Audley Travel (Amy C is our guest)

https://www.audleytravel.com/

https://www.audleytravel.com/us/africa/specialists/amy-c

Audley Travel Kenya Web Page (Tremendous Resource)

https://www.audleytravel.com/us/kenya/places-to-go

Nairobi (Capital of Kenya)

https://www.audleytravel.com/us/kenya/places-to-go/nairobi

Kenya Airways   

www.kenya-airways.com

Big Five (lion, leopard, rhinoceros, elephant, and Cape buffalo)

https://www.audleytravel.com/us/kenya/country-guides/big-five-in-kenya

Karen Nairobi (Suburb – ideal place to stay)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Karen,_Kenya

Karen Blixen (namesake of suburb Karen and author of Out of Africa)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Karen_Blixen

Karen Blixen museum

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rungstedlund

Nairobi National Park

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nairobi_National_Park

Karisia Hills

https://www.audleytravel.com/us/kenya/places-to-go/kenyas-northern-frontier/karisia-hills

Maasai People

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maasai_people

Maasai Mara National Park

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maasai_Mara

https://www.audleytravel.com/us/kenya/places-to-go/masai-mara-national-reserve

Great Migration

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Serengeti#Great_migration

Laikipia Plateau

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Laikipia_County\

Samburu National Park

https://www.audleytravel.com/us/kenya/places-to-go/parks-and-reserves-of-northern-kenya/samburu-national-reserve

Meru National Park

https://www.audleytravel.com/us/kenya/places-to-go/parks-and-reserves-of-northern-kenya/meru-national-park

Good afternoon and welcome to the how to train your wagon podcast.

The podcast that takes three generations of travelers around the

world to different destinations.

And in this episode,

The reason why people are so excited about river crossings is

because of how spectacular and dynamic and chaotic they are.

The great migration is essentially 2 million animals that are

attempting to cross this river.

At any given point, you might see a hundred, you might see 200, you

might see 50, you might see a hundred thousand and they might all try to

go at the same time across the river.

Today we're joined by Amy Czarnecki of Audley travel.

Amy is a travel specialist with Audley travel that among other

responsibilities helps plan safaris to Africa and other destinations.

I'm also joined by my wife, Kimberlee but first the warm welcome to Amy.

. Welcome.

Thanks for having me on behalf of Audley

so first what you say a little about yourself

so I'm an east Africa senior travel specialist with Audley travel, which

means that there's a dedicated region of the world that I put all of my

effort and thought into, I've done numerous research trips into the regions

in which I do design travel trips.

We do everything completely custom designed based on the client's desires

their whole portfolio who's coming, what their preferences are and their

total kind of idea of what their ideal budget and level of luxury would be.

We can do everything essentially as a company from door to door.

So we can do international travel from the U S all the way over to your destination.

And then certainly on the return taking care of all of the logistics

completely while you're on the ground.

So really there's very little left out of pocket specifically, I would say.

In the safari realm of what we do.

Certainly we do cover around 85 countries worldwide now including

us domestic at this point.

And so there are various countries that have elements that you do have a lot

of pieces on your own, but safari is one that tends to be more inclusive.

And just for the audience's benefit, recognize that we're recording this,

hopefully what is the tail end of COVID?

While I think we've seen the worst of it, I think we see the

it'll light up into the tunnel and hopefully we're leaving the tunnel.

Please be mindful that different countries are in different states right now.

And please be sure to check with the local travel guidance and conditions to get the

most current and up-to-date information.

Hey listeners.

If you like our podcast and enjoying traveling with your family, then

this is the right podcast for you.

Please share your support by clicking subscribe in however you listened to

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please enjoy our newest episodes.

As we are producing a new episode every week.

Amy first question is I think for many of us safaris are a

once in a lifetime dream travel.

So tell us about traveling to east Africa for a safari.

I'll say that.

Like you everyone thinks that this is the trip they're going to do one time.

And I can tell you very honestly, that 96% of people easily and I've,

yes, I've totally made that number up, but it does seem to be real.

They come back again.

Safari is a place that steals your heart.

Getting into east Africa, meeting the people, seeing the wildlife

in an untamed completely wild environment is just something that

can not be replicated other places.

It is.

Each country.

And I think that is also something that's really important to

recognize each country is uniquely different and does offer something

different from the country prior.

You get in, you get that initial experience.

And I have many clients that come in and they say, this is it.

I'm going one time.

I want to get, all of the iconic national parks off my list.

There's certain things I'm looking to see.

I saw it here.

I saw it there, a friend did it.

And I can almost tell you hands down, I speak with the same client the year

following doing a totally different trip to a different area of Africa.

So it is a place that completely the, bewitches is you and steals your heart.

And once people go they want to find a way to get back.

That's the truth.

Okay, great.

And so I guess one question is, east Africa obviously

encompasses a large area.

We structure this to allow a three-generation travel party to visualize

a focused vacation, for maybe something like a region of Europe, we may focus

on things over the course of a week, given the time and the expense of travel.

I imagine they're gonna want to travel for more than a week.

So knowing that our framework for safari might be different than

a framework for Western Europe.

Why don't you walk us through what you would envision for a great safari vacation

for a three-generation party of travel.

Absolutely.

So there is a lot of different factors that would go into which country you might

ultimately travel to level of fitness, level of activity, how much safari you

really do love as opposed to perhaps wanting to do some city maybe some beach

aspects for this particular conversation.

We've decided to focus on Kenya as a destination because it

offers a great deal of variety.

It specializes, I would say almost truly specializes in multi-generational

travel in that very specific safari camps and lodges we'll have a lots

of different activities to go to the different levels of activity

in any individual party of people.

So not only can it be customized for you based on how active you are, but then

each camp will then also have a variety of activities that you can then individually

select from, as you're coming along.

I really love the idea of doing Kenya.

I've done it with my family.

Just two generations, but I brought my 18 month old with me

and it was absolutely spectacular.

We basically focused on a few regions and that's what I would

suggest you do with safari.

So you need to prioritize, what are the most important

aspects of the trip for you?

Is there a specific animal that you want to see?

Some people absolutely have to see every giraffe there ever was or elephants with

the longest tusks, or they need to see Kilimanjaro, for example you need to

figure out what are the most important priorities, what are the things that

you're not willing to sacrifice on the.

And then you take those things and you speak to a specialist about it.

It can be some of the silliest things you've ever heard.

We really love, archery.

I have to drink goat, tea, goat, milk tea, I, whatever it might be

that they've seen somewhere else.

And then you can take those interests and pull them into a safari trip.

So what I would say is that you at least want to do, I think a minimum of a two

stops safari trip is what I would call it.

So picking two unique regions, if not three, I think three is ideal.

And there are very unique and biodiverse regions all throughout Kenya.

So you have these very interesting and unique ecosystems that you can

focus on based on your preferences.

That sounds great.

. Now talking about that in the areas, where would you recommend a stay like

on our first day or coming in, like how would you break that up into the

two destinations explain also like the places that you may put us in?

Absolutely.

So I would say on arrival from the U S there's really only one direct flight

from the U S and it comes out of JFK that direct flight is on Kenya airways, and

it lands around 10:30 in the morning.

So that's really the only flight option where you have the day on arrival to

perhaps do something or take it easy or settle in, essentially all the other

flights, aside from a few others that come in and like mid-afternoon, and right after

midnight, something like that, typically people are coming in the evening hours.

So you arrive that first night, you basically go straight to

your lodge and then you sleep.

You have that whole night's sleep depending on the person

you might spend a day and night.

Typically when you arrive, most people, there are a bunch of city center hotels

in Nairobi, but most people are, if, especially if they're going to spend

any time in Nairobi area, they're going out to a suburb called Karen.

The Karen suburb is quite literally where Karen blixen's house once was.

It's that whole area.

If you spend two nights in Nairobi, you can do things like go into Nairobi

national park, which is quite beautiful.

And it's right.

It's quite startling.

I think in terms of you have this national park with wild animals, lions,

and rhinos and whatnot set against, the backdrop of this, skyscraper

city behind you, which is quite incredible, then people might do, Karen

Blixen's museum cause they're a beads.

They'll go and do some shopping and souvenir stuff.

They'll go to the elephant orphanage, Daphne Sheldrick Some people adopt

elephants and do an evening tour there.

That's a little bit more private.

You can hike in the air gong Hills, if you're more active.

And there's just lots of little eateries and places to go throughout, the area you

go to the draft center and there's lots of different options as far as budget.

So there's some really basic options of places to stay on up to draft manner,

which is obviously world famous.

And you feed the draft from your hands at breakfast time in the morning.

You have lots of different options of places to go while you're there.

That sounds

incredible.

Yeah.

And so the first thing that comes up is typically we, we have that day,

we call it getting our sea legs.

We try and find some time to kill and tough where we can go to sleep and

then hopefully a good night's sleep.

And so the two first questions that come up are what would be your understanding?

Kenya is itself is very diverse.

What would be a good Kenyan meal?

What is, and what is good Kenyan Cuisine.

That's a really tough question.

I would say most people are not eating local foods typically.

So obviously Kenya was colonized many years ago.

So the food has come along.

And so what, when you're thinking of traditional Kenyan food, I would think

more in terms of like tribal food, I would think food like that, the

Maasai eating or the Sambura eating.

And a lot of that is , it's corn it's literally goat's milk it's, cows, blood

it's, things of that nature that typically people aren't So interested in eating

for, so you were excited about eating.

You'll find a lot of times is that the vegetables, the beans, the fresh food

eating the meats are just absolutely out of this world because everything

essentially so much more so than here, certainly in the U S is like essentially

farm to table, like farm to table.

Isn't a thing.

Cause that's just quite frankly how they dine people, grow everything.

Your fruits and vegetables are going to be some of the most incredible

flavors that you've ever had.

They're going to just burst off your tongue.

The meats are all, local and fresh, the fish is coming

right from the Indian ocean.

So anything that you have, even if it's more catered towards a Western

pallet or a European pallet is going to have, I think so much more flavor.

And then as you move through a safari, every camp will want to do some sort of

traditional night, but they'll do it on a traditional night with a Western flair.

I'll call it.

So you'll get something that's a bit bean base, rice-based corn based, but

actually it's all these local vegetables that you're very familiar with already

as opposed to a real local meal.

Sure.

I'll tell you, this is actually one of the more insightful questions we've asked.

I, when I started this process, I never thought this would be an

insightful question, but now the other thing is I question, I typically ask

when we've had our good first night.

We're rearing to go the next day.

Talk to me about , what is a Kenyan breakfast or what would

an American traveler experience for breakfast in Kenya?

And then the other question is Kenya to your coffee country.

Great questions.

Again, safari being a unique animal altogether is that they

have, what they call an American breakfast at a lot of these places.

So yeah.

Get a breakfast that you would be much more familiar with.

Again but it might be local mango.

It's going to be pineapples.

It's going to be these incredible bananas, and they'll have oats and

they'll have millet porridge and, so you'll get a lot of local grains and

a lot of local Porges for breakfast, you'll get they'll offer eggs.

But they, again they try to mimic what we're expecting the food to be a little

bit more when you're in these hotels and a little bit more when you're in the safari

lodges locals typically, I think locals that are more modern and city bound,

they will eat, three meals a day and snacks like we're so accustomed to doing.

But I do know from some conversations I've had with guys they're guides and

whatnot, Very much more commonly to eat two meals that are really like chip

potty and beans and corn and whatnot.

I think you find that it's going to be, again, much more catered

to our preferences for a breakfast meal, but it will be abundant.

There'll be more food than, what to do with is what's typical.

And it will be a lot of fresh fruits typically in the morning, fresh juices

that are hand squeezed, things like that.

I would say naturally to the region east Africa is naturally a coffee region.

The coffee beans.

They're absolutely incredible.

The roasting that's done there.

A lot of places are lots of co coffee plantations.

But also this is a bit from colonization.

So then there's also tea plantations and whatnot as well.

So truthfully it's a little bit of both and I would say.

Also truthfully that you'll probably have some of the best coffee you've

had potentially in your life out there as well as tea, because it's all

again, locally source locally made.

So it's actually absolutely delicious.

. Now that we've been there for a full day

I guess our jet lag is over, what would you have us do on our first big day?

Like our first big attraction in Kenya or Nairobi?

If you were in Nairobi, you would probably do to some of the more basic stuff.

Just seeing the area.

What I would more or less like Lee have you do is get on a light

aircraft flight and head out to your first safari destination.

So you would come from wherever your lodge is.

You'd go to the local domestic airport, you get on this 12

seater, plane and you fly out.

So they go to a lot of different areas and what I like to do, and I'm sure a

lot of safari operators think similarly is what I like to do is I have to build

your trip in climax for the wildlife expectation or based on your preferences.

What is the most important aspect of your trip?

So the first destination for me, I like to make sure that it has a good

biodiversity, lots of wildlife to see, but also offers a variety of activity.

I'm thinking for a more active family, I really love the Chrisia Hills

region, which is up on be a plateau.

I love attended camp called tumaren intend to camp and they do walking safaris.

So it's a, you can do a multi night just walking safari and pitch a tent, camping

with them with local Samburu guides and they have camels to support the walk.

But you can also do just walks out from a luxury camp.

So you can then base on being three generations.

You can then tailor those walks based on the physical fitness

level of each person in the group.

Or for example, you have the younger folks that want to go out, in the

morning and in the evening, perhaps the older individuals in the group

would rather just go in the mornings or just in the evenings and kind of rest.

I love this camp because it is incredibly personalized.

You feel like you've just gone to your best friend's house.

It's a place that makes you feel like you belong there and

that you've always belong there.

You get to know all the guides on a very personal level.

It's Like this area called the Laikipia plateau.

So the bugs and insects are very low because the elevation of the

plateau itself is quite high.

It's nice and cool in the evenings and warm and hot during the day.

They have some basic rock climbing that can be done.

You can do sundowners, overlooking the Plains and seeing all the wildlife there.

If you're there on the right days, they have a market day, you can

go out and go to the local markets and meet with the local people and

go through the markets and do some shopping and see what that's like.

And then the big, applause is getting out and actually doing these walking safaris.

You experienced the safari in ways that most people bypass.

So you see everything from the macro, from the macro, to the

micro, you're seeing all of it.

The big elephants, the Elan's, the zebra, but also the insects and

how they build their nests and, the different plant life that they live on.

And so it's really a, an incredible experience and you're doing it

with a local Samburu guide as well.

So the guides that they've had with them have been there 10, 15, 20 years.

And they know the area like the back of their hands.

So it's really exceptional.

Okay.

And so we're out there in the safari.

Talk to me about nights on a safari at a camp like that.

So with tumor and you would do your safaris during the day.

They wouldn't really offer a nighttime safari walking wise because of your

safety, but in the camp itself, they'll have a fire pit you'll do so

you can do, what's called a sundowner.

So you get a drink.

Everybody goes out on a walk, you get a drink, the sun is going down.

The wildlife is in the backdrop.

That's always amazing.

Usually with snacks or like a toppest kind of experience.

And then you'll come back to camp and you'll have dinner after dinner

and people clean up be washed, wash up, change your clothes.

You might go to the fire.

And it.

It tumor in, I think is a really special place.

There's a lot of times where there's wildlife, they don't have

a lot of predators in the area.

They do exist, but so there's a lot of wildlife that comes in

closer to camp and they'll come in closer to camp in the evenings.

So while you're sitting at the fire, you won't really see anything necessarily

quite close, but once the fire goes down, once everybody's done catching up, what

are the amazing things I saw that day?

You head back to your tent and.

That evening, as you turn out the lights, you might as you're getting

ready for sleep, you might hear or see some wildlife out in the distance.

And so sometimes if you keep the lights down low, you can actually

see things that are out there.

Zebras that are coming close into camp after everything's gotten

quiet Eland giraffe, even that are coming in close to camp.

There's just always, these camps are really special because they're not fenced.

They're really open all the time.

And obviously there's a lot of safety protocols in place, but in

theory, you can see wildlife all the

time.

Glad you said that.

Cause that was going to be my question.

Yeah.

They have night guards that patrol all of these camps have

night guards that go around all the time and they're in constant

communication about what's in camp.

And what is it doing and where is it?

So not to worry there.

That's good to know.

Okay.

Yeah, this sounds spectacular.

So it sounds like this is the you said probably more the grazing

animals more than it is the things that would be more carnivores.

Yeah.

So they're both, there,, they are both there.

But it's, there's not going to be as dense of a population of

predatory animals in the area.

So they do have a lion population of lion pride, but there's not going to be as

much around as say when we get you out to the Masai Mara, which is like big cat

country, it's all the big cats are there.

Lots of activity.

So this area just has a little less.

Okay.

And especially for a country like Africa with migrations and other

things, what would you command a three generation party visit?

It does.

It depends on what you want to see.

Kenya, I think is amazing as far as east African countries go, is that even in the

low season, there's still a lot to see.

There's still a lot to do.

The rains do come, but in smaller spurts.

So I would say if you're looking for great migration activity, which would

be part of our two or three stop, safari, destination itinerary, then

you're really for Kenya specifically, you definitely have to be there.

Maybe very tail end of July.

So August really August and September and perhaps early, early October,

that's when the migration is going back and forth between the Serengeti

ecosystem in Tanzania to the Masai Mara ecosystem, which obviously they're

the same ecosystem back and forth.

And they move back and forth in large groups and in smaller

groups based on the rains and the nutritional levels and the grasses.

So it really does depend how much activity you get based on what's

going on with nutrition in the area.

So explain to us like what a safari would be like, how many days would we

stay in one tent or would, or we would move on with a Jeep or do we walk or.

Absolutely.

So the first place I mentioned to Moran is a walking safari, but there's other places

on the Laikipia plateau, for example, that are fully, vehicle based safaris

that offer different activities as well.

So Camelbacks safari is horseback safaris, things like that.

You would go to Laikipia plateau maybe for three nights.

And you would do the region, whichever area you really isolated

in on you would do the region so that you could see as much diversity

as you can while you're there.

Certainly without feeling like you're moving around too much from there.

If you go from there you go right out to the Masai Mara, which you can do, you

would do three or four nights out there.

So if you did a two stop safari, I would probably suggest

three nights in one location.

And four nights in another location again.

So you don't feel like your safari is really rushed and short.

If you're doing a three-stop safari or more, and I've had people do

trips that are 30, 40 days long.

So if you're doing more it depends on how quickly you want to move through it.

But I like to do, specifically for Kenya, I like to do three nights, three nights,

three nights at a minimum, because almost all the areas in Kenya you have to fly to.

So if you're going to take all that time and energy to fly to a location,

then you might as well really feel like you're settling in and truly enjoying it.

Okay.

And when you speak to fly between deaf different destinations, I

know in conferring with friends of ours that traveled through Audley

travel and had a fantastic time.

I know they talked about the importance of packing light because they were

really going into the remote regions and there was a premium on unpacking.

Can you maybe speak.

The insofar as we're traveling between different areas, how people would

pack and what type of plane it is.

Absolutely.

So in, in Kenya and Tanzania, Uganda all of these areas, you do have to

take lights, light aircraft flight.

It is a propeller plane, basically it seats 12 and the weight limits

are obviously really important based on keeping the plane safe in flight.

So the weight limits do depends on which airline you have, but they're

take typically between 15 kilograms, and 20 kilograms, which is typically

33 pounds to 44 pounds for your checked luggage and also your hand luggage.

So the reason why, and for those of you can't see me, the reason I did

that is because I did air quotes around that because there are certain

ways get around it a little bit.

Basically, what you need to do is you need to make sure that you have a day

pack that you take physically on the plane with you, and it can have, your

camera your snacks, whatever your water bottle and things of that nature.

And then you have a duffel bag that is totally soft sided for the most part.

It is gotta be a specific size and dimension, and it can't wait any

more than 33 pounds when you put it together with your hand luggage,

which would be your backpack.

And that in some cases goes under the plane and in some cases

goes inside the plane with you, but in the tail of the plane.

So you do end up having to be a little bit more strategic about how you pack, cause

you don't get to bring a roller board with you or a large suitcase with you.

And so you are typically thinking about lightweight, quick drawing materials

and clothing as opposed to your more luxurious cottons and jeans and things

of that nature, bringing it down to two shoes instead of four, that sort

of stuff, leaving the makeup at home.

Understood.

Yeah.

So again this first site sounds tremendous, you

mentioned was it the Masai mara

as a very even more robust, a second spot?

Yeah.

So if you were doing a two stop safari, I would say and again,

there's lots of other areas too.

So there's Amboseli where Kilimanjaro is at the base of Amboseli.

There's late night, Nyasha, there's Savo, there's all these other areas.

But if you want to really diverse destinations, I personally tend to

really like Laikipia plateau, which is a very diverse ecosystem, mountains,

five different species that you can't see anywhere else live here.

And you can do a little bit more activity typically in the area.

Then you can, some of the other places combined with the Masai

Mara is really spectacular.

The Masai Mara has a national reserve, run by.

Kenya.

And then it also has concessions and conservancies that essentially

border it all the way around.

So from the Tanzania border on each side of the national reserve, going

over the Northern part of the Mara down back to the Tanzania border and the

national reserve area is where, the great migration the river, the Mara river

is, and it's where people are typically wanting to go for the great migration,

sit along the river and watch the great migration, but you can also do your stay.

And what I like to recommend is doing your stay in a concession or a Conservancy.

Again, the, they have the same wildlife, the same big cats, the

same elephants, the same giraffe.

The migration will be in the conservancies in some way or

another as well from a concession.

Basically what you're looking at is.

A lower number of people and vehicles allowed in any given concession.

You have to be staying in a concession in order to do wildlife viewing in them.

And so you get far less traffic.

If you're at a really good siting, there's not going to be a lot of other

cars trying to also see the same thing.

And that could be a kill.

You could be watching a hunt, you could be watching just a beautiful elephant but

you won't be there with, 10 other cars.

That being said, you, when you're in the concession, you can come into

the Masai Mara national reserve and do a full day at the river.

If you want to and try to catch a river crossing.

The reason why people are so excited about river crossings is

because of how spectacular and dynamic and chaotic they are.

The great migration is essentially 2 million animals that are

attempting to cross this river.

At any given point, you might see a hundred, you might see 200, you

might see 50, you might see a hundred thousand and they might all try to

go at the same time across the river.

And but what I would say is what most people end up seeing is a big

lineup of animals waiting for the first one to be brave enough to go.

And so you have to wait.

And you're waiting it out with a lot of other vehicles

who are also waiting it out.

So it's nice to have this breakup with a concession.

So you come in, you try to see the great migration.

You try to see this river crossing event.

You can do two stops in the Mara if you want to, where you're doing some

nights and a concession and some nights in the national reserve, if you really

want to dedicate a lot more time to the river crossing, but if you're doing a

concession, you can leave the crowd behind and go to your much more exclusive, much

more isolated area where the only people who are there are people who are staying

at a larger camp that's in the region.

And of course, at a river crossing, these are crocodile infested rivers.

So

yes.

Yeah.

Crocodiles, hippos.

Yeah.

wildebeest and zebra trying to cross it's very, it's all very dramatic, exciting.

It's exciting.

Yeah.

And when they're not trying to cross the rivers and there's lions

and cheetahs and leopards all trying to catch them elsewhere.

So it's all very exciting.

Great..

Let's say for our purposes, we wanted to take on a third remote region to frequent.

Where would you have us finish up?

We could do it a couple of different ways.

So depending on the age of everyone in the group and thinking about in terms

of when you might travel and if COVID is a factor, to be honest, leaving the

country and are going to another country if everyone is over the age of 15 and

you wanted something really spectacular, I would send you to Rwanda, Uganda,

and I would send you guerrilla treking.

That's what I would do.

Wow.

You can get into both regions.

Uganda is very seamless with Kenya, or if you want to keep it

really safari based, maybe your group is not as physically active.

Maybe the difficulty of a train of gorilla tracking would be too much.

I would say on the front end of the trip, we could add Amboseli national

park, which has those absolutely incredible views of Kilimanjaro.

All those pictures of Kilimanjaro with the elephants in the foreground and this

incredible mountain in the background.

Those are all from Amboseli.

The.

Elephant population in Amboseli is absolutely incredible.

It's a very different ecosystem that is very reliant on the

glacier melt from Kilimanjaro.

And so it's also an ecosystem that over time is going to continue is

going to change and may not be the same in years to come when the glacier

is essentially gone and Kilimanjaro.

So I do think it's a really important ecosystem to explore.

If you're interested.

You also get a chance there to.

The elephants that have those really long tusks that go all the way to the

ground, or longer that's where they're transiting and traveling through, they

go between Amboseli essentially and Savo, which is closer to the beach, . Oh,

there's so many options, but your last, like very easy add on kind of

option, I would say is heading over to the Kenyan coast on the Indian ocean.

So if you have folks in your group that really liked the beach, maybe

they want to do some snorkeling or diving, or they want to see the whale

sharks depending on the time of year.

Getting out to the Kenyan coast would be a really interesting option as well.

White Sandy beaches, beautiful, pristine water completely

different cultural vibe as well.

It's a really beautiful place.

I think you've done a very nice job of speaking to someone.

How do you accommodate people that operate at different speeds?

How do you accommodate the kids and where some of the restrictions on

kids, what are the restrictions on, what might be some of the ways where

the older generation can, maybe go at a slower speed for some of this?

So thank you.

My question is, are there other aspects that you think this is really good for

kids or need to be of kids and suddenly for adults, other aspects that would be

really attractive for the grandparents and things that you've seen where grandparents

may want to stay ahead of some issues?

Absolutely.

So I think a lot of it just goes down or goes back to people's physical

capabilities, and really you're dealing with this just incredible plethora

of what people feel comfortable doing and what they're capable of doing.

And those conversations are so important to have when you're designing a safari.

And it could be as something as simple as.

We really love this camp, but actually all of the tents are, this arduous walk

from the main area, uphill up rocks, 75,000 steps to get from place to place.

And so some of those things might be important as part of the conversation

to make sure that you're going to the right place and you're staying

at the right accommodation as well as, what the kids might be interested

in and certainly their ages.

So there are a lot of different camps.

And another reason why I love Kenya so much, there are a lot of

different camps that really cater to a child and a family oriented trip.

They will have activities with their local guides.

They'll have basically like scouting or a ascari type activities.

They'll teach archery to the kids.

They'll take them out on community walks and do a community walk with

the children depending on their age and their interest level.

Of course.

Yeah.

And they'll do just really anything.

They'll teach them traditional ways, fire starting even like in

a traditional way of doing that.

And I've seen this.

Really diverse layering of how this has done and what families

are really comfortable with doing.

There are areas where you can get really in with the local community and you can

just literally quite let your child run and go and play with the local kids.

Obviously again, a pre COVID situation, but it would be one of those, one

of those things where you would say hopefully as this, we see the light

at the end of the tunnel of this we see those things starting to pick

up again where you can really engage with local families and whatnot.

So the kids, I think are.

The easiest because they really, we really have a family focus in

Kenya and the majority of camps will have some sort of child activity.

Some of them, a lot of we'll have pools.

They'll have massage, they'll have beadwork, they'll have something to

go to that will give the kids extra activities to do for your older clients.

I think what you really need to do is make sure again, that the

physical capabilities are being met.

And so do they have anything that you need to be concerned about?

Is it really that they can't do a lot of walking?

They, they need to sit and rest for a while or are they actually super active

and they're going to be bored to tears sitting in a vehicle all day long.

Because certainly that happens too.

For the most part, I would say safari is really.

Relaxing for a lot of people because you're not doing the driving, you're

not doing the talking, you're not doing the instructing or any of that.

You have this incredible guide who's in charge of all of it and ensuring that

you're getting to the right places at the right time to get the best wildlife.

And you're sitting laid back in a vehicle again, for the most part.

Taking it all in having this wildlife come 10 feet off the vehicle and just be

right there and then getting a complete lesson in what they're doing and why

they're doing it and their whole, biology.

I think that it tends to cater to everybody in those terms for your

older clients, I think you, are they somebody who really wants a massage?

Are they super into photography?

I think some of those things come out later, do they have a C-PAP machine?

You need to know the medical requirements and interests, do they want to sit down

and speak with elders of the tribal group?

Is that important to them?

And those kinds of things, the cultural aspects, I find oftentimes

tend to be more important for our older clientele than some of our kids.

Tremendous again, very inspiring.

And I think for us certainly great.

Iceland's a great example.

Sometimes we pick a hike where some people can do part of the

hike but not the entire hike.

And that tends to be a happy middle.

So speaking of medical issues is there a physician or some type of person

that knows medicine a little bit

yeah.

So there is basic, obviously there's first aid and basic first aide and

in all of the camps, but there's also clinics there's local clinics

dotted throughout the country.

And so it's, in the Masai Mara or in the like EPO, wherever you might

be, there is going to be a local clinic that can deal with quite

a bit of what might be going on.

If you do have a more major medical emergency, you would need to be

medivaced to Nairobi where they do have a very modern hospital.

They essentially are the most modern hospital in the area.

Okay, perfect.

Yeah.

I think she could speak to this, but do you want to ask them picky eater?

. That's this is a tough question.

I'll tell you that we have some picky eaters and we have allergies.

So what do you do when you have that coming to a safari when

there's probably limited food?

Yeah.

So they will do an exceptional job catering to, any kind of dietary needs.

So whether it is, I don't like this food, I love this food or an

allergy or, whatever it might be.

They, if in a safari setting, you do need to tell your specialist or whomever

is planning the trip in advance so that they can add that information.

And then camp can purchase food based on what they're going to be cooking for you.

And they'll meal plan based on what they are able to feed you.

So for example I'm vegan.

Obviously there's quite a bit of foods that I don't eat.

And so they'll make an entire amazing meal for everyone else that's at the table.

And it'll be some sort of steak or chicken or, who knows what it is,

it's this beautiful plate of food.

And then I'll have something they'll, I'll have something completely different.

So my food will be maybe in line with some of the side dishes that are going

on, but also then I'll have my own names.

So it'll be a chick pea fritter, it'll be grilled eggplant.

It'll be, some sort of fresh vegetable that's going on.

And they do a really great job at that.

So they, they do really well.

And there are some camps, again, that we might select based on your dietary needs.

So if you're kosher or gluten-free there's some places that are going

to be better at it than others.

And so depending on where, what your situation is, it is important to express

that so that you can get fitted into the right camps that are going to

be able to meet your needs the best.

I think that's good because I know with food allergies with our daughter, we

definitely are well ahead of planning on where they can and cannot go.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Another question so if we were going to go shopping for our souvenirs,

what kind of souvenirs would we want to bring back from Africa or Kenya?

Wow.

I'm from Kenya.

I like local traditional artwork.

So I like obviously the Messiah really famous for their beadwork and the

colors are really vibrant, other tribal groups are great with their fabrics.

If you're in Nairobi, cause Kazuri beads is all handmade and handcrafted

and they do all the jewelry by hand.

And so that's a really great option, but basically I think what

you're looking for is you want to purchase as locally as possible.

I think when you're shopping for souvenirs I.

I think village visit visits are tricky in terms of souvenir

shopping, just because a lot of times they're put on tourist villages.

So what you're actually really hoping for is much more of a unique experience,

a true interaction, as much as possible.

There are definitely souvenir shops that your guide can direct you to

that are going to be more in line.

But after that, going right to the source, so going right to the women,

making the beautiful bead work necklace that you have, these ha they'll make

these incredible collars basically.

And they'll be made out of leather and their hand stitched bead work with these

beautiful long beads trailing down in the front, and they can be put up on

your wall is art, or handmade paintings.

They'll do basically they'll do bead work on pretty much everything.

So yeah.

Quite literally coffee mugs with beadwork all over them and

beaded bowls and all of that.

And I think as long as you're getting it from the source, you'll

get this spectacular, very vibrant, very colorful piece of work.

That's true to the heritage of the area.

That

sounds perfect.

Exactly.

Something we're looking for when we bring some Africa back with us.

Yeah.

So I think I'm down to my last three questions.

The question is the part of the show, our mother-in-law refers to as the Do's

and donuts what should three things that we should do and three things we

should not do while we're in Kenya.

Three things you should do.

I was thinking about this.

I was really thinking about this.

Like what are the must haves while you're there?

And I think that in Kenya I really feel like you should.

I don't know if this really works in the category, but I think you should

just really put yourself out there, like 100% don't hold back, don't be reserved.

Don't be concerned.

And just let it beat you just be there.

And if you do that, you'll really immerse yourself in the culture.

You're really hear all the sounds of the wildlife at night.

When you're on a drive at night, you can hear like the bull frogs and

the cat calls late in the evening.

And if you really allow yourself to be in the moment, you can experience

Africa on a whole another level.

And I think that is probably my most important do.

Just leave it behind you and do it just be there 100%.

And I think Africa will touch you in a way that, that no other place can.

And then Other dues would be take all the experiences that they will give you.

So there's things that I can preplan for you and there's things that I can't

and the things that I can't preplan for, you could be the most amazing

thing that you could possibly do.

Certainly it could be a off the cuff.

Hey, this morning, let's go for a walk.

Let's go to the village.

Let's try this.

Let's try that.

Hey, do you want to go to this local little eatery down here?

And I would say, obviously safety first, but do it go and do it, experience it.

And those, I tend to find, tend to be the most rewarding experiences for

all of my travelers when they do them.

And then my last big do would be to definitely do a walking safari.

So even if you don't go to a place that is like solely a walking safari, destination,

do some sort of walking safari in your time, because you'll, again, you'll

experience safari in a very different way,

real quick on a walking safari.

How long are you expected to walk for our older generation to know?

Cause my mother has limitations, but she's very healthy.

So she, is, are we looking for one mile 10 miles?

Yeah.

Yeah.

So it depends.

So if you're doing it out of a camp that doesn't solely do walking safaris, then

you know, you might go out early in the morning as the sun is rising and it'll

be one of those things where you're going out and it'll be like an hour long walks.

So how long it actually is, might depend on what you're

seeing and experiencing really.

But you'll get out there.

You'll do it for an hour maybe, and then you'll turn around and come back.

And then if you're doing a place that's an actual walking safari location.

You can definitely.

Do it in terms of catering, the walks, the tumerian.

And I, like I mentioned, we'll cater the walks to your preferences and abilities.

So if she's only capable of doing a mile or two miles, whatever it might

be, that's what they'll cater it to.

And then if everybody else wants to go out and go further, you can do that also.

Perfect.

Okay.

And three, do you not, sir, or three cautionary things

you would caution against?

Yes.

Three do nots do not drink the water straight from the tap?

That's really bad.

Sounds like a silly one.

It sounds like things we should all know, but don't do it.

If you're going to get sick, that's probably how do you be extra careful

when you're in bigger cities and areas?

As far as As well so even at a big hotel, a big chain or at a restaurant, you do

want to be a little bit more thoughtful about what you eat and how it's prepared.

That would be fruits with peels or things that are fully cooked.

How is it being prepared to make sure that again, you're keeping

yourself healthy during the trip.

And then I would say, do not, while you're in Kenya, go out for a night on the town.

It's not really a place where you do that.

There are areas that aren't really not that great as far as your safety.

And there it's just not, it's just not that kind of place.

If you're going to go out in the evenings, you want to go with a guide.

You want to make sure that you have somebody in that, there's somebody that's

speaking the local language for you.

Three, three very useful lessons.

So two more questions I had, and maybe you've touched upon this, but

I'll fill in the blank question.

My most memorable experience in Kenya was.

Oh, my most memorable experience in Kenya was I was recently really reminiscing

about some time that I spent in a place called Samburu national reserve.

That has two big moments that really stand out for me.

One, which is a really simple one to explain, which was we stopped for a Bush

breakfast a surprise Bush breakfast, and we were all in this beautiful river and

there was a herd of, it must've been.

20 elephants that just started coming and they just kept coming and coming.

And there is, all sizes, all shapes all the way down to babies

and helping them get across the matriarchs, helping them get across

the river and kind of all of that.

And it was completely unexpected.

It was not, we were not there necessarily to see kind of wildlife.

We were there to be in an area to have this Bush breakfast and

that was really spectacular.

And then another one that comes to mind is my closest encounter.

Closest viewing of a leopard.

A lot of times leopards are extremely elusive.

They tend to be alone.

They tend to be solitary.

And they're really hard to see.

As far as the big cats are concerned and we were out in Samburu, same

place in an evening drive and the sun was starting to set.

We were starting to head towards our sundowners again,

along the same beautiful.

And all of a sudden there was just this leopard, this beautiful leopard.

And she was out on a hunt.

And I think for the duration of the time that we were with her, she was six to

10 feet off the side of the vehicle.

And at one point, I have my camera and I'm taking all these pictures

of her and waiting for her to, is she going to look at us?

Is she going, gonna look at us?

And sh there's this moment where she just makes direct eye contact

and I captured it on, on film.

And it was just really spectacular.

I've never had a wildlife siding like that since or before.

Obviously the gorillas chimpanzees, all of that.

But the, in Kenya, definitely that leopard, just piercing look right in

your eyes also somewhat terrifying.

Exactly.

I can see I'm gonna have to get a new camera when we go to Kenya or rent one.

, I was going to ask my final question again, our guest today is Amy Czarnecki.

Amy.

Thank you so much.

This has been a tremendous interview.

I know we will definitely be in touch in the near future about

setting up a vacation to Kenya.

So thank you.

Just want to give you one last chance to say whatever you wanted to say and

promote what would promote yourself.

Absolutely.

I think that the way there's a lot of different ways to do incredible trips

these days, and there's a lot of different ways to get your family out there.

And what I really love about Audley travel and what I do for them is that

they really ensure that we know our stuff.

And I think that is something that's so important when you're trying to

design a trip for multi-generations because you need somebody that can

talk and speak to all the different generations and their needs.

So I think Audley is really special that way is that they'll send you

on research trips every single year.

You get in-depth training, you get in-depth look at everything that

you are talking about and selling.

And they really care about the entire user, client

experience from start to finish.

So I do really love the experience.

Yeah.

Anecdotally, the friends that we've known that have used all the Audley

travel to an African safari, I just had a tremendous experience both at

the onset preparing for it, making sure they knew what they were getting into.

They were well prepared for the trip.

And then afterwards just the pictures and you hear them

talking about the experience.

You can not do better than the travel with all the Audley travel.

So thank you so much.

It's

been a tremendous, yeah.

Thank you so much.

Loved it.

That was wonderful.

You guys, thank you so much as well, and have having incredible safari when you go,

maybe that's something else to add.

It's never too early to start.

The camps are really small.

They're, eight, 10 rooms.

And so they sell out quickly the good ones.

Anyway, they sell out really quick.

And then if you want exactly what you want without compromise, you do it early.

All right.

So until next time, thank you very much.

Grab the Kids.

Don't forget the grandparents thank you all.

We thank you and appreciate your continued support.