Calling all active women: This episode has the answers you’ve been needing to deal with issues some folks are too embarrassed to talk about. Not us! The guest, journalist and podcast Molly Hurford, author of Saddle, Sore: Ride Comfortable, Ride Happy, sat down at FeistyFest with hosts Sarah Bowen Shea and newbie Rachel Domb to cover:

-the age-old commando versus undies debate

-laundry tips for de-stinking workout wear (+ what causes the funk!)

-bike short recommendations

-why you shouldn’t be like Donald Duck post-workout!

-the recent Hyrox “shituation”

In the short intro chitchat, new occasional co-host Rachel shares a bit about herself. The TMI talk with Molly kicks off around 04:20.

Feisty Running Retreat, Feb. 5-8, 2027 in Austin: https://livefeisty.com/events/feisty-womens-running-retreat/

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Foreign.

Welcome to another mother runner, your best running friend in podcast form.

We do all the talking, even on the uphills.

I'm Sarah Bowen Shea along with Rachel Dahm, a potential new co host.

G. No pressure there, Rachel, welcome.

Thank you.

It's a pleasure to be here after so many years.

Yes.

So.

And we are joining you from Feisty Fest here in Pennsylvania.

Outdoor venue overlooking an amazing track.

One of I believe 18 in the country.

So.

Yeah.

So.

And Rachel, you just wrapped up a run.

I did indeed.

I'm really glad that this isn't going on YouTube because I warned Sarah that I would be sweaty.

So.

And you were just across the street on trails.

Yeah, it was gorgeous.

I did a nice six mile run, got all my podcast wiggles.

So.

And you typically run on trails or.

Road or so I'm from Boston.

I've been in the Boston in Boston for the past six years.

So the Esplanade is my go to.

I know it well.

It's a beautiful place to run, but it's also mostly hard surface, but it's also flat.

But I just moved to LA recently so a bunch of new runs ahead of me.

I'm trying to talk you into moving to San Francisco.

It'll happen where you really want to be.

Yeah, yeah.

So.

So we're not going to go too far into your story because you do have a very intrigu AMR related backstory.

So saving that for another episode that when we are doing it over Riverside and there will be YouTube and yeah, I'm not sure why I chose a 25 year old to be a co host when we're doing YouTube but mistakes might be made.

But.

Can we filter this half of the screen?

Yes, you're over.

That can be hd.

This is gently blurred.

Yeah, exactly.

Okay, so today's topic is basically one of the cornerstones of another mother runner and feisty running.

It is tmi.

Too much information topics.

So one of the main ways that the AMR community grew in our early years back when we could actually use Facebook to our advantage rather than being manipulated by Mark Zuckerberg two different ways.

We started doing our first Facebook post back when we could not even schedule them.

We had to do them live was TMI Tuesdays.

And so that back then this was and I'm talking late 2010, maybe 2011, people weren't talking about, you know, having your period on race day or what do you do when you have to poop every half mile.

And so.

And back then Facebook allowed users or I guess that's what you call somebody on Facebook to post their own questions.

So people would post questions, and then we dimity and I would elevate them and.

And, you know, serve them up on the page.

And it was amazing what people would admit to.

And so, you know, it would be something about, you know, a peeing your pants, you know, when on a run, because you're 18 months postpartum and get 292 comments.

And then that's actually how we grew the community, because everybody's like, oh, my gosh.

Well, Jill posted on this another Mother Runner community.

What's that?

Oh, I want to like that page, too.

So we have TMI to thank for our, you know, I don't know, 120,000 Facebook followers.

So.

Yeah, so.

So.

And our guests, you know, pretty much established herself partially because of her willingness to talk about TMI topics.

Our guest is Molly Hereford, an author, journalist, podcaster, and publisher, as well as a cyclist and runner.

She has written numerous YA novels focused on sporty girls, as well as the book that prompted us to do this episode, Saddle Sore Ride Comfortable Ride Happy with Deals, which deals with all sorts of cycling related TMI topics.

Molly's also the host of two podcasts, one called the Consummate Athlete, and the other is the Queen Stage Women's cycling Podcast.

You are one busy woman, Molly.

We are so glad that you could join us at Feisty Fest.

Oh, my gosh.

Thank you so much for having me.

This is.

I love what you just said about having that as your Facebook page, because that's really how I came to doing everything.

Riding Saddle sore.

I'd be at bike races, and at least you got it.

Like, over the Internet, I straight up had women, like, pulling down their pants to be like, hey, do you know what's going on here?

I'm like, whoa.

No, I don't.

Unless when they pulled them down, I saw underwear, in which case I was like, no, we don't wear that with our bike shorts, which we'll definitely get into.

But that's all part of being the sisterhood of sports here.

And that's what I love so much.

I love that Sisterhood of sports.

Yeah.

So, Molly, tell us, how did you get into sports?

What was your athletic background?

Ooh, zero to none.

Um, so I don't know about all of you, but I was not an athletic child.

I actually, this is, like, a bad thing to admit on a running podcast, but everyone remember the Presidential Physical Fitness Test, how you had to run the mile in gym class?

I never ran It.

Every year I came up with some excuse.

It's impressive.

Got the booze.

Every year I came up with some kind of excuse.

Oh, I twisted my ankle.

Oh, I think I'm going to throw up.

Oh, my period, etc.

Never did it.

And then got to college.

And I really shouldn't say this, but there was a cute boy and he was into triathlon, and I was like, I can do that.

Sure, no problem.

Here's an Ironman triathlon.

So, like, in retrospect, bad idea for someone who couldn't run a mile, but I figured it out.

So, yeah, got really into running, got really into cycling, kind of got into swimming as much as you have to to do a triathlon.

And really?

Yeah, never looked back after that except to say to my parents, why didn't you guys get me into sports when I was younger?

And they were like, molly, we cannot stress how much we tried to get you into sports.

You just weren't doing it.

Were you too busy reading?

Way too busy reading.

Yeah, Right on.

That's me.

Yeah, yeah.

And here we are today.

So, yeah, now I write books about girls in sport.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

The Venn diagram.

Exactly.

Yeah.

So as we've already established, you know, like another mother runner, you were an early adopter of bringing, you know, verbo, formerly verboten topics out into the light.

So your book originally debuted in 2014.

That was a while ago.

Yeah.

So what prompted you to write it and how was it received in 2014?

Yeah, well, as per the women asking me at bike races, what the heck is going on here?

And me not quite knowing, you know, I was a woman journalist in cycling, and that meant it was pretty much me and Celine, who most of you probably know and have seen this weekend.

So it was just she and I and, you know, really these questions weren't being answered anywhere.

This is before you could, you know, chatgpt it.

I cannot express to anyone listening how much I'm rolling my eyes when I say that.

You know, Facebook was just kind of getting started with stuff like that, and women were kind of afraid to ask any of these questions.

And my motto has really been, like, if you have a question, you should probably write a book about it.

So I basically pulled all the questions that I'd been getting and then asked a bunch of experts.

I found a couple of amazing doctors, gynecologists, physical therapists, bike fitters, people who really understood bike saddles and stuff and just asked them a ton of questions and kind of started putting it all together and yeah.

At first it was received really well by the women who needed it and with, like, the confusion you would expect from the men that didn't understand why women would possibly need to know why wearing a pad with bike shorts during their period is maybe not going to be the most comfortable thing for you.

Yeah.

Or, you know, anything about, like, you know, the tampon string and how we should make sure we tuck that so it doesn't get tugged whilst we pedal.

All of these things that guys were just.

Yeah.

Not super thrilled about.

Although, you know what?

I got way more hate mail the one time I wrote about how you could wear makeup when you rode a bike.

Oh.

Compared to.

Really?

Yeah.

From men or from women?

Oddly enough, from both.

Yeah.

A lot of men that were really upset.

Wasting time.

Wasting their time.

Oh.

Huh.

Okay.

I think there's more important things to be taking issue with.

I should.

Yeah, yeah.

That I should be taking issue with.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Well, Molly, your book is aimed at cyclists, but I think a lot of the issues that you talked about in your book could be also applicable to runners.

There's chafing, hormones, periods, hygiene, and generally just being pretty uncomfortable talking about these sort of things.

So what could runners gleam from your book that you talk about to cyclists?

Oh, yeah.

I mean, there is so much overlap.

The chafe definitely happens to everyone is probably, like, the number one thing that I'm always talking about, because I think it's one of those things that people feel really uncomfortable and almost, like, awkward about or as though it shouldn't be happening.

You're running the wrong way or you're riding the wrong way if you're chafing.

And yes, there's stuff we can do to alleviate chafing, but not changing your body, simply just changing what we're wearing, how we're wearing it, what type of chafe cream we're using, all that kind of fun stuff.

Yeah.

I mean, I think pretty much everything in the book, barring anything really specific about the saddle construction, is very much a runner issue as much as it is a cyclist issue.

And actually, a lot of runners ended up with the book because women who ride often end up like women who are like cyclists.

Cyclists often end up on group rides with other women.

They start having these conversations.

You kind of pick this stuff up.

Whereas there's a lot of runners who ride as cross training and don't necessarily have a group of women cyclists around them to be like, oh, hey, like, I noticed you have a panty line in your bike shorts.

You know, it's Actually, way more comfortable if you're not wearing underwear with the bike shorts due to chafing concerns that I'm sure we'll get to.

But if you're only ever riding alone or you're riding inside on your trainer, you probably wouldn't realize that, because why would you.

So what I'm hearing is that saddle sores are to cycling as running is to chafing.

Yeah, absolutely.

And when we say saddle sore, I should say, like, there's kind of all different types of things that we kind of lump into the pun intended Salisaur category.

We have anything from, like, chafing that kind of ends up with a bit of more of a hive kind of situation, a bit rashy, to a single kind of bump that's more like a pimple to.

I mean, you can have saddle sores that are.

We're talking like grape size or bigger situations that actually require surgical intervention.

Yeah.

Which we really do not want to get to.

Yeah.

And we really don't want to Google that with image.

No, no, no, no.

Yeah.

Not a picture book, too.

We should just mention to everybody.

Yeah.

As a publisher, that should not be a picture book.

Yeah, we'll not be putting that one out,.

I guess.

Okay, so you've already alluded to twice, I think, about the underwear under bike shorts.

And I got to tell you that when we would post on Facebook about going commando, no underwear versus wearing underwear under running shorts, you know, which a lot of running shorts have built in.

You know, panties in them.

Yeah.

Briefs in them.

And that was like a third rail of a topic.

I mean, so excites much debate and form of enthusiasm.

Yeah.

So what are your.

What are your thoughts?

And because I am so firmly in the commando camp, like, just off the charts commando.

Yeah, off the charts commando.

Put it on a T shirt.

Yeah.

Here.

For the women's race.

Off the charts.

Like, there's a scale of all of the command.

Yeah, Right.

Oh, see, I'm a. I'm a hybrid when it comes to running in that.

Like, when the shorts have briefs in them, obviously commando.

That just makes sense.

But if I'm wearing more of a bike short, really ironically, I wear underwear with the bike short style.

It's a weird thing.

I like.

I like something that's more cupping that area.

I can't explain it.

But when you're wearing bike shorts, just psa.

So if we're talking about bike shorts that have the.

The chamois in it.

So, like the little diapery thing that I don't know about any of you that have gotten bike shorts before.

I remember the first time my teammates when I joined Rucker cycling handed me a pair of shorts.

I was like, what the hell is this?

Like, I'm supposed to do what?

So weird.

It's like, are we.

Is this like one of those butt pads where we're like, just trying to really make my butt look good, but it's really meant for comfort and it's meant to be anti chafing because it provides a nice smooth surface between your undercarriage, your inner thighs and the bike.

That's why the pad, like, that's why the pad is actually long enough that it doesn't just cover your undercarriage, it covers kind of your inner thighs as well.

It's so when you're on the saddle and every time you pedal, you're moving a tiny bit from left to right.

That's all one piece of fabric.

So when we add underwear to the equation, now we've added this other thing that is going to be scraping every time we're pedaling.

And that is how we end up with tiny microabrasions that end up potentially becoming saddle sores.

I have a follow up to that.

I'm intrigued by your use of the phrase undercarriage.

Right.

Is that just tactful for crotch or.

Yeah, why, yes, it is.

I think so.

Okay.

Okay.

And do you have a TM on that?

I mean, not a tmi, but a trademark.

I really should.

I really should.

I started doing it at, when I was at bike shops doing these talks for two reasons.

One, I used to say vagina, but then inevitably I'd have someone in the audience, you know, it's not technically the vagina.

Okay.

But we all know what I mean.

Yeah.

And then also because usually bike shops have like, at least, you know, a couple 17 year old dudes who are just working as mechanics.

And I started feeling bad for them because they looked like they wanted to just sink into the ground.

And I wanted to give them the vocabulary to talk to women about it potentially as they were talking about like saddles and bike shorts.

So undercarriage just felt like a thing that, like, everyone could get on board with.

Fabulous.

So there's a whole category of things that women don't talk about when it comes to exercise, but that we all experience.

There's odor, we get chafing, itching, all these things that are often categorized or even we think about as gross.

Can you tell us what some of the things that are completely normal that women experience and maybe some things that we should look out for and should not brush off.

Oh, yeah, absolutely.

I mean, to your point, as far as odor goes, yeah, that's pretty normal.

And actually, like, one thing I've learned is a lot of women, especially when you're biking, you're wearing and running, you're wearing really tight stuff, right?

Like, it's very much attached to you.

And one of the big problems I noticed a lot of women have is we have fairly sensitive skin.

And when you think about sweating, your pores are opening.

And if you have a lot of stuff with fragrance in it, if you're using those detergents from Tide and stuff that are, like, ultra sport extra smells for, like, that, you know, you can smell from, like, the house over when they're in the dryer kind of thing.

Like, think about that stuff just getting into your pocket.

Pour open pores as you're sweating, as you're, you know, the fabrics rubbing against you so you have a little bit of that friction.

Like, rashes are so common and something we don't talk about enough.

And laundry is one of the, like, the hills I will die on.

As far as, like, going to the sensitive skin.

Like, no odor or no fragrance stuff, even if, yes, we may smell a little funky by the end of a run.

Who cares?

Who cares?

And okay, the other.

The other thing, because we're in TMI mode, let's talk discharge.

It happens.

And, you know, it's one of those things where, like, at the end of a ride or at the end of the run, you know, you pull off your shorts and you're like, oh, totally normal.

It's fine.

We just want to wash our shorts inside out to make sure that it actually does get clean for the next time.

But otherwise, we should not be upset or embarrassed about that.

That is just part of life.

That is our body's natural cleansing system doing its job.

I love that.

I love that.

I think everyone needed to hear that.

We need to send a memo to Gwyneth, don't we, about that?

Oh, dear God, yes.

Yes.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

No steaming of anything, please.

No, Jade.

Yeah, well, he brought up the topic of detergent a couple times in that answer.

So do you have a detergent that you are a fan of?

Because, I mean, I also cannot stand fragranced scented laundry detergents.

I mean, I can't even stand it on my sheets, on my towels, anything.

Because I just also reminds me of being in a cheap airbnb.

Totally.

Because I feel that it's trying to mask an odor rather than give an Odor.

And so, yeah, so I'm really.

For a long time, AMR was partnered with SweatX.

And so these things that really work on a subatomic, practically level, you know, to get the.

Because it's.

Because I did stories for the New York Times Runner's World about how it is not the sweat that smells.

It is.

And you can back me up on this.

Perhaps it is the microbes that are in there and it is their poop that smells, which.

Sorry, everyone.

So you got to get that poop out of there.

Do you need to get that poop out of there?

Yeah.

I'm shocked.

Yeah.

Shook.

Yeah.

Right here.

I'm learning a lot today.

Yeah.

I mean, to me, one of the best defenses.

So honestly, I will use pretty much any detergent that's just, like, sensitive skin, fragrance free, dye free.

And then I do the pre.

Like the pre soak cycle and the extra rinse cycle, which may not, I recognize, is probably not the most ecologically friendly thing I could do.

But you know what?

That extra rinse, so helpful for getting out that extra.

The extra suds.

I've been on a couple of bike rides with people that definitely did not do that.

And I swear to God, it would start raining, and, like, you'd see the back of their bubbling, like, bubbles coming out of the chamois because it's like squishing.

Because it's basically.

Oh, my gosh, I don't like it.

Smudge.

Oh, my gosh.

It's like you're doing a car wash. My God.

Wow.

Yeah.

The only thing worse than that is when cyclists overdo it on shammy cream.

So shammy cream is basically like a heavy body lotion, for lack of a better phrase, for someone who hasn't seen it.

And it's often, guys, I've never seen a woman do this, but they will just, like, squirt it all over their shammy and, like, pull up their shorts, and then it will, like, squelch like mayonnaise.

Wow.

Like mayonnaise in a blt.

You don't want to be behind that rider.

And this was all super appealing when you had a boyfriend that did all of this.

Right, Right.

Flattering sport.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Cycling is not the most, like, sexy sport in the world.

It's.

It's pretty gross and pretty silly.

Like, no one looks cool in bib shorts, which, by the way, are the most comfortable type of bike shorts for anyone who, like, isn't necessarily a regular cyclist.

Most shops will try to fob you off with just regular bike shorts.

That come up to here and they hit you right in the center of your stomach.

And then what do you do on the bike?

You bend over.

So these bike shirts are just smashing right into your gut, making it so that you're hiccupy and uncomfortable and it's just unpleasant.

And bib shorts have suspenders.

And yes, you look silly, but you also look super good in pictures because you don't have a muffin top situation.

Just saying.

And also, you can actually breathe.

You can let your belly out.

It's fantastic.

But 11 out of 10 recommend.

But then people also should know they wear their jersey over it.

You do not like a regular pair of overalls.

Wear.

Wear it over your jersey.

Yes.

Unless you're in, like, an ASOS ad or like a Zara ad or something.

Now that Zara has gotten into bike shorts, which I would not put on my, like, must haves.

Listen, starts to make it, then it'll.

Be, oh, then you're actually supposed to put the suspenders on the outside.

The tiny strap bandeau.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

We're going to beat that horse until it's well underground.

Yeah, yeah.

All right, well, let's pause to hear about some great deals from our sponsors.

Okay, folks, for those of you who are here in the audience, if it's.

And probably listeners, maybe case it's not blatantly obvious, Rachel and I are a few generations apart, which is one of the many reasons I asked her to join me on this recording stage.

And so, in talking to women athletes, Molly, for your book.

And since then, do you feel there are generational differences about discussing and even addressing TMI matters that, like, I mean, so I was a collegiate rower, and we just.

I don't ever remember the word period coming up unless it was talking about an essay we were writing and, you know, comma, period, semicolon, you know, so.

And with this whole running boom of these youngsters, you know, do you feel there's more openness?

Yes and no.

I'm gonna say, like the.

So my.

My husband's a cycling coach, and he actually works with a lot of young riders, and I help out on a lot of camps and stuff, so I get to be around a lot of junior riders and U23 riders, and that's awesome.

And I think they still experience a lot of the same stuff that we did.

As far as being really, like, still uncomfortable talking about their periods and stuff.

I would say the biggest difference is now a lot of coaches and people in sport understand the importance of.

Of getting them to Talk about their periods.

So at least we're having those discussions, even if they, they still feel a little uncomfortable, unfortunately.

You know what, if you'd asked me this question five years ago, I would have said, oh yeah, it's doing great.

The younger generations, like, they're so much more like body confident, body positive, all this kind of stuff and been like really happy about that.

But I would say, I don't know that we've seen a huge improvement at this point because it does feel like the skinny talk trend and you know, young athletes with body image issues and disordered eating and stuff just feels like it's.

We're coming right back to it again.

So some improvements, some stuff staying pretty much the same, but at least the information is now available for them, which is better than it used to be.

Yeah.

You indicated earlier about, you mentioned AI.

I mean, do you feel, have you ever spent some time, you know, kind of looking to see what AI says about TMI topics, which is a lot of acronyms, but yeah, so many acronyms.

Honestly, I have not.

Partially because I don't want to waste the water.

You need it for that second rinse cycle.

Yeah, exactly, exactly.

Look, I'm gonna be non ecologically friendly with my laundry and then try to stay off AI as much as I can.

It balances out.

Yeah.

I'd be really interested to see what Claude had to say about having a saddle sore and what to do about it.

I feel like it might actually lead to one of those topics you were telling me about we're going to talk about.

As far as DIY methodology is.

You're leading me right into it, actually.

Yeah.

I mean, when I was reading your book, it was clear you've spoken to many women, you've helped many women.

What has been the craziest DIY solution that a woman has come to you with to help their saddle sore man?

Okay, so when this book came out, essential oils were huge.

Oh my gosh.

Oh no.

This is like the.

It was like the peak of the MLM essential oil trend.

Yes.

So I swear, like every city I would be in at a bike shop talking, there would be a different essential oil that totally cured each channel.

So.

Yeah.

Yeah.

And honestly, I'm sure to some extent there is some truth to some of it.

However, at no point in time will I ever recommend putting straight up essential oils directly on your lady bits.

Don't do it.

At most you want to try it.

Tea tree oil.

Fine, cut it with another oil, for the love of God.

It will burn you.

It Will be very unpleasant.

Even, like, tea tree body washes sometimes are like, whoa.

Yeah.

For uppers only.

Yeah.

Buy me a drink first.

I once accidentally bought pads that were infused, I think, with tea tree oil.

Oh.

And I didn't know.

And I was like, is something wrong?

It was.

And then I looked at the packet, and I was like, who would do this?

Okay, so my favorite cycling story.

I don't know if anyone's ever heard of embracation.

So embracation is this thing that cyclists use that is either like, tea trail or capsaicin in, like, a smooth, lovely lotion.

You put it on your legs to keep your legs warm in a race.

Actually, you know what?

I think runners should really get on board with embrocation because it feels fantastic.

It doesn't actually keep your legs warm, but it makes them feel nice and warm for, like, short, hard efforts.

Unfortunately, a lot of companies make both embrication and chamois cream in very similar vessels, actually.

Oh.

It was here.

This is the best part of the story.

This venue Nittany used to so the tricks on Velodrome used to host this amazing cyclocross race.

Nittany Cross.

And I once saw a professional racer from Belgium who did not speak English, fantastically.

Who borrowed what he thought was chamois cream from a teammate, come screaming out of a porta potty because he had accidentally applied the embrocation to his undercarriage.

And there is no cure for that.

Right over there in that field.

That man.

A duvet or bidet stat.

Yes.

Yeah.

Wow.

Good times.

Good times.

Yeah.

Wow.

Wow, wow, wow.

Okay, so settle this debate.

After sweaty workout, how long is too long to sit around in your sweaty, close to the skin workout wearer?

Whether it's shorts with a pad or whether it's, you know, your yoga tights, whatever.

I feel like I'm gonna be sad with this response.

You are gonna be so.

Yeah.

I always feel really bad when I do these talks at events where there's activities going, because I'm like, oh, what I'm about to say is gonna bum everyone out.

Don't do it, Donald Duck that.

Sorry if you have to believe me on that.

But, like, you know how Donald Duck just walks around, shirt, no pants.

That's what we want to do after a workout.

Let's normalize it here.

Let's normalize it.

Obviously not around the venue.

That's weird.

But change out of those sweaty shorts as soon as you can, because back to the chafing bit.

Like I say, chafing creates These tiny little micro tears.

And as per the why our sweat smells and the microbes and the microbe poop and then some tiny little open tears in our skin.

Let's think about the combination of that.

When I started writing this book, I was, I was able to get in touch with some of my friends at Rutgers and they actually did a scraping for me of cycling shorts after a run in a petri dish.

And they let it go and they showed me the results after like 30 minutes, after an hour.

Because, like, what do bacteria love?

Warm, dark, moist.

Yeah, it's not a good situation, folks.

So get the shorts off, get something dry.

Ideally wipe stuff down.

Even if it's like with a wet, wet wipe.

I keep baby wipes in the van, like water, towel.

What?

I just clean and dry, think clean and dry.

Okay.

I can't say that I feel great about myself sitting here after the six mile run, panicking just a little.

So the pelvic floor is something that many women know about and talk about, but it's often not talked about in relation to sport.

You had a whole chapter on the pelvic floor in your book.

What role does the pelvic floor play for female athletes?

And what should we be paying attention to?

Oh, so many things, actually.

So much that just a few weeks ago we actually put out a course about pelvic floor for young female athletes, partially because so much stuff about the pelvic floor, including what I wrote in the book, is really aimed at women who've already had kids.

And this idea that like, oh, you know, after we've had kids, then we need to start worrying about the pelvic floor because then we're going to have issues potentially with leaking and, you know, the muscles not being as tight as they used to be.

But actually anyone can have issues with their pelvic floor, both from like the muscles being too loose to the muscles actually being too tight and causing, funny enough, similar issues.

And the problem is the fixes for both of those are not the same thing.

If you have a tight pelvic floor, all the Kegels in the world are just going to serve to like tighten that screw.

Whereas if you have a looser pelvic floor, then Kegels might actually be the correct answer.

So this is why I'm so glad that pelvic floor physiotherapists now exist.

Highly recommend.

Even if you don't have pelvic floor issues, go like, if you have one locally, go to them and just get like a checkup.

Check in the amount that you learn about yourself from going to one of those appointments is astounding.

Um, I cannot recommend it enough.

But, yeah, and bike and run both cause kind of different issues, actually.

Like pelvic floor.

You're probably gonna have more of, like, the tightening issues on the bike, just given how hunched over we are when we're pedaling away.

Whereas running, leaking, obviously tends to be one of the bigger ones.

Um, but, yeah, it is connected to so much stuff that it is wild.

You would never think about it because we never talk about it.

Mm.

Yeah.

All right, it's time for another brief sponsor break.

So, Molly, since writing a whole book about things that nobody wants to talk about, is there anything that still feels TMI to you?

Oh.

Oh, man.

Absolutely.

I mean, my mother would say everything in that book is still tmi and she's still mad about it.

Gotta let it go, Mom.

It's been a dozen years.

Gotta let it go.

It's out there.

Um, I guess the only thing I can really think of offhand with TMI is just this, like, constant pressure.

Actually, no.

Okay, here.

Here we go.

Here's, like, the way I can say this is like the.

Now that we're in this point of there is no more tmi, there's this push that every woman has to share every single thing, or she's, like, holding back and not, you know, living her truth or being authentic or all of that.

And I think everyone can share as much as.

Or as little as they want to, and that's okay.

I don't think every, like, professional female cyclist or runner owes everyone an explanation about their period or about their.

Their body or about this, that, or the other thing.

If they want to share, that's awesome.

But I think we've kind of hit this weird point where we now expect them to share, and we're angry when they don't give us that.

Well, then that does bring up something that we have to talk about.

Given when it is the shituation, should we say, oh, my God and hyrox.

I mean, we would be neglect if we didn't talk about that.

That's true.

I mean, okay, so my husband is not a fitness person at all.

And he texted me a screenshot of it and was like, we need to talk about this when you get back, like, from a.

Like, can you believe?

And I'm like, wow.

If it's trickled down to Jack Carney,.

Then it was very important.

Yeah.

Yeah.

So.

So, I mean, let's.

Let's though without passing any judgment on The.

The officials, the athlete, anything like.

I worry now that people are.

Think they're going to exert themselves just a little too hard and suddenly they're going to the proverbial bed.

Right.

Or the literal bed.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, I would say.

And my husband and I have also talked ad nauseam about this, as with, like, my sister, her boyfriend.

People that are very unathletic have to know all about this now.

Yeah.

You usually get at least a little bit of warning before that situation happens.

Now, I, you know, it's really hard.

I understand probably her point of view, but accidents like that.

Yes, maybe it did just like it was an explosive situation, but no athlete should be panicking that that is going to happen to them.

Um, if it hasn't happened to you yet, you're probably okay.

Uh, if you.

But if you are someone who has, like, a lot of that, like, sprint to the porta potty situation, that is a good reason to.

Okay, maybe this.

Maybe this gives you the nudge.

You need to go talk to a dietitian, a doctor, a gynecologist, pelvic floor physiothere.

So many causes for GI distress on the run.

I'm sure you've covered this in a billion different episodes and figuring out which it is, because I have to doubt that this was that athlete's first time having an issue like that.

That we should say, your pants in sport goes way back.

Right.

Yeah.

Julie Moss.

That's what I was just gonna say.

Yeah.

The first professional article I ever wrote was about irritable bowel syndrome and the triathlete.

And the final line in it was like, triathlon is the only sport where an athlete can their pants cross the finish line and be universally loved for it.

Yes.

Right.

Like, we adore Julie Moss.

Oh.

I mean.

I mean, how many years ago?

And I can immediately call forth her name, you know?

Yeah, exactly.

The hyrax thing really is primarily problematic because it's an indoor event that.

With shared equipment.

With shared equipment.

So maybe we just keep the.

Keep the pooping for the strictly individual endurance sports.

Yeah.

If we have to do it at all.

Not on carpeting.

Yeah.

With weights.

Yeah.

And machines and.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

So we want to see if any of you all have questions and open it up for a few questions for Molly.

Okay.

I'm going to be pretty specific about the TMI and saddle sores, and I don't bicycle a whole lot.

And there's a reason for it.

And I think the.

I had no idea about the underwear like, if you don't know, you don't know.

Exactly.

And so that's one of the biggest takeaways that and Cassie Nieman and her air it out when you lift.

But also applies to the bike.

Honestly, if that's a.

If saddle sores are an issue standing up on, like, getting off the saddle, even if you just hover a tiny bit and then coming back down, you're making these micro adjustments.

So the same tissue is not hitting the exact same spot.

So keep that strength training going on the bike, Will.

So the specific thing was, and I told my husband, I said, I can't go too far on a bike because I feel like my pubic hairs are like two saws going in opposite directions.

Is that because of the underwear or is there something else I need to know about?

Okay.

Okay.

Yeah.

I would say the underwear is probably the biggest part of that for sure, because the chamois in the bike shorts is such a tight knit fabric that you're not gonna have anything catching.

My other recommendation would be a little bit of chamois cream.

Look for one of the ones that's a bit more liquidy because I think the kind of, like, oils there would be really helpful.

I think mad alchemy still makes a really, just beautiful chamois cream that's very, like, silky.

So I think that would huge help.

Guarantee.

Silky sounds so much better.

Yeah.

Okay.

Come on, Pepper.

Open the floodgates.

There we go.

Yes, Sue.

So solution for Pepper?

Rip it off.

Just rip it off before you bike.

But problem after that.

Ingrown hairs and bumps.

Yeah.

Painful.

Yeah.

This is man.

Women cannot win.

Right.

Because if you leave the hair, you avoid the ingrown hair issue, but you do have a little bit more friction, right?

Because then you do have something between your skin and the shammy itself.

But then, yeah, you get rid of it.

And now you've got the ingrown hair situation, which unfortunately, like, there's no super easy cure for it.

The best thing I can say about that is, like, timing.

When you're waxing with your riding schedule, so waxing, laser shaving, any of that.

Like, just make sure that when you're doing anything that is going to be, you know, rough on the lady parts, we're doing that a couple days before we're gonna be on the ride, and it might be three or four days out, but give that tissue time to heal because again, we're back to the micro tears, the micro traumas.

So, I mean, if you're, you know, if you're Shaving the morning before you ride, like that's a hard.

Yikes.

Like you are not doing your skin any favors.

And then we get back to just basic skincare.

Exfoliation is so key for that especially.

Yeah.

With waxing, with shaving, like just making sure that you're doing the exfoliation.

Basically treat your lady area like you do the skin on your face.

As far as the exfoliation goes, that doesn't mean use like a loofah and just be like rubbing away.

Don't do that.

But think about, you know, glycolic acid.

That kind of like the gentle chemical exfoliants to, to keep everything cycling through.

So last night I. Donald ducked it.

Literally.

Yes.

Never knew that term.

Thank you for that.

I will be using that one.

It's great and hot compress and I just hung out.

I love it.

Yep, yep.

Warm compress when you're not riding and that or like when you're, when you have the time to do it and then cool compress when it's irritated.

I know plenty of like, like very high level cyclists that are training, you know, 30 hours a week or whatever and they are literally sitting on a cold bag of peas after their rides because they have no choice but to keep training through stuff like that.

So.

Other questions.

If anyone has any experience with vaginal.

Estrogen as we get older, has that seemed to help with any pain that.

You might experience on bike rides or runs or you know, whatever.

Sex.

What?

I, I'm.

We're speaking about sport now, but I'm just curious.

Okay.

In the book I should actually, now that you brought it up, I'm gonna say it in the book.

I do have a section that's about sex and it literally is just like your bike should not impact how you feel about sex.

Unless it's like, sorry, I would, you know, I would do it now, but I'd actually rather be riding my bike.

In which case like go forth and pedal.

But if you're like, oh, I can't have sex for like a week after I ride, we gotta fix something about that ride or the run.

Like this stuff is what we do for fun and it shouldn't be ruining the fun stuff in the rest of our lives.

So one question I have, I'm thinking about getting into triathlon training.

I have not a lot of experience on the bike.

So as somebody who just be going into this world, is there like a kit I should buy?

What are the, what are the basics that I need to make sure that I'm comfortable Ooh, great question.

And when I first got into triathlon, I spent the first, like, four years of training.

Training in a bathing suit.

Because when I saw professional triathletes, they raced in bathing suits.

So therefore, obviously, that's what you wear when you train.

Right.

I wouldn't know.

I looked like the dumbest person in the world.

I'd be out in, like, a T shirt and bikini.

Bikini bottoms.

Like, pedaling down 29 in Frenchtown in New Jersey.

Just, like, back and forth.

Don't do that.

Invest in a pair of bike shorts, preferably a bib short.

I. I really like Velo.

They have a great collection that's relatively inexpensive.

The core collection.

The really nice part about it is they've got bib shorts that have a zip up in the back.

So when you have a tee.

Yeah.

You do not have to take off your jersey and all of your layers.

You just unzip and pull.

See, this is why you're the expert.

It's fantastic.

And get a jersey.

Not for any reason other than you have somewhere to tuck all your stuff.

Okay.

Like, the esthetic is fine, but, like, really, it's about having a place for your snacks.

See, I hadn't even heard of bib shorts before today.

Yeah, very helpful.

Extremely helpful.

Do not try to do it in your running shorts.

That will chafe the crap out of your legs.

Thank you.

Yeah.

All right.

Well, Molly, thank you for over sharing with us today.

It's been fabulous.

Literally, anytime.

Excellent.

We'll take you up on that.

Yeah.

Yeah.

This podcast is a production of another Mother Runner and feisty Media.

And I hope everyone here listening in person and over the airwaves, considers coming to our feisty running retreat.

It is everything that was special about another Mother Runner retreat.

Morning runs, swims, pickleball instruction, aqua aerobics, yoga, karaoke, fabulous dinners.

Plus the feisty element, particularly of Celine Yeager, who many of you here with us live have gotten to soak up her knowledge and her smarts and her candor about menopausal transition and hormones.

And that is happening in fabulous Austin, Texas.

I talked to Pepper, the one who asked about the pubic hairs at Crosshairs, and that Pepper said that she signed up specifically because it was an excuse to visit Austin, Texas for the first time.

So I am in full support of that.

That's happening February 5th through 8th, 2027.

You can find all the details at live feisty.com, click on Events.

Again, it's L I V E F-E-I-S-T-Y.com and the link is always in our show notes.

Stay feisty, Sam.