities since

the 1990s. What is this community? I think all three of you use that term. I've got it in

quotations now in my notes. Who wants to define this community? This community is a complicated

statement because we're, United Jewish People's Order is an umbrella organization that kind

of oversees or is intertwined with multiple organizations and multiple communities. So

when we say this community, we're talking a lot of people who engage with us with the

United Jewish People's Order, with our school, the Morrison Chesky Schools, with our summer

camp, Camp Neiveldt. We have national reach. There's a United Jewish People's Order in Winnipeg.

There's members all over the country. So the community is a kind of catch-all for quite

a diverse and large group. And we've been around for 100 years. To get to go to another level

with it, we're talking about secular left-leaning Jews and non-Jews who are also connected

to... to secular Jewish culture in one way or another, whether that's through their

families or just getting connected to our cultural events, which reach non-Jews as well.

em So yeah, think politically active em lefty Jews is really our base. And I'll just sprinkle

the magic dust, which is also em Jews over the course of a century interested in cultural

expression of our politics. So there is a Yiddish, there's a thread of Yiddish-Kite, uh which

has now expanded into broader forms of Jewish expression as well. But that have really

hold a special place in uh expressing ourselves through music and art and theater and dance

and not just direct. Lobbying. Mixing this community building and the cultural though

with the political or do we keep it separate? Yes, always with the political lens. 100 years,

that was the significant number thrown out there. As you reminded me, this whole year is the

100 year anniversary of the organization. That is a very long time. You're having a celebration.

We definitely want to talk about it. Why are you folks celebrating a hundred years and how?

I really can't think of any other organization in our country of Canada that has uh continuously

held a leftist position among uh the broader Jewish culture. So, uh while there are other

organizations as old as ours, maybe even older, We're the continuously left-leaning Jewish

organization of this age. So that in and of itself is, it's just remarkable. Like when

you stop and think just about that, um it's really a moment of ah significance that we

really want to preserve our identity in this way. And we really want to preserve our institution

to continue for another hundred years. So we're thinking about 100 year chunks, right? At

this very, very moment in time. And so how can we preserve this organization for the next

100 years? And that is exactly the question that we as staff and we as an organization

as a whole are constantly like wrestling with. I think also, you know, in today's political

landscape, it's just so important that we... Oujpo, some people say Ajpo. that's our acronym

for United Jewish People's Order. um Some people say the Ajpo. That we make it clear that

we've been around for a century and Jews with leftist, quite far left radical politics, this

is not a new thing, this is not something that's just happened since October 7th. this, our...

history is 100 years long and throughout that whole history we've been an extremely politically

active radical organization and we've been real Jews who really have been celebrating

and participating actively in Jewish culture and uh expression of our Jewishness while

being radical leftists and you know there's always been a range of different uh political

affiliations in Ujpo. There's communists and socialists and people who would probably not

define themselves by either of those terms, but are just fighting for a just world or

this utopian vision of a free, a freedom for all. so yeah, we just celebrating the a hundred

years, think today really matters to just show that Jews like us have been around for 100

years plus and actually since the beginning of Judaism, but Yeah, we're not we're not new

and that That's a really important message that we want to get across I'm sorry, Jess. Did

you say in your question? Did you say how? We're celebrating. I think that was part of it, right?

It was a two-parter. Yeah Yeah, so let me tackle that so this entire year is an excuse for us

to celebrate so we're having multiple events and celebrations and stuff. And because it's

been mentioned that a big part of what we do is cultural, we believe that cultural expression

is intrinsically intertwined with political action. That's just a thing that we stand

by. The big thing we're doing is on June 11th, which is coming up soon, June 11th, 2026 at

Trinity St. Pauli United Church in Toronto, in Blorence, Benin, we're having this Pretty

massive celebratory event featuring the great Naomi Klein in conversation with Professor

Deborah Cohen. That'll be a big thing. We're also reconvening after a 13 year hiatus, our

Toronto Jewish Folk Choir. The Toronto Jewish Folk Choir is a big deal. This was a United

Jewish People's Order affiliated cultural group that was started in 1925 and was at one point

had hundreds of members in it, played Massey Hall backed by the Toronto Symphony Orchestra,

uh had guest singers like Paul Robeson, Jan Pierce. This was a big deal. There's a street

named after the Toronto Jewish Folk Choir in Toronto, actually. But we've reestablished

the choir. It's reborn and it will be performing as well on June 11th. And we're also having

the great Ray Spoon and Jeff Berner, wonderful singer songwriters. It's going to be a big...

Marvelous show and we invite everyone to uh Get tickets Tickets are on a sliding scale.

There's slightly more expensive tickets. There's cheaper tickets and we also Part of our ethos

is that we never turn people away from our events for economic So People can contact us and

uh if they need help getting into the show for a cheaper price And so there's that Anyway,

we invite everyone, we're also doing events all year because this is a monumental moment

for us, 100 years of activism and cultural expression. Let's talk about how those are

tied together, right? That is something our audience would be interested in on how collective

liberation and responsibility are tied into this cultural. And I think that ties into

what Shail was saying as we're not new. uh shoe, they weren't playing flip it there. It was

just, ah you really do mean it. It's part of a long Jewish tradition. Can we talk about

that? Because there are parts of history you're clearly emphasizing when you're bringing up

the hundred year history, I got the press release. So um let's talk about that. I think that's

important in this moment. Well, one thing that David touched on, you know, and and how sort

of things manifest from our historical precedence into present day moment is um our things like

uh our sliding scale, right? So, and tickets and access to community and participation.

So, you know, it's a bedrock principle that no one gets turned away. Like we really do

mean it and we will really meet with each and every individual um and meet them at their

need, right? At the level of need. That is really a... part of our origin story. Like that is

something, that is a thread that has, you know, carried us through the last century. That in,

you know, at the time of conception, we gathered together because of economic barriers. And

so economic justice has always been something like a uh bedrock principle, as we're saying,

that really has carried through. So... Even if somebody needs free entry, can do, you

know, like we can meet that. So, you know, I think our social justice priorities, economic

justice being one of them, uh are the ways in which we continue this legacy and we carry

it forward. And it's not going anywhere and it's always been. Thanks, Serena. Yeah, I think

to build on that, you know, yeah, we began... in the 1920s out of a need for mutual aid

uh between secular leftist Jews who were, the majority of them, factory workers and they

needed uh community and also, at certain points in our history, we've been a credit union.

We have cemetery lands. uh we have all kinds of kind of legacy institutions of mutual

aid because there wasn't, there weren't necessarily, there wasn't like universal healthcare and

Jews were obviously shut out of a lot of um spaces. So there was this like real need to

come together and that's kind of our origin story. And I think these people who started

Ujpo, they were radical leftists. many of them were in support of the Russian Revolution,

they were communists, many of them, and there wasn't necessarily another space for these

radical leftist Jews in Canadian Jewish culture in general. And so this political beliefs

and the need brought people together, but you also, to really build a lasting community,

you need joy and um cultural expression and em you need fun and you need all of these

elements that are not just single issue political organizing but like that's why we have the

choir and why we have and why we you know we do holiday celebrations and why our camp,

Camp Navel exists as well because um there was this need for for a place to just be human.

So most Jewish institutions are, you know, places where people who are in solidarity,

where Jews in solidarity with Palestine can have any kind of community or any, they can't

find anyone who's like-minded and these institutions don't support uh solidarity with Palestine

at all, these Zionist institutions. And so what we offer is a space where we do that political

work and we come together for that political work, but we also have this element of just

like finding joy in community and culture. And we have our Sunday school, you know, for kids

and families. And we have this, it's a fulsome community. that's been a through line throughout

all of the hundred years of Ujpa history. the political beliefs and the political organizing

and the need bringing folks together and then folks stay because we um have all of these

cultural offerings that nourish people um in every aspect of their lives. I would just

add that they just answered perfectly. That we have a very important intrinsic part of

what we do is education. So we have activism, we have cultural expression. And we have education

that's really reflected in the main three entities that we oversee. Morrison Chessie School and

Camp Nibel perfectly encapsulates that you have the camp. Now it's a place where we can commune

with nature and be in a joyful space and let go. We have our school in which liberationist

education is taught to, you know, from kindergarten all the way up to adults. We have Ujpo which

oversees the you know, all of it, but we're definitely dedicated to the activist, social

activist part of our organization. So those three things have been from the beginning,

our major focuses. And the mandate of solidarity within collective, our understanding of collective

liberation makes it almost awkward for us to focus on ourselves. So this year of turning

100, And it being a very internal reflective moment, worthy of deep reflection and consideration,

we almost fumble a bit. It's awkward for us because so often our gaze is about linking

arms with our allies and our comrades. And it's not just being about our insular community

at Uchpo. It's about the solidarity with others. I'm trying to imagine the, obviously not huge

political shifts, but just the moments in time that your organization has gone through in

this 100 years. Obviously one thinks of the Holocaust, first and foremost, of how the need

must have been great, you know, and the strain on your members. I know you don't like focusing

on yourselves, but you know, when you talk about bringing joy and all of these moments together

in celebration, it does make me think of what needs you've had to fill over the last two

and a half years, knowing that you've always been a home for secular Jewish people struggling

to perhaps fit in with their with their political beliefs, you know, and because we've talked

about that on the show and we've had Jewish comrades come and talk about being called

capos, being called not genuine Jews um and how that obviously hit a fever pitch um post

October 7th. Have you... Will you do be reflecting on that in your hundred years? Are there parallels

perhaps we can draw to how your organization has dealt with these moments of particular

need and perhaps division within the greater Jewish community? That's a doozy. Yeah.

I'll begin if that's okay. just yeah. Yeah. So there's a there's a number of answers to

that was a very broad based and excellent question. ah Errol Angel, who runs Jewish Currents,

the most wonderful magazine in the world, left one of the few really successful institutions

other than ours that is staunchly, not staunchly, that is uh certainly Zionist critical, if not

outright anti-Zionist. um She says that it's one thing to tear down Jewish institutions,

to spend a lot of time... quite rightly criticizing and separating oneself as a leftist from mainstream

Jewish institutions. know, most Jewish institutions, synagogues, organizations, know, are staunchly

pro-Israel and we don't want to be doing that in the face of genocide. So it's one thing

to tear down these institutions, but because these institutions are so intrinsic to people's

lives, you need to create alternatives. You need to create places where people can land.

So if a person separates themselves from everything they've known in terms of their Jewish expression,

their Jewish communities, sometimes their families, in the face of genocide, in the face of Zionism,

their needs have placed open arms for them to embrace. And I really think that's one of the

things that Ajpo is so great at is that we are a warm and friendly multifaceted space that

people who are critical of Israel and our leftist can enter and feel welcome in. And we have

all these things that we offer. And I think that that has been Ajpo's mandate forever.

Well, I also want to mention that, you know, the history of Ajpo is very exciting and dramatic.

There's been schisms, there's been you know, basically wars between factions. There's been,

you know, thinking back to our origins in the 1920s was a group breaking away from the Workmen

circle, which was the sort of catch-all place where leftist secular Jews existed in Canada.

People broke away. Disagreements around the Bolshevik revolution. There was a schism. There

were other schisms. There was famously in 1956 when it became apparent that Stalin was a horrible

fascist anti-Semite. people were shocked and horrified and broke away from allegiance to

Soviet Russia. That happened in our organization and led to different factions. um Obviously

there's been schisms around uh Palestinian solidarity and it has had real ramifications for our

organization and other leftist organizations. So it's actually an incredibly dramatic and

exciting history. um And we're just sort of continuing. um You know, since October 7th,

it's been, like on steroids, this kind of schism and these schisms in the Jewish community.

One of the things that we can really offer, is, which is we pull from our history and

still matters today is this, there's, think there's two kind of two things. And one of

them is comfort with taking the space as outsiders. Like we have been outsiders to the mainstream

Jewish community. uh And also outsiders to just the mainstream. Toronto Canadian community

uh throughout our whole history. And I think we've had a real, we've really landed in a

comfort with that in the last 100 years. Like, yes, we, know, as much as I'm saying, we are

really, we are a real Jewish institution that's 100 years old. We've always been, we've always

been on the radical outskirts of, uh you know, Jewish identity. And that was, that's always

been where we've wanted to be, right? there was, there was and still is a lot of belief

in a world, a just future world that will, where everyone has freedom and dignity. But

while we're struggling towards that, are in that kind of place, that outsider place, but

that's okay. And there's a lot of joy and community that can come from that. And I think we've

seen that throughout our whole hundred years of history and we still. occupy that space

now and I think we can like offer a level of comfort with that. And I think the other thing

which David touched on and where we can draw from our history, obviously there's so many

shifts and changes over a hundred years. We have changed when we needed to over the last

a hundred years and we continue to change and we will continue to change. that, um like for

David's example of um You know, 19th split in the 1950s when revelations about Stalin

uh kind of reached the leftist Jewish community here, uh there was a real reckoning with

this kind of really strongly held belief in Soviet communism that a lot of members of

our organization had and that, and you know, things changed and we, but we kept going.

And I think that's just really still true and it's true with how we uh talk about Palestine

and that's changed over the years as well. uh There was a time when we were less critical

of Israel and uh we're moving with the moment now to be much more actively in solidarity

with Palestinians. And a lot of the time that means anti-Zionism. And so we have met them

a lot. We've met the moment in that way. And I think that comfort with change is just a

really big uh lesson that we've learned from our history and like still draw from today.

I mean, I love everything that that you guys have been saying, but I'll just sort of say

like, you know, central to our identity as being that outlier, you know, like Shail described

in the comfort in that. um It's it's it's not just an observable thing, it's actually, it

feeds our passion and it fuels us to continue and to keep showing up and arriving in that

way in that shifting, needful way, right? So nuances and more, as things continue to emerge

and more, there's more disruption to misinformation, we keep evolving. And... Staying true to the

evolution of being at the, know, sort of the crest of being that outlier is, it is a motivating,

it is such a motivating factor to be engaged in this work. And we love that about ourselves,

I think. We too brand ourselves as, the podcast for shit disturbers. So I could I could relate.

I wonder though, there's got to be a lot of organizations sitting out there going, how

do you do that? How do you I'm going to recap for you, you know, how do you maintain a leftist

position for 100 years amidst all of these splits and conflict? and changing political

landscape while not turning anybody away. While changing when you need to. You know, that

sounds like either blind luck or like very deliberate organizing that you've maintained

this way. ah for so long, know, lot of organizations don't even last that long. They definitely

don't hold these positions for so long, but also remaining fluid. sounds almost... Utopic.

Yeah, I think, you know, it's not to say that it's easy and it's not to say that it's not

without internal conflicts. Like we in our membership exist on a continuum of beliefs.

But I think the value that holds us together is that criticality is at the center. And maybe,

now I'm shooting from the hip here, but maybe our secular nature has a protective factor

here because we're not so immersed in the dogma. Because when you sort of look around to the

Shuls and why have Shuls remained so static in this moment? Why can't shools be more responsive

and reflective to the moment that we're living in? And I think maybe it's our secularness

that gives us the space to keep the organizing muscle the strongest, right? And to put our

focus and our energy there on how to maintain our values without getting lost in the dogma

so much. So the values remain consistent, but the conditions that surround us, we can be

responsive to that change. I think also just to get concrete, we do have a laborious process

of membership engagement. And like Serena said, there's not one political viewpoint in our

organization, there's many. And we do not... turn people away, which is a way that we differ

from a lot of other Jewish institutions. Like we don't blacklist people for their political

beliefs, whatever that is, right? And so we do value holding everyone in our community.

Then dialogue happens, there's conversations, there's slow shifts. uh And so I do think

we have a really strong value of not... uh exiling anyone from our community. For example, in

January 2023, so the beginning of 2023, we came out with a statement in solidarity with Palestine

and Palestinians and that came from years of your educationals and all and membership

engagement and meetings and meeting with our members and hearing what are the what do our

members have to say? What do our members think? And incorporating all of that into A statement

that was then voted on by the whole organization voted into practice as an official viewpoint

of our organization that we are officially in solidarity with Palestinians. And uh that

was just this a long process that our board members of our board and staff undertook to

to really gather. What do our members think about this and synthesize it into something

that we now use as a bedrock when we say we are officially in solidarity with Palestine

and we know that we are based on what our members think, not just what a few members

of the board think or what the staff thinks, but based on consultation with our whole membership.

So that's a concrete example of a way that we you know, we bring ourselves into the present

moment by the leadership of our our membership um and making sure that we we meet the current

moment and what is needed. why it's necessary for Jewish organizations to if they consider

themselves in solidarity with Palestine to have an official a way to point to that officially

right now. So we we knew visionary members of our organization knew that was necessary and

and created that. Well, I think another reason we've lasted, if I understood the question

properly, another way that we've lasted 100 years and sort of swum the tide of all these

changes, but still managed to be thriving, is because we're versatile as well. We have these

different aspects to our organization. There's other leftist Jewish organizations in Canada

and they're all wonderful, but they don't have the cultural stuff, they don't have the summer

camp, they don't have these other things that people can kind of fall back on. And I can

think of only one other Canadian Jewish left institution that has lasted like us, that is

similar to us because it's so multifaceted. And that's the Parrots Institute in Vancouver

that just celebrated its 80th anniversary. that's also, and similar to us, they've had political

changes and shifts and ups and downs, but because they have cultural offerings and because they're

so multifaceted, I think that's one of the main reasons they as well have lasted this long.

Palestinian youth movement, we had them on in 2022 and they emphasized as well the need to

diversify their activities despite, you know, not having a lot of resources to do so. They

incorporated the arts and culture and food and obviously political activism as well.

But yeah, 80 years isn't anything to sniff at either, right? So there's You're finding a

secret sauce here. I would suggest this comfort in being an outsider allows you to move with

the moment as well and to sit in a discomfort and challenge, you know, with that critical

thought that Serena talked about. Outsiders are cool. Outsiders are cool. You're not,

I'm not going to argue. I also just want to quickly add that I feel like we didn't say

this and it's necessary to say. A huge part of the reason that we have been able to walk

this kind of delicate line and do this work is because of our relationships with other

visionary organizations, Jewish and non-Jewish activist organizations, cultural organizations.

have all kinds of partnerships and relationships and we look to those organizations for inspiration

and we're very much always getting inspired by our movement partners and other cultural

Jewish organizations. So I think that's just an important thing to say is we wouldn't be

able to do it alone, but we're part of a web, know, like an organization like Independent

Jewish Voices, which is more of a single issue organization devoted to Jewish Palestine solidarity

and advocacy and em like lobbying, we need an organization like that to exist for us to be

who we are, right? So, that's, we're in this web and that's also how we've survived. Do

you feel like you've grown, like what, or not feel like, I'm sure that's measurable. Have

you experienced growth in the past two and a half years? I mean, a lot, definitely. I

think that there are, people who have been unlearning their Zionism or, you know, being critical

of mainstream Jewish spaces in the last two and a half years. Absolutely. And the fact

that we have, you know, you're speaking to three new people at the organization too, like to

be in these leadership roles, right? So there's like a whole bunch of factors that sort of

created a nice perfect storm to really be able to grab the reins and grow and focus on growth.

So you talked at the beginning about seeing your role as preserving for the next 100 years.

And we've reflected together on perhaps what kept you together and whatnot over the last

100 years. What are your plans? What are you going to do to set you? your seven generations

up for success. No pressure.

um Yeah, we I mean thinking and talking about the future is um is the hope right like that's

sort of like the hope sauce in the whole mix um and and exciting and like it's fun to radically

imagine right like what we can be and where we can go and um and I think you know the

future like we In our 100 year history, we for, I don't know, for 40, over 40 years, we

had bricks and mortar. Over 40, over 60 years, excuse me, over 60 years, we had bricks and

mortar. Like we had an actual community center to sort of be a home. And just in 2025, we

sold that building. So in our kind of immediate future, we are hoping to reestablish a new

forever home. and have a home base again where we can have membership meet in person, um access

our huge Yiddish library, which is gorgeous and a total jewel of our collection. We have

an incredible Jewish left archive. um Again, we want accessible. We don't want it to be

in storage, right? um And we want to be able to meet in person and organize in person. And

that is an immediate sort of in the next five-year goal to set ourselves up as you know and launch

into the next hundred years. You know for sure and yeah like where are we? We're starved for

third spaces right so that is so critical and to maintaining your community is this event

I know that there's lots of events all year but you are building towards one very large

event at in Toronto there. Is that going to help you fundraise for this? Hopefully it

all helps. It all helps. It all helps. I mean, typically, you know, our cultural events operate

on a break even model so that we can just engage um and come together and, you know, our superpowers

fronting money and we pay ourselves back. And we also like to provide donations to, you know,

those that we are in solidarity with. um So. You know, there's a lot of different ways,

uh you know, to try to think about how to acquire. But I think that 60, that year of 60 years,

sorry, that era of 60 years um of having that bricks and mortars, I think it was like a really

key ingredient to why we're still standing too. Like it's not to be underestimated that having

physical presence in that third space that you're talking about um exists. Right? Like it's

not just a virtual world and it's not just, um you know, uh just moving around. Like moving

around is okay for a while, but we have a goal to plant. I think a hundred years means that

we have resources that not every organization has, you know? Like, obviously we had a building

and, um you know, we have We have paid staff. Like we have these resources and I think we

are always thinking about how can we use these resources that are kind of unique to really

build ourselves up and position ourselves for the next hundred years and also build our

solidarity networks and share our resources so that we build others up as well and we

like maintain a really strong uh coalition on the left. and help maintain that. And we can

help maintain that by like just our 100 year reputation, but our literal resources as well,

like our actual material resources. And that's, you know, part of our economic justice model

as well is using that privilege that we have to really build up our networks of solidarity.

And I think that's like one of the plans for the next hundred years, how do we stay strong

and maintain maintain our work is to do that. I think that we're at an amazing time right

now. I mean, there's lots of horror in the world and there's lots to look at and feel depressed

about. We're also, I feel like we're at the ground floor of something very special and

very new. By way of example, Molly Crabapple, just great author and illustrator, just put

out a book about the Bund, which was this socialist organization that was anti-Zionist way back

uh and all about solidarity. And the book is amazingly, shockingly a huge bestseller. It

had its fifth printing in about five minutes. So I think this is a time when uh stuff that

we've been talking about forever is entering mainstream is too strong a word, but there's

a potential to have this kind of, this ethos. of liberationist politics, especially around

Palestine, but other things too. This idea that we can have solidarity in a diasporic

sense of Jewish expression, not tied to Israel. That this is now the end, and we're entering,

think, perhaps an age where this is going to become more more mainstream. And we are,

I think, poised, if I may, to be part of the leadership of this, especially in a Canadian

sense. But I see only a bright future and I see us as really being a strong and powerful

kind of sentinel for the future. And I think that things are only gonna get bigger and better

and more fabulous and we'll be part of the international solidarity web that only again

has a big and bright future. careful now you'll lose your outsider status. Yeah. David's

throwing mainstream out here. What happened to being comfortable being outsiders? Well,

we'll have to whatever the next frontier is, don't that we can't even imagine yet. Like

we have to we have to build through all our tools we have to build to be to being to struggling

for that next frontier. But I think we can see that. we can see that there's really only

one option for sustaining Jewish life and that is an anti-Zionist diasporist vision that's

in solidarity with Palestine. Everyone is nodding along. Amen. Definitely no arguments from

me. I think we talk a lot about on the show. building new models to usher in a different

future, but who's to say we can't rely a little bit on old models or adapt them as needed.

uh Lessons are abound. I very much appreciate you folks coming in and sharing some of the

resources that you've built up over the hundred years. I hope folks will check you out, check

the event out, but. All of the links will be in the show notes so they can easily find it.

Thank you. And keep up the good work on the ground. Thank you so much. Thank you for having

us, Jessa. Thank you. Thank you, Jessa. That is a wrap on another episode of Blueprints

of Disruption. Thank you for joining us. Also, a very big thank you to the producer of our

show, Santiago Halu-Quintero. Blueprints of Disruption is an independent production operated

cooperatively. You can follow us on Twitter at BPEofDisruption. If you'd like to help us

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next time, keep disrupting.