Getting big returns in venture capital can involve stepping away from the mainstream and investing in opportunities that others won't. Will Gibbs of Octopus Ventures has a reputation for investing in areas others see as taboo. We ask him about being a contrarian investor, how to do it well and what needs to change to create a successful investment.

In a discussion filled with numerous examples, Will discusses:

• getting big enough markets when the market is somewhat hidden
• balancing new technology and new markets
• when specialist investors are needed
• judging whether a company will be ripe for follow-on investment
• how taboo investments can interact with social change
• sequencing market expansion
• what a company needs to internationalise
• what problems that internationalising doesn't solve
• building deal flow in taboo areas
• how the venture capital industry is creating some of the problems
• the value of team diversity in looking away from consensus areas
• whether valuations are different in taboo areas.

In a wide ranging conversation, Will brings a great perspective on how to bring mainstream venture capital skills to genuinely new areas. Its a great discussion for investors and companies who dare to be different. Enjoy!

01:00 Will introduces himself

03:40 Who Octopus Ventures are

06:30 Contrarian and tabooo investing

07:45 Example: Elvie - silent breast pump

09:50 Example: Pelago - substance use disorder

13:20 the size of taboo markets, challenges in assessing true market size

16:00 new tech and new markets - need for specialists

17:30 Example Overture - improving and automating IVF

19:20 market meets social movements - will someone follow-on?

22:05 assessing the pace of social change - risk of too early

25:30 sequencing the right national / international markets

25:45 Example Skin & Me - getting expansion right and not too quick

29:30 Time and capital to internationalise

31:00 when is the right or wrong time to internationalise

33:30 building deal flow in taboo areas

35:15 to what extent is the venture capital industry part of the problem - value of diversity

38:05 is the industry going in the right direction?

40:00 are valuations different in taboo areas?

42:35 creating communities supporting companies

47:45 prospects

50:20 Favourite questions

Links

Octopus Investments: https://octopusinvestments.com/

Octopus Ventures website: https://octopusventures.com/

Companies mentioned:

Pelago https://www.pelagohealth.com/

Overture https://www.overture.life/

Vira https://www.vira.health/

Elvie https://www.elvie.com/en-gb

Skin and me https://www.skinandme.com/

Subscribe to the EIS Navigator podcast on most services here: https://the-eis-navigator.captivate.fm/listen

Suggested books and media

Essentialism by Greg McKeown

In the Company of Givers and Takers by Adam Grant (article)

https://hbr.org/2013/04/in-the-company-of-givers-and-takers

Bio

Will Gibbs

Healthtech Partmer, Octopus Ventures

Will joined Octopus in 2013 and sits in its Health team. He works with portfolio companies from consumer to enterprise, with a strong bias towards businesses making the biggest impacts on health.

In recent years he has explored taboo areas within health, resulting in multiple new investments around this theme, from substance addiction to LGBT sexual health. He’s also passionate about the potential for digital therapeutics to deliver superior outcomes for some conditions, US expansion, the future of cannabinoids and novel business models within health.

Will was based in Octopus' US office in New York during 2016, and continues to support portfolio companies looking to expand into the US health market. Many of his portfolio companies are based in the US, and he invests alongside big global investors like SoftBank Group, Kinnevik, Atomico and EQT Partners.

Will is also a vocal champion of diversity and LGBT issues and is happily married to his husband Christopher.

He founded multiple startups before joining Octopus Ventures, including a rare-breed pig farm and an organic spirits company.

Will holds a degree in ancient history and classical archaeology from the University of Oxford.

https://www.linkedin.com/in/willgibbs1/