In 1969, the Real Alternatives Program called for the closure of SF’s Youth Guidance Center. 50 years later in 2019, the SF Board of Supervisors overwhelmingly approved the closure by the end of 2021. RAMA Blueprints hosts a live discussion with community members and leaders who were active in the Shut YGC down movement over the last 50 years. The discussion includes a lively intergenerational conversation between Alfredo Bojórquez(Court Alternatives Specialist, Office of SF Public Defender), Marlene Sanchez (Executive Director, Ella Baker Center for Human Rights), and Krea Gomez (Senior Program Officer, Rosenberg Foundation)moderated by Host Socorro Gamboa.

The live podcast was recorded at BRAVA For Women in the Arts' Cabaret. SHUT IT DOWN!: The Closure of Youth Guidance Center is part of our Tres Generaciones/Three Voices conversations.

Well, welcome everyone.

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Welcome to the RAMA Blueprints podcast.

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I'd like to welcome you to

Brava Women for the Arts.

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we are here live and we're

recording today our Shut It Down.

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the closure of Youth Guidance Center.

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This is part of a series called

Tres Generaciones, Three Voices.

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We are streaming live from Brava,

on Facebook Live, at the Cabaret in

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San Francisco's Mission District.

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It's a chilly evening, it feels cool, it

feels nice, and we're so happy to be here.

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In 2021, city officials

acknowledge that the effort to

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close Juvenile Hall was dead.

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There are no more committees, no

official conversations, no pending

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steps to accomplish the goal.

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A 150 bed facility remains open.

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operational, and still mostly empty.

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24 young people remain locked up inside.

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Over 50 percent of them that are

detained are immigrant youth.

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Seven serious offenders that

are 18 to 25 are serving up to

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seven years in that facility.

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From the leadership efforts

of Shaman Walton, the Board of

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Supervisors voted to close YGC down.

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What did they do?

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Created a working group that can

involve community members, communities

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participated, they did focus groups,

and after many meetings and discussions,

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recommendations were submitted.

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Meanwhile, young people

are still locked up.

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Then the mayor, she creates

her blue ribbon committee.

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They too come up with

recommendations and all along,

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young people are still locked up.

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Then the chief probation Leader

responds with her own committee

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and more recommendations are given.

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Everyone has their findings.

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The community contributes,

provides strategies that have

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been proven to be effective,

interventions that they know work.

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Meanwhile, young people are

still locked up, traumatized,

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criminalized, and thrown away.

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All while, we all know that the

long term effects of incarceration

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will significantly impact them.

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And it will impact their spirit,

their hearts, their mental health,

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and their overall well being.

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Three reports later.

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Three years later, 55 years later,

this community still finds itself at

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the hands of bureaucracy, basically,

they just took the community on a wild

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ride, derailed the hopes of so many,

a strategy that they used to detour

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and derail the goal to shut it down.

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The long term negative effects of

isolation and incarceration on young

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people have led to many questions.

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The logic of maintaining expenses

to operate a facility that only

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is one fourth capacity and it

costs over 300, 000 per youth.

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Incarcerating young people is harmful.

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Incarcerating anyone is

harmful to their being.

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And to their humanists.

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The bureaucracies have pledged to place

these incarcerated young people in a

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more home like, supportive environment.

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More focus, more rehabilitation.

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Really?

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When?

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Maybe, what we need to do is look

at the dehumanization of these young

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people, of the individuals incarcerated.

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Governor Newsom, former mayor of San

Francisco, made a move not alone,

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with many advocates, to shut down

the California Youth Authority.

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They identified it as

inhumane and dehumanizing.

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And here in San Francisco, that used

to be one of the most liberal cities

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in the nation, willfully knowing

that for every day, and every night,

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Young people remain incarcerated.

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How long will the community

sit or wait and go along with

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what the city has proposed?

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What plan of action does the

community have to hold the

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city and county accountable?

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Is San Francisco as

liberal as it used to be?

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Did you know San Francisco was the

first city in the nation to agree

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to close juvenile justice centers?

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Even though YGC population continued to

dwindle and closure seemed logical, when

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will the priority and the recommendations

from the community be taken serious?

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So here we are, like I said,

55 years later, in the same

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struggle, same situation.

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And young people are locked up.

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We're here today, RAMA is here today,

not to provide the answer, but to

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create a dialogue with our distinguished

guests, our distinguished panelists,

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with the community, that hopefully will

lead to encourage a proven strategy

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and intervention that historically

the community has implemented and

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success, and had success with it.

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The answer may not come

tonight, or next week.

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Maybe not even in three to five years from

now, but it is imperative that we start

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somewhere and that we start here tonight.

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In 2019, we were that

close to closing it down.

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What can we do tonight to reach that goal?

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So let's talk.

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Let's talk about it.

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Tonight with us we have, to my left,

The distinguished Alfredo Bohorquez.

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Yeah, let's give him a hand.

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Fred is a lifelong

resident of San Francisco.

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He has dedicated his life

over 30 years of advocacy.

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to working with at risk immigrant

youth and their families.

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He's a former staff of RAP, where

he himself received services, and he

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was exposed to community organizing.

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Alfredo worked at RAP for 15 years as

a juvenile court liaison and on the

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Calle Street Outreach Team, providing

direct services, gang intervention,

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case management, and court advocacy.

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Alfredo has sat on the Executive

Committee of the JDI, Juvenile Detention

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Alternative Initiative, and the

JJPA, Juvenile Providers Association.

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he also was employed at Instituto

Familiar de la Raza, a non profit

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community mental health and social service

agency, as a Youth Services Coordinator.

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He is currently employed as the

Court Alternative Specialist with

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the Youth Defender Unit of the San

Francisco Public Defender's Office.

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Welcome, Alfredo Bogorges.

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Also with us, we have Marlene

Sanchez, otra veterana, San Francisco

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native, Chicana, movement leader,

formerly incarcerated woman.

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And she began her community

work at 15 years old.

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She is the former Executive Director

of the Young Women's Freedom Center.

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Marlene has also worked in

leadership with COURAGE, Communities

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United for Restorative Justice.

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She also helped form the Alliance

for Girls and is a founding

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member of All of Us or None.

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You want to give it some up?

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All right, here we go.

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She currently serves as the

Executive Director of Ella

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Baker Center for Human Rights.

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We are humbled and honored to

have Marlene with us today.

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Thank you, Marlene.

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And last but not least, The new

generation of leadership Krea Gomez.

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CREA is an indigenous mother of six.

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For more than 20 years, she has anchored

her work in education, community

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organizing, youth development, and

juvenile and criminal justice advocacy.

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She has served as a member of the

leadership team at the Young Women's

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Freedom Center, and was the former

Dean of Students and School Culture at

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the North Oakland Community Charter.

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She received the Social Justice Teacher of

the Year Award and is the founding member

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of the Sisters Warriors Freedom Coalition.

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She is a former leading fellow at

Rosenberg Foundation and currently

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serves as the Senior Program

Officer of Rosenberg's Foundation.

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Let's welcome Krea.

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Well, just so you all know, we

did provide our panelists with the

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question, and we're going to give

them some time now to respond, and the

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question spoke about what brought them.

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So we can get a feel of who we

have with us today, and get a sense

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of, what keeps people inspired.

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So we're gonna start with Crea, and

then we'll work our way this way.

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Crea.

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Krea: Good evening, everyone.

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Before I get started, I just want to

shout out the Young Women's Freedom

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Center is here, we have, Chalk here,

we have 5 Elements in the house, I

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think it's important just to know

that we have a whole the mission, San

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Francisco, uh, we don't do this work by

ourselves, we do this in collaboration,

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and, our partners are here, our,

our, Our organizing family is here.

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So, my first introduction

to the system was at 15.

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And it's not easy to live in San

Francisco, everyone knows that.

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I think when you come from a family

that, uh, you know, you You do your

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best, you're working class, you do

your best to provide what you can

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for your kids, but life is tough.

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There's a lot of opportunity for kids

to get into things that aren't so great.

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And there's a lot of, peer pressure

to look certain ways and to wear

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certain things, especially in a

very flashy city like San Francisco.

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So my introduction to the system was

to stealing and that was literally

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just to make sure that I had clothes

to go to school with and decent shoes.

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My last interaction with

the system was in 93.

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And that last interaction probably was

the most important because it's where I

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met a woman named Sandy Close, who led an

organization called Pacific News Service.

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And she was just creating a newspaper

called Youth Outlook Magazine.

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And she had done a focus group

with folks inside Juvenile Hall.

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And anybody that's been in Juvenile

Hall knows that if you want to get out

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of your room and eat pizza that a guest

brings, you go to the groups, whether

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you know what they're doing or not.

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And there, to eat the pizza, I

talked a lot, and she said, there's

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an organization I know that's going

to be starting and it's through a

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place called the Coming to the Sun

Coalition, and they work with girls, and

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they're starting a, a, an organization

for girls that have been homeless

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and, involved in the streets, and.

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The Life and, I'll pass your name

on to the woman that's running it.

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And I was one of the first six girls

to be part of what is now known as

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the Young Women's Freedom Center.

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And I think the reason why that was so

important is because it was the first

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place where instead of being told what

to do, I was asked what I wanted to do.

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And I think that for me that was It,

it let me know that there were people

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that actually cared, and people that

wanted to hear my voice, and people

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that didn't think I was a bad person

and that, I had agency, and that I was

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smart, and I could do great things, and

I could help my community, and give back.

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So

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Socorro: yeah.

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Thank you, Crea.

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And next we'll hear from Marlene Sanchez.

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Marlene: Thank you.

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Thank you, Socorro.

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And just feel really honored to be

able to be in community and be here

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with With folks whose shoulders I stand

on, there is so much work that was

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done even before I came into the work.

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So many organizations that, opened the

doors to me, and so I'm really grateful.

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Alfredo, when you did Calles,

like, Alfredo used to come outreach

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to me when I was in the mission.

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And it really taught me a lot about

meeting people where they are.

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because there was a time where somebody

met me where I was and I didn't

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necessarily have to walk into an

organization because during those times

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we just weren't walking into organizations

and so that has left such an impact on

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me because to this day, 20 something

years later, I meet people where they

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are because of People like Alfredo and

people like Ray who met me where I was.

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So, thank you, uh, for, for inviting me.

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And also, I feel really grateful

for the opportunity to just reflect.

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I think it's, we don't get that

moment as often as we would like.

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It's just an opportunity to think back,

like, what was happening in the 90s.

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What was, and we know that we have to,

we have to learn about what was happening

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before and what is happening currently

and, and in order to continue to create

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spaces where we reimagine what's possible.

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So, I feel like this.

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This question did that for me.

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It gave me an opportunity

to really just reflect.

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And so the question around

like what brought me into the

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work very similar to Crea.

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Crea actually is one of my mentors and

someone who I look up to and after a

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while, we just start mentoring each other.

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I guess it's just there's It's

not about age it's about creating

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community and so, to be able to see

young people like Crea out in the

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community also gave me a lot of, a

lot of inspiration so thank you Crea.

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I, I grew up in Juvenile Hall and so

this, this place yeah, I, I caught my

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first case in In sixth grade in middle

school, I was, I was 11 years old.

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I was I got in a fight at school because,

uh, I mean, I'm sure it's still like

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this today, but there was a lot of, of,

of fights in middle schools, I mean, I'm

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hearing from middle school kids right now

too, it's, it's, not much has changed in

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terms of like what is happening in school,

but the difference is that I went to a

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school that was primarily Socorro, Black

and brown and Asian and low income, and

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so the response to those kids, it looks

very different to the response to kids in

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middle school and in other communities.

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So the response was to call the

gang task force to call the police.

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Well, it was my first

introduction to gangs.

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I was like, who is the gang task force?

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I had to like, ask my older

sister who, she knew who they

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were and I always say like that

was my, that was my introduction.

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Later on I ended up joining a gang because

I was like I'm already being treated

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as if I'm in a gang so I might as well

actually have the protection of a gang.

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It just made sense.

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And What I was looking

for is, is community.

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And spent a lot of my years in and

out of, of the detention center and,

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and after and met amazing people.

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And I think that is one of the common

things you'll hear is that it is

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not the institution, sometimes it's

not even the programs, it is the.

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People the people that connect with

you while you are in these spaces it is

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people like Jack Jackwell and people who

I remember from my time in the system that

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really made an impact on me, but also.

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When I got, when I got out, my, one of

my first things was, I was, I was at the

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Young Women's Freedom Center and it was,

again, similar to CREA, it was like the

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first time I actually got a job to go

back into the community and be seen in

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a different light, instead of somebody

who was Trouble which was my nickname

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coincidentally But uh, somebody who was

a problem I, I, it was an opportunity

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to be seen as somebody who actually has

solutions, who actually has a, a voice,

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and a lot of my, the, the foundation

of the work that I do today really just

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comes from the teachings that I learned

at the Young Women's Freedom Center,

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uh, but I got to go back into juvenile

home because as, as many of us who've

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uh, been incarcerated, the first thing

we want to do is, like, reach back and,

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and, and reach back for the folks we

left behind and we knew then that places

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like this were not places that we're

going to support our healing, that we're

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going to support us in general, and

so I know we're going to have more of

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a conversation, so I'll stop there so

Alfredo can talk, but excited to just

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continue to talk about what did we learn

during that time and how do we use that

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to really help us think about And again,

I'm really excited about the generation

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of folks who is leading this work.

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I'm not in San Francisco leading the work.

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And so I feel really

humbled to be invited.

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I think of so many people who should be

up here having this conversation, but

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I'm really excited to, to just start it.

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So thank

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Socorro: you.

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Thank you, Marlene.

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They called you trouble?

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Well, now you're causing

good trouble, right?

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Right on.

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And now we're here from Alfredo Borges.

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Alfredo.

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Alfredo: Uh, first of all, I

have a message of inspiring

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love from Ray Balbaron, who

could not be with us tonight.

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And I also want to recognize this

space here at BRAVA and thank Stacy,

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the Executive Director, who is also

has benefited from the advocacy work

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that we've done to do intervention work

because, uh, she also receives funding

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from DCYF, Department of Children, Youth,

and Family, for the running crew, and

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I'm very proud that my eldest daughter,

during high school, was a participant

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here, and during her undergraduate

experience at State, came back to be an

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assistant coordinator here in the running

crew, so many props for this space.

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In 1979, I found myself in

detention at YGC, what's now

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called the Juvenile Justice Center.

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Uh, I met a man named Fred Smith, the

first African American public defender

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in San Francisco, Tuskegee Airmen, who,

during the interview process, says,

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Alfredo, I see something different

about you that's very unique than

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the other youth that I represent here

in, in, in the juvenile court, and I

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see you live in the Mission District.

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I'm going to refer you to a friend

of mine who started an organization

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named Jim Queen, and he also worked

with Danny Glover during the San

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Francisco Ethnic Studies revolt.

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And the ironic thing is that RAP

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I live right next door.

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Never put attention to

what was happening there.

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I was connected with a man called

Ricardo Caballero, who was the

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court liaison for RAP at that time.

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And in my involvement in RAP, one of the

first things that I joined was a youth

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council, where I was surrounded by many

positive young ladies in the community,

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Sandy Cuadra, Yolanda Amador, Chachi.

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And we started focusing on youth issues.

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Uh, we collaborated with Mitchell

Salazar on the UNI dances, recruiting

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young people to have a safe space

on a Friday night where to go.

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But we had a turn of events here in the

mission that was impacting a lot of us.

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Uh, we had a curfew and

the police department was

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doing selective enforcement.

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Off my own stoop, I was taken in at

11 o'clock is when the The shift,

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uh, would come in, and they would

put us in mission station for hours,

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calling your parents at 3 or 4 in

the morning to come get you, right?

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So we presented to the Board of

Supervisors that this was inhumane, and

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it was selective enforcement, because

if you were in the sunset, and you got a

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curfew violation, the most likely result

was that the cops would drive you home.

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So that's, that's,

that's how I got started.

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Fast forward, I'm a college freshman.

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I needed money for rent.

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Uh, Lisa Miranda was

Executive Director of RAP.

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Uh, Esperanza Echavarri

was the Board President.

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And they recommended that I get

a half time position to shadow.

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One of the greatest persons I

ever met, Ray Balbaron, who was

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assigned to do intervention in

juvenile court and in juvenile hall.

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I was basically his scribe.

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I'd go in the afternoons with Ray to

interview young people and I documented

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everything that was being said.

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During that course of time, the

things that young people were telling

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us about the conditions and the

treatment at Youth Guidance Center

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We're matching, because we're there

at different times, young people are

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there at different periods of time,

but the same incidents were happening.

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We connected enough information where we

filed a brief as friends of the court,

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saying there's institutional child abuse

occurring in San Francisco Juvenile Hall.

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Arlo Smith was the DA at that time.

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John D.

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Van de Kamp was the Attorney

General for the State of California.

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Both.

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Uh, the district attorney's office and

the state attorney general investigated

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our allegations and they came back and

told us that all the, thank you for your

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efforts, but everything was anecdotal and

past tense, statutes of limitations, etc.

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We were very disappointed

with those results.

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And I remember having dinner at

Ray's home one night, excellent cook

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by the way, always, always a treat.

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And, we were a little elevated and he

grabs the phone, I go, what are you

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doing And I'm calling the White House.

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I want to talk to Ronald Reagan.

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A human being answers the phone.

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And Ray says, I'm a veteran, I'm

a homeowner, and I'm concerned

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that kids are dying in our

juvenile hall in San Francisco.

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I wanted to speak to the president.

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She goes, well, the president's busy,

and I understand the nature of your call.

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Let me get some more information.

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And, we hung up and didn't think about it.

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Two weeks later, we get a call from

the Department of Justice Civil Rights

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Division that they found enough evidence,

historically through publications that

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have been here in San Francisco since

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is a pattern of abuse and violation

of young people's civil rights.

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They sent their investigator, a paraplegic

African American man, and the first

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thing that we encounter No access

for a wheelchair bound person, right?

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They had to put him through

the freight elevators.

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Ray and I were accompanying him.

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It was so embarrassing.

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ADA, right?

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They weren't in compliance.

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First experience.

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This is in 84.

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By 1985, the then Assistant

Attorney General for, for, for the

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United States, William Bradford.

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sent Mayor Dianne Feinstein a report on

their findings, substaining that there is

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civil rights violations in San Francisco

Juvenile Hall, and they demanded that they

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take action to fund alternatives for young

people in this county, city and county.

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And from that experience, we've had the

growth of all these organizations that

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are serving youth that are involved

in the juvenile justice system.

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Again, I had the opportunity

to be part of that.

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There was many things that happened.

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Ray Balbaron's lives were threatened.

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His family was threatened.

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We lost a very vital program, La Casa

de Alternativas, that provided an

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alternative to young people that were

facing detention in juvenile hall.

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They went after our money.

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And in 1999, when RAP folded, for many

different reasons, many different reasons.

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Our programs weren't defunded.

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The silver lining in the cloud was

that all the other non profit youth

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organizations in the mission stepped

up to deal with juvenile justice

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issues because RAP was always the one

that dealt with these topics, right?

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And again, the silver lining

was that the funding spread out.

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And everybody in this community

stepped up, Horizons, Instituto,

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Mission Neighborhood Centers, to deal

with juvenile justice issues, right?

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During my tenure at Instituto

Cultura Cura Program, We found that

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the contractors from the juvenile

probation department that were brought

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on to provide these alternatives for

young people were getting screwed.

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We weren't getting reimbursed

for a lot of different reasons.

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They were using our community

funding to pay for workers comp.

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Uh, we had an accountant over

there that embezzled money.

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Scandal.

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That's why the juvenile probation

department does not handle its contracts.

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It's handled by the Department of

Children, Youth, and Families, right?

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And we fast forward to Mayor Breed's

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Then the Board of Supervisors

on 11 1 to vote passes the

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ordinance to close juvenile hall

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And here we are and we

still have the same issues.

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And I just remember one of the

things that in documenting things

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for Ray, just inappropriate behavior

staff in junior hall, like men.

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Supervising young women showering.

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And I believe that's still an

issue today, because right now,

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in San Francisco Juvenile Hall,

there's 17 vacant positions.

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Right now the staff there are

working mandatory overtime.

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It's good for their pocketbooks,

but it's not good for their

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mental health and how they react

to situations with young people.

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Access to Juvenile Hall for attorneys,

social workers, and community groups has

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been limited because of staff shortages.

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So here we are, with all these

recommendations, and we're in an impasse.

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With the realignment of the closure of

the California Youth Authority, we, as a

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county, are now having to deal with young

people who are committed for long term

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commitments, and we are doing a miserable

job because services are non existent.

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And they could say because of the

small numbers, but it is a struggle.

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It is a struggle.

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And today, before I came here, I was

reminded of the Osbons person that we

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have up there, because we have filed,

as an office, so many complaints about

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attorney access, and agents, the social

workers that we have, to struggle just

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to get access to our young people, so.

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Things have not changed, and we are

hopeful that we can get some, some

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traction in making these recommendations

come to, to, to, to come to light.

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So, I'm very thankful, and

again, in San Francisco, we're

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a youth resource rich city.

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This power, this entity.

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Detention has not changed.

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Thank you.

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Socorro: Thank you, Alfredo.

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So hearing what the three of you

said and, Fred bringing it forward

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to where we're at today, right?

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I had a, a thought, in the last six

months, what's been the interaction?

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I know, Krea, you and I had a

really in depth dialogue on the

423

phone as we were recruiting you

to become part of this panel.

424

But I think it's important that

you share you were a member of

425

the working group and, just so you

all know, you can get a copy of all

426

the recommendations in the reports.

427

They're all online and you can read them.

428

you had a really great perspective to

share about what was the frustration after

429

sitting and I also think that there was

a lot of organizations that lent their

430

staff to go to these meetings and be there

and, and what's happened in the last six

431

months or where do you sit with it now?

432

Krea: Yeah well, I.

433

I haven't been involved in the last

six months, but I think what's really

434

important to know is that when the Closed

Juvenile Work Group had ended, normally,

435

uh, a work group, when you come up with

recommendations it's your job as the

436

person that wrote those recommendations to

present them to the Board of Supervisors.

437

When the work group ended, we basically

were told, Thank you very much for your

438

service, and we'll let you know when we

present them to the Board of Supervisors.

439

One of the things that had happened is

that there were varying degrees of, I

440

would say varying, varying opinions about

the purpose of Juvenile Hall and varying

441

opinions really about young people in San

Francisco that I think made it really hard

442

for us to create concrete recommendations.

443

In reality, we should have had

Sixty recommendations tops.

444

Ones that were really finite and

were vetted through the community.

445

I want to lift up Valentina Sedeno, who

is a Mission Girls, Mission Native She

446

was the other community member that sat

on the Closed Juvenile Hall Work Group.

447

We worked really hard with community

members to hold those listening sessions.

448

And there were some great recommendations

that came forward from parents whose kids

449

had been in the system and had graduated

to the adult system and went to prison.

450

From, young people that were in the

system and had successfully left because

451

they had mentors in the community.

452

There were these through lines that we

saw that always came back to community.

453

What we ended up handing over

to the Board of Supervisors

454

was almost 200 recommendations.

455

Wow.

456

Because there was not alignment on

which recommendations could go forward

457

because there was a split on the work

group of people that still believe

458

that juvenile hall is a viable Place

to condition young people somehow to,

459

go back out into the community and,

and I'm not sure what happens when you

460

lock kids up for three, four months at

a time what you think is gonna happen.

461

But, many of us that were, that had

been there, many of us that had.

462

We've done community work the Juvenile

Justice Providers Association that

463

supported with advocating for a

lot of the recommendations and

464

endorsed the ones that came from

the families and, and the providers.

465

We knew that, like, we

don't need a juvenile hall.

466

What we really need is honestly what

San Francisco needs, and that is safe,

467

quality, housing, and places for young

people to be, and for them to be reunited

468

with their families, and for their

families to have the resources that are

469

necessary for them to have a quality

of life that allow for them to leave,

470

live healthy and safe in San Francisco.

471

And so really, there was 65 of those

recommendations, not 200 and something.

472

So those recommendations are still out

there, and what I do know is happening

473

right now is that Katie Miller, the

Chief Probation Officer, for juvenile

474

she actually did see some, some of

those recommendations and said, I'm

475

gonna move forward on some of them.

476

And Found some money in her budget to

bring in yet more consultants, right,

477

to basically vet the recommendations

that came from the community were

478

actually the right recommendations.

479

And attempted to also try and validate

the positions of the staff and probation

480

there and wanted Community to work with

them to actualize these recommendations.

481

So what I know as of now is

that there is a plan in place.

482

That plan came from her findings to

rehabilitate and renovate Juvenile Hall.

483

If I'm correct, the last

count was that there was 18

484

young people in Juvenile Hall.

485

I believe there was one girl, everyone

else, four girls, three girls and

486

that the recommendation is, based off

of numbers, which we play all day at

487

community based organizations, right,

really we only need like 20 beds.

488

And that's really because no young

person should ever be held Uh, in

489

Juvenile Hall because they are a ward

of the court and don't have placement.

490

Which we know, a lot of times, is

what Juvenile Hall is used for.

491

We were well aware of that when advocates

came forward to demand that Juvenile

492

Hall be, be, deconstructed, put out

of its misery, and that we find some

493

place in San Francisco to build this

secure place for young people to be.

494

We were really told that the red tape came

from all of the permits and having to go

495

to the community and survey the community.

496

If we're going to put a house

in, we're going to put kids

497

that have records in there.

498

We're going to have to talk to

everybody in the neighborhood.

499

Nobody's going to, want

to renovate a house.

500

Nobody's going to want

to sell it to the city.

501

There's very little properties.

502

We were told everything under the sun.

503

And ultimately, what I realized in

hindsight, it was because They never

504

wanted to do it in the first place.

505

Right.

506

Socorro: The derailing to the goal.

507

Krea: Yeah.

508

So that's where we're at.

509

Socorro: Wow.

510

Go ahead, Alfredo.

511

Alfredo: We're at 30 young

people detained to this date.

512

Three are young ladies.

513

Socorro: Thank you for that.

514

When I think about you saying that

and I think about all the hours and

515

the effort, one thing is, I was in a

conversation last night With Estela

516

Garcia, we were talking about when

you are committed to this work, right?

517

And you see it all the way through

and it takes from you, right?

518

And I'm sure it's, it's been disappointing

that, people put a lot of time and a lot

519

of hours, but also that 55 years later

we're talking about the same thing again.

520

I remember my first trip coming

to RAP and Alfredo trained me, to

521

do the workup, at, Juvenile Hall.

522

And, um, you know, it was a benefit

that I spoke Spanish because we,

523

there was a lot of young people

that were incarcerated during that

524

time that were Spanish speaking.

525

But what it took, right, and you present

a plan and you, you dream that the kid's

526

gonna get out or the young woman's gonna

get out and, and then, nothing's put

527

in place at home and There's so many

things going on and then they land back

528

out at Juvenile Hall and at that time it

was really around battling with the POs

529

because they were so uncooperative, right?

530

And when I think about it, I think

the count is 88 staff up there and now

531

Fred report telling us that there are,

probably understaffed and who knows

532

what is really going on now, right?

533

We don't have a Fred and a Ray

reporting with what's happening.

534

So, thinking of that, I think, well,

what's, what's an action that maybe,

535

Marlene, you can answer that may be

a recommendation because I know your

536

work is, at a, at a larger scale and

talking about, getting people out

537

of jail, what do we need to put in

place, let's talk about what could be

538

something that What we know can happen,

but how should we move with this?

539

Marlene: Yeah.

540

I mean, I'll just say, uh, when

you asked who, like what, what

541

happens, I mean, we know that the

longer somebody is incarcerated, the

542

actually it decreases somebody's.

543

Quality of life, it decreases

your ability to earn, earn more.

544

There's, treating this, this

is a, a public health issue.

545

And we know, right, that more

jails do not create public safety.

546

We know police do not

create public safety.

547

And so, but there are these incentives for

These institutions to continue to build

548

I think we've, we've seen this over and

over again over the years, that there is,

549

it is not driven by the fact that, like,

the data shows that it is actually caught

550

that, that actually putting young people

in solitary confinement causes more harm,

551

that the longer you have a young person

incarcerated, it's causes more harm.

552

The data proves it, but the, the incentive

of these institutions continues to be

553

to just continue to build something

bigger, put more beds, and fill them.

554

We know that it is also racially motivated

because we know that this is, like, we

555

know who's in these detention centers.

556

at Ella Baker Center, we've been

tackling things via legislation.

557

I mean, I think, I don't

have the solutions.

558

I think it's gonna take like a

multi pronged solution, multi

559

generational, I think every generation

is making some kind of impact.

560

I know, when I was at the Young Women's

Freedom Center for, for 18 years, we were

561

able to make some impact around even just

providing like gender responsive services.

562

There was a time where that was like

unheard of, like, things like, Getting

563

young moms visits with their kids or

like supporting young moms who had

564

just given birth to like nurse their

children and and the fact that we needed

565

to tend to to the specific needs of of

young people and, and I always think

566

of that as like the, like the middle

era, from like what, what I'm hearing

567

like Alfredo talk about and, and CREA.

568

But we've been tackling, we've also been

tackling things with, with legislation

569

that challenges the racism that

challenges the incentives to continue

570

to, to, to build bigger juvenile halls.

571

I think just shutting them

down is not enough, right?

572

We know that they will, like, reinvent

themselves, they will grow a new head,

573

and our approach has been, like, let's

empty them, and then let's shut them

574

down, and then let's reimagine something,

but we are definitely up against a beast

575

of, and, we are up against a system

that sees us as Profit, this is modern

576

day slavery and not much has changed in

terms of like these are bodies of young

577

people that they're gonna profit off

of, the consultants, the staff, I think.

578

The fact that we can't find a

solution for 20 kids is, I just,

579

I can't imagine that like We can't

build, like, build an alternative,

580

but those incentives are not there.

581

I think we've been critiqued in the, in

the process of, like, closing prisons.

582

About not having a component

that addresses labor.

583

So, but I think folks have,

have gotten really creative.

584

We're definitely not trying to, because

now, even some of the, the staff

585

at the California Youth Authority

that It's closing, and like, we're

586

going to be violence interrupter.

587

I'm like, the hell you are!

588

Like, you caused the vio I mean,

you've been trained to be violent.

589

And so, and we know cultureship

doesn't just happen overnight

590

because you have a different title.

591

Or you, you, you don't change

the culture of an institution

592

because you changed the name and

put rehabilitation in front of it.

593

And we've seen that strategy

over and over again.

594

But yeah, I mean, we, we

definitely have to, to tackle.

595

Yeah.

596

Some of the, the, the

structural racism, right.

597

And the incentives to continue to profit

598

Socorro: off.

599

Excellent point.

600

Alfredo: Excellent.

601

And here's the, I know you want,

here's the hypocrisy, right?

602

One of the main issues is venue.

603

Where do we do this?

604

And the other hypocrisy is there's

major efforts to revitalize downtown.

605

There's lots of vacant buildings

in San Francisco that we can

606

refurbish to make this happen.

607

But the hypocrisy of community safety and

citizen safety is bullshit because locking

608

up kids does not make the community safer.

609

It makes Angry young people.

610

Okay?

611

And we have an administration now

where the mayor has racially profiled

612

a whole Latin American group to blame

the cause of the fentanyl crisis.

613

Hello.

614

These kids are not the

chemists making these.

615

These are young people who are trafficked

and who are being taken advantage of.

616

So when we have those kind of attitudes.

617

In our city administration, we're not

going to get anywhere, but we could pour

618

resources into, from vacant to vibrant.

619

Why can't we have that resource to

get the venue for an alternative

620

Socorro: Thank you.

621

Right on.

622

So part of this dialogue includes having

the audience, if you want to make a

623

statement, this is the opportunity now.

624

Go ahead and, and identify

who you are go ahead.

625

Lariza: So, Larisa Dugan Cuadra,

Director of CARES in San Francisco.

626

We have our team also from Second Chance.

627

Thank you all for your interventions.

628

So, two things I wanted to comment.

629

To your point about

monetizing young people.

630

I heard it's 300, 000

per youth at the hall.

631

And when I did, you said 85 to 30

youth, it's like 3 staff to a youth.

632

But in the community side, it's like

10 youth to a staff member, right?

633

So the equation doesn't pan out in

terms of prevention and investments in

634

our young people so they can thrive.

635

So if you could speak a little bit about

the monet Let's go deeper, like, let's

636

put the numbers on it about monetizing.

637

But also, if you could talk about,

I was at RAP, also a staff member

638

with Por Vida, I used to go in the

hall, do writing workshops with

639

young, uh, Spanish speaking youth.

640

And at the time, the city of San

Francisco was deporting young people

641

back to their countries of origin.

642

And those of us from Central America

know that the gangs in Central

643

America were exported from California

from these detention centers.

644

From juvenile hall, from the

criminal injustice system.

645

And if you could reflect on

that, tell us a little bit about,

646

because we're all connected, right?

647

And so now we're like re criminalizing

young people, particularly migrants,

648

even though this country, this state,

was a big catalyst for what's happening

649

in the region in terms of gang violence.

650

So if you could maybe speak to that.

651

And Fred, if you could elaborate a little

bit more about the criminalization,

652

the detention of migrants that are

not being released solely because

653

they don't have Loving adults.

654

Socorro: Go ahead, Alfredo.

655

Well,

656

Alfredo: foremost, we cannot change

the way we treat young people

657

when we continue to model, like,

correctional facilities for adults.

658

That's right.

659

Okay.

660

When you don't have that change of

culture, when you don't have staff buy

661

in, one of the first recommendations

when we had these consulting groups

662

come in is that they needed to get

rid of all the current staff members,

663

because if they don't buy in, you

can't, uh, institutionalize the change.

664

And I understand, because I am also,

665

member, and I'm shop steward, and

my union also represents the people

666

that work in the institution, right?

667

The so called counselors, who are,

for all purposes, guards, because

668

that has not changed, right?

669

And when we have The crises that

are happening in our home countries,

670

the immigration flow, and young

people getting caught up in crime.

671

The blatant racism that we see on

a daily basis because young people

672

don't have the caring adults, right?

673

We have to mobilize and we

find those caring adults.

674

We, we, we, we find them.

675

And we also have a scary moment coming up.

676

We're going to have a change in the

judicial person that's going to run

677

juvenile hall and the new person we're

having has made it very clear he's not

678

sympathetic to these young people and

another issue we have many of these

679

young people being arrested here are not

residents of our county they're coming

680

from Alameda and what I fear right

now is that what we as an office have

681

been doing to To represent these young

people where they have less damaging

682

results, where they have pleas that

are immigration safe, are going to be

683

lost because they're going to say that

these young people are not our county

684

residents, let's resolve the matter and

send them back to their county of origin.

685

So that's a very scary proposition because

the welfare institution Code in California

686

says very clearly that we don't have

to do that, that we could treat young

687

people on an informal supervision, right?

688

But, again, probation officers

are tasked with, well, I can't do

689

that, they're not in this county,

but yet us as providers can do it.

690

All right?

691

And I'm very fortunate that I'm from this

community and I continue to keep my ties

692

with IFR, CARESEN, Horizons Unlimited,

that we're able to join together,

693

present tangible, concrete alternatives

to the court for consideration.

694

But we're also facing a conservative

court that's coming in and we have

695

to pull together to make sure that

we're presenting viable alternatives.

696

Competent alternatives, and I do believe

as a community we can do that, but we

697

have to roll up our sleeves because this

is a new challenge that we're facing.

698

Socorro: Right.

699

Thank you, Alfredo.

700

I know you had a question.

701

Hi,

702

Audience 2: everyone.

703

My name is Tatiana Lewis.

704

I'm an organizer with the Ella

Baker Center for Human Rights.

705

I would say my question is, how do

we change the narrative of our youth?

706

I'm formerly incarcerated, I'm now

25 years old, but my first time ever

707

being incarcerated, I was 13 years old.

708

A fight broke out at school, same

thing, and I was arrested at school,

709

like the whole school actually seeing

me and three other individuals.

710

took in a paddywacky and our parents

was like crying and things like that

711

we was incarcerated for about a month

and then from there though the cycle

712

was like violation after violation and

so it was a revolving door for me I've

713

even been to the group homes I've been

to Euclid group home on 823 Euclid

714

Avenue that's crazy I still remember

the address and so I'm just wondering

715

now I'm a student at UC Berkeley now.

716

Thank you.

717

Socorro: Go Bears.

718

Audience 2: And now I'm at the

Ella Baker Center for Human Rights

719

and just making a way and, uh,

making a change for our youth.

720

And I'm wondering, like, how do we change

that narrative that people automatically

721

think of black and brown individuals?

722

Like, it's like when we come in a room,

they automatically, like, shut us down.

723

They automatically close us out.

724

And it's like, how do we

get us out of that box?

725

Socorro: Thank you for your question.

726

Crea or Marlene, you want to take it on?

727

Marlene: I'll just start with

saying that yeah, it is critical

728

that we change the narrative.

729

I mean, we're just seeing sometimes,

we're just seeing some like, like

730

the repetition of these narratives.

731

And so, but what we know is that they have

a The, the, whatever you want to call it,

732

the opposition, the enemy, I don't know,

whatever you want to call them have a,

733

they, they've been consistent and they

have this, like, machine, right, that's

734

been and they control the, the, the news.

735

I mean, I think places like this, like,

these kind of podcasts is important.

736

I think Larissa, what you were saying is,

like, the creating of alternative media

737

but also I do feel like we need to have

a little bit more of like a coordinated

738

effort to change the narrative because

by ourselves and our little organizations

739

and like even if we're like a mid to big

size organization, it is small compared

740

to the like the left's apparatus.

741

Apparatus around creating this

like false narrative or the, that

742

we are living in a time right now

where fear mongering is like what

743

is driving even our, our politics.

744

And so, it is not like by

coincidence and it isn't new.

745

It is actually, old, but I don't,

a lot of us don't have the, the.

746

The infrastructure to like

go against that alone.

747

And so I definitely think like, how

do we join forces, create coordinated

748

efforts and use multiple ways to

get in, in multiple media and,

749

and owning or like media stream.

750

'cause again, I mean some of.

751

Mainstream media isn't picking it up and

saying like I want to do a story on this

752

and we we try I mean we We definitely

try to hit them up as well, too.

753

But we are gonna have to create our own

alternative media Lots of thoughts on this

754

Socorro: but Korea you want to

755

Krea: chime in Yeah, I mean, I think you

said something that was really important.

756

You said, how do we change the

narrative for black and brown youth?

757

And I think that that's really poignant

because, young people in the sunset,

758

they do just as many dumb things as

kids in the Mission or in Bayview.

759

In fact, in in Alameda County, Berkeley

has one of the lowest, uh, number of young

760

people in, Alameda County's Juvenile Hall.

761

And why is that?

762

Because the majority of the kids that

get picked up there are white and the

763

majority of them have access to lawyers.

764

It's a small town where the police

officers know the families and they,

765

as Alfredo was saying earlier, right?

766

Like, kids get driven home.

767

We don't get driven home.

768

I think one of the other ways, like,

our storytelling is really important.

769

The fact that we own our

narratives is really important.

770

I think one of the things I've

always really loved about the

771

programs in San Francisco.

772

And the people that run the

programs is that they believe

773

that young people are sacred.

774

And, and, it's super important

that, that's instilled in

775

young people constantly.

776

The media is using our young

people right now to push a

777

narrative around public safety.

778

They are the scapegoat.

779

And I think it's important

that we push back.

780

And that we do that collectively.

781

When we see these stories where

the headlines are really scathing

782

and they're meant to evoke fear

because it's a group of young people

783

or they want to glorify, right?

784

It'll say something like, band of

young people and then you read the

785

article and it's like two kids, right?

786

Yeah.

787

We have to be calling the news

outlets and demanding that

788

they correct those narratives.

789

We, the same way that we did when they

used to name our kids in the articles.

790

And we fought back against them

putting our kids names in there

791

for the sake of their future.

792

Right?

793

So there's a lot that can be done.

794

I think the other thing is we

have to start looking at all

795

of these fights more long term.

796

They're not going to happen tomorrow, so

how are we chipping away at things today?

797

And it does happen by, doing our own

storytelling, it does happen by getting

798

as many people to write, editorials, it

does happen by utilizing social media.

799

Which we know are young people pay

attention to and not just using it to

800

say, that's messed up, but to actually

say, did you know that this is happening?

801

Like, let me school you on some stuff.

802

And young people are really great at that.

803

I mean, I learned so much from

TikTok now, but I think it is really

804

important that when people say I

can't believe how many young people

805

are like out here doing crime.

806

We say, really, where'd

you learn that from?

807

What's the statistics?

808

Where did that come from?

809

Who told you that?

810

Do you know anybody?

811

Have you had your car broken into?

812

Oh, that didn't happen in your community.

813

Oh, you don't live there?

814

Because pushing back makes people

go, Well, maybe, maybe I was wrong.

815

You're right, that didn't happen to

me, and no, I am just fear mongering.

816

So I think the more we push back,

we, we do start to create a sense

817

of, like, questioning that requires

people to think more critically

818

about what they're saying themselves.

819

But also to think about what am I buying

into and how, how is it impacting me

820

and the way that I'm seeing myself, my

safety, and, and am I fear mongering?

821

Like am I actually pushing a

narrative that actually isn't true?

822

Because I actually don't know

anybody that's got their car broken

823

into and actually I've never, I've

never got my car broken into, right?

824

Or I've never been.

825

And that's, if you ask the majority of

people, they'll tell you that's the truth.

826

I, I don't, that's never

happened to me, but I've heard

827

it so much, I feel like it has.

828

And perception becomes reality, right?

829

That's right.

830

And so, and the, and the

right knows that very well.

831

Donald Trump, I hate to say his name,

but he got up so many times to say so

832

many things that weren't true, and it

didn't matter whether they were true,

833

because once they were out there.

834

Perception became reality,

and he had tons of people that

835

regurgitated that information.

836

I'm not saying we should lie, but I'm

saying that we should make perception,

837

the perception that we need to put

out there is the truth, and we need to

838

reinforce that it's actually reality.

839

That there are young people out here

doing great things, and there are

840

community based organizations that

have been supporting those young

841

people throughout their whole life.

842

We have young people that are doing,

I mean, like, this whole neighborhood,

843

I, I mean, there's so many young

people, including myself and Marlene,

844

that, like, are doing great things

that once people thought we were bad,

845

and I feel like that's That's the

case for the majority of young people

846

that, end up engaging in the system.

847

Marlene: Thank you for that.

848

And this crime is going down, and

I just looked at some statistics

849

around the theft, and we are like

down almost, at least in, in Alameda

850

County 8 percent from last year.

851

But why did they, were

there like a hundred anew?

852

Police deployed, Highway Patrol

deployed into the streets

853

because, that same reason.

854

But, and crime is going down nationally.

855

Alfredo: So, so data shows

that juvenile crime across the

856

country, it's at its lowest.

857

But how do we change that narrative

because, during the pandemic,

858

the smash and grab, that's, that,

that makes headlines, right?

859

And I, I'm just gonna say it, I'm not

a fan of Willie Brown, but Willie Brown

860

has control of editorial power here

for the Chronicle and the Examiner.

861

If you didn't know that.

862

If, if you remember when his

administration was happening, he

863

suppressed all the, all the stories about

crime and everything in San Francisco

864

because of, of the tourist industry.

865

Okay, but we are blessed to have

publications like Pacific News Service,

866

The Beat Within, that humanizes the young

people that are involved in our system.

867

And I'm forever thankful for Sandy Close.

868

for bringing those things

into our juvenile hall.

869

I am very thankful to Submission Local,

El Tecolote, for covering these things.

870

And again, we look at the data, juvenile

crime across this nation is at a low.

871

It is at a low.

872

Socorro: Thank you for that, Alfredo.

873

Thank all three of you.

874

I mean, this is really, really important.

875

I'm glad That the questions are

stimulating these thoughts and

876

maybe even out of this comes a,

a roadmap to, to figure out, to

877

move towards, the ultimate goal.

878

If it is just repurposing that

facility or, keeping at priority

879

how do we stop what's happening,

the dehumanizing of our children?

880

That young people are incarcerated,

that the, the monetization, all these

881

things that are happening, that we start

moving that, and you're right, Crea,

882

this is not, this is a long term fight.

883

This is a long one, and it doesn't

just, if we attack one thing,

884

then we have to go after it all.

885

And I think that collaboration and all

those words that people talk about,

886

they work, but it's also about action.

887

How do you take action?

888

So, thank you for that.

889

Yes, go ahead, your question.

890

Audience 2: Shout out to the BeWithin!

891

So, I was thinking about

892

the BeWithin when I was

sitting up here earlier.

893

Okay, so I have like three

894

questions.

895

My name is KD.

896

I'm a formerly incarcerated person.

897

I am associated in work for a

non profit and yada yada yada.

898

But today, I'm just here

as a community member.

899

I'm just here as an

impacted community member.

900

My first question is, around the

901

Krea: DJJ

902

Audience 2: closure.

903

Is there a realignment talk

904

Krea: around that?

905

Is the youth coming here?

906

Is that why we're at the 30?

907

Like, what's going on with that?

908

Alfredo: Well, with the realignment of

the whole state of California with the

909

closure of the California Youth Authority

or Department of Youth Justice, every

910

county now in the state is tasked where

providing secure track is the term that

911

is used where young people are committed

to long sentences in juvenile hall.

912

Right now in San Francisco, the

longest commitment is a seven year

913

commitment and again, Different

jurisdictions are doing it differently.

914

Unfortunately, San Francisco is doing

a miserable job just because of the low

915

numbers we have and they have not been

able to tailor any equitable Programming

916

for these young people, we have barely

gotten computers for young people,

917

laptops for young people in the secure

track in San Francisco to be able to do

918

college or community college courses.

919

It's been, uh, it's been ridiculous.

920

The, the resources, the human

resources are not there.

921

Alright, and as a county, we are failing

miserably, uh, we know other jurisdictions

922

are more advanced just because of

the larger numbers, and it's a big

923

responsibility for, for, for the different

jurisdictions to implement SecureTrack.

924

And we're just lucky that our numbers

are low, but the young people that

925

are committed long term to our

San Francisco school facility.

926

are not getting the services they deserve.

927

Socorro: Thank you for that.

928

Is there another question?

929

Audience 2: Yeah, and so my last

question is, like, what's the

930

strategy, I guess moving forward, you

guys already said basically that the

931

city and county didn't shut it down.

932

We really ain't even talking

about closing this down no more.

933

What's the strategy moving forward?

934

Like, are we, can we point out

the 88 to the 30, the money, like,

935

what's the strategy that we deploy

in moving forward to continue?

936

Well, this fight to shut it down and

really put together something different.

937

Socorro: Go ahead, Crea.

938

Krea: So I'm going to be really honest.

939

I don't have any faith in the city of

San Francisco to be able to shut down.

940

I believe that what they're

trying to do is repurpose it.

941

And when you slap lipstick

on a pig, it's still big.

942

I think our only strategy is

to actually starve the beast.

943

And that requires really strong

prevention and intervention programs.

944

I think it's really important

to note that the same reason why

945

we have young people going into

juvenile hall is the same reason

946

why we have so many homeless people.

947

Because there is not enough housing.

948

And there is not enough treatment.

949

And when I say that, and there's

not enough services that are created

950

by the city that are on demand.

951

And what I mean by that is it

should not take you two weeks to get

952

into a program the minute that you

decide you want to get clean, right?

953

The other problem is, is that we

see young people as one solo entity

954

and the reality of it is, is that

they're part of a family unit.

955

that actually needed support and

resources before that young person

956

decided to start doing whatever it

was that ended up up in Juvenile Hall.

957

When you start to have conversations with

parents, you'll realize that they had

958

been asking for help a long time ago and

didn't get the help that they needed.

959

And when they tried to get referred to a

service that could have been right around

960

the corner, they were never referred.

961

to that service.

962

Probation, the, the year that we

963

referred one kid to, there were 30

services that they could have provided

964

them, referred them to, and, and

referred only one kid that year.

965

That's a problem.

966

And I don't see it getting any better,

not because it can't, but because of

967

the ideology that people believe young

people are inherently bad, and that's

968

now wrapped up in this whole idea that

like, in order for us to survive in San

969

Francisco as employees of the city and

county, I need to keep my job, even though

970

my job is inherently bad for young people.

971

And we're not going to ever be able

to have a real conversation around

972

shutting down Juvenile Hall unless

we start having that conversation.

973

Yeah, that's right.

974

Because fundamentally, like,

you have to have values that

975

believe young people are sacred.

976

And you have to believe that

families should be together.

977

And you have to believe that families

can take care of each other if

978

they had the things that they need.

979

When you do that.

980

You have families that can stay together.

981

You have young people that can go home.

982

You have resources that

a family can go to.

983

You have a supportive network

that you can call on instead of

984

calling the police on your own kid.

985

Which a lot of parents don't realize is

harmful to their young person because

986

they're going to end up on a track into

juvenile hall that they can't get out of.

987

So, I personally don't believe that

the solution is about continuing

988

to fight to close it down.

989

We just need to get more coordinated

about the way that we serve young people

990

and the way that we actually collaborate

together and it can't be about the money.

991

It has to be rooted in the young

person and what we want to do for these

992

families and we have to starve the beast.

993

We have to just make sure that our young

people never touch that door to detention.

994

Socorro: Starve the beast.

995

Let's do that.

996

Starve the beast training.

997

This will be the last question

we'll take and then we'll come back.

998

Julia Arroyo: Okay, so I'm julia

Arroyo I'm just here, born and

999

raised in the city, but Sorry,

y'all, I'm giving y'all my last.

01:05:50,696 --> 01:05:55,086

We just had a really powerful training

with a lot of young folks, uh, to develop

01:05:55,086 --> 01:05:59,546

a speaker's bro to be able to combat

some of this messaging, but it's really

01:05:59,546 --> 01:06:03,776

from their voices and what alternatives

look like for them, so, uh, my question

01:06:03,776 --> 01:06:08,206

is around uh, prevention and the harm

reduction piece of it before I go off

01:06:08,206 --> 01:06:12,816

on a, uh, just giving a little bit

of testimonial from experiencing that

01:06:12,816 --> 01:06:14,616

facility as a really young person.

01:06:14,926 --> 01:06:19,516

I want to say that I first entered into

the system before I was even verbal,

01:06:19,866 --> 01:06:23,746

and that was through the foster care

system, through family separation.

01:06:24,286 --> 01:06:29,156

And through, uh, my journey there for

the search for what home was, right?

01:06:29,546 --> 01:06:32,666

And I navigated the

streets of San Francisco.

01:06:32,706 --> 01:06:37,026

Street economy only happens, really,

when you don't include the people, right?

01:06:37,366 --> 01:06:41,226

The young people, the families that

actually have built San Francisco,

01:06:41,226 --> 01:06:46,186

when you don't include an economy that

you can actually envision yourself and

01:06:46,186 --> 01:06:50,716

say, I could be that store owner, or

I could have that house, or whatever

01:06:50,716 --> 01:06:54,916

it is not a lot of us can look and

say that, like, I can do those things.

01:06:55,416 --> 01:06:59,526

And so, entering inside of that facility

as a young person I was in the search

01:06:59,556 --> 01:07:03,536

for a home, and I was navigating

that underground street economy.

01:07:03,971 --> 01:07:09,671

And I want to give a story that when I was

inside of that facility, that one of the

01:07:09,701 --> 01:07:14,961

counselors handed me a phone number and

he said, when you get out, give me a call.

01:07:15,721 --> 01:07:20,351

And then when I got out, I'm thinking

that this is another adult that is gonna,

01:07:20,561 --> 01:07:24,741

uh, support me, which propositioned

me for sex for a bag of coke.

01:07:25,311 --> 01:07:25,991

And so.

01:07:26,891 --> 01:07:29,861

Those are the type of things

that is personal to me.

01:07:31,131 --> 01:07:34,201

The closure of this facility is

very personal to me because I

01:07:34,201 --> 01:07:37,511

know firsthand the abuse that

happens inside of that facility.

01:07:38,926 --> 01:07:44,356

I now have been, had a calling to be into

this role as the co executive director

01:07:44,356 --> 01:07:51,246

of the Young Women's Freedom Center, and

right now there's a lot of talks about

01:07:51,326 --> 01:07:55,426

push back against harm reduction, that

it's just limiting our conversations

01:07:55,466 --> 01:08:02,041

to needle exchanges and things like

that, and we'll, and to me, like, When

01:08:02,041 --> 01:08:06,001

I was 15 years old, when we asked the

question of what would you tell your

01:08:06,001 --> 01:08:09,581

younger self, and I always say not a

damn thing, you couldn't tell me nothing,

01:08:10,041 --> 01:08:12,261

because I felt very alone at the time.

01:08:12,801 --> 01:08:16,871

And so, there needed to be some

type of harm reduction with me.

01:08:17,611 --> 01:08:22,631

I didn't, I didn't get to leave that

facility until my 18th birthday.

01:08:22,731 --> 01:08:26,261

That's when they, that's when they

said that, okay, that you can go now.

01:08:26,541 --> 01:08:28,921

And then I entered right into county jail.

01:08:29,501 --> 01:08:31,511

That was, that was my

next step right there.

01:08:31,761 --> 01:08:35,220

And so, can you give me like a

little bit of pointers or anything?

01:08:35,231 --> 01:08:36,551

Y'all are my predecessors.

01:08:36,691 --> 01:08:38,051

Y'all are my teachers.

01:08:38,060 --> 01:08:40,371

So, anything that you

could say on that piece?

01:08:42,431 --> 01:08:44,520

Alfredo: Well, the pipeline is real.

01:08:45,560 --> 01:08:46,621

The pipeline is real.

01:08:46,951 --> 01:08:49,560

One of the issues we have here

in San Francisco when we have the

01:08:49,560 --> 01:08:53,231

resources that are benefited to the

Juvenile Probation Department as the

01:08:53,231 --> 01:08:55,551

probation officers are the gatekeepers.

01:08:55,831 --> 01:08:56,701

for the referrals.

01:08:57,691 --> 01:08:59,031

And that needs to change.

01:09:00,191 --> 01:09:06,231

I access those services, but I have to

go to court and ask the judge to order

01:09:06,231 --> 01:09:08,261

probation department to make the referral.

01:09:08,631 --> 01:09:09,741

That should not happen.

01:09:10,011 --> 01:09:13,191

They have resources at their

fingertips and again, like you

01:09:13,201 --> 01:09:16,970

01:09:17,661 --> 01:09:20,551

They don't utilize the services

that are existing under their

01:09:20,551 --> 01:09:22,371

contracts, and that is a problem.

01:09:22,681 --> 01:09:25,881

As long as they're the gatekeepers for

the referral, it's not going to work.

01:09:27,671 --> 01:09:28,171

Socorro: Thank you.

01:09:28,890 --> 01:09:29,791

Kerry, you want to add

01:09:29,791 --> 01:09:30,151

Krea: to that?

01:09:30,151 --> 01:09:35,621

Yeah, I just, I really, you

know, There was a, there was

01:09:35,621 --> 01:09:40,651

a part of the recommendations

that called for these mentors.

01:09:40,651 --> 01:09:46,121

And when we had talked to a lot of young

people in those listening sessions,

01:09:46,121 --> 01:09:49,931

there were a couple of things that

really, like, became really finite.

01:09:49,961 --> 01:09:56,121

And, and one was that young people that

are on probation don't get the chance

01:09:56,191 --> 01:10:02,091

to actually build the skills that they

need to participate in the things that

01:10:02,091 --> 01:10:04,961

are going to keep them out of the system.

01:10:05,021 --> 01:10:06,171

I'll give you an example.

01:10:06,771 --> 01:10:08,981

Who knows what the first

condition of probation is?

01:10:14,416 --> 01:10:18,566

It's actually to not come

in contact with the police.

01:10:19,146 --> 01:10:20,526

The second one is to go to school.

01:10:22,636 --> 01:10:28,196

I spent maybe 12 days of my

7th grade year in school.

01:10:28,446 --> 01:10:32,416

The rest were on the bus and

probably like down here and like

01:10:32,416 --> 01:10:33,796

going around the city on the bus.

01:10:34,796 --> 01:10:37,066

I didn't have a practice

of going to school.

01:10:38,646 --> 01:10:40,026

When you're on probation.

01:10:40,371 --> 01:10:43,411

You're automatically expected to

go to school five days a week.

01:10:44,021 --> 01:10:49,131

If you had problems, if your problems

started in school, if the people, if

01:10:49,141 --> 01:10:53,381

you have been bused across the city to a

school because you got kicked out of the

01:10:53,381 --> 01:10:57,061

one that you were supposed to go to and

now you're in another neighborhood and

01:10:57,061 --> 01:10:58,701

you have to navigate how to get there.

01:10:59,251 --> 01:11:01,991

and you're crossing lines

that you're not supposed to,

01:11:02,041 --> 01:11:03,481

communities you're not supposed to.

01:11:04,371 --> 01:11:09,541

Like, you have to find ways to get there,

and I will tell you right now, I would

01:11:09,551 --> 01:11:14,881

rather go back to Juvenile Hall than I

would to get my ASPE in a community where

01:11:14,881 --> 01:11:18,991

nobody knows me, and I could possibly

lose my life trying to get to school.

01:11:21,541 --> 01:11:27,356

Why we don't give A leeway, while we

don't say the first 30 days, the first

01:11:27,366 --> 01:11:32,406

90 days of somebody on probation,

we allow for them to mess up, right?

01:11:32,436 --> 01:11:34,296

We allow for you not to go to school.

01:11:34,766 --> 01:11:38,266

We allow for you to, miss calling us.

01:11:38,316 --> 01:11:40,676

We as probation officers,

whatever it may be, right?

01:11:41,226 --> 01:11:43,256

Because you have to build that muscle.

01:11:43,256 --> 01:11:47,756

It's like going to a job and

like not expecting to mess

01:11:47,756 --> 01:11:49,476

up the first week, right?

01:11:50,546 --> 01:11:54,926

Why do we expect kids to go to school

five days a week when they haven't

01:11:54,926 --> 01:11:56,456

gone to school in three months?

01:11:57,166 --> 01:11:58,706

Can we start off with two days?

01:11:59,376 --> 01:12:01,546

Can we start off with three

days and work our ways up?

01:12:01,896 --> 01:12:04,296

Can we incentivize you when you get there?

01:12:04,646 --> 01:12:09,456

Because we know that young people's

desires are what need to be fed

01:12:09,536 --> 01:12:11,116

beyond just their needs, right?

01:12:11,736 --> 01:12:13,336

This is all harm reduction.

01:12:13,966 --> 01:12:16,076

These are all forms of harm reduction.

01:12:16,861 --> 01:12:20,741

Can we, can we find alternative

ways to get you to school?

01:12:21,201 --> 01:12:25,241

Can we give you a Lyft

Can we get your mom?

01:12:25,791 --> 01:12:26,841

Can we help her get a car?

01:12:26,871 --> 01:12:31,491

Because if we're spending 300, 000 on

a young person being locked up in, uh,

01:12:31,651 --> 01:12:34,721

Juvenile Hall, I'm sure we could use a

little bit of that money to get a car

01:12:34,721 --> 01:12:36,511

for somebody so you don't go back, right?

01:12:37,421 --> 01:12:41,691

But these are the ways in which, like, we

have to start thinking outside of the box.

01:12:41,691 --> 01:12:42,091

That's right.

01:12:42,661 --> 01:12:45,831

Because the box has been

built a long time ago.

01:12:45,841 --> 01:12:49,311

It's looked the same way,

like, God bless Ray Balbaron.

01:12:50,631 --> 01:12:55,461

Who first started this, when we started

01:12:55,541 --> 01:12:55,891

Yeah.

01:12:56,291 --> 01:12:58,091

And we said, we stand on your shoulders.

01:12:58,111 --> 01:12:59,191

You did this first.

01:12:59,221 --> 01:13:03,521

You, Roberto, Alfredo, we need

to know what are the lessons you

01:13:03,521 --> 01:13:07,031

learned from the work that you've

done and the fight that you did.

01:13:07,041 --> 01:13:09,481

And one of the first things he

said is, it's always going to

01:13:09,481 --> 01:13:10,701

go back to the community creole.

01:13:11,616 --> 01:13:12,936

It's, we are the answer.

01:13:14,136 --> 01:13:15,136

We're the answer.

01:13:15,176 --> 01:13:19,346

So the other thing is, is harm reduction

is also connecting young people to

01:13:19,346 --> 01:13:23,896

people in their community that they can

trust and making sure that those, those

01:13:23,936 --> 01:13:27,716

adults who have an investment in the

young person, not in their punishment.

01:13:28,146 --> 01:13:29,076

That's the problem.

01:13:29,096 --> 01:13:34,856

I'm not going to a program if I

don't come to that program, your,

01:13:34,916 --> 01:13:36,786

our relationship changes because

you're going to call my PO.

01:13:38,021 --> 01:13:41,981

These are all forms of harm reduction that

honestly don't take anything to do other

01:13:41,981 --> 01:13:45,841

than caring about the young person and

wanting them to win, wanting them to get

01:13:45,841 --> 01:13:50,871

off probation, wanting them to be whole,

investing in their families, making sure

01:13:50,871 --> 01:13:52,261

that they have the things that they need.

01:13:52,611 --> 01:13:55,311

A young person is not going to

stay at home if their PG& E is off.

01:13:56,841 --> 01:13:57,951

I can't be on my phone.

01:13:57,951 --> 01:13:58,851

I'm not gonna be home.

01:13:59,031 --> 01:13:59,951

I'm gonna be in the streets.

01:14:00,961 --> 01:14:04,601

Why can't we take some of that money

and actually pay phone bill, pay

01:14:04,621 --> 01:14:06,091

PG& E bills for a couple of months?

01:14:06,931 --> 01:14:11,541

Like we, we have to get innovative

and I'm gonna be really honest,

01:14:11,581 --> 01:14:14,521

it's on community to do that

because probation is not going to.

01:14:14,531 --> 01:14:15,121

That's right.

01:14:16,021 --> 01:14:16,701

Socorro: Thank you for that.

01:14:16,711 --> 01:14:21,051

And I was just, I leaned over

to Tell Alfredo that when

01:14:21,211 --> 01:14:23,701

rap was in its heyday, right?

01:14:23,931 --> 01:14:25,171

And I was blessed to be there.

01:14:25,171 --> 01:14:29,781

I was blessed to experience that, to

be creative, to think outside of the

01:14:29,781 --> 01:14:36,551

box with folks like Mitch, with Ray,

Ernesto Salazar, all these folks that we

01:14:36,551 --> 01:14:37,751

would say, how are we going to get them?

01:14:37,821 --> 01:14:39,378

and they need to back to school.

01:14:39,378 --> 01:14:41,261

They've never even been to school.

01:14:41,541 --> 01:14:46,141

Elisa Miranda was brilliant and she would

say, Socorro, you're expecting too much,

01:14:46,411 --> 01:14:48,121

because they haven't been in school.

01:14:48,331 --> 01:14:52,731

When I when I was the director of

the rap school, we had to dig deep

01:14:52,731 --> 01:14:55,911

and be creative and think what's

going to motivate them to get here.

01:14:56,421 --> 01:14:57,601

They don't know how to be here.

01:14:57,701 --> 01:14:59,951

They never were taught to be here.

01:15:00,381 --> 01:15:01,381

So what do we do?

01:15:02,696 --> 01:15:08,566

Creating incentives, uh, Breakfast

with Socorro, whatever it was, right?

01:15:09,006 --> 01:15:14,146

But I think if this, we as a

community, this community, has done it.

01:15:14,896 --> 01:15:21,576

Historically, they have proven that it

makes sense to reconnect the sacred child

01:15:21,796 --> 01:15:24,206

back to its community, to its family.

01:15:24,706 --> 01:15:29,376

Being, and I had asked Fred to

comment on that because that's

01:15:29,576 --> 01:15:31,906

why we're here, why RAMA was born.

01:15:31,916 --> 01:15:36,136

The RAMA Blueprints is the Real

Alternatives Media archive.

01:15:36,326 --> 01:15:38,136

It's the project to document.

01:15:38,471 --> 01:15:41,881

All the good things that were done,

the historical things that worked,

01:15:42,161 --> 01:15:47,411

the lessons learned, so that the new

generation of folks, they learn from that.

01:15:47,881 --> 01:15:52,051

You look up there and, and this

banner that we recreated, and stuff

01:15:52,051 --> 01:15:57,551

that it says La Casa, the, uh, the

En Barrio Warfare, the Youth Council.

01:15:58,251 --> 01:16:03,761

When I was talking to Jim about this, Jim

Queen, Darren and I, and to Ray the other

01:16:03,761 --> 01:16:08,221

day, Because I talk to Ray all the time

still, Ray still calls me, and he says

01:16:08,271 --> 01:16:13,461

what's missing is the youth leadership

and reconnecting it back to community.

01:16:13,881 --> 01:16:18,541

And so, I want to remind us of that,

and you reminded me of that right now.

01:16:18,581 --> 01:16:20,981

And Alfredo, I know you were

going to say something about

01:16:20,981 --> 01:16:22,636

that too, so, what do you think?

01:16:24,766 --> 01:16:27,746

Alfredo: So, I'm going to

pump my unit a little bit, uh,

01:16:27,756 --> 01:16:28,986

the Public Defender's Office.

01:16:29,396 --> 01:16:33,586

We have an educational attorney that's

assigned to every young person that we