Shownotes
Join Alberto Aguilar, CEO of Plantaform, as he provides a captivating and insightful perspective on the challenges and opportunities of the rapidly growing vertical farming industry. Discover the secrets to creating a successful product through constant innovation and adaptation, and explore the potential of sustainable agriculture. Aguilar's expertise extends to exciting developments like the world's first fogponic vertical farm, showcasing the forefront of industry advancements. Gain valuable insights not only on the future of sustainable agriculture but also on the importance of work-life balance for startup founders. If you're intrigued by the intersection of sustainability, agriculture, and entrepreneurship, this episode of the Vertical Farming Podcast is a must-listen.
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Key Takeaways
- Discover the secrets to creating a successful product in the rapidly growing vertical farming industry through constant innovation and adaptation.
- Uncover the challenges Plantaform faced, including over 100 iterations and determining optimal conditions for different cultivars.
- Explore the positive feedback and potential for vertical farming in the Middle East, where countries like the UAE, Qatar, and Saudi Arabia are competing to become leaders in the field.
- Learn about the groundbreaking construction of the world's first fogponic vertical farm in Quebec and its potential to produce thousands of vegetables per day.
- Gain insights into the importance of work-life balance for startup founders and how prioritizing self-care can help prevent burnout.
- Tap into Alberto’s serious and insightful perspective on the challenges and opportunities of the rapidly growing vertical farming industry.
- Get a glimpse into the future of sustainable agriculture and the exciting potential of vertical farming.
Tweetable Quotes
“I don't think it's ever a waste of time or a wasted opportunity, regardless of where it could be. We've made so many connections (at Indoor AgCon) that I was not expecting, and it's just about finding like minded people on the same floor right. That you never know what doors it can open up. So, honestly, the more trade shows we go to, I feel like the more opportunities rise.”
“And it's super cool because rather than doing the outbound calls, we're getting a lot of inbound requests from restaurant owners saying that we've seen this in television, we've seen this in these restaurants. We want to have the exact same thing, and everyone want to spend more money on herbs. This is fantastic.”
Resources Mentioned
Alberto's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/alberto-aguilar-a2138aa4/
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/plantaform/
Twitter: https://twitter.com/PlantaformCA
Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/plantaform
YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@plantaform
Website: https://plantaform.com/
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Mentioned in this episode:
2025 Precision Ag Report by iGrowNews
2025 Precision Ag Report by iGrowNews
Transcripts
$680 million poured into precision ag last year.
Speaker:Autonomous weeding robots dominated, and John Deere made 2 acquisitions in 3
Speaker:months. A food company, not an equipment maker, bought a
Speaker:robotics startup to protect its own supply chain. The deals are
Speaker:accelerating, the money is moving, and the winners are already separating from the
Speaker:pack. If you're investing, building, or buying in this space,
Speaker:you need the full picture before your competitors get it. The 2025
Speaker:Precision Agriculture Intelligence Report From iGrow News is now
Speaker:available. Get your copy today at
Speaker:igrownews.com/precision. If you are starting a vertical
Speaker:farm and don't know where to begin or which technology would suit your needs,
Speaker:then reach out to the experts at Cultivated. As indoor farm brokers, they
Speaker:help connect you to the right technology and ensure your project is successful.
Speaker:Best of all, their service is free because they work on behalf of their partners.
Speaker:Visit cultivated.com to learn more. And that's spelled
Speaker:C-U-L-T-I-V-A-T-D.com,
Speaker:or click the link in the show notes. If I could go back and do
Speaker:things differently, I would do many, many things differently. But I had a
Speaker:very big assumption that it'd be a lot easier to just figure out the conditions
Speaker:for different types of seeds and different types of cultivars that they're growing. We
Speaker:mainly focus a lot on organic, non-GMO-based
Speaker:seeds that we can use in our device. So that's been a bit of a
Speaker:challenge, mainly just finding the right amount of supplies. There was a lot of supply
Speaker:issues actually when it came to seeds.
Speaker:Welcome to the Vertical Farming Podcast, weekly conversations with
Speaker:fascinating CEOs, founders, and agtech visionaries.
Speaker:Join us every week as we dive deep into the world of vertical
Speaker:farming with your host, Harry Duran. Vertical Farming
Speaker:Podcast Season 8 is ongoing,
Speaker:underway, and in motion. No signs of slowing down.
Speaker:Regular listeners to the show, welcome back, and thank you so much for investing the
Speaker:time and energy it takes to listen to these
Speaker:episodes. I hope you're getting a lot out of them. I thoroughly
Speaker:enjoy these conversations, as you can sometimes tell from my excitement
Speaker:during these interviews, and I really appreciate you sharing your
Speaker:insights, sharing your feedback, emailing me, contacting me through the social
Speaker:channels about the impact it's having on you. And how
Speaker:you're being educated on everything that's happening in this space, and also learning a bit
Speaker:more about some of these fantastic CEOs, founders, and luminaries from
Speaker:the world of vertical farming, which really gets us excited.
Speaker:Everyone, everyone that's involved about the opportunities and the possibilities
Speaker:for the future. And I still feel we're in our early, early days.
Speaker:And I'm so grateful that I've had the opportunity to be on this journey with
Speaker:you for the past 3 years. If you are new to this show, thank you
Speaker:so much for investing your time and taking a chance on this show. I hope
Speaker:you become a regular listener as well. In case you missed last
Speaker:week's episode, we had a great conversation with Alaric Overbay.
Speaker:He's the director of Green Side Up Farm, and we talked about the transformative
Speaker:potential of vertical farming in addressing food security issues in underserved communities.
Speaker:Regular listeners will know that this is a topic that's near and dear to my
Speaker:heart. We talked about the work he's doing in Las Vegas, the
Speaker:tour they took us on of the food deserts, and the work that they're doing
Speaker:now in partnership with Harvests. I saw that Ali Daniely is
Speaker:A previous guest on the show posted something on LinkedIn recently, so
Speaker:I'll be sure to show you some of the work that they're doing. They've got,
Speaker:I believe, 5 container farms on site, and this was
Speaker:after the tour. So it's so great to see something in
Speaker:motion happening, partnerships happening, and good work
Speaker:being done for communities, which is something I really enjoy. This week
Speaker:we have the pleasure of speaking with Alberto Aguilar. He's the CEO of Plantaform.
Speaker:In this conversation, Alberto provides a captivating and insightful perspective
Speaker:on the challenges and opportunities of a rapidly
Speaker:growing CEA business. They've had a lot of
Speaker:success with their in-home farms, and in this conversation,
Speaker:you'll learn a little bit about the secrets to creating a successful product
Speaker:through constant innovation and adaptation. Together with his team, they're working
Speaker:on creating the world's first fogponic vertical farm. I'm excited to
Speaker:share this episode with you. You're gonna hear valuable insights, not only on the future
Speaker:of sustainable agriculture, but also on the importance of work-life
Speaker:balance for startup founders, which is a topic that's been coming up a lot lately.
Speaker:As a reminder, if you're enjoying this episode or past episodes, I would really love
Speaker:it if you leave a rating and a review at ratethispodcast.com/vfp.
Speaker:Nothing pleases me more than to read those out on a future episode. Also
Speaker:remember that these episodes are always chock-full of great takeaways, and as a listener,
Speaker:I want you to focus all your energy on our conversation. Rest assured, you can
Speaker:always visit verticalfarmingpodcast.com at any time to read the full show
Speaker:notes for each episode, which includes guest links as well. Thought it might be helpful
Speaker:to give you a quick peek into my world lately. Things have been quite hectic
Speaker:as I've been on a men's retreat a
Speaker:couple of weeks ago in Brennan, Washington. First time to that part of the country.
Speaker:We were at Camp Parsons and engaged with a group of
Speaker:about probably 30 other men. Men and
Speaker:did a lot of work, some of it challenging, some
Speaker:of it pushing me to my limits. And it was a group with a group
Speaker:called Sacred Sons, which if you're into that type of stuff, I highly
Speaker:encourage you to take a look at their website, sacredsons.com.
Speaker:Additionally, just after returning from that trip, I also had to continue
Speaker:packing and moving as my partner and I were moving
Speaker:still in Minnesota to somewhere just outside Minneapolis To
Speaker:another location temporarily. Still a lot involved—
Speaker:packing, deciding what to keep, moving boxes. It was about
Speaker:a week's worth of back and forth coordinating with a
Speaker:moving truck. As you might know, as anyone knows who's done this before, it's one
Speaker:of the most stressful events on the list of most stressful events in a person's
Speaker:life. And so it definitely pushes you to your limit. So had to
Speaker:deal with all that. Seasonal allergies kicking in. So
Speaker:really the last 2 weeks have been pretty crazy for me. And so I'm really
Speaker:grateful to now be settled into this new space and hopefully
Speaker:get some new conversations going in this space, upcoming
Speaker:interviews I have scheduled. And so it's been exciting for me,
Speaker:a reminder that things are always in motion and always to sort of slow
Speaker:down when you can take the opportunity to do so. And the last 2 weeks
Speaker:were a lot of back and forth movement for me in my personal life,
Speaker:in my personal growth as well, which is helpful for me at all
Speaker:times. I always want to make sure I'm continuously growing and developing
Speaker:myself. But that's been top of mind for me, and I'm grateful to
Speaker:slow down and share these few moments with you and help you every
Speaker:once in a while get a peek into my personal life so that you know
Speaker:there's a real person on the other side of this mic. And it's a lot
Speaker:of work to keep all these things in motion in addition to the work we
Speaker:do at Fullcast, our podcast production agency. So
Speaker:excited for the upcoming interviews and also for some projects we're
Speaker:working on. We're in development of a few
Speaker:show ideas, and so we are always on the lookout for
Speaker:folks who are interested in possibly being a host for some of these new
Speaker:projects, if that's of interest to you, and also sponsorship opportunities.
Speaker:The high-level themes are going to be conversations with funders
Speaker:in the space, tentatively titled AgTech Deal Flow,
Speaker:so expect more on that later. And we're also
Speaker:exploring the opportunity to do a show that provides a deeper
Speaker:dive into the successes and failures of some of the recent vertical farms
Speaker:in this space. So if any of those topics resonates with you and you wanted
Speaker:to talk further with me about it, by all means, anytime, reach out,
Speaker:[email protected]. Okay, before we jump into this
Speaker:uninterrupted conversation with Alberto, here are a few words from the folks that
Speaker:support this show. This year, Vertifarm takes place from September
Speaker:26th through September 28th at the Exhibition Center in
Speaker:Dortmund, Germany. For those new to Vertifarm, it's the most significant
Speaker:trade fair for next-level farming and new food systems. Their international
Speaker:platform is set to showcase the latest developments in innovative
Speaker:controlled production systems for vegetables, salad crops, herbs, and
Speaker:microgreens, as well as sustainable fish, insect breeding, fruit
Speaker:cultivation, and medicinal plants. Vertifarm is shaping the future of
Speaker:vertical farming and new food systems. Reserve your ticket and learn more
Speaker:at vertifarm.de. That's
Speaker:V-E-R-T-I-F-A-R-M dot D-E. When
Speaker:registering for the show, don't forget to use the promo code for
Speaker:listeners VFPODCAST23. That's VFPODCAST23,
Speaker:and you can enter that in the access code section when securing your ticket.
Speaker:This year, Indoor AgTech is coming to New York City's Times Square, and it's bringing
Speaker:together the world's leading growers, retailers, tech providers, seed
Speaker:companies, and investors. Join us from June 29th to June 30th
Speaker:to meet, expand networks, and produce fruitful partnerships.
Speaker:The team has been gracious enough to provide listeners of this show with an additional
Speaker:10% off of the registration. Simply use promo code
Speaker:VFP when you register and lock that in. And by the way, if you're on
Speaker:the fence, remember that early bird discount ends on May 11th.
Speaker:After a pivotal year for CEA, the summit will explore what's needed to ensure
Speaker:the industry can continue innovating and growing into a crucial part of the
Speaker:global agri-food supply chain. Alberto Aguilar,
Speaker:Co-founder and CEO of Plantaform. Thank you so much for joining me
Speaker:on the Vertical Farming Podcast. Thanks for having me on the show, Gary.
Speaker:Yeah, so we got connected through Cultivated, who
Speaker:regular listeners will know very well, but we met briefly at
Speaker:Indoor AgCon, right? And so Indoor AgCon,
Speaker:what number conference was that for you this year? That should have
Speaker:been— I think it's straight through number 3 or 4. Wow. And
Speaker:how many are you up to now? We're late March of
Speaker:2023. We had, I think we had 3 more
Speaker:after that. So now we're in round number 6. It's been a busy year.
Speaker:Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. How did you get connected with the Cultivator team? So
Speaker:Eric actually reached out to us around 2 years ago and he came by our
Speaker:office as they were mainly specializing on reselling indoor
Speaker:gardens. Yeah. And we stayed connected ever since. We
Speaker:became closer buddies. And then he just gave me a ring actually the week
Speaker:before Indoor AgCon happened in Vegas and told me, hey,
Speaker:you should actually be here right now. Booked the flight right away and met him
Speaker:the week after. What was your opinion of it? That was my second time. And
Speaker:it was actually last year was my very first indoor
Speaker:farming conference. So that was like my introduction into the world of indoor farming. And
Speaker:then I built up a good relationship with Suzanne and the team
Speaker:there. So, and it looks like they doubled in size. I'm wondering what your experience
Speaker:was like. I think it was super cool. I mean, there's companies from all around
Speaker:the world. We had some companies all the way from China to like New Zealand.
Speaker:It was Holland. Yeah, there was some from Holland as well. It was pretty crazy.
Speaker:Got to see a lot of the latest innovation in the industry and connected with
Speaker:a lot of other leaders in the industry. So overall, I mean, it was an
Speaker:incredibly fruitful event for sure. Yeah. So how do you
Speaker:think about from a marketing perspective in terms of best use of your
Speaker:time? There's no shortage of conferences and even just from what I see
Speaker:coming into my inbox, Especially with indoor farming, it's global. I mean,
Speaker:at this point I'm getting notices about stuff happening in Africa and
Speaker:India, and obviously all the, you know, Dubai, Abu
Speaker:Dhabi. It's so you could essentially be on a plane
Speaker:nonstop throughout the year. So I'm curious how you think about where are the
Speaker:best opportunities for you and for Plantiform. I don't think it's ever a waste
Speaker:of time or a wasted opportunity regardless of where it could be. We've
Speaker:made so many connections in Vegas that I was not expecting. And it's
Speaker:just about finding like-minded people on the same floor,
Speaker:right? That, yeah, you never know what doors it can open up. So
Speaker:honestly, I mean, the more trade shows we go to, I feel like the more
Speaker:opportunities rise. And is it mainly you making the
Speaker:rounds or have you split it up with the team? We all tend to go
Speaker:together. 2 of the co-founders, we tend to go to the trade shows along our
Speaker:sales and marketing team. Yeah. But now that the team's getting bigger, we're gonna start
Speaker:dividing and trying to tap 2 shows at the same time if they're matching the
Speaker:same weekend. Okay. And where's home and headquarters for you now?
Speaker:We're based in Gatineau, so right here in the capital region of Canada. Not many
Speaker:people know what Gatineau is, so I tend to tell them, hey, it's just Ottawa
Speaker:but just across the border. Okay. And what— and you grew up there?
Speaker:I actually grew up in Spain. I'm originally from Barcelona, so I spent most of
Speaker:my life growing up there and was fortunate enough to be able to move around
Speaker:and lived in countries like Dubai, Indonesia, and now here in Canada.
Speaker:Yeah. What was life like growing up in Spain? What are some fond memories of
Speaker:that? Oh, pretty much everything. Let's
Speaker:start with the weather. It is warm weather year-round.
Speaker:Yeah, at the beach every single day. So I
Speaker:mean, actually one of my favorite memories was probably growing up in our
Speaker:home where we had a gigantic garden and we're able to like grow
Speaker:any type of vegetables and fruits year-round. You know, we're quite limited here
Speaker:in Canada with our gardening season. So I kind of miss that. What
Speaker:part of Spain? Barcelona. Barcelona. Yeah, I've been to Barcelona and
Speaker:Madrid as well. Nice. Yeah. What were your best memories of
Speaker:Barcelona? The food.
Speaker:Yeah, the food, the music,
Speaker:the culture. I'm Salvadorian. I was born in El Salvador. And so
Speaker:we've done some like lineage history and I've talked to my dad a little bit.
Speaker:I have a feeling that there's some lineage of mine that goes back to
Speaker:Spain, just because of the— what's interesting is like, if I go to El Salvador,
Speaker:like, I don't look like a lot of like Salvadorans.
Speaker:And, you know, people keep, you know, always think that I'm more like European.
Speaker:I've been like asked if I was ever— I've been everything from like Greek
Speaker:to Armenian to Italian to Spanish. It's just
Speaker:like— and I'm sure maybe you do too. I mean, you have one of those
Speaker:looks, you know, like that people could mistake you for a bunch of different cultures
Speaker:as well. All the time. And I feel like South America is very blended,
Speaker:right? Yeah, my mom was actually— well, she's actually Indonesian, the
Speaker:Asian appearance. And a lot of people are either like Filipino
Speaker:or Spanish, South American, all kind of like different
Speaker:nationalities as well. So I guess we're both on the same page there. What brought
Speaker:you to Canada? Studies. I had a big opportunity when I was in
Speaker:Dubai to choose to either go to university back in Spain or come
Speaker:here to Canada, and I wanted a new adventure. So I came here in
Speaker:2014 and stayed ever since. Okay. What are
Speaker:your thoughts on Dubai? I was there recently again partnering with Cultivated, but we were
Speaker:there for AgraMe and probably going to be back again this year. I'm just
Speaker:curious, you ended up there and what your thoughts of it were back
Speaker:then. I loved it. I mean, I moved to Dubai mainly to reunite
Speaker:myself with my mom and to play soccer. So I was playing soccer there at
Speaker:more of a competitive level and then lived there for around 2 and
Speaker:a half years. I think it was fantastic. It's such an
Speaker:extravagant world where it's all about the bigger, the
Speaker:better, right? You kind of see new things pop up every single
Speaker:week, so you never get bored of the city. Yeah, it's an interesting city, and
Speaker:extravagant is probably the right word. It's
Speaker:probably one of the most expensive malls in the world, and there's so much
Speaker:money and opulence there. It's interesting to see how they've shifted
Speaker:in terms of their focus, especially now we're talking about indoor
Speaker:farming, right? Because there was like an aha moment with COVID
Speaker:about the fact that 95+% of their food gets imported.
Speaker:And I think it was a bit of a wake-up call. I don't know if
Speaker:you maybe saw as much back then, but definitely now when I did see, obviously
Speaker:the interest has peaked a lot since the last couple of years.
Speaker:There's always been an interest there. I think it was mainly about
Speaker:positioning and planning appropriately how to build those vertical farms
Speaker:back in 2012. When I was there, they were talking about this
Speaker:big green city in the middle of the desert that was gonna be inside of
Speaker:a biodome and everything was gonna be sustainable. I'm not sure how that's going on
Speaker:right now, but they've invested billions of dollars in vertical farms in the middle of
Speaker:the desert, right? Let it be vertical farms, container farms, such a
Speaker:wide variety of options. But have you noticed how, like, between the UAE,
Speaker:Qatar, and Saudi, now they're all kind of competing to be the
Speaker:lead in vertical farming? And most of that was actually—
Speaker:established, mainly in Northern Europe and North America. So like, it's pretty bizarre
Speaker:to see that like the MENA region is now pushing to be the leaders in
Speaker:vertical farming. Yeah, and the interesting thing there is they've got the money to try
Speaker:a little, you know, a bunch of experiments, a bunch of projects.
Speaker:AeroFarms just opened up, launched a new farm there. It was in Abu
Speaker:Dhabi recently. And so yeah, I just see a lot of activity happening.
Speaker:It'll be interesting to go back again this year and see how much more interest
Speaker:there is because Neom, I think, is the new city that's being planned
Speaker:in Dubai. So I think there's, it's interesting to
Speaker:see because I think what that does is also moves the speed of innovation
Speaker:because there's companies trying to meet that specific need that they have out there. You
Speaker:know, completely different need. You know, you're seeing the whole range of whether people are
Speaker:doing something like you're doing at the consumer level or
Speaker:at the huge multi-thousand acre level. in
Speaker:complete, very hostile environments for growing. So it's
Speaker:interesting to see how people are innovating to meet those needs. Yeah,
Speaker:actually, talking about that, I think the MENA region might be probably the
Speaker:best R&D hub of the world right now, right? You
Speaker:mentioned funding, which they have very deep pockets to invest in projects that might
Speaker:fail or might succeed. It doesn't seem like they care much if it fails as
Speaker:long as they're trying. And they're attracting lots of great talent worldwide. As you
Speaker:said, AeroFarms invested like, I think it was $1.2 billion, a little bit more,
Speaker:on building a facility in Abu Dhabi. And Emirates as well are
Speaker:building their own facility or indoor growing facility to supply
Speaker:all the food instead of the airplanes. So like, it's incredible the
Speaker:amount of progression that the country is making. And you mentioned it earlier, right?
Speaker:95% of the produce is being imported. So like, right on, that's the step to
Speaker:do it, to promote sustainability and start depending more on their local
Speaker:economy. Yeah. And so I'm curious, as you were
Speaker:wrapping up your university studies, I get the sense from the company
Speaker:you started probably while you're still in college that you've always
Speaker:had like an entrepreneurial streak in you. And is that something that always—
Speaker:something that you have even before college? Do you think you're gonna start your own
Speaker:business? I mean, growing up in Spain, you know, we had a— the
Speaker:economy got a big crash after 2008, so I was always
Speaker:showing initiatives to make some extra cash on the side with side hustles, whatever I
Speaker:could do. And then when I came to Canada, I actually started my first startup
Speaker:on my second year called Your Dorm, which, you know, was a cool gig. It
Speaker:was my first steps into entrepreneurship. Then 3 years later, I sold the
Speaker:company to a local property management and started a corporate relocation
Speaker:agency, which was, you know, I had more experience. It was a lot more fun.
Speaker:We got some funding going and then COVID killed it. COVID absolutely
Speaker:killed my startup like many others out there. And that was a wake-up
Speaker:call to start something fresh, to start something that maybe would make a bigger
Speaker:impact. So that was around my 4th year in university
Speaker:when I decided to start Plantaform. It was probably the best opportunity
Speaker:to start a company like this. Where did the idea come from?
Speaker:The idea actually came from my partner. His name is Kiel. We actually met in
Speaker:high school in Dubai. We were best buddies back then, and he
Speaker:moved to Australia in his 4th year, his thesis was
Speaker:all about this smart indoor gardening system using
Speaker:aquaponics technology, which I was so caught off guard when
Speaker:he came up with that project to me. And I loved it, fell in love
Speaker:with it immediately. It was using new technology from NASA that he just found an
Speaker:article online about it. And food sustainability has always
Speaker:been something that I've been a big advocate about since I lived in Dubai. As
Speaker:I mentioned earlier, I grew up in Spain mainly doing gardening throughout my entire
Speaker:childhood. That was something I was really missing and I felt like I lost touch
Speaker:with. So when Kiwa came up with me— to me with this idea, I
Speaker:was like, man, let's turn this into a business. I know it's a thesis, but
Speaker:like, I feel like we can help lots of people and promote this new
Speaker:technology, which can essentially scale to a bigger impact when it comes
Speaker:to food production. So the end of 2019 is when we started talking
Speaker:about it. And if you remember, March of 2020 is
Speaker:when You know, everyone just— Oh yeah. Panicked about COVID and
Speaker:all the borders just shut and the world just did a full upside
Speaker:down. So, that was actually when COVID killed my
Speaker:business and I decided to just move full-time onto the platform with
Speaker:Kiwa. And we said like, you know what, this is a
Speaker:chance, like a one-in-a-lifetime chance to fully
Speaker:focus on this. We don't have any social life right now, nobody's going out,
Speaker:everyone's staying at home, we might as well use this time and be obsessed by
Speaker:making this product happen. And that was actually the birth of Plantaform. And
Speaker:we incorporated in May of 2020, and ever since we've just
Speaker:been grinding it out throughout all the lockdowns and pandemics. Doesn't
Speaker:matter what happened, we just made this entire company happen. What's interesting
Speaker:is that this podcast actually started in March of 2020 as
Speaker:well. I've told that story often. I was— I had the idea, I
Speaker:got the socials going, and I own a podcast production agency, so We
Speaker:know how to produce shows. I've got another show that I've hosted for 8
Speaker:years. I've done long-form interviews. So I had all the pieces. And then I was
Speaker:lining up. I lined up by David Farkar from IGS as one of my early
Speaker:interviews. But it was lockdown. And I've told this story a couple of times. But
Speaker:I said, hey, do you still want to do this? He's like, yeah, let's do
Speaker:it. And he was probably in his kid's bedroom. And
Speaker:it was just an interesting— it was a special time because it's
Speaker:like the world got a little closer. People were more empathetic
Speaker:and genuine, and, you know, we all kind of were going through this thing together.
Speaker:So it's definitely an interesting time. We'll likely
Speaker:never experience anything like that in our lifetimes ever again. So it's interesting to say
Speaker:that we've been through that experience. 100%.
Speaker:Yeah. I'm curious how that colored your
Speaker:decision-making, because obviously the big thing to think about during
Speaker:that time was the impact on supply chains, the awareness of
Speaker:people's access to fresh foods, food deserts, you know, like all these things were coming
Speaker:into place, and I'm sure You know, in hindsight, it looks like, wow, we made
Speaker:the right choice. We jumped into the right thing at the right time. But as
Speaker:we were getting deeper and deeper into the pandemic, how did that color
Speaker:the decisions you make about where you wanted to take the business? I
Speaker:think it lightened up the path a lot better. When we started, I mean,
Speaker:we faced lots of challenges when it came to supply chain. As you mentioned, we
Speaker:were getting supply parts from China and overseas to test with
Speaker:prototype. Any local stores that we could use or businesses to
Speaker:collaborate with would just close. So we really had to figure everything out from
Speaker:the beginning. We started with some 3D printers, printing in our own homes.
Speaker:It was in Australia, so imagine we're doing video calls every single day.
Speaker:Wow. Time zones. And then we started assembling a remote
Speaker:team where we've never even met in person. So it was very
Speaker:interesting. Now, how did that impact our decision-making?
Speaker:As we progressed with the prototypes of the first smart indoor garden that we
Speaker:designed, it just became more clear that there was a
Speaker:demand for this type of products. And there's lots of competitors that were
Speaker:established in around 2016, 2017 that have been in the market
Speaker:for a while. So we kind of had to focus on a new value
Speaker:proposition, right? It had to be— the functionality had to be more enhanced,
Speaker:it had to have a better design, and the technology was sexy.
Speaker:It's this, you know, Ponics essentially, it's a new aeroponic type of system
Speaker:where irrigation system that used an ultrasonic
Speaker:atomizer to vaporize the water into these tiny microns that allows
Speaker:the roots to be able to absorb the water, the nutrients, and the oxygen more
Speaker:efficiently, which it seemed like it came out of like a sci-fi
Speaker:movie. And then we took over that and then, yeah, I mean,
Speaker:we decided to test it for many, many months. It
Speaker:didn't essentially go the way we wanted it at first, and it was very
Speaker:tough to like find the right people to help us with this technology. But as
Speaker:you said, people were very empathetic. So we start reaching out to the Canadian National
Speaker:Research Council, university professors in the agritech
Speaker:industry, and everyone was super helpful. As you said, it was
Speaker:a period of time where everyone just decided to leave their egos on the
Speaker:side or any type of doubts on the side and would do anything to help
Speaker:another startup, or in this case, young entrepreneurs, to build something good for the
Speaker:world. So after receiving so much support and openness to
Speaker:development of the product, we decided that, you know what, this is definitely the right
Speaker:decision. Let's go raise some more capital. And then, you know, after— once
Speaker:the pandemic started to calm down, the product was nearly done. We had enough
Speaker:traction, enough investments to move the company forward. But
Speaker:then the fact that people were lining up in front of the
Speaker:supermarkets to just get their groceries and were limited in what they could get
Speaker:just opened our eyes. We have to launch this as soon as possible
Speaker:before things even calm down again. But with that came another line of
Speaker:problems. Supply chain. Again, we have to manufacture everything here locally.
Speaker:We actually have a factory out of Montreal where we do all of our plastic
Speaker:injection molding. A lot of the electronics are supplied from here in Ottawa.
Speaker:And now that the supply chain's calmed down, we still believe that it was the
Speaker:right choice. This is a 100% local, made-in-Canada product. The
Speaker:Canadian population has really, really welcomed us when it came to
Speaker:the development of this product being local. And a lot of people really are buying
Speaker:the product just because they know this has been made in Canadian soil. So overall,
Speaker:I think everything was meant to be the way it has been, and we did
Speaker:grab that opportunity and made the best out of it while it lasted.
Speaker:That's an awesome story. So for the benefit of the listener who is not
Speaker:familiar with Plantiform, do you want to talk a little bit about what the product—
Speaker:current product offering is, who the audience is, and, you know,
Speaker:how you're delivering, and essentially kind of the whole story?
Speaker:about who the audience is for this? Yeah, of course. So we
Speaker:created the Rejuvenate, which is the world's first smart indoor garden using
Speaker:this aquaponics technology. We got inspired by Nespresso since
Speaker:you can grow up to 15 plants at a time using the smart pots that
Speaker:the seeds are already inside of them. To make it work, you simply add the
Speaker:pots into the system, you add some water nutrients, and with a click of a
Speaker:button, it'll grow all your vegetables year-round. Unlike the typical
Speaker:pH water smart indoor gardens, This one actually lasts up to 3 weeks without having
Speaker:to add water. It is fully self-autonomous to the point that it controls your
Speaker:watering, your nutrients, the lighting wavelengths can change depending on the cultivar
Speaker:that you're growing, and even the temperature inside can be controlled. It was
Speaker:a very big factor for us because in Canada a lot of people do leave
Speaker:their devices or their indoor gardens in their basement or near a window where it
Speaker:gets very cold and affects the plant growth. So we're actually able to
Speaker:control that controlled environment inside of the system. Through some
Speaker:sensors that we put around the device. Now, our audience— essentially, this
Speaker:is catered to those garden lovers, food fanatics,
Speaker:and essentially people with a good interior design taste that just want to add that
Speaker:living piece of furniture aspect inside of any space. We've had
Speaker:a large variety of customers ranging from the B2C aspect, which are those
Speaker:3 categories mentioned earlier, all the way to like actual
Speaker:large corporations who are buying them for that ESG approach We have
Speaker:retirement homes that bought many of them for their amenities. And
Speaker:right now we have lots of restaurant chains who are buying them purely to grow
Speaker:herbs. Like, they don't care about the leafy greens, they don't care about the edible
Speaker:flowers, they mainly grow herbs just because that way they'll never go bad and there's
Speaker:no food waste in the process. Yeah. And it's been super cool because rather than
Speaker:doing the outbound calls, we're getting a lot of inbound requests from
Speaker:restaurant owners saying that we've seen this on television, we've seen this in these restaurants,
Speaker:we want to have the exact same thing, I never want to spend more money
Speaker:on herbs. This is fantastic. And they're using it for their bar and
Speaker:their certain dishes that use maybe cilantro and basil, which has been
Speaker:incredibly fascinating to see that there was other usage to it
Speaker:besides the target audience that we're focusing on. When you start to deal with that
Speaker:range of people who have an interest in the product, how do you
Speaker:think about making something that meets all their needs? Or are you getting
Speaker:enough feedback so you can make the product itself
Speaker:Versatile or customizable itself? You know, because you mentioned
Speaker:the restaurants will focus on the herbs, you know, maybe people who want it in
Speaker:their home are in fact doing the leafy greens. You have us, and you talk
Speaker:about the pods as well. So do you have, I imagine you've given some thought
Speaker:into having people pick and choose essentially to what works best for
Speaker:them in their environment? Absolutely. I mean, I'm assuming most people
Speaker:don't want to grow the exact
Speaker:same produce all the time. So we have these different pod varieties multiple different types
Speaker:of pods in them. They can grow like, let's say, a bunch of leafy greens,
Speaker:a bunch of herbs, different types of edible flowers. Now we're coming up with
Speaker:more of the cherry tomatoes and strawberry packs. But the very cool thing
Speaker:is that because the device is fully customizable
Speaker:due to that controlled environment, the user doesn't have to
Speaker:manually change any of the conditions. The Plant Pots have this QR code
Speaker:that through the app you can just scan the QR code, put the pods, the
Speaker:device recognizes what you're growing and sets the optimal conditions through the different
Speaker:stages of the plant growth to make sure that your plants are growing optimally
Speaker:and that they're essentially prompted to success. Can you
Speaker:grow multiple varieties of crops within the unit? Is it
Speaker:smart enough to recognize that you have different pods in there, or is it better
Speaker:if you have, you know, a selection of the same type of pod? There's parameters
Speaker:in between what you can grow. Certain cultivars require different conditions like
Speaker:temperature, nutrient values, so the app will allow you
Speaker:to like say say you can mix and match certain pots in there, but
Speaker:something just goes outside of that parameter, it just will
Speaker:just show red. So it won't allow people to grow at the same time.
Speaker:Okay. The cool thing as well is we have these empty pots that people can
Speaker:use their own seeds, and then they go in the app with a library of
Speaker:all the different seeds and pots you can grow so they can save.
Speaker:Someone was actually— they contacted us a couple weeks ago that they were testing baby
Speaker:cucumbers. I was like, man, that's great. I mean, once you figure that out, please
Speaker:send me the information so We can figure out how to put that into the
Speaker:system. But they manually went on the app and set their own conditions,
Speaker:which allowed them to grow those baby cucumbers. And the plant outgrew
Speaker:the device a little bit. Yeah. But it worked. So it's pretty cool that, you
Speaker:know, we have an audience, a DIY audience, that they tend to test
Speaker:different plant cultivars, and we can receive that data to see what works
Speaker:and what doesn't work and work with them to be able to launch new pod
Speaker:packs every season. So it's kind of like a feedback loop and a relationship
Speaker:with our customers to be able to improve and launch new products based on their
Speaker:own test cases. That's great to hear, especially that DIY
Speaker:ethos. It's almost— you think back to like the early computer days and, you
Speaker:know, you hear those early stories of like Steve Jobs and, you know, how they
Speaker:would meet in the garage and like HP and like tinker with all the electronics.
Speaker:And it sounds like, you know, there's always going to be— every generation has the
Speaker:people that if you give them things to play with, And if they have
Speaker:that DIY ethos, I think they're doing some of the R&D for
Speaker:you. Yeah, exactly. No, it's been super helpful. I think
Speaker:it just shows that, uh, maintaining the closest relationship with your clients
Speaker:at the end of the day is the most important thing since they are the
Speaker:ones who are going to build your business. How much of a learning curve has
Speaker:it been for you when you talk about, you know, cultivars, you talk about
Speaker:seeds, talk about pods, you know, all this different technology, even the whole
Speaker:world of seeds? I've had a couple conversations with folks, you know,
Speaker:specifically for the needs that you have, not only in an indoor
Speaker:farming environment, but even in your case, just like an even more micro environment, which
Speaker:is like a desktop environment. And how much of a learning curve has that
Speaker:been for you? And what have you had to learn about
Speaker:the whole world of seeds? Everything. I mean, if I could go back and do
Speaker:things differently, I would do many, many things differently. But I had a
Speaker:very big assumption that it'd be a lot easier to just figure out the conditions
Speaker:for different types of seeds and different types of cultivars that they're growing. We
Speaker:mainly focus a lot on organic, non-GMO-based
Speaker:seeds that we can use on our device. So that's been a bit of a
Speaker:challenge, mainly to find the right amount of supplies. There was a lot of supply
Speaker:issues, actually, when it came to seeds as well. So partnering up with the right
Speaker:supplier that can promote the quality of these seeds and make sure that your
Speaker:germination is correct, And then figuring out a lot of trial
Speaker:and error in our systems to see what would work and what would not
Speaker:has taken a lot longer than we expected. So if I would've done things
Speaker:differently, for sure I would've partnered up with other organizations a lot
Speaker:sooner to see if any of these systems, or if they could trial
Speaker:our systems with different cultivars, and they could essentially narrow down which would be the
Speaker:best plants to grow. But since we're using aquaponics, there
Speaker:was no research out there on what works best and what didn't. So it has
Speaker:been a learning curve from the first seed to the ones that we're still testing
Speaker:today. And unfortunately, we can't just grab the conditions
Speaker:that would grow well in the hydroponic system and assume that they would work the
Speaker:same way in a, in a aquaponics system. So we're kind of building our
Speaker:own database now and articles when it comes to the different
Speaker:conditions for the seeds that we're testing. I'm curious about the form
Speaker:factor because it is like a beautiful unit and It's different
Speaker:than a lot of the form factors that you see for the in-home units because
Speaker:there's typically a standard look and feel, more of a cabinet feel
Speaker:or an under-the-counter. There's a couple of different— or a tower,
Speaker:I think, is a couple of different models. How much— you obviously gave it a
Speaker:lot of thought. And it's probably conversations you've had with your co-founder. But I'm
Speaker:curious how many iterations you went through. And how did you end
Speaker:up at this final form factor? And why was that important?
Speaker:We've gone through at least 100 different iterations, not even
Speaker:exaggerating that number. You know, first of all, we wanted to make something
Speaker:very different from what there's in the industry, so design played a huge factor
Speaker:here. And then we pretty much interviewed many of the
Speaker:clients from our competitors. We actually went onto their Google reviews
Speaker:and started looking at some people commenting and just emailed them directly and said, hey,
Speaker:do you have a good 30-minute call so I can just ask you a couple
Speaker:questions about your experience. And we grabbed all the good
Speaker:feedback from those devices, but then focused a lot on the negative stuff.
Speaker:And, you know, size has always been a problem for a lot of people. These
Speaker:tower gardens are incredibly high. Yeah. It works for many who are trying to be
Speaker:more self-sustainable, yet for many others, they realize that it does take up a lot
Speaker:of space in their home. Yet, the smaller counter units
Speaker:are perfect to put on your kitchen counter, and they only grow
Speaker:3 to plants at a time, which didn't make it effective enough to put in
Speaker:the efforts to grow that amount of produce. So we wanted to find a little
Speaker:bit of an in-between when it came to the number of plants they can grow,
Speaker:the size of the system, and then the lighting was actually not a big
Speaker:problem. You know, a lot of the systems are very bright, they're intrusive into your
Speaker:household, especially the ones that are kind of like hanging outside of the
Speaker:system. So we wanted to make it integrated with the design,
Speaker:and then we have this very cool tinted magnetic windows that besides
Speaker:from protecting the produce from your pets, let's say, it actually
Speaker:blocks a lot of the light from entering your home. Okay. I mentioned earlier it
Speaker:serves as a living piece of furniture. So it's very cool. So a lot of
Speaker:our clients are actually using it as a lamp. They have it in their living
Speaker:room next to their couch. At nighttime, let's say they put on some Netflix, they
Speaker:go in the app, bring down the brightness of the device. So it serves
Speaker:its purpose. I mean, uh, people have been very creative with it. And
Speaker:then finally, actually, one of the biggest accomplishments that we came with this device
Speaker:was actually solved accidentally through aquaponics. A lot
Speaker:of these vertical systems, right, they use an aeroponic system
Speaker:that pretty much flushes the water from the top and then drips all the
Speaker:way down, feeding all the roots from every single level. That's very
Speaker:noisy. And if you have that in your room or your living room and you
Speaker:hear that water fountain going down all the time, it gets kind of irritating.
Speaker:And our system uses no water pumps. We actually only use
Speaker:fans that push down the fog to travel across the
Speaker:column. And we've really put in a lot of time to figure out the fluid
Speaker:dynamics to make sure that we're able to distribute the right amount of fog and
Speaker:water saturation among every single level. So it's the first vertical
Speaker:structure that is completely silent. People really
Speaker:appreciated that part. And of course, the magic of the fog escaping
Speaker:inside of the system makes it look like it's interactive, right? It's not a slow
Speaker:plant growing that you don't see any movements every day. You might as well watch
Speaker:your wall paint dry. In
Speaker:this case, it's always breathing and interacting with you in your living
Speaker:room. And for the benefit of folks who are familiar with hydroponics, what
Speaker:are you calling the new ponics system? Is this something that you guys have invented,
Speaker:or you've like created this hybrid ponics system that you
Speaker:mentioned? It's a fog NASA
Speaker:actually discovered this, and they were essentially trying to grow
Speaker:plants in space. This is a lot more efficient with water. Fogponics uses
Speaker:98% less water than traditional farming. I mean, compared to hydroponics, which
Speaker:is the new standard, obviously, all across the agritech industry,
Speaker:we use 40 to 60% less water than hydroponic systems
Speaker:and actually increase yearly crop yields by 20 to 200%,
Speaker:depending on the cultivar. It's a lot more efficient in resources and a
Speaker:lot more productive when it comes to planting. Very nice. I saw
Speaker:recently that you posted about the chance to pitch at the
Speaker:Mashup competition. Can you talk a little bit about that experience?
Speaker:Yeah, that was a pitch that happened, I think it was in Q4 of last
Speaker:year. It was an event here in Ottawa hosted by the Capital Angel
Speaker:Network, and we were the first agritech company to actually appear in
Speaker:that competition to pitch about Fantaform. And you should have seen
Speaker:people's faces as soon as I presented the product and told them that you can
Speaker:grow plants using fog. I think everyone was super confused. Some of them
Speaker:probably thought this was a scam, but the majority, once they saw
Speaker:the product, they were just mind-blown. They thought this belonged in a Star
Speaker:Wars movie or something sci-fi. Or on the Star Trek ship or
Speaker:something like that. Yeah, exactly. But overall, very
Speaker:positive feedback from the audience. We got second place there. there. And
Speaker:overall, I mean, we're pretty happy and proud that this
Speaker:was all developed out of this small city here in Gatineau
Speaker:that nobody knows of, and now it's starting to become more national, hopefully
Speaker:international, in the next couple of years. So it was a good exposure of the
Speaker:brand, and overall great to see the reaction from hundreds of investors
Speaker:to see the potential of this technology. Yeah, congrats on that. I saw it must
Speaker:have been a great experience. Are you looking to enter more
Speaker:types of those competitions, or just, you know, is that something that's on the roadmap
Speaker:for you? In the summertime, we'll probably be applying for
Speaker:more. We've noticed that it does take up a lot of the time to just
Speaker:even apply, travel, and obviously compete in them. But we will
Speaker:resume those pitch competitions later in the year. Right now, we're really hyper-focused
Speaker:on increasing the capacity of our manufacturing and
Speaker:scaling right now Fogponics into the vertical farming industry. So we're actually working
Speaker:on a project 2 projects actually here in Quebec to build the
Speaker:first fogponics vertical farm in the world. So it's taking a lot of
Speaker:our time, a lot of funding. So we're trying to minimize distractions
Speaker:and just focus on making this project happen. Yeah, talk a little bit about that.
Speaker:You briefly mentioned it in NorAgCon. I was like, hold that thought, we're going to
Speaker:talk about this on the show. So obviously, you could have
Speaker:continued on the path that you're on with what you have with
Speaker:the current product offering, and you'd still still have your hands full. So I'm
Speaker:curious, as an entrepreneur myself, you know, you think critically about these types
Speaker:of decisions because they're important ones. What opportunities did you see?
Speaker:And I'm curious just about the thought process, you having these conversations with your
Speaker:co-founder about taking on this bigger scale project.
Speaker:It's pretty scary, not gonna lie. It's one of those decisions that might make or
Speaker:break the company just due to the capital intensiveness of the
Speaker:project. But we've always wanted Our dream has always
Speaker:been to build a big commercial-scale vertical
Speaker:farm that can essentially help contribute more to the food sustainability of
Speaker:the future. So, you know, it's been a couple of years, we didn't really have
Speaker:the time or the resources to focus on this, but after our partnership
Speaker:with Cultivated, which was established actually last year more officially,
Speaker:we started discussing about how can we focus now on building this vertical
Speaker:farm by using aquaponics. We've been testing it in our facility for the last
Speaker:2 years in some vertical racks that we've built. They grow incredibly
Speaker:well. Now we're just figuring out how to make it on a larger scale. So
Speaker:after partnering up with Cultivated, we found a new partner that manufactures
Speaker:vertical farms, and this construction should
Speaker:essentially begin by the end of the summer, either here in Gatineau first
Speaker:or in Val-d'Or, which is north of Quebec. We're looking at
Speaker:around a 25,000 square feet facility. with a goal of producing around
Speaker:17,000 to 20,000 vegetables per day. Since, you know, up
Speaker:here in Canada, I think the need for vertical farming is probably
Speaker:not as high, but close to being as high as in the UAE,
Speaker:since we import 90% of our leafy greens from the US and Mexico.
Speaker:So that dependency on the import of produce is still scary. You
Speaker:never know really what can happen again with supply chains. And recently,
Speaker:I'm not sure how it is in the US, but lettuce prices here have hiked
Speaker:like Up to $8 a lettuce head. Wow. It's
Speaker:super unaffordable. It's a basic item that everyone uses, that
Speaker:as much vertical farms that keep popping up or greenhouses here in Canada, it's still
Speaker:not enough to self-sustain. So I wouldn't say it's a competitive
Speaker:market. Rather than that, it's our opportunity to be able to enter and
Speaker:contribute to that need. And, you know, we found the land, now we
Speaker:already have the plans, we're getting the permits, getting the funding from the government. So
Speaker:now it's just about beginning the construction and making that we can build
Speaker:this farm properly. And fingers crossed that all of
Speaker:our R&D is in place and we actually successfully build this first
Speaker:conics vertical farm here in Canada. So it's a long process, a lot
Speaker:of capital required to make this happen, but when we achieve
Speaker:this project, we believe that it's opening a whole new market. Talking about
Speaker:licensing deals, we're talking about expansions, but right now we're going to mainly
Speaker:focus on here in Quebec. Since it's where we're located, I mean, we
Speaker:can do our fair share to contribute to making the province a lot more sustainable,
Speaker:then our goals have been met. What's been interesting and consistent for me in these
Speaker:conversations I've had with folks in Canada and entrepreneurs and business owners in
Speaker:Canada is I do hear a consistent thread about support from the
Speaker:government, support, you know, in the form of grants or even just
Speaker:like supporting the initiatives that are happening in this space.
Speaker:It makes for like a really helpful environment as an entrepreneur.
Speaker:As you're growing a company, to have that support from the Canadian
Speaker:government? Oh, 100%. If anything, what
Speaker:allowed Plantiform to stand on its feet has been the support from
Speaker:the government, along with obviously the private investors that we've gotten. But the
Speaker:government, pretty much focusing on the Canadian National Research Council,
Speaker:has been supporting a lot of our R&D, if not everything in our
Speaker:R&D, for the last 3 years. And now that we're trying to build this vertical
Speaker:farm, we reached out to Investissement Canada, which is the Quebec
Speaker:government, and they've topped up their resources and finances
Speaker:to support the agritech industry. And they've actually
Speaker:announced, I think it was January, that they had replenished their funding by $1.2
Speaker:billion or $1.1 billion to support the entire province.
Speaker:And they also announced in January that they were actually 50%
Speaker:self-sustainable. So the government in 2019, Quebec
Speaker:was around 10 to 12% self-sustainable. sustainable. And in
Speaker:just 3, 4 years, they've achieved 50% sustainability
Speaker:due to their, you know, motivation in inflecting more capital
Speaker:into the agricultural industry and promoting more of these greenhouses popping
Speaker:up all across the province. So we kind of jumped in at the right
Speaker:time asking them to be partners in this project. They're very, very excited
Speaker:to be able to grow more or create more of these vertical farms to support
Speaker:local economies. And the goal for Quebec in the next 3 to
Speaker:4 years to become 100% self-sustainable. So we
Speaker:fit in right at the perfect category, let's say, or
Speaker:requirements for them to jump on board with us. And then the
Speaker:fact that we're using QuantConnect was really the icing to the cake that made them
Speaker:decide that, yeah, we have to help plant the form. Let's make this company happen.
Speaker:Let's be part of this movement and see how this can
Speaker:essentially encourage other entrepreneurs to build more vertical farms across
Speaker:the province. Very exciting. Are you seeing a
Speaker:network? You mentioned other farms. Obviously you can see connections
Speaker:with other indoor farm companies when you go to the conferences, but are you seeing
Speaker:more of a sort of a partnership vibe or a collaboration
Speaker:vibe when it comes to companies specifically in this space in Canada?
Speaker:Absolutely. It's not competitive at all. As I mentioned earlier, there's so
Speaker:much room for entry that other farmers or
Speaker:other vertical farmers I guess it's the same term, a vertical farmer and a
Speaker:farmer is pretty much the same thing now. They all have a core motivation
Speaker:when they started that business and still to feed the
Speaker:local economy. As much as obviously the profitability behind it is
Speaker:one of the main motivators, they all started for the same reason. They were either
Speaker:previous farmers or just someone who's trying to help with the food sustainability
Speaker:challenge. So when they see a new, let's say,
Speaker:competitor entering the market, They were very
Speaker:receptive and welcoming to us. Every time we asked for help,
Speaker:they're always willing to come and give us their advice and supply connections
Speaker:and try to help us avoid the challenges that they came
Speaker:over. So we've been very happy with the
Speaker:receptiveness of other vertical farmers across the region willing to help us and
Speaker:make this project happen. If anything, they were actually extremely excited that more of these
Speaker:farms were popping up and did not see us as a threat at all. I
Speaker:guess that's why every time that these— most of these people sell to retailers,
Speaker:and we have major supermarkets across the province that are always looking for new
Speaker:suppliers that are growing in Quebec, and these farmers can't even supply
Speaker:it because the demand is so high. So by them being able to see
Speaker:other people jumping in and offering their produce as well, it just keeps
Speaker:reassuring from their end or their relationship with the supermarkets that
Speaker:hydroponics or any type of vertical farms really realistically
Speaker:is the solution to be able to supply that demand here in
Speaker:Quebec and Canada overall. So overall, yeah, I mean, super
Speaker:happy with how everyone has been in the industry. I'm surprised there
Speaker:hasn't been a Canadian conference specifically for vertical
Speaker:farming with so much activity that's happening in the region. I mean,
Speaker:they're obviously all over the place, but I mean, I just keep hearing there's so
Speaker:much— it's almost like a, not exactly a Silicon Valley aspect to it, but
Speaker:there's a lot of activity happening in the different provinces, I think, which is pretty
Speaker:exciting. It would be. I think there's some micro, like, trade
Speaker:shows maybe, or some organizations around, but nothing as big as, like, Indoor
Speaker:AgCon. Like, if that happened here in Canada, it'd be filled
Speaker:by all the Canadian farmers going there for sure. But I guess for now we're
Speaker:just left with the option of flying down to Vegas every year and seeing
Speaker:everyone else in the industry. Yeah. And there's the Indoor AgTech
Speaker:NYC conference that's in Brooklyn, and That's picking up steam as
Speaker:well. So I'll be at that. And then Vertifarm in Dortmund, Germany.
Speaker:I think there's one happening in Qatar in May as well. Oh
Speaker:yeah. Yeah. I mean, the whole MENA region is overlapping on each other. I
Speaker:think there's 2 in Dubai and a couple in Abu Dhabi. Like
Speaker:you said, there's a bit of a competitive nature, I think, with
Speaker:people. I just got contacted by someone who's starting a new conference
Speaker:in Abu Dhabi. And so we're talking about Getting some
Speaker:promotion for that as well. But again, because of the need, the big, big, big
Speaker:need and big, big, big interest out in that space, I think there's right now
Speaker:room for everyone to try to give it a shot and see if they can
Speaker:build that buzz around the space. I'm curious, when you talk
Speaker:about fogponics for your— the bigger project, does that
Speaker:change the type of crops you'd be focused on because of
Speaker:the technology, or are you going down the So, are you going around the same
Speaker:route with leafy greens as well? We're going around
Speaker:the same route, but we're really focusing on leafy greens such as lettuce,
Speaker:kale, and potentially like herbs such as basil,
Speaker:maybe cilantro. But we're trying to make an effort to stay away from
Speaker:lettuce since everyone else is making lettuce, and I don't think we
Speaker:need more vertical farms focusing on that. Yeah. So, we're making a big
Speaker:effort working with the Ministry of Agriculture of Canada and the Canadian National Research
Speaker:Council to focus on other items such as strawberries,
Speaker:potentially cherry tomatoes. But if we can focus on those
Speaker:cultivars and we can actually succeed with it using fogponics, we'll be for
Speaker:sure focusing on just scaling that production itself. Sounds like
Speaker:you have a lot of initiatives underway. I'm curious,
Speaker:having started the company yourself with your co-founder, started in the consumer
Speaker:side, now moving into the bigger production,
Speaker:how have you had to evolve? As the CEO, as a leader, you
Speaker:know, wearing these different hats, understanding like all these moving parts,
Speaker:learning things you probably are learning for the first time. So I'm curious,
Speaker:you know, what that journey for like for you has been. I mean, I guess
Speaker:it's a mixture of excitement and anxiety in a way.
Speaker:You know, we made it very clear among the team, and this is
Speaker:both execs and employees, that Plantaform is growing at a
Speaker:very fast rate. And if anyone falls behind on
Speaker:this growth and Plantaform outgrows anyone, that person will
Speaker:have to be replaced, including myself. And with that mindset, it really allowed everyone
Speaker:to always be a step ahead of the unforeseen challenges that are going to be
Speaker:coming up and how to be the right person for
Speaker:this role for what Plantaform needs in the next couple months.
Speaker:And with that mindset, I mean, we're always preparing ourselves to be, you know, in
Speaker:my case, it's Who does Plantform need as the CEO for
Speaker:2024, let's say, for this project to succeed?
Speaker:And the best way to figure that out is, I mean, talking to other experts
Speaker:in the industry who have done it, right? Get the right mentors, talk to other
Speaker:vertical farmers. Since now we're moving more to the B2B space, I am more
Speaker:surrounded by other CEOs in the vertical farming industry, learning from
Speaker:them on a daily basis, staying up to date with the news, and attending all
Speaker:these conferences to really be up to date with what's happening in the
Speaker:industry. Now, that doesn't mean we don't go through mistakes. We make tons of
Speaker:mistakes all the time, but we are well— luckily, we're well surrounded with a good
Speaker:board of advisors. The team itself has a good network
Speaker:of, let's say, people with similar roles in different
Speaker:companies. So we really are learning from each other and trying to stay
Speaker:ahead with the growth. So that's how we've been coping with it. And of
Speaker:course, not your— like every other startup, it's your typical 80 to
Speaker:90-hour weeks where you're trying to figure everything out and change hats
Speaker:and figure out how to do that role if nobody can figure it out, and
Speaker:while still being lean on the cash flows to be able to make
Speaker:it that far. What's a tough question you've had to ask yourself
Speaker:recently? Tough question. You know, a couple weeks ago I
Speaker:actually had a talk with the board of advisors at YRX Effect. I was like,
Speaker:this next project is scary and I hope I can
Speaker:be the right CEO to make it happen. but I need
Speaker:all of your honest opinions to say I'm the right CEO to make this happen.
Speaker:And I offered to even, like, you know, if you need to find someone more
Speaker:qualified who can get this project, you know, successful, I'd
Speaker:be willing to give them the role, whatever it takes to make Quantum succeed. So
Speaker:being able to set the ego aside and
Speaker:determine that whatever is best for the company means me stepping down was
Speaker:a thought that kept coming to my head. And I asked the Everyone
Speaker:was confident that we have the right management, that we are on track with
Speaker:everything. But I think having that thought is humbling enough to know that we do
Speaker:not know everything, that we need to always keep up with what's going to come.
Speaker:So it always keeps us on our toes. Everyone on the team is always on
Speaker:their toes. And I think that really plays a huge role in the success
Speaker:of the company. It takes a lot to
Speaker:ask those tough questions, right? Because you have to be humble.
Speaker:You have to check your ego at the door. And if your mission is
Speaker:really do what's right for the benefit of the company, even if it
Speaker:means that you may not be the person at the end of the day
Speaker:leading the company in that direction, obviously this is still
Speaker:your baby and still your passion. But I think that's something that a
Speaker:lot of leaders and CEOs struggle with. I'm
Speaker:curious where you picked up that trait. If you can think
Speaker:back, is that something you were taught early on? Is this just a family
Speaker:trait? I'm curious, you know, this idea of, you know, doing the right thing, having
Speaker:this humble approach. My second startup I mentioned earlier, we
Speaker:did corporate relocations, and I came up with that idea, yet
Speaker:gave the CEO role to my other co-founder who had a lot more years of
Speaker:experience in the industry. And I guess that was the first step that I learned
Speaker:that, you know, regardless if the idea is fine or not, My
Speaker:best interest is for the company to succeed no matter what.
Speaker:And a couple of weeks ago, that thought came up just because we had some
Speaker:delays with supply chain recently. We had some issues with manufacturing. And as
Speaker:much as I was trying to figure out everything,
Speaker:I just felt I was getting more overwhelmed and more anxious. And at one point,
Speaker:I was scared that I was not even able to control all these moving
Speaker:factors in the company. So, I mean, As I said,
Speaker:it's more the fact that there's so many investors involved in this company right
Speaker:now, and my team as well, right? There, it's families
Speaker:being fed through Plantaform right now that if I made a mistake and that
Speaker:costed the company's lifeline, it would be my fault. And no
Speaker:matter what happens to the success of this company, it will fall under my blame.
Speaker:So it's that moment when I realized that like, hey, like I don't want to
Speaker:be responsible for that if everything goes down, and I want to do whatever
Speaker:it it takes to make sure that I can avoid that situation.
Speaker:And if that means finding someone smarter than me and someone better than me, then
Speaker:something that was— we're willing to do. But thankfully, I have a good
Speaker:team behind me that supports my thoughts and can— and the board of
Speaker:advisors support the decisions I've been making. So it's more about the fact that we're
Speaker:all in the same boat, and if we need to switch positions once in a
Speaker:while to find the perfect role for everyone, it has to be done. And
Speaker:we've done that. We've moved several positions around executives to
Speaker:employees to find the best fit for them. So right now
Speaker:things are going well. I'm still confident I'm the right person for this role, but
Speaker:always willing to take a step aside if we find someone better that can
Speaker:push the boundaries of our growth. So that's a good mindset that everyone has.
Speaker:Very admirable. What do you do to find balance in your
Speaker:life? I don't have balance.
Speaker:It's just, this is my plan A and there's no plan B. I wake up
Speaker:in the morning and I focus on my to-do list that I planned the night
Speaker:before and I get through it the entire day. I
Speaker:mean, last night I was still sending out documents and emails at 1:00 AM. So
Speaker:it's, I don't think there's such a thing as a work-life balance when you're in
Speaker:startup phase. So right now it's pretty much
Speaker:90% of my time with Plantaform,
Speaker:5% of the time to eat and go to the gym, and then 5% of
Speaker:the time with my girlfriend. So that's the fair life balance that I have.
Speaker:Yeah, no, I'd say I totally agree as an entrepreneur myself. There is no—
Speaker:it never evens out, you know. There's always like that seesaw. You, at certain times
Speaker:during your company, you have to put in the work. But the good thing is
Speaker:you do, you know, I think as it is important to take care of yourself
Speaker:though. So the fact that you have like a gym, and I think for me
Speaker:just finding something similar as well helps to offset the
Speaker:anxiety sometimes of all the things that are going on. So it's good that you
Speaker:have that. So as we wrap up, I've been leaving some space at
Speaker:the end of these interviews because there's a lot of people in the industry that
Speaker:listen, a lot of your colleagues, a lot of your peers in the space. Do
Speaker:you have a message? Is there something you want to talk or say to people
Speaker:that are in the world of vertical farming that are listening to this
Speaker:that's just top of mind for you? I guess it's the same tip that
Speaker:everyone gives in entrepreneurship, and it's just not to be scared or
Speaker:worried about what this big step might be. whether it be you
Speaker:focusing on building a vertical farm or building
Speaker:equipment that can facilitate vertical farms. I
Speaker:mean, in Vegas we saw there was all types of booths over there from
Speaker:brokers to actual vertical farms to these water systems
Speaker:to X, Y, and Z. It's an industry that's gonna keep growing.
Speaker:And although some people believe that it might not be as profitable and others might
Speaker:think that it might be capped, it's the only way out. And because of that,
Speaker:I mean, the sooner we, any of us start, the sooner we can contribute to
Speaker:these needs and the sooner we can meet that demand of doubling the food supply
Speaker:by 2050. Regardless of the age, regardless of the
Speaker:experience, realistically, as long as you put your mind into
Speaker:it, anything can happen. And you go with the core values, which is to
Speaker:help with food sustainability, you'll overcome any challenges. If you're
Speaker:doing it just for the money, it's going to be very tough. So for sure,
Speaker:I think having a good balance of your values with the purpose of the
Speaker:business And obviously, I'm thinking on the profitability behind
Speaker:it. No matter what you're doing in the vertical farming industry, it's going to work
Speaker:sooner or later. It's just about finding the right steps and moving forward
Speaker:and having a collaborative mindset to work
Speaker:with other leaders in the industry to learn from and share any resources
Speaker:and data that you might have found that can benefit anyone else. Unlike many other
Speaker:industries, as I mentioned earlier, here in Canada, we're super supportive towards one
Speaker:another. And I I think, I strongly believe
Speaker:that in the next decade, we're gonna see another movement when it comes to
Speaker:collaboration. I don't think it's an industry that's gonna be monopolized. Yes,
Speaker:there's bigger competitors like AeroFarms and Plenty going around and
Speaker:taking over a lot of the bigger farms. But as I said earlier, there's so
Speaker:much room for entry that 1,000 tiny vertical
Speaker:farms can make as big of an impact as one of the larger ones. And
Speaker:we need both in this industry. So I'm very, very excited to see what's coming
Speaker:up in the next couple of years. Obviously, I would always encourage anyone to enter
Speaker:this industry and take that leap of faith that they're going to do some good
Speaker:in the world. That's a great way to wrap up. Thank you for sharing
Speaker:those thoughts. And I think it is really like I say almost every episode,
Speaker:it's all hands on deck moment where everything— everyone is needed,
Speaker:everyone's help is needed, everyone's expertise is needed, everyone's enthusiasm is needed. And I
Speaker:think there's plenty of room And I think if we adopt that mindset
Speaker:of cooperation and helping each other out whenever possible, I think
Speaker:we'll end up better in the industry for it. So I appreciate
Speaker:you echoing a lot of the thoughts that have been shared here previously, and I
Speaker:think that's the right approach. Thanks so much for your time, Alberto. It was
Speaker:really exciting to connect with you and just to hear all the different ways people
Speaker:are entering the space. And the fact that we started around the same time is
Speaker:fun too, because it's been so exciting to see the potential.
Speaker:So really excited for what you and the team are doing at Plantaform.
Speaker:plantaform.com is the website. Anywhere else you want to send people to learn more
Speaker:about what you're working on? They can follow us on our social medias. We're very
Speaker:active on Instagram, TikToks, anything with Plantaform. They can find our
Speaker:names in those social media platforms. Okay. And we'll be sure to include all
Speaker:those links in the show notes as well. Thanks again for being generous with your
Speaker:time. Thanks a lot, Harry. It was a pleasure being on the show. Thanks again
Speaker:to Alberto for coming on the show and sharing his story and the success of
Speaker:Plantaform, both with their in-home farm and the work that they're
Speaker:doing to create their own fogponic-driven vertical farm. Very
Speaker:exciting developments, and Alberto and his team show no signs of
Speaker:slowing down. Special thanks to our Season 8 title sponsor, Cultivated. If you are looking
Speaker:into a vertical farm and don't know where to start or which technology would suit
Speaker:your needs, reach out to them today. Best of all, their service is free because
Speaker:they work on behalf of their partners. Learn more at cultivated.com,
Speaker:and that's spelled C-U-L-T-I-V-A-T-D.com. Just leave out that last
Speaker:E. Podcast production and marketing provided by Fullcast. Learn more at
Speaker:fullcast.co. As a reminder, if you enjoyed this episode or past
Speaker:episodes, please leave us a rating and a review at ratethispodcast.com/vfb.
Speaker:We'll be sure to read those out on future episodes. Tune in next week for
Speaker:my conversation with another fascinating leader from the
Speaker:world of vertical farming. This time it's Gabriel Zarafonitis
Speaker:of Farm Anywhere. Until we meet again, here's to your health.
Speaker:Thanks for listening. To read the full show notes for this episode, which
Speaker:includes any links mentioned in the episode, as well as a full show
Speaker:transcription, visit verticalfarmingpodcast.com.
Speaker:There, you can sign up for our email list to be notified when new
Speaker:episodes are published.
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