“We’re not making museums. And I believe that a building has to be usable to be preserved. There are definite historic features that we advocate for retaining that make the building what it is. But I believe that you should be able to add modern amenities and things that make it work for our modern needs.”

-- Danielle Keperling, COO of Keperling Preservation Services

Although America is a relatively young country, you can find historic buildings in communities all over. Every state has buildings listed on the National Register of Historic Places and many more buildings in varying states of disrepair.

Danielle Keperling developed a love for restoring historic buildings after growing up working for her parent’s restoration business. Now the part owner with her husband, she helps Keperling Preservation Services transform projects into complete buildings.

Listen in as Danielle shares an inside look into the details of historic restoration, including several notable projects her company has completed.

Topics discussed in this interview:

- Danielle’s path to her career in historical restoration

- What does Keperling Preservation Service do?

- Danielle’s mindset on maintaining historical accuracy or allowing modern convenience

- Operating from Lancaster, PA, a historically significant city

- The difficulty of finding passionate workers for historical work

- Info on the Historic Preservation Trust of Lancaster County

- The difference between historic preservation and historic restoration

- Historic restoration contractors

- Which criteria does Danielle look for when considering whether or not to save a building?

- Working for private vs publicly owned buildings

- How receptive are manufacturers to making new parts for historic work?

- When are engineers involved with restoration projects?

- What kind of grants are available to private or public projects?

- Advice for new members of the construction industry

- Rapid fire questions

Visit Keperling Preservation Services’s website, practicalpreservationservices.com, or send Danielle an email at danielle@practicalpreservationservices.com.

Titles mentioned: The Choice

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This episode was produced by Isaiah Industries, Inc.

Intro/Outro: Welcome to the Construction Disruption podcast, where we uncover the future of design, building, and remodeling.

Todd Miller: I'm Todd Miller of Isaiah industries, a manufacturer of specialty metal roofing and other building materials. Today, my co-host is Seth Heckaman. Seth, how is today going for you?

Seth Heckaman: Going well. How's it going for you?

Todd Miller: Good. Well, I'm hoping for an exciting today. Seth is our VP of Sales here at Isaiah Industries and he gets to help take care of customers and all that type of fun stuff. And then we record podcasts once in a while. So that's what we're doing today. So very excited about our guest today. You know, for some time we as a company have been kind of watching the increase in historic restoration, historic preservation projects across the country. And today we're very excited to be able to talk with an expert in this field and discuss what's going on and also the opportunities that exist for those in design and construction in this realm of historic work. So our guest today is Danielle Keperling of Lancaster, Pennsylvania. Danielle is chief operating officer of Keperling Preservation Services, a family-owned, Lancaster-based contracting company that specializes in preserving and restoring older buildings. She is also executive director of the Historic Preservation Trust of Lancaster County and co-owner of Effective Construction Marketing. I know that she's going to be a wealth of insight for us today. So, Danielle, welcome to Construction Disruption. A real pleasure to have you here today.

Danielle Keperling: Thank you for, thank you for inviting me. I'm excited for our conversation.

Todd Miller: Well, I am, too. So let's kind of kick it off by having you tell us a little bit about yourself. I know that sort of like me, it perhaps wasn't your original intent to end up in the family business, but here we are both years later doing what we love to do. Can you tell us a little bit about your story?

Danielle Keperling: Sure. So all through high school, I was going to be a social worker. And I got to my senior year of high school, my wisdom teeth were infected. I was out of school sick a lot because they didn't know what was wrong. I just kept getting sick, getting antibiotics. I would get better then I would get sick again because my wisdom teeth were still in. So one day I was home, like March of my senior year. So just months from graduating, laying on the sofa and I saw a pastry chef commercial like, "You too, can make these beautiful desserts." And I'm like, That's what I want to do. And it's like I announce to my parents that I was going to culinary arts school instead of instead of like a regular four-year college. My dad freaked out, but supported me. And at this point, I had right around the same time I had started dating my husband. And so he went, he did another year of school. So in 1998, that summer, my dad said to him, Would you like to work with me for the summer? And Jonathan did, and he never went back to school. So Jonathan, my husband, actually was working with my dad before I was. So I went to culinary school, I worked in a bakery for several years. We got married one day. I was working at a small family bakery and there wasn't you know, it's a small family business. There wasn't a lot of room for me to move. So I was talking to my dad about it. He's like, I was waiting for this opportunity. Come work for us. And I did. I started as a glorified secretary. I was answering the phones, running errands, doing what needed to be done. I went back to school. I did get my MBA in management and I learned everything. You know, most of my construction and preservation training has been has been, you know, continuing education classes and on-the-job training. So and I've been full time in construction since 2001.

Todd Miller: Wow, that is quite a story. 20 plus years later, here you are. So you must enjoy it. That's good.

Danielle Keperling: I do, yeah.

Todd Miller: Well, tell us a little bit about Keperling Preservation Services. What types of projects do you get involved with? How far of a distance do you travel for work? That sort of thing.

Danielle Keperling: So we we restore 18th, 19th, early 20th century buildings. We do public and private buildings, some for government agencies, some for private homeowners. It just depends on on the project. And we have, we say mid-Atlantic. So right now we have projects in Northern Virginia that we're doing for a previous client. But we have gone as far north as Maine. One thing that's nice about our setup is that we do have a shop in in Lancaster County. So we build things, we restore things, do what we need to in the shop, and then we can take it out to install it. So we're not on site for the entire duration of the project.

Todd Miller: Okay. So that's a lot of like wood work and that type of thing that you build there and then move it.

Seth Heckaman: I'm curious, is your specialty more, you know, true, just as accurate as possible, you know, restoration? Or do you get into this design and and you know, conversation with clients about maybe mixing the historical restoration with more modern amenities like a barista station in the corner mixed in with everything else? Or what does that look like?

Danielle Keperling: I was actually just talking to somebody a couple of, maybe this past week that we put a kitchenette in and we did a barn conversion. And we put a kitchenette in their bedroom because they didn't want to have to go downstairs for coffee.

Seth Heckaman: There you go.

Danielle Keperling: But we, I mean, I believe and we're not making museums. And I believe that a building has to be usable to be preserved. If it's going to stay here, people have to be able to use it and utilize it. There are definite historic features that we advocate for retaining that make the building what it is. But I believe that you should be able to add modern amenities and things that make it work for our modern needs. I mean, where I'm not, I don't think anybody would advocate not putting a bathroom in a house that was built, you know, before the 1900s.

Seth Heckaman: Sure, sure, sure.

Todd Miller: So these are not necessarily museum pieces you're creating, but these are usable, functional, buildings.

Danielle Keperling: Right. And we do, I mean, we do work on some buildings that are museums. But, you know, that's a different level than a building that people are going to live in.

Todd Miller: Very good. Well, I want to talk a little bit. So here you are in Lancaster, Pennsylvania. I realize your work goes beyond that. But, you know, Lancaster, Pennsylvania, I largely know it for its Amish population in the area. But, you know, dating back to the mid 1700s, it's one of the largest non=seaboard cities or one of the oldest non-seaboard cities in the country. So I have to imagine you've got some older structures there you've worked on as well. Can you maybe tell us about a building or favor building or two you've worked on there in your immediate area?

Danielle Keperling: Sure, and yeah, Lancaster is the oldest inland city in the United States.

Seth Heckaman: Wow.

Danielle Keperling: So we have a lot of firsts here because, you know, if you're the oldest city, you could claim everything that wasn't on the coast as your first. One thing that I love about the East Coast and Lancaster in general is specifically is that you can walk a city block and see, you know, a colonial building, a Victorian building, because there was there was development, you know, throughout the past 300 years. So you get a wide variety of of architecture specifically in Lancaster. I'm trying to think of. We did, we helped to restore old Main at Franklin and Marshall College and there's, it's I think it's like 1850s and it's a Gothic Revival. It's one of the only Gothic Revival buildings in the city. That's a really fun project. Probably our most famous project, and it's not in Lancaster. We worked for the National Park Service to restore the Petersen house, which is the house across from Ford's Theater, where President Lincoln died.

Todd Miller: Okay.

Danielle Keperling: And we did that ten years ago or so. So that's probably our most famous project. Like, if people ask our most famous, that's what I tell them.

Todd Miller: Yeah, very interesting. Well, okay, so I've got to break for a second and remind our audience we are doing our challenge words this episode. I forgot to let everyone know that. I always forget that. But each one of us does have a word that we're challenged to work into the conversation. So you can kind of be listening for those. At the end, we'll say whether we were successful or not. So, you know, as a contractor specializing in working on older buildings, do you find it's hard to find and train folks, you know, that may have special skills or knowledge that are required? I mean, are you having to look for skills that aren't always commonplace? And I guess I'm curious, too, is that exciting for your team members to be involved with, you know, a building that's maybe pushing 200 years old or something?

Danielle Keperling: Yeah, I think there's a combination of answers there. So it is hard to find people with the skills. We do train people, so and often it's interesting. Oftentimes the people who really get passionate about this have like an art background or some other non-construction background, and they get very passionate about it and they love it. Sometimes it's hard, you know, kind of tying into that. Sometimes it's hard to find people who have worked in construction for a while that want to get into the type of work we do just because you don't just go in and do it quick. You know, it's a process and it's tedious. And it's not just, you know, you're just installing things. And some people who have a lot of experience in construction don't like that aspect of it. So it's, there's a balance there, finding people that have some skills but are open to, you know, learning how to restore, you know, windows or doors or something like that. That's going to take time and it's going to be repetitive and kind of tedious.

Todd Miller: Well, and that's really interesting. And in some cases, these are folks that do come from other backgrounds, more sort of creative sort of backgrounds and things, interesting. So I'm kind of curious about the Historic Preservation Trust of Lancaster County and the work that the folks there do. Is that an organization you started?

Danielle Keperling: It is not. So I did have an organization that I started that I was doing for training or bringing knowledge to construction people and preservation design professionals in the area that we had like monthly lectures and different speakers that came in. But the Historic Preservation Trust of Lancaster County was actually founded in the sixties to help push against the urban renewal that was going on and the teardowns. I started consulting for them about four years ago, doing preservation consulting and helping them. And then two years ago they asked if I would be the part time executive director. So I've been doing that for, I'm supposed to be part time. It creeps up. But I'm doing that along with my work in in the construction company. And it's, I enjoy it because it's a way to make more of an impact in the preservation world, not just building by building, we're able to make a bigger impact, you know, on the policymaking level.

Todd Miller: So, I'm kind of curious. I hear these both words used a lot, and I don't know if they mean the same thing. I hear historic restoration and historic preservation. Is there a distinction between them?

Danielle Keperling: There is. So preservation is like kind of like food preservation. It's preserving what's there. It's just maintaining or repairing if you need to. Restoration tends to be putting it back the way it was where things have been changed and you're making it the way it was. So that's the distinction. People do use those words interchangeably. But if you're looking at the dictionary or you're looking at the National Park Service, you know, specifications, those are the definitions.

Todd Miller: So is historic, I guess I'll go back to restoration, I mean.

Danielle Keperling: Yeah.

Todd Miller: Is that a growing industry? I mean, obviously we have more older buildings, but it seems like there's more and more contractors that are specializing in it. And, you know, if I have an older building, should I be looking for a contractor that has some experience and some desire to be involved in that?

Danielle Keperling: I think there's a mixture there. I think like all aspects of construction, you have contractors that try it out. They think that, you know, they could do it, you know, themselves. You know, employees go out on their own and they realize it's not as as glamorous as it seems. But so I think you do get that kind of churn even in preservation. But I, I think that there's a growing interest and, you know, it goes in cycles. You know, people just, society goes in cycles like that. I also think that I know for us, for my husband and myself, for a long time, Jonathan was the youngest person on a job site for a significant amount of time. And now a lot of the people that he worked with are retiring or have retired. And that is causing, you know, somewhat of a of a skills gap because we don't have the people that, you know, came up and have spent 20 years doing it that are there to do it. Now, you have people who are, you know, trying it out. And there are some people who have been doing it a while. I've noticed one trend that I've noticed is women starting window restoration companies. There's several that I can think of, and it makes sense to me from like window restoration as an important aspect of preservation. But it also, it doesn't require a ton of heavy lifting. You can, you know, they're easy to transport and move back to where you're going to work on them. So I could see why that, you know, maybe women would gravitate towards that more than some of the other aspects of construction.

Todd Miller: There's an interesting situation going on in a town near us right now, Troy, Ohio. And, you know, Troy has a fairly significant historic building. But, you know, basically it's falling down and the current owner just wants to raze it. And there are people in the city saying, no, that's not what we should do. And so right now, an entire main street in town or entire block of Main Street is blocked off in case this building collapses. Now, I'm kind of curious. I mean, you know, with your specialty in nature, I mean, what what do you look for in finding the building that, you know, should be restored rather than razed? Or are you looking for architectural style, construction methods, current condition, maybe how the building has been used historically, what are the things that really hallmark and say, this is a building we need to save now?

Danielle Keperling: And that's an interesting question and something that I deal with a lot at the Trust. So it's hard because all of those factors factor in. But like I look, like the building that the Trust is headquartered in is on the National Register. It has national significance because Andrew Ellicott, who was a famous surveyor, lived there in the early 1800s and he trained Meriwether Lewis of Lewis and Clark to survey in that building. So they had wanted to tear it down to build a parking garage. The parking garage now goes completely around us. They carved out a corner for this building, and that's what started the preservation trust. But I look at the pictures of what that building looked like at that time, and I don't know if I would have advocated as hard, which probably makes me feel a little guilty. But it was not in great shape. Like, I could see the argument for, you know, but these people had a vision and they went forward and they said, you know, we need to save this because it is historic, it is important. So looking at current conditions sometimes can be hard. But one thing that I really look for when I'm advocating for a building to be restored is if it has a lot of the original features. Because even if they're in bad shape, those can be restored and brought back. And then you still have like the original, what in the preservation world they call historic fabric. And that part of the building is still there. We went into, we restored a train station in Redding a few years ago and I was in charge of going through and like labeling so that the demo crew didn't take out what we were restoring. And it had been abandoned for like 40 years. There was standing water in the building. There were dead birds. It was not a fun labeling exercise. But that building turned out beautifully because almost all of the original features were there. It had just been mothballed for 40 years. So, you know, it does it, but it takes somebody with a vision and somebody with money to to be able to go in and save these buildings, especially when they have been so, so neglected. And so, yeah, I guess neglect is a good word.

Todd Miller: So I'm curious, in your company, are most of your clients, private owners or do they tend to be more trusts and organizations or government organizations?

Danielle Keperling: I would say before my parents retired, we're probably 50, 50. 50 private, 50 public. But now I would say we're probably 75 private and 25 public. And that's just because when my parents retired, Jonathan and I kind of looked at each other, we had a ton of employees. We were like, you know, we were busy managing people, not really doing the work that we enjoyed. And we're like, Is this fun? Should we go get real jobs? Like what should we do? And we opted not to get real jobs, but we did we did decide that we were going to scale back and kind of make it a smaller, more manageable company. And we're both a lot happier for that.

Todd Miller: One of the kind of dynamics with the situation near us here is the kind of ongoing conflict between this building owner and the very active board of the historic district that the building is in. So I'm curious, when you're working with your private clients, probably especially, what's your best practices of, you know, working with ARBs or just the boards of the districts or anyone else who has a say in what the vision for that building's going to be?

Danielle Keperling: So typically, thankfully, our our private clients love their buildings and they want to preserve them. So what we want to do, usually we just get, we get approvals because we're doing something that the board would agree with.

Seth Heckaman: Sure.

Danielle Keperling: But it is hard, like there is that tension there where there's a building that has significance to the community and it's in private ownership and this private owner doesn't want to preserve it or do whatever they need to to to make it safe even. And you know, we have, there's a tension there between what's in the public interest and private ownership, private property ownership. And that's a problem that I have not solved. I don't know the answer to. But it's a problem, it is. Because you can't go in, well the government could. We can't go in and force people to maintain their buildings.

Todd Miller: Very interesting. So I kind of want to switch gears here a tiny bit. So we manufacture metal roofing. And one of the things that we get involved in over the years have been some historical buildings. And, you know, a lot of times we were called upon to make special parts or develop custom colors to help accomplish, you know, the goals of the project. I remember a historic building in North Carolina that's a library now. And, you know, they wanted a very specific roof color to match what was their original. And, you know, a lot of times that's a hard thing to accomplish. I'm kind of curious and, you know, how willing do you find building products manufacturers? How willing are they to step outside of the box and do special things for historic projects? Or do you find some manufacturers are willing to and others aren't? Have you gotten involved any with that sort of thing?

Danielle Keperling: Yeah, we do sometimes, because there sometimes we're trying to match something that's not being made anymore and it was commercially available, which also then makes that much harder because it's not like it was a custom piece at the time. It was, you know, being manufactured. I yeah, there, there are some manufacturers that are willing to do that, and I'm glad to hear that, that you are because there are some that just, they won't deviate and then you have to go find another another solution. And not that it's exactly the same, but like it happens to us a lot when we're trying to match like an old paint or an old stain, because the formulas have all changed because of the environment and then you can't even get the color the same. It's like, Oh, what are we going to do? Like we're, you know, we're trying to achieve this and there's no other options. So, yeah, so it's great when you can find somebody that you can work with that is willing to kind of work with you to to achieve the goal. And maybe it is a more modern solution, but as long as it looks the same, it doesn't, you know, at that point doesn't matter as much as as creating the the look that you're going for.

Todd Miller: Very interesting. I get very excited when people bring those projects to us. I mean honestly they are probably some of the least profitable projects, but they're always exciting. So there was a little town out in Santa Clarita, California, not related to the Santa Clarita Diet television show, but they've got a historic village that's kind of based upon the film industry and before that. But, you know, they had a lot of old buildings there, and they had called me in and I was there meeting with the folks that kind of owned the museum from the city. And I was there with historic folks. And, you know, they were saying, well, there's no way we can use a metal roof that's going to look like our old wood shingles. And yet here they are in the height of fire country.

Danielle Keperling: Right.

Todd Miller: And so that was a concern. And I remember what one person particular from the historic review board or whatever, it was getting very upset. And it was kind of fun, though, because I actually brought wood shingles from a building back and had one of our folks work on replicating the color and texture, and we sent them a product they were absolutely thrilled about. They have at this point, roofed pretty much every building in this whole little historical village with our products. And we love stuff like that.

Danielle Keperling: That's great.

Todd Miller: It's fun. Again, the least profitable stuff.

Danielle Keperling: I think that those compromises make a lot of sense is like when you're talking about fire danger, when you're talking about... I don't know if you're familiar with Cape May in New Jersey.

Todd Miller: Oh, sure.

Danielle Keperling: Yeah, it is New Jersey, but it's a Victorian town and it's still pretty Victorian. But that sea air just batters the woodwork. And so I don't know, I think that some people have started using a ASAC or some kind of product like that, at least at the upper where maintenance is going to be such an issue makes sense to me. And it's not a purist, it's not the replacement in kind that the Secretary of Interior calls for. But if you want to maintain that look and the products that we have won't because they're just not as good as what they built with, then I think that those are good solutions. So it makes sense to me.

Todd Miller: Yeah, I was on a conference call actually first thing this morning and I won't give it away because the project isn't completely nailed down yet, but it was some East Coast seaboard properties and very high-end developed by a well-known wealthy family. And you know, same thing though, they're saying, you know, we want to preserve these buildings, but yet we don't want to go back with the old materials because they didn't perform so well.

Danielle Keperling: Right.

Todd Miller: So are architects and engineers often involved with the projects you work with, and if so, you know, what does that relationship look like?

Danielle Keperling: Yeah, it depends. It depends on the project. If it's a homeowner that reached out, they just want to do some maintenance and repair that usually doesn't have an architect or an engineer. If there is, you know, some structural issues that we're not sure about. Sometimes, like a house will shift and there's a way to, you know, to do that without without having to bring an engineer. But if there's if there's shifting going on, we're not sure what's happening. You know, definitely an engineer that has worked on historic buildings, because sometimes an engineer that has an and doesn't have that experience, they will over engineer and they'll make solutions that aren't compatible with the building. And the same with an architect that's unfamiliar with what would be appropriate for a historic building. But typically, you know, it's the same as a modern construction. You know, you get drawings, you get specifications, you know, you have discussions. And oftentimes, thankfully, because, you know, this is what we do, people sometimes will come to us and ask, you know, how would you approach this? And then they kind of write the specification to match that too. Just because it's you know, they know that we were familiar with the materials and what's available in the marketplace.

Todd Miller: When I was, I really wanted someone on the show to talk about this subject. So I'm glad you're here. But one of the people I'd approached, you know, as I was looking for the right person had said, you know, a lot of times there are grants, federal, state, local grants available for restoring historic buildings that honestly, I knew nothing about that. That was a completely new concept to me. So can you tell us a little bit about some of those programs that are out there and maybe criteria that are required for folks to tap into some of that funding? Or how does someone go about trying to tap into it?

Danielle Keperling: So typically, and I think this is probably across the board, the grants and the tax credits that are available, I'll clarify. The grants tend to be for nonprofits or government agencies. So they're not for private homeowners. Then there's the federal rehabilitation tax credits, which is a percentage of the tax credits on the construction costs. And there's federal and state. I know Pennsylvania has one. It's not very big. Those are for income-producing properties. So if you're a business redeveloping as a property, if you're a landlord that has, you know, that's renting out, as long as it's an income-producing property you can apply for and get those tax credits. But there's not a lot for private homeowners. And that's the logic that I've heard behind that, is that when they put these federal rehabilitation tax credits in they felt like they could justify businesses getting it because it's doing more for the the community. It's creating jobs. It's you know, it's doing more things. But for a private homeowner, just to get money from the government to increase their own equity wouldn't go over so well.

Todd Miller: Very interesting. That makes sense. So is the I assume, though, the process is sort of an application process.

Danielle Keperling: It is, it's an application process. Usually every state has a state office of historic preservation. Usually that's the office that handles those those bigger grant applications. And the National Trust administers some. And then there are some local foundations if somebody is looking for like a nonprofit or some other entity that's looking for it. There's also like local private foundations that also will give money, but it's just not usually for homeowners.

Todd Miller: Okay.

Danielle Keperling: There are, at least in Pennsylvania, at the county and the state and the city level, the municipal level, they have like emergency repair grants and I have heard of people using those as private homeowners for repairs. So that would be the other. That would be like the one thing that I'm aware of that homeowners can use.

Todd Miller: So we believe that a lot of folks in our audience are kind of younger folks, fairly new to our industry, either design or construction, trying to figure out what their future might be. Do you have any suggestion for someone who might be interested in getting involved with historic restoration work?

Danielle Keperling: Mm hmm. I, and actually, I've become acquainted with a professor at one of the local colleges, and he keeps sending people to me that need career advice. But I, sometimes it's hard without experience. So if you can find, you know, if you can work your day job, but still, you know, find ways to volunteer, get involved and then try to find a job, it doesn't have a lot of the kids that he's dealing with want to work in like museums and things. But there is a lot of preservation work that can be done that isn't museum-based, whether it's construction or design or manufacturing. There's a lot of manufacturers that manufacture things for historic projects. So there are ways to get involved in the industry without having to be, you know, in a museum setting. So that's kind of like, I think that there's a lot of opportunity if people are kind of creative and look for it.

Todd Miller: Very neat. Well, yeah, I think there's huge opportunities out there. And for me, a fascinating part of construction. So, I'm kind of curious. So, you know, here you are, donut maker turned into this. Actually, I'm sure you made much fancier pastries than donuts, but what do you love about what you do, Danielle?

Danielle Keperling: I love helping people, kind of create their visions and then the history. I love, I loved history even through school. And I love that. I go back to people are the same like whether it's 200 years ago or now. Like the basic makeup of people is the same. I have this book about like classifieds from the Colonial papers and it's like it was their Facebook, but you had to go down the newspaper office and put your, you know, status update in the paper. And but it you know, it just reminds me that people are same. But we are entrusted with, you know, the stewardship of these buildings so that they can, you know, be here for future generations. And I think that that makes what we do rewarding.

Todd Miller: Very neat and good stuff. Well, thank you so much, Danielle. This has been very informative. We're close to wrapping up what we call the business end of things. Is there anything we haven't covered today that you'd like to share with our audience?

Danielle Keperling: I think we've covered a great overview of historic preservation. I think that you covered everything with your questions, but I thank you for for inviting me on and and asking me if there was anything that I needed that you didn't cover because I think you covered everything.

Todd Miller: Well, we did cover a lot of ground, and that's good stuff. You've been a been a great guest. So before we close out, though, I have to ask if you're willing to participate in something we do here on the show called our rapid fire questions. So these are seven questions, some are serious, some are a little more silly. All you have to do is give an answer to each. So are you up to the challenge of rapid fire having no idea what we're going to ask you?

Danielle Keperling: Sure.

Todd Miller: Well, we will alternate asking. Seth, you wanna ask the first question?

Seth Heckaman: Sure. Question number one, is there a product or service you've purchased in recent memory that was a real disruptor or game-changer for you? Sort of a "where have you been all my life moment."

Danielle Keperling: I, I found these French cookies at Costco and I love them. I don't think that's exactly what you're asking. That was the first thing that came to mind. And just as a funny aside, I have a friend who was born and raised in China, and she's been here like 30 years. But she came to me a year or so ago. She's like, why didn't anybody ever tell me about an Egg McMuffin? So she had just had one, and she thought it was the best.

Seth Heckaman: That's incredible.

Todd Miller: Well, we will absolutely check out the Costco French cookies.

Danielle Keperling: Oh, my goodness. Yeah, they're the best.

Todd Miller: So that may answer the next question. But the next question is, would you rather eat only sweet foods or salty, savory foods for the rest of your life?

Danielle Keperling: Oh, sweet all the way. Carbs, like I joked that I would go to Europe and it would be my No Carb Left Behind tour, so.

Todd Miller: Good stuff. Yeah, that would be me too, I must admit.

Seth Heckaman: Alright, question number three. What was the first car you ever drove?

Danielle Keperling: That I ever drove?

Seth Heckaman: Yes.

Danielle Keperling: I know I learned to drive in a Chrysler LeBaron. So I'm assuming that that that would have been it.

Seth Heckaman: There you go.

Todd Miller: I think that had rich Corinthian leather seats, if I remember right in the Chrysler LeBaron. I'm dating myself. Okay. What is your favorite season of the year?

Danielle Keperling: I love, I do love living where we do that we have seasons, but I think I really have started to enjoy fall.

Todd Miller: I'm looking forward to fall actually this year. I love the color and little bit cooler temperatures and all that type of stuff. Okay. Oh, next one's yours, isn't it Seth? Sorry.

Seth Heckaman: What would you like to be remembered for?

Danielle Keperling: I think that the work that we do, the preservation work. So okay, this is, this is a little bit, both my parents died this year and but it was amazing to me how many people reached out to say how much of a difference they made in their lives. And I, you know, when you're living your life, you don't realize that. So I hope that I'm doing that with with my work and my interactions with people, too. So we, even at their memorial somebody, my dad had helped with the youth group when I was in middle school. These kids, they're not kids. They're older than I am. These kids from the youth group came just to say how much of a difference that he made in their lives. And I don't think he probably realized that because, you know, you don't tell people when when people make a difference in your life. So I, I hope that I can, you know, make the world a better place.

Seth Heckaman: Wonderful. That's a beautiful legacy.

Todd Miller: Yep. Okay, next question's one I've never asked anyone before. Would you rather have only super weird dreams or never dream again when you sleep?

Danielle Keperling: I don't tend to remember my dreams, so I don't know if that would be a difference. Once in a while, like if as I'm waking up, if I'm still dreaming, I'll remember those. But I don't tend to remember my dreams. So I think I would rather not so that I don't get woken up because after I wake up in the night, I don't go back to sleep.

Todd Miller: That makes perfect sense. That's all right. Last rapid fire question and this one may be difficult to narrow down to just one, considering the background in your picture, but what is a book that has had a major impact on your life?

Danielle Keperling: Oh, there's so many. And that's like, that's not an exaggeration. I just and I read like, fun fantasy books, but then I have like, business books and and I get something out of all of them. But I just read, I think it's The Choice by Edith Eger. And she's a Holocaust survivor that in her forties and fifties became a psychiatrist. And she then looks at her experience living through Auschwitz in the lens of trauma. And it's fascinating to me because I don't think they had those words and the concepts at that time. And she talks about how then she has used that to help heal other people at her work here in America, and she's still alive.

Seth Heckaman: Wow. Powerful.

Todd Miller: Good stuff. Well, Danielle, thank you again. This has been a great episode and enjoyed getting to know you and getting some great information. So for folks who would like to get in touch with you, how can they most easily do that?

Danielle Keperling: I would say visit our website, its practicalpreservationservices.com and my email is just danielle@practicalpreservationservices.com. But that's probably the easiest way to get in touch with me.

Todd Miller: Very good. Well we will put that information in the show notes as well so folks can have it there also. So this has been great. I do, we did do our challenge words this episode. Seth, I know you got yours worked in. Your challenge word was?

Seth Heckaman: Barista.

Todd Miller: Barista. Mine was donut, which I got worked in there. Danielle, if you worked your's in.

Danielle Keperling: I did not. I failed.

Todd Miller: You were so masterful at it that I didn't even catch it. Oh, well, that's quite okay. There's a, there's no consolation prize, but there was no prize if you would have worked it any other way. This has been great. Thank you so much for your time, Danielle. It's been a lot of fun.

Danielle Keperling: You're welcome. Thank you.

Todd Miller: And I'd like to thank our audience for tuning in to this very special episode of Construction Disruption with Danielle Keperling of Keperling Preservation Services, based in Lancaster, Pennsylvania. Please, please watch for future episodes of our podcast. We're always blessed with great guests. Don't forget to leave a review on Apple Podcasts or YouTube. Until the next time we're together, keep on challenging, keep on looking for new ways of doing things and keep pushing the envelope. Don't forget to to have a positive impact on everyone you encounter. Make them smile, encourage them; simple yet powerful things we can all do with every interaction. So in the meanwhile, God bless and take care. This is Isaiah Industries signing off until the next episode of Construction Disruption.

Intro/Outro: This podcast is produced by Isaiah Industries, a manufacturer of specialty metal roofing and other building products.