Episode 20: Children First! Selling The Home or Not?

Our guest for this episode:

A sought-after mortgage financing expert, Renee consults with consumers and their advisors to help them make the best decision for their financial needs for their particular stage of life. Her mantra: dispel the myths; get the facts. As a Certified Divorce Lending Professional (CDLP), she focuses her divorce work on helping homeowners make a more informed decision regarding their home equity solutions and the divorce team identifies any potential conflicts between the divorce settlement, the mortgage, and the real property. Divorce Mortgage Planning is a holistic approach to the process of evaluating mortgage options in the context of the overall financial objectives as they relate to divorcing situations. As someone who went through a divorce herself, Renee understands the emotions at play and the confusion of the economic aspects.

Visit her website here:

Renee's Website

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Better Than Bitter: Navigating Amicable Separation & Divorce Support

Summary

In this episode of the Better Than Bitter podcast, host Tania Leichliter speaks with divorce mortgage expert Renee Coleman about her experience with an amicable divorce. They discuss the importance of prioritizing children during the divorce process, the stages of transitioning to co-parenting, and how to create a supportive environment for children. Renee shares insights on navigating divorce mortgage planning and the nuances of mortgage assumptions, emphasizing the need for open communication and collaboration between co-parents. The conversation highlights that divorce can be approached in a way that minimizes conflict and focuses on the well-being of children.

Takeaways

• Amicable divorce is possible with the right mindset.
• Prioritizing children is crucial during separation.
• Avoiding child support and alimony can simplify finances.
• Transitioning to co-parenting takes time and planning.
• Open communication is key to successful co-parenting.
• Embracing new family dynamics can benefit children.
• Understanding mortgage options is essential during divorce.
• Mortgage assumptions can help maintain favorable loan terms.
• Persistence is important when dealing with lenders.
• Forgiveness and acceptance can lead to a healthier post-divorce life.

Sound Bites

"Life is short, I guess."

"You don't know what you don't know."

"Keep pushing it, keep pushing it."

Chapters

00:00 Navigating Amicable Divorce: A Personal Journey

11:20 Co-Parenting Dynamics: Strategies for Success

21:12 Embracing New Relationships: The Role of Stepparents

31:13 Financial Insights: Divorce and Mortgage Planning

38:19 Introduction to Amicable Divorce

39:48 Resources for Support and Growth

Keywords

amicable divorce, co-parenting, divorce mortgage expert, family dynamics, divorce planning, child support, financial strategies, divorce resolution, parenting after divorce, divorce coaching

On our website you'll find details and additional information on our 5-Step Gameplan multimedia course, our different types of coaching methods, monthly memberships, events and retreats, and a whole lot more. Plus, we've got a ton of free resources, like our monthly newsletter, our private Facebook group, our Instagram channel, and a library of articles and free webinars to help you along the way. When you go to our website, you'll be able to schedule a free 45-minute breakthrough call. Remember, we're here to help you reach an amicable resolution. Find your courage and believe in your brighter future because you know what? It is possible.

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Welcome to the Better Than Bitter Divorce Podcast, where we flip the script on divorce and show you how to have a more amicable divorce resolution. I'm your host, Tania Leichliter a divorce coach, a certified life coach, and the mastermind behind the Better Than Bitter five-step game plan course, where I help individuals build a pathway towards a more amicable divorce resolution.

Each week, I'll bring you uplifting stories from people who've successfully experienced amicable separations, proving that divorce doesn't have to be a battleground. Whether you're overwhelmed with grief, struggling with custody and co-parenting, or just dealing with a high-conflict individual, this podcast is here to guide you towards reclaiming your life and being what I know is possible, better than bitter.

Welcome to episode 20 of the Better Than Bitter podcast. Today, I'm super excited to welcome Renee Coleman. Renee is a divorce mortgage expert, but she also came from an amicable divorce. And what I love about Renee is that she and her ex mutually decided that their children came first, and it was the rules that they lived by throughout their divorce. Early on, her and her ex decided to make their kids a priority.

Those children were only two and four when they decided to separate. So there was going to be a long time that they were gonna need to function as co-parents. And as her ex got married first, she opened up her home to his wife because his wife was also going to have to be with her children. And she was great with the children. But what they did decide was that parenting was between the two of them.

and his wife never got involved in the parenting. This really led Renee down a path, not only to become a mortgage broker, but also somebody that really focused on mortgages for those getting divorced. As a trusted advisor, Renee helps her clients establish viability, eligibility, and qualification requirements.

all to align with your financial strategies and plans as you begin to put offers forward on the table. Welcome, Renee.

Thank you so much, Tonya. I'm so happy to be here. So to get us started again, I really want to dig in a little bit into your divorce because most of our listeners here are really hoping to have the courage and the hope that an amicable resolution is possible. So tell me a little bit about your separation and what you and your ex did in order to make that step towards a more amicable divorce.

Yeah, so right off the bat, so my kids were two and four when we decided to separate. And one of the things that we kind of decided together was throughout the process and throughout ongoing years, we put the kids first. And that was kind of the mantra that we lived by. So, you know, there were things that we had to do that I didn't necessarily like. And at times he didn't necessarily like.

but we did them because it was the right thing for the kids. know, nobody gets married and has children in the hopes that they're going to get a divorce. You know, we didn't want to, you know, scar them for life. So it was really important for both of us to put the kids first, whatever's right, whatever's best for them. And wow, I mean, you really got divorced when those kids were super young. So when you decided to put those children first, when they were two and four years old, I mean,

They were really young. You had a long road ahead of you in terms of co-parenting. So what were the stages of kind of that process for you? I know a lot of people come to a better than bitter and they're still living under the same roof. They haven't made that plan yet as to what the home living situation, the custody, the parenting plan is going to look like. So if you can reflect, and I know it was a while ago, but if you can reflect

back and give some advice to the way that you all at that very early stage did things in stages. Yeah. So for me in my situation, I was the one that wanted to leave. before I did that, you know, we owned a house and so we kind of in my mind, you know, I needed to know what my options are, you know, okay, I don't want to be married anymore, but

What does that mean? What does that look like? What are my options? Where can I go? You know, I, I know that I'm fortunate that we were amicable. We both had similar incomes at the time. So really it was just a matter of, know, can I go buy another house? Like, do I qualify? No, I was not a mortgage lender at the time, but I remember it well. So this was almost free internet. That's how long ago it was.

then I remember going to Barnes and Noble and just trying to find books. what, you know, a, how do I do this without scarring my children? But B, you know, mortgages in general, I didn't know anything about them. We bought our house from my mother-in-law. Like, so it was, you know, a private sale kind of a thing. And, you know, we got a mortgage, but I wasn't really involved in all of that as much. So I really had no idea. I was kind of running some rough.

math numbers in my head, you know, could I do this on my own? And one of the decisions early on that we both made was that we weren't going to get into child support and alimony. And for us, because we had similar incomes at that time, it made sense. So he did buy me out. And again, we just did some rough math in hindsight.

Probably not the best decision, but at the time it worked for us. So he bought me out and I bought my own house. And for me, it was important. You know, the judge was kind of funny back then. Of course, they had different rules. We're talking 20-plus years ago. They, we did it ourselves. We didn't have attorneys and the judge, he's looking at the paperwork and he's like, where's the child support? And we both chimed in, there is none. And he was kind of like,

questioning and looking at both of us. And in the end, he looked at my ex and said, you know, she can change her mind and come back. And we both kind of nodded, which to me, we both had the same incomes. We were both going to be having households and the kids were going to be 50, 50. And it just didn't seem right. Why would I take money from him? Because then I knew how much money he wouldn't have and where was he going to live?

and my kids were going to go visit him. For us, it just didn't make sense. So it was important that, you know, we both had a house. both had, you know, our finances kind of squared away and we were semi-equal. And so we kind of just decided that early on. And I honestly think that that's really how we stayed amicable.

there weren't a lot of finances involved. know, we kind of at the end of the month kind of squared up, you know, I paid this and you paid that and it worked. And like you mentioned, we had a long, long time to go before we were. So what was the timing between the time you decided to separate to the, to the time by which you ended up buying your new house and moving into it. So the kids were going to be in transition for a time period. So what did that

time period look like and can you guide people who are in that stage to allow them some insight on some of the things that can be done when obviously it can't happen overnight? Nothing can happen overnight. So I know a lot of people get stuck in this transition and do not know what to do. I would say it was a good year that we kind of went back and forth. You know, we're not happy but

how are we going to fix it? What are we going to do? So it did take us some time to determine it. In the end, we decided my family lived locally and I would come home after work, you know, do dinner, bedtime, whatever with the kids. And then I would go to my parents' house and spend the nights there. And I would come back early in the morning. My husband at the time, he went to work at 6 a.m. So one of us had to be there with the kids. Again, they were young. So

I would come back to the house at six in the morning. So the kids didn't really know, you know, that I wasn't there. so we did that for about six months. And, interestingly, the timing, was around nine 11. And at that point we both kind of just said, my gosh, what are we doing? And within a month I was under contract to buy a house. So that was kind of the push, the realization that

Life is short, I guess. And so, yeah, so I crunched to the numbers. I reached out to a lender, and sort of did my due diligence to figure out, you know, where could I go and what can I afford? So I was lucky that I didn't know lenders at that time. I just, I think I just found somebody back then in the phone book. So I didn't really know any better. I mean, it worked out in the end, but.

When I look back now, I kind of cringe and go, my gosh, I did exactly what I tell all of my clients not to do. on the phone. Look and look on Google it. Right? Yeah. Right. Exactly. Yeah. so that's super, super interesting and that's very insightful. So from the time that you all decided like, listen, we're going to separate, we're going to divorce. You had a temporary opportunity to go live at night with your family.

But the children did not know as much because you still came in and out of the house in that year and had time with the kids. You ate with the kids. You put them to bed and then you were there in the morning for them. So that was your transition plan, which is a great transition plan if people have the opportunity to do that. Again, it's just another way. I know that

Two snowflakes aren't alike. No divorces are exactly alike. And we have heard that over and over again through some of the work that you and I do together through Vesta Divorce Concierge. But yet that is just one way for people to handle it. I talk about other ways that people can handle it if they have to stay under the same roof. And if they do for a certain amount of time.

You can have an on and off-duty schedule, meaning Monday and Tuesday, mom is going to be picking you up from activities, making dinner, putting you to sleep on Wednesdays and Thursdays. Dad will be doing that. And then we will alternate every other weekend. And the other parent, you know, can, if they can't make themselves scarce during that time, because obviously it's still where they live, it's still an open communication around that to say, you know,

Is it okay if I join you on your night to eat with the kids? I haven't made any plans and it would be awkward for me to be in the house and not eating with you all. Would that be okay? So there is dialogue around that. So the children don't believe or feel that there is this push-pull that's happening in the household. And again, that is the most important thing is.

what you do for the sake of your children, for the sake of their wellbeing. So after that transition and you moved into your new house, you had a more traditional custody plan. Very untraditional. So my ex worked, he started work at 6 a.m. I worked from home, but I was on the road every day. So I kind of made my own schedule. But when the kids started school or, you know, they were going to daycare,

You know, you couldn't bring them at 6 a.m. So I think in the very beginning, he only had them one night during the week because I would have to go to his house at 6 a.m. not to wake the kids and, you know, kind of hang out till it was time to go to school, which worked out fine. Once they got a little bit older and into school, I think we upped it to two nights a week. And again, I would come to his house when they got a little bit older and they were awake. He would sometimes drop them off to me, you know, a little before six, but we kind of

We made it work for our work schedules because where he started at six, he finished at three. So he could pick the kids up from school every day. So it worked for us. And then when I was on the road, I made sure that I arranged my schedule. So when I had overnights, I was in outside sales at the time and I covered New England. So, you know, I could be eight hours away, but I could schedule that on the nights that they were with him as they got older and, know, he could get them.

to school in the morning and things. So, we didn't do the traditional every other weekend. We both kind of said, well, I don't really want to not be with the kids all weekend. So we switched off. One would have them Friday night. And then the other would be free Saturday, Sunday, and then we'd switch every week. But in the end, our kids were super active, you know, sports and different things.

We both went to all of their activities. So didn't matter whose weekend it was or whose night it was, we both participated. We had a little bit of a joke because he remarried a couple of years after we divorced and it was kind of the three of us. We'd go to all the events for the kids and it was the three of us.

I actually love seeing that on the stand. So my ex and I also sit together for every single one of the games and we each have had people in our lives that have sat with us. So sometimes there is three of us sitting in the stands, but I see it in other divorce couples and it just makes me really happy to see all of these individuals who have gone through divorces and they're sitting, you know, on the bleachers together.

you know, cheering on their children. And that's the way it should be. Yeah, agree. Because there's not going to be anybody who has more joy than the two of you when something good on the field happens. There just isn't. And that's the person you want to share it with that joy, right? The high fives and the standing up and cheering. And I just, encourage everybody to recognize.

how much joy that will give you if you can get to that place. And you have just shown us, Renee, talking about your story that you have to do what's gonna work for your schedule. And you have to really think through how to make it work, right? And how to be collaborative and supportive of one another and the needs that you're gonna have in your work and your career to be able to accommodate.

what's needed to take care of these children. And you are always going to be a team. And when I was talking to our children and, or we were talking to our children about what this family was going to be, we just said it was going to be a family re-envisioned because is that not right? I mean, it is a family re-envisioned. You are always going to be a family if you have children. I can't imagine any other way.

Um, then what we did when they were real young and we were first divorced, we still did birthdays and things at one of our houses, whichever it happened to be. And both families would attend. We would do it together. They were little. They, you know, as they aged and they got two Christmases and two birthday parties at two different houses, they loved it. When they were smaller, you know, we did it together. It just, it made sense for us. And I, you know, I really can't imagine it any other way.

Yes, and I encourage individuals to also consider that. And I know that at the very beginning stages of the journey, it feels very awkward to do that, but I just want everybody to know that it gets easier. And again, if you can manage your own mindset if you can get to this place of forgiveness where you're releasing that burden of resentment and anger and bitterness and getting to that place of just

acceptance, like this is what it is and it doesn't matter what turned your marriage upside down. If there was an event or if there was infidelity or there was something, if you can move through that and once again, it's not that you have to forgive that individual for doing something that you believe was a betrayal, but you do need to allow that forgiveness to happen for yourself. And because you're the one who's going to suffer.

You're the one, if you continue to carry that bitterness and resentfulness and anger forward, you're the one who's going to suffer. That brighter future you're hoping for will get tainted because of this feeling that you're carrying. So I encourage everybody to just know that every year in terms of distance from that divorce,

proceedings, like it just gets easier and allowing for your children not to be the ones that are feeling the brunt of the discourse. think that that's what's so amazing for people who can change that inner narrative, change that inner dialogue, move through whatever challenges you're having without allowing your children to see it. And just again, put on your children's hat.

and just be there for them and love them and focus on them versus your soon-to-be ex or your ex. You know, if you just pay that attention forward, you will be able to get through this. So Renee, your story is really, really hopeful and give so many people courage because again, it was different. It was different. was non-traditional. You did things what worked for you. And I want everybody to know that

figuring out what's gonna work for you, what's gonna work for your kids is the most important thing, but you have to have open communication in order to do that. And again, the conversations are all about what's gonna work for the kids and making it very factual. This is my work schedule. This is your work schedule. What do we hope we can do here for the children that's not gonna completely turn their lives upside down? How can we normalize it for them? Yeah, so.

The other piece before I move into what you do in this industry, I would love to talk a little bit about the relationship with your ex-husband's wife, because I also believe that it's unique in the fact that you have been able to embrace her as an important figure in your children's life. So can you talk a little bit about what it took for you to get there? And then also just

you know, how your children view her. And, you know, I always say the more people that love our children, the better. Yeah. Yeah. so I feel like they probably started dating a year or so after we got divorced. think I met her at one of the kid's activities, the first time she was introduced to him through friends, mutual friends of ours. So I knew of her but had never met her. So he, he had given me a heads up.

that she was coming to whatever the event. I think it was a sporting event of some sort. And very corny, just we didn't really need to have a conversation, but hi, nice to meet you. But we were both there to watch the kids in whatever activity it was. And it just kind of from there went to friendly because we were both there for the same reasons for the kids. And the more I saw her around the kids,

You know, if my kids were uncomfortable around her or didn't like her, that may have changed the situation, but she's a lovely person and she treats my kids like her own. You know, that said, she and my ex did not have any children together. So it was just my two. And I think I'm lucky in that way. You know, there wasn't a third, third kid competing for their attention. So she treats, treats them like they're out, like her own and her family.

You know, I know most of her family just because of the events that they would come to and they love my kids and they treat them well and my kids adore them. So I really, you know, again, we put the kids first. so for us, she was just one of the three parents at all of the events. you know, even if I didn't like her necessarily, you know, would I hang out with her? Had I met her under different circumstances? Maybe, you know, we're, not exactly alike.

But she's lovely. really, I'm really fortunate. I know that I'm fortunate and she's been a great stepmom to the kids. But we were very careful to my, my ex and I to keep the kids separate. You know, it was never like, if I needed, know, can you pick the kids up today for whatever reason, I've got something going on. I would never have said, you know, we'll just ask Linda to do it. That was not.

It was he and I, we were the parents and we kept that very separate. Or if it was, you know, something financial, it was not, well, you've got her too. and at the time I did not like that was never part of the equation. It was just us. which we felt was the right way to do it. But yeah, so, you know, I don't see her as often anymore because the kids are grown and gone, but I did have the occasion to talk with her a few months back.

My father had passed away and I was, I had just told the kids. So I was trying to get ahold of my ex just to let him know, you know, he was still part of the family. And, and so I wanted him to know, but I couldn't get ahold of him. So I called her and of course, she answered, Oh my God, but you know, what's the matter? Why are you calling me? And so when I told her, you know, why I was calling, she had lost her parents a couple of years prior to that. So she was so kind.

Yeah, I think, it was such a wonderful story. And thank you so much for sharing it because again, I think that so many people hold on to so much anger or they believe that when their ex gets together with somebody else, that it is an indicator of what they're not. And it's just, that's just not the case. And there isn't and doesn't need to be a comparison. that especially when there's kids involved.

If you can have more people loving on your children and they can have more love in their lives, like that's better, you know, and you seem to jackpot and you know, your ex married a lovely woman who embraced your children and didn't have a competitive spirit and that, you know, she really being part of their lives and part of your life. And I really appreciate you sharing that story because again, I just think it's an important one to tell. So.

As we move forward, I just want everybody to really understand a little bit more about what you do in the industry. Because when I was going through my divorce and I wasn't selling a house, but just having a deeper understanding that like there were people, if I wanted to talk to somebody about how to secure a mortgage in the process of a divorce, especially individuals who are

not like you who weren't making a living, who were maybe stay-at-home parents and are really concerned about if they sell the house, how do I afford a new house? And how does maintenance or alimony work into that? How does child support work into that? can you talk a little bit about what it means to be a certified divorce lender and how you can really help?

people who are really living in a place of financial fear right now because they just don't know what their choices are. Yeah. And that's really what it's all about, right? You don't know what you don't know. so don't do what I did. That was not the way to go about it. So when I'm working with a client, so I work in divorce every day. So there's lots of nuances with mortgages to begin with. And then when you add on top of that, you know,

The divorce itself and the emotions of it and the, you have so much on your plate. It really takes a certain kind of person, I think, to have that empathy. Could you go to any old lender and get a mortgage? Sure. We're going to work with you a little bit deeper. For me personally, it's, I think my clients find it empowering to make a decision that they're comfortable with because they know all of their options.

And so we take the time. So we refer to ourselves as a CDLP, as a mortgage, a divorce mortgage planner. And really that's what we're, working with our clients to do. We want to look at, you know, as you're going through the process, not when your divorce is final and that final agreement's been signed because once it's, once it's signed, that's it. There's no going back. We want you to know upfront, you know, likely you have an idea in the very, very beginning, you know, if you're

contemplating, separating. You know, if there's a family home, what are our options? And likely, there's usually one spouse that maybe thinks I'd like to keep the house, but from there they don't know, what do I do? How do we do this? And that's where I come in. So in the very beginning stages, let's look at what your situation looks like today. What does your income look like today? What does your credit look like today? What does your existing mortgage look like today?

And from there we can expand, you know, as you progress through, you know, whether we can get you qualified or not qualified, that helps you in the decision process. If we can qualify you and it is your idea to potentially keep the house, well, now you know what the numbers will look like. And if you qualify, right? So if you're then going to your attorney or your mediator, whoever you're working with, now you know what your options are.

Yes, I'd like to keep the house and yes, I know I qualify for it. I know what the monthly payment's going to look like. We don't want you to spend the time and the money with your attorney to fight for something that you maybe don't qualify for. So, and again, there's lots of nuance to it as far as, you know, what can we use for income? You know, there's all different types of income and how we can calculate it. And there's so many different mortgage programs out there. So we just do that bit of a deeper dive to help you know.

and empower you to make the decision that's right for you based on having all of the information. So can you list out maybe some things that are non-income based? So for instance, obviously child support, maintenance, maybe investment dividends, list out some more things that you look at so you can give individuals listening, you know, some peace of mind to be like, okay, I have that. Yeah.

Yeah, so of course we'd look at, know, if you're an employee collecting a paycheck, we would look at that income. If you're self-employed, we would look at that for income. But other sources of income, you know, if, as long as there's a history of it, so you mentioned dividend income, that's fine. If we have a history of it, we can use it. Child support and alimony kind of works the same way. If there's a history of it, and we know it's going to continue,

So again, there's some rules around that depending on which mortgage program, but you can absolutely use child support and alimony as income to qualify for a mortgage. You can use if you've got annuities or pensions or 401ks that you're collecting on, that's all income. Social security, that's income. Disability, that's income. We can use all of those. What about just money in an investment? So if you have all your money is tied up, but there's quite a bit of it.

you know, do you look at kind of, cause all of that could be liquidated for a, you know, at a cost, but is it that as, you know, qualify, qualifying dollars? there, so we can use that in two ways for some loan programs. We can use that as what we call a compensating factor. So if the numbers are tight with the income and it's maybe not going to fly, if we can show that there's savings.

that can sometimes make the difference to qualify you. On the other hand, we could also, there are programs out there, and my company happens to have a bunch of them, where instead of using income to qualify you, we use assets to qualify you. So assets being investment accounts, retirement accounts. Again, there's a couple different programs and some rules and guidelines around them. But if you've got a significant amount of those assets, we can use those to qualify you instead of income.

So there are some options. one of the key things when I was getting divorced that I had to look into about my mortgage was that is the mortgage transferable? Meaning that there are two people on that mortgage. have a really good rate. Can you talk about how individuals should go about seeing if that mortgage is transferable or not? Yeah. So that's what we call a mortgage assumption. So exactly like you said, it's transferring. So

In most cases, both spouses are on the mortgage together and likely you have a mortgage with a very low interest rate right now if you either purchased or refinanced in the last several years. And so that's been a huge topic right now because nobody wants to lose that interest rate. The problem is if one spouse is leaving, they're not going to want to stay on that mortgage, that obligation. Even if your divorce agreement says that spouse A is responsible for the payments,

Spouse B is still on that mortgage and the lender doesn't care what your divorce agreement says. You're still legally liable for that debt. So to remove somebody from that debt, you either pay the loan off or you refinance or you do a mortgage assumption. So an assumption is where you need to call your loan servicer. So not necessarily the loan officer that you worked with like myself.

you want to call the loan servicer where you're making your payments every month. There's an 800 number on your statement that you can call and you want to ask them if your mortgage is assumable. So to assume the mortgage means you have spouse A and spouse B, spouse A has been awarded the house and is responsible for all the payments. And we want to keep spouse A on the mortgage, but we want to take spouse B off. The lender, they will likely tell you no at first. They don't like

doing them. And the reason for that is it's a lot of work for them, but it's not a new mortgage for them, which is how they get paid. And so they will drag their feet a bit, but you can be persistent. They're getting a little better with it now, what we call incident to divorce. So if the reason for the assumption is because of a divorce, they're a little more inclined to do it. But the person assuming the loan, they still have to qualify.

It's almost like applying all over again because the lender wants to make sure, okay, if we're going to take spouse B off, we got to make sure spouse A qualifies. So you'll still need to provide, you know, your income documents and things like that to qualify. But what you do get to do is keep the remaining term of the loan, right? If you're four years into a 30 year mortgage, that stays the same. If you've got a 3 % interest rate, that stays the same. So everything stays the same with the loan.

just removing party B. So I just learned something. So that is such good information, Renee, because we did contact our mortgage company to see if I could assume the loan. And they said, no. So the negotiation that was on the table for us is that my ex has stayed on the loan and will stay on the loan for two years post when my child goes to, is in college or one of children.

But now that you just told me that I feel like maybe there's a solution. Maybe we can press a little harder. We tell them that no is not the answer we want to hear and we press on that. And that would allow for my ex to go buy another house, which is better for our kids because he's stuck on this mortgage, which is not going to allow for him to buy another property until he gets off of this one. again,

Well, I'm going to surprise you with another piece of information. If your divorce agreement says that you're responsible for the payments, the house has been awarded to you, and the mortgage will get refinanced, you know, down the road, he can still go get a mortgage and we will exclude the existing mortgage from his debt. Again, if it's incident to divorce and the agreement

says that you are responsible for the payments, we can exclude it from his debt. So if he does want to go buy a house before you refinance him off, he still could. Well, he is coming to you this week. I guarantee you that, Renee. I think that in our scenario, he has, he now has our second home. So he does, but there's no mortgage on that. So I think that he might be in good shape. So he will potentially be one of your clients. Wonderful. Wonderful. But back to your assumption. So.

Press them right when you call that 800 number the first person they've been trained to say no, okay That's just how it is. Nope. Your loan is not assumable however when you call ask to speak to somebody in the assumption department Have an assumption department go up the chain keep pushing it keep pushing it and you can tell them it's it's incident to divorce and that might sway them to Allow it. Yes, very interesting

Very interesting. Well, Renee, how can people find you? Can you tell people if they are in a situation and they just want to consult with a mortgage broker, they want to make sure that they're gathering the information that's needed or they're ready, they're ready to buy. How can they find you? Easiest way to find me is my website. It's teamrennecullman.com.

All of my contact information is on there. My calendar link to book a call with me is on there. My application is on there. Everything you can find, you know, my office phone number, my cell phone number, my email, everything is on my website, teamrennaykohlmann.com. That is great. And when I, and every podcast, I always give my three top tips of things that I have learned from today. So my three top tips that I have learned from Renee today is number one.

Make sure that you keep your children at the forefront. It is all about your kids. Start this divorce journey with what is going to be best for your children. Number two is keep an open heart with your ex. If they bring somebody into their lives and that person is willing to open up their heart and their lives to your children, embrace that again because it supports

the top tip number one, is what is best for your children and what is best for your children is to allow for as many people to love them as possible. And number three, assumed loans. Make sure that you, if you are getting the door shut in your face from your lender, that you go and bang again and you try to get that loan. You called it an assumption. So again,

Make sure you don't just take that first no, go up the ladder. Make sure that you talk to the right people at your lender's office who specifically deal with these assumable loans or the assumption loans and make sure that you push for that. Because again, if it's not allowing in my scenario to have your ex go and buy another house, which is going to have room for your children, then it makes a lot of sense for you.

to really push forward to try to get that loan assumed. Again, thank you so much, Renee. This has been so enlightening. You are delightful. And I'm so happy that, you know, it's been obviously years since you got divorced, but that you still can carry that torch for an amicable resolution. Yes, I encourage it. It makes life so much easier. Thank you for having me. It was my pleasure.

Thanks for tuning in to Better Than Bitter, navigating an amicable divorce. Whether you are at the beginning of your divorce journey, midway through, or even done, we want the stories from our guests to give you hope that an amicable resolution is possible. If you'd like to dive deeper into today's episode, check out our show notes for a full transcript, reflections, and links to learn more about Better Than Bitter's coaching courses,

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