Artwork for podcast Elemental Evan
195. The HIGHEST Quality Chocolate and Adaptogens with Sage Dammers
Episode 195 • 12th November 2024 • Elemental Evan • Evan Roberts
00:00:00 01:06:34

Share Episode

Shownotes

Addictive Wellness Chocolates and Adaptogens: Use Code ELEMENTAL_EVAN for 10% off your entire order!

Elemental Evan Instagram

Elemental Evan Youtube Page

Connect with Sage and Addictive Wellness

Addictive Wellness Facebook

https://www.facebook.com/AddictiveWellness/


Did you know that less than 1% of the chocolate consumed today is from heirloom cacao? Plus, most of the chocolate today is loaded with sugar, might contain mycotoxins (mold 🤮), and is sprayed with pesticides.

Today's guest, Sage Dammers, is the founder of Addictive Wellness which provides LITERALLY the highest quality cacao/chocolate that I've ever come across. Sage is brining the most antioxidant rich food in the world right to your doorstep in the cleanest and highest quality possible! On top of that, he loads these delicious chocolates with adaptogens so that you can both enjoy your chocolate and reap some amazing benefits from it.

In this episode of the Elemental Evan podcast, host Evan and Sage delve into the health benefits of high quality cacao. They discuss the astounding properties of heirloom, volcanic soil-grown, mycotoxin-free organic cacao. Sage shares insights on adaptogenic herbs and their integration into his chocolate products. The episode covers Sage's journey into the health and wellness space, the nutritional gaps filled by cacao, and the challenges faced in sourcing high-quality cacao amidst political and economic turbulence in Ecuador. Tune in to discover why this chocolate powerhouse continues to captivate health enthusiasts worldwide.


00:29 The Health Benefits of Cacao

00:57 Introducing Sage from Addictive Wellness

04:07 Sage's Journey into Health and Wellness

04:42 The Impact of Diet on Performance

05:03 Early Influences and Family Background

05:34 Discovering the Power of Superfoods

08:58 College Life and Health Experiments

17:32 Infrared Saunas vs. Traditional Saunas

21:57 The Philosophy of Taoist Tonic Herbalism

28:39 Why Cacao? The Ultimate Superfood

32:27 Navigating Modern Dating

32:45 The Health Benefits of Cacao

35:29 Cacao Processing Explained

38:39 Challenges in Cacao Sourcing

44:38 The Impact of Cartels on Cacao

51:06 The Benefits of Coca Leaves

54:43 The Importance of Adaptogens

01:01:32 Final Thoughts and Recommendations



DISCLAIMER:

This podcast is for educational purposes only, it is not a substitute for professional care by a doctor or other qualified medical professional. Evan Roberts is not a medical professional and this podcast is provided on the understanding that it does not constitute medical or other professional advice or services. Statements and views expressed on this show are not medical advice, this podcast, including Evan Roberts and any guests on the show, disclaims responsibility for any possible adverse effects from the use of information contained in this episode. If you think you have a medical problem please consult a medical professional.

Transcripts

Speaker:

Hey, what's going on.

2

:

Everyone.

3

:

You're listening to the elemental Evan

podcast designed to provide you with

4

:

a simplified and holistic breakdown

of health and wellness topics.

5

:

So you can walk away from these

episodes of ready to apply this

6

:

knowledge to your life and take

control of your health as always.

7

:

This is your host, Evan Roberts, and

today's episode is going to be one for the

8

:

books, especially if you're a chocolate

lover, which most people tend to be.

9

:

Why wouldn't you be chocolate is

absolutely delicious and packed with so

10

:

many good properties for your health.

11

:

It's the highest known amount

of antioxidants in a food.

12

:

Uh, so right there, it's the

most antioxidant rich food

13

:

that you can be eating as well.

14

:

It's got a ton of trace minerals

and minerals that are super

15

:

important for your health, and we're

just not getting enough of them.

16

:

And today we're going to talk with

the founder of addictive wellness.

17

:

His name is Sage, and he's a wealth

of knowledge on all things, not only

18

:

chocolate or better referred to as

cacao, but also on adaptogenic herbs.

19

:

And he talks about the different

adaptogenic herbs that he uses

20

:

in his chocolate bars, which are.

21

:

Insanely delicious.

22

:

And I've been kind of eating probably

more than I should be of them, but,

23

:

uh, nonetheless they're super tasty.

24

:

They don't contain any

sugar, which is awesome.

25

:

Uh, they use monk fruit sweetener instead,

and they also use the highest quality.

26

:

Pick how that I have ever

personally come across.

27

:

And I'm a pretty big fan of cacao.

28

:

I've really got into the health

benefits of it, probably a

29

:

good 10 years ago now actually.

30

:

Man, maybe even more

like 12, I don't know.

31

:

It's been, it's been a while.

32

:

I'm really a big fan of cacao.

33

:

Um, Started reading about

its health benefits.

34

:

And I've seen inaction with my dad because

it's one of the main things that I've

35

:

given to my dad to consume, to really

help with his heart health, which if

36

:

you're a longtime listener of the show,

you know, it has gotten so much better.

37

:

And I really attribute a lot

of that to cacao and, uh, yeah,

38

:

I'm just a big fan of cacao.

39

:

But Sage, the type of cacao that

he's harvesting is not your ordinary

40

:

Hershey's chocolate type cacau.

41

:

This is.

42

:

Heirloom volcanic soil grown, mycotoxin

free organic, and it's just truly one of

43

:

the best ones you could possibly find.

44

:

Um, the lengths that Sage goes through

to get this cow produced and brought

45

:

out here is I'm sure a little bit of a

headache at times, but I'm so grateful

46

:

that he's doing it because it means

that we get to reap those benefits.

47

:

So first off before we jump into the

episode, if you want to try some of

48

:

this chocolate, which I highly recommend

you do, you're going to thank me later.

49

:

Not only for how delicious it

tastes, but how good it is for you.

50

:

And, uh, you can go ahead and

find it at addictive wellness, and

51

:

you're going to get a discount code

for being a listener to the show.

52

:

Sade was generous enough

to provide us with that.

53

:

So, if you want to go ahead and check

out this chocolate, check out the

54

:

description or the show notes of today's

episode, and you will be able to find

55

:

both the link and the discount code.

56

:

So you can go ahead and try out

some of these delicious chocolates,

57

:

which I've been munching on for the

last couple of weeks here recently.

58

:

Um, probably more than I need

to, but they are so tasty.

59

:

So go ahead and try those out.

60

:

And honestly, I'm going to give away

all of the awesome takeaways if I

61

:

continue talking here in this intro.

62

:

So let's welcome onto the show Sage.

63

:

, Evan: so I think I wanna start off with.

64

:

How the heck did you become so

knowledgeable on all things adaptogens

65

:

and just health and wellness as a whole?

66

:

Yeah, I always I love to

hear people's stories.

67

:

I think it kind of sets the sets

the tone for everything we do So if

68

:

you wouldn't mind just giving that

intro, I'd really appreciate that

69

:

Sage: I have a good fortune really

to be born into a family that was

70

:

already ahead of his time and quite

wellness focused Not perfect by any

71

:

means, but, but who is, we all just

are either doing our best with the

72

:

information and resources that we have.

73

:

But my parents raised me in the nineties

as a vegetarian, not necessarily a

74

:

super healthy one, but it was kind

of like the best they knew with the

75

:

information they had at the time.

76

:

So it was like white rice, basmati

rice and tofu five nights a week.

77

:

And one night a week was pizza.

78

:

And one night a week was pasta.

79

:

And.

80

:

That kind of went on for

many, many, many years.

81

:

And I always did pretty well in

school, pretty well in sports, but

82

:

there was always that upper echelon of

ultra high performers that I couldn't

83

:

ever quite figure out how to break

into in either of these kinds of

84

:

departments of my life, so to speak.

85

:

And I knew my food was

different from everybody else.

86

:

I was like, is this, all these

guys are performing higher than me.

87

:

They're eating differently than me.

88

:

Maybe, does it have

anything to do with it?

89

:

I don't know.

90

:

I don't really want to change,

but eventually my parents

91

:

had a wellness center and.

92

:

They were, like I said,

ahead of their time.

93

:

They had infrared saunas back, you

know, in the early two thousands, before

94

:

anybody was talking about this kind of

stuff, they had infrared heated Jade

95

:

massage beds, they had naturopathic

doctors consulting with people there.

96

:

And they were selling some kind of like

supplement and superfood type products.

97

:

And I started seeing a lot of people

coming through and having radical

98

:

transformations in their lives.

99

:

As I was, you know, just a

teenager working in the front desk.

100

:

And I was really excited by that

because I was hearing so much of this

101

:

Eastern philosophy during that time,

uh, in the sense of, um, an, an ounce

102

:

of prevention is worth a pound of a

cure in the sense that you want to

103

:

get ahead of your health, promote your

health actively before you get sick.

104

:

And then you don't have to deal with

getting sick later, but as much as all

105

:

the people that I saw coming in there

would parrot the same kind of sayings and

106

:

did sincerely believe in it, I made this

realization that made this connection

107

:

that they weren't actually doing that.

108

:

They were all coming in in their forties,

fifties, sixties with back pain, liver

109

:

issues, prostate issues, bad sleep,

blood pressure issues, all this stuff.

110

:

They were all getting better.

111

:

They were all experiencing amazing

transformations, but they had

112

:

waited until they got sick to

actually do something about it.

113

:

They were treating it holistically, which

is a way better than the alternative

114

:

in many cases, but they hadn't actually

followed that principle with these things.

115

:

So it got me thinking, okay, if

they're having such amazing results,

116

:

even though they waited to get sick.

117

:

What happens if I start this

now at the ripe old age of 14?

118

:

What does that mean for the overall,

like my overall life experience?

119

:

What can, how long can I stay healthy?

120

:

How long can I live in total?

121

:

What amount more of life experiences can

I pack into this lifetime if I get on it?

122

:

And I didn't have really any examples

of anybody who had done that.

123

:

Until one day this gentleman from

the local community came in, his

124

:

name is Tom, and he was the first

example of something like this.

125

:

He was in his 40s, looked like

he could be in his 20s though.

126

:

He was super intelligent, absolutely

jacked, and he had this protein

127

:

powder mix that he was bringing

to see if they would sell there.

128

:

And it was like hemp protein with some

spirulina, chlorella, some other Western

129

:

herbs like milk thistle, and you had

astragalus in there is something I highly

130

:

regard to this day as a great adaptogen.

131

:

And I thought, okay, this guy

tells me he's having this as

132

:

two of his meals out of the day.

133

:

I'm going to try this.

134

:

I want to see if I can get

those same kind of results.

135

:

Cause this is the first time I've seen

anybody being a living example of what I

136

:

had in mind that maybe could be possible.

137

:

So we did.

138

:

I didn't know what I was doing.

139

:

I would blend up this mix every day,

twice a day with some Tropicana orange

140

:

juice, some frozen berries, a frozen

banana, and it tasted pretty rough.

141

:

And so I, but I didn't care.

142

:

I was going to get those benefits.

143

:

So I would stick a straw down to the back

of my throat and just suck this thing

144

:

down, trying to bypass my taste buds.

145

:

And I noticed after a couple

of weeks, I was feeling this

146

:

amazing high from drinking this.

147

:

Not like, um, like a, a cannabis

high, but just an incredible.

148

:

Alive awake clarity that I had never

experienced before and it got me thinking

149

:

if this has been out there all this

time And i've been missing out on it

150

:

What else have I been missing out on?

151

:

So I started really deeply researching

everything that was in there.

152

:

And then the more that, that, that I

read about, and the more I wanted to

153

:

try some of these things in higher doses

individually, and the more I did that,

154

:

the better I would feel and I would

learn more about different ingredients.

155

:

And the more I would learn about these

other ingredients, the more I would

156

:

want to consume new and better things.

157

:

And.

158

:

It just, the better I would feel,

the more new stuff I would do.

159

:

The more new stuff I would

do, the better I'd feel.

160

:

And just like this cycle continued

and it motivated me to learn

161

:

as much as I possibly could.

162

:

And that cycle never really stopped.

163

:

And so eventually it got to the point

where a couple of years later, now I'm

164

:

in college and you can only do something

that's really beneficial for you for

165

:

such a long period of time before you

want to share it with other people.

166

:

It's the natural hero's journey.

167

:

You go out and slay your

personal dragon, right?

168

:

And then you want to come back

and share the gold and the, the

169

:

lessons learned with your community.

170

:

Problem was my community at that

time was my college friends.

171

:

It was the height of the opioid epidemic.

172

:

They were far more interested in

having Oxycontins and Percocets.

173

:

And then they were in going anywhere

near any kind of anything that I would

174

:

call it superfood or, or an adaptogenic

herb or chocolate or anything.

175

:

So.

176

:

I was really hesitant.

177

:

I was mostly just keeping it

to myself, you know, trying to

178

:

have friendships still go party.

179

:

I would show up to the party with my own

chocolate blended drink with all kinds

180

:

of euphoria and inducing herbs in there.

181

:

Just doing my own thing.

182

:

Everybody thought I was a

little bit odd, I think.

183

:

But what can you do?

184

:

Um, and eventually I was on a surf

trip with a couple of my closest

185

:

friends and we went to Costa Rica.

186

:

And they would go out surfing

would go out surf together.

187

:

And after two hours, they'd

want to come back in.

188

:

They'd be tired.

189

:

They'd be hungry.

190

:

They want to rest.

191

:

And I didn't want to stay out

for four or five, six hours.

192

:

Like guys, it's amazing out here.

193

:

The water is warm.

194

:

The sun is shining.

195

:

The waves are perfect.

196

:

And they saw Like I, like I

saw when I was a kid, okay.

197

:

Other people are eating

different stuff than me.

198

:

What's the difference here.

199

:

They saw that I was quietly in the corner

of the hotel room had brought my little

200

:

magic bullet blender and it was blending

up these weird Brown drinks all day long.

201

:

And they finally asked like, Hey, could

you maybe make me one of those before

202

:

we go back out in the water again?

203

:

And this is quietly the

moment I'd been waiting for.

204

:

Right.

205

:

So I had to kind of contain

my excitement, play it cool.

206

:

Like, yeah, I can make you one.

207

:

And the problem was I'd been

doing this for so many years.

208

:

I forgot how bad it tasted because

I'd gotten totally used to it.

209

:

So.

210

:

Two out of the four of them were

throwing up within minutes afterwards

211

:

because they were so toxic from the

whole college experience when you take

212

:

something that's powerfully detoxifying

and you have a lot of toxicity on board.

213

:

Sometimes your body mobilizes those toxins

back out right the way they came in.

214

:

And so they were in the

bathroom doing their thing and

215

:

like nobody was enjoying it.

216

:

And it was really a moment of realization

for me because I realized, okay, if

217

:

I'm going to really share this with

anybody else and have a long term

218

:

serious benefit to the world beyond

just my own health and wellness, I have

219

:

to figure out a better way to do this.

220

:

And I had the goal at that point.

221

:

I want to figure out a way to share

the healthiest ingredients in the world

222

:

with people in a way that's so delicious

and such an amazing food experience.

223

:

They want to consume the

food and drinks that I make.

224

:

Just because it's such

an amazing experience.

225

:

And it just so happens to be

massively healthy as an afterthought.

226

:

Evan: Okay.

227

:

There's a lot of, uh, different avenues.

228

:

I want to take that.

229

:

But first off, just going back

to, yeah, it's pretty wild.

230

:

How quickly the taste buds can change

and, uh, adapt to what you're consuming.

231

:

And then.

232

:

Just the experience of your friends

literally like having to vomit from

233

:

from the healthy smoothie that they're

essentially drinking It reminds me of like

234

:

the keto flu for example where people all

of a sudden go keto for the first time

235

:

and they've never done any kind of healthy

lifestyle diet change ever and then

236

:

it's all of these toxins being released

and Yeah, essentially making them sick.

237

:

But uh, I want to actually

backtrack even a little bit

238

:

further to the vegetarian diet.

239

:

So your parents starting with

the vegetarian diet, where,

240

:

where did that stem from?

241

:

I know, um, like my mom, for

example, was pretty big on white

242

:

meat only, and then pretty heavy

on veggies, which was awesome.

243

:

Um, but I think that was just kind

of like the style at the time,

244

:

especially like the, um, low fat,

high carb kind of style dieting.

245

:

Was it something along those lines

or was there other influence?

246

:

Sage: It was, um, it was kind of a

spiritual thing for them in, in, in

247

:

large part, you know, they, they,

um, were on a strong spiritual path.

248

:

They were, they were devotees of an

Indian guru named Baba Muktananda.

249

:

They spent a lot of time in India and

were very influenced by these traditions.

250

:

Um, they also, even from like

my mom, when she was a teenager,

251

:

she had an, had an, a kind of an

aversion to the concept of meat.

252

:

Just to be clear, I'm no longer a

vegetarian actually, and so I, you

253

:

know, I incorporate select animal

foods that I have found take me to a

254

:

higher level of health and I feel are

minimally negative in their impact

255

:

on the other side of the equation.

256

:

And so I, you know, I try to take a

really non dogmatic approach to whatever.

257

:

But, but yeah, it was, they, they thought

it was healthier and certainly, I think

258

:

it probably was still healthier to have a,

a, a vegetarian, probably like higher carb

259

:

than you'd really want diet as opposed

to, you know, all, all the other kids were

260

:

like having Burger King and McDonald's.

261

:

And I don't think that

would have been better.

262

:

So, um, given what was around at the time,

it was probably one of the best options.

263

:

Evan: Yeah, the reason I had asked is

because, uh, going through like my,

264

:

uh, experience with dieting and as well

becoming a yoga practitioner, um, you

265

:

know, one of the big things is ahimsa

and like, um, you know, going vegan

266

:

and, and really trying to get away

from essentially eating any animal

267

:

products, which I agree with you very

like non dogmatic approach to it.

268

:

Whatever kind of food you eat.

269

:

I think there's um, certain foods

work better for certain people Maybe

270

:

even at a certain time in their life.

271

:

There might be a specific type of diet.

272

:

That's right for you in that moment So,

um, yeah, definitely on board with the

273

:

non dogmatic stuff, but I I wanted to ask

Um, one of the things I noticed I went

274

:

I never went vegan, but I went very Like

I would say almost full on vegetarian.

275

:

Um, maybe more so plant based, but one

of the big things that I noticed was,

276

:

uh, my teeth seemed to take a pretty

big hit from that dietary change.

277

:

And I'm sure I just wasn't

consuming enough of.

278

:

Something to, you know, I don't know

if it's like K2 calcium, something

279

:

along those lines, but did you ever

notice any, uh, issues growing up with

280

:

like your, the health of your teeth?

281

:

Sage: Fortunately not, you know, the,

some of the main areas and the pitfalls

282

:

that people end up with, I didn't really

have issues with, I mean, I will say

283

:

that my, my bite didn't develop as.

284

:

As wide in terms of my upper arch of

the palate as, as would have been ideal.

285

:

And if my teeth look weird in the video,

it's not because I have fake teeth.

286

:

It's because I have aligners on because

I'm undergoing a whole process right

287

:

now to try to expand my upper arch and

be able to, to fit everything properly.

288

:

So that can, that can actually

happen from the previous generation,

289

:

not having enough nutrition.

290

:

Um, and then into my, my generation as

well, and also to do with maybe some

291

:

food allergies and, and doing a little

too much mouth breathing when I was a

292

:

kid, going through all that, and not

having the tongue pushing up against the

293

:

roof of my mouth on an ongoing basis.

294

:

So, so I, you know, I, I certainly

had some, some issues in that

295

:

department in terms of overall strength

and mineralization of the teeth.

296

:

Somehow I ended up

doing pretty okay there.

297

:

I don't know if it would work out the

same across a broad group of people.

298

:

You always have, you know, you

could have a hundred people do

299

:

the worst thing ever and one of

them would end up being somehow.

300

:

Okay.

301

:

So fortunately I got lucky there.

302

:

Evan: That's just a personal question

of mine because in general when you

303

:

talk about having like Not a broad

enough palate I think most people

304

:

probably don't just from like you

said mouth breathing not having the

305

:

tongue putting the pressure up there

Also just with all the like processed

306

:

foods that I know I ate as a kid.

307

:

There was not much Uh, in terms

of like difficult consistency

308

:

to like really chew through.

309

:

So, uh, yeah, that plays a whole

role, but this is me going down

310

:

a path of personal curiosity.

311

:

So anyways, we're going to draw.

312

:

Sage: It's a, it's a common issue for long

term vegans to run into dental issues.

313

:

Um, so, so it's not,

um, out of the ordinary.

314

:

Evan: Yeah, yeah, no, and that and

that was one of the most like obvious

315

:

kind of issues that I found with it.

316

:

Um, I Personally do feel like in in my

soul more so that I would love to be

317

:

more plant based and I do still have

like A pretty balanced plate at pretty

318

:

much every meal But yeah, I definitely

eat protein But yeah, it's very, very

319

:

interesting and a super interesting

background as well with your parents

320

:

and, um, you were mentioning as well that

they own a, uh, infrared sauna company.

321

:

And so here's my other

personal curiosity question.

322

:

Uh, what is the biggest difference

between an infrared sauna

323

:

and just a traditional sauna?

324

:

Pour some hot water on

some rocks, kind of sauna.

325

:

Um, like what are the benefits?

326

:

What, yeah, what's the main reason for

having infrared as opposed to others?

327

:

The only main difference I can feel

is just they're not as hot typically.

328

:

Um, but beyond that, I'm curious

to pick your brain on that.

329

:

Sage: I just want to preface it by

saying, yes, I am in the infrared

330

:

sauna business through my family.

331

:

And so I, you know, there could

be some bias here, first of all.

332

:

Um, and, and second of all, I recognize.

333

:

Saunas are a very personal and passionate

thing for a lot of people, especially,

334

:

um, northern Europeans, especially

Finnish people, are, are, have very

335

:

strong feelings about their saunas

being the one and only true saunas.

336

:

So take it easy on me, folks.

337

:

Uh, I'm, I'm just sharing

my personal experience here.

338

:

And so the best way I would describe

the difference between the two is that

339

:

in a traditional sauna using a hot

rocks to heat the air and then the hot

340

:

air heats your body certainly works.

341

:

It's been done that way for

hundreds, if not thousands of years.

342

:

The downside is that air doesn't

transmit heat all that effectively.

343

:

It's like you can stick

your hand in an oven.

344

:

That's three 50, 400 degrees.

345

:

It's hot, but it's not that big of

a deal until you accidentally touch

346

:

some of the metal in the oven, then

that transmits heat very effectively.

347

:

And you've got a problem

on your hands real fast.

348

:

So, so you don't have the most efficiency

of transmission of that heat to the body.

349

:

Um, that's a part of the reason why

they're throwing water on the rocks,

350

:

because as you increase the humidity.

351

:

That helps to transmit

the heat more effectively.

352

:

If you have a sauna at a, say 180

degrees, that's has no water being

353

:

thrown on the rocks versus one with

much higher humidity because somebody is

354

:

tossing the water on the rocks in there,

it's a totally different experience.

355

:

So with infrared, these infrared

wavelengths only lose a small

356

:

percentage of their energy to heating

the air in the sauna and the rest

357

:

are directly penetrating your tissue.

358

:

To work on increasing your core body

temperature, which is the real metric,

359

:

in my opinion, that you're actually after

your body in terms of the biological

360

:

results that you're going to get is

not as concerned with what temperature

361

:

the areas or what temperature your skin

is getting to, but more what challenge

362

:

is being placed upon your body's

control mechanisms of its core body

363

:

temperature, because as it gets hotter

and hotter and your core, your body's

364

:

doing everything it can to cool you off.

365

:

And it's that push and pull that

drives a lot of the benefits

366

:

that are going to happen.

367

:

So, Um, you can get, in my opinion,

in my personal experience, similar

368

:

results at a different temperature.

369

:

Um, from, there's been very

limited comparative study done.

370

:

Um, the only one that I've seen,

it was faulty in my opinion in the

371

:

way they studied it, because They

looked at an infrared sauna and

372

:

a traditional sauna at the same

temperature and studied what results

373

:

will it produce for athletic recovery.

374

:

The infrared sauna outperformed

the traditional sauna, but they

375

:

did at the same temperature,

which you would never really have.

376

:

You would have a traditional sauna

that would be quite a bit hotter.

377

:

So all of that really shows, I

think, is that there certainly is

378

:

something more to an infrared sauna

than just the air temperature.

379

:

Evan: Yeah.

380

:

And, , the other noticeable difference

is I enjoy sitting at infrared

381

:

sauna for a longer period of time,

cause it's not just crazy hot and

382

:

super intense, um, at least the air.

383

:

Right.

384

:

Uh, so I, I feel that the benefits

as well, kind of steep a little bit

385

:

longer, like when you're able to sit in

there longer, you're able to reap those

386

:

benefits for a longer period of time.

387

:

So I really enjoy them, but I

was, I was just curious to really.

388

:

on those two.

389

:

Sage: Even in the world of infrared

sonos, there's variants, right?

390

:

You'll have some that get to 120, 130.

391

:

You'll have some that get to Maybe

into the 150s or even popping

392

:

up into the 160s a little bit.

393

:

My personal experience is having

used both kinds of saunas a lot is

394

:

that an infrared sauna in like the

mid 150s is a pretty comparable

395

:

experience to traditional around 180.

396

:

Evan: Okay.

397

:

Okay.

398

:

No, that's that's super good to note.

399

:

Um, moving back into the chocolates,

first off, I just got to know, how

400

:

did you become so knowledgeable

on all these different adaptogens?

401

:

Because there's certain adaptogens

that you have in your chocolates

402

:

that I've never even heard of.

403

:

Um, if we take the recharge one

here, you have something called,

404

:

I'm probably going to pronounce this

wrong, but euchomia and remonia?

405

:

Sage: Perfect pronunciation.

406

:

Evan: Thank you.

407

:

I appreciate it.

408

:

But yeah, these are, I've

never heard of those before.

409

:

So how did you become so

knowledgeable on these?

410

:

Sage: So as I was kind of going off

down that rabbit hole of learning more

411

:

about every healthy ingredient I could

possibly get my hands on, I came across

412

:

this school of Taoist tonic herbalism.

413

:

And this is something that

dates back thousands of years.

414

:

And I was really.

415

:

Just taken by the philosophy and the

theory of it, the way that it isn't just

416

:

this herb does that it's, it intertwines

with so many elements of your life.

417

:

It intertwines with your mentality and

intertwines with your spiritual energy.

418

:

It intertwines with your physical

energy, and they have these amazing

419

:

structures of how to understand

what these herbs are doing.

420

:

In their philosophy, the idea of

yin and yang, the, the hot and

421

:

the cold, the expending of energy

and the collecting of energy.

422

:

And not only that, they had this other

thing called the three treasure system.

423

:

You know, young, a lot of people

have heard of and have some kind

424

:

of vague idea, the three treasures,

nobody knows about this pretty much.

425

:

And it is an amazing structure

to understand all these

426

:

herbs and what they're doing.

427

:

So I'll just, if you don't

mind, share a little brief.

428

:

Look at it real quick, . So they would

say that your life is formed of these

429

:

three treasures and they would use the

metaphor of a candle to describe these.

430

:

I find it works a little bit better to

use a metaphor, a financial metaphor.

431

:

And so I'll give you both and

everybody can take whichever

432

:

metaphor works for them.

433

:

So, The wax and the wick of the

candle is what's called your gene.

434

:

This is your core kidney adrenal energy.

435

:

It is something that you inherit from

your parents and your grandparents

436

:

before them, depending on what their

diet was like and how healthy they lived.

437

:

If you had parents that were

not living so well, maybe they

438

:

had a huge amount of stress.

439

:

They ate a poor diet, lots of grain,

not a lot of nutritional density.

440

:

You're not going to start off necessarily

with as much Jing as somebody whose

441

:

parents were maybe living close to the

earth and eating their ancestral diet and

442

:

Uh, just living a close to nature life.

443

:

So some people start off with more.

444

:

Some people start off with less.

445

:

It's like, we all know people

who can do whatever they want.

446

:

They don't have to live a healthy life

and they're still doing pretty well.

447

:

And they make fun of people who actually

have to actively take care of their

448

:

health until they eventually like run

out of this Jing at like age 60 because

449

:

of a heart attack and then it's over.

450

:

But They were going

pretty good until then.

451

:

On the other hand, you have people who are

really kind of sickly from a young age.

452

:

And, and no matter what they do, they

always have to be really careful about

453

:

how they're using their energy and

how they're taking care of themselves.

454

:

Cause they're just right on that

precipice where it can all fall apart

455

:

very easily to the financial metaphor

that I said, I was going to give you.

456

:

Here, this is your inheritance.

457

:

It's some people end up with a

big fat trust fund from their

458

:

parents because their parents

dominated the financial world.

459

:

Some people start off with nothing

and you just got to build your

460

:

way up the old fashioned way.

461

:

And so that's your, the wax and the wick.

462

:

That's your core kidney adrenal essence.

463

:

That is something that you can

build with certain yoga practices

464

:

and certain jing building herbs.

465

:

Things like you mentioned, eucomia,

ramania, cordyceps, mirinda.

466

:

Uh, these are all the herbs.

467

:

Actually, the chocolate you happen

to grab is the recharge chocolate.

468

:

It's all built around building the jing.

469

:

So it's a great one to start with.

470

:

So that's where you start

because to build the foundation.

471

:

And this, it starts out as your trust

fund, but then as you go through

472

:

life, it's then your savings account.

473

:

It's your energy reserves.

474

:

You tap into it when you need

to, but ideally you don't want to

475

:

be reaching into that too much.

476

:

You want to live more sustainably.

477

:

You want to build the

next treasure, your chi.

478

:

This is the active part of the candle.

479

:

It's the flame.

480

:

It's the moment to moment active

vitality, energy, cognitive

481

:

function, immune system function.

482

:

You build this through also like

through breath work, for example,

483

:

you build it through a healthy diet,

you build it through good sleep, you

484

:

build it through chi herbs, things

like astragalus, cordyceps, asparagus

485

:

root, um, even Ayurvedic system.

486

:

You have ashwagandha, which is a prana

tonic, which basically translates

487

:

over to and So these builds your chief

and that's your checking account.

488

:

That's the active part where you're doing

your regular deposits and withdrawals.

489

:

And if you've got a healthy

checking account, you don't have

490

:

to touch your savings account.

491

:

You can leave that alone for a

rainy day when things get super

492

:

stressful and you have to, you know,

once every few years, pull an all

493

:

nighter and dip into those reserves.

494

:

And the faster you, you, I

should, let me reword that.

495

:

I should say that the, the more you

stress, the worse a diet you live,

496

:

the more you do alcohol and drugs,

et cetera, The more you are tapping

497

:

into that jing, into those reserves

of energy, and when those eventually

498

:

run out, that's the end of your life.

499

:

And, So you want to really be

careful about how you use that.

500

:

And you want to focus on build

and building the Qi to have a

501

:

strong active checking account.

502

:

So you don't have to mess

with your savings account.

503

:

But ultimately the ultimate

purpose of life is not just to

504

:

have a big checking account.

505

:

The ultimate purpose of a candle

is not just to have a big flame.

506

:

The ultimate purpose of you is

not just to have a lot of energy.

507

:

It's to have a beautiful

impact on the world around you.

508

:

So you have your third treasure.

509

:

This is Shen.

510

:

This is your higher self.

511

:

It's a light in your eyes.

512

:

It's your spirit.

513

:

It's your ability to have a beautiful

effect on the world around you.

514

:

So this is the light that the candle gives

off or in the financial metaphor, if you

515

:

have a great savings account and a great

checking account, what do you do now?

516

:

You start a nonprofit.

517

:

This is your ability to really help

those around you and you're not going to

518

:

have a very successful nonprofit if your

personal finances are in total disarray.

519

:

So you start by building your Jing, then

your Qi, and then you get to your Shen.

520

:

And so the Shen herbs are things.

521

:

Like reishi mushroom would

be my absolute favorite.

522

:

Albizia flower is another great one.

523

:

Pearl powder is one coming from an

oceanic mineral source, basically.

524

:

And so you can fit these herbs

into these different treasures.

525

:

Some herbs even work on two

treasures and there's a rare few.

526

:

That work on all three, like

reishi mushroom, which I briefly

527

:

mentioned, and she's Andrew Berry.

528

:

These are two examples of what

they call three treasure herbs

529

:

that can build your Shen.

530

:

So they're amazing to

incorporate into your life.

531

:

And so I got just romanticized by

this whole philosophy and learning

532

:

about these different herbs.

533

:

And every time I would learn about

one, I was like, wow, I can't believe

534

:

I lived this long, didn't know about.

535

:

Reishi mushroom about

astragalus about kind of stemma.

536

:

There's so much power in here.

537

:

I need to know this information like

intuitively like the back of my hand

538

:

and so that just drove me from one to

the next to the next and Got obsessed

539

:

and never stopped being obsessed

540

:

Evan: That was probably the best

breakdown I've heard of that personally.

541

:

And, uh, I love any kind of health and

wellness type philosophy that really

542

:

brings together, not just the physical

wellness, but also the emotional, the

543

:

mental, the, the spiritual wellness,

because it all comes together.

544

:

Ties together at one point or another.

545

:

Uh, so thanks for breaking that down.

546

:

That was incredible.

547

:

Um, you've like inspired me to go

and do some more research on it.

548

:

So thank you for that.

549

:

No, Sage, that was, that was excellent.

550

:

Um, this leads me to my next point, which

is why choose cacao, which I'm a huge fan

551

:

of, and obviously majority of people love

chocolate, but specifically cacao in its

552

:

raw, bitter state, I really love cacao.

553

:

Why did you choose that or even more

specifically, I guess, chocolate

554

:

as your, um, basically the system

of delivering these adaptogens

555

:

and super herbs, uh, to people.

556

:

Sage: There were, there were

a couple of driving factors.

557

:

And so rewind back to my teen years as my

parents had the wellness center, they were

558

:

selling various products there as well.

559

:

I noticed eventually one day they

had this bag of what looked like

560

:

cocoa powder on the shelf to me.

561

:

And I said, cacao, which was.

562

:

Seemed like a misspelling.

563

:

So at first I was asking my mom,

Hey, did they misspell that?

564

:

And she's like, no, no, that's

what it, what it means when

565

:

it's less processed, basically.

566

:

And I was still confused because this

sounded to me like my only point of

567

:

comparison to this was like Hershey's

hot cocoa that I had growing up with the

568

:

marshmallows mixed in with the powder.

569

:

And I knew that wasn't healthy.

570

:

I would, you know, we would have it

as a kid, like every now and then

571

:

with like hot soy milk, you know,

that's the way we were doing it.

572

:

Um, I didn't understand why, why is

this amongst all these other incredible

573

:

things that you guys have here?

574

:

What, how did it earn this place?

575

:

And I started learning more about it

and I realized, okay, wow, this is the

576

:

highest natural source of antioxidants.

577

:

Then you look at what mineral are

more than 80 percent of people in the

578

:

Western world chronically deficient

in the number one deficiency?

579

:

Magnesium.

580

:

Okay.

581

:

What's the number one

natural source of magnesium?

582

:

Oh, it's cacao.

583

:

Wow.

584

:

That's pretty cool.

585

:

Then people have all over the

place, blood sugar issues.

586

:

What's the mineral that helps the trace

mineral that helps with blood sugar?

587

:

Chromium.

588

:

Incredible source of chromium?

589

:

Cacao.

590

:

And that's something that like

80 plus percent of people also

591

:

have major deficiencies in.

592

:

And then you start learning about some

of these other more exotic compounds

593

:

in there like fennyethylamine, love

bliss chemical or anandamide, which

594

:

is another bliss chemical and things

that just make people feel amazing.

595

:

And I was like, okay, this is pretty

cool because this is a rare thing.

596

:

Most foods that I understood

they're either healthy for you,

597

:

but nobody generally thinks that

they're an amazing food experience

598

:

that they really taste good.

599

:

Or on the other hand, you have

foods that people love to eat.

600

:

But nobody's confusing them with

being super healthy for you.

601

:

The it's like the grand Canyon, this

wide divide between these two worlds.

602

:

And it's kind of like there's

this little bridge between the two

603

:

sides made out of chocolate because

chocolate on one hand, and it is, is

604

:

something that people crave, right?

605

:

And on the other hand, if done right,

it can be an incredible health food.

606

:

And so I saw this as, as a way to

achieve my goal that I mentioned earlier

607

:

of delivering health and wellness

to people through an incredible food

608

:

experience that they would crave and

love and eat just because it tasted

609

:

good and just so happened to be really

good for them as an afterthought.

610

:

And I had a couple other

motivating factors.

611

:

One, I really enjoyed chocolate.

612

:

And so if there was a way to

have it healthier, I wanted it.

613

:

And the, a lot of the higher, higher

quality cacao and chocolate products

614

:

at the time were quite expensive.

615

:

So I thought it'd be better if I

could learn to make this myself.

616

:

And I also thought it would

be a fun way to meet girls.

617

:

If you could meet a girl and say,

Hey, want to come over and we

618

:

can make some chocolate together.

619

:

And so eventually that's how I

met my girlfriend who I've been

620

:

with now for 12 and a half years,

and it worked out really well.

621

:

Evan: That's awesome.

622

:

Well, congratulations on,

on that long relationship.

623

:

Um, Yeah, my, my wife and I actually just,

just hit 12 years in September as well.

624

:

So that's awesome.

625

:

Nice.

626

:

Congrats.

627

:

Yeah.

628

:

Um, 2012,

629

:

Sage: those are good times.

630

:

Evan: Yeah, yeah, exactly.

631

:

2012 just

632

:

Sage: before, probably like just

before dating apps, like made

633

:

everybody's head spinner up.

634

:

Evan: Yeah.

635

:

We, we often, Oh, I mean, we, we talk

about, we're like, it's gotta be super

636

:

weird if we were to like be back in

the dating game right now with all

637

:

the dating apps, like I would be.

638

:

completely lost personally,

but we're blessed.

639

:

Yeah, a hundred percent.

640

:

Uh, now with the cacao being like super

rich in all these, uh, minerals, trace

641

:

minerals, it's actually, uh, one of the

foods that I was really big on giving

642

:

to my dad who, uh, he's dealt with,

uh, some heart complications, uh, In

643

:

the last, he's gotten so much better,

but it probably around like:

644

:

That's when he started hearing, uh,

that he was having heart complications,

645

:

kind of like irregular heartbeats,

part of his heart was enlarged and

646

:

working harder than the other portion.

647

:

And, uh, you know, I've, I've put

them on a few different things, but

648

:

one of the Biggest ones is cacao.

649

:

Um, he's pretty religious about

taking it and he's seen massive

650

:

improvements in his heart health His

tests are coming back a lot better.

651

:

Yeah, it's it's really awesome Um,

so I'm huge on the power of cacao.

652

:

I read I think like a superfoods book

by David Wolfe and that's where I

653

:

really learned about cacao and kind

of went down that rabbit hole but You

654

:

have raw cacao, which I think, um,

or I guess, would cacao be raw and

655

:

cocoa be the not raw version of cacao?

656

:

Sage: People interpret

it in different ways.

657

:

There's, there's no official definition

and no official delineation between

658

:

what is cocoa and what is cacao.

659

:

Really, the, the, the differentiation

and how it's pronounced.

660

:

You have to go back to the original

times in Central America when

661

:

the Spanish first arrived and you

had the cacao there at the time.

662

:

But what they called it was cacuarro.

663

:

And that was a little too crazy

of a word, even for the Spanish.

664

:

And so the Spanish took that and

they started saying cacao and the

665

:

Spanish took this back to Europe,

tried to introduce it to the British

666

:

for the British cacao was too weird.

667

:

And they made it cocoa.

668

:

So it just, get further and further

from it, but basically in the way

669

:

it's used these days, if you see

something that says cacao, it's likely

670

:

to be on the less processed side.

671

:

Whereas cocoa is something that has had,

you know, more human intervention gone

672

:

into what's being delivered to you there.

673

:

Evan: Yeah, so, and the reason I asked

this is because, uh, I had the opportunity

674

:

to go to a cacao and coffee farm in, uh,

Columbia, in near, I think it was in Minka

675

:

was the town, and just, you know, Insane.

676

:

They actually, they had a toucan

that they saved when it was a baby.

677

:

It's tree head and nest had fallen down.

678

:

And since they rescued it,

they didn't want to keep it.

679

:

They just kind of like

wanted to rehabilitate it.

680

:

But now it just like literally hangs out

on the premise there and they feed it.

681

:

It'll come up, you can pet it.

682

:

It is a true Colombian toucan because

it'll dip its beak into your coffee.

683

:

If you're not drinking it quick enough.

684

:

Um, he's full blown, uh, Colombian, but.

685

:

Uh, while I was there, I was lucky

enough to experience, uh, like a

686

:

cacao or chocolate making process.

687

:

And so they show that, you know, first

off, the cacao pod, which is So unique

688

:

looking and then, you know, you have

the little seeds inside with the white

689

:

pulp on them Which is also super tasty,

but they would take the seeds with

690

:

the white pulp and put it in Uh, I

think they put it in a jar They would

691

:

ferment it first and then after it had

fermented for a certain period of time

692

:

Then they put it into a pot roasting

machine and roast it and then the whole

693

:

room smells like delicious chocolate.

694

:

But of course that's

where the raw stage ends.

695

:

So for a raw cacao, you would ferment it.

696

:

And then what would be

the next step after that?

697

:

Sage: So you're, you're fermenting

and then sun drying from, from being

698

:

sun dried, it depends on how far

you're going to take it and what

699

:

you're planning to make out of it.

700

:

So let's say you're going all

the way to the most processed,

701

:

so to speak, end points of cacao.

702

:

A raw cacao, which would be making

cacao powder and cacao butter.

703

:

So from there, it's going

to be crushed into nibs.

704

:

And then you have people going through

it by hand, taking out the skins.

705

:

Um, and so you just have the,

the, the beans themselves.

706

:

So at this point you have cacao

nibs, you could just sell those

707

:

or eat those at that point.

708

:

But if you wanted to go

further, they go through a very

709

:

slow stone grinding process.

710

:

Uh, to, to make sure you don't create

too much heat as you're stone grinding

711

:

them, because you could do it a lot

faster with a lot more aggressive heat,

712

:

but that's, that's not what you want.

713

:

So very slowly stone ground up

over a period of a couple of days.

714

:

And that creates cocoa or cacao paste,

or the, the like more mainstream

715

:

term for this is chocolate liqueur.

716

:

Um, and so this is basically

just the cacao bean turned into

717

:

basically like a nut butter.

718

:

It's like you would take an almond

and make it into almond butter.

719

:

You take the cacao bean and you turn

it into cacao paste from this point,

720

:

uh, you might use that right at

that stage to start making chocolate

721

:

or you basically put it through a

press and you end up pressing it.

722

:

And so at one end of the machine

comes cacao butter, and that is the

723

:

pure fat of the cacao bean out the

other, other end of the machine, you

724

:

get what's called cake and this is

just cacao powder, highly compressed.

725

:

And then that basically gets sifted to

kind of allow it to separate out and

726

:

get some air in there and break it,

you know, get into smaller particles.

727

:

And then you have a cacao powder.

728

:

Evan: Wow.

729

:

Okay.

730

:

I missed, I missed a few steps in there.

731

:

Okay.

732

:

That, that makes a lot more sense.

733

:

And then that was something I've really

enjoyed about your chocolate as well

734

:

is that you keep the cacao butter in

there, which a lot of chocolate that

735

:

you'll find in the markets, they don't.

736

:

have the original cacao butter or they'll

add with a cacao butter, some kind of a

737

:

different kind of fat like soybean oil

or whatever, like fill in the blank.

738

:

Um, so I really appreciated

that you kept that in there.

739

:

And it, and it gives it that really

velvety, just nice mouthfeel.

740

:

And I know, um, when I had that chocolate,

even though it wasn't raw, that was

741

:

one of the things that I noticed was

that texture of chocolate was very

742

:

similar to the one that you have.

743

:

Cause I'm guessing because of

that, uh, cacao butter in there.

744

:

Yeah.

745

:

Sage: Yeah.

746

:

And that's something that is, um,

you're, you're absolutely right that

747

:

many companies try to minimize the cacao

butter in there and Especially so over

748

:

the past year, and not a lot of people

are aware of this, but, um, about a

749

:

year ago, there was huge El Nino type

rains in Africa, where the majority

750

:

of the world's cacao is produced.

751

:

They lost pretty much the whole

crop due to disease because

752

:

of how much rain there was.

753

:

And so when you take away the majority of

the cacao supply in the world, Suddenly,

754

:

whatever's remaining, whether it's from

Africa or from Central or South America or

755

:

Indonesia, the prices go through the roof.

756

:

So historically, you could look back

like decades and decades and decades.

757

:

The price stays pretty consistent

between like 000 per metric ton.

758

:

And this is just like for

commodity, basic African cacao.

759

:

Um, and, but like whatever cacao

you're getting, higher quality is just

760

:

going to be some multiple of that.

761

:

So the commodity price affects

the price of everything.

762

:

And so now the price suddenly this

year went from between 2, 500 to 3,

763

:

000 historically to up around 10, 000.

764

:

So.

765

:

The, the prices for the ingredients

going into here have basically

766

:

tripled or quadruple, depending

on what start point you pick.

767

:

And so the most expensive element

of cacao processing is the butter.

768

:

So the, the more like mainstream type

companies are trying to cut this out

769

:

as much as they can, because they're

trying to control our cost somehow.

770

:

We, we haven't changed our recipes

at all in response to this.

771

:

And we're doing everything we can

to try to keep prices under control.

772

:

And.

773

:

Keep our quality there, but it's, uh,

it's been a crazy year in the cacao world.

774

:

Evan: Well, yeah, and I, I think we, this

is a perfect entry point to kind of jump

775

:

into all of that because I, uh, I know I

saw recently you talking about because you

776

:

source your cacao from Ecuador, I believe.

777

:

And, uh, there's kind of been a

issue there with like the U S kind of

778

:

getting out of there and then cartels

kind of coming in and running amok.

779

:

And as well, not to mention, um, you

source a really specific Type of cacao,

780

:

which is, was it the Arriba Nacionale?

781

:

Sage: Correct.

782

:

Yeah.

783

:

It's a wild grown Arriba Nacionale.

784

:

Evan: And wild grown too, which I think

for a lot of people, uh, listening to

785

:

this, they, they don't know that, you

know, this is a, um, you know, it's

786

:

like kind of like the, is it, would

you call it like the original strain?

787

:

Cause I know the type that we

get is not that Arriba Nacionale

788

:

typically like in your, I don't know,

Hershey's bar or something like that.

789

:

Correct.

790

:

Sage: Right.

791

:

So Arriba Nacionale, this is basically

like the heirloom original variety.

792

:

It represents.

793

:

Less than 1 percent of the total

cacao grown most of what is consumed

794

:

are one of several different hybrids.

795

:

Um, the, the main ones are called

Trinitario and Forastero hybridized to

796

:

grow better and produce more and be more

disease resistant in different climates.

797

:

And then you also have now in the last

couple of decades becoming more common.

798

:

Um, especially out of central and South

America is a variety called a heavily

799

:

hybridized variety called CCN 51.

800

:

And this is, um, an

embarrassment of a cacao tree.

801

:

It produces huge yield,

but the quality is crap.

802

:

Um, it's, it's known for having the

flavor of acidic dirt and Unfortunately,

803

:

more and more farmers are turning

to it because they can, in the short

804

:

run, you know, make more money.

805

:

Um, but the, the, the, everything about it

and the way it has to be grown with huge

806

:

amounts of protection, it has to be grown,

obviously monocropped on a plantation

807

:

and it's these small trees that are just

producing, you know, In many, many ways

808

:

in inferior to cow, we are obsessive,

as you can probably already tell by

809

:

listening to me up until this point.

810

:

So we go for the absolute highest

quality and we'll take nothing less.

811

:

So that sometimes makes our life

really difficult because most

812

:

other companies, if they're not.

813

:

Something becomes challenging

with the country or source of

814

:

origin of your cacao, or whatever.

815

:

There's there's a dozen other countries.

816

:

You can go to, you can go figure

something else out we have for better

817

:

or for worse I think in the long run for

better, but we have pigeon, our pigeon,

818

:

hold ourselves into only accepting.

819

:

A cacao.

820

:

That's.

821

:

Wild grown heirloom grown in volcanic

soil, organic, of course, but beyond

822

:

that mycotoxin free, which is mold

toxins that are present in almost

823

:

every chocolate product in the world.

824

:

And so because of this over the last

year, when the political and economic

825

:

situation in Ecuador got pretty dicey,

it wasn't so easy as saying, okay,

826

:

let's go to the country next door.

827

:

Let's just go to Peru and

get something from there.

828

:

Because this, the kind that

we're getting this level of

829

:

quality only happens in Ecuador.

830

:

Evan: Yeah.

831

:

Well, is Ecuador known as

like the home place of cacao?

832

:

Sage: There's a couple

of different opinions.

833

:

You know, anytime you're tracing

something back to its origins, there's

834

:

a lot of national pride involved.

835

:

Um, and, and so there may be some

origins in Central America, you

836

:

know, pretty much any country.

837

:

In Central and South America, where

cacao comes from, people will tell you

838

:

that's where it originally came from.

839

:

So it's a little bit hard to

say, but it's, it's around there.

840

:

Evan: Yeah.

841

:

Yeah.

842

:

Yeah.

843

:

Gotcha.

844

:

Um, but to that point, I mean, all

of the, all of the points that you've

845

:

listed on your cacao is, is correct.

846

:

It's insane.

847

:

It's top of the line.

848

:

It's the type of cacao that I've been

looking for for a long time and, uh, happy

849

:

to find your, your, your company addictive

wellness and literally meeting all the,

850

:

all the boxes take him off and like,

not even just stopping at, uh, organic

851

:

and you know, a Rabin Nasht Nal volcanic

realm, but then also the mycotoxin free.

852

:

That's a huge one.

853

:

That's a big point.

854

:

That's I think becoming, um, more

well known, uh, is, is this, uh,

855

:

mycotoxin with like coffee and cacao.

856

:

Uh, so, incredible.

857

:

But what's, what was kind of the

issue with your sourcing of cacao?

858

:

Um, obviously, you have to get it from

specifically there, but what was the

859

:

issue with kind of like the cartels and,

um, their involvement and lack of U.

860

:

S.

861

:

involvement, I guess?

862

:

Sage: Yeah.

863

:

So, so going back a little ways, the

U S used to have a military base in,

864

:

in Ecuador, and that had a kind of a

nice ripple effect in the sense of the,

865

:

the cartels tend to keep some distance

from the U S military, because that's

866

:

the only, the only, you know, more

bad ass group of people on the block,

867

:

uh, with, with, with bigger weapons.

868

:

So.

869

:

That things were good during those

times in many ways, but Ecuador,

870

:

they got a, you know, a leader

involved who said, no more Americans.

871

:

We don't want you in here anymore.

872

:

No more, uh, colonization or whatever

you want to try to say that this is.

873

:

And so the American said,

okay, fine, we'll leave.

874

:

No problem.

875

:

See you guys later.

876

:

We got the whole rest of the

world to go hang out with.

877

:

And so they left and right in

came the cartels and they got

878

:

really powerful in, in Ecuador.

879

:

And it has, it's very

tied to the cocaine trade.

880

:

The.

881

:

Next thing that happened was this

past year or earlier, earlier

882

:

this year, um, the president said.

883

:

We are declaring a state of emergency

and declaring war on the cartels because

884

:

the cartels had gained so much power.

885

:

The cartels didn't just roll

over and said, okay, come get us.

886

:

They said, okay, you're

going to declare war on us.

887

:

We will declare war back on you.

888

:

Let's go.

889

:

And violence went through the

roof from one day to the next.

890

:

You had groups of armed gangsters

storming into live TV broadcasts.

891

:

And basically it almost like, um,

that, that thing from the, the,

892

:

the pirate movie where he says,

I'm the, I'm the captain now, like.

893

:

I'm your, I'm your broadcaster now.

894

:

It really gnarly and the

violence, it became so crazy.

895

:

And the extortion that just happened

with, you know, just like common

896

:

people on the street being told,

pay me this crazy amount of money

897

:

or I'm going to kill you right now.

898

:

And they just say, I

don't have that money.

899

:

It's okay.

900

:

I'll kill you now.

901

:

Um, just insanity.

902

:

And so the result of this was

our cacao is not grown on farms.

903

:

It's not grown somewhere.

904

:

That's.

905

:

easy to get to, and so people have

to go to somewhat remote regions.

906

:

People weren't very excited to

travel when you have these marauding

907

:

gangsters all over the place.

908

:

So it's hard to get people to go and

harvest cacao from these areas where it

909

:

grows in the wild, in the rainforest,

and then hard to get them to transport

910

:

it back because you had the colliding

things happening at the same time.

911

:

You have incredible amounts of violence

and people trying to take advantage

912

:

of the less Uh, well protected, I

suppose you could say in Ecuador.

913

:

And at the same time you have

skyrocketing cacao prices.

914

:

So now anybody transporting

cacao in their vehicle, it's like

915

:

transporting gold there there.

916

:

So cacao transport was becoming

targets for armed robbery.

917

:

On the highway.

918

:

And so for most of this year, we hadn't

been able to get any processing done.

919

:

There hadn't been able

to get any shipments out.

920

:

And with our partners there, we actually

earlier in the year did have a whole

921

:

production, a whole thing ready to go.

922

:

A whole shipment ready to go out.

923

:

The one of the people involved with the

factory saw the whole situation that

924

:

was going on with the skyrocketing cacao

prices, the difficulty harvesting, and.

925

:

Basically decided to cash out.

926

:

He went on the side and sold off all the

inventory, all the machinery, everything.

927

:

And there's nothing.

928

:

And so the cacao that was supposed to,

you know, come back in the spring and last

929

:

us through most of the rest of the year.

930

:

Never came so it's been just like working

so hard, trying to get, trying to get it

931

:

harvested, trying to get it processed.

932

:

And we have to have it processed to

very specific standards to maintain all

933

:

these properties that we are so proud

of with our chocolate and our cacao.

934

:

So finally, finally, we got

it produced and then had to

935

:

figure out how to get it here.

936

:

And nobody wants to ship in

terms of international shipping

937

:

companies out of Ecuador right

now, for all the same reasons.

938

:

And so DHL wanted to charge us some

insane prices to get the product over.

939

:

They wanted to charge us like three

X, the value of the product itself,

940

:

which is just a total non starter.

941

:

Fortunately, we managed to

get a good discounted, like

942

:

last minute deal with FedEx.

943

:

As of now, we got about half the shipment

delivered last week, which I'm over the

944

:

moon about because it means we will have

chocolate for Black Friday customers.

945

:

The other half is still sitting in

Ecuador and has no tracking updates

946

:

for the past week and a half, so

I'm a little bit concerned still.

947

:

Still, the drama is not totally over.

948

:

To know that we will have chocolate

for people for the holidays.

949

:

I am so relieved.

950

:

Evan: Yeah, and also, uh, massive thank

you from myself, my wife, everyone else

951

:

who enjoys your chocolate, because you're

really providing, uh, something incredibly

952

:

unique, and in many ways supporting the

continued growth of Ariba Nacional, and

953

:

supporting Yeah, that whole process.

954

:

So, uh, your headache, I promise is,

uh, it's not for nothing, very greatly

955

:

enjoyed, and I appreciate it so much.

956

:

Sage: The thing, just to quickly

interject based off of something you that.

957

:

And a lot of people don't think of this,

but when you consume this kind of cacao,

958

:

you're actually protecting the rainforest

because you're incentivizing these people

959

:

to be good stewards of the rainforest.

960

:

You know, a lot of people are

incentivized to cut it down for

961

:

logging, to cut it down for mining.

962

:

Here, you're making the most lucrative

thing for people to protect that

963

:

rainforest where this wild cacao grows.

964

:

That it's not necessarily true

of cacao grown on a plantation.

965

:

So, um, this is like, it has

other positive ripple effects

966

:

that most people don't even know.

967

:

Evan: Yeah.

968

:

Cause this cacao is essentially, it's

just, like you said, it's wild harvested.

969

:

So this is not planted and then,

you know, taking out other native

970

:

plants and then put cacao here.

971

:

This is wild grown cacao.

972

:

I mean, it's biodynamic on

the next level, essentially.

973

:

Right?

974

:

Like this is, this is

the best that it gets.

975

:

Sage: It's right.

976

:

It's hard to imagine anything better.

977

:

Um, , once you start having this kind of,

it's hard to go back to anything else.

978

:

Evan: Yeah, it really is.

979

:

Um, no, I was just, I was going to

mention, I had been to, uh, Ecuador

980

:

in 2018, um, very different situation

down there at that time and yeah, very

981

:

easy to get around like great country

982

:

Sage: peaceful.

983

:

It was the most people peaceful

places until very recently.

984

:

Evan: Yeah, a hundred percent.

985

:

I mean, uh, and then as well,

they use the U S dollar, which

986

:

makes it very easy as a traveler.

987

:

So, um, yeah, it's a, it's a shame and

it's really sad to hear that, but I'm

988

:

glad that things are hopefully turning a

corner and getting a little bit better.

989

:

Also, I was just going to say, it's,

it's so sad to see kind of, you know,

990

:

we talk about the cocaine trade and the

fact that cocaine as well comes from a

991

:

really Medicinal and great plant as well.

992

:

The, um, the coca leaf, which is

993

:

Sage: super food of the highest order.

994

:

Yep.

995

:

Evan: I tell people all the time, and they

kind of freak out when I tell them that

996

:

I would chew coca leaves all the time.

997

:

When I was in South America, it helped

so much when you're hiking, it makes

998

:

you feel like you're energized for

the entire day, but like a sustained

999

:

energy, not a crazy wired energy.

:

00:51:43,315 --> 00:51:46,365

And then as well, you,

I wasn't super hungry.

:

00:51:46,475 --> 00:51:47,205

I could go.

:

00:51:47,585 --> 00:51:49,955

Long distances without drinking

water, which is probably not a

:

00:51:49,955 --> 00:51:53,945

good thing, especially for altitude

sickness, but, um, it's incredible.

:

00:51:53,945 --> 00:51:59,075

And so, given the opportunity,

would you formulate a chocolate with

:

00:51:59,195 --> 00:52:04,385

some coca leaves, but like in the

truest sense, not obviously cocaine?

:

00:52:04,945 --> 00:52:06,675

Sage: If I could do it

without going to jail yet.

:

00:52:06,675 --> 00:52:08,745

Evan: Yeah, yeah.

:

00:52:08,925 --> 00:52:12,195

Uh, what, what were some of the

benefits you noticed from coca leaves?

:

00:52:12,705 --> 00:52:17,475

Sage: So, um, I, I have a minimal

personal experience consuming it, but,

:

00:52:17,485 --> 00:52:19,875

but definitely the, the sustained energy.

:

00:52:19,885 --> 00:52:24,805

One really unique factor about it is

that amongst green leafy plants, it's

:

00:52:24,805 --> 00:52:28,205

a rare one that actually contains Omega

three essential fatty acids, which

:

00:52:28,231 --> 00:52:30,381

basically unheard of amongst green leaves.

:

00:52:30,641 --> 00:52:35,041

Um, and the, the other thing that people

have to understand about it is that it

:

00:52:35,041 --> 00:52:41,101

takes a huge amount, like, like imagine

like seven trash bags full of coca leaves.

:

00:52:41,631 --> 00:52:46,751

To make a line of cocaine and so you're

consuming such a small Little thing in a

:

00:52:46,761 --> 00:52:51,251

huge quantity and as with anything Dosage

is a key factor whether we're talking

:

00:52:51,251 --> 00:52:54,031

about the amount of time you spend in

the sauna the right amount of chocolate

:

00:52:54,041 --> 00:52:58,786

to eat or What you're going to do with

a coca leaf or even drinking water.

:

00:52:58,836 --> 00:53:02,306

If you drink the right amount of water,

we'll pretty much, everybody's going

:

00:53:02,306 --> 00:53:03,636

to agree that it's healthy for you.

:

00:53:04,146 --> 00:53:07,856

I know a couple of people who will say you

should minimize your water consumption.

:

00:53:07,866 --> 00:53:08,846

I'm not so sure about that though.

:

00:53:09,376 --> 00:53:13,296

But on the other hand, if you drink 10

gallons a day, you're not going to feel

:

00:53:13,296 --> 00:53:15,756

so great dosage with anything is key.

:

00:53:15,916 --> 00:53:19,926

And if your dosage of the coca

leaf is so radically different

:

00:53:19,936 --> 00:53:23,056

from what nature designed, it's

not going to go so well, long term.

:

00:53:23,771 --> 00:53:27,551

Evan: Yeah, you're a hundred

percent on point with that.

:

00:53:27,561 --> 00:53:33,831

You know, the, the coca leaves that I was

chewing barely numbed my mouth at maximum.

:

00:53:33,831 --> 00:53:38,551

And, you know, there's like

no major physical difference.

:

00:53:38,551 --> 00:53:41,881

It's more, it's, it's literally like

consuming an adaptogen, you know, you

:

00:53:41,881 --> 00:53:46,631

have to tune in maybe a little bit more

noticeable, like slightly more noticeable.

:

00:53:46,631 --> 00:53:50,241

Um, I, cause it's, it is very nice

for like if you're having a headache

:

00:53:50,241 --> 00:53:51,361

or something along those lines.

:

00:53:51,371 --> 00:53:52,301

So there is like,

:

00:53:52,591 --> 00:53:53,331

Sage: like I'm sure you were there.

:

00:53:53,868 --> 00:53:58,128

Evan: It helped massively with the

altitude with headaches, uh, which were

:

00:53:58,128 --> 00:53:59,698

very common for me with the altitude.

:

00:53:59,698 --> 00:54:03,328

And also just it, I needed

to drink more water.

:

00:54:03,338 --> 00:54:04,498

That was one of the big things.

:

00:54:04,508 --> 00:54:08,128

But, uh, when you're, when you're

chewing on cocoa leaves, it really

:

00:54:08,128 --> 00:54:13,228

just, man, like I understand why people

chew those and go on crazy expedition

:

00:54:13,238 --> 00:54:15,148

hikes, because it just sustains you.

:

00:54:15,148 --> 00:54:16,268

You don't feel super hungry.

:

00:54:16,268 --> 00:54:17,348

You're not super thirsty.

:

00:54:17,498 --> 00:54:20,838

You can just track and

yeah, it's just like a very.

:

00:54:21,833 --> 00:54:24,013

Like constant energy.

:

00:54:24,013 --> 00:54:24,663

It's awesome.

:

00:54:24,703 --> 00:54:29,263

Um, so I'm, I'm a huge fan and yeah, super

sad to see kind of where it's gone with

:

00:54:29,263 --> 00:54:31,613

that, but it is such as life, I guess.

:

00:54:31,713 --> 00:54:33,924

Sage: We'll see brings maybe

when, when AI government takes

:

00:54:33,924 --> 00:54:35,044

over, it'll illustrate and things.

:

00:54:35,422 --> 00:54:35,802

Evan: Yeah.

:

00:54:37,132 --> 00:54:37,532

Let's see.

:

00:54:37,532 --> 00:54:38,462

Let's see what happens.

:

00:54:38,462 --> 00:54:41,672

It's either straightened out

or, or down a worse path.

:

00:54:41,682 --> 00:54:42,182

We'll see.

:

00:54:43,792 --> 00:54:49,042

Um, but one more thing I wanted to mention

about your chocolates that I, Once again,

:

00:54:49,042 --> 00:54:57,492

appreciate , is your usage of intentional

adaptogens and not overdoing it?

:

00:54:57,862 --> 00:55:01,732

One of the things I really like is

your ingredient list isn't crazy long.

:

00:55:01,842 --> 00:55:06,102

It's got You know, the adaptogens

you intentionally wanted in there

:

00:55:06,352 --> 00:55:09,402

and in a good amount as well,

which I think is really important.

:

00:55:09,512 --> 00:55:13,032

Um, you know, a lot of the times

it's easy to say you have something

:

00:55:13,032 --> 00:55:15,942

on there and then it's such a

minuscule amount that you're really

:

00:55:15,942 --> 00:55:17,662

not going to receive that benefit.

:

00:55:17,662 --> 00:55:22,882

So I, Deeply appreciate that and

as well using monk fruit as a

:

00:55:22,882 --> 00:55:24,142

sweetener, as opposed to sugar.

:

00:55:24,192 --> 00:55:26,392

That's just really appreciate that.

:

00:55:26,402 --> 00:55:29,862

And, uh, yeah, I could tell, you

know, I didn't know the name of

:

00:55:29,862 --> 00:55:33,702

some of these adaptogens, but I knew

that you were doing it with a very

:

00:55:34,022 --> 00:55:36,162

serious intention and outcome with it.

:

00:55:36,842 --> 00:55:37,262

Sage: Thank you.

:

00:55:37,262 --> 00:55:37,552

Yeah.

:

00:55:37,562 --> 00:55:42,012

I, I wanted to use these chocolates as

a way to introduce these adaptogens.

:

00:55:42,632 --> 00:55:46,472

So you have a crazy ingredient

list of 30 different adaptogens.

:

00:55:46,532 --> 00:55:48,612

First of all, you're not putting

that much of any individual one in

:

00:55:48,612 --> 00:55:49,672

there, which gets a little bit weird.

:

00:55:50,192 --> 00:55:53,142

And then nobody gets to know any

of them because, okay, this crazy

:

00:55:53,142 --> 00:55:54,422

long list words I've never heard of.

:

00:55:54,927 --> 00:55:58,367

If you put somewhere in the range of like

four to six in there, there's a chance

:

00:55:58,407 --> 00:56:00,077

people might actually take a closer look.

:

00:56:00,497 --> 00:56:03,057

So that's why we put pictures of them on

the back of the box, that we want people

:

00:56:03,057 --> 00:56:06,337

to really get to know these and maybe

even start consuming them on their own.

:

00:56:07,277 --> 00:56:09,717

You know, maybe they start taking

astragalus for a cleaner energy, or

:

00:56:09,717 --> 00:56:13,147

maybe they start taking cordyceps

to build that core energy reserve.

:

00:56:13,447 --> 00:56:17,182

And I do, Really think it's important

that, like you said, that we put enough

:

00:56:17,212 --> 00:56:21,212

in there to create a real experience for

somebody, because I realized first, a

:

00:56:21,212 --> 00:56:25,002

matter of personal integrity and pride,

but also just from a pure business

:

00:56:25,022 --> 00:56:29,022

perspective, I can hype somebody up

talking about it just like this and get

:

00:56:29,022 --> 00:56:30,522

them to buy a bar of chocolate one time.

:

00:56:30,852 --> 00:56:31,692

No problem, fine.

:

00:56:32,022 --> 00:56:36,092

But they're not going to come back if

they don't have an experience, if they

:

00:56:36,092 --> 00:56:39,372

don't feel it, if they don't, you know,

if it's not a fully embodied experience

:

00:56:39,382 --> 00:56:42,532

for them, so you got to make it serious.

:

00:56:42,532 --> 00:56:42,662

Yeah.

:

00:56:43,577 --> 00:56:47,827

Evan: Yeah, well, the other point

of that is and I noticed this a

:

00:56:47,827 --> 00:56:53,157

lot when so my my wife does tea

ceremonies and They're all in silence.

:

00:56:53,177 --> 00:56:58,257

You just for you know, 45 minutes to an

hour sitting with tea drinking bowls and

:

00:56:58,257 --> 00:57:02,927

bowls of tea and just sitting with inner

reflections and and the tea itself and the

:

00:57:02,927 --> 00:57:08,017

thing that I Really love about that whole

practice aside from just like a meditation

:

00:57:08,017 --> 00:57:13,232

of it But is the fact that you're sitting

with tea a single ingredient food,

:

00:57:13,242 --> 00:57:14,572

drink, whatever you want to call it.

:

00:57:14,742 --> 00:57:18,112

And noticing the effects that it has on

the body and even like the variations in

:

00:57:18,112 --> 00:57:22,622

the tea, but that's something we don't

do very often, which is sit with a food

:

00:57:22,622 --> 00:57:29,382

or herb and just that one and just deeply

feel what that's doing to the body.

:

00:57:29,382 --> 00:57:30,057

I think that's.

:

00:57:30,307 --> 00:57:34,267

Not a common thing for us to do and as

well, uh, you know, like doing like the

:

00:57:34,267 --> 00:57:38,727

elimination diet, for example, you cut

out all these foods that are trigger

:

00:57:38,727 --> 00:57:43,217

foods and then you slowly reintegrate

them and just notice how is this

:

00:57:43,387 --> 00:57:45,517

affecting my body and my digestive system.

:

00:57:45,717 --> 00:57:49,717

Um, and so when I do that with tea,

it's a great opportunity to just

:

00:57:49,737 --> 00:57:51,707

really feel the effects of the tea.

:

00:57:51,707 --> 00:57:52,157

And I think.

:

00:57:52,482 --> 00:57:53,322

With these as well.

:

00:57:53,382 --> 00:57:56,772

It's very specific to the

ingredients that are in there and

:

00:57:56,772 --> 00:57:58,112

noticing the benefits of them.

:

00:58:00,042 --> 00:58:01,082

Sage: You're speaking my language there.

:

00:58:01,082 --> 00:58:05,152

When people ask about the different

adapters and how to try out, how to

:

00:58:05,152 --> 00:58:07,202

take them, I say the exact same thing.

:

00:58:07,212 --> 00:58:11,402

I say, take a half a teaspoon of this

herb, put it in, uh, like four ounces of

:

00:58:11,402 --> 00:58:16,142

hot water, stir it up, let it dissolve,

sit somewhere quiet, sip it slowly.

:

00:58:16,342 --> 00:58:18,512

Pay attention to how you feel,

pay attention to your breath,

:

00:58:18,512 --> 00:58:19,742

pay attention to your energy.

:

00:58:20,132 --> 00:58:23,552

And I, I liken it to a

first date with that herb.

:

00:58:23,642 --> 00:58:25,652

You want to get to know the

herbs one by one so you can

:

00:58:25,662 --> 00:58:26,732

understand how to relate to them.

:

00:58:27,322 --> 00:58:29,922

You wouldn't take somebody on

a first date to a rave because

:

00:58:29,932 --> 00:58:30,832

it's going to be too crazy.

:

00:58:30,832 --> 00:58:32,102

There's too much else going on.

:

00:58:32,392 --> 00:58:33,992

You're not going to get

to know them, right?

:

00:58:34,002 --> 00:58:36,222

You're going to end the night's going

You're like, wow, that was nuts.

:

00:58:36,222 --> 00:58:37,382

But what the heck just happened?

:

00:58:37,382 --> 00:58:37,832

Who are you?

:

00:58:38,212 --> 00:58:38,822

I don't know yet.

:

00:58:39,597 --> 00:58:42,597

You go somewhere quiet, somewhere

romantic, one on one, nice candlelit

:

00:58:42,607 --> 00:58:46,517

dinner with Reishi Mushroom or, or

Ashwagandha or Astragalus, you come

:

00:58:46,517 --> 00:58:50,117

away from that really knowing what just

happened and who this other person is.

:

00:58:50,537 --> 00:58:54,947

And then, you know, after a while, you

can have a few of them over for a party.

:

00:58:54,947 --> 00:58:59,017

I know we're going to kind of into, out

of monogamy in my little, uh, in my,

:

00:58:59,057 --> 00:59:02,057

my little metaphor here, it's getting

a little too crazy, but you know, you

:

00:59:02,057 --> 00:59:05,647

get the point, like you start off, um,

with, with one and then you can get

:

00:59:05,657 --> 00:59:08,277

into the others and you go from there,

get to know them one on one and then

:

00:59:09,472 --> 00:59:11,462

Evan: Sage, you're crushing

it with these examples here.

:

00:59:12,712 --> 00:59:15,312

You're, you're, you're managing to

take everything and then just putting

:

00:59:15,312 --> 00:59:17,262

it in an excellent way to explain it.

:

00:59:17,262 --> 00:59:17,512

Yeah.

:

00:59:18,052 --> 00:59:18,502

Hands down.

:

00:59:18,512 --> 00:59:19,702

That's, that's literally it.

:

00:59:19,712 --> 00:59:22,802

You're, you're spending quality

time with that single ingredient

:

00:59:22,812 --> 00:59:24,212

and, uh, getting to know it better.

:

00:59:24,212 --> 00:59:24,532

So.

:

00:59:25,787 --> 00:59:28,597

I appreciate all the work

that you've done with this.

:

00:59:28,597 --> 00:59:32,757

And as well, I think it's important to

note that you don't just have chocolate

:

00:59:32,797 --> 00:59:37,127

and cacao powder on, uh, you know,

addictive wellness, but you also have

:

00:59:37,357 --> 00:59:41,217

a lot of these adaptogens as well,

which is something I really appreciate.

:

00:59:41,217 --> 00:59:46,847

And, you know, now knowing your

strict process with the cacao, I

:

00:59:46,847 --> 00:59:50,777

can only imagine It carries right

on over into all these adaptogens.

:

00:59:50,947 --> 00:59:55,917

Sage: The purity, the potency, it

is something that I'm obsessed over.

:

00:59:55,947 --> 00:59:59,497

I want people to have the ultimate

experience because beyond just Any

:

00:59:59,507 --> 01:00:01,517

aspirations of, of business success.

:

01:00:01,787 --> 01:00:06,447

I just love these adaptogens and I

want people to have amazing experiences

:

01:00:06,447 --> 01:00:10,347

with them and for them to share it

with others and just, uh, to have as

:

01:00:10,347 --> 01:00:12,397

much of a positive ripple type effect.

:

01:00:12,567 --> 01:00:13,757

So they gotta be good.

:

01:00:14,717 --> 01:00:19,677

Evan: Uh, no, I, I appreciate all, all

of the work that you do and, uh, you

:

01:00:19,677 --> 01:00:24,882

know, As you had mentioned earlier on

in this podcast about you kind of paved

:

01:00:24,882 --> 01:00:28,592

the way for yourself, you know, and you

have your own experience, you slay your

:

01:00:28,592 --> 01:00:32,722

own dragon, and it's almost natural for

you to want to relay that information.

:

01:00:32,722 --> 01:00:36,442

And that's largely why I started

this podcast was dealing with a

:

01:00:36,442 --> 01:00:38,052

lot of gastrointestinal issues.

:

01:00:38,242 --> 01:00:41,512

It was one of those things that I

had to largely navigate on my own in

:

01:00:41,512 --> 01:00:48,057

terms of Finding more of a health and

wellness holistic style practice to

:

01:00:48,207 --> 01:00:52,137

heal my body as opposed to uh, the

western approach which Not saying

:

01:00:52,137 --> 01:00:53,867

that's not right for certain people.

:

01:00:53,877 --> 01:00:54,837

It just wasn't for me.

:

01:00:55,067 --> 01:00:58,627

And, uh, yeah, so this, the whole

purpose of this podcast is like, I look

:

01:00:58,627 --> 01:01:02,977

back to if I was that seven year old

kid at home, maybe a little bit older,

:

01:01:03,167 --> 01:01:07,327

uh, to understand this podcast, but

I wanted to provide that information

:

01:01:07,327 --> 01:01:11,147

that I would have been seeking and,

uh, yeah, so I can tell it's the same

:

01:01:11,147 --> 01:01:14,107

thing with you drinking those rough

smoothies and then finding a way.

:

01:01:14,362 --> 01:01:18,552

To make it enjoyable so that everyone

can just enjoy their adapted gins in a

:

01:01:18,552 --> 01:01:22,372

way that doesn't make them feel slightly

nauseous after drinking a smoothie.

:

01:01:23,822 --> 01:01:25,732

Sage: And thank you for everything

that you're doing to share all this

:

01:01:25,732 --> 01:01:28,802

information with people and help

people take steps forward in their

:

01:01:28,802 --> 01:01:29,782

health and their family's health.

:

01:01:30,432 --> 01:01:31,552

Evan: Yeah, no, thank you, Sage.

:

01:01:31,552 --> 01:01:32,342

I appreciate that.

:

01:01:32,382 --> 01:01:35,992

And I want to also just kind

of open up the floor here as we

:

01:01:36,272 --> 01:01:39,932

are coming to a conclusion on

this podcast episode to share.

:

01:01:40,492 --> 01:01:42,972

Anything that you would

love to share with people.

:

01:01:43,152 --> 01:01:46,232

Uh, it could be related

to addictive wellness.

:

01:01:46,232 --> 01:01:48,592

It could be related to anything off topic.

:

01:01:48,832 --> 01:01:50,262

This is kind of just your opportunity.

:

01:01:50,262 --> 01:01:52,762

And then as well, uh, how

people can connect with you.

:

01:01:52,782 --> 01:01:57,292

Um, and then I just want to quickly

mention before I forget Sage was awesome

:

01:01:57,292 --> 01:01:59,932

enough to provide us with a discount code.

:

01:01:59,932 --> 01:02:03,912

So that is going to be in the description,

the show notes of, uh, today's episode.

:

01:02:03,912 --> 01:02:07,757

So go ahead and check that out so you can,

uh, Get a little thank you from Sage, uh,

:

01:02:07,757 --> 01:02:09,957

and try out some of his amazing chocolate.

:

01:02:09,957 --> 01:02:11,237

But Sage, the floor is yours.

:

01:02:11,797 --> 01:02:14,077

Sage: So I would just say, we've

obviously mentioned a lot of different

:

01:02:14,077 --> 01:02:16,917

foods, a lot of different herbs,

adaptogens throughout the conversation.

:

01:02:16,927 --> 01:02:18,607

And I know it can get

overwhelming for people.

:

01:02:18,607 --> 01:02:20,277

Sometimes they're going to think, what?

:

01:02:20,287 --> 01:02:23,287

He just mentioned all these like

10, 12, 15 different things.

:

01:02:23,907 --> 01:02:25,177

Do I have to start with all of them?

:

01:02:25,177 --> 01:02:25,897

That's not possible.

:

01:02:25,897 --> 01:02:27,717

I'm just going to start on not forget it.

:

01:02:27,717 --> 01:02:32,677

Like it's a nice idea, but no, not

for me, but that's, I hope you won't

:

01:02:32,687 --> 01:02:35,917

take that, that, that, uh, approach

what I want you to take away is.

:

01:02:36,277 --> 01:02:37,967

You don't have to start

with all of it at once.

:

01:02:38,057 --> 01:02:41,277

It's just a matter of picking

the one thing I mentioned that

:

01:02:41,277 --> 01:02:42,597

was the most interesting for you.

:

01:02:42,597 --> 01:02:43,917

Maybe it's a bar of chocolate.

:

01:02:44,277 --> 01:02:45,807

Maybe it's a stragglers.

:

01:02:45,847 --> 01:02:46,947

Maybe it's reishi mushroom.

:

01:02:47,767 --> 01:02:48,847

Maybe it's cacao powder.

:

01:02:49,247 --> 01:02:50,607

Incorporate one thing.

:

01:02:51,117 --> 01:02:52,217

Do that for a month.

:

01:02:52,427 --> 01:02:53,367

See how you feel.

:

01:02:53,767 --> 01:02:55,337

If it was great, Awesome.

:

01:02:55,387 --> 01:02:56,177

Keep doing it.

:

01:02:56,277 --> 01:02:59,757

And then maybe as you're just having

that becoming a comfortable part of

:

01:02:59,767 --> 01:03:03,297

your daily life, maybe you add in

one more new thing that also sounded

:

01:03:03,297 --> 01:03:05,117

interesting to you, just start with one.

:

01:03:05,477 --> 01:03:07,847

You don't need to go to

that rave on the beginning.

:

01:03:08,347 --> 01:03:09,737

Just make it easy for yourself.

:

01:03:09,767 --> 01:03:15,247

And it's amazing what one new thing in

your life can do and what, like, I had

:

01:03:15,247 --> 01:03:20,137

that one experience with a superfood

mix when I was a kid and look at what a

:

01:03:20,217 --> 01:03:21,927

ripple effect that created down the line.

:

01:03:22,147 --> 01:03:24,367

Just try one new thing and

see where it takes you.

:

01:03:25,597 --> 01:03:26,227

Evan: I like that.

:

01:03:26,227 --> 01:03:26,917

Definitely.

:

01:03:26,977 --> 01:03:30,057

Uh, we don't need to look at the entire

staircase, just the step in front of

:

01:03:30,057 --> 01:03:31,557

us and kind of take it from there.

:

01:03:31,557 --> 01:03:31,627

But.

:

01:03:32,662 --> 01:03:35,412

You led me to another

question I want to ask you.

:

01:03:35,422 --> 01:03:36,082

Sorry.

:

01:03:36,102 --> 01:03:41,732

But, uh, what, what is, uh, what

would be, you know, your top three,

:

01:03:41,962 --> 01:03:47,022

uh, adaptogen slash superfoods we put

cacao in there, um, that you would

:

01:03:47,022 --> 01:03:51,792

recommend for someone who's never even

dabbled in any of these things, like

:

01:03:51,802 --> 01:03:55,132

what would you recommend for them to

kind of start with and, and go on to

:

01:03:57,282 --> 01:03:57,622

Sage: read?

:

01:03:58,382 --> 01:04:04,912

The easiest adaptogens to start with are

astragalus, turkey tail, and gynostemma,

:

01:04:05,272 --> 01:04:07,502

because they all taste delicious.

:

01:04:07,592 --> 01:04:08,962

You don't have to do anything fancy.

:

01:04:09,302 --> 01:04:12,722

You just add it to hot

water and drink it as a tea.

:

01:04:13,342 --> 01:04:16,322

Even somebody who has zero interest

in health and no palate for healthy

:

01:04:16,322 --> 01:04:18,092

foods is going to enjoy this.

:

01:04:18,221 --> 01:04:20,212

So it's a great place to start.

:

01:04:21,777 --> 01:04:25,277

Beyond that, of course, cacao added to

anything is going to be pretty awesome.

:

01:04:25,607 --> 01:04:30,407

So, so big, big fan there, but just in

the adaptogen category, if you're not

:

01:04:30,407 --> 01:04:33,777

wanting to delve right into some of

the more bitter flavors, like a reishi

:

01:04:33,787 --> 01:04:37,596

mushroom, even though that can be such

a transformational herb, astragalus,

:

01:04:37,677 --> 01:04:42,787

turkey tail mushroom, and gynostemma

are three amazing starting points.

:

01:04:44,082 --> 01:04:44,692

Evan: That's awesome.

:

01:04:44,752 --> 01:04:48,971

Yeah, that's, uh, a good point is

some of them can taste a little rough.

:

01:04:48,982 --> 01:04:50,602

So I've learned

:

01:04:51,072 --> 01:04:52,882

Sage: from my old smoothie

days that you got to make it

:

01:04:52,882 --> 01:04:54,332

acceptable to the old taste buds.

:

01:04:55,162 --> 01:04:55,762

Evan: I like that.

:

01:04:55,812 --> 01:04:56,602

I like that Sage.

:

01:04:56,632 --> 01:05:00,522

Well, Sage, uh, your,

uh, wealth of knowledge.

:

01:05:00,522 --> 01:05:04,352

I appreciate you and, and truly

appreciate the work you're doing with, uh,

:

01:05:04,392 --> 01:05:07,122

bringing this high quality cacao out my

:

01:05:07,902 --> 01:05:08,221

Sage: pleasure.

:

01:05:08,221 --> 01:05:08,422

Yeah.

:

01:05:08,422 --> 01:05:10,272

And for anybody who wants

to find our stuff, you can

:

01:05:10,272 --> 01:05:11,182

check out addictive wellness.

:

01:05:11,302 --> 01:05:11,612

com.

:

01:05:11,992 --> 01:05:14,622

As Evan mentioned, we got the discount

code ready to go for you guys.

:

01:05:14,962 --> 01:05:18,582

Um, if you enjoyed this kind of

information, you can, uh, I'm.

:

01:05:19,157 --> 01:05:22,207

Kind of obsessed as you can tell and

really enjoy sharing so I've got a whole

:

01:05:22,207 --> 01:05:25,617

YouTube channel and Instagram page and

all that at Addictive Wellness where

:

01:05:25,877 --> 01:05:28,747

I speak pretty endlessly about this

kind of stuff and would be happy to

:

01:05:28,757 --> 01:05:31,667

have anybody else along for the ride

and you can even send us questions and

:

01:05:31,667 --> 01:05:34,237

we'll make videos in response to your

questions and have a lot of fun with it.

:

01:05:35,057 --> 01:05:39,437

Evan: All of, uh, Sage's contact

information and where you can connect will

:

01:05:39,437 --> 01:05:40,767

be in the description in the show notes.

:

01:05:40,767 --> 01:05:41,777

So please check them out.

:

01:05:41,797 --> 01:05:44,577

And, uh, yeah, thank you so much,

Sage, for all the work that you do.

:

01:05:45,567 --> 01:05:46,437

Sage: Thank you for having me on.

:

01:05:47,117 --> 01:05:47,897

Evan: Alrighty, everyone.

:

01:05:47,987 --> 01:05:49,037

We'll catch you on the next one.

Links

Chapters

Video

More from YouTube