In this special Pride Month episode, host Dan Hall explores the vital concept of "finding our tribes" within the Queer community through conversations with previous guests. For many LGBTQ+ individuals, discovering safe spaces has been about more than friendship—it's been essential for survival and self-acceptance in a world that often fails to see or understand queer experiences.

These communities serve as places where Queer people celebrate triumphs and mourn losses together, but like any family, they can be complicated. Through intimate discussions with Queer musicians from around the world, this episode examines what community means to them, its imperfections, and how we might build more inclusive spaces. From hidden bars of decades past to the evolution of Pride from protest to celebration, these artists share personal stories that illuminate the ongoing journey of creating and maintaining vibrant queer communities.

Timestamped Key Takeaways

[00:01:00] Finding Our Tribes: Dan discusses how finding safe spaces in the queer community is often about survival and learning to be comfortable with who we are, finally seeing ourselves mirrored in a world that didn't always see us.

[00:02:02] Historical Context: Looking back at previous decades helps us understand why queer spaces remain vital today, as openly queer living wasn't an option for many generations who had to carve out their own hidden corners of the world.

[00:02:49] Kele Fleming's First Community: Singer-songwriter Kele Fleming shares how a gay club called Rumours in Victoria became her "community centre" and "life saver" in 1984, offering a space where she could be her authentic self despite family non-acceptance.

[00:05:25] Creating New Spaces: Jon Ginoli of Pansy Division discusses founding a queer rock band in the early 90s when rock music wasn't considered "gay enough" within mainstream gay culture, helping pioneer the queercore music scene.

[00:08:01] Global Perspectives on Safety: Brazilian musician Eric Lenfair speaks about the inherent cautiousness that many queer people develop growing up, while Eric Torino shares his experiences with fear of public affection even in supposedly accepting places like New York.

[00:11:12] Exclusion Within the Community: James Taylor Junior discusses feeling left out of the queer community due to factors like ageism and racism, highlighting that the LGBTQ+ community isn't one unified entity but complex and diverse.

[00:13:14] Specific Spaces for Specific Needs: Brooklyn-based singer Roderick Woodruff explains the importance of spaces specifically for Black queer individuals where he doesn't have to "perform" or diminish himself to make others comfortable.

[00:15:19] Artistic Communities: Baltimore musician Greg Hatem describes how supportive queer ecosystems allow artists to thrive and create work that connects with people from all backgrounds.

[00:19:46] The Evolution of Pride: Various artists reflect on how Pride has changed from its origins as a protest movement to becoming more commercialized and mainstream, questioning what this means for its political message.

[00:24:33] Internal Community Challenges: James Taylor Junior and others discuss damaging stereotypes within the gay community, from body image pressures to racism experienced by queer people of color within LGBTQ+ spaces.

[00:29:23] Hope for the Future: Polish singer-songwriter Tomek Zdyb shares his vision for what community can achieve through mutual support and education, emphasizing respect and human connection.

Resource List

Featured Artists and Their Episodes

• Kele Fleming - April 2025 Episode
• Jon Ginoli (Pansy Division) - May 2025 Episode
• Eric Lenfair - April 2025 Episode
• Eric Torino - May 2025 Episode
• James Taylor Junior - April 2025 Episode
• Roderick Woodruff - April 2025 Episode
• Greg Hatem - April 2025 Episode
• Ben McGarvey (Minute Taker) - May 2025 Episode
• Travie Austin - April 2025 Episode
• MEL LENNON - Available from 15 July 2025
• TIN - May 2025 Episode
• Tomek Zdyb - Available from 1 July 2025

Links

Read deep dives into our queer lives at the blog HERE.

Check out the official podcast playlist on Spotify.

Follow the podcast on:

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• Facebook

See producer and presenter Dan Hall's other work HERE (subtitled version HERE).

Listen to other episodes at the homepage.

Dan Hall

Hello there. I'm Dan Hall and this is the podcast in the key of Q. Before I begin, I've got to wish you all a very, very happy Pride Month. And this is my first pride special. It's somewhat different from the normal episode. So do tell me what you think. Would you like more like this? Drop me an email on in the key of q@gmail.com.

Dan Hall

Today I'll be talking about finding our tribes in the queer community and hearing what previous guests have to say on the topic. For most people, finding our tribe, finding those safe spots has often been about more than just making friends. It's about survival and learning to be comfortable about who we are. It's about finally seeing ourselves mirrored in a world that maybe didn't always get us, or even see us at all.

Dan Hall

These tribes are where we've celebrated our biggest joys and sometimes grieved our toughest losses. But like any family, our communities can be complicated. They're places of warmth and connection, for sure. Sometimes, though, they can also be places where we face new kinds of challenges. Even with each other. So in this special pride episode, I'm going to find out what previous guests think about community.

Dan Hall

What does it mean to them? What are its flaws? And how can we make things better?

Dan Hall

To understand why our queer spaces are still so vital today. It's useful to look back to previous decades for generations of queer people living openly. Just wasn't much of an option. Society was often downright hostile. So our communities had to get creative. They carved out their own corners of the world. These places were often hidden away, behind closed doors or in dimly lit clubs.

Dan Hall

But this is where people found each other. These weren't just places to hang out. They were often lifelines. Kelly Fleming is a singer songwriter from Victoria, British Columbia, and she joined me back in April and discussed her first community experience.

Kele Flemming

Kele Flemming

It was kind of my life saver in those days.

Dan Hall

It wasn't just about the music or dancing for her. She explained how fundamental that feeling of acceptance and belonging was. This was especially true when support from other areas of her life weren't so present.

Kele Flemming

I felt like I could be myself, and I was surrounded by people who accepted me for who I was, where I was, you know, at that time getting a lot of, non-acceptance from my family at the time. That has amazingly changed over the years. But it was a place where I could be myself, meet people who were okay with who I was and dance the night away to amazing music.

Kele Flemming

And I felt safe. For the most part, they're feeling safe.

Dan Hall

Feeling like you can just be you is what we all look for. Kelly also talks about living a shadow self when she was out in the mainstream world, and this contrasted sharply with the freedom she felt when she was inside that club.

Kele Flemming

It's so true. It was the one space where I felt like I could was a fully dimensional human right. Because, as you say, that there just what it was like. Your shadow self was existing in the rest of the world.

Dan Hall

That need to create your own scene, your own specific kind of community is a powerful drive for many. John Ginola from the band Pansy Division was my guest in May. He experienced this firsthand back in the 80s and early 90s. Things were very different, even within what you might call the mainstream gay culture of the time. If you were into punk and rock music, you would still feel like an outsider.

Dan Hall

John certainly did. That feeling pushed him and his band mates to blaze their own trail. In doing that, they created a vital new space for the queer core music scene. Queercore was the name given to the marriage between punk and queer identities.

Jon Ginoli

I'd been noticing for a long time, ever since I came out really in the early 80s, that, you know, rock n roll is not considered game. Is it like you go to a gay bar? That's not what they play. If you meet gay people, that's not what they're into. It. And to me, it seemed like there was a kind of it's like, okay, once you get educated about what the gay community is, you know, and what it consists of, then you learn that certain things are considered not gay, even though you're gay and you're doing that.

Jon Ginoli

So I had this kind of alienation from the beginning that, that, you know, what I was doing was, was not gay enough for a lot of gay people that I met. They had the idea for Pansy Division when I was still in Illinois, but I thought, nobody is, you know, what is the audience for a gay rock n roll band?

Jon Ginoli

13 people. So I thought, no, I'm not going to do that. So I got to San Francisco and realize, oh, yeah, there are, you know, I can envision my idea for this band, which seemed like it was going to be pretty fictitious to actually add, you know, become reality there. So, that was in the at the very beginning of 91.

Jon Ginoli

I thought, okay, I think I should I should try to do this.

Dan Hall

So whether you're trying to find your spot within a specific culture like John was with queer cool, or you're simply looking for any place where you don't have to constantly look over your shoulder, that basic human desire for safety, for the freedom to just be connects all of us over the world gay, straight. It doesn't matter where you live or what your specific story is.

Dan Hall

But history has shown that as queer people, we have more reason to be cautious. We heard from singer songwriter Eric Lenfair, who joined me from Rio de Janeiro in Brazil. His episode dropped back in April.

Eric Lenfair

Brazil. This is a country that kills the most trans people, so I can't say it's good, but I feel safe in some places. And usually those are the places I tend to go to.

Dan Hall

Eric also mentioned something many of us probably recognise. It's that constant awareness, that feeling that you need to be a bit careful.

Eric Lenfair

I think that's something very common in the queer community. Like you grew up with this inherent cautiousness in everything you do, and that it kind of takes a while to get that away from you, you know? I think I still have to like it's I think it made me shy. Like, every time I met someone I knew I had something.

Eric Lenfair

I felt like I had something to hide. Like I couldn't be myself too much.

Dan Hall

Eric calls it an ongoing journey, and that cautiousness often comes from painful past experiences. Or it comes from the awareness that you could face hostility or danger just for being who you are. Musician Eric Torino, from New England in the United States, was on the show in May. He talked about living in New York, a place often associated it with diversity, acceptance and tolerance.

Eric Torino

You know, when I was living in New York with, boyfriend for a long time, I still even living in New York, I had a hard time accepting. You know, he wanted to hold my hand if we were out in public. Because there is a fear that someone will say something hurtful, which could really destroy your day, could really break your character.

Eric Torino

Your, could really break your spirit for a long time. But more so the fear that someone might physically harm you. And that's something that I've had to, you know, deal with for for all of my, my youth was that sense of not feeling like it was a wise choice to be openly affectionate with the same sex partner.

Dan Hall

When the outside world doesn't feel like a safe space. We go looking for queer safety in other places. But here's where things can get a little tricky. The truth is, the queer community isn't just one single unified thing. It's huge and sprawling and incredibly diverse and riddled with its own internal politics. It has its own unspoken rules and sometimes its own ways of excluding people.

Dan Hall

James Taylor Junior shared his story with me back in April.

James Taylor Junior

There's a huge part of me that even today, still doesn't feel like I have a part in the community, even though I have so many friends and I've got, you know, places I go where it's every type of person. But I think there's a lot of us that feel sort of left out, either because we're aged out because there's a lot of ageism or maybe, the community that people are in doesn't really, embrace, multiple races, which happens as well.

James Taylor Junior

Still.

Dan Hall

It's a complex picture. This feeling of exclusion from within. We all want these spaces to be perfect havens. And James went on to make an important point about why, despite these difficulties, that search for connection is so critical.

James Taylor Junior

It is important because just like with, generational divides, the reason we divide people into generations is shared experiences. You know, the reason, you know, some races gravitate towards each other is shared experiences. And that's really what we're looking for. We want to know we're not alone. I want to know I'm not alone. When you don't belong. When you're outside of everything and you feel so alone.

James Taylor Junior

It's just. It can be devastating. It can break people. It really can. It has.

Dan Hall

Even under the big LGBTQ plus umbrella, different people often need different kinds of spaces. They need different kinds of understanding. That's what often leads us to creating more specific, more tailored communities within the broader queer world. Brooklyn based singer Roderick Woodruff was my guest back in April.

Roderick Woodruff

As a black queer man, I want to be around people who share similar experience with me. I want to sorry to get churchy, but I want to praise and worship with my girls. I want people that look like me and share similar experiences with me because they get me, and I feel like I can let my guard down.

Roderick Woodruff

I don't have to perform for you to make you feel comfortable in spaces. I can be as loud and as free and as, yeah, as chaotic as I want to be without worrying about if you're going to judge me. Because for so long we have had to quiet ourselves. We have had to diminish our own beings and spaces to make others feel comfortable in theirs.

Roderick Woodruff

When I go out on a Friday, I want to go out and have fun. Not go out and coddle you and make you feel safe in spaces. I want spaces where I inherently and innately just feel safe.

Dan Hall

When people feel truly, deeply safe. When they feel understood and free to be every part of themselves. That's often when creativity can really ignite. I think many of my guests here on in the key of Q would agree. And then, of course, that creativity that art feeds right back into the community and it strengthens it. It helps define it.

Dan Hall

Greg Haytem lives in Baltimore's eccentric and artistic arts scene. I chatted with him in April. Greg talked about how supportive ecosystems allow queer artists to thrive, and then how the work they create goes on to connect with people from all walks of life.

Greg Hatem

I think there's a lot of, queer music that isn't just for queer people. You don't have to. You don't have to Jim your light so that other people can shine, you know, like like we're all in this together. And people love queer music whether they're queer or not. And, I love straight music. It's cool. Whatever.

Dan Hall

And it's not just about the individual artists. It's about the whole vibe of the place. Baltimore is a city where artists know each other. They show up for each other and create a fertile ground for new ideas.

Greg Hatem

A lot of the like, more corporate minded folks move to Washington, D.C.. So a lot of the artists and weirdos stay in Baltimore. It's kind of like we're like the weird cousin, you know? But it really it's a really fertile ground because there's, it's a combination of it being a small town and a big city, you know, there's like a lot of venues, a lot of bands, a lot of musicians, a lot of artists, a lot of galleries.

Greg Hatem

But everyone knows each other, and it's really the community is like, not that big. I mean, I would love it for it to be larger, but, it's like you still really know a lot of people in the scene. They know you, you go to each other's shows. It feels like a small town in that way.

Dan Hall

That feeling of connection, or sometimes the sharp sense of not having it, can really shape an artist's whole journey. Ben McGarvey, who creates under the name Minute Taker, was my guest in May. He didn't quite find that tribe in the way that so many people do. For Ben, music itself, the worlds created by the artists he loved, became a kind of intensely personal community.

Ben McGarvey

The pros lived in my own world, really. You know, there's been a bit of a loner. I'm an only child. I've always felt a bit at odds with kind of everything and everyone around me to an extent. And certainly with music, because it's just it really, you know, just go into my own world and I just, walk for hours, you know, listening to albums.

Ben McGarvey

And it's just always been such a personal thing for me. Like, I've never really felt kind of part of a any kind of, you know, tribe or kind of, you know, like a lot of people kind of get into especially probably in cities, you know, that people would find their tribe and, you know, they go to certain clubs and bars and, you know, they all wear certain things and listen to certain music.

Ben McGarvey

I kind of never really felt like I've been part of any of that, but just kind of it so has just been kind of a very personal kind of means of escapism for me. You know, I just kind of, wander around in the hills, in the woods, just, you know, just completely immersed in this music and, you know, just appreciating nature and and the sounds.

Dan Hall

It's clear that these personal journeys and artistic expressions are deeply intertwined with the sense of community. But we can't talk about queer spaces and communities without talking about politics. Our very existence, our right to love, our right to gather has always been and still is a political issue from those earliest hidden gatherings and basement bars to the explosive genesis of the modern LGBTQ plus rights movement to places like Stonewall, to the pride marches that now happen all over the world, simply claiming and celebrating our space has always been a political act, but things change, particularly pride, which has grown and become more integrated into the mainstream.

Dan Hall

What happens to the original spirit of protest when events become more commercialised? Are they still effective as platforms for protest, or have they become something else entirely? Kelly Fleming, who we heard from at the start of the episode, shares her thoughts on this.

Kele Flemming

There's been a lot of corporatization. There's been a lot of, you know, politicians. I feel like it's great they're there and it's become like a kind of a rote thing, at least here and in Canada, where, you know, all the various members of parliament and politicians are marching in the pride parade. But, you know, I kind of watch them and question will, what are you doing from a policy standpoint to make sure that, you know, laws aren't passed here in Canada that are anti-trans and, and, you know, so there's that.

Kele Flemming

I totally hear you in that. I guess one thing I'm wondering is that the character arc of pride to go from being a, a place of protest to something that becomes more mainstream and more palatable to people who may not arrive there on their own or who may be anti queer, anti-trans. And is that a way to make it palatable so that they can be part of it?

Dan Hall

Is mainstream integration a sign of progress, or does it dilute the core message? Travie Austin from Chicago was on the show in April. He reminded me that pride began as a riot, as a protest. It was born out of a sheer necessity and a desperate fight for basic dignity. And he voiced his worry that this essential history, this activist heart for pride, can sometimes get lost.

Travie Austin

Rock n roll is rebellious. It's about tearing down oppressive forces and, like, going against the grain. And so when I was writing some of these songs and Pride Season was coming up, every pride season we get another electronic EDM dance track from queer artists. And that's great because, you know, sometimes we just want to dance all of our problems away and forget that the world hates us sometimes.

Travie Austin

But I wanted to if I was going to drop a song for pride last year, I wanted it to be something that's saying, hey, remember that pride was a protest? Pride is a riot. Pride was where Marsha P Johnson and the other queer, black and brown trans folk threw the brick at Stonewall and, like, started this entire, riot and protest so that we can get the equality that we deserve, that we, get to experience and enjoy today.

Travie Austin

And I think the as the generations go on and on, we forget what pride is about. Like, we see we see the march, we see the parades. You see everyone with their six packs walking around in Speedos and being sexually free. And that is something that we get to do and be proud of. But that's not what pride is about.

Travie Austin

And that's not what this started to ask.

Dan Hall

The work to find our spaces isn't done. It's not enough just to have spaces. We need to constantly work to make sure those spaces are genuinely good. We need them to be supportive and inclusive for everyone who needs them. And this means looking inward. It means being honest. And it sometimes means confronting those battlegrounds within the prejudices, the pressures.

Dan Hall

James Taylor junior, who spoke earlier, also talked about damaging stereotypes within the gay community.

James Taylor Junior

There's this huge, idea in the gay community, and there's a stereotype that you have to be, like, fit and tight and ripped and and if you're not, you have to be teensy, teensy, tiny so that, you know, you know, the hyper masculine or hyper feminine. And that's just not the case for most people. I mean, and that sort of idea goes back well into the 60s, late 60s and the 70s with, muscle magazines that were, you know, supposed to be about working out, but they were all about, you know, the male gaze.

Dan Hall

It's a challenging thought that we can sometimes replicate the very pressures we're trying to escape. And that effect is even greater where different forms of marginalisation overlap. If you're a queer person of colour, you're likely to face racism from within the wider world and then still encounter it within your own smaller chosen queer space. MEL LENNON, whose episode drops this month, talked about his early experiences performing and the pressure of fitting into a particular kind of caricature.

MEL LENNON

I perform with a lot of drag queens, and I also kind of felt like I was sometimes the only black person there, so it was kind of a joke like, and presenting melanin, you know, introducing the only person with melanin here, you know, and, I was also a rapper first, so I was always everyone, you know, rap feature and that black caricature.

MEL LENNON

And I just thought, no, you know, I don't want to be that.

Dan Hall

This experience of being othered or facing different standards isn't unique to MEL LENNON. TIN. An Aussie pop artist of Vietnamese heritage joined me in May.

TIN

People of colour have to work so much harder than people who have a lot of, you know, white or pretty privilege.

Dan Hall

Tin also shared how this can play out in social settings within the community. Even at chemisex, chill outs where drugs make people so horny they'd fuck the standard lamp, he felt othered.

TIN

There's nothing more sobering that I walk into a room, and I'm the only person of colour in the whole room out of 20 guys knowing that, yeah, there's a real. I'm not saying it'll always happen, but knowing that there's a very real chance that 80% of them won't even realise that I'm there. I could be jumping here and doing star jumps right in front of them, and they wouldn't even see me.

Dan Hall

The impact of this lack of visibility extends beyond the chill out space, and we see it in the world around us. MEL LENNON tells us that although these people aren't visible, they are there.

MEL LENNON

Black queer youth are the culture. So many things derive from their imagination. Their influence is literally everywhere. But I will say that who they are and their faces are always behind the scenes. And that was a reason why. Another reason why I didn't just want to be a producer and a songwriter behind the scene. I wanted to be the artist.

Dan Hall

The journey to find and build community is ongoing. It's filled with challenges, yes, but it is also filled with joy, creativity, and the strength that genuinely comes from shared experience. Thomas Seb is a singer songwriter from Poland. His full episode is coming up in July, but until then I thought I'd share a clip with you. He shared a personal and ultimately hopeful vision for what community can achieve.

Tomek Zdyb

Music is a great way to educate people and to inspire people, and I think we should just start treating each other with respect and just as human beings, you know. Because why do we still suggest that the reason of any problem lies in the sexual identity? Why do we still blame people that they know for the things that they cannot control?

Tomek Zdyb

Hopefully, we can bond together and create this family that can support each other, and maybe at some point, at one point, change something for the good.

Dan Hall

That spirit of mutual support and shared hope is what can to find the best of our communities. There's nothing wrong with taking a top off. There's nothing wrong with dancing. There's nothing wrong with flirting. There's nothing wrong with getting pissed on Old Compton Street, with a bunch of friends and flirting with a bunch of strangers. But it can't just be that.

Dan Hall

Pride cannot just be that.

Dan Hall

A massive, heartfelt thank you to all the artists who opened up and shared their lives and their wisdom for us in this special pride episode. That's Kele Flemming, Jon Ginoli, Eric Lenfair, Eric Torino, James Taylor Jr, Roderick Woodruff, Greg Hatem, Ben McGarvey (aka Minute Taker), Trave Austin, MEL LENNON, TIN, and Tomek Zdyb. Their honesty, courage, humour, insight. That's what makes in the key of Q what it is.

Dan Hall

And I'm grateful to every single one of them. Links to their episodes and their music are, of course, in the show. Notes. A huge thank you to all of you there for listening on this Pride Month. May we all continue to find, build and cherish the communities that make us feel seen, heard, and loved. And I would love to hear your thoughts on what has been said on this episode, either through email and in the key of Q at gmail.com, or on the various social media platforms that I'm on.

Dan Hall

Links, of course, are in the show notes.

Dan Hall

Dan Hall