Welcome to this episode of Orange Hatter, where we dive deep into a conversation with Ella, a college student with a unique perspective on Bitcoin, blockchain, and how it's shaping the outlook of Gen Z.

Key Takeaways:

1. Discovering Bitcoin: Ella’s introduction to Bitcoin during her high school years and her exploration of blockchain technologies through courses and online resources.
2. Ella's Investment Choices: The transition from initially buying Ethereum and Cardano to becoming a staunch Bitcoin advocate.
3. The Power of Knowledge: How attending the Oslo Freedom Forum and understanding global challenges changed Ella's views.
4. Bitcoin and Personal Growth: Ella discusses the non-monetary benefits of Bitcoin, emphasizing the transformation of self and heightened self-awareness it brought her.
5. Gen Z's Digital Dilemma: Ella's insights into the challenges and changes she sees in her generation’s relationship with social media and digital platforms.

Quote of the Episode: "... it was never really price for me. It was just learning about Bitcoin... seeing the values that Bitcoin is aligned with, what it does for humanity... the effects of sound money, how it's changing our time preferences, and we can talk about that more also, but it was the human aspect..." - Ella

Resources: The Oslo Freedom Forum: https://oslofreedomforum.com

Have thoughts or feedback on the episode? Email us at tali@orangehatter.com. Don't forget to tune in tomorrow for the continuation of our enlightening chat!

Mentioned in this episode:

Aleia Free Market Kids Sponsorship FULL

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Hey everybody.

Welcome to Orange Hatter.

Today you'll be listening in to my conversation with Ella.

She is a college student and has a fascinating story to

share, so I hope you enjoy.

Hi.

Welcome, Ella to Orange Chatter.

I am so happy to be chatting with you.

I'm gonna jump right into my typical first question for all my guests.

How did you hear about Bitcoin and and when?

Sounds great.

Well, first, Tali, thank you so much for having me.

I first learned about Bitcoin when I was, I think it was either the

end of my junior year or beginning of my senior year of high school.

So that was 2020, 2021.

And I just learned about blockchain.

I didn't know what Bitcoin was, at first.

I was taking a class on blockchain in my high school and then, um, I

eventually found the Gary Gensler on MIT OpenCourseWare on blockchain and money.

And so, you know, I learned about, I had to do presentations on Cardano and

Ethereum, and of course, Bitcoin was in there as well, but I, I didn't, I

didn't understand or appreciate Bitcoin for what it was, which I, I think is a

good thing, because then I now really understand and appreciate Bitcoin.

Um, so yeah, I was just learning about it, and I was also starting my first

job, where I got a real paycheck.

And so my parents sat down with me and said, okay, you know,

Ella, you should think about saving for, you know, the future.

You know, this is your money, but we wanna make sure you can take care of yourself.

So let's set up a brokerage account.

Let's set up a Roth IRA.

And I said, okay, great.

And then, you know, what am I going to invest in?

And I was learning about blockchain, my mom was as well, and we kind of came to

the question of how do we buy blockchain?

And then, you know, bought Ethereum, Cardano Bitcoin, and then you

just learn more about Bitcoin and you fall down the rabbit hole.

And now Bitcoin only.

So you bought Ethereum, Cardano, and Bitcoin.

Why did you eventually only end in Bitcoin?

Were you reading up a lot, or were you just watching the prize rise and fall?

Yes.

Um, and it's funny cuz I, I still have the scratch paper when I was trying

to decide how much I was going to allocate to Bitcoin versus the others.

And sadly it was not majority Bitcoin.

But I, it wasn't price.

I actually bought Bitcoin at the, I bought Bitcoin at the all time high.

I looked back and I still proudly hodl that, never sold it.

So when it crashed, or not crashed, but when it significantly declined

in price, I didn't go and sell it and say, okay, I'm gonna buy more Ethereum.

So, it was never really price for me.

It was just learning about Bitcoin.

Reading, you know, all the, the typical books, "Bitcoin Standard", listening to

podcasts, and then, I think the big moment was going to the Oslo Freedom Forum and

really seeing the values that Bitcoin is aligned with, what it does for humanity.

That, that, that aspect of Bitcoin I, I think is what really kind of captured me.

So not money, but of course how it...

the effects of sound money, how it's changing our time preferences, and

we can talk about that more also, but it was the human aspect and just the

values of Bitcoin versus fiat, um, the dollar, or other cryptocurrencies.

Okay, so the human aspect and the freedom aspect, can you expand a

little bit more with maybe specific examples that you remember that you

read that made a difference for you?

Um, yes.

So I, we, my mom and I both went to the Oslo Freedom Forum last summer, and

we really went for the Bitcoin track.

But now looking back, we both said it was everything else that was happening

in that space that we were really so grateful that we went, because, you

know, embarrassed to admit, but I really had no idea what was happening

in many other parts of the world.

Um, I had studied abroad in China, so I knew the situation with Uyghurs, and

I knew some of what they discussed at the conference, but I had no idea about

the Belarusian activists using Bitcoin to fund their political campaigns

or just, I mean, um, in, I think it was Costa Rica, it was happening.

Also Venezuela, just...

el Salvador.

All the places where they don't have sound money, where they don't

have access to the financial system.

Only two thirds of the world is banked.

So I kind of think about our world is operating at, you

know, max two thirds capacity.

We're missing out on a whole third of people.

So I hope those are some specific examples for you.

But though...

all of those stories that we heard over the course of the, the time,

there's really what spoke to us.

So what did you do differently when you came back from that?

It's, I wish I, I journaled maybe, and so that I could really

understand what I did differently.

But in terms of how I want to move forward in my own life, I was very

down the rabbit hole of AI and ethics, and how do we code ethics into AI?

So when I, I studied abroad in China.

And when I went, I did not know any Chinese.

I just accepted that I didn't know anything and that I would

learn it when I was there.

And so when I was learning the language, um, some of the characters, our teachers

taught us that they literally kind of code ethics into the language.

And so I was curious if you could do the same thing with

AI, if you could code and...

ethically into computer language.

And I now think maybe that's not possible.

But that's really what I wanted to focus on.

And now I've switched much more over to Bitcoin.

How do I...

I've taken so much from Bitcoin, all the learning...

how do I now start giving, how do I now start, um, focusing my

energy and my time on Bitcoin?

So I think just in the direction that my life goes, it's changed,

um, since the Oslo Freedom Forum.

And then, Bitcoin itself...

you know, I, this is a quote from Erik Cason, but he said "kind of the greatest

wealth that you get from Bitcoin, it's not the monetary, um, value.

It's just the transformation of self and the knowledge that you acquire."

So, I've never had social media, I've never kind of been in that

world, but I think Bitcoin just makes you hyper aware and focused

of how you spend your time, what you consume, where you put your energy.

And so, just from a sense of self, I think, um, has grown and

transformed because of Bitcoin.

Um, So kind of life path and then on the daily basis has changed a lot.

So you are a recent high school grad then, if you were a junior...

or a junior in 2021?

Um, no.

I was a senior in 2021.

Um, but yes, I'll be a junior now in college.

In college, okay.

So you've never been on social media except for Twitter.

Yes, it's the, it's the news source that's...

and Noster now also, but yeah.

Right.

Um, but I think what you said really popped, jumped out at me, which

is that it makes you very aware of how you're consuming your time.

And I think that is a very, very big challenge for kids.

I call you kids.

Sorry.

Everybody...

all young people are kids to me.

Um, but, because my kids...

you're about the same age as my kids.

So, it is such a huge challenge for them to separate themselves from their

phone, even with the best intentions.

And so I'm just curious...

it's gonna be a hard sell to people your age when you say, watch

how you are consuming your time.

Especially with just mindlessly scrolling through YouTube shorts and TikTok videos

and losing two, two hours at a time that they're never going to get back.

So how do you address that with them?

Yeah.

So, um, and this maybe I'll, I'll touch on the low versus high time

preference here, because I, I think it, it kind of, um, fits in right here.

But the whole concept of Bitcoin, um, credit to...

for this is that Bitcoin makes you low time preference.

So you, you have sound money and so you're, you know that in the future,

your money will hold its value or increase in value, and so you're more

inclined to cooperate or be peaceful or think positively about your future.

Whereas right now, we live in a much more high time preference society, where we

don't expect our money to hold its value.

In fact, we know it won't.

That's why we invest in stocks.

And oh, what, what should we save our money in?

Um, we're less inclined to cooperate, think positively about the future.

Um, so that's the society we live in now.

And then if you think about, um, Google, you know, it tells us how many

milliseconds it took to get our response.

Um, social media, TikTok, Snapchat, everything is just instant.

Um, there's no sense of delayed gratification there...

which Bitcoin is all about the long-term gratification.

So I think it's hard, the fact that society's not helping us.

All of the platforms that we are on, on a daily basis, are high time preference,

they're not low time preference focused.

Um, but I give a lot of credit to Gen Z because I, I do...

I've seen that a lot of my friends, they've been on social media, um,

but now they've, they honestly, a lot of them are getting off of

it or they're just not using it.

And so that's been a very interesting shift.

Um, 'cause when I was younger, you know, people would text if they had a

homework question or anything like that.

And I, I got a phone much later compared to other friends, which...

very happy about not complaining about it.

Um, the people would email me.

And so, everything has just changed, I think, within Gen Z...

or it's changing, um, slowly.

So, I'm not entirely sure how to address it, I guess is the short answer.

Um, but I think it's happening somewhat naturally.

People are just realizing, um, and once enough people in your circle do it, your

behaviors are more likely to change.

So, I wish I had a better answer for you on how to address it.

Um, And maybe that's something for me to work on and, and figure out.

Yeah.

Um, I definitely see an awakening happening.

I just, it's, it's tough.

It's tough.

Thank you for listening.

Did you hear anything in our conversation today that you resonated with?

Were you able to identify with some of the feelings that Ella had?

If so, I would love to hear from you.

Please send your questions or comments to my email, Tali@orange hatter.com.

I would love to hear from you.

Come back tomorrow and hear the rest of our conversation.

Thank you.

See you soon.