Safety: An Invaluable Asset with Gavin Coyle
Episode 88 • 31st May 2023 • Construction Disruption • Isaiah Industries
00:00:00 00:52:36

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“I just want everybody to embrace health and safety as a tool of your business that’s going to make you money. And it’s actually going to improve the quality and the standard of your work and that, you know, you will attract really good people to your business if you have a reputation for safety.”  

  

-Gavin Coyle, CEO of the Coyle Group 

  

For many of us, health and safety bring to mind bureaucracy and process, a long list of rules to follow, procedures to implement, and equipment to buy and maintain. Yet, we know that safety is integral to business; it keeps our workers protected from harm and our job sites from being a hazard to all involved. 

  

Gavin Coyle sees greater depth in workplace safety; he believes focusing on it can increase profitability, marketability, and reliability for any size company. With a consulting group that creates safety plans for contractors of all sizes, Gavin captured these ideas in his book, Workplace Safety On a Budget: How to stop and prevent accidents and injuries without sacrificing the bottom line. 

  

Listen in as Gavin explains how a safe workplace can transform your business and be cost-effective and sustainable. 

  

Topics discussed in this interview: 

- ChatGPT/Google Bard 

- Gavin’s target market, his wheelhouse 

- His inspiration to enter health and safety 

- Defining accidents that cemented Gavin’s career choice 

- Adjusting to regulations based on location 

- Elevating safety choices regardless of standard 

- Implementing a safety plan early is necessary 

- How do attitudes differ on safety from country to country? 

- Better safety leads to more profit 

- Serving contractors of all sizes 

- Building in company-wide accountability 

- Safety as a marketable quality 

- Rapid fire questions 

  

Network with Gavin on LinkedIn, check out his book Workplace Safety On A Budget: How to stop and prevent accidents and injuries without sacrificing the bottom line and visit his site, gavin-coyle.com. 

For more Construction Disruption, listen on Apple Podcasts or YouTube

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This episode was produced by Isaiah Industries, Inc.



This podcast uses the following third-party services for analysis:

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Transcripts

Intro/Outro:

:

Welcome to the Construction

Intro/Outro:

:

Disruption podcast,

Intro/Outro:

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where we uncover the future of

Intro/Outro:

:

design, building, and remodeling.

Todd Miller:

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I'm Todd Miller of Isaiah

Todd Miller:

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Industries, manufacturer of

Todd Miller:

:

specialty metal roofing and other

Todd Miller:

:

building materials. Today, my

Todd Miller:

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co-host is Seth

Todd Miller:

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Heckaman. How are you today, Seth?

Seth Heckaman:

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Doing well. How are you?

Todd Miller:

:

I'm doing well also.

Todd Miller:

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So I know you and I have

Todd Miller:

:

talked a little bit about a topic

Todd Miller:

:

that I think we're going to be

Todd Miller:

:

hearing more and more about

Todd Miller:

:

in everything, not just

Todd Miller:

:

construction, but in the

Todd Miller:

:

entire world.

Todd Miller:

:

And you haven't dug into it a

Todd Miller:

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whole lot yet.

Todd Miller:

:

But that is the

Todd Miller:

:

topic of A.I.

Todd Miller:

:

and A.I.

Todd Miller:

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generated text

Todd Miller:

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that everyone's doing with ChatGPT

Todd Miller:

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and Google Bard and a number of

Todd Miller:

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others. So

Todd Miller:

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to me, that's something that's

Todd Miller:

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incredibly disruptive.

Todd Miller:

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So seems like an important thing to

Todd Miller:

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talk about here on the show,

Todd Miller:

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although we do have a guest also who

Todd Miller:

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is not talking about A.I..

Todd Miller:

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But I was sitting in a meeting

Todd Miller:

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this week and

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folks were brainstorming.

Todd Miller:

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And I know as I say this,

Todd Miller:

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I'm probably driving a stake

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through Ethan's heart.

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Ethan's one of our behind the scenes

Todd Miller:

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folks here. And he also

Todd Miller:

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does a lot of writing

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and an incredible writer.

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But as I said in this meeting this

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week, we were trying to come up with

Todd Miller:

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some marketing ideas.

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It was a church-related thing.

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I was there, so a guy just started

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plugging stuff in, come up with

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marketing slogans on this and this,

Todd Miller:

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and he was using ChatGPT.

Todd Miller:

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I used Google Bard more

Todd Miller:

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than I have ChatGPT.

Todd Miller:

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But yeah, this thing was coming up

Todd Miller:

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with really some good marketing

Todd Miller:

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slogans. And you know, one of the

Todd Miller:

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things I got to thinking about as I

Todd Miller:

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listened to that was

Todd Miller:

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probably an up-and-coming career is

Todd Miller:

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going to be A.I.

Todd Miller:

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editor. So people who are good at

Todd Miller:

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writing, who simply can go

Todd Miller:

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in and edit A.I.

Todd Miller:

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generated things.

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But

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you know, the other thing I'm

Todd Miller:

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hearing a lot about is A.I.

Todd Miller:

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generated video

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and the fact that you'll just be

Todd Miller:

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able to plug in and, you know, pop

Todd Miller:

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up a video that's been generated

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on a particular topic and,

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you know, that's going to have a

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huge impact on marketing

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and all the world

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that we live in so much helping

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contractors generate leads

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and things like that.

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So this morning before we started

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recording,

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some of our audience realizes

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that a lot of times we'll start

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episodes with a dad joke

Todd Miller:

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or something that really is a

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groaner.

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So I asked ChatGPT,

Todd Miller:

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I said, Write me a

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dad joke about something

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new.

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That's all I said.

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In this process, I discovered

Todd Miller:

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that while ChatGPT may

Todd Miller:

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be good at some things

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and excuse me, this is actually

Todd Miller:

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Google Bard, it is

Todd Miller:

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really bad at writing jokes.

Todd Miller:

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So let me tell you that if joke

Todd Miller:

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that Google Bard gave

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up with.

Todd Miller:

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It's asked, What do

Todd Miller:

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you call a newt, N-E-W-T,

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which I guess it pulled because

Todd Miller:

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I asked it to write a joke about

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something new.

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What do you call a newt

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that just got a promotion?

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The answer is a newt

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manager.

Todd Miller:

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I really had to work to even figure

Todd Miller:

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out what the joke was, but.

Seth Heckaman:

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That's a worse dad joke than you

Seth Heckaman:

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typically come up with.

Seth Heckaman:

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So yes, it's.

Todd Miller:

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Yeah.

Seth Heckaman:

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It's got a ways to go.

Todd Miller:

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So the Bard is

Todd Miller:

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not particularly good at jokes,

Todd Miller:

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apparently. But anyway,

Todd Miller:

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I think there's a lot of useful

Todd Miller:

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stuff there. People talk about being

Todd Miller:

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scared of it and stuff and

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I guess I can relate to that.

Todd Miller:

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I am concerned about how it impacts

Todd Miller:

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job market, but it seems

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like any time you have technology

Todd Miller:

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come along that feels

Todd Miller:

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like it's going to take jobs,

Todd Miller:

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it actually also creates jobs

Todd Miller:

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of some sort.

Todd Miller:

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And so I think, we'll

Todd Miller:

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see a little bit of both happen with

Todd Miller:

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this. So anyway,

Todd Miller:

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are you ready to go ahead and get it

Todd Miller:

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rolling and quit listening to me

Todd Miller:

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babble now Seth?

Seth Heckaman:

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That's okay, sounds great. Here we go.

Todd Miller:

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Okay.

Todd Miller:

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Well, today's guest I'm very excited

Todd Miller:

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about. Today's guest is Gavin Coyle.

Todd Miller:

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Gavin is CEO of Coyle

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Group, based in County Dublin,

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Ireland.

Todd Miller:

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Coyle Group provides safety

Todd Miller:

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consulting services to contractors

Todd Miller:

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across the globe.

Todd Miller:

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And Gavin himself is known

Todd Miller:

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as the Safety CEO.

Todd Miller:

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Gavin, welcome to Construction

Todd Miller:

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Disruption. It's a real pleasure to

Todd Miller:

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have you here today.

Gavin Coyle:

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Hey Todd, delighted to be here.

Gavin Coyle:

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Thanks very much.

Gavin Coyle:

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And looking forward to having a

Gavin Coyle:

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chat.

Todd Miller:

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Well, I know it'll be a great

Todd Miller:

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discussion. So

Todd Miller:

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in looking at Coyle Group, I

Todd Miller:

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know that you guys provide

Todd Miller:

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consulting and safety

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management consulting,

Todd Miller:

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but you also do some providing

Todd Miller:

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safety managers under contract

Todd Miller:

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to go out and spend time

Todd Miller:

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in the field with your clients, as I

Todd Miller:

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understand it.

Todd Miller:

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Can you just kind of give us an

Todd Miller:

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overview of what your company

Todd Miller:

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does and you know who your typical

Todd Miller:

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clients are, as far as size

Todd Miller:

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or maybe certain

Todd Miller:

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industries in construction that

Todd Miller:

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there are genres of construction

Todd Miller:

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they work with?

Gavin Coyle:

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Yeah, thanks very much.

Gavin Coyle:

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And so

Gavin Coyle:

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we kind of created a niche for

Gavin Coyle:

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ourselves in the energy sector

Gavin Coyle:

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and power generation and utilities

Gavin Coyle:

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and a large

Gavin Coyle:

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proportion, if not all of our

Gavin Coyle:

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clients operate in those areas.

Gavin Coyle:

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And I suppose

Gavin Coyle:

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it was a strategic vision

Gavin Coyle:

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for myself in terms of

Gavin Coyle:

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wanting to work with

Gavin Coyle:

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premium-type clients

Gavin Coyle:

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in a highly regulated area

Gavin Coyle:

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and to have assets to protect.

Gavin Coyle:

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And so what we

Gavin Coyle:

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found was there was a gap

Gavin Coyle:

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whereby these particular

Gavin Coyle:

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companies were

Gavin Coyle:

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either having maintenance schedules

Gavin Coyle:

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in terms of outages and shutdowns

Gavin Coyle:

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and overhauls, or they

Gavin Coyle:

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were building new assets.

Gavin Coyle:

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And so they wouldn't have

Gavin Coyle:

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the same level of capacity of

Gavin Coyle:

:

health and safety within the

Gavin Coyle:

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overall organization on a continuous

Gavin Coyle:

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basis to deal with the level of

Gavin Coyle:

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the amount of projects that they

Gavin Coyle:

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were dealing with.

Gavin Coyle:

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So we tapped into that market very

Gavin Coyle:

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early in terms of providing

Gavin Coyle:

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an end source solution where they

Gavin Coyle:

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could come to us and we would give

Gavin Coyle:

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them a safety person who had

Gavin Coyle:

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20 plus years experience

Gavin Coyle:

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in that particular industry

Gavin Coyle:

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that could manage the overall health

Gavin Coyle:

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and safety for that project, to

Gavin Coyle:

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bring it through from the start

Gavin Coyle:

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right through to the end.

Gavin Coyle:

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And so over

Gavin Coyle:

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the years, we've become very

Gavin Coyle:

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established with a reputation that

Gavin Coyle:

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we don't just provide

Gavin Coyle:

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the people, we also provide a

Gavin Coyle:

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managed service behind that.

Gavin Coyle:

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So I would work with the leaders

Gavin Coyle:

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and with the clients

Gavin Coyle:

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and their team on strategy.

Gavin Coyle:

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And you know what it

Gavin Coyle:

:

is that we can get

Gavin Coyle:

:

out of this project that we could

Gavin Coyle:

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use as a future

Gavin Coyle:

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experience for future projects

Gavin Coyle:

:

like lessons learned.

Gavin Coyle:

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And how do we implement

Gavin Coyle:

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that and how do we change systems

Gavin Coyle:

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and change cultures in order to

Gavin Coyle:

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deal with and

Gavin Coyle:

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protecting against

Gavin Coyle:

:

scenarios and certain risks

Gavin Coyle:

:

are becoming more consistent

Gavin Coyle:

:

within those type of environment.

Gavin Coyle:

:

So it's been very challenging but

Gavin Coyle:

:

very rewarding.

Gavin Coyle:

:

And the type of people that we deal

Gavin Coyle:

:

with on a daily basis are

Gavin Coyle:

:

extremely knowledgeable and

Gavin Coyle:

:

technical in their own areas and in

Gavin Coyle:

:

their own right.

Gavin Coyle:

:

And I kind of get a great buzz

Gavin Coyle:

:

from working with people like that

Gavin Coyle:

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because you could just feed off

Gavin Coyle:

:

their enthusiasm and their

Gavin Coyle:

:

motivation and their, you know,

Gavin Coyle:

:

their want to get up and go

Gavin Coyle:

:

and deliver a project, not

Gavin Coyle:

:

just a safe project, but a quality

Gavin Coyle:

:

project.

Gavin Coyle:

:

And, you know,

Gavin Coyle:

:

we are where we are today, which,

Gavin Coyle:

:

you know, major multinational

Gavin Coyle:

:

clients across the world building

Gavin Coyle:

:

wind farms and power stations.

Gavin Coyle:

:

And it's exciting and

Gavin Coyle:

:

if not, you know,

Gavin Coyle:

:

stressful at times.

Todd Miller:

:

Oh, absolutely.

Todd Miller:

:

I can imagine, and

Todd Miller:

:

certainly I assume those are

Todd Miller:

:

projects that are on tight

Todd Miller:

:

timetables a lot of times also.

Todd Miller:

:

And, you know, sometimes tight

Todd Miller:

:

timetables can accidentally

Todd Miller:

:

become the enemy of safety

Todd Miller:

:

also, I suppose.

Todd Miller:

:

But so,

Todd Miller:

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I'm kind of curious,

Todd Miller:

:

what interested you

Todd Miller:

:

in this line of work and what drove

Todd Miller:

:

your passion for safety?

Todd Miller:

:

I know I heard you tell a little bit

Todd Miller:

:

of that story on a podcast

Todd Miller:

:

you were on recently with our mutual

Todd Miller:

:

friend Jim Johnson,

Todd Miller:

:

but we'd love to have you share it

Todd Miller:

:

here on some of that here on this

Todd Miller:

:

show as well.

Gavin Coyle:

:

And yes, so like

Gavin Coyle:

:

I live in Ireland, small, obviously,

Gavin Coyle:

:

country and surrounded

Gavin Coyle:

:

by water.

Gavin Coyle:

:

And at

Gavin Coyle:

:

one stage, maybe 20 odd

Gavin Coyle:

:

years ago, and

Gavin Coyle:

:

we became a magnet

Gavin Coyle:

:

for American clients

Gavin Coyle:

:

who wanted to probably

Gavin Coyle:

:

step a foot into Europe.

Gavin Coyle:

:

And we were the first country that

Gavin Coyle:

:

probably has intensive

Gavin Coyle:

:

land base, if you like.

Gavin Coyle:

:

And we had the likes of

Gavin Coyle:

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Warner-Lambert, which is now

Gavin Coyle:

:

Pfizer's.

Gavin Coyle:

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We didn't have Hewlett-Packard

Gavin Coyle:

:

and Compaq,

Gavin Coyle:

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All the big names

Gavin Coyle:

:

that were trying to establish a

Gavin Coyle:

:

foothold in the European markets

Gavin Coyle:

:

were coming into our and

Gavin Coyle:

:

building hyperscale projects.

Gavin Coyle:

:

And I just come out of school.

Gavin Coyle:

:

And one of the main requirements

Gavin Coyle:

:

on these projects was a full time

Gavin Coyle:

:

health and safety officer, which

Gavin Coyle:

:

was never really a thing

Gavin Coyle:

:

in Ireland.

Gavin Coyle:

:

And a lot of people scratching their

Gavin Coyle:

:

heads going, What do you mean, a

Gavin Coyle:

:

full time health and safety officer?

Gavin Coyle:

:

What does that person do and

Gavin Coyle:

:

what kind of qualifications do these

Gavin Coyle:

:

people have? So

Gavin Coyle:

:

and I was told

Gavin Coyle:

:

to go to meeting the health and

Gavin Coyle:

:

safety meeting and sort of really

Gavin Coyle:

:

liked, you know, the whole concept

Gavin Coyle:

:

of, well, we're not just here to

Gavin Coyle:

:

work, we're also here to get to work

Gavin Coyle:

:

safely, and

Gavin Coyle:

:

we want everybody going home

Gavin Coyle:

:

to their families.

Gavin Coyle:

:

And I totally embraced

Gavin Coyle:

:

that whole logic.

Gavin Coyle:

:

And there was a whole sort of

Gavin Coyle:

:

systematic approach the

Gavin Coyle:

:

American guys were bringing with

Gavin Coyle:

:

them that they had built in their

Gavin Coyle:

:

own models within the States.

Gavin Coyle:

:

And so it was a very good learning

Gavin Coyle:

:

curve for me to sort of understand

Gavin Coyle:

:

all of these systems and understand

Gavin Coyle:

:

the logics that they put together

Gavin Coyle:

:

in order to make a safe project.

Gavin Coyle:

:

And, you know, you're talking to a

Gavin Coyle:

:

couple of thousand people maybe

Gavin Coyle:

:

on the project at any one time, up

Gavin Coyle:

:

to 10,000 people, in some cases,

Gavin Coyle:

:

construction workers. So you're not

Gavin Coyle:

:

talking small scale stuff,

Gavin Coyle:

:

but in around the same time or the

Gavin Coyle:

:

same time periods.

Gavin Coyle:

:

And as

Gavin Coyle:

:

I grew within the

Gavin Coyle:

:

contracting business that I was

Gavin Coyle:

:

working for, and

Gavin Coyle:

:

I started looking after more and

Gavin Coyle:

:

more of their projects, not just

Gavin Coyle:

:

the major hyperscale stuff, but

Gavin Coyle:

:

it was a project in talking about

Gavin Coyle:

:

Four Seasons hotel projects, and

Gavin Coyle:

:

I would have been looking after that

Gavin Coyle:

:

as well. So I was kind of stretched

Gavin Coyle:

:

between going around to multiple

Gavin Coyle:

:

different projects and

Gavin Coyle:

:

I was on the Four Seasons project

Gavin Coyle:

:

one morning, one was banging on the

Gavin Coyle:

:

door and it was basically

Gavin Coyle:

:

someone at site sharing that there

Gavin Coyle:

:

was a man down.

Gavin Coyle:

:

And that's when

Gavin Coyle:

:

we went out to have a look.

Gavin Coyle:

:

It was a young

Gavin Coyle:

:

guy, 17 years of age,

Gavin Coyle:

:

and had fallen into a hole head

Gavin Coyle:

:

first and he was fighting for his

Gavin Coyle:

:

life in a in a hole.

Gavin Coyle:

:

So we managed

Gavin Coyle:

:

to get him out and I went

Gavin Coyle:

:

to the ambulance with him and

Gavin Coyle:

:

within 24 hours he was

Gavin Coyle:

:

pronounced dead due to

Gavin Coyle:

:

his head injuries.

Gavin Coyle:

:

And so it was it was a very

Gavin Coyle:

:

sort of wake up

Gavin Coyle:

:

traumatic time for myself,

Gavin Coyle:

:

obviously, for the family was much

Gavin Coyle:

:

worse. But to see a

Gavin Coyle:

:

guy fighting for his life in

Gavin Coyle:

:

the hole and then in the

Gavin Coyle:

:

in the ambulance and then in the

Gavin Coyle:

:

end and it's

Gavin Coyle:

:

it's something that would stay with

Gavin Coyle:

:

me for the rest of my life.

Gavin Coyle:

:

My younger brother

Gavin Coyle:

:

would in a short period of time

Gavin Coyle:

:

after that fatality, had a

Gavin Coyle:

:

tragedy of his own where himself

Gavin Coyle:

:

and two of his friends drowned

Gavin Coyle:

:

off the coast of Ireland, where they

Gavin Coyle:

:

were just waist high, throwing balls

Gavin Coyle:

:

at each other and

Gavin Coyle:

:

a freak wave came in and the

Gavin Coyle:

:

undercurrent stuck them at sea.

Gavin Coyle:

:

So I suppose within

Gavin Coyle:

:

a 24 month period,

Gavin Coyle:

:

I had two massive events,

Gavin Coyle:

:

traumatic events in my life.

Gavin Coyle:

:

I was kind of like, Okay.

Gavin Coyle:

:

Is health and safety really for me?

Todd Miller:

:

Wow.

Gavin Coyle:

:

And if it is like

Gavin Coyle:

:

you're going to get, you're going to

Gavin Coyle:

:

have to be, have the tools

Gavin Coyle:

:

and have the mindset and the

Gavin Coyle:

:

sort of the

Gavin Coyle:

:

push to to continue

Gavin Coyle:

:

on in this. Otherwise, it

Gavin Coyle:

:

would just break me because I was

Gavin Coyle:

:

very young and and

Gavin Coyle:

:

there was no such thing as

Gavin Coyle:

:

counseling or anything at that time.

Gavin Coyle:

:

And so no one was talking about,

Gavin Coyle:

:

you know, the aftershock of

Gavin Coyle:

:

of events.

Gavin Coyle:

:

But it definitely did shape my

Gavin Coyle:

:

views and my empathy towards people.

Gavin Coyle:

:

You know, I talk to people

Gavin Coyle:

:

and on the basis of,

Gavin Coyle:

:

you know, I could be that person

Gavin Coyle:

:

myself.

Gavin Coyle:

:

You know, what we want from the from

Gavin Coyle:

:

the conversation in terms of,

Gavin Coyle:

:

you know, not talking down to

Gavin Coyle:

:

people, talk to them at

Gavin Coyle:

:

their own level, bring them with

Gavin Coyle:

:

you, learn from them,

Gavin Coyle:

:

give them your experience, share,

Gavin Coyle:

:

collaborate together and

Gavin Coyle:

:

walk in a way that

Gavin Coyle:

:

you treat people with respect and

Gavin Coyle:

:

you expect that respect come back to

Gavin Coyle:

:

you. And that has been

Gavin Coyle:

:

stuck with me for years

Gavin Coyle:

:

where it's still worked on projects

Gavin Coyle:

:

now. People would come

Gavin Coyle:

:

over shaking hands. I remember when

Gavin Coyle:

:

you when you were on this particular

Gavin Coyle:

:

project. I don't be on the sites as

Gavin Coyle:

:

much of the projects as much.

Gavin Coyle:

:

And I got great buzz

Gavin Coyle:

:

from the whole collaboration

Gavin Coyle:

:

to certainly some characters

Gavin Coyle:

:

in the construction and

Gavin Coyle:

:

especially the auction industry

Gavin Coyle:

:

anyway, and

Gavin Coyle:

:

I hope it continues to be so.

Gavin Coyle:

:

But in terms of our health and

Gavin Coyle:

:

safety that, you know, it's moved

Gavin Coyle:

:

on quite a lot since I started

Gavin Coyle:

:

2017

Gavin Coyle:

:

when I started on the path for

Gavin Coyle:

:

health and safety.

Todd Miller:

:

Well, that's really something going

Todd Miller:

:

through those, you know, couple of

Todd Miller:

:

tragedies, one of them extremely

Todd Miller:

:

personal. And yet, you know,

Todd Miller:

:

out of that, it drove

Todd Miller:

:

you to a life's path.

Todd Miller:

:

And so I'm

Todd Miller:

:

kind of curious. I know the Coyle

Todd Miller:

:

group, you know, works with

Todd Miller:

:

contractors across the globe.

Todd Miller:

:

It seems like safety regulations

Todd Miller:

:

to some degree vary geographically,

Todd Miller:

:

but by the same token, safety

Todd Miller:

:

is safety. So how does

Todd Miller:

:

that impact your business?

Todd Miller:

:

How do you

Todd Miller:

:

how do you adjust to the fact that,

Todd Miller:

:

you know, different areas probably

Todd Miller:

:

have different regulations, but yet

Todd Miller:

:

again, safety is safety?

Gavin Coyle:

:

Yeah, it's

Gavin Coyle:

:

a great question.

Gavin Coyle:

:

And like once you have

Gavin Coyle:

:

a system that is

Gavin Coyle:

:

organic to your business

Gavin Coyle:

:

and you can put your finger

Gavin Coyle:

:

on any part of that system and it

Gavin Coyle:

:

is live and it is actionable

Gavin Coyle:

:

and it is, you know

Gavin Coyle:

:

and something that you can stand

Gavin Coyle:

:

over.

Gavin Coyle:

:

That's a real system.

Gavin Coyle:

:

Unfortunately, we've seen in the

Gavin Coyle:

:

past where people have brought

Gavin Coyle:

:

in maybe outside consultants

Gavin Coyle:

:

or management consultants and said,

Gavin Coyle:

:

Look, you know, build me a system

Gavin Coyle:

:

because a company is massive

Gavin Coyle:

:

growth and they tend to

Gavin Coyle:

:

just pick sort of a generic model

Gavin Coyle:

:

system and try and

Gavin Coyle:

:

sort of pinhole that company into

Gavin Coyle:

:

that particular system.

Gavin Coyle:

:

And once you don't

Gavin Coyle:

:

have any sort of

Gavin Coyle:

:

input for sort of,

Gavin Coyle:

:

how would you say? Once you don't

Gavin Coyle:

:

have your own footprint on that

Gavin Coyle:

:

system, you can't really stand over

Gavin Coyle:

:

it. And then, you know, when

Gavin Coyle:

:

something goes wrong,

Gavin Coyle:

:

everybody's going, How come the

Gavin Coyle:

:

system didn't pick this up and

Gavin Coyle:

:

whatever else?

Gavin Coyle:

:

System didn't pick it up because

Gavin Coyle:

:

people didn't embrace the system

Gavin Coyle:

:

from the start and build the system

Gavin Coyle:

:

from the ground up.

Gavin Coyle:

:

So we're always conscious to say

Gavin Coyle:

:

to people, you know, don't jump

Gavin Coyle:

:

into creating a management system

Gavin Coyle:

:

that is kind of an off-the-shelf

Gavin Coyle:

:

approach.

Gavin Coyle:

:

When you decide that you want to

Gavin Coyle:

:

build the system, you think

Gavin Coyle:

:

about this in the two-year type

Gavin Coyle:

:

project where you're just going to

Gavin Coyle:

:

feed in information into exactly

Gavin Coyle:

:

how you operate as a business,

Gavin Coyle:

:

because we all have our own nuances

Gavin Coyle:

:

as regards how we deliver

Gavin Coyle:

:

at projects, not just in the safety

Gavin Coyle:

:

perspective for quality and

Gavin Coyle:

:

operations and people.

Gavin Coyle:

:

And it's all those little nuances

Gavin Coyle:

:

that actually make up your policies

Gavin Coyle:

:

and your actions with how

Gavin Coyle:

:

you're going to manage that system.

Gavin Coyle:

:

And we're very, very strong about

Gavin Coyle:

:

saying to people, you

Gavin Coyle:

:

know, Make it about you so that if

Gavin Coyle:

:

anybody walks into that business,

Gavin Coyle:

:

that all of your team can put

Gavin Coyle:

:

their finger on any piece of that

Gavin Coyle:

:

system and say, That's us.

Gavin Coyle:

:

That's what we stand for.

Gavin Coyle:

:

That's how we deliver.

Gavin Coyle:

:

That's us. It may change because

Gavin Coyle:

:

regulations might change.

Gavin Coyle:

:

As you say, you might go into a

Gavin Coyle:

:

different country.

Gavin Coyle:

:

And but ultimately, there's a

Gavin Coyle:

:

standard there that everybody is

Gavin Coyle:

:

accustomed to, and you shouldn't

Gavin Coyle:

:

change that for anybody, other than

Gavin Coyle:

:

the fact that you might have

Gavin Coyle:

:

local regulations where a form

Gavin Coyle:

:

might be a different definition,

Gavin Coyle:

:

or you might have to report

Gavin Coyle:

:

it in a different way.

Gavin Coyle:

:

But those are obstacles that can be

Gavin Coyle:

:

overcome from a local expertise

Gavin Coyle:

:

type of scenario where you're

Gavin Coyle:

:

putting in somebody just say, Look,

Gavin Coyle:

:

can you navigate us here?

Gavin Coyle:

:

So we've, for example, done

Gavin Coyle:

:

a recent project for

Gavin Coyle:

:

offshore wind turbines

Gavin Coyle:

:

to be built.

Gavin Coyle:

:

And the question was

Gavin Coyle:

:

which which regulations are we going

Gavin Coyle:

:

to follow here, guys?

Gavin Coyle:

:

And it was all major

Gavin Coyle:

:

league of the patterns involved, you

Gavin Coyle:

:

know, lots of money being spent

Gavin Coyle:

:

by the clients.

Gavin Coyle:

:

And we were kind of like it's kind

Gavin Coyle:

:

of not really relevant in terms of

Gavin Coyle:

:

once you have the system

Gavin Coyle:

:

that is, you know, credit

Gavin Coyle:

:

is internationally approved,

Gavin Coyle:

:

the likes of an ISO system or an

Gavin Coyle:

:

OSHA system.

Gavin Coyle:

:

That was traveled right across

Gavin Coyle:

:

the world, and then you just create

Gavin Coyle:

:

that nuance. So what we've done was

Gavin Coyle:

:

we created webinar

Gavin Coyle:

:

videos for all of their management

Gavin Coyle:

:

team to say, Here's the legislation,

Gavin Coyle:

:

you used it before, here's the other

Gavin Coyle:

:

legislation that's actually meeting

Gavin Coyle:

:

you on the notes

Gavin Coyle:

:

for this particular project.

Gavin Coyle:

:

Here's the higher standards that we

Gavin Coyle:

:

believe you should follow that is

Gavin Coyle:

:

above those regulations.

Gavin Coyle:

:

And so if something does fall

Gavin Coyle:

:

down to the holes, we can always

Gavin Coyle:

:

say, yet we took the legislation

Gavin Coyle:

:

as a minimum standards,

Gavin Coyle:

:

but this is our standards.

Todd Miller:

:

I love that.

Todd Miller:

:

So it sounds like a lot of

Todd Miller:

:

your clients are

Todd Miller:

:

in themselves international

Todd Miller:

:

companies, so they may be doing

Todd Miller:

:

projects in different countries

Todd Miller:

:

and so forth. So, you know, you're

Todd Miller:

:

able to help them set their

Todd Miller:

:

standards and then also make sure

Todd Miller:

:

that they are meeting anything

Todd Miller:

:

local that might be special as well.

Todd Miller:

:

And I kind of understand that,

Todd Miller:

:

correct?

Gavin Coyle:

:

Yes.

Todd Miller:

:

Okay.

Gavin Coyle:

:

Yes, 100%.

Gavin Coyle:

:

And as I said, you can bring

Gavin Coyle:

:

in local knowledge wherever you need

Gavin Coyle:

:

it. And it's not, it shouldn't.

Gavin Coyle:

:

Yeah, it's not a drama

Gavin Coyle:

:

bush like anybody that's

Gavin Coyle:

:

listened to the podcast.

Gavin Coyle:

:

If you don't have a

Gavin Coyle:

:

proper planning schedule

Gavin Coyle:

:

in place before you start the

Gavin Coyle:

:

project. And we've all been there

Gavin Coyle:

:

where we started the project and

Gavin Coyle:

:

we're two months in and

Gavin Coyle:

:

next thing there's fighting going on

Gavin Coyle:

:

because guys are jockeying for

Gavin Coyle:

:

position or, you know,

Gavin Coyle:

:

there's a, a sort of a conflict

Gavin Coyle:

:

starting to arise between

Gavin Coyle:

:

people trying to

Gavin Coyle:

:

do the right thing, but popping,

Gavin Coyle:

:

coming up with barriers.

Gavin Coyle:

:

And so most of that stems from

Gavin Coyle:

:

the preplan process, where people

Gavin Coyle:

:

just didn't get together in a

Gavin Coyle:

:

workshop style and

Gavin Coyle:

:

mantra and said, Okay.

Gavin Coyle:

:

What do we want to get out of this

Gavin Coyle:

:

project as a team, as contractors,

Gavin Coyle:

:

as as individuals?

Gavin Coyle:

:

And sort of create those goals

Gavin Coyle:

:

and those aspirations and say,

Gavin Coyle:

:

That's the strategic vision for this

Gavin Coyle:

:

project.

Gavin Coyle:

:

Are we all agreed we're going to

Gavin Coyle:

:

follow that?

Gavin Coyle:

:

Unfortunately, that doesn't happen

Gavin Coyle:

:

quite often as you think.

Gavin Coyle:

:

And we still see it today where,

Gavin Coyle:

:

you know, it's too late

Gavin Coyle:

:

by the time you're in the project

Gavin Coyle:

:

because people are too focused on

Gavin Coyle:

:

trying to deliver the projects and

Gavin Coyle:

:

they're in the projects, you can't

Gavin Coyle:

:

put on the handbrake at that stage

Gavin Coyle:

:

and you've just got to let it go and

Gavin Coyle:

:

try and catch up.

Seth Heckaman:

:

You surprised me earlier,

Seth Heckaman:

:

Gavin, when you said that those

Seth Heckaman:

:

American companies coming into

Seth Heckaman:

:

Ireland were the ones that brought

Seth Heckaman:

:

this idea of the for

Seth Heckaman:

:

health, for a full-time health and

Seth Heckaman:

:

safety officer, which

Seth Heckaman:

:

may not be what most would guess

Seth Heckaman:

:

from those cutthroat capitalist

Seth Heckaman:

:

Americans, you know, being the

Seth Heckaman:

:

the ones that originated that.

Seth Heckaman:

:

So curious, making

Seth Heckaman:

:

sure I heard that right.

Seth Heckaman:

:

But then also getting your

Seth Heckaman:

:

perspective on, you know, what

Seth Heckaman:

:

countries are sort of leading the

Seth Heckaman:

:

way in some of these guidelines and

Seth Heckaman:

:

are there some countries that might

Seth Heckaman:

:

be lagging a little bit in that

Seth Heckaman:

:

regard?

Gavin Coyle:

:

I don't know if that could back

Gavin Coyle:

:

up the whole cutthroat capitalist

Gavin Coyle:

:

comment, because

Gavin Coyle:

:

that might get me in trouble.

Gavin Coyle:

:

But I get no, I know what you mean.

Gavin Coyle:

:

And I look

Gavin Coyle:

:

at there's Canada

Gavin Coyle:

:

has got a great reputation in

Gavin Coyle:

:

terms of health and safety.

Gavin Coyle:

:

And people might say that they're

Gavin Coyle:

:

overboard.

Gavin Coyle:

:

It's not a nanny state.

Gavin Coyle:

:

That's a different conversation for

Gavin Coyle:

:

different topics and social,

Gavin Coyle:

:

political and more so than safety.

Gavin Coyle:

:

And Australia

Gavin Coyle:

:

has a good strong sense,

Gavin Coyle:

:

and I like the Swedish model

Gavin Coyle:

:

personally myself in terms of health

Gavin Coyle:

:

and safety, because I remember

Gavin Coyle:

:

going into to a wind project

Gavin Coyle:

:

and it

Gavin Coyle:

:

was a test Islands.

Gavin Coyle:

:

The whole island was actually just a

Gavin Coyle:

:

test island for wind turbines

Gavin Coyle:

:

and reading the safety

Gavin Coyle:

:

framework documents for Sweden.

Gavin Coyle:

:

And it was like, it was like a

Gavin Coyle:

:

couple of pages wasn't corporate

Gavin Coyle:

:

pages, but it was like a person's

Gavin Coyle:

:

or a legal framework

Gavin Coyle:

:

so small I couldn't get over.

Gavin Coyle:

:

I was like, Wow.

Gavin Coyle:

:

Like, that's how it makes sense

Gavin Coyle:

:

in terms of like, why

Gavin Coyle:

:

would you just fill a whole book

Gavin Coyle:

:

of legal jargon

Gavin Coyle:

:

and show it to people and say, here,

Gavin Coyle:

:

and, you know, we need you to follow

Gavin Coyle:

:

the legislation like it's

Gavin Coyle:

:

a minefield?

Gavin Coyle:

:

You know, there's so many different

Gavin Coyle:

:

areas that you can get on.

Gavin Coyle:

:

And they just brought it down

Gavin Coyle:

:

a small bit on the flip side

Gavin Coyle:

:

of things, their social welfare

Gavin Coyle:

:

and their employee welfare

Gavin Coyle:

:

programs are kind of like

Gavin Coyle:

:

a disadvantage to

Gavin Coyle:

:

the cartoonists because

Gavin Coyle:

:

there's restrictions on hours,

Gavin Coyle:

:

sticks and sometimes holiday

Gavin Coyle:

:

periods and pensions.

Gavin Coyle:

:

And what you have to pay these

Gavin Coyle:

:

people and stuff like that.

Gavin Coyle:

:

And so that has a sort of a

Gavin Coyle:

:

negative

Gavin Coyle:

:

impact on progression

Gavin Coyle:

:

because I see how

Gavin Coyle:

:

things can get done

Gavin Coyle:

:

and it's a pity that

Gavin Coyle:

:

we don't have more of a

Gavin Coyle:

:

freestyle open-market

Gavin Coyle:

:

approach to if people

Gavin Coyle:

:

can do the job on their feet

Gavin Coyle:

:

from what they're doing.

Gavin Coyle:

:

And you can control the risk and

Gavin Coyle:

:

you can demonstrate that, but then

Gavin Coyle:

:

leave them alone. Let them get on

Gavin Coyle:

:

with the job.

Gavin Coyle:

:

And this creates

Gavin Coyle:

:

people and companies that are

Gavin Coyle:

:

managed in such a way that

Gavin Coyle:

:

their reputation travels with them.

Gavin Coyle:

:

And that's where

Gavin Coyle:

:

we, for myself, had

Gavin Coyle:

:

set up

Gavin Coyle:

:

gavin-coyle.com and wrote the

Gavin Coyle:

:

book on workplace safety

Gavin Coyle:

:

and budgets because we

Gavin Coyle:

:

felt and

Gavin Coyle:

:

there was a whole business of safety

Gavin Coyle:

:

and model that was missing from

Gavin Coyle:

:

the boardrooms.

Gavin Coyle:

:

And in terms of

Gavin Coyle:

:

making safety a profit center

Gavin Coyle:

:

for your business as opposed

Gavin Coyle:

:

to a regulatory compliance

Gavin Coyle:

:

center, which is what people

Gavin Coyle:

:

think about today.

Gavin Coyle:

:

So what we're talking about is

Gavin Coyle:

:

how can you look at your business

Gavin Coyle:

:

from a safety perspective

Gavin Coyle:

:

and make it more efficient from a

Gavin Coyle:

:

safety perspective, which obviously

Gavin Coyle:

:

raised safety standards,

Gavin Coyle:

:

but also creates a situation where

Gavin Coyle:

:

you stop spending money on certain

Gavin Coyle:

:

things that have nothing to do

Gavin Coyle:

:

with the efficiency of your business

Gavin Coyle:

:

and with the bottom line.

Gavin Coyle:

:

And so how do we talk and

Gavin Coyle:

:

how do we get a better return

Gavin Coyle:

:

on investment for each pound you

Gavin Coyle:

:

spend on safety?

Gavin Coyle:

:

And what does that look like?

Gavin Coyle:

:

And so you create a whole profit

Gavin Coyle:

:

center mindset from

Gavin Coyle:

:

the boardroom right down to the

Gavin Coyle:

:

grassroots, and then

Gavin Coyle:

:

you can repurpose that that dollar

Gavin Coyle:

:

value safe and back into

Gavin Coyle:

:

better staff because you pay them

Gavin Coyle:

:

better wages, better equipment

Gavin Coyle:

:

because you couldn't buy that

Gavin Coyle:

:

equipment previously.

Gavin Coyle:

:

So now it's repurposed and it's

Gavin Coyle:

:

safer equipment and it's more

Gavin Coyle:

:

innovative and it's more creative

Gavin Coyle:

:

and it's more it's producing more

Gavin Coyle:

:

and better programs

Gavin Coyle:

:

for the business and more bonuses

Gavin Coyle:

:

for the people that are delivering

Gavin Coyle:

:

on all the aspects of

Gavin Coyle:

:

of a profit center

Gavin Coyle:

:

within your within your business.

Gavin Coyle:

:

And that this is a a major

Gavin Coyle:

:

talking point for me at the moment

Gavin Coyle:

:

because it's a taboo

Gavin Coyle:

:

subject to say, I want

Gavin Coyle:

:

you to cut your costs on safety.

Gavin Coyle:

:

And you know, nobody wants

Gavin Coyle:

:

to say that because something goes

Gavin Coyle:

:

wrong. The fingers point.

Gavin Coyle:

:

You're the man that says,

Gavin Coyle:

:

you know, we should all reduce

Gavin Coyle:

:

the cost and safety.

Gavin Coyle:

:

I'm saying that.

Gavin Coyle:

:

And in an open way

Gavin Coyle:

:

over my 20 years experience, people

Gavin Coyle:

:

are spending a humongous amount of

Gavin Coyle:

:

money on on safety in different

Gavin Coyle:

:

areas that have absolutely no

Gavin Coyle:

:

drop down in terms of the

Gavin Coyle:

:

sustainability of the business.

Gavin Coyle:

:

And I, I

Gavin Coyle:

:

have seen situations

Gavin Coyle:

:

like the smaller contractors listen

Gavin Coyle:

:

to the podcast where if you can

Gavin Coyle:

:

raise the profile of your business

Gavin Coyle:

:

from a safety perspective and have

Gavin Coyle:

:

a reputation for a very safe

Gavin Coyle:

:

business, you will win more

Gavin Coyle:

:

work guaranteed.

Gavin Coyle:

:

It might take a while, might take a

Gavin Coyle:

:

year or two to sort of create

Gavin Coyle:

:

that sort of reputation.

Gavin Coyle:

:

But clients, in my experience

Gavin Coyle:

:

on weekdays with major clients,

Gavin Coyle:

:

will actually go for a small

Gavin Coyle:

:

contractor if they can raise

Gavin Coyle:

:

the bar on safety, ensure that they

Gavin Coyle:

:

have a sustainable model that's

Gavin Coyle:

:

on a plan for the future of health

Gavin Coyle:

:

and safety and all of the people

Gavin Coyle:

:

around their business buys into it

Gavin Coyle:

:

and that takes

Gavin Coyle:

:

time. But to

Gavin Coyle:

:

clients and to

Gavin Coyle:

:

my estates will pay

Gavin Coyle:

:

the extra bit of money if they

Gavin Coyle:

:

know they have a safe company

Gavin Coyle:

:

that also can deliver quality.

Todd Miller:

:

Yeah, I think that's really

Todd Miller:

:

interesting and it kind of goes down

Todd Miller:

:

a line of something I want to ask

Todd Miller:

:

you, Gavin, because, you know,

Todd Miller:

:

I hear you talking a lot.

Todd Miller:

:

We're talking about international

Todd Miller:

:

businesses and boardrooms,

Todd Miller:

:

and I'm thinking a lot of

Todd Miller:

:

contractors are much smaller than

Todd Miller:

:

that and don't have all of that.

Todd Miller:

:

But yet, you know, you're

Todd Miller:

:

giving them a framework of saying,

Todd Miller:

:

Hey, if you start everything

Todd Miller:

:

with safety in mind and

Todd Miller:

:

then make that a hallmark of

Todd Miller:

:

your company and actually be can

Todd Miller:

:

become a, you know, a great

Todd Miller:

:

marketing tool for you as well.

Todd Miller:

:

Let's talk a little bit about your

Todd Miller:

:

book, Workplace Safety on a Budget,

Todd Miller:

:

which I looked it up.

Todd Miller:

:

You can get it on Amazon, so

Todd Miller:

:

I haven't bought it yet, but I

Todd Miller:

:

encourage everybody to check it out.

Todd Miller:

:

But so is that book

Todd Miller:

:

applicable for anyone

Todd Miller:

:

with any size of a contracting

Todd Miller:

:

business?

Gavin Coyle:

:

It's 100%, Todd.

Gavin Coyle:

:

And one of the main drivers

Gavin Coyle:

:

for me writing the book was

Gavin Coyle:

:

I felt that I wasn't getting

Gavin Coyle:

:

access to the middle market

Gavin Coyle:

:

and to the small scale

Gavin Coyle:

:

markets within construction

Gavin Coyle:

:

and contracting in general.

Gavin Coyle:

:

And I felt sort of

Gavin Coyle:

:

an obligation, but because

Gavin Coyle:

:

of our business was with premium

Gavin Coyle:

:

clients. Other people are

Gavin Coyle:

:

premium level in terms of

Gavin Coyle:

:

cost base.

Gavin Coyle:

:

We couldn't give that advice.

Gavin Coyle:

:

We couldn't support small

Gavin Coyle:

:

to medium enterprises because

Gavin Coyle:

:

we had niched ourselves into this

Gavin Coyle:

:

premium market.

Gavin Coyle:

:

So it was something that was known

Gavin Coyle:

:

to me for a long time.

Gavin Coyle:

:

As it gets, you know, we're not I'm

Gavin Coyle:

:

not really giving back anything to

Gavin Coyle:

:

the guys that actually are

Gavin Coyle:

:

as good as anyone.

Gavin Coyle:

:

But they decided to go out on their

Gavin Coyle:

:

own and they might only be one man

Gavin Coyle:

:

in a van or they might be,

Gavin Coyle:

:

you know, somebody with 20

Gavin Coyle:

:

contractors. So how do I get

Gavin Coyle:

:

it? How do I make a difference

Gavin Coyle:

:

on that? So the website

Gavin Coyle:

:

that we have is

Gavin Coyle:

:

under construction for the last two

Gavin Coyle:

:

years. It's constantly putting in

Gavin Coyle:

:

free safety courses

Gavin Coyle:

:

and then just paid

Gavin Coyle:

:

certified courses that

Gavin Coyle:

:

I deliver and

Gavin Coyle:

:

that are like $29.99

Gavin Coyle:

:

per person.

Gavin Coyle:

:

Free toolkits,

Gavin Coyle:

:

as much free advice as we can give

Gavin Coyle:

:

people.

Gavin Coyle:

:

And the book is like $12

Gavin Coyle:

:

on Amazon.

Gavin Coyle:

:

So again, it's not; I'm not

Gavin Coyle:

:

going to be

Gavin Coyle:

:

going to Monaco any time soon.

Gavin Coyle:

:

It's safety

Gavin Coyle:

:

information should be shared and

Gavin Coyle:

:

should be out there for everybody.

Gavin Coyle:

:

It shouldn't be a guarded secret.

Gavin Coyle:

:

And the book covers every

Gavin Coyle:

:

part of every business,

Gavin Coyle:

:

regardless whether you're in

Gavin Coyle:

:

construction or not.

Gavin Coyle:

:

It can be any workplace, and

Gavin Coyle:

:

whether you're somebody that's

Gavin Coyle:

:

starting out in health and safety as

Gavin Coyle:

:

a graduation, you want to or

Gavin Coyle:

:

you're thinking about starting out

Gavin Coyle:

:

in safety, it's for you.

Gavin Coyle:

:

If you're a seasoned professional

Gavin Coyle:

:

and you want to understand how to

Gavin Coyle:

:

put a different model in place

Gavin Coyle:

:

to create more profit

Gavin Coyle:

:

for you to spend money on order

Gavin Coyle:

:

things and safety, it's for you.

Gavin Coyle:

:

If you're an employer and you just

Gavin Coyle:

:

want to navigate through health and

Gavin Coyle:

:

safety and understand what are the

Gavin Coyle:

:

hacks, if you like,

Gavin Coyle:

:

of reducing my cost and safety,

Gavin Coyle:

:

but still making a big impression

Gavin Coyle:

:

to win, to win over clients.

Gavin Coyle:

:

That's the purpose of the book and

Gavin Coyle:

:

that's what we termed the business

Gavin Coyle:

:

of safety.

Seth Heckaman:

:

Very interesting.

Seth Heckaman:

:

And I know you mentioned earlier

Seth Heckaman:

:

taking this 1 to 2 year kind of

Seth Heckaman:

:

perspective on starting to build

Seth Heckaman:

:

this culture in your business and

Seth Heckaman:

:

building systems.

Seth Heckaman:

:

But I'm curious, when you work with

Seth Heckaman:

:

a new client, what, are there

Seth Heckaman:

:

any, do

Seth Heckaman:

:

there seem to be any consistent

Seth Heckaman:

:

first steps or low-hanging

Seth Heckaman:

:

fruit that, you know, first

Seth Heckaman:

:

recommendations you find yourself

Seth Heckaman:

:

giving pretty regularly?

Gavin Coyle:

:

Yeah, great question Seth,

Gavin Coyle:

:

and it's actually turning

Gavin Coyle:

:

into a program.

Gavin Coyle:

:

So we

Gavin Coyle:

:

were doing it naturally

Gavin Coyle:

:

ourselves without actually having

Gavin Coyle:

:

a specific model

Gavin Coyle:

:

program,

Gavin Coyle:

:

but we

Gavin Coyle:

:

were breaking down at the moment.

Gavin Coyle:

:

We're actually that's going to go

Gavin Coyle:

:

live in the next couple of months as

Gavin Coyle:

:

a program.

Gavin Coyle:

:

We're just trying to figure out the

Gavin Coyle:

:

monetary value of that

Gavin Coyle:

:

for small to medium

Gavin Coyle:

:

companies. And then if there's large

Gavin Coyle:

:

companies to come in because we've

Gavin Coyle:

:

done it for the larger companies.

Gavin Coyle:

:

And I'll give you a classic

Gavin Coyle:

:

example where,

Gavin Coyle:

:

to give a simple

Gavin Coyle:

:

answer for your question is we would

Gavin Coyle:

:

do a gap analysis at discovery

Gavin Coyle:

:

stage process initially

Gavin Coyle:

:

to understand the logic of the

Gavin Coyle:

:

business and how the business

Gavin Coyle:

:

operates in the structure and

Gavin Coyle:

:

what's happened.

Gavin Coyle:

:

And in this specific case, it's like

Gavin Coyle:

:

a $50 million

Gavin Coyle:

:

turnover business, pretty strong

Gavin Coyle:

:

business and utilities.

Gavin Coyle:

:

But when we got into and started

Gavin Coyle:

:

speaking to the workers, which was

Gavin Coyle:

:

over a hundred workers, they were

Gavin Coyle:

:

all working in an

Gavin Coyle:

:

underground situations,

Gavin Coyle:

:

but they were actually employed as

Gavin Coyle:

:

overhead linesmen.

Gavin Coyle:

:

So this should have been up on a

Gavin Coyle:

:

poll that they were down in the

Gavin Coyle:

:

hole. And what

Gavin Coyle:

:

happened was they

Gavin Coyle:

:

had one big major client

Gavin Coyle:

:

contracts, the company

Gavin Coyle:

:

had.

Gavin Coyle:

:

And they told the guys, look,

Gavin Coyle:

:

big news. We've got loads of work

Gavin Coyle:

:

for the next 20 years where you're

Gavin Coyle:

:

going to have to go into the holes

Gavin Coyle:

:

and sort of do this kind of civils

Gavin Coyle:

:

type work.

Gavin Coyle:

:

And so all the guys did is because

Gavin Coyle:

:

obviously they see the families and

Gavin Coyle:

:

mortgages and the money was still

Gavin Coyle:

:

good.

Gavin Coyle:

:

But when I spoke to them, they were

Gavin Coyle:

:

like, we were never employed to do

Gavin Coyle:

:

this kind of.

Gavin Coyle:

:

You know, this is not us.

Gavin Coyle:

:

So we went back to the

Gavin Coyle:

:

contractor and we said, look,

Gavin Coyle:

:

we think there's a great opportunity

Gavin Coyle:

:

here, that there is

Gavin Coyle:

:

companies out there that

Gavin Coyle:

:

specifically of that task.

Gavin Coyle:

:

You've now got a load of data built

Gavin Coyle:

:

up in your business, how much time

Gavin Coyle:

:

it takes, what type of person you

Gavin Coyle:

:

need. It wasn't a competency-based

Gavin Coyle:

:

task, so they weren't

Gavin Coyle:

:

being slanting the rules

Gavin Coyle:

:

of safety in terms of putting

Gavin Coyle:

:

incompetent people into a competent

Gavin Coyle:

:

situation. Wasn't was manual

Gavin Coyle:

:

type task but still

Gavin Coyle:

:

they'd done this. And

Gavin Coyle:

:

so they had all this information and

Gavin Coyle:

:

then we said, let's go to tender

Gavin Coyle:

:

now. So we help them with the tender

Gavin Coyle:

:

process and we have to select

Gavin Coyle:

:

a contractor who specifically,

Gavin Coyle:

:

that's all they done.

Gavin Coyle:

:

And they knew exactly the dollar

Gavin Coyle:

:

value, how much that was worth than

Gavin Coyle:

:

in terms of savings.

Gavin Coyle:

:

So now our people are able to hold,

Gavin Coyle:

:

they become more productive because

Gavin Coyle:

:

now you have more capacity to take

Gavin Coyle:

:

on more work, because now your real

Gavin Coyle:

:

people, your direct staff, has

Gavin Coyle:

:

had time to do other things

Gavin Coyle:

:

and you had a company that was just

Gavin Coyle:

:

focused on those difficult tasks

Gavin Coyle:

:

that these guys were doing anyway.

Gavin Coyle:

:

And you knew the margins and you

Gavin Coyle:

:

knew what you were making and

Gavin Coyle:

:

still have a kind of

Gavin Coyle:

:

a wry smile with that company

Gavin Coyle:

:

because they've made over a billion

Gavin Coyle:

:

in terms of savings and

Gavin Coyle:

:

they've gone on to bigger things as

Gavin Coyle:

:

a company.

Gavin Coyle:

:

And it's just again, it's just

Gavin Coyle:

:

another way of companies

Gavin Coyle:

:

to say, stop.

Gavin Coyle:

:

What are you actually doing and what

Gavin Coyle:

:

is your specialty or what are you

Gavin Coyle:

:

what is your focus and where do you

Gavin Coyle:

:

want to be and what type of an

Gavin Coyle:

:

organization do you want to be known

Gavin Coyle:

:

for?

Gavin Coyle:

:

And sometimes we get distracted

Gavin Coyle:

:

or pulled into areas we don't

Gavin Coyle:

:

belong.

Gavin Coyle:

:

And safety has an impact

Gavin Coyle:

:

on that because people are

Gavin Coyle:

:

demotivated.

Gavin Coyle:

:

They weren't happy in the end, the

Gavin Coyle:

:

job they were in and

Gavin Coyle:

:

they were just going through the motions.

Seth Heckaman:

:

Yeah. And that opportunity was

Seth Heckaman:

:

identified by

Seth Heckaman:

:

talking to your people.

Seth Heckaman:

:

And so there's a good leadership

Seth Heckaman:

:

principle there too, of maybe that's

Seth Heckaman:

:

a good place to start.

Gavin Coyle:

:

Another classic example, just,

Gavin Coyle:

:

just to add to that is, when

Gavin Coyle:

:

we interview people and

Gavin Coyle:

:

which we do as part of the process,

Gavin Coyle:

:

we find that there's a disparity

Gavin Coyle:

:

of information being given

Gavin Coyle:

:

back to us by the people.

Gavin Coyle:

:

And it's done in a confidential

Gavin Coyle:

:

manner so people can speak

Gavin Coyle:

:

openly and freely.

Gavin Coyle:

:

But what we're really thinking about

Gavin Coyle:

:

on the call is and

Gavin Coyle:

:

with that, with that person, with

Gavin Coyle:

:

the manager, whoever it is guy on

Gavin Coyle:

:

the shop floor.

Gavin Coyle:

:

If there's an accident, that person

Gavin Coyle:

:

is going to say the exact same thing

Gavin Coyle:

:

to the health and safety inspector

Gavin Coyle:

:

that has to prosecute

Gavin Coyle:

:

your company.

Gavin Coyle:

:

And, you know, somebody is going are

Gavin Coyle:

:

saying exactly how they see

Gavin Coyle:

:

it and it's not really good.

Gavin Coyle:

:

In some cases they're saying, you

Gavin Coyle:

:

know what, we now we break

Gavin Coyle:

:

the process on such and such.

Gavin Coyle:

:

We know we don't really follow

Gavin Coyle:

:

through on that safety procedure.

Gavin Coyle:

:

You know, our my manager

Gavin Coyle:

:

doesn't really care about safety and

Gavin Coyle:

:

stuff like that.

Gavin Coyle:

:

So if he's going to say to me, he's

Gavin Coyle:

:

going to say to our health and

Gavin Coyle:

:

safety inspector who's prosecuting

Gavin Coyle:

:

maybe an accident.

Gavin Coyle:

:

So we need to know if people

Gavin Coyle:

:

we need to have a forum that people

Gavin Coyle:

:

can express their views and be open

Gavin Coyle:

:

about that.

Gavin Coyle:

:

They shouldn't have, obviously have

Gavin Coyle:

:

to be reprimanded

Gavin Coyle:

:

in any way, shape or form.

Gavin Coyle:

:

But we need to be open to better

Gavin Coyle:

:

conversations and so that

Gavin Coyle:

:

the trust can be built in such a way

Gavin Coyle:

:

that it's open and transparent for

Gavin Coyle:

:

the whole business.

Gavin Coyle:

:

And, you know,

Gavin Coyle:

:

that's an area that people kind of

Gavin Coyle:

:

shy away from as well, that they

Gavin Coyle:

:

don't really want exactly what you

Gavin Coyle:

:

just said, their set.

Gavin Coyle:

:

They don't really set sides, the

Gavin Coyle:

:

questions to be asked and people

Gavin Coyle:

:

in such a way that's, you know,

Gavin Coyle:

:

well, okay, if you feel that's

Gavin Coyle:

:

a problem, let's address the

Gavin Coyle:

:

problem. Let's have an open forum

Gavin Coyle:

:

and let's talk about.

Gavin Coyle:

:

Now, if you don't follow through,

Gavin Coyle:

:

you know, you're back to your

Gavin Coyle:

:

culture question and you're back to

Gavin Coyle:

:

it's not just safety that's going to

Gavin Coyle:

:

be affected. Everybody's job is

Gavin Coyle:

:

going to be affected now, if we

Gavin Coyle:

:

have this type of environment going

Gavin Coyle:

:

on.

Todd Miller:

:

Very interesting.

Todd Miller:

:

And I think that's you know, when

Todd Miller:

:

you talk about transparency and

Todd Miller:

:

openness, I think a lot of companies

Todd Miller:

:

do struggle with that when it comes

Todd Miller:

:

to these important things.

Todd Miller:

:

Everyone kind of wonders, well,

Todd Miller:

:

who's listening to this and who's

Todd Miller:

:

watching me?

Todd Miller:

:

And, you know, who am I really

Todd Miller:

:

saying this to?

Todd Miller:

:

And so I love that you,

Todd Miller:

:

as a company, as a consultant,

Todd Miller:

:

can bring that kind of

Todd Miller:

:

openness out of people.

Todd Miller:

:

That's great.

Todd Miller:

:

Kind of backing up a little bit, I'm

Todd Miller:

:

still kind of thinking

Todd Miller:

:

a lot about this concept

Todd Miller:

:

of businesses using

Todd Miller:

:

their safety record as,

Todd Miller:

:

you know, as something they promote

Todd Miller:

:

to prospective clients.

Todd Miller:

:

I don't see that happen very much.

Todd Miller:

:

I mean, are there any companies

Todd Miller:

:

you've seen who are really good at

Todd Miller:

:

that or any tools,

Todd Miller:

:

you know, for for being good at

Todd Miller:

:

that?

Gavin Coyle:

:

I forgot I was going to say Boeing,

Gavin Coyle:

:

but I...

Todd Miller:

:

Yeah, I.

Gavin Coyle:

:

I don't think,

Gavin Coyle:

:

but doesn't it go to show you know,

Gavin Coyle:

:

without going into specifics,

Gavin Coyle:

:

where was the open and transparent

Gavin Coyle:

:

discussion around that whole

Gavin Coyle:

:

scenario?

Todd Miller:

:

Right.

Gavin Coyle:

:

And, you know,

Gavin Coyle:

:

a company with massive resources

Gavin Coyle:

:

in terms of safety

Gavin Coyle:

:

and in general, but still

Gavin Coyle:

:

want to. And so what

Gavin Coyle:

:

does that tell you?

Gavin Coyle:

:

It doesn't matter what the size of

Gavin Coyle:

:

the company is, that same

Gavin Coyle:

:

environment or culture can be

Gavin Coyle:

:

transferred into a small company.

Gavin Coyle:

:

And if you're a small business

Gavin Coyle:

:

owner, listen to the podcast.

Gavin Coyle:

:

You know, just because it's phone or

Gavin Coyle:

:

just because it's whoever-sized

Gavin Coyle:

:

company. The same

Gavin Coyle:

:

challenges are in everybody's

Gavin Coyle:

:

business.

Gavin Coyle:

:

It's just different scale.

Gavin Coyle:

:

And at the end of the day, a

Gavin Coyle:

:

fatality is a fatality.

Gavin Coyle:

:

It's

Gavin Coyle:

:

a person, it's a family.

Gavin Coyle:

:

And it's massive collateral damage

Gavin Coyle:

:

that comes out of that and

Gavin Coyle:

:

every company that we've dealt with

Gavin Coyle:

:

honors their own challenges.

Gavin Coyle:

:

And there's nobody you can say to

Gavin Coyle:

:

have changed the health department,

Gavin Coyle:

:

their you know,

Gavin Coyle:

:

their and their leader,

Gavin Coyle:

:

if you like, in terms of health and

Gavin Coyle:

:

safety.

Gavin Coyle:

:

But,

Gavin Coyle:

:

as you said, Todd, how do they

Gavin Coyle:

:

promote and sets and in

Gavin Coyle:

:

terms of how do they get their

Gavin Coyle:

:

message out there, a safe company?

Gavin Coyle:

:

Like, where is it that

Gavin Coyle:

:

there is an implied

Gavin Coyle:

:

and sort of mantra

Gavin Coyle:

:

within the client to say,

Gavin Coyle:

:

You know, I don't, I just know this

Gavin Coyle:

:

company's safe anyway, because I

Gavin Coyle:

:

know their reputation.

Gavin Coyle:

:

I know that they're safe.

Gavin Coyle:

:

They don't even have to really

Gavin Coyle:

:

challenge it so much because

Gavin Coyle:

:

they just know that when you're

Gavin Coyle:

:

talking to really good, competent

Gavin Coyle:

:

people, you know, to take on, it's a

Gavin Coyle:

:

never for you. And fortunately,

Gavin Coyle:

:

especially in the contracting game

Gavin Coyle:

:

and the dilution

Gavin Coyle:

:

of people's

Gavin Coyle:

:

process as you go down, the food

Gavin Coyle:

:

chain gets worse and worse

Gavin Coyle:

:

and therefore the output gets worse

Gavin Coyle:

:

and worse.

Gavin Coyle:

:

And so we see people going bankrupt.

Gavin Coyle:

:

We see accidents happening, and

Gavin Coyle:

:

you see things that are happening

Gavin Coyle:

:

that shouldn't be happening.

Gavin Coyle:

:

And so we go back to transparency.

Gavin Coyle:

:

There isn't a transparent process

Gavin Coyle:

:

per se in how we

Gavin Coyle:

:

award contracts, how we

Gavin Coyle:

:

secure contracts, and how

Gavin Coyle:

:

we have an open, honest discussion

Gavin Coyle:

:

about there's enough in the pot

Gavin Coyle:

:

for everybody here.

Gavin Coyle:

:

So why don't we come together as

Gavin Coyle:

:

a collective team of contractors

Gavin Coyle:

:

and we say to clients, Look,

Gavin Coyle:

:

we're actually more unified than you

Gavin Coyle:

:

think we are.

Gavin Coyle:

:

We have a common purpose.

Gavin Coyle:

:

We have a common goal.

Gavin Coyle:

:

We all want to make money, and

Gavin Coyle:

:

we don't want to sort of have to

Gavin Coyle:

:

go down the sparring route of

Gavin Coyle:

:

subcontracting our work to

Gavin Coyle:

:

another subcontractor that's going

Gavin Coyle:

:

to subcontract out again and again

Gavin Coyle:

:

and again.

Gavin Coyle:

:

And next thing it breaks and we all

Gavin Coyle:

:

go, We didn't even

Gavin Coyle:

:

know this company existed.

Gavin Coyle:

:

We thought we gave this contract to

Gavin Coyle:

:

X Carptentry services or whatever

Gavin Coyle:

:

else. Like just if we want

Gavin Coyle:

:

to talk about start

Gavin Coyle:

:

correcting the situations

Gavin Coyle:

:

within the system.

Gavin Coyle:

:

The procurement system has major

Gavin Coyle:

:

challenges in their experience.

Seth Heckaman:

:

Todd, hearing him talk, I'm thinking

Seth Heckaman:

:

about the times that we've both had

Seth Heckaman:

:

being in the house with, you know,

Seth Heckaman:

:

one of our dealers selling a roof

Seth Heckaman:

:

and either the husband or the wife

Seth Heckaman:

:

making the comment that they

Seth Heckaman:

:

want to go on vacation when the roof

Seth Heckaman:

:

is being installed because it's

Seth Heckaman:

:

going to stress them out too much.

Seth Heckaman:

:

Seeing the guys walk up all around

Seth Heckaman:

:

the roof are worried something's

Seth Heckaman:

:

going to happen. And definitely

Seth Heckaman:

:

the companies that have a clear

Seth Heckaman:

:

process and a system

Seth Heckaman:

:

in place and give a clear answer

Seth Heckaman:

:

about how they're going to keep

Seth Heckaman:

:

their people safe as well as the

Seth Heckaman:

:

property safe during during

Seth Heckaman:

:

it are going to have a clear

Seth Heckaman:

:

advantage versus those that

Seth Heckaman:

:

can't say much then, other than I

Seth Heckaman:

:

have no idea what the sub is going

Seth Heckaman:

:

to do when he's up there.

Seth Heckaman:

:

So, yeah,

Seth Heckaman:

:

you know, knowing what your plan is

Seth Heckaman:

:

to keep people safe is, you know, a

Seth Heckaman:

:

clear advantage in those cases.

Todd Miller:

:

I always think it's interesting

Todd Miller:

:

whenever you know, someone is

Todd Miller:

:

looking at buying something or

Todd Miller:

:

contracting out for a service.

Todd Miller:

:

I think they always start with the

Todd Miller:

:

assumption that everything is going

Todd Miller:

:

to go right amongst

Todd Miller:

:

everyone that they're talking to as

Todd Miller:

:

far as possible bidders of

Todd Miller:

:

their project.

Todd Miller:

:

And some companies gradually sort

Todd Miller:

:

of eliminate themselves during

Todd Miller:

:

that bidding process where they

Todd Miller:

:

start to realize, oh,

Todd Miller:

:

things may not go quite so right

Todd Miller:

:

with this company, and

Todd Miller:

:

yet the cream always rises to the

Todd Miller:

:

top, hopefully.

Gavin Coyle:

:

Now we all know

Gavin Coyle:

:

that there's, you know,

Gavin Coyle:

:

plenty of tenders go out and

Gavin Coyle:

:

then

Gavin Coyle:

:

people don't really think about

Gavin Coyle:

:

their capacity.

Gavin Coyle:

:

And the

Gavin Coyle:

:

next thing, there's a contractor

Gavin Coyle:

:

comes in, we want that contract and

Gavin Coyle:

:

everybody's looking at it.

Gavin Coyle:

:

We actually want that contract and,

Gavin Coyle:

:

you know, oh shit, like, sorry for

Gavin Coyle:

:

the language, but where are we going

Gavin Coyle:

:

to get the people to deliver it?

Todd Miller:

:

Right.

Gavin Coyle:

:

Okay, well look,

Gavin Coyle:

:

we'll spam the next thing and in a

Gavin Coyle:

:

lot of cases that there should be

Gavin Coyle:

:

some sort of a lead-in period where

Gavin Coyle:

:

there's a cooling off period,

Gavin Coyle:

:

we talk about cooling off and

Gavin Coyle:

:

contracts.

Gavin Coyle:

:

There should be a cooling off period

Gavin Coyle:

:

for for contractors to allow

Gavin Coyle:

:

them to get up to speed

Gavin Coyle:

:

with regards to what the

Gavin Coyle:

:

requirements are for projects.

Gavin Coyle:

:

Because, you know,

Gavin Coyle:

:

a lot of people don't ask the

Gavin Coyle:

:

question, have you got the capacity

Gavin Coyle:

:

to deliver this and how many other

Gavin Coyle:

:

tenders have you got that are

Gavin Coyle:

:

out there that are live at the

Gavin Coyle:

:

moment?

Gavin Coyle:

:

And what sort of resources do you

Gavin Coyle:

:

have around that that actually

Gavin Coyle:

:

might affect the the chances

Gavin Coyle:

:

of you not turning up on

Gavin Coyle:

:

a Monday or turning

Gavin Coyle:

:

up on a Friday and telling me you

Gavin Coyle:

:

can't do a job anymore?

Todd Miller:

:

Well, Gavin, this has been very

Todd Miller:

:

interesting.

Todd Miller:

:

And, you know, I really do encourage

Todd Miller:

:

everyone to check out your book,

Todd Miller:

:

Workplace Safety on a Budget.

Todd Miller:

:

Also, of course,

Todd Miller:

:

gavincoyle.com and looking up the

Todd Miller:

:

Coyle Group. But is there anything

Todd Miller:

:

that we haven't covered today that

Todd Miller:

:

you'd like to share with our

Todd Miller:

:

audience?

Gavin Coyle:

:

That I just want everybody to

Gavin Coyle:

:

embrace

Gavin Coyle:

:

health and safety as a tool of

Gavin Coyle:

:

your business that's going to make

Gavin Coyle:

:

your money. And it's actually going

Gavin Coyle:

:

to improve the quality and the

Gavin Coyle:

:

standard of your work and

Gavin Coyle:

:

that, you know, you will attract

Gavin Coyle:

:

really good people to your business

Gavin Coyle:

:

if you have a reputation for safety.

Todd Miller:

:

Wow, we haven't even touched on that

Todd Miller:

:

yet. But you're yeah, that makes

Todd Miller:

:

every bit of sense.

Todd Miller:

:

So I love your model here

Todd Miller:

:

of just helping businesses look at

Todd Miller:

:

safety as a way to

Todd Miller:

:

grow themselves to to

Todd Miller:

:

profitability and and

Todd Miller:

:

other levels of success

Todd Miller:

:

rather than the sort of necessary

Todd Miller:

:

evil that, oh, I got to do this to

Todd Miller:

:

meet regulatory requirements or

Todd Miller:

:

something.

Gavin Coyle:

:

Yeah, trying to make it more positive.

Seth Heckaman:

:

Right, and it shouldn't be taboo.

Seth Heckaman:

:

And it just it

Seth Heckaman:

:

makes so much sense because

Seth Heckaman:

:

it's an individual kind of a single

Seth Heckaman:

:

perspective that everyone can get

Seth Heckaman:

:

behind in the organization,

Seth Heckaman:

:

regardless of how many degrees you

Seth Heckaman:

:

are removed from the hazard

Seth Heckaman:

:

itself. So it makes total

Seth Heckaman:

:

sense.

Todd Miller:

:

Very good. Well, I have to ask

Todd Miller:

:

you, Gavin, before we close out this

Todd Miller:

:

episode, if you're

Todd Miller:

:

willing to participate in something

Todd Miller:

:

we call our rapid fire questions.

Todd Miller:

:

So this is where we have a little

Todd Miller:

:

fun at the end of most episodes,

Todd Miller:

:

and we will ask you seven

Todd Miller:

:

questions that may be serious,

Todd Miller:

:

may be silly.

Todd Miller:

:

All you have to do is give an

Todd Miller:

:

answer, and

Todd Miller:

:

everyone needs to understand that

Todd Miller:

:

you, Gavin, has absolutely no idea

Todd Miller:

:

what we're about to ask.

Todd Miller:

:

So are you up to the

Todd Miller:

:

challenge of rapid fire?

Gavin Coyle:

:

Yeah, my wifi is a little bit

Gavin Coyle:

:

unsteady at the moment Todd, so just

Gavin Coyle:

:

in case it drops out, you know.

Todd Miller:

:

Honestly, it's not a scary process.

Gavin Coyle:

:

Hello, Todd? Hello, Todd?

Todd Miller:

:

Well, let's go.

Todd Miller:

:

We will alternate asking.

Todd Miller:

:

Seth, you want to start out?

Seth Heckaman:

:

Sure.

Seth Heckaman:

:

So rapid fire question number one,

Seth Heckaman:

:

what product have you bought in

Seth Heckaman:

:

recent memory that has been a

Seth Heckaman:

:

disruptor or game changer

Seth Heckaman:

:

for you?

Gavin Coyle:

:

Yeah, I have to say I had a

Gavin Coyle:

:

Microsoft laptop and I thought

Gavin Coyle:

:

Microsoft was doing,

Gavin Coyle:

:

you know, the Microsoft Surface.

Gavin Coyle:

:

I thought it was phenomenal.

Gavin Coyle:

:

I thought this was definitely going

Gavin Coyle:

:

to trump the Apple

Gavin Coyle:

:

because I'd always been Apple.

Gavin Coyle:

:

And I had a heartbreak with that

Gavin Coyle:

:

Microsoft. I never want to see

Gavin Coyle:

:

Microsoft ever again.

Gavin Coyle:

:

I absolutely love Apple.

Gavin Coyle:

:

And I'm not being paid by Apple, by

Gavin Coyle:

:

the way. It was like and

Gavin Coyle:

:

I don't want to get into a lawsuit

Gavin Coyle:

:

here. I'm not going to discuss the

Gavin Coyle:

:

issues. But brand new laptop

Gavin Coyle:

:

shouldn't be doing some of the stuff

Gavin Coyle:

:

my laptop was.

Gavin Coyle:

:

But the Apple is working perfectly

Gavin Coyle:

:

well.

Todd Miller:

:

All four of us involved with the

Todd Miller:

:

show here today are Apple folks.

Todd Miller:

:

So you're in

Todd Miller:

:

a friendly audience there.

Todd Miller:

:

So question number two,

Todd Miller:

:

what part of a business

Todd Miller:

:

do you think absolutely must

Todd Miller:

:

be gotten right?

Todd Miller:

:

In other words, if a business can't

Todd Miller:

:

get this right, there's no

Todd Miller:

:

point in even attempting anything

Todd Miller:

:

else.

Todd Miller:

:

This may be a softball question for

Todd Miller:

:

you, or maybe it's a little bit

Todd Miller:

:

harder. I don't know.

Gavin Coyle:

:

Yeah.

Gavin Coyle:

:

At the end of the day, if

Gavin Coyle:

:

we spoke about it earlier,

Gavin Coyle:

:

if your

Gavin Coyle:

:

culture and your systems and your

Gavin Coyle:

:

processes doesn't match up, go home.

Gavin Coyle:

:

It's not worth it.

Gavin Coyle:

:

You're in total disarray,

Gavin Coyle:

:

you're in chaos, you're in negative

Gavin Coyle:

:

territory and

Gavin Coyle:

:

you don't know what to do.

Gavin Coyle:

:

And that might sound harsh,

Gavin Coyle:

:

but like, if you want a rain check

Gavin Coyle:

:

and if you haven't got the strength

Gavin Coyle:

:

or if you can't bring people around

Gavin Coyle:

:

you that can give you the strength

Gavin Coyle:

:

and the confidence to deliver,

Gavin Coyle:

:

though, in those areas.

Gavin Coyle:

:

You're going to be a failure.

Todd Miller:

:

That's a good answer. Very good.

Seth Heckaman:

:

Absolutely. Question number three, What

Seth Heckaman:

:

would you like to be remembered for?

Gavin Coyle:

:

I was thinking of some events on

Gavin Coyle:

:

Saturday night, but that's not going

Gavin Coyle:

:

to

Gavin Coyle:

:

happen.

Gavin Coyle:

:

I don't think that's going to.

Gavin Coyle:

:

I'd like to be able to

Gavin Coyle:

:

for people to say that

Gavin Coyle:

:

I done me best in health and safety

Gavin Coyle:

:

to deliver safety for people

Gavin Coyle:

:

at all levels, regardless of who

Gavin Coyle:

:

or where they are in the world

Gavin Coyle:

:

of what size a company they work

Gavin Coyle:

:

for or what age they are or

Gavin Coyle:

:

race or anything or whatever.

Gavin Coyle:

:

It's just, you know, at the end of

Gavin Coyle:

:

the day, everybody

Gavin Coyle:

:

deserves safety.

Todd Miller:

:

Good stuff, So our first three

Todd Miller:

:

questions were a little heavier.

Todd Miller:

:

The next four are actually a little

Todd Miller:

:

more lighthearted, just so you know.

Gavin Coyle:

:

Okay.

Todd Miller:

:

Question number four.

Todd Miller:

:

If you had to eat a crayon,

Todd Miller:

:

what color of crayon would you

Todd Miller:

:

choose?

Gavin Coyle:

:

I can't. That's

Gavin Coyle:

:

not safe.

Gavin Coyle:

:

That's not a safe question to ask anybody.

Todd Miller:

:

I figured that would come up.

Gavin Coyle:

:

Oh,

Gavin Coyle:

:

my God. Next question please.

Gavin Coyle:

:

Who asks the safety person

Gavin Coyle:

:

that question? I remember you,

Gavin Coyle:

:

you're the crayon man.

Gavin Coyle:

:

Safety guy told everybody he eats crayons

Gavin Coyle:

:

there.

Gavin Coyle:

:

I'm sorry, I can't go there.

Gavin Coyle:

:

That's actually, that's

Gavin Coyle:

:

a planted question, Todd.

Gavin Coyle:

:

I have to say, when you

Gavin Coyle:

:

roll that one in very nicely to see

Gavin Coyle:

:

and test me.

Gavin Coyle:

:

Moving on, moving on.

Todd Miller:

:

We will move on. I'm not sure what your reaction

Todd Miller:

:

will be to this next one, though.

Gavin Coyle:

:

Whoa.

Seth Heckaman:

:

So the next one, you're

Seth Heckaman:

:

trying to survive a zombie

Seth Heckaman:

:

apocalypse.

Seth Heckaman:

:

What one person do you definitely

Seth Heckaman:

:

want on your team?

Gavin Coyle:

:

Oh, Elon Musk.

Gavin Coyle:

:

All day, every day.

Gavin Coyle:

:

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Gavin Coyle:

:

He's got the assets, he's got the resources.

Gavin Coyle:

:

He's got the spaceship to get us out

Gavin Coyle:

:

of there.

Seth Heckaman:

:

There you go. Good answer.

Todd Miller:

:

I like it.

Todd Miller:

:

Okay, next to last question.

Todd Miller:

:

Are you a morning person or a night

Todd Miller:

:

owl?

Gavin Coyle:

:

Good question.

Gavin Coyle:

:

I would suggest I'd be a night owl.

Todd Miller:

:

I was more of a night owl when I was

Todd Miller:

:

younger. But as I get older, I'm a

Todd Miller:

:

morning person.

Todd Miller:

:

I conk out about 9:00 at night.

Seth Heckaman:

:

Alright. Last rapid fire question.

Seth Heckaman:

:

Would you prefer to have to wear

Seth Heckaman:

:

bellbottom pants or have

Seth Heckaman:

:

your hair styled in a mohawk?

Gavin Coyle:

:

Oh, my God. Well, look at that.

Gavin Coyle:

:

Have you seen my hair?

Todd Miller:

:

Well, I'm

Todd Miller:

:

right there with you.

Gavin Coyle:

:

Or what's left of it. I'd go with the Mohawk

Gavin Coyle:

:

because it kind of has an aspiration

Gavin Coyle:

:

that I do have hair.

Seth Heckaman:

:

There you go.

Todd Miller:

:

Love it, good answer.

Todd Miller:

:

This has been a real pleasure and

Todd Miller:

:

very eye-opening to learn about your

Todd Miller:

:

business.

Todd Miller:

:

So, again, if you could remind

Todd Miller:

:

us for folks who want to get in

Todd Miller:

:

touch with you or follow what you're

Todd Miller:

:

doing, what are the best ways

Todd Miller:

:

for them to do that?

Gavin Coyle:

:

So I'm on LinkedIn,

Gavin Coyle:

:

always happy to connect with people

Gavin Coyle:

:

on LinkedIn and

Gavin Coyle:

:

the book is on Amazon.com.

Gavin Coyle:

:

Workplace Safety on a Budget and

Gavin Coyle:

:

gavin-coyle.com is the website

Gavin Coyle:

:

with the book and with free courses

Gavin Coyle:

:

and the free resources and all that

Gavin Coyle:

:

good stuff. So read it and encourage

Gavin Coyle:

:

people to go to that website

Gavin Coyle:

:

and, and either way you'll get

Gavin Coyle:

:

me through those channels.

Gavin Coyle:

:

Even though

Gavin Coyle:

:

we have Coyle group on socials, I

Gavin Coyle:

:

would suggest go to gavin-coyle.com

Gavin Coyle:

:

and you still got me anyway.

Todd Miller:

:

Great.

Todd Miller:

:

Well, and we will put all those in

Todd Miller:

:

the show notes as well.

Todd Miller:

:

But we do encourage folks to

Todd Miller:

:

check you out further as well.

Todd Miller:

:

And just some great concepts

Todd Miller:

:

here about safety that

Todd Miller:

:

I think are really disruptive for

Todd Miller:

:

contracting businesses.

Todd Miller:

:

So I sure hope people check

Todd Miller:

:

it out. So thank you again,

Todd Miller:

:

Gavin, for being here today.

Todd Miller:

:

It's been a real pleasure.

Gavin Coyle:

:

Hundred percent correct.

Gavin Coyle:

:

Had a great time and thank you very

Gavin Coyle:

:

much for having me, guys.

Todd Miller:

:

And I will also thank our audience

Todd Miller:

:

for tuning into this episode of

Todd Miller:

:

Construction Disruption with Gavin

Todd Miller:

:

Coyle of Coyle Group,

Todd Miller:

:

and he is also the Safety CEO.

Todd Miller:

:

So please watch for future episodes

Todd Miller:

:

of our podcast.

Todd Miller:

:

We're always blessed with great

Todd Miller:

:

guests.

Todd Miller:

:

Don't forget to leave a review

Todd Miller:

:

please, on Apple Podcasts or

Todd Miller:

:

YouTube. Until the next time

Todd Miller:

:

we're together, though, I encourage

Todd Miller:

:

everyone keep on disrupting,

Todd Miller:

:

keep on doing things different from

Todd Miller:

:

everybody else.

Todd Miller:

:

And also don't forget to have a

Todd Miller:

:

positive impact on everyone you

Todd Miller:

:

encounter. Make them smile,

Todd Miller:

:

encourage them.

Todd Miller:

:

Simple yet powerful things we can

Todd Miller:

:

all do to change the world for

Todd Miller:

:

someone.

Todd Miller:

:

So God bless and take care.

Todd Miller:

:

This is Isaiah Industries signing

Todd Miller:

:

off until the next episode of

Todd Miller:

:

Construction Disruption.

Intro/Outro:

:

This podcast is produced by Isaiah

Intro/Outro:

:

Industries, manufacturer

Intro/Outro:

:

of specialty metal roofing and other

Intro/Outro:

:

Intro/Outro: building products.

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